Author Topic: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?  (Read 5818 times)

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Offline OldIsNew

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So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 09:45:51 »
I've used IBM Model F boards,  KeyTronic foam and foil and a Harris capacitive metal leaf board. I, like many, love the Model F switches and I also really like the KeyTronic and Harris switches too.

I'm just curious what people think - do people consider capacitive boards "mechanical" or is that reserved for actual physical metal contact switches? It may just be semantics, but I've seen the question come up on a couple of threads and wonder if there is any kind of consensus about it.

Offline chyros

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #1 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 10:17:40 »
Personally, I call everything that isn't rubber dome "mechanical". I don't think that the sensing method has anything to do with it.
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Offline Riverman

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #2 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 11:33:49 »
I think this question is probably right up there with asking what type of oil filter you should use on Bob Is The Oil Guy.  You're going to get 10 million opinions.  That being said, I call my Topre a mechanical keyboard to anyone who asks what it is, even though I don't think it really is one.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #3 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 11:52:40 »
One school of thought feels that there need to be discreet, stand-alone switches in order to be "mechanical" that is, there is a fully independent mechanism to make and break electrical contact in each.

The IBM family, for example, has mechanisms that operate some sort of sensors ("feet" = pivot plates) and they are actually causing the current to flow. That is really more akin to a "slider over dome" concept, but mostly common usage is rubber dome vs everything else.

It is hard to produce an explanation for Topre not being a rubber dome keyboard.
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Offline Findecanor

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #4 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 12:49:48 »
A key does not need to have electrical contact to be mechanical. A membrane keyboard has electrical contact between membranes - but that does not make it mechanical.

I would define "mechanical key" is one that has:
* A "mechanism", in classic terms. There is at least two parts that together form a simple machine: a joint, a lever, wedge, etc. and...
* This mechanism plays a part in actuation of the key.

+ A IBM Buckling Spring switch (membrane or capacitative) is mechanical because the foot pivots.
+ Cherry MX is mechanical because the plunger has an inclined plane that presses against a leaf spring.
+ Alps SKCL/SKCM is mechanical because it has a plunger that presses against a leaf spring - that is an inclined plane.
+ Fujitsu Peerless is mechanical because the coiled spring interacts with the rubber dome that it sits on!

- A scissor switch is not mechanical: there is a mechanisms but the mechanism is not used to actuate the key.
- Topre is not mechanical because there is no classic mechanism: only a sensor, which provides a value in a range.
- Linear Flaretech is not mechanical because there is only a plunger: only a sensor which provides a value in a range.

? I am not sure if I should call Clicky Flaretech mechanical or not. It uses the same mechanism as Cherry MX, but it is not the force on the leaf spring that actuates - it is when the sensed position of the inner plunger crosses a threshold.
« Last Edit: Thu, 19 October 2017, 12:51:43 by Findecanor »

Offline zslane

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #5 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 13:40:37 »
I think Topre and Topre-clone boards label themselves as "electro-capacitive" rather than "mechanical" on their boxes and marketing literature. It is primarily mech board enthusiasts who "get it wrong" by calling all their boards (even Topre boards) "mechanical" as a kind of conversational shorthand for "expensive boards I can hack/tweak/modify".

Offline davkol

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 15:03:34 »
According to Reddit, there are two types of keyboards: mechanical and $5 rubber domes. They don't like being questioned about it either.

Then again, Reddit attracts idiots.

Offline zslane

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 15:21:50 »
Heh. The only way my daily driver--which is a Realforce RGB--could be called a $5 rubberdome is if the "$5" refers to the spacebar I put on it.

Offline klennkellon

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 16:26:02 »
I always saw it as mechanical if it actuates before bottoming out.

Offline davkol

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #9 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 17:03:50 »
Quote from: LDOCE
mechanical (technical)
~ relating to or produced by physical forces

I can give you a list of keyboards that aren't mechanical:
  • touch screens and other touch-sensitive surfaces (FingerWorks TouchStream anyone?)
  • projected keyboards
  • other virtual keyboards
  • that optical keyboard, on which you actuate keys by covering their light source with a fingertip/stick/whatever

Offline justinmtype

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 18:16:55 »
I always saw it as mechanical if it actuates before bottoming out.

Agreed.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 22:47:06 »
as long as Friction exists in the Universe..

it's technically , mechanical..



Offline rich1051414

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #12 on: Thu, 19 October 2017, 23:33:21 »
I say everything that isn't rubber dome ON MEMBRANE is mechanical. Capacitive(Topre) is not something a keyboard will do if they are cutting costs. Also, I consider the Model M to be mechanical, in spite of it being a membrane keyboard.
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Offline SamirD

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 20 October 2017, 00:10:39 »
I look at it more this way--is it an enthusiast keyboard or not?  That in itself will tell me if there's anything in there that's worth more than a cheaply made rubberdome.

Offline rowdy

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #14 on: Tue, 02 January 2018, 21:52:43 »
One school of thought feels that there need to be discreet, stand-alone switches in order to be "mechanical" that is, there is a fully independent mechanism to make and break electrical contact in each.

The IBM family, for example, has mechanisms that operate some sort of sensors ("feet" = pivot plates) and they are actually causing the current to flow. That is really more akin to a "slider over dome" concept, but mostly common usage is rubber dome vs everything else.

It is hard to produce an explanation for Topre not being a rubber dome keyboard.

I've generally gone with this definition, and seen it stated a few times in the past when this question has arisen.

You can think of Topre keyboards as The Ultimate Rubber Dome i.e. TURD keyboards.  Unfortunate acronym, perhaps.

Ultimately the label "rubber dome" fits Topre keyboards far more than "mechanical", which to me definitely implies a mechanical contraption that switches current on and off.
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Offline SamirD

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #15 on: Wed, 03 January 2018, 08:25:33 »
You can think of Topre keyboards as The Ultimate Rubber Dome i.e. TURD keyboards.
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Offline zslane

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #16 on: Wed, 03 January 2018, 12:29:30 »
Topre switches may not be mechanical according to some rigid definition, but they are definitely "mech keyboard enthusiast" switches, which is ultimately what matters to this community. They are high-end, both in terms of build quality and durability (compared to membrane rubberdomes), they feel great, sound great, and in some cases even take MX-stemmed keycaps. These are all the qualities that enthusiasts look for, which makes them honorary members of the "mechanical switch" family. That's why they usually get lumped in with MX and Alps style switches around here. Only the Topre haters insist on excluding them from the conversation.

Offline chyros

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #17 on: Wed, 03 January 2018, 16:08:26 »
The distinction is really meaningless tbh.
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Offline Puddsy

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Re: So are Capacitive Keyboards Mechanical?
« Reply #18 on: Wed, 03 January 2018, 16:09:44 »
The distinction is really meaningless tbh.

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