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Quote from: PancakeMSTR on Thu, 26 October 2017, 13:34:59 Do you have any idea why that alloy was discontinued?cost
Do you have any idea why that alloy was discontinued?
If it's the type that was common in the 80s, iirc, it was strong but too brittle for modern multi layer pcbs; I vaguely remember the articles in the tech press at the time. The more modern substrates came out that wouldn't crack when each layer was much thinner; modern PCBs are thinner and weaker under compression, but stronger under tension, so the multiple layers won't lift off. Although the older type was better for through mounts, as you get shorter stress fractures when drilling holes in it. Of course there isn't now, or wasn't back then, a one type of pcb; but that is the general gist of it, if memory serves me right.
Quote from: Puddsy on Thu, 26 October 2017, 15:48:47Quote from: PancakeMSTR on Thu, 26 October 2017, 13:34:59 Do you have any idea why that alloy was discontinued?costIf it's the type that was common in the 80s, iirc, it was strong but too brittle for modern multi layer pcbs; I vaguely remember the articles in the tech press at the time. The more modern substrates came out that wouldn't crack when each layer was much thinner; modern PCBs are thinner and weaker under compression, but stronger under tension, so the multiple layers won't lift off. Although the older type was better for through mounts, as you get shorter stress fractures when drilling holes in it. Of course there isn't now, or wasn't back then, a one type of pcb; but that is the general gist of it, if memory serves me right.
Quote from: consolation on Thu, 26 October 2017, 16:24:01If it's the type that was common in the 80s, iirc, it was strong but too brittle for modern multi layer pcbs; I vaguely remember the articles in the tech press at the time. The more modern substrates came out that wouldn't crack when each layer was much thinner; modern PCBs are thinner and weaker under compression, but stronger under tension, so the multiple layers won't lift off. Although the older type was better for through mounts, as you get shorter stress fractures when drilling holes in it. Of course there isn't now, or wasn't back then, a one type of pcb; but that is the general gist of it, if memory serves me right.Pretty sure they’re talking about the spring steel.
This is going to sound pretty grim and may insult but I do have a questionEllipse do you have anyone backing you up on the project management and distribution of the product if something were to happen to you. I know this usually does not get asked on other group buys but this is literally the biggest and complex community centered project I have ever seen on geekhack over 5 years being on here. You have have become a god.
We just passed $400,000 in orders - a major milestone for this project! Who would have expected so much awareness of the Model F!
Ordered an F62 .Thank Ellipse for the best GB so far.
I'd like something clarified, by Ellipse. We are still in an "Early Bird" round, correct? Then after this "early bird" round "ends," there is effectively a round 2, correct? What conditions have to be met for this "early bird" round to be over?
Quote from: PancakeMSTR on Thu, 02 November 2017, 11:01:00I'd like something clarified, by Ellipse. We are still in an "Early Bird" round, correct? Then after this "early bird" round "ends," there is effectively a round 2, correct? What conditions have to be met for this "early bird" round to be over?They have to be made and shipped, of course.
Quote from: InvidiousIgnoramus on Thu, 02 November 2017, 12:21:40Quote from: PancakeMSTR on Thu, 02 November 2017, 11:01:00I'd like something clarified, by Ellipse. We are still in an "Early Bird" round, correct? Then after this "early bird" round "ends," there is effectively a round 2, correct? What conditions have to be met for this "early bird" round to be over?They have to be made and shipped, of course.You're not quite understanding my question. Let me clarify: What conditions need to be met for Early bird ordering to close.
Quote from: PancakeMSTR on Thu, 02 November 2017, 12:37:45Quote from: InvidiousIgnoramus on Thu, 02 November 2017, 12:21:40Quote from: PancakeMSTR on Thu, 02 November 2017, 11:01:00I'd like something clarified, by Ellipse. We are still in an "Early Bird" round, correct? Then after this "early bird" round "ends," there is effectively a round 2, correct? What conditions have to be met for this "early bird" round to be over?They have to be made and shipped, of course.You're not quite understanding my question. Let me clarify: What conditions need to be met for Early bird ordering to close.I guess all the orders before he ships out any orders are all "early bird" round. So I assume he will keep postponing the deadline for "early bird" round util all the parts meet his standards, if they ever will.
We are still looking at shipping in Q1 2018 - again my apologies for the factory production delays. Even with a $400,000 manufacturing project we are not the highest priority project with the factory which focuses on much larger orders. I am happy they accepted the project and have spent a couple years of back and forth to perfect the parts - they have been a great partner except for the delays over the past year.Yes we are still in the early bird round for all orders. If all goes well with the factory timeline we can move to the regular round of orders next month! Fluffypupper these keyboards will be well worth the wait! Early on I decided that quality is the most important aspect of this project, above meeting any self-imposed timeline. I will not ship poor quality goods to save a few months, especially with all the funds everyone has put in already for their keyboards. I want the factory to make quality products matching original specs and that should last for decades of use.
Yes there is an extra pad and barrel to split each of the left/right shifts into two keys. This is for both the regular and split right shift PCBs.
Whoops - yes confirmed there is a barrel with no pad as part of the space bar.
At least double. Even IBM offshored some Model F components to Asia, like the PCB.
The springs are moving back to China. I found a factory willing to make the springs and am ordering samples this week. They said they have the advanced equipment to inspect each spring during production, like the US factory. The only US supplier of the old standard spring material would have required two months to produce the wire (not counting the time to make all the springs) so I am going back to China to make sure we stay on track. This large factory in China has enough capacity to make the needed 100,000+ springs in 1-2 weeks!
The spring samples have been ordered! I ordered half the samples with heat treatment and half without so that we can eliminate heat treating as a source of the sound differences. The samples should ship by DHL Express by the end of next week.
mini update + dark gray keys now available to order!Per the factory the key molds are expected to finish the first week of January. This is the same subcontractor that did a good job with the barrels and flippers (all to spec).The spring samples should arrive next week. These are made with a new factory that had the exact original standard material that IBM used for their springs (I had them analyzed at a lab). To speed up assembly, the factory expects to build a bulk spring attacher (their prototype could attach one spring and flipper at a time). Dark gray printed and unprinted sets are now up for order! https://www.modelfkeyboards.com/product/extra-set-of-brand-new-production-xt-quality-one-piece-keys/Total cost is $5 less than the $10 expected premium. These will be a limited early bird color to minimize extra setup charges for the final production run next year. You can pick free/other shipping if you want to add keys to your current order.To keep the project on track and avoid extra assembly variations, these are extra sets only - they can't be your only set or installed set if ordering a keyboard.
Nope the molds are still in production.
Here are the first factory photos of the unfinished springs made with IBM's original material spec (they have not yet had the final protective finish applied to match the originals).The springs should be finished up and shipped this week by DHL Express where I will examine them and hopefully sign off on them. (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
Here are the first factory photos of the unfinished springs made with IBM's original material spec (they have not yet had the final protective finish applied to match the originals).The springs should be finished up and shipped this week by DHL Express. I will examine them and hopefully sign off on them soon....