Author Topic: [GB] CNC Alum. Cooler Master TKL cases r2, SHIPPING  (Read 186321 times)

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Offline poolside

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #50 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 06:30:47 »
From the retro-green picture in the OP, it looks like powder-coated cases will have their interior surfaces covered. :thumb:
Will that apply to the mating surfaces too?

I'm actually still vacillating on that. This new shop I'm working with does amazing work, and they masked the samples they made for me, but only along the mating surfaces and (as you noticed), not the interior of the case. These didn't suffer any of the problems we saw on some of the edges last time because they did a more meticulous job of it, but honestly I think they can go ahead and powder coat even the mating surfaces since I adjusted the tolerances a bit to compensate. I'll do some tests while the cases are being manufactured (with a leftover case I have from r1) to figure out what the best way to get these coated is, and we can just go with whatever yields the best results. :)

Great! Retro is really enticing. I might likely have to limit myself to one "budget" ;D non powder-coat case, however.
Will you be using DHL again for the powder-coat cases? And what about those shipping straight from the China factory?

Offline numerus

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #51 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 09:22:27 »
Just ordered one Tactical Grey Yesterday :D cant wait for it finaly will have Case for my Novatouch so happy !
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Offline YH YOON

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #52 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 09:36:31 »
nice~!!   ;D

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #53 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 10:03:00 »
I know you've mentioned this in passing, but will the price of the case be included for shipping? If it's not then taxes will not be a huge issue, since I'm looking to order more than 1 I might end up paying rather substantially in taxes.

I've looked into this pretty extensively. Many people don't realize that customs in many countries can and will, randomly, ask you for an original receipt to prove the value for which you paid for goods if there is any question as to the value. This actually happened to multiple buyers in round 1. If customs find that the value has been mis-represented, the goods can be impounded and destroyed, or a severe penalty can be charged to the importer who is (in the laws of many countries, such as the UK) actually held responsible for the contents of the customs forms. Sure, 99 items may get through unquestioned, but for the 1 out of a 100 that gets flagged, it's very bad news. So that's why, with my sincerest apologies, I have to declare the cases at the legal price paid.

I strongly believe that tariffs are awful and a horrible drag on global economic development, so I totally understand and sympathize with the request, but asking me to falsify official customs documents is like asking me to help you cheat on your income taxes: the risk to both of us just isn't worth it.  :( I really do feel very bad about it though.

Incidentally, however, tariffs are calculated not in general terms but on the specific category of the item being imported. This item fits into HTS category 8473.30.5100, which in the USA is import duty-free. That may be true in your country as well.

I truly respect your choice. But for me it's a deal breaker sadly I would have love the seafoam or the galactic blue.

Cheers

I totally understand. Are you sure that your country imposes customs duties on keyboard parts, though? Like I said, category 8473.30.5100 is import duty-free in the US at least. It might be worth checking.

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #54 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 10:11:51 »
From the retro-green picture in the OP, it looks like powder-coated cases will have their interior surfaces covered. :thumb:
Will that apply to the mating surfaces too?

I'm actually still vacillating on that. This new shop I'm working with does amazing work, and they masked the samples they made for me, but only along the mating surfaces and (as you noticed), not the interior of the case. These didn't suffer any of the problems we saw on some of the edges last time because they did a more meticulous job of it, but honestly I think they can go ahead and powder coat even the mating surfaces since I adjusted the tolerances a bit to compensate. I'll do some tests while the cases are being manufactured (with a leftover case I have from r1) to figure out what the best way to get these coated is, and we can just go with whatever yields the best results. :)

Great! Retro is really enticing. I might likely have to limit myself to one "budget" ;D non powder-coat case, however.
Will you be using DHL again for the powder-coat cases? And what about those shipping straight from the China factory?

Yes, alas, the powder coat process makes everything complicated, which again is the reason for the high cost on those. Here is how it will all break down, as I currently understand it:

1) Cases are finished at factory in Shenzhen
2) Cases go to fulfillment center in same city
3) Cases are boxed into orders, setting aside unfinished cases for powder
4) International boxes are given DHL labels (or other international express carrier), and US boxes are given FedEx/UPS ground labels. Unfinished cases are boxed together.
5) International boxes are shipped directly to customers. US boxes (including unfinished) come, in one crate, here to California. The US boxes that are ready to go out are added into the FedEx/UPS streams immediately. For the unfinished cases, I go pick them up and drive them to the powder coating place.
6) After the powder cases are finished, they're individually sent to buyers all over the world from California after the approximately 1-month lead time of the powder coating facility.

Frankly, I added the powder options because I knew a few people would be excited to have them and I was glad to finally find a shop that could do it really well, but even with the raised price, I kind of am hoping that not too many people choose it, because it sort of breaks this nice streamlined system I worked out for r2 that avoids my having to have my living room covered in packing peanuts for a week. :rolleyes:
« Last Edit: Sat, 08 April 2017, 10:18:37 by norbauer »

Offline navy2x

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #55 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 10:26:37 »
Can you explain a bit more about the powder coated option. What exactly does that mean and why is it nicer than bead blasted?

Also, I saw a GB on originative for your cases but there are different colors (specifically coral red) and they are different prices ($209). What's the difference between the originative GB and the GB on your website? I apologize if I've missed something obvious.

https://originative.co/products/novatouch-alucase?variant=25368557968

Offline zslane

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #56 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 10:56:03 »
I believe that powder coating is the only way to achieve a white aluminum case (other than painting it, which is not durable like anodizing or powder-coating).

Offline zslane

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #57 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 11:05:17 »
Okay, I just pulled the trigger on Galactic Blue (brushed), Tactical Gray (brushed), and Space Station White.

Three sexy ways to dress up my NovaTouch. Methinks I could really use a second NovaTouch...

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #58 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 11:32:57 »
Can you explain a bit more about the powder coated option. What exactly does that mean and why is it nicer than bead blasted?

Also, I saw a GB on originative for your cases but there are different colors (specifically coral red) and they are different prices ($209). What's the difference between the originative GB and the GB on your website? I apologize if I've missed something obvious.

https://originative.co/products/novatouch-alucase?variant=25368557968

Well, more expensive doesn't necessarily mean nicer. It is just more labor intensive to apply and requires more individual skill to do well.
 It's just a question of your aesthetic preference. Powder coating is a layer on top of the metal, so it is capable of creating an opaque finish. White, for example, is totally impossible with regular anodizing, so powder coat is the only option there. The retro green color would also be impossible to accomplish in anodizing dyes and give the same pastel effect (the underlying aluminum always shows through and changes the color, making it look metallic, which is also cool). Powder coat has less of a uniform finish (it can be a little wavy if you look at it really close in the right kind of light). Because anodizing uses a dye bath, the finish is very uniform. But again, you're limited in the types of looks you can achieve. Higher-build textures, like with the enigma black, are also impossible to achieve with anodizing.

Regarding the Originative options: they are joining the group buy with everyone else here, but since they are purchasing in relatively high volume, I've been able to work out with them some special terms, such as custom colors. They have their own community, which reaches beyond GeekHack, so for many people the Originative group buy may be their only exposure to these cases. I also just like working with sherryton, so I think we look for excuses to do projects together. ;) I'm very excited for their "Coral" color, which is an excellent complement to the "Retro Refrigerator" color in my group buy. Together, those two colors really make me think of the aesthetic of California, which is cool since we're both located here in the state.

Oh also, Originative keeps cases in stock after the group buy has ended. Since I don't really want to get into running an always-on e-commerce site, they perform the useful function of continuing to make these cases available for people who missed out on the group buy but still want a case, which is always pretty common.
« Last Edit: Sat, 08 April 2017, 11:36:17 by norbauer »

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #59 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 11:37:37 »
Okay, I just pulled the trigger on Galactic Blue (brushed), Tactical Gray (brushed), and Space Station White.

Three sexy ways to dress up my NovaTouch. Methinks I could really use a second NovaTouch...

Wow. You're not messing around.

And I share your sadness about the availability of the NovaTouch. =\

Offline AuDiTH

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #60 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 12:38:08 »
Hi Norbauer, just a quick question, will the early access case start shipping next week? Awesome work on the video by the way  :thumb:
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Offline zslane

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #61 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 12:38:53 »
Okay, I just pulled the trigger on Galactic Blue (brushed), Tactical Gray (brushed), and Space Station White.

Three sexy ways to dress up my NovaTouch. Methinks I could really use a second NovaTouch...

Wow. You're not messing around.

Well, I have more money than sense, that's all...  :p

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #62 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 13:20:49 »
Hi Norbauer, just a quick question, will the early access case start shipping next week? Awesome work on the video by the way  :thumb:

Thanks!

And, yes, absolutely. I would have shipped them on Friday, but I discovered that I need to go out and buy some more void-fill packing materials. :)

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #63 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 13:22:27 »
Okay, I just pulled the trigger on Galactic Blue (brushed), Tactical Gray (brushed), and Space Station White.

Three sexy ways to dress up my NovaTouch. Methinks I could really use a second NovaTouch...

Wow. You're not messing around.

Well, I have more money than sense, that's all...  :p

Haha. I know the feeling. It's not that I have a lot of money, just very little sense.  :rolleyes:

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #64 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 14:02:24 »
Might it be possible to get more photos of the Galactic Blue and the Galactic Blue brushed?

Sure. I tried not to overload the product listing with too many photos. But here are pics of the two cases in varying lighting circumstances.











Brushed






« Last Edit: Sat, 08 April 2017, 18:57:12 by norbauer »

Offline Dee1

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #65 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 14:50:39 »
Real life hit me like a truck so I wasn't able to join the last one, but this time I'll get one for sure! :D

Now for the hard part... picking a color! Is the only plain black option the one on the originative site? & is the color in this picture the white finish?

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #66 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 15:20:04 »
Real life hit me like a truck so I wasn't able to join the last one, but this time I'll get one for sure! :D

Now for the hard part... picking a color! Is the only plain black option the one on the originative site? & is the color in this picture the white finish?

Plain black is only available through O Co, yes. There is also a textured finish available in black called "Enigma black." It's very nice, but it's unfortunately quite expensive due to the finishing process.



The one in the picture to which you linked is actually the Aerospace Aluminum color.

This is the white case:




Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #67 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 18:53:29 »
For those who have contacted me who need spare riser feet from r1 (or if anybody just wants spares for r2), I created this listing:
https://shop.norbauer.com/products/spare-riser-feet

I don't have the full range of colors available, but hopefully one will work if you're in need of feet.

Offline MechanicalCafe

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #68 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 22:50:14 »
I bought a Novatouch specifically for round 1 but, couldn't fully pull the trigger then but, now I am super excited for Galatic Blue + DSA Royal. Amazing job and thanks for a R2!

Offline hpfalcon

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #69 on: Sat, 08 April 2017, 23:07:13 »
Those look great! Do you also have any more pics of the Retro Refrigerator?

Offline LightningXI

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #70 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 00:41:21 »
Out of complete curiosity, Ryan, what are your three favorite case colors and finishes among the listing?

Offline richard912

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #71 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 07:56:53 »
That Space Station White!!! Alas, my wallet ran off with all my credit cards after seeing the price tag on it. Well, I do have until 21 April to mull on the Tactical Gray. Only thing is, to brush or not to brush, that is the question...

EDIT : Is the picture in the first post that of the "aerospace aluminium"? *feeling cheap*
« Last Edit: Sun, 09 April 2017, 09:38:31 by richard912 »

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #72 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 10:28:58 »
By the way, regarding the customs duties issue, I noticed that a couple of customers are using the Shipito service for their orders.
https://www.shipito.com/en/services/usa-address-mail-forwarding

This parcel forwarding service here in California takes advantage of the fact that I'm using a bulk courier shipment of the USA keyboards to California save on shipping costs, making shipping to US addresses much less expensive. Shipito allows you to complete your own customs form, and how you fill that one out is none of my business, so you can declare it however you want. It looks like you can also submit a special request to have the product repackaged and (presumably) the invoice thrown away before it's sent to you.

I still advise against customs under-declaration, for the reasons I mentioned, but for those who prefer living dangerously, I just thought I'd mention what some customers are doing.

Offline navy2x

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #73 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 11:13:02 »
I know this is a long shot, but what are the chances that this case would fit a KUL ES-87?

Offline Geroximo

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #74 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 12:09:51 »
Thank you for the additional pictures, that was exactly what I needed.
Just ordered Galactic Blue  :thumb:

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #75 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 12:53:35 »
Out of complete curiosity, Ryan, what are your three favorite case colors and finishes among the listing?

I think these would have to be my favorites: Aerospace Aluminum (clean and simple and matches my Macs well), Retro Refrigerator (such an unusual color for a case, and I'm a sucker for pastel/desaturated colors), Enigma Black (the subtle 1940s-style texture is very cool and also quite unusual in the hobby).

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #76 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 12:59:47 »
Those look great! Do you also have any more pics of the Retro Refrigerator?

Sure. Here are a few. For some reason I didn't get any pics of it with an actual keyboard inside, but I think these convey the flavor—again, in these photos you can see it in a wide variety of lighting circumstances from bright light to shadow, which all have a huge effect on how the color looks.











Offline LightningXI

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #77 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 13:03:15 »
Out of complete curiosity, Ryan, what are your three favorite case colors and finishes among the listing?

I think these would have to be my favorites: Aerospace Aluminum (clean and simple and matches my Macs well), Retro Refrigerator (such an unusual color for a case, and I'm a sucker for pastel/desaturated colors), Enigma Black (the subtle 1940s-style texture is very cool and also quite unusual in the hobby).
Interesting choices!! Is hand-brushed any more refined over the regular non-brushed anodizing? What's your take on that? I'm just curious and don't know much about the aluminum finish.

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Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #78 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 13:17:50 »
Interesting choices!! Is hand-brushed any more refined over the regular non-brushed anodizing? What's your take on that? I'm just curious and don't know much about the aluminum finish.

Aesthetically, I tend to favor visual simplicity and soft/matte looks, so I would never have even thought about doing a brushed finish. But someone in the last group buy asked me to see if I could get a custom brushed finish for him. I did, and it turned out (to my surprise) to look really cool! I actually think it does, as you implied, look more refined and less utilitarian. It's still not entirely to my taste (I'm all about the beauty of the utilitarian), but a lot of people are really into brushed finishes, and I can now appreciate why.

Also, again, one of my goals on this project is simply to make some creative finish options available that you don't often seen in the keyboard world, so I figured why not offer it and see if it strikes anyone's fancy.  :D

Offline LightningXI

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #79 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 13:22:09 »
Interesting choices!! Is hand-brushed any more refined over the regular non-brushed anodizing? What's your take on that? I'm just curious and don't know much about the aluminum finish.

Aesthetically, I tend to favor visual simplicity and soft/matte looks, so I would never have even thought about doing a brushed finish. But someone in the last group buy asked me to see if I could get a custom brushed finish for him. I did, and it turned out (to my surprise) to look really cool! I actually think it does, as you implied, look more refined and less utilitarian. It's still not entirely to my taste (I'm all about the beauty of the utilitarian), but a lot of people are really into brushed finishes, and I can now appreciate why.

Also, again, one of my goals on this project is simply to make some creative finish options available that you don't often seen in the keyboard world, so I figured why not offer it and see if it strikes anyone's fancy.  :D
Lovely way to put it. Thanks for your input. I will see if I can get one brushed and one unbrushed case, for science. :) Thanks for offering us the options to do so! I'm very pleased with where this is going.

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Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #80 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 13:26:37 »
Lovely way to put it. Thanks for your input. I will see if I can get one brushed and one unbrushed case, for science. :)

for science!  :thumb:

« Last Edit: Mon, 10 April 2017, 22:02:17 by norbauer »

Offline usopia

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #81 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 13:34:34 »
1x Tactical Gray ordered! ;)

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #82 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 17:10:49 »
Is the picture in the first post that of the "aerospace aluminium"? *feeling cheap*

Affirmative. :)

Aerospace aluminum is a great finish. Don't mistake low price for low awesomeness. The color options and costs are really just a question of taste and desire—and, from my perspective, the fuss/cost involved in getting each particular finish made and out the door. ;)

Offline navy2x

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #83 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 18:01:22 »
Is the black color offered by originative the same as enigma black offered on your website?

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #84 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 18:03:21 »
Is the black color offered by originative the same as enigma black offered on your website?

The O Co. version is black anodized. The "enigma black" is powder-coated and has an unusual texture that is different from the anodized cases.

Offline navy2x

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #85 on: Sun, 09 April 2017, 19:35:50 »
Is the black color offered by originative the same as enigma black offered on your website?

The O Co. version is black anodized. The "enigma black" is powder-coated and has an unusual texture that is different from the anodized cases.

That's what I was wondering! Do you happen to have more photos of the enigma black vs anodized black? I just can't decide between the two!

Offline richard912

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #86 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 00:08:30 »
Is the picture in the first post that of the "aerospace aluminium"? *feeling cheap*

Affirmative. :)

Aerospace aluminum is a great finish. Don't mistake low price for low awesomeness. The color options and costs are really just a question of taste and desire—and, from my perspective, the fuss/cost involved in getting each particular finish made and out the door. ;)
Thanks for the confirmation. I like it because it looks simple and clean. Btw, was told that I may have an issue using the case with my custom Pexon cable :(

Offline zslane

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #87 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 00:47:20 »
Simple and clean? I don't understand what that means in the context of an aluminum keyboard case. In what way do any of the other colors look complicated or dirty?  :confused:

Offline MMKB

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #88 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 01:41:43 »
Well said in the video. Without internet and global trade this GB would not have happened.  ^-^ Globalization comes at a price  -- well what else came without any -- and there are pushback but we just need to learn to deal with it.

Wish you another successful GB. I'll join in the future for a 40% or 60% case like this for sure!
        

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #89 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 10:33:30 »
Well said in the video. Without internet and global trade this GB would not have happened.  ^-^ Globalization comes at a price  -- well what else came without any -- and there are pushback but we just need to learn to deal with it.

Thanks!

Globalization is indeed commonly believed to come at a price (i.e., US manufacturing jobs), but is often said to be worth the ill effects. But if you actually look at the data and research, I would argue that the supposed ill effects are not even at all clear. And that's the thing that really irks me about the pushback you hear in some quarters. I think it's mostly about blind nationalism and fear of the foreign, not economics.

From what I can tell, certainly in aggregate, trade is always a win-win proposition for nations and for human productivity as a whole. While a tiny and already declining sector of the economy has diminished since the US signed its free trade agreements, far more jobs (higher-paying jobs that most Americans would rather have) have been gained by the overall expansion of the American (and global) economy. And, any American who is willing to be mobile to get work (as the Chinese certainly are), or to find ways of doing work online, can take advantage of that. Also, manufacturing still exists in the US; it's just very specialized and high-end—and organized around the kind of sectors that America focuses on nowadays—it's not hard to find prototyping shops here, for example.

I do kind of lament that it's hard to find local vendors who do various manufacturing trades because I'm the kind of guy who likes to go down to the workshop and see how stuff is made. But I wouldn't trade going back the American economy of the 1960s to have that luxury. Not even close. As I said in the video, in a pre-internet, pre-globalization world growing up in West Virginia, I would likely have had few options beyond being a coal miner and dying a premature death of black lung.

In any case, the proposed solution (tariffs) is just a way for the government to transfer money from people who don't work in the manufacturing sector (i.e., the vast majority of all Americans) by making them pay higher prices for all their goods in order to subsidize, Soviet-style, a small industry that the market has decided doesn't make practical sense in the US right now. It's hard for me to see how that's a good idea.

But, anyway, that's why I (thankfully!) no longer work in politics.  :rolleyes:

(As an aside: there is a valid case to be made that globalization fragilizes the world economy by making it more interconnected—and thus more likely to suffer booms and busts all the same time. I've been reading a lot of Nassim Nicholas Taleb lately, and I find this argument a compelling one, but not even he suggests we should turn back the clock and de-globalize, either culturally or economically. But this is a much more nuanced argument that calls for remedies other than tariffs, and one that I've never heard the America First crowd making.)

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #90 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 10:36:07 »
Simple and clean? I don't understand what that means in the context of an aluminum keyboard case. In what way do any of the other colors look complicated or dirty?  :confused:

Haha. OK, I take your point. By simple and clean I just meant without adding a dye beyond the natural color of the metal itself. ;)

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #91 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 10:43:49 »
That's what I was wondering! Do you happen to have more photos of the enigma black vs anodized black? I just can't decide between the two!

Unfortunately I've never had cases with those two finishes in the same room at the same time. But since the color is black, it's easier to judge the difference between them than if they were different hues, without their being in the same photo next to each other. The enigma has a gentle but noticeable texture, the anodized black has a relatively smooth texture like the Galactic Blue cases (or probably most any anodized case you've ever seen in person). I called it Enigma black because the finish is a bit reminiscent of the textured paint that used to be on the German Enigma machines in WWII.



Thanks for the confirmation. I like it because it looks simple and clean. Btw, was told that I may have an issue using the case with my custom Pexon cable :(

I have heard that as well, but I don't have a Pexon cable myself with which to test.

You can do this with the case, however. ;)


Offline floris

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #92 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 11:26:40 »
In round 1 there were some issues with cases from originative, missing screws, bumpers, etc.

Will the cases that are shipped directly from china still contain these parts?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #93 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 11:52:58 »
Will the cases that are shipped directly from china still contain these parts?

Yes, the cases will all include: bumpers for use with riser feet and without (small and large), screws for holding the two halves of the case together, two flange screws for holding the plate in place against the bottom half of the case, and two tiny screws for fastening the USB bracket against the bottom of the plate well.

Offline zslane

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #94 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 12:10:47 »
...not even he suggests we should turn back the clock and de-globalize, either culturally or economically.

Uh yeah, I don't think there's any way to put that genie back in the bottle at this point.

The only way to survive in the presence of a competitor who can easily and dramatically undercut your costs is to focus on the segment of the market that can be convinced to pay the premium for your domestically-made product. What added value does that premium buy? You have to have a really strong unique value proposition to stay in business these days.

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #95 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 12:24:50 »
...not even he suggests we should turn back the clock and de-globalize, either culturally or economically.

Uh yeah, I don't think there's any way to put that genie back in the bottle at this point.

The only way to survive in the presence of a competitor who can easily and dramatically undercut your costs is to focus on the segment of the market that can be convinced to pay the premium for your domestically-made product. What added value does that premium buy? You have to have a really strong unique value proposition to stay in business these days.

Yeah, totally. And I'm all for that kind of thing. I have produced stuff with some great artisanal shops here in the US in the past, because the very old-fashioned inefficient, hand-made, way they make things is part of the charm and appeal of the product itself. Here is a video I made on one of those (with apologies that parts of it may not make sense to non-Trekkies):


As far as I'm concerned, businesses to should try to avoid competing directly and instead focus on differentiation. When there is a wide range of really affordable versions of a product to very high-end stuff, it means you have a healthy market: everybody gets something more tailored to what he or she wants and can afford, and there is a place for lots of varying types of jobs all over the planet. Globalization actually makes this kind of manufacturing in the US more possible, not less.

Offline zslane

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #96 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 17:56:46 »
I can't help but think about Signature Plastics who is facing new competition from MaxKeys. The Chinese version of SA keycaps are virtually identical to SP's but can be sold at a substantially lower price due to their significantly lower labor costs. I think it will be extraordinarily difficult for SP to sell "Made in the USA" as its only value proposition. Already you have community members hungrily eyeing MaxKeys sets for their lower price.

I imagine that if the "Norbauer Case" was something that was in constant high demand, there would inevitably be a Chinese knock-off being sold at 75% of the quality level and half the price. And unless you are like Apple, willing to engage the same kind of labor exploitation your competition does, it would be a real struggle to find a sustainable customer base for that product.

The mantra in the US has always been "Innovate or Die", but I think globalization has made that more necessary than ever.
« Last Edit: Mon, 10 April 2017, 18:45:57 by zslane »

Offline norbauer

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #97 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 19:26:30 »
I can't help but think about Signature Plastics who is facing new competition from MaxKeys. The Chinese version of SA keycaps are virtually identical to SP's but can be sold at a substantially lower price due to their significantly lower labor costs. I think it will be extraordinarily difficult for SP to sell "Made in the USA" as its only value proposition. Already you have community members hungrily eyeing MaxKeys sets for their lower price.

I imagine that if the "Norbauer Case" was something that was in constant high demand, there would inevitably be a Chinese knock-off being sold at 75% of the quality level and half the price. And unless you are like Apple, willing to engage the same kind of labor exploitation your competition does, it would be a real struggle to find a sustainable customer base for that product.

The mantra in the US has always been "Innovate or Die", but I think globalization has made that more necessary than ever.

Well, I should first say that I love Signature Plastics because of the excellent job they've always done with my Galaxy Class design. And Melissa there in particular is great to deal with.

However, I think that a bit competitive pressure would be good for SP—if for no other reason than to drive them to differentiate into stuff that only they can do well because they're a US company. They could, if they had wanted to, come to have been known for amazing customer service and communication, community cultivation, and/or a luxury brand feeling with amazing packaging and cool little details aimed at delighting the customer. They haven't really fully done any of that. I can only assume that they believed for a long time that they had something that was so niche that competition wouldn't ever be very relevant. As such, they didn't really make the kind of investments in brand- and community-building that would be necessary to really help them resist being commoditized. PMK was a nice effort in that direction, but it has always felt kind of half-hearted and under-funded (and I think MassDrop partially, though unintentionally, obviated it a bit). Then again, I hear they're also swamped with more demand than they can meet, so maybe they're doing just fine. I hope so.

If somebody made a Chinese knockoff of my case design at 75% of the quality and half the price, I wouldn't be surprised nor would I complain too fervently. As a buyer, I love having those kinds of choices, and I often choose the more expensive product that gives me better feels and a nicer overall experience whenever I can afford to do so. I mean, after all, this hobby is all about extremely arcane aesthetic experiences in the first place. There is nothing in $200 keyboards that has to do with meeting necessity; it's all about having fun and a good feeling about an otherwise very sublunary object. So while getting a "cheap knockoff" may appeal to some people (which I entirely endorse), I think that sort of solution misses a core element what appeals about this hobby: having an extremely luxurious keyboard with a cool back-story and a sense of personal connection.

I'm not saying I could necessarily always give people a better buying and quality experience than a Chinese "knockoff" purveyor could, but I do try my best, and that's all I feel that I need to worry about. In any event, I'd certainly rather sell a tiny handful of a product to a small crowd of people who are delighted with the product and experience than be the knockoff company and sell a ton of something at a cut-throat price. I want no part in that game and I'm happy to cede it to anybody else. This is also why, incidentally, round 2 will almost surely be my last for this particular design. ;)

Of course, this is also all well and easy for me to say this since I have the luxury that this keyboard stuff is just a fun sideline/hobby for me (where my profit objectives are first and foremost not to lose money). So maybe that's easier for me to say than somebody else, but I think there is a kernel of truth in the strategy even for a purely profit-motivated business.

Offline zslane

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #98 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 19:59:06 »
In any event, I'd certainly rather sell a tiny handful of a product to a small crowd of people who are delighted with the product and experience than be the knockoff company and sell a ton of something at a cut-throat price.

Yeah, I probably chose poorly when using you and your keyboard cases as an example. The sort of marketplace pressures that have the potential to put small US companies out of business in a matter of a few short years don't really apply to individual artisans selling their wares to like-minded individuals who circulate within the same special interest community. But if your business relied on selling (on an on-going basis) to a substantial consumer base, it would be quite a struggle to compete with an industrial force that had access to nearly limitless labor at a tiny fraction of (your) cost.

For small-scale artisans, however, globalization opens the doors to customers previously closed off to them, and the world surely looks considerably rosier and full of exciting potential.

Offline zslane

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Re: [GB] CNC Aluminum Cases for Cooler Master TKL boards (r2) ORDERING
« Reply #99 on: Mon, 10 April 2017, 20:54:55 »
I have heard that as well, but I don't have a Pexon cable myself with which to test.

You can do this with the case, however. ;)


Ryan, could you elaborate on this magnetic connector a bit? Where does one get the connector kit that goes on the inside of the case? And how does one tell Pexon to make a cable compatible with this?