[IC] GMK Bingsu R2 [GB Starts July 7]

[heyman]

· Remove extra 'b' from base, put extra 'b' in Extension kit. (Alice need it and 2.25u spacebar or extra 2.25u shift)
· Remove numpad from base, Add numpad kit. (reduce base price)
· Put 'F13' in base.
· More Novelties pls.
· Add white alphas kit with spacebar, can be used with mod kit.
· If possible, Icon kit is necessary because it looks so clean.

[hottrout]

· Remove extra 'b' from base, put extra 'b' in Extension kit. (Alice need it and 2.25u spacebar or extra 2.25u shift)
· Remove numpad from base, Add numpad kit. (reduce base price)
· Put 'F13' in base.
· More Novelties pls.
· Add white alphas kit with spacebar, can be used with mod kit.
· If possible, Icon kit is necessary because it looks so clean.

Solid idea and to finish just add UK ISO into the base kit and we are done.

[J3ff_Leopard]

· Remove extra 'b' from base, put extra 'b' in Extension kit. (Alice need it and 2.25u spacebar or extra 2.25u shift)
· Remove numpad from base, Add numpad kit. (reduce base price)
· Put 'F13' in base.
· More Novelties pls.
· Add white alphas kit with spacebar, can be used with mod kit.
· If possible, Icon kit is necessary because it looks so clean.

Removing numpad saves you $10-$15 and increases the price by $50 for people who actually use it. I do not abide.

[ZongZiWang]

· Remove extra 'b' from base, put extra 'b' in Extension kit. (Alice need it and 2.25u spacebar or extra 2.25u shift)
· Remove numpad from base, Add numpad kit. (reduce base price)
· Put 'F13' in base.
· More Novelties pls.
· Add white alphas kit with spacebar, can be used with mod kit.
· If possible, Icon kit is necessary because it looks so clean.

Remove B from base kit saves $0 and I need to spend $30-50 additionally, even I have Alice spacebars in CP color from Olivia, which can be working as accent bars for Bingsu. Hope this does not happen.

Second on other suggestions!

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

[azack]

· Remove extra 'b' from base, put extra 'b' in Extension kit. (Alice need it and 2.25u spacebar or extra 2.25u shift)
· Remove numpad from base, Add numpad kit. (reduce base price)
· Put 'F13' in base.
· More Novelties pls.
· Add white alphas kit with spacebar, can be used with mod kit.
· If possible, Icon kit is necessary because it looks so clean.

Since 'b' doesn't add to the cost, no point in removing it since it gives people the opportunity to just purchase accented spacebars. Personally I rather just leave the numpad in base since the price should be rather reasonable in the first place (high moq) so i do not agree with removing numpad from base which will lead to an absurd separate numpad price.

[hali]

B in base does add cost, but it's disproportionate considering how much the price of the bars kit would be jacked if it added a third colour for a single key.

[LightningXI]

Personally:

- F13 in Extension is fine.
- Numpad should stay in base. I am honestly against splitting Numpad from base unless it were exactly the same net price adding it as a separate kit. In most cases, as far as pricing is concerned, it's worse and costlier for Numpad users when it's split off.
- The point about extra B being in the base to be combined with CP bars from OG Spacekeys, Oblivion, or even an unrelated accent color is actually pretty good. Wouldn't just adding the second Bs to Extension and Forties somewhat circumvent this argument in the thread? That way Alice users who'd buy 40s or Extension anyway would be happy, and even have extra B's to spare. And those who buy only Base and use them with accent bars would be OK too.
- Even though I love Alice layout, I don't think Alice spacebar support needs to be in Base.
- I'm actually in favor of physical ISO support in base. But I'm not an ISO user so I have no real preference in this. But if I were, I'd think it sucks I have to buy an expensive, chonky INTL kit just to even put caps on a board, even if the legends aren't exactly what I want.
- Wish there were accents and alternate mod kit keys in R5 but I can live with R4 because I know it's expensive and unlikely to jive with everyone
- Same goes with R5 novelties -- wish there were fewer keys in that kit in R2/R3, or removing the ones in accent colors, just so that there at least can be 1u novelties in R5.

I'm actually okay with much of the kitting but just wanted to post some thoughts.

[o3okevin]

For the Alice support issue, how about:

• Create spacebar kit out of accented bars and split bars from extension
• Move the rest of extension keys to base, and accented arrow/numpad enter to base
• Bye bye extension kit

Also solves the F13 issue that's been a major talking point so far.

[LightningXI]

For the Alice support issue, how about:

• Create spacebar kit out of accented bars and split bars from extension
• Move the rest of extension keys to base, and accented arrow/numpad enter to base
• Bye bye extension kit

Also solves the F13 issue that's been a major talking point so far.

While I personally don't mind buying a chonky Base kit because I tend to buy kits that support all possible layouts that I'd use (pretty much anything from 60 to full size, so I want numpad and Alice support often, too, for example), I feel like getting rid of Extension and moving all of those alternate keys into Base would make it pretty expensive to those who just want to get only Base for their designated keyboard.

This favors Alice users, sure, but is unfavorable for what I think is likely the larger portion of the customer base (more people only buy Base and want to have it as cheap as possible).

I think makeshift Alice support in base (2.25u Shift) as Liz suggested is also a way to compromise. Or the removal of Accents (while trimming Extension and 40s) in favor of a separate Spacebars kit, if it had to be the same number of SKUs.

[hkhawk]

· Remove extra 'b' from base, put extra 'b' in Extension kit. (Alice need it and 2.25u spacebar or extra 2.25u shift)
· Remove numpad from base, Add numpad kit. (reduce base price)
· Put 'F13' in base.
· More Novelties pls.
· Add white alphas kit with spacebar, can be used with mod kit.
· If possible, Icon kit is necessary because it looks so clean.

Please do NOT remove numpad from Base

[o3okevin]

For the Alice support issue, how about:

• Create spacebar kit out of accented bars and split bars from extension
• Move the rest of extension keys to base, and accented arrow/numpad enter to base
• Bye bye extension kit

Also solves the F13 issue that's been a major talking point so far.

While I personally don't mind buying a chonky Base kit because I tend to buy kits that support all possible layouts that I'd use (pretty much anything from 60 to full size, so I want numpad and Alice support often, too, for example), I feel like getting rid of Extension and moving all of those alternate keys into Base would make it pretty expensive to those who just want to get only Base for their designated keyboard.

This favors Alice users, sure, but is unfavorable for what I think is likely the larger portion of the customer base (more people only buy Base and want to have it as cheap as possible).

I think makeshift Alice support in base (2.25u Shift) as Liz suggested is also a way to compromise. Or the removal of Accents (while trimming Extension and 40s) in favor of a separate Spacebars kit, if it had to be the same number of SKUs.

That is true, but I'm of the belief that this is a popular enough set that they can safely price it at a higher MOQ even with a larger base set (of course this does have its compromises, especially on the vendor's side, but I'm speaking in optimistics).

Moving accents out would work as well + separate spacebars

[Auracity]

6u in accent kit please

[roguesystem087]

- Hopefully the base kit just stays simple but full enough.
- It would be great if we kept the numpad
- I think what Lightning said is pretty reasonable,
- novelties seem a little lacking, but then again i have no idea what else I would add to make it fancier
- I hope we can just get the old icon mods. Bingsu seems to look a bit crowded with text or icon+text.

[Pluto19]

Don't forget everyone ~ makeshift Alice layout is already supported in the base with 2u 0

[Easonic]

****........we need icon

[azack]

Maybe an icon mod kit would work for those who wants icon while people like me can enjoy my text+icons

[paulgali]

You're not listening to anyone in this thread.

• B in base is useless without the subsequent shifts to at least cover alice style layouts. Keep b in base, add shifts, or add the alice bars into base.
• You have excluded F13 so we would need to buy a whole kit for one single key, that is more and more commonly in use
• Not having UK ISO in base is okay, I guess - but you should absolutely (at the very least) support the ISO layout.

It's clear you are reading feedback on the IC, but at this point it is a cashgrab, you are selectively kitting to try and maximize kits sold. Base should cover the majority of layouts, and leaving out ISO completely is not something that should be taken lightly. Please consider changes, as you have already done so.

B in base: The extra "B" key in base kit does NOT change the price of the base set, it allows for Alice support if you add the following child kits:

• Accent Kit
• Extension Kit
• Fourties Kit

This makes more sense than adding an extra "B" to each of those 3 kits.

ISO: See reply above.
F13 not in base: F13 is included in the extension kit, which supports extended 65+ cluster, Alice/split bars, Terminal/Mac users. F13 is also included in the Mod Kit.

The point of a 2nd b in base is to allow alice support using the extra shifts available. Nowhere did I say it affects the price. Because you are missing shifts, we can no longer use this on ergo without buying additional space kits. You should be supporting the physical layout no matter what (same for ISO, terminal + r3 pipe should be mandatory). I didn't say add b to the other 3 kits. All you have to do is add the extra shift key and it would be fine. F13 being in the mod kit is irrelevant if users dont want the lighter mods

I still stand by my ISO layout and F13 comments, it should be in base. You are stripping this base kit and forcing buyers to purchase unnecessary extra kits for one or 2 keys.

Accommodate layouts at the very least. You are stripping the base kit to line your pocket and taking advantage of the fact the colorway is sought after. I thought after your rebrand you did good things, this is honestly a step backwards. Help the community, don't hinder it. If my honesty is too harsh, I'm sorry, but I do not speak alone when we only ask for one thing - supporting physical layouts in base.

[Omarpixel9]

ISO: The alternative would be to put us/terminal ISO in base. This would provide physical compatibility, but you would lose the expanded support for nordeuk etc. I am open to this idea, but would prefer that users have access to their preferred aesthetics. Let me know your thoughts!

Honestly? Functionality over aesthetics. Having the absolute minimum ISO layout in base kit would allow more people to be able to actually physically use their keyboard with it.

[carlouws]

Is it remotely possible to add a macro kit (look at GMK Symbiote macro kit) or add macro keys to extension kit for boards like Ion Jubi, Ion Zenith, Kmac mini, etc? I know physical support is already possible with the F-row but it would be nice to have the cherry sculpt instead of all R1 while also being mono-colored (mod colors). Thanks for your consideration.

[hali]

Is it remotely possible to add a macro kit (look at GMK Symbiote macro kit) or add macro keys to extension kit for boards like Ion Jubi, Ion Zenith, Kmac mini, etc? I know physical support is already possible with the F-row but it would be nice to have the cherry sculpt instead of all R1 while also being mono-colored (mod colors). Thanks for your consideration.

Feels very unnecessary when the Novelties are already columns

[OscillatorSlave]

Sorry for the really nooby question but would the base kit cover everything I need for a Drop Alt? Thank you

[paulgali]

Sorry for the really nooby question but would the base kit cover everything I need for a Drop Alt? Thank you

Yes

[WillyWortel]

lets gooooooo

[Pluto19]

Massive minority request: R1 1u Equal sign in Mod kit would be wonderful.

¤ ¤ ¤

The point of a 2nd b in base is to allow alice support using the extra shifts available.

Totally disagree here as their reasoning is extremely logical and well-considered.

Nowhere did I say it affects the price. Because you are missing shifts, we can no longer use this on ergo without buying additional space kits. You should be supporting the physical layout no matter what (same for ISO, terminal + r3 pipe should be mandatory). I didn't say add b to the other 3 kits. All you have to do is add the extra shift key and it would be fine. F13 being in the mod kit is irrelevant if users dont want the lighter mods

Again, a lot of people overlook this, but both Base kits already have physical Alice support with the 2u Zero for use on the left space and the 2.75u Shift for use on the right space. I don't think I'd have to point out that in doing so would force a split right Shift, but some may not know.

Now, it'd be different if your main reasoning behind the extra 2.25u Shift's inclusion in the Base kits were for 660 users, but that doesn't seem to be so that's a different time.

I still stand by my ISO layout and F13 comments, it should be in base. You are stripping this base kit and forcing buyers to purchase unnecessary extra kits for one or 2 keys.

Physical ISO compatibility in Base is something I'd also agree with, however we don't know how requested, if at all, an International ISO kit is/was nor whether any involved parties are willing/going to guarantee its MOQ as we've seen with other GMK sets. It might not be the cheapest option for a small group of users, but it could definitely be the slightly more expensive and more inclusive kitting if this were to be the case.

F13 I couldn't care less about, but at least there's plenty of alternatives in the Base kits for that if F13 stays in Extension.

Accommodate layouts at the very least. You are stripping the base kit to line your pocket and taking advantage of the fact the colorway is sought after. I thought after your rebrand you did good things, this is honestly a step backwards. Help the community, don't hinder it. If my honesty is too harsh, I'm sorry, but I do not speak alone when we only ask for one thing - supporting physical layouts in base.

A bit passionate, but at least it shows that you really like the set too

[actress]

Happy to see international kit!
Keep the text+icon mods 

[onefivenine]

Original post has been updated with revisions to the following kits:

Base:
- Basic/terminal ISO has been added
- F13 added
- Extra "B" dropped
- Accent arrows and numpad enter added

Hangul:
- Reverted back to child kit

Spacebar:
- Previously "Accent Kit"
- Split spacebars and extra "B" added

Extension:
- Stepped "Control" added
- R4 1.5u "Function" added
- Windowed "Num" and "Scroll" added

International:
- Kit size reduced (terminal ISO in base increases the likelihood of this kit not reaching MOQ)

Common Questions:
Q: Can we have icon mods instead?
A: Not for this run. First round had both icon and text options. We would like to do something different this time.

Q: Can we have the old deskmats?
A: No we do not want to rerun previous mats. However, we are working on extra designs for those looking for something simple.

Q: Where are renders?
A: Renders will be provided after we have finalized kitting. We want to make sure that renders have keycaps that are available in the kitting.

Notes:
- Reviewing Novelties Kit to reduce some redundancy.
- Reviewing Row 5 Kit for possible key additions.
- Please realize that we are doing our best to accommodate as many users as possible. The demographic and metrics of the KB community has changed in the past couple of years. We want to be inclusive and mindful of the growing layouts and their popularity.

[roguesystem087]

adfas;ldfasjakl;sdjfasfkjlsad

[hkhawk]

Thanks for taking all the feedback, the new kitting looks good!

[heyimpanda]

I'm happy with these changes

[upstairscoffee5]

can't spell bingsu without bingus

[heyman]

· Remove extra 'b' from base, put extra 'b' in Extension kit. (Alice need it and 2.25u spacebar or extra 2.25u shift)
· Remove numpad from base, Add numpad kit. (reduce base price)
· Put 'F13' in base.
· More Novelties pls.
· Add white alphas kit with spacebar, can be used with mod kit.
· If possible, Icon kit is necessary because it looks so clean.

Removing numpad saves you $10-$15 and increases the price by $50 for people who actually use it. I do not abide.

Yeah, separate numpad will be more expensive, but more people will avoid the extra money. the lower the price of base kit, the more the sales volume of base kit. I think very few people will use numpad, basically 60 65 tkl,  but i think numpad big probability will stay in base in the end, just the difference between 10 people pay $10 and 2 people pay $50, but 8 of them won't use numpad

[heyman]

· Remove extra 'b' from base, put extra 'b' in Extension kit. (Alice need it and 2.25u spacebar or extra 2.25u shift)
· Remove numpad from base, Add numpad kit. (reduce base price)
· Put 'F13' in base.
· More Novelties pls.
· Add white alphas kit with spacebar, can be used with mod kit.
· If possible, Icon kit is necessary because it looks so clean.

Remove B from base kit saves $0 and I need to spend $30-50 additionally, even I have Alice spacebars in CP color from Olivia, which can be working as accent bars for Bingsu. Hope this does not happen.

Second on other suggestions!

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

If no extra 2.25shift, only extra 'B' in base can't support alice layout, it will look cleaner if it is removed, unless base add another 2.25shift

[Pluto19]

If no extra 2.25shift, only extra 'B' in base can't support alice layout, it will look cleaner if it is removed, unless base add another 2.25shift

Yes... yes it can. As I said before, 2u Zero can be used.

[Lizcuits]

Solid revisions. I still am hoping for at least one of the old deskmats to return since I really feel like there's no "subtle" option for this round.

I also wish the windowed keys would be moved to Novelties but I am okay with them as it stands since Extensions has been reduced to a (most likely) more affordable kit.

Spacebar kit w/B was the move. Very happy with that choice!

Thanks for taking feedback into consideration. I am sure there are still revisions that could be made re: obscure layouts but I'll leave notes on that to those who are more knowledgeable than I am.

Thanks for being receptive to feedback, it's going to make this set shine for a really solid R2 (I hope!)

[A.Belousov]

Guys please can someone explain me in which cases i will need R5 kit?

[stevenT]

Guys please can someone explain me in which cases i will need R5 kit?

from my humble knowledge, the difference of round of keycaps is height(find cherry profile picture for detail) so if you don't need the specific height of R5, just skip it

Picture from GMK WoB 40s, Colevrak+, R0/R5
(full cherry profile; currently most kits have two sets of R1 and R4 instead of R0 and R5)

maybe I missed it but will there be artisan collab for this set? RAMA maybe..

[rowie]

Been awhile since I checked this IC and wow I love the new kitting! I’m definitely all in. Thanks for listening and great job. Let’s go!! 

[senbae]

Revisions to the kitting looks great. Thanks for taking in all the feedback. I'm definitely going in on this

[JQ27]

So from my understanding the reduced international kit makes it impossible to actually fit a proper layout? (UK-ISO as example)

[Fraaaan]

Good to see basic ISO support and F13 in base kit. No accented ISO enter in base but we can live without it. Thanks for listening to the community!

[Jakob]

Why are so many keys missing from the International kit now? I don't think you can get full coverage for any of the nordic layouts anymore due to missing 2, 3, 4, +? and \` keys. I get that the Int kit is being down-prioritized because of poor sales/attachement rates, but of course it won't sell when it's effectively useless for the people it's supposedly targetting.

[ZavaZ86]

You almost managed to do it 100% but why are you moving accent iso enter into the international kit instead of having it in the base just like the ansi accent enter?

[bukowski]

International Kit has no 2 with " and 2-sublegend, while the 3 with § and 3-sublegend exists. Should be corrected, as it would look weird on Intl-Keyboards to have the 2 without 2-sublegend and the 3 with 3-sublegend.

[hali]

This new kitting is a major step in the right direction.
I have a couple things to recommend here:
- Replace accent arrows with accent ISO Enter
- Move B and 2.25u shift to Base to effectively make the Spacebars kit blanks instead of having a doubleshot key and because nobody wants to spend money for Extension for a shift key
- Remove 2u shift from Extension; the GK64 and K66 are <$100 kits and the users probably shouldn't spend $140 on keycaps for them
- Remove extra nav keys from Extension; nobody wants to buy Extension for those alone
- Norde could do without all tertiary sublegends for consistency and instead offer more compatibility, see Retro Runic
- Consider 3 key support because a slightly more expensive base is far better than having to drag a 40s kit to MOQ

Again, I'm really appreciative of the new kitting and listening to feedback.

[Scoobsheister]

Bring back UK ISO support, please

[XiXora]

Yes, need UK ISO somewhere…
From extension to intl to gone
Accent ISO being included somewhere is ok but I wouldn't get it if theres no UK ISO in that kit.

2x 1.5U Supers/1u alt in R5 would be nice but I'll be ok with using the ones in extension kit.

[Daniel]

Many keysets nowadays have support for Alice in the base kit, so it would be nice to have it here as well. It's just 3 keys: B, 2.25u, 2.75u.. maybe some people need 2u as well so 4 keys.
Example: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=113197.0

Cheers

[SafeAtShore]

New kitting is looking a lot better.

I'd still merge extension with base; pricing should still be favorable with high MOQ.

Also, please add back the white mini bars to space bar kit.

[Pylon]

New base kit looks great. I have R1, but I prefer Icon+text so I'll probably be joining for R2 (or I'll try to trade my R1 icon mods for someone's R2 Icon+text)

[jpg2401]

Could we get an Icon mods child kit ?