What Linux Distro do the Linux users of GH use?

[xondat]

Tried Mint in college for a few days, I like it but I feel like I'd never switch simply because so much more is supported for windows. Feel free to enlighten me though, I'd love to hear why I should switch to Linux.

There isn't necessarily "more", it's just that you are used to your windows programs. The Android Play store has "more" than the Itunes store, but how much of the Play store is garbage? Do we need 90 fake fart sound apps, 80 of which are the same exact app?

On the surface, Windows has more than Mac and Linux and in some specific things it does, but think about it more deeply. For graphics it's Photoshop, for office it's MS Office. There's Corel, Krita, Gimp, Open Office, and more for Windows, but how many know they even exist? Same with Office. Ask most office workers what text editor they use and most will say Word. Even when they have options, they don't even know they exist. So is there really more? Or is 90% of that just perception. The fact that the programs you know are not on Linux doesn't equate to significantly less options, just not the options you're used to.

Unless you play the latest trendy games or need something specific for work, odds are you could get by on Linux every bit as good as Windows. I'm not saying you should, you like Windows, you're familiar with it and see no reason to change, which is fine, just don't mistake quantity for quality.

I meant that for things that I download I rarely see a 'Download for Linux' section - it sounds like I was horribly wrong though, didn't mean to sound offence whatsoever, just that on the surface to me W10 looks better.

[sean]

Tried Mint in college for a few days, I like it but I feel like I'd never switch simply because so much more is supported for windows. Feel free to enlighten me though, I'd love to hear why I should switch to Linux.

There isn't necessarily "more", it's just that you are used to your windows programs. The Android Play store has "more" than the Itunes store, but how much of the Play store is garbage? Do we need 90 fake fart sound apps, 80 of which are the same exact app?

On the surface, Windows has more than Mac and Linux and in some specific things it does, but think about it more deeply. For graphics it's Photoshop, for office it's MS Office. There's Corel, Krita, Gimp, Open Office, and more for Windows, but how many know they even exist? Same with Office. Ask most office workers what text editor they use and most will say Word. Even when they have options, they don't even know they exist. So is there really more? Or is 90% of that just perception. The fact that the programs you know are not on Linux doesn't equate to significantly less options, just not the options you're used to.

Unless you play the latest trendy games or need something specific for work, odds are you could get by on Linux every bit as good as Windows. I'm not saying you should, you like Windows, you're familiar with it and see no reason to change, which is fine, just don't mistake quantity for quality.

I meant that for things that I download I rarely see a 'Download for Linux' section - it sounds like I was horribly wrong though, didn't mean to sound offence whatsoever, just that on the surface to me W10 looks better.

You typically don't download things from a web browser. Everything is done through the packages manager. There are numerous reasons why using a package manager is better than downloading and installing a program like you would on Windows. The biggest reason (for me) is that your programs will update while you update the rest of your system. I will assume though that the programs you were looking for were not available for Linux and it is more likely that the Linux alternatives are just as good as what you are using on Windows. Like Leslieann said if you're comfortable with Windows then that's perfectly fine but I'd encourage you to have fun trying different stuff out in Linux and expand your mind a little.

[sth]

Or just use a different unix entirely  )

YUP

[deduction]

Or just use a different unix entirely  )

YUP

I think I can hear RMS shouting from here! GNU(/Linux) is Not UNIX.   But I do love me some OpenBSD and FreeBSD.

[iri]

Other unices suck.

[CSCoder4ever]

Or just use a different unix entirely  )

YUP

I think I can hear RMS shouting from here! GNU(/Linux) is Not UNIX.   But I do love me some OpenBSD and FreeBSD.

Meh lol, Sorry RMS, as much as I respect you I have ideas myself.

Other unices suck.

Install suckless tools and they'll suckless.

[davkol]

Other unices suck.

Install suckless tools and they'll suckless.

It sounds funny (kinda like Schiit), but those guys are on crack.

[KRKS]

Well I am interested in trying BSD's at some point(especially since I have very high hopes for Lumina)

[sth]

Other unices suck.

computers suck universally

[sean]

My ext4 partition (which contained everything) on my laptop just straight up corrupted while I was using it. I honestly never though that would happen to me. I lost a lot of stuff but I don't think I lost anything critical. Currently reinstalling Arch at 3:30 AM so I have a laptop for class tomorrow! :S

[rowdy]

Well I am interested in trying BSD's at some point(especially since I have very high hopes for Lumina)

I used to use FreeBSD a lot, even had a few servers at home and work running it.  But Java support became more important, and we had some problems with the hardware running FreeBSD at work, and I retired the FreeBSD servers at home, and gradually moved over to Linux.

[Matt3o]

My ext4 partition (which contained everything) on my laptop just straight up corrupted while I was using it. I honestly never though that would happen to me. I lost a lot of stuff but I don't think I lost anything critical. Currently reinstalling Arch at 3:30 AM so I have a laptop for class tomorrow! :S

storage always fails, it's just a matter of when not if.

[CSCoder4ever]

Well I am interested in trying BSD's at some point(especially since I have very high hopes for Lumina)

I used to use FreeBSD a lot, even had a few servers at home and work running it.  But Java support became more important, and we had some problems with the hardware running FreeBSD at work, and I retired the FreeBSD servers at home, and gradually moved over to Linux.

If I can take a guess as to what the reason was for java support becoming important, Was it because of Jenkins? 

[Marizen]

Mostly using Ubuntu GNOME, but I switch around a lot. I just always end up going back to Ubuntu GNOME because I really like the interface and in terms of compatibility Ubuntu is the easiest. I used to love Manjaro, but I don't entirely trust yaourt.

[xtrafrood]

Well I am interested in trying BSD's at some point(especially since I have very high hopes for Lumina)

I used to use FreeBSD a lot, even had a few servers at home and work running it.  But Java support became more important, and we had some problems with the hardware running FreeBSD at work, and I retired the FreeBSD servers at home, and gradually moved over to Linux.

If I can take a guess as to what the reason was for java support becoming important, Was it because of Jenkins? 

Java became important because legions of children (like myself) where trained to save the parent company. See? It was written.

[Moistgun]

I've never used Linux before, only been chained to Windows my whole life.
And now, I'm required to use a Mac for work.

Thinking about getting some distro to dual boot at home.

[G-Dubs]

I'm currently running Xubuntu on a Thinkpad T420. I don't do anything out of the ordinary with it, but it's nice to keep up what little Linux skill I have.

[sean]

My ext4 partition (which contained everything) on my laptop just straight up corrupted while I was using it. I honestly never though that would happen to me. I lost a lot of stuff but I don't think I lost anything critical. Currently reinstalling Arch at 3:30 AM so I have a laptop for class tomorrow! :S

storage always fails, it's just a matter of when not if.

Yeah... That's why I have a triple redundant ZFS drive array on FreeNAS. All of my important stuff was backed up. I originally thought it was my old OCZ Vertex 4 that finally gave in but it turned out to be ext4 (which is known to degrade over time). I guess I'm lucky that I don't need to scrounge together some money for a new SSD...! (yet)

[CSCoder4ever]

if ext4 can degrade overtime, I wonder how much worse btrfs is about it. 

[sean]

if ext4 can degrade overtime, I wonder how much worse btrfs is about it. 

It's actually supposedly much better thank ext4, rivaling ZFS. Except for a few flaws such as not being able to accurately tell how big files are on the disk. You know, small inconveniences like that.

[rowdy]

if ext4 can degrade overtime, I wonder how much worse btrfs is about it. 

It's actually supposedly much better thank ext4, rivaling ZFS. Except for a few flaws such as not being able to accurately tell how big files are on the disk. You know, the little stuff.

I keep reading it as "betterFS", although it's supposed to be "butterFS", right?

[sean]

if ext4 can degrade overtime, I wonder how much worse btrfs is about it. 

It's actually supposedly much better thank ext4, rivaling ZFS. Except for a few flaws such as not being able to accurately tell how big files are on the disk. You know, the little stuff.

I keep reading it as "betterFS", although it's supposed to be "butterFS", right?

Either or is correct. You can also throw "bee-treeFS" into the mix

[CSCoder4ever]

Add B T R F S too lol.

if ext4 can degrade overtime, I wonder how much worse btrfs is about it. 

It's actually supposedly much better thank ext4, rivaling ZFS. Except for a few flaws such as not being able to accurately tell how big files are on the disk. You know, small inconveniences like that.

I also hear it's still full of bugs itself lol, but oh well, Once the 16.04 LTS releases of some *buntu I'll switch my desktop's SSDs to btrfs lol.
I mean my laptop already went btrfs, so why not just follow the trend I figure.

[xtrafrood]

So butterFS has some kind of checksum? I see. I see.

[KRKS]

I think I'm at a bit of a loss here.

I'm going to be changing my system soon. So I've been looking around at systemd-less distros. And the sight ain't pretty.

KDE4(pre-systemd dependency) version of PCLinuxOS might as well be called PCBloatOS. A lot of stuff, including either control center or the settings manager(two cog icons next to each other on the desktop bar, no wonder I can't tell which is which) hard-depends on webkit. And it ships with a lot of crap like Skype or Flash out of the box. But then again, it's appealing to first time Linux users, and I guess it'd be good at that. I may try the LXDE version, but I have a bad feeling about it since as bloaty as KDE is, most of it wasn't KDE's fault and I'm afraid LXDE version will have it too.

Void is void of documentation. Also, the default menu for Openbox has exactly ONE program that comes with the system, and that's Firefox. Yup, can't even open a terminal without editing the menu file outside of OB and then coming back. This clearly shows that they don't care at all about *box workflow. Probably too busy wth tiling, cause that's what all cool kids do. Also, not sure if it's just a live boot issue, but xbps always reported Lumina needing exactly 7MB more than I had free.

Devuan is behind schedule. It'll probably be a strong contender for best distro around(not just systemd-less) once it's done, but right now there aren't even security updates.

I also considered installing Debian Wheezy and then transforming that into Devuan, but trying to install a media player convinced me against it. A bunch of VLC and Mplayer packages were missing. On the other hand the players for KDE(Dragon Player) and GNOME(forgot the name) are there, but they depend on their environments, which depend on systemd.

Elementary is listed on Distrowatch as systemd-less but it's not.

I'm not even touching Arch because my friend does that, and he says that systemd is pushed into dependencies of more and more stuff and frankly he's considering installing Gentoo because he reckons it'll take less time for everyday use.

To see why I haven't tried Manjaro, please set your system clock back a bunch.

So it seems like all I have left is waiting for Devuan, installing something advanced like CRUX/Slax/Gentoo, or going BSD. Although I haven't tried Antix, Puppy and possibly LXDE-based PCLOS.

Any remarks or suggestions?

[sth]

Void is void of documentation. Also, the default menu for Openbox has exactly ONE program that comes with the system, and that's Firefox. Yup, can't even open a terminal without editing the menu file outside of OB and then coming back. This clearly shows that they don't care at all about *box workflow. Probably too busy wth tiling, cause that's what all cool kids do. Also, not sure if it's just a live boot issue, but xbps always reported Lumina needing exactly 7MB more than I had free.

void ships with man pages :/ the lead dev uses GNOME3 - nobody on the dev team cares what you do with void, they just make it work. almost every package is upstream so if you need documentation on anything, you know where to find it. the only thing that really makes void 'void' is xbps and that has extensive docs on their website.

Devuan is behind schedule. It'll probably be a strong contender for best distro around(not just systemd-less) once it's done, but right now there aren't even security updates.

devuan has been behind schedule since they started. their mailing list is a room full of monkeys throwing **** at each other.

So it seems like all I have left is waiting for Devuan, installing something advanced like CRUX/Slax/Gentoo, or going BSD. Although I haven't tried Antix, Puppy and possibly LXDE-based PCLOS.

Any remarks or suggestions?

you are going to be disappointed in CRUX if you don't like void. even less handholding there - you do EVERYTHING yourself.

openbsd is great except for the awful web browser performance. everything is really well documented in openbsd via man pages

[smknjoe]

Slackware

[iLLucionist]

openbsd is great except for the awful web browser performance. everything is really well documented in openbsd via man pages

Yeah... why is it actually that web browser performance is so awful on *BSD?

[iri]

Slackware

Is the way to go.

[Altis]

Bit of a noob question here:

Is pretty much all the software for Ubuntu also available for its derivatives? For example, Xubuntu, or even more specifically, ChaletOS (which is based off Xubuntu).

I much prefer the ChaletOS layout at the moment but want to make sure that I'm not limiting myself with it. I'm also looking at using Lubuntu on an older laptop since it's said to be more lightweight... but again, I don't want to be affected in terms of software availability.

Thanks!

[deduction]

Bit of a noob question here:

Is pretty much all the software for Ubuntu also available for its derivatives? For example, Xubuntu, or even more specifically, ChaletOS (which is based off Xubuntu).

I much prefer the ChaletOS layout at the moment but want to make sure that I'm not limiting myself with it. I'm also looking at using Lubuntu on an older laptop since it's said to be more lightweight... but again, I don't want to be affected in terms of software availability.

Thanks!

Short answer: Yes. 

Slightly longer answer: All Ubuntu derivatives use the same package repositories.  The distinguishing feature between Ubuntu derivatives is the default desktop environment.

[Vibex]

Had to stop using linux  becuase I love my vidya games to much. Been playing around with cygwin though. Never really realized how powerful it was. It's (almost) like I never left linux.

Bit of a noob question here:

Is pretty much all the software for Ubuntu also available for its derivatives? For example, Xubuntu, or even more specifically, ChaletOS (which is based off Xubuntu).

I much prefer the ChaletOS layout at the moment but want to make sure that I'm not limiting myself with it. I'm also looking at using Lubuntu on an older laptop since it's said to be more lightweight... but again, I don't want to be affected in terms of software availability.

Thanks!

Similar to what deduction said. Yes, though you may run into small  problems specific to a distro though. For Ubuntu based distros, those should be few and far between.

[sean]

Had to stop using linux  becuase I love my vidya games to much. Been playing around with cygwin though. Never really realized how powerful it was. It's (almost) like I never left linux.

How dedicated were you to using Linux? There are definitely ways to run any and all Windows games within Linux if you have the hardware required.

Edit: My post kinda sounds disdainful, which is not my intention.

[Vibex]

Had to stop using linux  becuase I love my vidya games to much. Been playing around with cygwin though. Never really realized how powerful it was. It's (almost) like I never left linux.

How dedicated were you to using Linux? There are definitely ways to run any and all Windows games within Linux if you have the hardware required.

Edit: My post kinda sounds disdainful, which is not my intention.

I know there are ways (I've pretty much used them all at some point or another), but I got tired of fixing problems with them. And I guess I should have stated I still use linux on some of my pc's, just not my main rigs or main laptop.
EDIT: Also cygwin really is powerful. I lived mostly in terminals, and it feels almost identical.

[deduction]

Had to stop using linux  becuase I love my vidya games to much. Been playing around with cygwin though. Never really realized how powerful it was. It's (almost) like I never left linux.

How dedicated were you to using Linux? There are definitely ways to run any and all Windows games within Linux if you have the hardware required.

Edit: My post kinda sounds disdainful, which is not my intention.

Most of the people I know that need winders for gaming end up using KVM virtual machines and PCIE passthrough.  I don't really care about gaming, but I hear it performs on par with booting to winders.

[xtrafrood]

Had to stop using linux  becuase I love my vidya games to much. Been playing around with cygwin though. Never really realized how powerful it was. It's (almost) like I never left linux.

How dedicated were you to using Linux? There are definitely ways to run any and all Windows games within Linux if you have the hardware required.

Edit: My post kinda sounds disdainful, which is not my intention.

Is this true? I did everything I could to emulate an mmorpg. I lost 10 fps on average when I compared my emulated copy to my non-emulated copy. At the time 10 fps seemed like a lot, I suppose 10 fps is negligible for those that can max out graphics settings for newer titles. (I used Wine/PlayOnLinux for emulation)

[Altis]

Thanks Vibex and deduction. I'll stick with ChaletOS until I encounter a problem.

I'm still fairly unfamiliar with the real workings of Linux. Linux is to me what Windows is for the average Windows user, for the most part I'd say. I know how to get around, do updates, and install stuff... but there's so very much I still don't really know or am not comfortable with.

I am trying to get better but I find that so much of the discussion and information I find is immediately over my head.

Ex: I want to make 1080p a resolution and use it at startup.
Answer given: "Since Kernel 3.2.14523.34.23 subset 5 of the flux capacitor means you need to write a shell script to call new packages that utilize the tar files..." 

I embellish slightly but that's often how it looks to me. 

[sean]

Had to stop using linux  becuase I love my vidya games to much. Been playing around with cygwin though. Never really realized how powerful it was. It's (almost) like I never left linux.

How dedicated were you to using Linux? There are definitely ways to run any and all Windows games within Linux if you have the hardware required.

Edit: My post kinda sounds disdainful, which is not my intention.

Most of the people I know that need winders for gaming end up using KVM virtual machines and PCIE passthrough.  I don't really care about gaming, but I hear it performs on par with booting to winders.

Yeah, that was what I was getting at. I'm using KVM-QEMU with vga passthrough to play mostly Halo: Online and to do schoolwork (Microsoft Visio and SQL Server). I think boot and load times could be on par with a bare metal solution but since I'm using virt.io loading times are slower.

Also I should mention there have been some big strides in getting 3D acceleration to Qemu without vga passthrough. Maybe in the near future we'll be able to run virtual machines for gaming without the need for a dedicated graphics card.

Is this true? I did everything I could to emulate an mmorpg. I lost 10 fps on average when I compared my emulated copy to my non-emulated copy. At the time 10 fps seemed like a lot, I suppose 10 fps is negligible for those that can max out graphics settings for newer titles.

Show Image

(I used Wine for emulation)

WINE: Wine Is Not an Emulator. Windows libraries are translated so that Windows programs can be run natively in Linux. I'm not surprised by the performance drop either. I remember playing Skyrim a few years ago under Wine and there was about a 50% performance hit.

[sean]

I'm still fairly unfamiliar with the real workings of Linux. Linux is to me what Windows is for the average Windows user, for the most part I'd say. I know how to get around, do updates, and install stuff... but there's so very much I still don't really know or am not comfortable with.

I am trying to get better but I find that so much of the discussion and information I find is immediately over my head.

Ex: I want to make 1080p a resolution and use it at startup.
Answer given: "Since Kernel 3.2.14523.34.23 subset 5 of the flux capacitor means you need to write a shell script to call new packages that utilize the tar files..." 

I embellish slightly but that's often how it looks to me. 

I still feel the same way whenever I try something new in Linux, My best advice would be to have patience and to not be afraid to break something. Most of the stuff on Linux isn't very hard to do; what is hard is setting a knowledge precedence. When I don't have prior knowledge on something then I have a hard time figuring out how to get it working. Then when I run into problems it's very had to troubleshoot what's causing those problems, again because I'm missing that prior knowledge. But once you start to understand how things work I guarantee you it will start being much easier for you.

[deduction]

Thanks Vibex and deduction. I'll stick with ChaletOS until I encounter a problem.

I'm still fairly unfamiliar with the real workings of Linux. Linux is to me what Windows is for the average Windows user, for the most part I'd say. I know how to get around, do updates, and install stuff... but there's so very much I still don't really know or am not comfortable with.

I am trying to get better but I find that so much of the discussion and information I find is immediately over my head.

Ex: I want to make 1080p a resolution and use it at startup.
Answer given: "Since Kernel 3.2.14523.34.23 subset 5 of the flux capacitor means you need to write a shell script to call new packages that utilize the tar files..." 

I embellish slightly but that's often how it looks to me. 

That's not unusual.  Don't feel bad - you're certainly not alone and I think many of us have felt the same way at one point or another.

The good news is that, because we're all using open source software, and the documentation is equally free and open source, you can almost always find detailed and accurate guides by formulating good searches for the technical phrases you do not understand.  Having strong Google-fu is an invaluable asset to the Linux learning process.

Google generally does a really good job of correcting typos and finding results it thinks the user wants, rather than the results for which the user queried.  This can be a huge pain the ass for the Linux and BSD world.  (I'm looking at you, OpenBSD, for calling my favorite load balancer 'relayd'.  )  Google will often interpret your error logs when you want to search for occurrences of the exact same log message.  You can revert this 'feature' by switching into verbatim search mode, as shown in the attachment below.

[xtrafrood]

Had to stop using linux  becuase I love my vidya games to much. Been playing around with cygwin though. Never really realized how powerful it was. It's (almost) like I never left linux.

How dedicated were you to using Linux? There are definitely ways to run any and all Windows games within Linux if you have the hardware required.

Edit: My post kinda sounds disdainful, which is not my intention.

Most of the people I know that need winders for gaming end up using KVM virtual machines and PCIE passthrough.  I don't really care about gaming, but I hear it performs on par with booting to winders.

Yeah, that was what I was getting at. I'm using KVM-QEMU with vga passthrough to play mostly Halo: Online and to do schoolwork (Microsoft Visio and SQL Server). I think boot and load times could be on par with a bare metal solution but since I'm using virt.io loading times are slower.

Also I should mention there have been some big strides in getting 3D acceleration to Qemu without vga passthrough. Maybe in the near future we'll be able to run virtual machines for gaming without the need for a dedicated graphics card.

Is this true? I did everything I could to emulate an mmorpg. I lost 10 fps on average when I compared my emulated copy to my non-emulated copy. At the time 10 fps seemed like a lot, I suppose 10 fps is negligible for those that can max out graphics settings for newer titles.

Show Image

(I used Wine for emulation)

WINE: Wine Is Not an Emulator. Windows libraries are translated so that Windows programs can be run natively in Linux. I'm not surprised by the performance drop either. I remember playing Skyrim a few years ago under Wine and there was about a 50% performance hit.

Ah I see, they might as well call it Windows Emulator like it was called initially. Perhaps I should find better alternatives in the future

[Vibex]

Thanks Vibex and deduction. I'll stick with ChaletOS until I encounter a problem.

I'm still fairly unfamiliar with the real workings of Linux. Linux is to me what Windows is for the average Windows user, for the most part I'd say. I know how to get around, do updates, and install stuff... but there's so very much I still don't really know or am not comfortable with.

I am trying to get better but I find that so much of the discussion and information I find is immediately over my head.

Ex: I want to make 1080p a resolution and use it at startup.
Answer given: "Since Kernel 3.2.14523.34.23 subset 5 of the flux capacitor means you need to write a shell script to call new packages that utilize the tar files..." 

I embellish slightly but that's often how it looks to me. 

Honestly I would reccomend installing gentoo or arch on a spare pc (or vm if you dont have an extra computer laying around). My first distro was funtoo, and it really helped me learn how to use and understand linux.

[CSCoder4ever]

going back to the Systemd discussion, I think you'll want to avoid FreeBSD at some point since it seems like it wants to create an init that imitates systemd.

Although as much as I despise systemd, I guess in some ways you can't get away from it. That or I just don't care anymore, one of the two.

[sean]

going back to the Systemd discussion, I think you'll want to avoid FreeBSD at some point since it seems like it wants to create an init that imitates systemd.

Although as much as I despise systemd, I guess in some ways you can't get away from it. That or I just don't care anymore, one of the two.

FreeBSD is much more monolithic when compared to Linux, so something like systemd would make a bit more sense if implemented on FreeBSD. The biggest reason why systemd's bad is because of how much it replaces other GNU/FOSS software which is completely against Linux philosophy.

I'm writing about systemd in my tech writing class as if I were making a recommendation to the Arch Linux devs to stop using systemd as its default init system. I've learned how it's insecure, bloated, and how it's monopolizing itself within major OS's among other things.

[vivalarevolución]

Thanks Vibex and deduction. I'll stick with ChaletOS until I encounter a problem.

Ex: I want to make 1080p a resolution and use it at startup.
Answer given: "Since Kernel 3.2.14523.34.23 subset 5 of the flux capacitor means you need to write a shell script to call new packages that utilize the tar files..." 

I embellish slightly but that's often how it looks to me. 

lol, this made me laugh.

[CSCoder4ever]

https://notehub.org/klz3i

Sad but true, not even sure if I should've posted it here, but I thought it was relevant enough.

[Matt3o]

this leads to an incontrovertible truth:

Linux sucks, but it's okay.

[sean]

https://notehub.org/klz3i

Sad but true, not even sure if I should've posted it here, but I thought it was relevant enough.

This article is confusing to say the least. First the author complains about Steam not working quite right on an obscure Window Manager, Fluxbox. In fact the only actual complaint the author has is that the window will not resize beyond a certain point because it isn't using a standard toolkit. The argument is false either way because you can still limit window sizes with either toolkit. The rest of the problems are specific to his WM since I couldn't replicate them in Gnome 3. In fact I would assume the issues are closer related to X and not Steam.

The author then goes to complain that Steam doesn't use commonly used toolkits like QT4/GTK3 which makes it look different from other applications that are using a specific toolkit. Maybe I'm in the minority here but I want and expect Steam to act and look exactly how it was designed to act and look. It doesn't use a toolkit because it's supposed to feel exactly like it does on Windows, and it does a damn good job at doing just that. In fact the rest of the article goes on about how its bad that Steam is ported to look and feel exactly the way it's supposed to look and feel. Now I could be wrong here but I am certain that just about all Steam users on Linux actually want it to look and feel as it does on Windows, because that is what users are accustomed to.

The author claims that SIGKILL risks corrupting Steams data but I haven't seen any indication of that by anyone.

They then go on to complain about how the Steam client works exactly how it is designed and expected to work. The argument just makes no sense.

Then they complain about how it lacks command line options but doesn't go into what useful command line options it could include. --version may make sense to add but it's just so nitpicky.

Then they complain about Steam being 32 bit. Alright sure they're totally right on that one.

I don't feel like going on anymore, I feel like every answer to the authors complaints are that Steam is the way is is because it is the way it's supposed to be and is what everybody wants it to be(say that ten times fast). If they don't like it so much then they should use a Steam Pidgin plugin and launch games through a shortcut. You don't need the client open to do either of those things.

I get that Steam violates the Unix philosophy in just about every way, but I have a slight feeling gaming in general violates Unix philosophy. I'm sure when Steam was ported Valve wasn't sweating to make sure every possible thing was compatible with Fluxbox, but was rather focused on expanding its client to a market that has been desperately awaiting its arrival for years. It should be no surprise to anyone that when Valve said they were porting Steam to Linux they, well, ported Steam to Linux.

[bricomaz]

https://notehub.org/klz3i

Sad but true, not even sure if I should've posted it here, but I thought it was relevant enough.

This article is confusing to say the least. First the author complains about Steam not working quite right on an obscure Window Manager, Fluxbox.
[...]

I've been using fluxbox at work and at home for YEARS now and I've never had any issues the author describes so I agree with sean here. I really had any issues whatsoever using it with fluxbox (or any other WM) but since the guy looks like he knows (more than) something about unix I don't know what to think. Inside the steam package there are copies of libraries handling the X protocol normally found on any linux distro so my guess here is Valve is using some old copies in respect to the author's distro. Like a windows program using dll from win 3.1

Anyway since the thread was about the linux distro I can add:

• (X)ubuntu at home (guess what I use fluxbox!)
• Ubuntu LTS at work on my workstation (yeah, also fluxbox here)
• Fedora on servers
• AIX on another server (show me you have the guts for that!  )
• CentOS on cloud servers

And for anyone else complaining about poor linux performance on games: are you still dual booting just to play games? In that case virtualization is the way to go:

• boot in windoze
• play games
• install virtualbox (or vmplayer) for free (almost no brainer)
• try - fullscreen - any distro you want for free (no partitioning/resizing risks involved)

You have a computer capable of playing modern games ==> linux on the Virtual Machine is as fast as the real thing.

[KRKS]

an obscure Window Manager, Fluxbox.

uwotm8

Also I've heard of similar problems on much more popular tiling managers, and since as the article says, what they did costs them more effort than just not giving a crap and letting the WM figure it out, that point is moot. And if you follow this issue in i3wm closely, you'll notice that quite a bit of code exclusively for handling steam was added between versions 4.4 and 4.11

As for the rest, well, Linux is NOT Windows. I think this article, as old as it is, should be compulsory reading before one's first install. Even though it's almost 10 years old, and there are a lot of distributions catering to Windows users, they make what my friends and I call "Windows users currently not on Windows". Some use the word "secondaries" as most of us come from the Touhou fandom(a "secondary" is someone who hasn't played the Touhou games and only knows derivative works, and threrefore only has second-hand experience and/or knowledge about Touhou which leads to a lot of misconceptions).

I used to frequent the linuxmasterrace subreddit. For the longest time the sidebar had no mention of any Linux subreddits, adding linux4noobs and linuxquestions only after they became bored of doing tech support. Meanwhile they always looked up to the PCMR subreddit. There were a bunch of people visibly displeased about that, including one guy who wrote the wisest words to ever be there:

Linux isn't PCMR because we're not limited to PC's

But they quit, one by one, because the jerking was too strong, even after a bunch of anti-Linux threads on PCMR. Although the author of the aforementioned quote was bullied out of reddit entirely after pointing out in a linux_gaming thread about VM pass-throughs that virtualisation of Windows isn't Linux gaming, and in fact hurts Linux gaming because it fuels the "they'll play it on Windows anyway" argument against it. Both subreddits' users are mostly the aforementioned "Windows users currently not on Windows"/"secondaries".

It may also be the reason why the systemd assimilation went so easily - it does so many things "the Windows way", that "Windows users currently not on Windows" might've just felt right at home with it, and people catering to them decided to go with it(with exception of PCLinuxOS).

That's also why the legendary "Year of the Linux desktop" never came and became a meme - "easy" became synonymous with with "Windows-like", and people are playing catch-up instead of improving their own system.