[IC] ePBT Royal Alpha

[pcire]

Received the updated samples from ePBT a few days ago. When I have a chance I'll go over them and check that everything is up to snuff before continuing on.

Awesome news!

[pepo2181]

Ohh didn't see this before!! Now I want it!!

[donutcat]

Got a chance to open the set up and see what's what:


Base kit - notice I'm missing the ISO Enter


Intl kit


Looking at warping in the big spacebars


Loooking at warping in the other longer keys


Good news: It looks good. Alignment seems quite good with many of the special characters being much improved.

Bad news: Long keys are pretty warped. In the very small amount of time I've had to check in on stuff I had seen some mention of recent ePBT stuff having more warping due to changing colors. When I get in touch I'll try to see if there's any info about working on that before the set is ready to run.

Unrelated: I really need to get a display board for full sets so I don’t have to try and line up keys manually. PCB for a standardized full set display board ? :thonk:

[cldskt]

Got a chance to open the set up and see what's what:

Show Image

Base kit - notice I'm missing the ISO Enter

Show Image

Intl kit

Show Image

Looking at warping in the big spacebars

Show Image

Loooking at warping in the other longer keys


Good news: It looks good. Alignment seems quite good with many of the special characters being much improved.

Bad news: Long keys are pretty warped. In the very small amount of time I've had to check in on stuff I had seen some mention of recent ePBT stuff having more warping due to changing colors. When I get in touch I'll try to see if there's any info about working on that before the set is ready to run.

Unrelated: I really need to get a display board for full sets so I don’t have to try and line up keys manually. PCB for a standardized full set display board ? :thonk:

Yep that’s the usual warping. Not sure if anything can be done about that at this point tbh.

[donutcat]

Finally had the time to get the set onto a board. Consistency and alignment are much better *across the board* than the first batch. I'm pretty happy with the current look of the set.

I did put what long keys I could on stabs to see how bad the warping would affect them. The long spacebars seem fine, a couple of the 2u-2.75u seem a little sticky, I couldn't test the 3u. I'll talk with them and see if the warping was just this sample being rushed out and if for the GB QA for warping will be a bit more stringent.

[laserbeamspewpew]

Show Image

Finally had the time to get the set onto a board. Consistency and alignment are much better *across the board* than the first batch. I'm pretty happy with the current look of the set.

I did put what long keys I could on stabs to see how bad the warping would affect them. The long spacebars seem fine, a couple of the 2u-2.75u seem a little sticky, I couldn't test the 3u. I'll talk with them and see if the warping was just this sample being rushed out and if for the GB QA for warping will be a bit more stringent.

Are those green accents part of this set? Can we get some of the lighter green color?

[tex_live_utility]

Wow, EPBT actually did reverse dye sub? Is that a first?

Edit: oops, those look like GMK caps.

[EMC Labs]

Did this ever drop by any chance? It's quite old but it is still in IC.

[donutcat]

Did this ever drop by any chance? It's quite old but it is still in IC.

Still working on it. Waiting for a bit more feedback on this stage and then the next step is hopefully discussing specifics of the GB process with KBDFans.

[EMC Labs]

Did this ever drop by any chance? It's quite old but it is still in IC.

Still working on it. Waiting for a bit more feedback on this stage and then the next step is hopefully discussing specifics of the GB process with KBDFans.

Oh okay. I really like the design and wish it makes GB. Thanks for letting me know.

[donutcat]

So, back to working on this and I've hit a point where feedback is needed. Lots of people are wanting some accent keys keys for the set. After talking with Gok about his experience with reverse subs from ePBT, his statement was that it's not as sharp as the normal subbing and the color has some inconsistency in it. So here's a strawpoll to see where people's opinions lie for this https://www.strawpoll.me/18401714. I'll let this run for awhile and see where it sits before moving forward.

[EMC Labs]

So, back to working on this and I've hit a point where feedback is needed. Lots of people are wanting some accent keys keys for the set. After talking with Gok about his experience with reverse subs from ePBT, his statement was that it's not as sharp as the normal subbing and the color has some inconsistency in it. So here's a strawpoll to see where people's opinions lie for this https://www.strawpoll.me/18401714. I'll let this run for awhile and see where it sits before moving forward.

Great to hear!

[laserbeamspewpew]

I think a couple accents like kuro/shiro had wouldn’t increase the cost too much, no? I suggest a couple of green CODE keys like the RA typewriter this set is based on instead of the traditional Esc-Enter. Or just make it a separate kit.

[ideus]

My wallet has a conflict of interest between this and 9009 r3. Cannot get both. 

[romevi]

My wallet has a conflict of interest between this and 9009 r3. Cannot get both. 

Easy:

ePBT > GMK.

[ideus]

My wallet has a conflict of interest between this and 9009 r3. Cannot get both. 

Easy:

ePBT > GMK.

But GMK has all the molds for my 50 oddness requirements and the great R5 bottom row. An old fart like me cannot let the Classic to pass.

[romevi]

My wallet has a conflict of interest between this and 9009 r3. Cannot get both. 

Easy:

ePBT > GMK.

But GMK has all the molds for my 50 oddness requirements and the great R5 bottom row. An old fart like me cannot let the Classic to pass.

Oh... I see.

[EMC Labs]

Any updates on this?

[donutcat]

Working on getting some updated quotes to consider the effect the reverse subs could have on the set price if implemented. The results of the poll were quite close so I'm wanting a bit more information to work with.

[EMC Labs]

Working on getting some updated quotes to consider the effect the reverse subs could have on the set price if implemented. The results of the poll were quite close so I'm wanting a bit more information to work with.

Great to hear. Excited about this set.

[Rayndalf]

Please considered 'barred only' (or 'scooped only' if ePBT has molds) instead of 'barred and scooped' homing keys.

[donutcat]

Small update, getting quotes for base kits both with and without some reverse subbed keys added in to see how significant the difference is. This should also be when I get my quotes for what KBDFans' pricing will be for the GB process since I've elected to go through them due to my current situation.

[donutcat]

So it's been a hot minute since the last update; stuff just kinda got buried under work to do and things that needed more of my attention. I'm back in touch with Wei and we're knocking out the final details right now. What I can tell you right now is we are looking to go forward with a couple reverse-subbed accent keys as long as the samples for them look good.

Of note is I'm also currently in a situation concerning the "international kit": ePBT's MOQ is 200, so I'm almost sure an international kit wouldn't hit that, but on the other hand it's a lot of keys to tuck into the base kit. I'm not wanting to ditch it completely but I'm sure keeping "unnecessary keys" in the base is of concern for people. Something I have to think on.

[bananasplit_00]

I think these look pretty great, interested for sure!

Really enjoy my Budget96 and i think these would look nice on it 

[scoopbb]

ortho kit please. epbt has molds and its super cheap usually

[tex_live_utility]

ortho kit please. epbt has molds and its super cheap usually

Kinda silly but how about green 1u blanks instead? Might be cheaper.

[scoopbb]

ortho kit please. epbt has molds and its super cheap usually

Kinda silly but how about green 1u blanks instead? Might be cheaper.

ortho kit is like 12 - 18 bucks for the epbt sets. thats already cheap in my book

[Slayer77]

Please keep 2u shift in base

Sent from my GM1911 using Tapatalk

[Zurg Eon]

Very interested in this. Hoping the international kit stays. A 1.5u green backspace like the original typewriter had could have been nice.

[rockydbull]

So it's been a hot minute since the last update; stuff just kinda got buried under work to do and things that needed more of my attention. I'm back in touch with Wei and we're knocking out the final details right now. What I can tell you right now is we are looking to go forward with a couple reverse-subbed accent keys as long as the samples for them look good.

Of note is I'm also currently in a situation concerning the "international kit": ePBT's MOQ is 200, so I'm almost sure an international kit wouldn't hit that, but on the other hand it's a lot of keys to tuck into the base kit. I'm not wanting to ditch it completely but I'm sure keeping "unnecessary keys" in the base is of concern for people. Something I have to think on.

Interesting, I was under the impression from other custom epbt sets run recently that the MOQ of 200 is for the base kit and the child kits don't have a MOQ. Looking at 2048 and SJA I can't imagine all of those child kits got to 200.

[ideus]

Very interested in this. Hoping the international kit stays. A 1.5u green backspace like the original typewriter had could have been nice.

There is no international kit in the OP. What do you mean? Even if it were included it only may be manufactured if vendors help to support it reaching MoQ. Also, an international kit would be redundant with the green international sub legends.

[Zurg Eon]

Very interested in this. Hoping the international kit stays. A 1.5u green backspace like the original typewriter had could have been nice.

There is no international kit in the OP. What do you mean? Even if it were included it only may be manufactured if vendors help to support it reaching MoQ. Also, an international kit would be redundant with the green international sub legends.

I mean this:

Show Image

Intl kit

Of note is I'm also currently in a situation concerning the "international kit": ePBT's MOQ is 200, so I'm almost sure an international kit wouldn't hit that, but on the other hand it's a lot of keys to tuck into the base kit. I'm not wanting to ditch it completely but I'm sure keeping "unnecessary keys" in the base is of concern for people. Something I have to think on.

[ideus]

Thank you for the answer. If this were included, I would be in. I do not use the US ANSI anymore, so I need a set that covers Nords layouts. By the way, it is missing a R4 <>| key.

[eskimojo]

Of note is I'm also currently in a situation concerning the "international kit": ePBT's MOQ is 200, so I'm almost sure an international kit wouldn't hit that, but on the other hand it's a lot of keys to tuck into the base kit. I'm not wanting to ditch it completely but I'm sure keeping "unnecessary keys" in the base is of concern for people. Something I have to think on.

So MOQ Hit?

Yes. It was 200 for the base kit. That’s all

Did something change on the ePBT side? biip and his vendors were very clear that the 200 MOQ was only for base, and child kits effectively had a MOQ of 1.

[donutcat]

Of note is I'm also currently in a situation concerning the "international kit": ePBT's MOQ is 200, so I'm almost sure an international kit wouldn't hit that, but on the other hand it's a lot of keys to tuck into the base kit. I'm not wanting to ditch it completely but I'm sure keeping "unnecessary keys" in the base is of concern for people. Something I have to think on.

So MOQ Hit?

Yes. It was 200 for the base kit. That’s all

Did something change on the ePBT side? biip and his vendors were very clear that the 200 MOQ was only for base, and child kits effectively had a MOQ of 1.

Seems I'll need to go doublecheck on what I was told then. I was fairly sure they said 200 per kit, but there's a chance with everything language barrier included I may have misunderstood.

[eskimojo]

By the way, I recommend checking these two articles out for designing an International kit - they helped me out a lot when designing mine. 

Possible International Kits for Custom Sets

A Visual Comparison of Different National Layouts on a Computer Keyboard

[donutcat]

I'll just leave this here. Also, I'm getting the splitting up of the kit and the issue of MOQ for the Intl kit taken care of as well. Hoping we might finally have this ready to get going here shortly.

[Fredington]

Show Image

I'll just leave this here. Also, I'm getting the splitting up of the kit and the issue of MOQ for the Intl kit taken care of as well. Hoping we might finally have this ready to get going here shortly.

Looks good but I would really like to see some of the lime green accents on non-traditional accent keys like delete and code (as per the original RA keyboard):

[bananasplit_00]

-snip-


I'll just leave this here. Also, I'm getting the splitting up of the kit and the issue of MOQ for the Intl kit taken care of as well. Hoping we might finally have this ready to get going here shortly.

So are the lime sublegends going to be there or not? Its really nice either way but they are definitely part of the appeal

[donutcat]

-snip-


I'll just leave this here. Also, I'm getting the splitting up of the kit and the issue of MOQ for the Intl kit taken care of as well. Hoping we might finally have this ready to get going here shortly.

So are the lime sublegends going to be there or not? Its really nice either way but they are definitely part of the appeal

Realized I hadn't yet posted a recent mockup for the set:


Hmm, for some reason this pic has issues with embedding well.

[bananasplit_00]

-snip-


I'll just leave this here. Also, I'm getting the splitting up of the kit and the issue of MOQ for the Intl kit taken care of as well. Hoping we might finally have this ready to get going here shortly.

So are the lime sublegends going to be there or not? Its really nice either way but they are definitely part of the appeal

Realized I hadn't yet posted a recent mockup for the set:
-snip-

Sweet, looks amazing!

[nephlock]

-snip-


I'll just leave this here. Also, I'm getting the splitting up of the kit and the issue of MOQ for the Intl kit taken care of as well. Hoping we might finally have this ready to get going here shortly.

So are the lime sublegends going to be there or not? Its really nice either way but they are definitely part of the appeal

Realized I hadn't yet posted a recent mockup for the set:

Show Image

Hmm, for some reason this pic has issues with embedding well.

I’m so hot for this.

[Zurg Eon]

Realized I hadn't yet posted a recent mockup for the set:

Show Image

Hmm, for some reason this pic has issues with embedding well.

Looks super nice!
Found an issue with the 9-key in the international section. I believe it should have ) as the sub legend. 8 has (.
Other than that, I feel like I can live without two of the keys that would bring perfect (?) or closer to perfect ISO Nor compat (i.e. 2"@ and 4¤$).

Interesting inclusion of two 3u spacebars. Haven't seen those before, but I guess there's a use for them.

Here's an idea: Include a lime green 2u backspace with box-icon. That's an accent key I would use, just to match the original this is based on for modern layouts. :D (even though the original had a 1.5u backspace in the top right corner)

And also, I would suggest dropping the icon from the shift keys. Would match better with the other mods. OG didn't have icons either, except for backspace. Icons on enter, backspace and tab are fine though.

[gok_nz]

Realized I hadn't yet posted a recent mockup for the set:

Show Image

Hmm, for some reason this pic has issues with embedding well.

Looks super nice!
Found an issue with the 9-key in the international section. I believe it should have ) as the sub legend. 8 has (.
Other than that, I feel like I can live without two of the keys that would bring perfect (?) or closer to perfect ISO Nor compat (i.e. 2"@ and 4¤$).

Interesting inclusion of two 3u spacebars. Haven't seen those before, but I guess there's a use for them.

Here's an idea: Include a lime green 2u backspace with box-icon. That's an accent key I would use, just to match the original this is based on for modern layouts. :D (even though the original had a 1.5u backspace in the top right corner)

And also, I would suggest dropping the icon from the shift keys. Would match better with the other mods. OG didn't have icons either, except for backspace. Icons on enter, backspace and tab are fine though.

Oops. Nice pick up. I'll get this fixed right now. Cheers.

[ideus]

Does the <> key cap fit better in the international kit? If so it should have the less/greater-than symbols in dark green and the pipe and back slash in light green, and their positions should be switched on the key.

[donutcat]

Does the <> key cap fit better in the international kit? If so it should have the less/greater-than symbols in dark green and the pipe and back slash in light green, and their positions should be switched on the key.

It's the R4 key for basic Eng-Intl/ISO support. As with many of the keys in this version, the legends are a bit of a compromise focusing firstly on Eng-Intl(the basis of the set) and *then* adding <> to technically meet the needs of several ISO layouts.

[bananasplit_00]

Got any updates on timeline and so on? Vendors? GB time? Looking forward to this set a lot

[bukowski]

The compatibility on the base-set... especially the extra addition of ÖÄÜ will make me join this one! Thanks for your efforts, donutcat

[ideus]

I'm so tempted by the Norse languages support. Also, the care the OP is giving to the quality of the fonts and plastic matching OG's is admirable. 

[donutcat]

Got any updates on timeline and so on? Vendors? GB time? Looking forward to this set a lot

This will be handled just by KBDFans just like how Kuro/Shiro was done. For right now I'm basically waiting on CNY to be over and then we can finish up the details to move to GB phase. With the Coronavirus dealio going on there's a chance that could affect our timeline too.