[GB] GH-122.2016 R1 PCB - Completed!

[samwisekoi]

Would the PCB be mounted to the case in any way or would it be the type that is held in suspension by the switches and the switch plate?

Both, probably.

However, 244+ solder connections is a pretty firm hold.

I am doing the case design right this very minute, so we will see.

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[Data]

Trying to come up with a layout that uses most of the available switch space and isn't just a direct copy of the Unicomp.



 ) It's an absurd number of keys and I love it.

[samwisekoi]

Working on the Unicomp case concept today.  Based on careful measurements, the space between blocks should be 0.330".  I think. 

Anyhow, I drew up a two-part adapter switch plate, and have submitted it for a quote in 6mm/1/4" Acrylic.

And since a switch plate is an essential part of a sandwich case, this will give a good indication of the cost of the most expensive layer of that piece.

Cheers!

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[toidbb]

Is there still room to get into this GB? Really interested on where this is going.

[Niomosy]

I don't need this I don't need this I don't need this.

Wait!  I'm going to wait until a fully assembled board is available.  Yeah, that's it! 

/begins chanting again
I don't need this I don't need this....

[punkpc]

This project is looking great. Be nice if it would fit in my 2100 case, but that sandwich style case looks great too.

I'll be down for one if prices stay reasonable. 

[Spaceman1200]

Sandwich case for the whole pcb layout with ANSI standard layout? Count me in.

[samwisekoi]

Got some prices back.  A single custom plate is $80-100; less with volume.  The price is pretty much the same for SS or Acrylic.  And what adds cost is cutting time, so a plate of any configuration is around $100.  From there you can build a sandwich case, or make a plate-mount in an empty Unicomp PC-122 case.

Or you could make the plate a little larger, bend it a few times, and do a bent-plate case.

This is the least expensive option, and it seems to go with the design, in an industrial 1950's kind of way.  Add a beige crinkle-finish powder coat and some sides and some Nuclear Data keycaps, and you've got a big-ass Cold War keyboard.

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[njbair]

That sounds amazing. The only concern with the oversized bent plate, is that the "floating keys" style wouldn't really go with the Cold War aesthetic. You need a mounting plate that's separate from the bent metal case.

[blai5000]

Got some prices back.  A single custom plate is $80-100; less with volume.  The price is pretty much the same for SS or Acrylic.  And what adds cost is cutting time, so a plate of any configuration is around $100.  From there you can build a sandwich case, or make a plate-mount in an empty Unicomp PC-122 case.

Or you could make the plate a little larger, bend it a few times, and do a bent-plate case.

This is the least expensive option, and it seems to go with the design, in an industrial 1950's kind of way.  Add a beige crinkle-finish powder coat and some sides and some Nuclear Data keycaps, and you've got a big-ass Cold War keyboard.

 - Ron | samwisekoi

That bent-plate case is pretty much exactly what I was thinking; it'd be perfect!

[Phenix]

awesome pic!

But I think I will add a top plate after some time because I want to figure some things out (e.g. add the keys around the arrowkeys, ...) and for that its easier+cheaper that I can modify/add/remove the switches better

The 100$ price for the plate: is it for the WHOLE plate pictured above (so basically a case without a bottom/sides) or only for the top plate??

[metalliqaz]

Workin on this.  So many keys! 

[njbair]

I wanna know who's going to make keycaps for all these keys?

[Phenix]

I don't really care. Got around 4 cherry boards yesterday (one 1500 and 3 medical ones, but no doubleshots one them)

If needed Ill color them

[SpAmRaY]

I wanna know who's going to make keycaps for all these keys?

It's already been done, haven't you heard of nuclear green data all row 3 SA caps? And you can always use RAD HARD as accents.

[njbair]

I wanna know who's going to make keycaps for all these keys?

It's already been done, haven't you heard of nuclear green data all row 3 SA caps? And you can always use RAD HARD as accents.

I know about nuclear data, but does it have enough keys?

[samwisekoi]

I wanna know who's going to make keycaps for all these keys?

It's already been done, haven't you heard of nuclear green data all row 3 SA caps? And you can always use RAD HARD as accents.

I know about nuclear data, but does it have enough keys?

Yup.  This is why there were all those extra packs.  M1-12, Media, re-labelable, etc.  I'll pull together a full kit and upload a photo.

[samwisekoi]

GH-122.2016 Weekend Update 2016-Mar-13

After pondering what to do for cases, and getting various estimates and quotes, I have come up with A Plan:

NOTE:  None of these estimates include switches, stabilizers, a Teensy++, or anything other than what is specified explicitly.

Option A.  Plain PCB.  >$50 (plus plus shipping and duties, if any.)

Sized to fit into a Unicomp PC-122 or to be used otherwise, the PCB alone will cost >$50 (plus shipping and duties, if any.)  The block spacing is 0.330", so if that works for Cherry cases, woo-hoo.  (More on that below.)


Option B.  Plain PCB plus adapter strips FOR the Unicomp PC-122 case.  ~$70 (plus plus shipping and duties, if any.)

This option add three or four plastic strips to be glued into the Unicomp case to provide a base for attaching the PCB.  The strips will be somewhere between $10 and $30 per case, depending on volume.  This option provides a PCB-only fit in the Unicomp case.  The case is $20 so this is the lowest-cost complete solution I can think of.


Option C.  PCB plus adapter strips AND a pair of stainless steel plates to fit the Unicomp PC-122 case.  ~$170 (plus plus shipping and duties, if any.)

This add a pair of steel plates to Option B, one for the main keyboard and a smaller one for the upper bank of 24 switches.  This option provides probably the best feel in the Unicomp Case.  The cost of the plate will depend greatly on the number of IDENTICAL plates ordered.  So if everyone orders the same ISO-style plate like the original F-122 had, then cost might go down by $40 each.  On the other hand, if everyone wants their very own plate layout, the cost for each plate will go up to $100+. So the total for this option is a semi-conservative estimate.


Option D.  Plain PCB plus full ANSI plate.  ~$170 (plus plus shipping and duties, if any.)

This is just a big plate and the plain PCB.  It will enable you to use all 150+/- switch positions.  As with Option C, this cost goes down with volume of IDENTICAL plates ordered.  MOQ for the first price drop is FIVE IDENTICAL plates.


Option E.  Plain PCB plus giant bendable stainless plate.  ~$200 (plus plus shipping and duties, if any.)

This is just a very big plate that can be bent into a "bent-plate case" and the plain PCB.  It will enable you to bend the plate, attach a populated PCB, and have a giant, hard-core keyboard.  As with Option C and D, this cost goes down with volume of IDENTICAL plates ordered.  MOQ for the first price drop is FIVE IDENTICAL plates.

===

So those are the options I think will work.  Naturally, if you want to get a PCB and a plate, and make your own case, that is ok as well.  I will publish all of the measurements and DXF files for the plates, so if someone else wants to design a case or other solution, they can.

As always, my desire is to find 20 people who want to go in with me to get the GH-122.2016 PCB made.  The case options are just enablers.

Please reply with comments and what option(s) seem interesting to you.

Happy Evil Clock Re-Setting Day!

 - Ron | samwisekoi

p.s.  I'd be happy to add mounting holes and check dimensions for Cherry case compatibility.  However, I do not HAVE such a keyboard, so if someone wants to either lend me one OR take careful measurements, I can put that info into the PCB design.  Absent a keyboard of the measurements I can't and won't add Cherry case compatibility except by accident!

[Phenix]

so no full ISO plate?

also no bent ISO-Plate?

[blai5000]

For the bendable plate, I assume it's just an extra-large plate that we have to bend ourselves, right?

[Hak Foo]

Did we get any estimates on the sandwich case and plate?

[Data]

In for a PCB for sure.  Can't commit to a plate/case until I see the layout but those options sound interesting.

[danielucf]

This would be the best keyboard to have 4 Esc keys on, and an insane amount of artisans. This is like the Limousine of the keyboard world. As someone that thinks an 80% is too big, I kind of want one. Regardless this is going to be a very cool project for anyone who partakes. I'm excited to see where this goes.

[Spaceman1200]

Im game for at least a pcb, but interested in option D once i see renders

[MAR82]

I need to see if I still have a case from a rubber dome 122 key, and if I do I'll be in for a PCB + plate

[samwisekoi]

OK, so everyone likes a PCB and some like a plate.  ON ALL PLATES, the layout is up to you/us.  I chose ISO for the F-122 because that is what the F-122 had, and ANSI for the full plate, because that provides the maximum switch positions.  But any plate option can be made in any layout.

I think I'll slice this project into two chunks.  #1 will be the PCB-only Group Buy thread (this one.)  #2 will be a GH-122.2016 Case Options thread, which I will go create in Making Stuff Together here: GH-122.2016 Case Options.  I *may* move some of the posts from this thread over there.

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[samwisekoi]

OK, I think this is ready to order.

GH-122.2016 PCB

- 7x24 Keyboard Matrix
- Teensy++ 2.0 Controller
- 100% Through-Hole Components
- 150+ Switch positions
- Full ANSI, ISO, and IBM F-122 Layout support (including dual split shift keys)
- 1.25 or 1.50 Modifiers with 6.25 or 7.00 spacebar
- PCB-mount switches and stabilizers in all positions.
- All 2.00 positions can be split into 2x1.00 keys
- Centered or offset Caps Lock positions
- PCB can be cut to fit Unicomp PC-122 case
- PCB can be cut and bent full-width
- CAPS (2x) plus NUM and SCRL LEDs
- All switch positions have pads and holes but not wiring for backlighting
- V++, Ground, and 2x PWM pads provided for expansion/backlight control
- Extra 2.00 position added to lower-left bank.

PCB will be 19.500" x 6.500" x 0.62" thick, black solder mask with white silkscreen.

Price estimate is $50 plus shipping.  MOQ is 20 PCBs, but I will place the order once payment is received for 10 PCBs.

Leadtime is estimated at 3 weeks.

Who wants one?

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[njbair]

Looks awesome! I absolutely love the revisions, and my mind is already wandering, trying to settle on the perfect layout for this thing. I am definitely in.

[jdcarpe]

Can I make one suggestion before you say it's the FINAL final revision, pretty please? Can we have the 2u key option for all the keys on the left side block?

[njbair]

By the time we're done with this thing there won't be any silicon left to mount the switches to!

[Hak Foo]

Personally, I'd say that left section a great location to use those two-stem 2x POS keys everyone has a trillion of from the Grab Bags.  Just mount a dummy switch (I suppose something like a Red would work, as it would offer the least resistancxe) in the other slot and program it as inactive.

Also, in for one, and for another for round II in which you give up your heretic ways and make it ALPS, in the style of classic ALPS battleships like the Focus 9000 and Ortek MCK-142.

[samwisekoi]

Can I make one suggestion before you say it's the FINAL final revision, pretty please? Can we have the 2u key option for all the keys on the left side block?

Yes. Are you in?

ALPS, on the other hand makes the bottom row and the ISO Enter block really hard. Unlike Cherry, ALPS has both leads in a line,  so multi-position spacing has fatal conflicts. So no ALPS on a multi-layout board. Sorry. (I could make the fixed 1.00 positions ALPS-compatible,  if that helps any.)

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[jdcarpe]

Can I make one suggestion before you say it's the FINAL final revision, pretty please? Can we have the 2u key option for all the keys on the left side block?

Yes. Are you in?

ALPS, on the other hand makes the bottom row and the ISO Enter block really hard. Unlike Cherry, ALPS has both leads in a line,  so multi-position spacing has fatal conflicts. So no ALPS on a multi-layout board. Sorry. (I could make the fixed 1.00 positions ALPS-compatible,  if that helps any.)

 - Ron | samwisekoi

I'm definitely in!


I must have a bent plate version with wooden sides. It shall be so.

[Spaceman1200]

Im in, Cant wait to see some case options.

[njbair]

Can I make one suggestion before you say it's the FINAL final revision, pretty please? Can we have the 2u key option for all the keys on the left side block?

Yes. Are you in?

ALPS, on the other hand makes the bottom row and the ISO Enter block really hard. Unlike Cherry, ALPS has both leads in a line,  so multi-position spacing has fatal conflicts. So no ALPS on a multi-layout board. Sorry. (I could make the fixed 1.00 positions ALPS-compatible,  if that helps any.)

 - Ron | samwisekoi

I'm definitely in!


I must have a bent plate version with wooden sides. It shall be so.

This is what I want. Although I would like to mount the guts deeper in the case, rather than the floating-keys style shown in the mock-ups.

[jdcarpe]

This is what I want. Although I would like to mount the guts deeper in the case, rather than the floating-keys style shown in the mock-ups.

I really like that idea. Bent metal "frame" with standoffs to mount the switch plate below. This should go into the case discussion, though.

Bring on the PCBs!

[samwisekoi]

Okay, I've added optional 2.00 positions and stab mounts to all of the LH bank.  Also, while I was in there, I added a "bonus" switch position that will enable a left-hand arrow cluster.  Totally optional, of course.

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[Phenix]

with the added left- Arrow cluster:

is it possible to make CTRL/ALT 1.5u each?
Or is 1.75u possible/Whats the possibilitys for CTRL/ALT?

[njbair]

with the added left- Arrow cluster:

is it possible to make CTRL/ALT 1.5u each?
Or is 1.75u possible/Whats the possibilitys for CTRL/ALT?

You could make ctrl and alt 1.25u each, with a .75u gap between ctrl and right arrow, but I don't think you can do 1.5 for both. You can do a 1.5u alt and a 1u ctrl.

It really doesn't matter actually, because ctrl belongs up next to the A key anyways.

[samwisekoi]

with the added left- Arrow cluster:

is it possible to make CTRL/ALT 1.5u each?
Or is 1.75u possible/Whats the possibilitys for CTRL/ALT?

You could make ctrl and alt 1.25u each, with a .75u gap between ctrl and right arrow, but I don't think you can do 1.5 for both. You can do a 1.5u alt and a 1u ctrl.

It really doesn't matter actually, because ctrl belongs up next to the A key anyways.

The possible options mentioned are correct.  Really the only available options are the one shown (1.0 + 1.5) or 2 x 1.25 with a 6.25 spacebar.

That extra switch position is a bonus for Lefties and gamers.  The rest of the bottom row is unchanged.

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[samwisekoi]

Updated OP with final description, rendering of PCB, and circuit layout.

Please reply to buy.

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[njbair]

I'm buying one, in case I haven't actually come out and said so yet.

[samwisekoi]

I'm buying one, in case I haven't actually come out and said so yet.

You did.  You are #1 on the list in OP2.   

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[SpAmRaY]

I'm interested.

[njbair]

I'm buying one, in case I haven't actually come out and said so yet.

You did.  You are #1 on the list in OP2.   

 - Ron | samwisekoi

Great! Now I can check off my bucket list entry for "join a GB before jdcarpe."

[Data]

Replying again to buy. Take my money, please.

[blai5000]

Put me in, I'm all for this beast!

[HoffmanMyster]

Who wants one?

Me, please.

[iamtootallforthis]

Got some prices back.  A single custom plate is $80-100; less with volume.  The price is pretty much the same for SS or Acrylic.  And what adds cost is cutting time, so a plate of any configuration is around $100.  From there you can build a sandwich case, or make a plate-mount in an empty Unicomp PC-122 case.

Or you could make the plate a little larger, bend it a few times, and do a bent-plate case.

This is the least expensive option, and it seems to go with the design, in an industrial 1950's kind of way.  Add a beige crinkle-finish powder coat and some sides and some Nuclear Data keycaps, and you've got a big-ass Cold War keyboard.

 - Ron | samwisekoi

The case you are describing with those caps is exactly what I would want!

[engicoder]

Not sure how I missed this. I'm in.