Author Topic: Comparisons: Filco MJ TKL-Blues, Razer BW TE Stealth-Browns, KBT Race S LE-Brown  (Read 2639 times)

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Offline JinDesu

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I thought I would do a comparison post and mini review of each of my 3 keyboards now that I'm very familiar with each. Hopefully this helps someone in their decision between the brands and switches.

Filco Majestouch Version I TKL with MX Blue switches


I like orange and black themes

I bought the Filco TKL about 3 years ago when I started developing tingling pain in my fingertips while typing on a rubberdome. I decided to find a mechanical switch that would have tactile feedback and audio feedback to train myself to not bottom out. At that time, blues was pretty popular amongst typists so I chose to get a Filco with MX blue switches.

Construction
The keyboard is solid. Even after 3 years, there isn't any signs of scratches or damage on this keyboard. While one may think "what damage would a keyboard suffer anyways?", I am a very clumsy person and I've dropped a few things onto my keyboard from my desk's top shelf before. I've also taken the keyboard with me to several LANs, and I trust in it's construction. The feet keep my keyboard pretty stable, and I've never felt any flex on this board. It's lacking in frills and whistles, but it really is a workhorse.

Keycaps, switches, enjoyment
The original ABS keycaps were replaced with PBT blanks. There was nothing inherently wrong with the ABS keycaps, it's just that I prefer a lot more texture on the keycaps than what the ABS ones had. I chose to get a set of PBT blanks that had very good texture on them, and they've lasted me since. The nice part about the Filco TKL is that it is a pretty standard keycap layout/sizing, so I was not lacking in keycap choices.

The MX blue switches are very enjoyable to type on for me. I've actually brought this keyboard to my work (it's my work one now), and while the clickies are noticeable - in an open environment, only my immediate neighbors can hear the clicking. Beyond the immediate neighbors, the ambient sound is loud enough to drown out most of the clicking. With the exception of my Z key, all my switches are still tactile. I'm able to touch type and not bottom out unless I'm trying to hold a key down. The switches are standard weight, and they are reasonably heavy and responsive for me. I have no problems reaching 120WPM on this keyboard.

Ease of use, complaints
The keyboard is simple plug and play. No fancy frills or whistles. With regards to keycap removal, it's pretty straightforward. The caps with stabilizers are difficult to remove, but not unreasonably. Because this is a plate mounted keyboard, I will need to desolder to remove switches - so I haven't bothered trying to mod it that way yet. The size of the keyboard is great - it lets me get my mouse hand parallel to my typing hand resting on WASD. The USB cable is not detachable - which is a good and bad thing. The good is that it's one thing less to fail. The bad is that if it does fail, I need to disassemble the board. Overall, I love this keyboard and it has great sentimental value to me.

Razer Blackwidow Tournament Edition Stealth with MX Brown switches


It comes with a nice felt bag... which attracts dust like nothing else!

Construction
The Razer BW has a pretty solid case and weight. Due to the larger size and the extra bits sticking out (the angled edge for the wrist), I did not feel that this keyboard was as tough as my Filco. Regardless, it still felt like it was a very solid keyboard - there was no noticeable flex while typing. The keyboard featured some LEDs for Fn and macro modes, but it is not a backlit keyboard (unlike the Ultimate). The flaw in the construction was the detachable USB. This is a common complaint with the Razers - the USB on mine got loose and can wiggle a little. When moving the keyboard, it would disconnect the keyboard. While reconnecting the keyboard wasn't that difficult, anytime you disconnect the keyboard and reconnect - the macro functions (located on a Razer cloud system) would reset and it was very annoying for me. I tested the keyboard USB port with another USB plug and it held better, but it would still occasionally disconnect.

Keycaps, switches, enjoyment
The keycaps actually have a pretty decent feel to them. I'm unsure of the lettering, but the material is ABS and the lettering has a texture to them. The font is kind of stupid, but I'm not really one to complain about that kind of thing. One problem I noticed with the keycaps was that the larger caps were very thin - I broke a piece off my spacebar's while trying to remove it from the keyboard. I've done that same removal multiple times to my other keyboards and never had such a situation occur.

The MX brown switches on this keyboard were pretty enjoyable. They were much quieter than my MX blues, but they still had a bit of sound. One issue I had with the keyboard/keycaps was that everything seemed "taller" than my Filco (and my Race S). I was having trouble typing faster than 100WPM on the keyboard after being used to my other keyboards. I wasn't sure originally if it was the switches or something else, but only recently I was able to really narrow it down to the keyboard profile. The switches have a very slight tactility to them, so I would bottom out more than when using my MX blues.

Ease of use, complaints
The keyboard could be used as a bare basic keyboard, but to access macro functions and media functions I had to install Razer's proprietary program (Synapse 2.0). The Synapse was a cloud based program that stored macro functions and keyboard profiles online, and if you want to access those features you must be logged in online. This means that if I bring my keyboard to a LAN without internet (literally, a LAN) - I won't be able to access my macro functions. In addition to that, somehow I broke my Synapse 2.0 profile where it would create blank profiles for me that would set themselves as default. What this means is that everytime I sign on and want to use my profiles, I would need to manually select the correct profile to use since the default one was a blank profile. To this day, that has not been fixed (even after contacting Razer support).

Although I liked the keyboard as is, the Synapse 2.0 and the odd profile really turned me off to this keyboard. Another complaint was the stabilizing stems were also prone to breaking. I broke two stabilizing stems while trying to remove the keycaps. Normally on my Filco and Race S, I could just pull the cap off with a little force and the stems would either come with the cap or stay on the keyboard. With the Razer, two of them broke off their stems. This issue, coupled with the USB plug and the broken spacebar, really makes a case for the quality of the Razer keyboards. This is an older model - so maybe the new ones are better, but I wouldn't bank on it.

Another issue with the Razer is that the keycaps are somewhat custom sized. The F# row is taller than all the other keys. In addition, the spacebar is a 6.25x spacebar. This makes customizing the keys a little more difficult - but at least all the F# keys are 1x wide so I could just replace them with R4 keys (or R1, which direction we're going).

Extra note
While the caps and the stabilizers leaves some things to be desired, the keyboard is surprisingly resilient. I had accidentally spilled a cup of orange juice onto the keyboard while it was plugged in, and afterwards it wouldn't respond to my computer. I recently washed the keyboard (under the sink) and cleared off some of the sticky switches (ethanol) and the keyboard works again. It has no problems now that I cleaned it up.

KBT Race S Limited Edition with MX Brown switches


I modded the LEDs with covers

Construction
The keyboard is much lighter than my other two keyboards. It is a 75% keyboard so it is smaller, but the casing feels much thinner and weaker than my Filco. It is also a PCB mounted keyboard That being said, it doesn't flex under my use so I don't think the construction is bad. I've heard that the paint will wear off over time (or at least, is thin enough to scratch), so that's not a good thing. It hasn't happened to me yet on the case, but one of my keycaps has a scratch on the face (not sure from what). The detachable USB has a nice snug fit and the PCB is very pretty to look at. The LEDs have some variance in brightness (which is annoying), but they are still working so I'm not complaining. The keyboard does not have extending legs, so that should be taken into account when considering this keyboard.

Keycaps, switches, enjoyment
The stock keycaps are white/clear ABS keycaps - I'm unsure how it's actually made, but I was able to scratch a part of the white off the keycap. I assume it's actually a clear keycap that's painted white. The keycaps have a reasonable texture to them so I don't mind typing on them. They have a very very snug fit on the switches. I find the snug fit reassuring because that means the tolerances were very tight. The PCB mounted switches make it a little confusing when using a keycap puller, because sometimes the wire puller lands under a switch and I can't pull anything out.

The MX brown switches on this keyboard feel way better than on the Razer for some reason. Typing on the Race S is like typing on fluffy clouds of light tactility. The sound is very muffled and it's a stark contrast to the Razer keyboard. I'm able to reach 120WPM on the keyboard, so it's definitely not artificially limiting me. I would be willing to say that typing on it is more enjoyable than typing on my Filco MX blues. In addition to the switches, the stabilizing stems on the keyboard are wonderfully done. On my Filco and the Razer, the stabilizing stems would be a pain in the butt to deal with when removing and installing keycaps. On those boards, the stabilizing stems would sit in their notches - but they had freedom to shift around. In addition, when pulling the caps out, those stabilizers would sometimes come with the cap. On the Race S, they have some housing that secures the stems so that they would stay on the board in the correct position. This made removing and reinstalling the larger caps easy.

Ease of use, complaints
The Race S is pretty much plug and play. It has an internal PCB that stores some functions - such as media functions and LED activation. The downside to this keyboard is that it doesn't remember the previous setting. When I turn off my computer and turn it on, the keyboard resets to the original settings. I understand that the Race 2 has memory for settings now - wish I had that!

The LEDs can be activated to all keys, just the WASD and arrows, or glowing and dimming. The LEDs are reasonably bright enough to shine around the keys if I replace them with non-glow keys. The overall effect is very pretty, and it makes me want to use the keyboard more (I'm shallow, so what). The lack of extending feet also makes it a little less accommodating, but the base profile is good enough for me. I have no problems reaching all the keys that I want.

One major complaint with regards to the Race S is the keycap profiles/sizes. The Race S has the basic R1-R4, but introduces a taller R5 row. The problem is that, unlike the Razer, the Escape and the Delete keys in R5 are 1.25x instead of 1x. There aren't any typical 1.25x number row keycaps out there, so I would either have to replace the F# keys with number row keycaps and leave the Escape and Delete, or I would have to replace them all with number row keycaps and have gaps. Or just use DSA for everything. If I was aware of this issue, it might have caused me to reconsider getting the keyboard. To be fair, I love the keyboard now that I used it - but the keycaps are annoying as heck for me.

Conclusion[/u]
Hopefully the above three mini-summaries help some people in choosing between brands and switch types. I enjoyed each keyboard for their own separate reasons, but I love my Filco for being steady and I love the Race S for being fun. The Razer has too many issues for me to love, but it was still nice to use. All three keyboards are older models, so the newer ones may have resolved some of the issues I've pointed out. The next keyboard I would get would probably be either a Topre or a MX Green/Clear. I can definitely try to answer any questions associated with the three keyboards mentioned in this post.
« Last Edit: Tue, 13 May 2014, 12:34:34 by JinDesu »
Someday somebody will best me, but it won't be today, and it won't be you.

Proud owner of a Filco Majestouch Cherry MX Blue Tenkeyless, KBT Race S, & Realforce 101

Offline CPTBadAss

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Ugh, I have bad memories with those inserts on the Blackwidow. I broke so many on mine. I also think the browns feel different on your race because of the lack of a plate.

Anyways, nice review! I enjoyed reading it and I have many of the same conclusions as you have about the Blackwidow and Filco.

Oh and I just wanted to point something out that I've noticed that is insanely annoying for me when I'm writing posts for Geekhack. At the ends of your titles, you have the [/u] showing. To fix that, your bbcode should read

Code: [Select]
[b][u]yourtexthere[/u][/b]

For some reason, the code won't read:

Code: [Select]
[b][u]yourtexthere[/b][/u]
« Last Edit: Tue, 13 May 2014, 12:27:23 by CPTBadAss »

Offline JinDesu

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I'll fix that. Also it keeps telling me gateway timed out when it actually posted. Ugh! Need to get rid of the other two.

You may have a point regarding the plate. It's a huge feel difference between the two keyboards - it's so much softer on the Race S.
« Last Edit: Tue, 13 May 2014, 12:30:42 by JinDesu »
Someday somebody will best me, but it won't be today, and it won't be you.

Proud owner of a Filco Majestouch Cherry MX Blue Tenkeyless, KBT Race S, & Realforce 101

Offline CPTBadAss

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Yeah that's also really annoying. All the gateway timeouts recently. :(

Offline JinDesu

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Yeah that's also really annoying. All the gateway timeouts recently. :(

Well, I went and tried to modify the [/u] but it gateway timed out on me again lol... and didn't go through... which is so confusing!

In addition to the blues and browns, I've played with a MX Red keyboard (Leopold, I believe) and I cannot stand the lack of tactility. The linear switches make sense, but I just can't use them :(
« Last Edit: Tue, 13 May 2014, 12:44:41 by JinDesu »
Someday somebody will best me, but it won't be today, and it won't be you.

Proud owner of a Filco Majestouch Cherry MX Blue Tenkeyless, KBT Race S, & Realforce 101

Offline CPTBadAss

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I think you'll really like a keyboard with MX clears as well if you like tactility and Browns.

Offline JinDesu

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I think you'll really like a keyboard with MX clears as well if you like tactility and Browns.

I'm thinking to mod the Race S to clears sometime. The Filco is at work and the Race S is at home, and the Blackwidow is going to a friend so he can try out browns. Don't really have space to keep getting more keyboards!
Someday somebody will best me, but it won't be today, and it won't be you.

Proud owner of a Filco Majestouch Cherry MX Blue Tenkeyless, KBT Race S, & Realforce 101

Offline the random asian

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Do you know where you got those caps?

Offline JinDesu

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I'll check my history when I get a chance, but I believe it was a group buy back about 3 years for coloured PBT blanks, 104 keys.
Someday somebody will best me, but it won't be today, and it won't be you.

Proud owner of a Filco Majestouch Cherry MX Blue Tenkeyless, KBT Race S, & Realforce 101