Author Topic: [IC] THINK6.5° - PC/Alu 65% Keyboard (Brass Raffle 4/13)  (Read 185135 times)

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Offline yur1orlov

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Man that full brass black with red samurai looks good
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Offline voxkey

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Skip the PVD on the solid brass and accelerate its patina with various oils. I want it to look like it’s been pulled from a shipwreck.  :)

Without surface treatment, the brass may oxidize though :(

Yes. That’s the idea :P

Offline bunanapeel

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Hmmmm idk if I would go for the full brass version, knowing my luck I would miss my chance anyways.  If I got a set of gmk olivia with the rose gold brass case I would do it in a heartbeat tho.  But honestly I'm mostly interested in this case because of the PC material.

Offline PikaJoyce

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Hmmmm idk if I would go for the full brass version, knowing my luck I would miss my chance anyways.  If I got a set of gmk olivia with the rose gold brass case I would do it in a heartbeat tho.  But honestly I'm mostly interested in this case because of the PC material.
Totally the same. I wanna see and hear what interesting things a t h i c c PC plate could do.

Offline oldcat

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Hmmmm idk if I would go for the full brass version, knowing my luck I would miss my chance anyways.  If I got a set of gmk olivia with the rose gold brass case I would do it in a heartbeat tho.  But honestly I'm mostly interested in this case because of the PC material.

PC is awesome! I added the option for full brass primarily because there was a strong push for it from the Chinese group :)
And it appears many GH friends are interested as well, so we shall see how this develops. In any way, full brass will not affect the PC Group Buy.

Offline oldcat

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Hmmmm idk if I would go for the full brass version, knowing my luck I would miss my chance anyways.  If I got a set of gmk olivia with the rose gold brass case I would do it in a heartbeat tho.  But honestly I'm mostly interested in this case because of the PC material.
Totally the same. I wanna see and hear what interesting things a t h i c c PC plate could do.

Yes, thicc PC plate can do wonders. haha

Offline oldcat

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For DMG and Olivia fans.



Offline mrboli

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So from what I gather here, the badge is removable and swappable?

What does it look like without a badge and can there be a PC insert (for color matching purposes)
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Offline Bhk1004

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Need render with brass caps.

Offline oldcat

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So from what I gather here, the badge is removable and swappable?

What does it look like without a badge and can there be a PC insert (for color matching purposes)

Yes the badge is removable and replaceable.

Yes, it is possible to have a PC badge. Great idea regarding a PC badge. I will do a render with the PC insert.

Offline voxkey

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So from what I gather here, the badge is removable and swappable?

What does it look like without a badge and can there be a PC insert (for color matching purposes)

Also keep in mind the badge file will be released after the GB, so getting one 3D printed in a custom color to match a keyset should be pretty inexpensive.

Offline oldcat

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So from what I gather here, the badge is removable and swappable?

What does it look like without a badge and can there be a PC insert (for color matching purposes)

Also keep in mind the badge file will be released after the GB, so getting one 3D printed in a custom color to match a keyset should be pretty inexpensive.

That's correct! 3D print is quite affordable, even in the US :)

Offline keysRus

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Hey oldcat, any word on whether the hotswap pcb will work in the compatible case yet? (Was hoping to buy 2 pcbs, one non hot swap and one that is)

Offline oldcat

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Hey oldcat, any word on whether the hotswap pcb will work in the compatible case yet? (Was hoping to buy 2 pcbs, one non hot swap and one that is)

Hey bro, hotswap PCB will work on the compatible layout, but only with the fixed layout it comes with. Not sure if this is what you are asking?
BTW, love you user ID :)

Offline foxmancore

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that rose gold brass looks awesome, will definitely join the raffle for it  :D

Offline mrboli

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Yes the badge is removable and replaceable.

Yes, it is possible to have a PC badge. Great idea regarding a PC badge. I will do a render with the PC insert.

Awesome. Loving this whole project! Definitely doing it right! The hype is so real even on instagram.

BTW what's the reasoning behind the PC plate? I know you mentioned it was about sound? I'm not aware of why this would be the case. I've only heard of brass having better sound due to certain metallic properties people draw parallels with musical instruments and people say it feels better since it's solid.

Also super curious if a full brass build would have a lot of interesting sounds with a super tactile / clicky switch or even just unlubed linears haha
KBD67 Zealios V2 65g | HHKB Pro 2 | Filco TKL MX Black | Razer BlackWidow

Offline fractl

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Hi oldcat,

I'm wondering, since you'll be getting prototypes, if there's a chance that you might be posting a sound test of the keyboard prior to or during the GB?  I know this doesn't usually happen, but, given that the keyboard is being built around the thick PC plate, and being designed to eliminate the need for sound dampening, I thought that might be very interesting and informative, particularly since the suggestion is that the keyboard might sound fairly different than what we're generally used to.  Frankly, I'm hoping to join the GB either way, but it doesn't hurt to be informed.   :D

Offline voxkey

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Yes the badge is removable and replaceable.

Yes, it is possible to have a PC badge. Great idea regarding a PC badge. I will do a render with the PC insert.

Awesome. Loving this whole project! Definitely doing it right! The hype is so real even on instagram.

BTW what's the reasoning behind the PC plate? I know you mentioned it was about sound? I'm not aware of why this would be the case. I've only heard of brass having better sound due to certain metallic properties people draw parallels with musical instruments and people say it feels better since it's solid.

Also super curious if a full brass build would have a lot of interesting sounds with a super tactile / clicky switch or even just unlubed linears haha

PC really let’s the sound of the switch come through unmolested and because it’s pretty flexible you can build a thick integrated plate with it and not have to worry about it being too stiff. So you end up with nice sound, consistent feel, and no harsh bottom out.

Full brass sounds great, but this is obviously subjective. If you can get spring ping reverb under control, it should sound nice, full, and deep.

Offline oldcat

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Yes the badge is removable and replaceable.

Yes, it is possible to have a PC badge. Great idea regarding a PC badge. I will do a render with the PC insert.

Awesome. Loving this whole project! Definitely doing it right! The hype is so real even on instagram.

BTW what's the reasoning behind the PC plate? I know you mentioned it was about sound? I'm not aware of why this would be the case. I've only heard of brass having better sound due to certain metallic properties people draw parallels with musical instruments and people say it feels better since it's solid.

Also super curious if a full brass build would have a lot of interesting sounds with a super tactile / clicky switch or even just unlubed linears haha

PC really let’s the sound of the switch come through unmolested and because it’s pretty flexible you can build a thick integrated plate with it and not have to worry about it being too stiff. So you end up with nice sound, consistent feel, and no harsh bottom out.

Full brass sounds great, but this is obviously subjective. If you can get spring ping reverb under control, it should sound nice, full, and deep.

Yes the badge is removable and replaceable.

Yes, it is possible to have a PC badge. Great idea regarding a PC badge. I will do a render with the PC insert.

Awesome. Loving this whole project! Definitely doing it right! The hype is so real even on instagram.

BTW what's the reasoning behind the PC plate? I know you mentioned it was about sound? I'm not aware of why this would be the case. I've only heard of brass having better sound due to certain metallic properties people draw parallels with musical instruments and people say it feels better since it's solid.

Also super curious if a full brass build would have a lot of interesting sounds with a super tactile / clicky switch or even just unlubed linears haha

Yes the badge is removable and replaceable.

Yes, it is possible to have a PC badge. Great idea regarding a PC badge. I will do a render with the PC insert.

Awesome. Loving this whole project! Definitely doing it right! The hype is so real even on instagram.

BTW what's the reasoning behind the PC plate? I know you mentioned it was about sound? I'm not aware of why this would be the case. I've only heard of brass having better sound due to certain metallic properties people draw parallels with musical instruments and people say it feels better since it's solid.

Also super curious if a full brass build would have a lot of interesting sounds with a super tactile / clicky switch or even just unlubed linears haha

PC really let’s the sound of the switch come through unmolested and because it’s pretty flexible you can build a thick integrated plate with it and not have to worry about it being too stiff. So you end up with nice sound, consistent feel, and no harsh bottom out.

Full brass sounds great, but this is obviously subjective. If you can get spring ping reverb under control, it should sound nice, full, and deep.

Voxkey basically provided the gist of it behind the design choice. I will explain in a bit of more details:

First off, people like consistent typing experience. It is widely accepted that tray mount is least consistent, top mount is a bit better and gasket seems promising (IMO still pretty bad based on recent sound test videos of Volcano66). Integrated thick plates are the most consistent, and it has been tested.

Second, people also do not enjoy the stiffness or the harshness of bottoming out (especially with tactile switches) due to no flex and reverberation of the metal sound. In this respect, Tray mount is ok, top mount is fine, and gasket is also promising. However, integrated thick, metal plates are not good.

To achieve an ideal balance and combination, one would expect gasket to be the happy medium. However, the question is whether there is a better design choice. My experiment results show that the sound of the typing depends quite a bit on the typing material, not so much the mounting mechanism (tested by myself). I have tried plates of numerous materials as comparisons, in different thickness, including aluminum, brass, polycarbonate, FR4, carbon fiber, steel. And I find PC to have a very nice property of absorbing the impact and preserving or even amplifying the sound and feel of the switch.

The last point, 1.5mm PC was way too flex and soft. Hence the final choice of 4.5mm PC. It is more difficult and costly to machine, than any other plate. But here we go.

Regarding your question around full brass. I have not used full brass in the past. I have tried keyboards with 1.5mm and 5mm brass plates. I would say brass sounds and feels better than steel and aluminum. If you can sort of get rid of the possible reverberation (I am not sure how serious it will be in a full brass model - need to find out), it will be golden, as you said it has some desirable qualities in the sound. I'd imagine it to be a super solid feeling.

« Last Edit: Thu, 21 March 2019, 18:05:25 by oldcat »

Offline oldcat

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Hi oldcat,

I'm wondering, since you'll be getting prototypes, if there's a chance that you might be posting a sound test of the keyboard prior to or during the GB?  I know this doesn't usually happen, but, given that the keyboard is being built around the thick PC plate, and being designed to eliminate the need for sound dampening, I thought that might be very interesting and informative, particularly since the suggestion is that the keyboard might sound fairly different than what we're generally used to.  Frankly, I'm hoping to join the GB either way, but it doesn't hurt to be informed.   :D

Thanks for the support!

For sure, I will either have Potter or myself record typing videos.

To be clear, it does not dampen the sound, rather, it removes the metal pingings and preserves the sound of your switch. It might even amplify your native switch sound, depending on what switch you use.

Offline fractl

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Great news... I'll definitely be looking forward to the typing video.  As for the descriptions regarding the way that the design and materials affect the sound, well, it all sounds very good to me.  Like most mechanical keyboard enthusiasts, I like a good click and/or clack, but do really dislike any type of accompanying resonance or echo.  Also, I'm not very enthusiastic about thin aluminum plates, definitely including integrated ones.  In fact, I'm not that excited about the acoustic properties of aluminum in general... again, the thinner the worse.  Of course, aluminum is comparatively easy to machine, and it's not as if a small group buy is going to be able to fund the type of PC injection-molding used for parts that are manufactured in the hundreds of thousands.  So, yes, this is where machined PC becomes really interesting, particularly at your projected price point.  Long story short, we seem to have the same aversions and want the same thing from a keyboard, which is what makes this so interesting to me.  Good luck with the rest of the process!

Offline keysRus

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Hey oldcat, any word on whether the hotswap pcb will work in the compatible case yet? (Was hoping to buy 2 pcbs, one non hot swap and one that is)

Hey bro, hotswap PCB will work on the compatible layout, but only with the fixed layout it comes with. Not sure if this is what you are asking?
BTW, love you user ID :)

Basically. So, the compatible layout is a different cut of the actual plate, right? Will it still have the same "perfect cut" snugness of the regular ansi hotswap layout in a regular case, if I use the hotswap pcb with ansi setup in the compatible case?

Hehe thanks good sir.

Offline voxkey

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Hey oldcat, any word on whether the hotswap pcb will work in the compatible case yet? (Was hoping to buy 2 pcbs, one non hot swap and one that is)

Hey bro, hotswap PCB will work on the compatible layout, but only with the fixed layout it comes with. Not sure if this is what you are asking?
BTW, love you user ID :)

Basically. So, the compatible layout is a different cut of the actual plate, right? Will it still have the same "perfect cut" snugness of the regular ansi hotswap layout in a regular case, if I use the hotswap pcb with ansi setup in the compatible case?

Hehe thanks good sir.

This will have to be tested of course since we really don’t have another integrated plate PC board to pull reference from, but speculating I believe it will be fine. Hopefully this is something Oldcat can test when the prototype comes in.

The switches will still fit snuggly into the hotswap socket and should properly align inside the plate. Of course if you for the solderable PCB there isn’t any issue to worry about.

Offline oldcat

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Some prototype pictures showcasing the top piece plate cuts. Build stream will come soon on Chinese streaming site Douyu.

Badge one is not frosted. Corrected white balance in the room.








« Last Edit: Fri, 22 March 2019, 09:32:57 by oldcat »

Offline knazze

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This keyboard is looking better everyday. I was 100% in a week ago and now I'm 1000% in.

Keep up the good work. I'm certain that this is going to turn into a beautiful board!

Offline oldcat

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This keyboard is looking better everyday. I was 100% in a week ago and now I'm 1000% in.

Keep up the good work. I'm certain that this is going to turn into a beautiful board!

Thanks much for the strong support!
We should see the pictures with real caps soon.

Offline Jaycob_Creighton

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I'm in on this one, it looks so nice!

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk


Offline voxkey

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Offline TheMnBN

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Show Image


 :eek:

It's alive! (almost)

Offline kolyz

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pictures are looking great!

Offline voxkey

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Just a heads up, the discussion over in the Gray Studio Discord is basically non-stop. Stop in if you have questions or just want to hang out.




Offline joelmats3

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This is really amazing. I'm definitely in!

Just curious if this is still on track for late March group buy?

Offline vicissitude

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Wow. A lot of renders.
Nice.

Offline oldcat

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This is really amazing. I'm definitely in!

Just curious if this is still on track for late March group buy?

Yes, the plan is to launch around the same time as GMK Wavez :) Stay tuned!



« Last Edit: Fri, 22 March 2019, 12:00:33 by oldcat »

Offline nguyenhimself

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Some prototype pictures showcasing the top piece plate cuts. Build stream will come soon on Chinese streaming site Douyu.

Badge one is not frosted. Corrected white balance in the room.


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I love this frosted look. With EnjoyPBT Kuro/Shiro coming later this month, it looks like I’m gonna have a super bright and shiny keyboard :)

Offline oldcat

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Some prototype pictures showcasing the top piece plate cuts. Build stream will come soon on Chinese streaming site Douyu.

Badge one is not frosted. Corrected white balance in the room.


Show Image


Show Image


Show Image


Show Image

I love this frosted look. With EnjoyPBT Kuro/Shiro coming later this month, it looks like I’m gonna have a super bright and shiny keyboard :)

Thanks! ePBT quality seems to go up quite substantially since 9009. I'd be interested in both Kuro/Shiro and biip's 2048

Offline PikaJoyce

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Some prototype pictures showcasing the top piece plate cuts. Build stream will come soon on Chinese streaming site Douyu.

Badge one is not frosted. Corrected white balance in the room.


Show Image


Show Image


Show Image


Show Image

I love this frosted look. With EnjoyPBT Kuro/Shiro coming later this month, it looks like I’m gonna have a super bright and shiny keyboard :)

Thanks! ePBT quality seems to go up quite substantially since 9009. I'd be interested in both Kuro/Shiro and biip's 2048
Agreed! I plan on tossing grayscale on it to tone down the brightness but k/s is also another option I'm thinking about :). Hoping both k/s and think 6.5 come within the same time frame so I'd have a shiny new board for a shiny new keyset.

Offline BobCarltheThird

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I realize it's an off the wall request but is it possible to get a renter with clear caps? My current plan is to cast a full set of clear blanks to fill this board out and I'm wondering if that's a worthwhile plan to follow through with.
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Offline oldcat

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I realize it's an off the wall request but is it possible to get a renter with clear caps? My current plan is to cast a full set of clear blanks to fill this board out and I'm wondering if that's a worthwhile plan to follow through with.

Sure, let me render one

Offline Rob27shred

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I realize it's an off the wall request but is it possible to get a renter with clear caps? My current plan is to cast a full set of clear blanks to fill this board out and I'm wondering if that's a worthwhile plan to follow through with.

Interesting ideal, I wonder how this will look too! It might make for a super unique look, clear everything! :cool:

Offline oldcat

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https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1KRWAYYYrB1h_g5ScqGBNsXAQZ2xYPu9bjIPLAIRx--4/   

Based on numerous requests from users on additional aluminum bottom piece, I gave Potter a call about this possibility. So I updated the Poll with a new question on the optional aluminum bottom. If there is not enough interest we will drop this option.

Offline voxkey

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Quote

Thanks! ePBT quality seems to go up quite substantially since 9009. I'd be interested in both Kuro/Shiro and biip's 2048

R4 9009 quality was amazing. Definitely pick up that set for the Think :)

Offline oldcat

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Quote

Thanks! ePBT quality seems to go up quite substantially since 9009. I'd be interested in both Kuro/Shiro and biip's 2048

R4 9009 quality was amazing. Definitely pick up that set for the Think :)

What? R4 already???

Offline Sic_Alpha

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I just picked up R4 ePBT 9009 last week.  It convinced me to sell all of my GMK sets.  Kicking myself for missing the ePBT Slate GB...
« Last Edit: Fri, 22 March 2019, 23:00:07 by Sic_Alpha »

Offline oldcat

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I just picked up R4 ePBT 9009 last week.  It convinced me to sell all of my GMK sets.  Kicking myself for missing the ePBT Slate GB...

This is a bold statement...
I have R2 9009 and for me it was "meh" according to Huey's scale. I did see heavy industry and it is much better.
I am even more excited for Shiro, Extend 2048 now...

Offline Sic_Alpha

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I just prefer the way PBT feels and sounds over ABS.  I've had some cheaper PBT caps that didn't impress me, but the ePBT 9009 R4 are really nice!  I'll have to check out the others you just mentioned.

Offline oldcat

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I just prefer the way PBT feels and sounds over ABS.  I've had some cheaper PBT caps that didn't impress me, but the ePBT 9009 R4 are really nice!  I'll have to check out the others you just mentioned.

Do check out Extend 2048 if you like ePBT!

Offline Darknight00z

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Alu bottom is an interesting idea, but it kind of breaks the aesthetics of the board for me.

For me the main concern is if the brass weight is large enough to be heavy. I find boards between 1.2-2kg to be most pleasant to use.

Offline oldcat

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Alu bottom is an interesting idea, but it kind of breaks the aesthetics of the board for me.

For me the main concern is if the brass weight is large enough to be heavy. I find boards between 1.2-2kg to be most pleasant to use.

Certainly agree it’s not everyone’s cup of tea :) will weigh the boards when I get them

Offline oldcat

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I realize it's an off the wall request but is it possible to get a renter with clear caps? My current plan is to cast a full set of clear blanks to fill this board out and I'm wondering if that's a worthwhile plan to follow through with.

Interesting ideal, I wonder how this will look too! It might make for a super unique look, clear everything! :cool:

clear/translucent cap material render is taking a bit long, should be completed tomorrow.