Author Topic: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White (New Kitting)  (Read 14675 times)

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Offline Pylon

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #50 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 13:29:06 »
It certainly is possible to reach the enthusiast and newcomer market in one base kit at a reasonable price.

i WOULD love to know more about this arrangement between drop and GMK that allows for the pricing of drop's wob to be so low. i wonder if there is like an annual moq or something. additionally, it would be nice to see more popular sets ran in a similar fashion... bow is the first that comes to mind :)



Taro R2 hit $110 base with a larger base kit than Drop GMK WoB (148 keys vs 140), with numpad, custom colors (4 colors total instead of 2), 2 sets of accent Esc and ANSI Enters,  and ISO support in base. I don't think Drop's deal is that special.

Offline Tyson

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #51 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 13:30:40 »
GMK BoW with text + icon mods and R5, I'm in!

Offline Kokaloo

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #52 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 13:34:45 »
It certainly is possible to reach the enthusiast and newcomer market in one base kit at a reasonable price.

i WOULD love to know more about this arrangement between drop and GMK that allows for the pricing of drop's wob to be so low. i wonder if there is like an annual moq or something. additionally, it would be nice to see more popular sets ran in a similar fashion... bow is the first that comes to mind :)



Taro R2 hit $110 base with a larger base kit than Drop GMK WoB (148 keys vs 140), with numpad, custom colors (4 colors total instead of 2), 2 sets of accent Esc and ANSI Enters,  and ISO support in base. I don't think Drop's deal is that special.

This. Keep in mind that MOQ plays only the first factor on the deciding MSRP vendors decide to publish. I highly doubt it's impossible to get a set made using stock colors with that base kit at 1000 moq for similar pricing, even for smaller vendors. For me it's a no brainer to expect simple sets to have this base kit, it's much more consumer friendly as a push for a "staple keyset" for both enthusiasts and newcomers.
« Last Edit: Mon, 12 April 2021, 13:36:50 by Kokaloo »

Offline unknownh

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #53 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 13:59:42 »
Minimal clone, outstanding move, pog

It's white on black, what do you expect? Sure it shares the same colour of CR + WS1 but it has icon + text mods which sets it apart from Minimal. Mito's GMK Hennessy by your standard is also a minimal clone. If anything this is a GMK Barebones stormtrooper clone (came before minimal btw) with a slightly different base colour (CP vs WS1) and kitting.
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Offline UGunaLOSE

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #54 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 14:04:32 »
To mirror the sentiment of others, for a set with an iconic colorway, and a staple in the collection of many a collector, the price for base is, imho, way too high. I'm not big on understanding the price hike that is included as a result of R5 so please forgive me if I missed something. Last I recall this set, with classic modifiers and such, was run as GMK Stormtrooper (proud owner of) and included more keys in the base at a cheaper price if I'm not mistaken ($100 not including shipping). I can see how folks may find it hard to rationalize purchasing the set as a result.

Either way, GLWIC

Offline Zeelobby

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #55 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 14:09:15 »
I mean is it fair to compare the price to that of GMK Stormtrooper which ran back in 2016? GMK prices have clearly gone up since then (just pricing of things in general).

Offline digital_nothing

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #56 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 14:19:08 »
You had me until R5. I want a BOW set so I can mix and match novelties, but R5 bottom row kills compatibility. No thanks, glwic.

Offline UGunaLOSE

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #57 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 14:21:18 »
I mean is it fair to compare the price to that of GMK Stormtrooper which ran back in 2016? GMK prices have clearly gone up since then (just pricing of things in general).

Perhaps that is true. But then looking at a set like GMK WHITE-ON-BLACK KATAKANA that has ISO, numpad, alice support etc., which had an original GB price of $120 USD (before it's current price of 145 USD), does show that it is possible to have a larger base kit for a cheaper price. Just food for thought.
« Last Edit: Mon, 12 April 2021, 14:29:24 by UGunaLOSE »

Offline Amuaisi

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #58 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 15:15:48 »
I like this lots.

How much more expensive would it be to add regular bottom row 5 keys to the extension kit?

Offline ephemeral25

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #59 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 15:19:12 »
R5 but 0 compat in the basekit ?

ok.

Offline gilbert

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #60 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 15:23:52 »
The current kitting cucks us international people so hard. Being forced to buy 2 kits just for basic layout support is a joke. Those 2 kits are easily gonna cost more than 130usd together. For that price i could get great kitted GMK sets with ISO and numpad. Consider a real international kit if you are going to remove us from base.
Not a great look.

Offline Prelim

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #61 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 16:33:17 »
Icon mods and take my money!

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Offline Zeelobby

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #62 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 18:06:40 »
I mean is it fair to compare the price to that of GMK Stormtrooper which ran back in 2016? GMK prices have clearly gone up since then (just pricing of things in general).

Perhaps that is true. But then looking at a set like GMK WHITE-ON-BLACK KATAKANA that has ISO, numpad, alice support etc., which had an original GB price of $120 USD (before it's current price of 145 USD), does show that it is possible to have a larger base kit for a cheaper price. Just food for thought.
True. But like. Drop is buying thousands. MOQ has gotta be at a different level. Designers have said 15% price increases from just last year. And the pricing seems inconsistent if anything. I just think direct comparisons can be unrealistic. Plain BoW with R5 might simply not sell close to a moq necessary to get that price point. Especially since drop leaves things in GB for an extended period of time. I don't know. Just see pricing complaints a lot on every set, but no real concrete explanation of why. Just the demand to do better, gain leverage over GMK or something XD.

Offline hkhawk

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #63 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 18:13:21 »
I personally would prefer a base kit like Serika 2 or Striker 2 offered with numpad and ISO for $110 (in recent months) and R5 as an add on option
« Last Edit: Mon, 12 April 2021, 18:15:18 by hkhawk »

Offline Altephor

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #64 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 19:02:44 »
I think prices would be better if kits are combined. Base + numpad is being estimated at $145 and it is still relatively small.
If my counting is correct base + numpad is 133 keys with 26 of them being r5. Red alert just ran with a more supportive 149 base kit with 26 r5 keys for $135 with a 500 MOQ.
Considering both sets are using stock GMK colors I don't see why this should be more expensive with less support.

Offline IOVERCALLHISTIOCYTES

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #65 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 19:45:57 »
while the numpad and TKL crowds battle it out, and you decide whether the 10000 kits of minimal 1, minimal 2, and hennessey have saturated the WS1 market....

how about a Rama B and a W like minimal had X and O?

Pros: 
-people like metal caps
-reverse profile the W is an M
-you can turn print scroll lock pause keys to "BBW" which would be funny

Cons:
-none

Offline lush_bunny

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #66 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 20:23:52 »
Goddammit. I like it, GLWIC. RIP my wallet.

Offline psxndc

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[IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #67 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 20:47:19 »
40s kit: I appreciate the option for a 1u R3 that isn’t tab or ESC, but super is an odd choice as I understood that to be basically the same as a Windows key. But it’s not tab or ESC, so I won’t complain about what you put there (but if you want to be consistent with other 40s offerings, you’ll have both r2 and R3 1u tab and ESC as well)

But you need a 1u R4 enter key. Unless “send” is supposed to fill that role.
« Last Edit: Mon, 12 April 2021, 23:37:05 by psxndc »

Offline 8six753o9

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #68 on: Tue, 13 April 2021, 08:45:53 »
I'm a little sad about the kitting.  I would prefer an all-in-one kit like my April Fools joke from last year and add a R5 addon kit that people can buy and use with their Minimal set.  Now I wish I had just made that into a reality now  :-[ .

Offline huey

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #69 on: Tue, 13 April 2021, 12:00:27 »
I do not understand this kitting at all. Anyone with a half decent understanding of kitting can tell you that this is a truly awful value proposition(per key) for absolutely everyone involved. There are base kits that are $10-$15 more expensive than the estimated $110 price tag that make this look like a McDonalds toy. We all know this can comfortably be MOQ-ed at 1000, and no one would raise an eyebrow.

It's going to disappointing when the now not-so new-comer who bought this set buys their 3rd or 10th board, only to realise that their BoW set they want to use can't support their board, because it dared to be anything bigger than TKL. Meaning that they would have to search user markets and spend even more than the wild GB prices.

On the topic of new-comers; I don't believe it's the price of a GMK set that is really a deterrent for them purchasing. I whole-hearted believe it's now absurd wait times that this community has put upon itself because it has no self-control. Sure, some people will be priced out and that is a shame. But I can guarantee when they find out they'll be waiting a year or more(I understand this could become better), they will then decide it's not worth purchasing.

As for the ISO kitting. No ISO user wants to pay $140+ for that base and basic ISO. I'd rather have some correct legending than a preferred shaped enter key. Put it in base or remove it IMO.

Offline Puddsy

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #70 on: Tue, 13 April 2021, 14:03:22 »
yeah i'll probably buy this
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Offline loop | esc lab

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #71 on: Tue, 13 April 2021, 14:54:00 »
As a diehard GMK Minimal fan, always down for more WS1.

That said, the color temperature of your renders of the WS1 color is a bit varied. In some renders it looks like WS2 (cool white of Bleached), in some it looks gray (in particular the kitting illustrations), and in some renders it looks like WS1.

I think those inconsistencies could be fixed so it's less confusing for the viewer.

GLWIC, I'm in this for sure.

Offline L4ll1g470r

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #72 on: Tue, 13 April 2021, 15:07:38 »
Obligatory ”no norde, no buy” comment. Glwic.

Offline LaserCrafter

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #73 on: Tue, 13 April 2021, 15:15:17 »
now i know i shouldn't have hopped on muted 2

Offline CustomerSupport

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #74 on: Wed, 14 April 2021, 02:40:39 »
But anyways - I guess the difference is - the child kits here are more enthusiast focused imo.

As a Mac user who now favors Tsangan/7u bottom row and HHKB layouts, the Extensions kit is disappointing because I'm buying the entire kit for really 3 keys, +/- the Windows keys. I don't imagine Mac users who like having OS-accurate Super/(modifier) keys are that much of a niche, but it's just a hunch.

Anyways, I have to echo the concerns of others on the kitting. $110 is a nice price, yes, but GMK Seafarer is an example of great kitting that has both "enthusiast" and beginner support, in both legends and key sizes.

Keep in mind, CBoW here has 2 stock colors, meanwhile Seafarer has 1 stock, 1 custom color; yet for $15 more, you get ISO, numpad, 1.5u Super/1u Alt, F13, and a B++ in Base.

Offline okidna

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #75 on: Wed, 14 April 2021, 03:35:09 »
Quote
The goal here is to keep the base kit priced around $110 (price is based on comparison with more recent GMK quotes and also the more expensive R5 keys)

I don't think the "R5 = more expensive" make sense at all, because just a couple days ago Red Alert, another R5 only keyset, (barely) managed to pull through GB period and the base kit price is just $135.
Only $25 more than this set projected price, with MUCH MORE compatibilities and options, oh and also a set of nice red accent keys.

Offline chung

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #76 on: Wed, 14 April 2021, 06:19:41 »
 :p :p

Offline break

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #77 on: Thu, 15 April 2021, 14:30:36 »
Quote
The goal here is to keep the base kit priced around $110 (price is based on comparison with more recent GMK quotes and also the more expensive R5 keys)

I don't think the "R5 = more expensive" make sense at all, because just a couple days ago Red Alert, another R5 only keyset, (barely) managed to pull through GB period and the base kit price is just $135.
Only $25 more than this set projected price, with MUCH MORE compatibilities and options, oh and also a set of nice red accent keys.

It's funny to hear you cite Red Alert, because I've been killed by folks on the pricing and kitting for Red Alert.

As I've said before, consider two sets: Birch and Red Alert. The former has three custom RAL colors and R4, the latter uses three stock colors and R5. At the same 500 MOQ with the same number of keys, both sets GBed for $135 - the same price.

If you compare the base kit in CBoW to that of Minimal, the primary difference is R5. Colors are otherwise exactly the same, differences in modifier legend costs are negligible, kits are same within a few keys. So: the price difference is solely due to R5. It really, really matters.

For folks citing Drop's Katakana WoB, or GMK Seafarer - those sets do not have R5. The community has a blind spot to GMK's R5 pricing right now, and it reappears any time folks evaluate two GMK sets with different bottom rows.

Offline Puddsy

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #78 on: Thu, 15 April 2021, 14:52:32 »
gmk's pricing, as well as the margins businesses are willing to run on, tend to be different depending on the week, day, or month you ask about them. if you want the set, buy it, if you don't, don't buy it.

don't overthink it
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Offline break

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #79 on: Thu, 15 April 2021, 15:02:04 »
gmk's pricing, as well as the margins businesses are willing to run on, tend to be different depending on the week, day, or month you ask about them. if you want the set, buy it, if you don't, don't buy it.

don't overthink it

Yeah seriously. Pick this up, provide constructive feedback, fight for GMK Minimal at extras / aftermarket price, go write posts on Drop forums about other sets that are not BoW. Whatever - find your zen!

End of the day, get it or not, the last time something like this was available was 2016 with GMK Stormtrooper. r/MechanicalKeyboards membership has increased over 900% since then.



So it's pretty damn nice that this cornerstone set is available again after a bunch of new people have started collecting things.

Offline Ensaum

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #80 on: Thu, 15 April 2021, 23:03:41 »
OMG yes, I've wanted this set for years. Please consider combing kits to beef up the base kit and at least offering a row 4 add on kit.

Offline HappyB0T

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #81 on: Thu, 15 April 2021, 23:27:14 »
It took my second read to get what you are going for. It totally makes sense. It is different enough warrant another IC. People who have maxed out their Beige Classic Retro keycap selection want something more edgy. ;)
Curious if you considered the fancier keycaps that you see in beige sets like shine through.

Offline adsfqwer

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #82 on: Fri, 16 April 2021, 12:01:44 »
This looks good. I understand the concept OP is going for, but I still think it would be better for the base kit to come with R1 - R4 and match the Drop WoB in terms of compatibility. Then offer R0 and R5 as optional kits and you still have a unique run but with potentially many more buyers of the base kit than you would otherwise.

Offline jpg2401

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #83 on: Sun, 18 April 2021, 18:21:15 »
Quote
The goal here is to keep the base kit priced around $110 (price is based on comparison with more recent GMK quotes and also the more expensive R5 keys)

I don't think the "R5 = more expensive" make sense at all, because just a couple days ago Red Alert, another R5 only keyset, (barely) managed to pull through GB period and the base kit price is just $135.
Only $25 more than this set projected price, with MUCH MORE compatibilities and options, oh and also a set of nice red accent keys.

It's funny to hear you cite Red Alert, because I've been killed by folks on the pricing and kitting for Red Alert.

As I've said before, consider two sets: Birch and Red Alert. The former has three custom RAL colors and R4, the latter uses three stock colors and R5. At the same 500 MOQ with the same number of keys, both sets GBed for $135 - the same price.

If you compare the base kit in CBoW to that of Minimal, the primary difference is R5. Colors are otherwise exactly the same, differences in modifier legend costs are negligible, kits are same within a few keys. So: the price difference is solely due to R5. It really, really matters.

For folks citing Drop's Katakana WoB, or GMK Seafarer - those sets do not have R5. The community has a blind spot to GMK's R5 pricing right now, and it reappears any time folks evaluate two GMK sets with different bottom rows.

It is interesting to hear insight from someone who dealt with these things. Thank you!
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Offline upas

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #84 on: Tue, 20 April 2021, 22:32:52 »
Hey guys,

I've gone through most of the feedback and I've revised the kitting.
I'm hoping my solution can make most people happy.

Once I have some new renders, I'll post them up!

Offline HappyB0T

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #85 on: Thu, 22 April 2021, 04:20:04 »
Kitting looks better

Offline tanghus

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #86 on: Thu, 22 April 2021, 11:45:22 »
Kitting looks better
OP hasn't been updated. It's still the old kitting being shown.  :rolleyes:

Offline gok_nz

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #87 on: Thu, 22 April 2021, 15:46:29 »
I'm wondering whether GMK has a white which matches e-white better.
WS1 is a bit warm but WS2 is too cool and bright.

Offline CustomerSupport

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #88 on: Thu, 22 April 2021, 21:19:31 »
Kitting looks better
OP hasn't been updated. It's still the old kitting being shown.  :rolleyes:

Got eeeeem

Offline L4ll1g470r

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #89 on: Fri, 23 April 2021, 00:20:22 »
Actually, I’m not aware of nordeuk having been available in ages in the ws1/cr combo. You might want to reconsider your approach, as this would compliment other sets like the awesome evil eye. I would get two norde sets just to go with that in addition to the one that would go with this.

Offline stevenT

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #90 on: Fri, 23 April 2021, 18:52:05 »
Someone may have mentioned this but if it is just BoW, why not choose ePbt, I think they are able to make it.

The reasons I pick GMK is to avoid unmatching colors and warping issue, but even GMK has noticeable issues with misprinted legend, crooked stem and warping long keycaps recently.

Offline break

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #91 on: Sat, 24 April 2021, 14:49:01 »
The reasons I pick GMK is to avoid unmatching colors and warping issue, but even GMK has noticeable issues with misprinted legend, crooked stem and warping long keycaps recently.

There are infinite sets of EPBT Black on White available at all sorts of vendors. You can grab one of those if they interest you.

Offline stevenT

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #92 on: Sat, 24 April 2021, 19:11:56 »
The reasons I pick GMK is to avoid unmatching colors and warping issue, but even GMK has noticeable issues with misprinted legend, crooked stem and warping long keycaps recently.

There are infinite sets of EPBT Black on White available at all sorts of vendors. You can grab one of those if they interest you.

thank you

Offline Pylon

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White
« Reply #93 on: Sat, 24 April 2021, 19:20:28 »
The reasons I pick GMK is to avoid unmatching colors and warping issue, but even GMK has noticeable issues with misprinted legend, crooked stem and warping long keycaps recently.

There are infinite sets of EPBT Black on White available at all sorts of vendors. You can grab one of those if they interest you.

thank you

None of them have text + icon legends though. That's pretty much the point of this set.

Offline upas

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White (New Kitting)
« Reply #94 on: Tue, 18 May 2021, 16:10:45 »
Just updated the kitting, complete with realistic price targets.

Please check out the first post!

These are still subject to change, and I'd still like feedback, but the core kitting is pretty set.

Online MIGHTY CHICKEN

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White (New Kitting)
« Reply #95 on: Tue, 18 May 2021, 16:14:47 »
Those are some pretty sexy price targets

Offline Kokaloo

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White (New Kitting)
« Reply #96 on: Tue, 18 May 2021, 16:18:39 »
Wonderful improvement! Two base kits feel a lot more viable than a trillion child kits.

Offline wholypantalones

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White (New Kitting)
« Reply #97 on: Tue, 18 May 2021, 16:44:19 »
Not for me, but happy to see text and icon mods making a comeback.

Offline psxndc

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[IC] GMK Classic Black on White (New Kitting)
« Reply #98 on: Tue, 18 May 2021, 16:47:24 »
I like the 40s kit. One request: can you add a 1u R3 key for something that’s not ESC or TAB? Some folks use that key on the left for things other than ESC and TAB - it could be CTRL, or backspace/DEL, or really anything. Usually I’d just stick a novelty there and be done with it, but since there’s no novelties, I’m hoping you can add something like a Code, Data,  Fn, or some other generic legend.

“Why not just stick TAB or ESC there anyway?” Well, if I have TAB above it and ESC above that, it looks weird (from the top: ESC, TAB, TAB, or ESC, TAB, ESC).

Thanks!
« Last Edit: Tue, 18 May 2021, 16:50:31 by psxndc »

Offline Baka Bot

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Re: [IC] GMK Classic Black on White (New Kitting)
« Reply #99 on: Tue, 18 May 2021, 16:50:31 »
Changes are great glwic