[IC] Phantom Skeleton Kit

[roostrc0gburn]

News/Updates:

This is my first IC/GB, so please be patient with me. I am here to learn and serve to community.

[1/15]   Interest Check Form is up! If you haven't already, please fill it out  http://goo.gl/forms/P0YV7AKsU4

[1/29]   IC phase ending soon. There is minimal interest in this project, so we are just getting plates. I can post resources for all other parts needed to do the build if people need that. Plate layout will be Standard ANSI, with optional Winkeyless - potato renders below. If you need ISO or some other layout, PM me and we'll see what we can do.

[2/1]   Posted to Reddit. 22 orders for plates before posting. here's some renders!

More

[2/6] emailed the vendor for lead times and price confirmation. Also emailed @bpiphany for options on PCB pricing. Waiting to hear back from them before opening the GB next week. I am hoping to have some options for people who want a full kit

[2/10] given that Chinese new year was monday (2/8), there is no point in starting this group buy this week. The holiday lasts all week, and the lantern festival is in a couple weeks. Realistically, this GB won't start until the end of Feb, or early March.

[2/16] talked to the plate fab shop again. here are our available options (all same price):

• ANSI 1.25, ANSI 1.5 WKL, ISO 1.25 and ISO 1.5 WKL
• Aluminum or Stainless Steel
• Dual-Action Sander Finish or #4 Grain

[2/19]   talked to a rep from mechanicalkeyboards.com at a local LAN event. i think it may now be possible to include phantom pcbs as well as the teensy 2.0 controllers, diodes, leds, resistors, etc into the group buy package! maybe even a little cheaper than our alternative options. I will keep you guys posted. GB starting this weekend if i can nail down some of these details and pricesin

[2/23]   Still negotiating prices, which will basically determine what parts will be included in the GB. I think we will be able to offer all layouts supported by the Teel PCB (ANSI 1.25, ANSI 1.5 WKL, ISO 1.25, ISO 1.5 WKL, and 7BIT. Still my goal to start GB and prototype by the end of the month!

[2/25]   OK, we have vendors and prices for all the parts except stabilizers. please PM me if you have a source that we could include, or at least point people to for the kit. working on final adjustments and preparations for the GB. looks like starting this week might be a stretch, so i will shoot for this weekend! thanks for your patience

[2/29]   Happy leap day! just posted the GB thread, awaiting mod approval. I will open up orders this week!!!

GROUP BUY IS OPEN
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=80118

What's Included:

This list is currently in progress, and I will update as more feedback comes in from the community. My goal is to provide a complete kit for under $100.

• 2 Stainless Steel Plates (SAE 304): Top and Bottom
• 12 Stainless Steel threaded standoffs
• 24 Machine Screws
• 1 Phantom PCB
• 1 Teensy 2.0 Controller
• Diodes (1N4148)
• 2 LEDs (colors TBD)
• 2 Resistors (if needed for LEDs)
• Various types of switches - Greetech, Kailh, Gateron, Cherry
• Stabilizers?

Some of these items we will need to find a vendor or omit from the kit. That will mean people will need to source those parts themselves.
I have a vendor for the plates, and bpiphany has offered to help with the PCBs. I am thinking it may be easiest to find a proxy and order the electronic parts from tao bao (LEDs, diodes, resistors). Maybe we can do the same for the Teensy 2.0. If anyone can help with this, please pm me.

Backstory:

This is a bit of a reboot of a group buy i was recently a part of. We had plates made, but they did not fit the Phantom PCB. There is still some interest from that group to have plates made, but there is not really enough interest to warrant a whole new group buy. My thought is to open this up to everyone, and include parts for an entire kit. If possible, I would like to be able to offer each individual part as a "child deal" that people could order separately. Ie. if you just wanted plates, or just wanted diodes, etc...

At this point, we just need to determine what is possible, and if we have enough people to make it happen.

[Steezus]

I got enough TKLs myself but this is a really cool idea if you can get it done. For ~$100 that would be a great starter kit for people to dive into building keyboards.

[SpAmRaY]

I wish you luck hopefully this doesn't succumb to the phantom curse.

[roostrc0gburn]

oh, now there's a curse...?

[SpAmRaY]

oh, now there's a curse...?

Well if you look at the last phantom group buy and a few buys people tried to do afterwards related to the phantom they all crashed and burned.

[Tym]

oh, now there's a curse...?

Well if you look at the last phantom group buy and a few buys people tried to do afterwards related to the phantom they all crashed and burned.

Yeah you should rename it; Ghost, revenant, shadow, shade, wraith or something.

Personally I like Wraith

[roostrc0gburn]

come to think of it... thats how this whole damn thing started

[cryptokey]

Might want to check out aliexpress or alibaba (for large quantities) so you don't need to proxy from taobao on the led's

[UsualSuspectXXX]

I'd definitely be interested.

[theanyday]

Guess this might be my 3rd round of trying to buy some Phantom plates.

[toidbb]

I am interested as well.

[wakko]

In

[mrbishop]

ive been wanting to build a phantom... but i need to do more Aluminum milling on my CNC so i'll probably just go it alone. BUT for someone who doesn't have a CNC or who has built a keyboard before. this sounds smashing.

[FLFisherman]

Are there any pictures anywhere of what you're thinking of buying? I've never heard of a Phantom before. :/

[mrbishop]

mechanicalkeyboards.com has phantoms
sparkfun.com has teensys and accessories
maxkeyboards.com has leds
wasdkeyboards.com has stabs
MAX also has caps

[Data]

Are there any pictures anywhere of what you're thinking of buying? I've never heard of a Phantom before. :/

http://deskthority.net/wiki/Phantom

---

I did a couple of Phantom builds recently on my own.  What happened with your plates not fitting?

[FLFisherman]

mechanicalkeyboards.com has phantoms
sparkfun.com has teensys and accessories
maxkeyboards.com has leds
wasdkeyboards.com has stabs
MAX also has caps

Are there any pictures anywhere of what you're thinking of buying? I've never heard of a Phantom before. :/

http://deskthority.net/wiki/Phantom

---

I did a couple of Phantom builds recently on my own.  What happened with your plates not fitting?

Ahhh, it's a PCB. Thank you!

[mrbishop]

More

mechanicalkeyboards.com has phantoms
sparkfun.com has teensys and accessories
maxkeyboards.com has leds
wasdkeyboards.com has stabs
MAX also has caps

Are there any pictures anywhere of what you're thinking of buying? I've never heard of a Phantom before. :/

http://deskthority.net/wiki/Phantom

---

I did a couple of Phantom builds recently on my own.  What happened with your plates not fitting?

Ahhh, it's a PCB. Thank you!

i have some useful information some times
at least thats where i usually get stuff from so i dont have to wait a month for over seas shipping

[jdcarpe]

I think this is what OP is trying to acheive?

[mrbishop]

I think this is what OP is trying to acheive?

Show Image

JD you always come in with the nicest stuff.  :thumb: :thumb:

[axtran]

JD's boards are always so beautiful.

[roostrc0gburn]

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

[axtran]

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

There was a JD Skeleton made in the past with a Phantom inside.

[roostrc0gburn]

mechanicalkeyboards.com has phantoms     $32 (+Teensy 2.0 $22)
sparkfun.com has teensys and accessories     
maxkeyboards.com has leds
wasdkeyboards.com has stabs
MAX also has caps

I bought a Phantom PCB and Teensy 2.0 from MechanicalKeyboards.com for $54. Depending on the amount of interest (and bpiphany's help) i think we can get ours made for less.

[roostrc0gburn]

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

There was a JD Skeleton made in the past with a Phantom inside.

TIL

[jdcarpe]

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

There was a JD Skeleton made in the past with a Phantom inside.

TIL

Do you need plate drawings? Sources for the hardware?

[SpAmRaY]

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

Where did you buy plates that didn't fit?

[axtran]

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

Where did you buy plates that didn't fit?

There was a DT GB for what seemed like an inexpensive set of plates for a skeleton-style TKL, which people assumed fit the Phantom.

Top row fitment didn't work out... Left everyone with plates they couldn't Phantom. People can turn to GON PCBs, but that's kind of expensive for what the board intended to be. Hope I captured it correctly!

[SpAmRaY]

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

Where did you buy plates that didn't fit?

There was a DT GB for what seemed like an inexpensive set of plates for a skeleton-style TKL, which people assumed fit the Phantom.

Top row fitment didn't work out... Left everyone with plates they couldn't Phantom. People can turn to GON PCBs, but that's kind of expensive for what the board intended to be. Hope I captured it correctly!

Ah ok. I don't follow DT much anymore.

[harlw]

I dig it

[roostrc0gburn]

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

There was a JD Skeleton made in the past with a Phantom inside.

TIL

Do you need plate drawings? Sources for the hardware?

I have developed CAD files and have quotes from a couple fab shops for the plates. Thanks for the offer. If this goes to GB and we can find a cheaper source, we will definitely go that route.

yep, that's exactly it, JD. thanks for posting the pictures. you were in the original group buy on DT, right? if those are the same SS plates i got, then you must have done your build with a GON or B.87 pcb.

Where did you buy plates that didn't fit?

There was a DT GB for what seemed like an inexpensive set of plates for a skeleton-style TKL, which people assumed fit the Phantom.

Top row fitment didn't work out... Left everyone with plates they couldn't Phantom. People can turn to GON PCBs, but that's kind of expensive for what the board intended to be. Hope I captured it correctly!

yeah, it was more of a selling point than an assumption. another hard lesson for me - always check yourself. i had left it to others to verify the design.

The plates in this GB will fit the Phantom sold by MechanicalKeyboards.com and our own PCBs if we have them made for a group buy.

[TalkingTree]

I'm interested in PCB, controller and plates.

[roostrc0gburn]

survey is up. thanks everyone for your responses in-thread. please also go to the link and submit your interest there

[ika]

Might want to check out aliexpress or alibaba (for large quantities) so you don't need to proxy from taobao on the led's

Many of the eBay dealers will work with you if you need larger quantities. Their english is decent enough to work a transaction with. I got 1800 1.8mm LEDs shipped ePacket for roughly $66, when the base prices were 0.05/ea or 0.10/ea for the LEDs.

[LeandreN]

Woooo!

If you need assistance for this project, feel free to PM me.

[roostrc0gburn]

Might want to check out aliexpress or alibaba (for large quantities) so you don't need to proxy from taobao on the led's

Many of the eBay dealers will work with you if you need larger quantities. Their english is decent enough to work a transaction with. I got 1800 1.8mm LEDs shipped ePacket for roughly $66, when the base prices were 0.05/ea or 0.10/ea for the LEDs.

good point! there are a couple vendors i have worked with previously. still getting emails from them every now and then... damn they are persistent

i am fairly confident that we can find electronic parts for cheap. if not, its pretty easy for people to source themselves. The trick will be finding the Teensy 2.0 boards for cheap, or someone who can make them for us.

[roostrc0gburn]

Woooo!

If you need assistance for this project, feel free to PM me.

Thanks, LeandreN! do you have any sources for switches and stabilizers? I'm thinking probly Gateron...

[roostrc0gburn]

_

[LeandreN]

Woooo!

If you need assistance for this project, feel free to PM me.

Thanks, LeandreN! do you have any sources for switches and stabilizers? I'm thinking probly Gateron...

Switches yes, stabilisers no.

[bbrotha]

Interested, I was in the DT GB as well, and I rather spend $100 ish on everything than on a single gon board tbh.

[roostrc0gburn]

Interested, I was in the DT GB as well, and I rather spend $100 ish on everything than on a single gon board tbh.

you could just order plates if thats all you need

[amharris]

A kit like this for under $100 is fantastic.
Though I wouldn't skimp where there would be small increases, as I think most would be happy to pay a tad more [I'm not implying that you are skimping, just making a statement].

...but yeah, I'd be in for this, even though I'm about to have a house move; this is just too cheap to pass up!

Brilliant work so far, roostrc0gburn.

[Dernubenfrieken]

I'm in. Was just looking into a phantom based TKL this week.
I have to agree about pricing and extra features. If we could pay a bit more to get a nicer case or other changes Id be willing too.

[roostrc0gburn]

A kit like this for under $100 is fantastic.
Though I wouldn't skimp where there would be small increases, as I think most would be happy to pay a tad more [I'm not implying that you are skimping, just making a statement].

...but yeah, I'd be in for this, even though I'm about to have a house move; this is just too cheap to pass up!

Brilliant work so far, roostrc0gburn.

I'm in. Was just looking into a phantom based TKL this week.
I have to agree about pricing and extra features. If we could pay a bit more to get a nicer case or other changes Id be willing too.

Thanks, guys. I agree. We want a quality product. I dont see any reason why this kit couldn't be under/around $100 though. That is what I'm shooting for

[amharris]

A kit like this for under $100 is fantastic.
Though I wouldn't skimp where there would be small increases, as I think most would be happy to pay a tad more [I'm not implying that you are skimping, just making a statement].

...but yeah, I'd be in for this, even though I'm about to have a house move; this is just too cheap to pass up!

Brilliant work so far, roostrc0gburn.

I'm in. Was just looking into a phantom based TKL this week.
I have to agree about pricing and extra features. If we could pay a bit more to get a nicer case or other changes Id be willing too.

Thanks, guys. I agree. We want a quality product. I dont see any reason why this kit couldn't be under/around $100 though. That is what I'm shooting for

Brilliant to hear that!
Additionally, you may want to change the checkboxes to radio buttons, given that they are 'Yes or No' responses, as - in their current state - the form can be submitted with both of each checked.

[roostrc0gburn]

A kit like this for under $100 is fantastic.
Though I wouldn't skimp where there would be small increases, as I think most would be happy to pay a tad more [I'm not implying that you are skimping, just making a statement].

...but yeah, I'd be in for this, even though I'm about to have a house move; this is just too cheap to pass up!

Brilliant work so far, roostrc0gburn.

I'm in. Was just looking into a phantom based TKL this week.
I have to agree about pricing and extra features. If we could pay a bit more to get a nicer case or other changes Id be willing too.

Thanks, guys. I agree. We want a quality product. I dont see any reason why this kit couldn't be under/around $100 though. That is what I'm shooting for

Brilliant to hear that!
Additionally, you may want to change the checkboxes to radio buttons, given that they are 'Yes or No' responses, as - in their current state - the form can be submitted with both of each checked.

thanks for that! this is a first time for many things :-D

[amharris]

A kit like this for under $100 is fantastic.
Though I wouldn't skimp where there would be small increases, as I think most would be happy to pay a tad more [I'm not implying that you are skimping, just making a statement].

...but yeah, I'd be in for this, even though I'm about to have a house move; this is just too cheap to pass up!

Brilliant work so far, roostrc0gburn.

I'm in. Was just looking into a phantom based TKL this week.
I have to agree about pricing and extra features. If we could pay a bit more to get a nicer case or other changes Id be willing too.

Thanks, guys. I agree. We want a quality product. I dont see any reason why this kit couldn't be under/around $100 though. That is what I'm shooting for

Brilliant to hear that!
Additionally, you may want to change the checkboxes to radio buttons, given that they are 'Yes or No' responses, as - in their current state - the form can be submitted with both of each checked.

thanks for that! this is a first time for many things :-D

Hehe.
Also, just a personal thing... I'd like to see the switches and stabilisers in the interest form separated, as it's easy for me to get switches at a fairly affordable price [Gaterons] but a bit tricky to get stabilisers, so being able to split up what I want would be great.
Thanks in advance!

[roostrc0gburn]

A kit like this for under $100 is fantastic.
Though I wouldn't skimp where there would be small increases, as I think most would be happy to pay a tad more [I'm not implying that you are skimping, just making a statement].

...but yeah, I'd be in for this, even though I'm about to have a house move; this is just too cheap to pass up!

Brilliant work so far, roostrc0gburn.

I'm in. Was just looking into a phantom based TKL this week.
I have to agree about pricing and extra features. If we could pay a bit more to get a nicer case or other changes Id be willing too.

Thanks, guys. I agree. We want a quality product. I dont see any reason why this kit couldn't be under/around $100 though. That is what I'm shooting for

Brilliant to hear that!
Additionally, you may want to change the checkboxes to radio buttons, given that they are 'Yes or No' responses, as - in their current state - the form can be submitted with both of each checked.

thanks for that! this is a first time for many things :-D

Hehe.
Also, just a personal thing... I'd like to see the switches and stabilisers in the interest form separated, as it's easy for me to get switches at a fairly affordable price [Gaterons] but a bit tricky to get stabilisers, so being able to split up what I want would be great.
Thanks in advance!

i agree on this one also. We just have to find a vendor first! looks LeandreN will be able to help with the switches.

[amharris]

A kit like this for under $100 is fantastic.
Though I wouldn't skimp where there would be small increases, as I think most would be happy to pay a tad more [I'm not implying that you are skimping, just making a statement].

...but yeah, I'd be in for this, even though I'm about to have a house move; this is just too cheap to pass up!

Brilliant work so far, roostrc0gburn.

I'm in. Was just looking into a phantom based TKL this week.
I have to agree about pricing and extra features. If we could pay a bit more to get a nicer case or other changes Id be willing too.

Thanks, guys. I agree. We want a quality product. I dont see any reason why this kit couldn't be under/around $100 though. That is what I'm shooting for

Brilliant to hear that!
Additionally, you may want to change the checkboxes to radio buttons, given that they are 'Yes or No' responses, as - in their current state - the form can be submitted with both of each checked.

thanks for that! this is a first time for many things :-D

Hehe.
Also, just a personal thing... I'd like to see the switches and stabilisers in the interest form separated, as it's easy for me to get switches at a fairly affordable price [Gaterons] but a bit tricky to get stabilisers, so being able to split up what I want would be great.
Thanks in advance!

i agree on this one also. We just have to find a vendor first! looks LeandreN will be able to help with the switches.

Yeah, he should be able to feed a lot of Gateron Blues to you and possibly other Gaterons, if there is a decent MOQ.

Cheers.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Submitted IC!

[asura]

you could just order plates if thats all you need

Please.

Which plates are you planning on producing?

[afonsoocosta]

Can I only ask for 1 plate? The top? I want a wood case with a metal/aluminum plate on the top, and the plate is like you have how i put only the top plate on the IC?

I want the top Plate, the PCB the Teensy 2.0 Controller, the diodes and the LED's for Caps... The switchs depends the price of them...

Thanks and I hope the GB runs

[cryptokey]

I'd be interested.

[roostrc0gburn]

you could just order plates if thats all you need

Please.

Which plates are you planning on producing?

Working on a render this week, but see JDCarpe's photos for reference for now.

Can I only ask for 1 plate? The top? I want a wood case with a metal/aluminum plate on the top, and the plate is like you have how i put only the top plate on the IC?

I want the top Plate, the PCB the Teensy 2.0 Controller, the diodes and the LED's for Caps... The switchs depends the price of them...

Thanks and I hope the GB runs

Thanks for the interest :-) plates will be sold in sets - top and bottom. If you haven't already, please fill out the form linked in OP

[roostrc0gburn]

Submitted IC!

Thanks! Input from the forms will set prices when this goes to group buy.

[roostrc0gburn]

so far, we only have 14 orders + mine. this is probably enough to do the plates, but not enough orders to really get a price break on anything else.

[asura]

you could just order plates if thats all you need

Please.

Which plates are you planning on producing?

Working on a render this week, but see JDCarpe's photos for reference for now.

Can I only ask for 1 plate? The top? I want a wood case with a metal/aluminum plate on the top, and the plate is like you have how i put only the top plate on the IC?

I want the top Plate, the PCB the Teensy 2.0 Controller, the diodes and the LED's for Caps... The switchs depends the price of them...

Thanks and I hope the GB runs

Thanks for the interest :-) plates will be sold in sets - top and bottom. If you haven't already, please fill out the form linked in OP

ANSI 1.25
ANSI 1.5
ISO 1.25
ISO 1.5
7BIT
PROF 1.25
PROF 1.5





I was part of the round 2 buy, and have everything except my plate* - a PROF 1.5.  I keep meaning to get one made (or a unique layout which I'd prefer even more) however, crap keeps getting in the way.

*having only ordered the plate and PCB half my order just vanished into...

[roostrc0gburn]

FYI erybody.

I'll leave this IC up for the rest of the week and probably post to reddit to see if there's any more interest over there. From the feedback so far, looks like we're doing just plates. Group Buy will start early Feb. I still have some stuff to do to set up before we can run

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Just plates? Welp, count me out.

[roostrc0gburn]

so... 14 plates

[asura]

I'm interested in one, and maybe a base plate, but not knowing what styles you plan on producing don't feel it would be fair to put my name down as a yes - only to turn to rescind at a later date if you're not producing the layout I want.

[roostrc0gburn]

I'm interested in one, and maybe a base plate, but not knowing what styles you plan on producing don't feel it would be fair to put my name down as a yes - only to turn to rescind at a later date if you're not producing the layout I want.

you're right - i never did specify. sorry! as of right now, I have developed a CAD file for standard ANSI layout. I modified it slightly to have a winkeyless plate made also. Other layouts are possible, but probably outside the scope of this little group buy. PM me if you want something else made. we might be able to do it

[Dernubenfrieken]

I'm only really interested if there's baseplates/standoffs included. A non universal plate is actually preferred for me.

[roostrc0gburn]

If you're okay with Costar, they are very inexpensive from WASD.

Doesn't Zeal have stabilisers in his store? Maybe only worth it if you are buying Zealios because of the shipping cost.

Will this need standoffs for the LEDs?

I'm only really interested if there's baseplates/standoffs included. A non universal plate is actually preferred for me.

I'm only really interested if there's baseplates/standoffs included. A non universal plate is actually preferred for me.

yes, plates must be orders in sets - top and bottom. you can easily source standoffs and screws yourself from McMaster Carr.

[Dernubenfrieken]

I'm only really interested if there's baseplates/standoffs included. A non universal plate is actually preferred for me.

I'm only really interested if there's baseplates/standoffs included. A non universal plate is actually preferred for me.

yes, plates must be orders in sets - top and bottom. you can easily source standoffs and screws yourself from McMaster Carr. Here's links to what I will use:
Standoffs: http://www.mcmaster.com/mv1453753815/#91125a613/=10wbq69
Screws: http://www.mcmaster.com/mv1453753815/#90910a710/=10wbq8f

That sounds perfect then.

[ehwc]

I hadn't checked on that Deskthority thread in a white because I was so annoyed with the "resolution" of that GB, haha. Glad to hear you're still looking to produce the plates! In for one

A question on the standoffs and screws for whoever has experience to answer this: a 1/2 inch standoff like this should be enough clearance, correct? Also, would a GON-style countersink screw link this sit relatively flush to the hole, or would I have to look for a screw that's much smaller and has a head that's just larger than the holes on the plate? And if the latter, I guess my question is then how large are the holes for the screws on the plate?

Thanks in advance!

[roostrc0gburn]

I hadn't checked on that Deskthority thread in a white because I was so annoyed with the "resolution" of that GB, haha. Glad to hear you're still looking to produce the plates! In for one

A question on the standoffs and screws for whoever has experience to answer this: a 1/2 inch standoff like this should be enough clearance, correct? Also, would a GON-style countersink screw link this sit relatively flush to the hole, or would I have to look for a screw that's much smaller and has a head that's just larger than the holes on the plate? And if the latter, I guess my question is then how large are the holes for the screws on the plate?

Thanks in advance!

bolt holes are 0.0650" (1/16 = 0.0625) Holes will not be countersunk. Your standoffs are fine. I suggested some hardware earlier in the thread. When this goes to GB I will be sure to list all the (suggested) parts, where to get them, and how much they cost.

[ehwc]

I hadn't checked on that Deskthority thread in a white because I was so annoyed with the "resolution" of that GB, haha. Glad to hear you're still looking to produce the plates! In for one

A question on the standoffs and screws for whoever has experience to answer this: a 1/2 inch standoff like this should be enough clearance, correct? Also, would a GON-style countersink screw link this sit relatively flush to the hole, or would I have to look for a screw that's much smaller and has a head that's just larger than the holes on the plate? And if the latter, I guess my question is then how large are the holes for the screws on the plate?

Thanks in advance!

bolt holes are 0.0650" (1/16 = 0.0625) Holes will not be countersunk. Your standoffs are fine. I suggested some hardware earlier in the thread. When this goes to GB I will be sure to list all the (suggested) parts, where to get them, and how much they cost.

Thanks!

[roostrc0gburn]

update bump. check OP

[Dernubenfrieken]

Not a fan of winkeyless myself. Probably would only buy if its standard ansi.

[tuco]

Not a fan of winkeyless myself. Probably would only buy if its standard ansi.

Me too.

[roostrc0gburn]

roger that. i think i will be able to make both layouts available in either stainless or aluminum

[TalkingTree]

The strike out on PCB and controller means that they won't available in the GB anymore?

[roostrc0gburn]

The strike out on PCB and controller means that they won't available in the GB anymore?

i crossed them out with the assumption that we dont have enough people to get a significant discount on those items. I am currently trying to determine if we can get a complete set in the ~ $100-$120 range before starting the Group Buy phase, so this could change.

small update, GB will be starting in a couple weeks. the delay is mainly due to chinese new year

[TurtleHat]

I'm interested in an ANSIWIN Phantom plate, but it doesn't look like that's on the table here. Maybe if there's a future group buy.

[axtran]

I recommend considering JD's offer as he can help with plates to meet International layouts too (if desired).

[roostrc0gburn]

I recommend considering JD's offer as he can help with plates to meet International layouts too (if desired).

yes, a good suggestion. i wanted to keep this simple in the beginning, but perhaps offering multiple layouts could gain interest. i dont know if multiple patterns will add complexity (price) to the order, or if it even matters.

since we'll be stuck in IC for a couple more weeks, i will put up a poll for multiple layouts. can i get suggestions?

[axtran]

I recommend considering JD's offer as he can help with plates to meet International layouts too (if desired).

yes, a good suggestion. i wanted to keep this simple in the beginning, but perhaps offering multiple layouts could gain interest. i dont know if multiple patterns will add complexity (price) to the order, or if it even matters.

since we'll be stuck in IC for a couple more weeks, i will put up a poll for multiple layouts. can i get suggestions?

I honestly think you'll need four major ones--ANSI 1.25, ANSI 1.5 WKL, ISO 1.25 and ISO 1.5 WKL.

[skiwithpete]

I'm in for one of these BTW.

Please let me know if this is going to happen.

P

[roostrc0gburn]

I'm in for one of these BTW.

Please let me know if this is going to happen.

P

definitely going to happen - just a question of when (after chinese new year), what all people want, and what we can get

[mrging]

i'm in , cant wait to see this GB happen

[roostrc0gburn]

I recommend considering JD's offer as he can help with plates to meet International layouts too (if desired).

yes, a good suggestion. i wanted to keep this simple in the beginning, but perhaps offering multiple layouts could gain interest. i dont know if multiple patterns will add complexity (price) to the order, or if it even matters.

since we'll be stuck in IC for a couple more weeks, i will put up a poll for multiple layouts. can i get suggestions?

I honestly think you'll need four major ones--ANSI 1.25, ANSI 1.5 WKL, ISO 1.25 and ISO 1.5 WKL.

@jdcarpe,  sent you a PM on this.

[kebby]

I hope you could consider including the 7BIT plate as an option. I'd go for even multiple if that helps the case. Being able to get a split space is so rare and the Phantom would offer it but not being able to get the plates anywhere keeps me from building one.

[roostrc0gburn]

I hope you could consider including the 7BIT plate as an option. I'd go for even multiple if that helps the case. Being able to get a split space is so rare and the Phantom would offer it but not being able to get the plates anywhere keeps me from building one.

If you (or JD) have a CAD file for the layout, it would be pretty easy. I talked to the plate fab shop agian today to confirm prices and lead times. they can do pretty much any TKL layout we want (within reason) for the same price. they can also do aluminum and have some basic finishing capabilities. I am not familiar with the 7BIT layout, so please enlighten me

OP has been updated

[kebby]

I hope you could consider including the 7BIT plate as an option. I'd go for even multiple if that helps the case. Being able to get a split space is so rare and the Phantom would offer it but not being able to get the plates anywhere keeps me from building one.

If you (or JD) have a CAD file for the layout, it would be pretty easy. I talked to the plate fab shop agian today to confirm prices and lead times. they can do pretty much any TKL layout we want (within reason) for the same price. they can also do aluminum and have some basic finishing capabilities. I am not familiar with the 7BIT layout, so please enlighten me

OP has been updated

Looks like you could get the CAD files for it and some other Phantom plates here:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=47744

The default variant is shown here https://deskthority.net/wiki/Phantom and there's also a download for some CAD files but it looks like it's a less complete archive.

[mrging]

Which better? steel or aluminum?

[mrbishop]

Which better? steel or aluminum?

steel is harder but aluminum wont rust  but you can paint either or anodize them. so it could be a toss up.

aluminum is softer and is faster/easier to machine out if your using a CNC.

just depends on the manufacturing or your requirements for the part.

[roostrc0gburn]

Which better? steel or aluminum?

steel is harder but aluminum wont rust  but you can paint either or anodize them. so it could be a toss up.

aluminum is softer and is faster/easier to machine out if your using a CNC.

just depends on the manufacturing or your requirements for the part.

these are all great points, but let me add some perspective - these parts will all be lazered, so material type is almost moot. stainless steel will be heavier and more rigid, which is better for linear switches. aluminum has a bit of flex, which is better for tactile or clicky switches. The aluminum plates available will not be anodized. aluminum will oxidize, but at a very slow rate. nevertheless, i would still suggest that people who select an aluminum plate provide some layer of protection - anodizing or painting. the steel plates will be stainless #304, so oxidization is not an issue.

[mrbishop]

Which better? steel or aluminum?

steel is harder but aluminum wont rust  but you can paint either or anodize them. so it could be a toss up.

aluminum is softer and is faster/easier to machine out if your using a CNC.

just depends on the manufacturing or your requirements for the part.

these are all great points, but let me add some perspective - these parts will all be lazered, so material type is almost moot. stainless steel will be heavier and more rigid, which is better for linear switches. aluminum has a bit of flex, which is better for tactile or clicky switches. The aluminum plates available will not be anodized. aluminum will oxidize, but at a very slow rate. nevertheless, i would still suggest that people who select an aluminum plate provide some layer of protection - anodizing or painting. the steel plates will be stainless #304, so oxidization is not an issue.

 

[mrging]

hmmm nice, but how about shipping? shipping to vietnam cost how much ?

[braidn]

Hmm, if there was a 7bit option thrown in here, especially with WKL... I might have to be in.

[mrging]

hmm.. what is ansi 1.25 and 1.5 diff? bottom row?

[kenshinjeff]

Filled up the form : )

[00zeRO]

+1

[roostrc0gburn]

Update Bump!

you wanted layouts? You got layouts! OP updated. Also, it might again be possible to offer kits for a full keyboard! all parts included! i'm psyched on this

it's happening, guys!

[roostrc0gburn]

update bump. OP updated

we will now have all the parts needed to build the keyboard available in the group buy - except stabilizers. if anyone knows of a source, please PM me. even if they are not included in the group buy, i would like to be able to point people in the right direction to find all the parts to build the board.

still finishing up a couple things. it has been my goal to start the GB this week, but that may be a little rushed. I will try for this weekend, but if not - next week is looking pretty doable.

Thanks everyone!

[TalkingTree]

Is anyone proxying in Europe?

[roostrc0gburn]

Is anyone proxying in Europe?

i haven't heard anyone volunteer, but i bet there are a couple people we could ask...

[mark_thaddeus]

I'm interested and did the survey!

[s3vv4]

Does the Phantom PCB need diodes? I thought you only need those when you do manual wiring in the form of a matrix.

[jdcarpe]

Does the Phantom PCB need diodes? I thought you only need those when you do manual wiring in the form of a matrix.

Any keyboard with anti-ghosting and/or more than 2KRO has diodes. Many newer PCBs have SMD diodes installed at the factory, but the Phantom was designed with through hole intentions. So yes, you have to solder the diodes in during assembly. It's not hard at all.

[mrbishop]

Does the Phantom PCB need diodes? I thought you only need those when you do manual wiring in the form of a matrix.

Any keyboard with anti-ghosting and/or more than 2KRO has diodes. Many newer PCBs have SMD diodes installed at the factory, but the Phantom was designed with through hole intentions. So yes, you have to solder the diodes in during assembly. It's not hard at all.

Soldering diodes is so relaxing
so Zen!
happy place
 

[axtran]

Checked in on the OP again--figure buying a large amount of Teensy modules directly from PJRC might be effective, and electrical components as a large order from Mouser would be bad either.

[s3vv4]

Does the Phantom PCB need diodes? I thought you only need those when you do manual wiring in the form of a matrix.

Any keyboard with anti-ghosting and/or more than 2KRO has diodes. Many newer PCBs have SMD diodes installed at the factory, but the Phantom was designed with through hole intentions. So yes, you have to solder the diodes in during assembly. It's not hard at all.

Thanks for the explanation!

[megaforce]

Would we be able to order pieces of the kit?

Thanks for your hard work on the project!

[roostrc0gburn]

Would we be able to order pieces of the kit?

Thanks for your hard work on the project!

Yup. I am thinking that I will offer all the parts in a kit at one price, and make all the individual parts (that I have access to) available for purchase separately.

[need]

So psyched about this, it's happening this weekend right?

[roostrc0gburn]

So psyched about this, it's happening this weekend right?

i would like to start it this weekend, but i'm not quite ready to start taking orders. still trying to procure a solid vendor for stabilizers. i would also like to offer gateron switches if possible

as soon as i get it all locked in, we're ready to launch 

[LechnerDE]

I have all the Phantom parts except for a case.

Depending on price I might get this simple skeleton one 

[mrging]

so can we get custom sw - like ergo clear or black 60g?

[roostrc0gburn]

so can we get custom sw - like ergo clear or black 60g?

probly not... at this point we have greetech, kailh, cherry, and a limited supply of gaterons. still no stabs...

[theanyday]

So psyched about this, it's happening this weekend right?

i would like to start it this weekend, but i'm not quite ready to start taking orders. still trying to procure a solid vendor for stabilizers. i would also like to offer gateron switches if possible

as soon as i get it all locked in, we're ready to launch 

Dang roostr, its been a while since I've checked in here, looks like this is going to be a solid buy hope you get lots of support. 

[s3vv4]

The survey to me suggests that switches and stabilizers come in a package deal, is that the case? I'd prefer to just get stabilizers.

[mrging]

:v hope we can get ZEALIO SWITCHES hehe. anw hope thing start soon.... cant wait anymore..

[need]

OP, how's it going?   

[roostrc0gburn]

The survey to me suggests that switches and stabilizers come in a package deal, is that the case? I'd prefer to just get stabilizers.

so far, we dont have a vendor for stabilizers. one may show up during GB, but looks like people will have to source their own. 

:v hope we can get ZEALIO SWITCHES hehe. anw hope thing start soon.... cant wait anymore..

Zealios are proprietary through Zeal, and i seriously doubt he would offer a discount for us on this kit. he has (or recently had) a LARGE group buy going on. expect to see more of these in the second hand market and other vendors soon

OP, how's it going?   

good. how you doin? 

I'll post the GB thread tonight. feels a bit premature, but wth

[LeandreN]

Doesn't Zeal have stabilisers in his store? Maybe only worth it if you are buying Zealios because of the shipping cost.

[axtran]

If you're okay with Costar, they are very inexpensive from WASD.

[tuco]

Will this need standoffs for the LEDs?

[roostrc0gburn]

Doesn't Zeal have stabilisers in his store? Maybe only worth it if you are buying Zealios because of the shipping cost.

yes, great idea. thanks for that! i thought i saw some in a recent GB thread... 

If you're okay with Costar, they are very inexpensive from WASD.

another good source, thanks!

Will this need standoffs for the LEDs?

no, standoffs will not be necessary, the plate design has very small holes for the LEDs. they will be installed flat to the pcb, under the plate. I will post a build log when prototyping to explain...

Just posted the GB thread. awaiting mod approval. I will open up orders this week. hoping to not get overwhelmed... kinda nervous

[axtran]

You could also opt to use the in-switch LED option for the locking keys instead of the a Filco positions. It's preference and both are supported.

Maybe do pinholes, similar to the Orion v2 at the Filco LED positions? Would be cool.

[roostrc0gburn]

You could also opt to use the in-switch LED option for the locking keys instead of the a Filco positions. It's preference and both are supported.

Maybe do pinholes, similar to the Orion v2 at the Filco LED positions? Would be cool.

pinholes are what we have now. I dont think I will be making any more changes to the plate design unless there is some flaw

[00zeRO]

You could also opt to use the in-switch LED option for the locking keys instead of the a Filco positions. It's preference and both are supported.

Maybe do pinholes, similar to the Orion v2 at the Filco LED positions? Would be cool.

pinholes are what we have now. I dont think I will be making any more changes to the plate design unless there is some flaw

Pinholes are gold! +1

[rotciveel]

Get that GB thread approved!

[roostrc0gburn]

Get that GB thread approved!

I DONT KNOW HOW!

[rotciveel]

Get that GB thread approved!

I DONT KNOW HOW!

 

[axtran]

Doesn't Zeal have stabilisers in his store? Maybe only worth it if you are buying Zealios because of the shipping cost.

Issue with Phantom PCB is that it requires plate-mount switches and plate-mount stabilizers. I don't think Zeal has plate-mount stabilizers. Cheapest solution is going to be purchasing 6.25U wire (or 7U wire) on eBay and then finding plate-mount hardware to get Cherry G99 stabilizers, else force everyone to use Costar (which will not jive well with the Cherry Profile keycap crowd.

[LeandreN]

Doesn't Zeal have stabilisers in his store? Maybe only worth it if you are buying Zealios because of the shipping cost.

Issue with Phantom PCB is that it requires plate-mount switches and plate-mount stabilizers. I don't think Zeal has plate-mount stabilizers. Cheapest solution is going to be purchasing 6.25U wire (or 7U wire) on eBay and then finding plate-mount hardware to get Cherry G99 stabilizers, else force everyone to use Costar (which will not jive well with the Cherry Profile keycap crowd.

I think he does.

https://zealpc.net/collections/accessories/products/pcb-plate-mount-cherry-stabilizers

[K.Mak]

Doesn't Zeal have stabilisers in his store? Maybe only worth it if you are buying Zealios because of the shipping cost.

Issue with Phantom PCB is that it requires plate-mount switches and plate-mount stabilizers. I don't think Zeal has plate-mount stabilizers. Cheapest solution is going to be purchasing 6.25U wire (or 7U wire) on eBay and then finding plate-mount hardware to get Cherry G99 stabilizers, else force everyone to use Costar (which will not jive well with the Cherry Profile keycap crowd.

I am a fan of thick Cherry profile PBT and Costar stabilizers and the only time I had a compatibility issue was when I was using a plate that clearly wasn't cut well enough to support the Costar. This was basically proven when I pulled the stabilizers out of my Filco to try out. Meanwhile, I popped those same "incompatible" stabilizers into the Filco, also flawless operation. I have had both Filco and WASD boards with Cherry profile thick PBT, the plate with the issue was from a group buy.

I am pretty sure the only time stabilizers grind keys is when the cutout in the plate isn't large enough, which ends up compressing the stabilizer pegs slightly. This leads to the wire itself being somewhat out of an ideal position and grinding the cap.

[roostrc0gburn]

Doesn't Zeal have stabilisers in his store? Maybe only worth it if you are buying Zealios because of the shipping cost.

Issue with Phantom PCB is that it requires plate-mount switches and plate-mount stabilizers. I don't think Zeal has plate-mount stabilizers. Cheapest solution is going to be purchasing 6.25U wire (or 7U wire) on eBay and then finding plate-mount hardware to get Cherry G99 stabilizers, else force everyone to use Costar (which will not jive well with the Cherry Profile keycap crowd.

I am a fan of thick Cherry profile PBT and Costar stabilizers and the only time I had a compatibility issue was when I was using a plate that clearly wasn't cut well enough to support the Costar. This was basically proven when I pulled the stabilizers out of my Filco to try out. Meanwhile, I popped those same "incompatible" stabilizers into the Filco, also flawless operation. I have had both Filco and WASD boards with Cherry profile thick PBT, the plate with the issue was from a group buy.

I am pretty sure the only time stabilizers grind keys is when the cutout in the plate isn't large enough, which ends up compressing the stabilizer pegs slightly. This leads to the wire itself being somewhat out of an ideal position and grinding the cap.

yup. 1000x this. i had the same issue with some of my previous keyboards. I am definitely verifying this during prototyping. Costar stabs are (in my experience) usually more available, and cheaper. They are very finicky, though. The problem is that not all clips are created equal; make the cutout too small, and the stems grind. Make the cutout too large and you get a TON of chatter. I have a couple different sets I will be using to verify the cutout sizes, but if anyone else has input please share!

[axtran]

I can guarantee that Costar doesn't work on true GMK/OG Cherry keycaps. "Cherry Profile" Gateron is YMMV. I also didn't see Zeal had Plate Mount stabs. No matter, the shipping is prohibitive for a cost-effective bulk purchase, all things considered with a Phantom package.

[TalkingTree]

I use Costar stabilizers on a Filco with OG Cherry keycaps without any issue.

[roostrc0gburn]

Group Buy thread here: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=80118

locking this thread. Thanks everyone!