About Tai Hao key caps, why they are actually decent

[typo]

People complain they are thin. However they are not PBT They are in fact Double shot POM. POM is a rarity and much stronger. They feel decent under finger. They average $60 a full 105+ set. At Mechanicalkeyboards and elsewhere that is about the average of all sets. I certainly would not call them rubbish. the font is very clear on all of them. Plus no one else has so many in stock colorways. I think they are okay. For shine through, you can do no better. Vortex is thicker but it is PBT not POM. I would hand it to POM. People either do not know this or fail to mention it. They simply complain how thin they are. Hoe do they feel? Watch typing demos on YouTube. I tried them and they are just fine. I decided to go with KAT. No shine through on my RGB but KAT id indeed better. The entire set I picked piece meal was over $350. Vs. $60 you cannot compare.Compare Tai Hao to any set shine through under $100 and I think you might be surprised. I just felt like defending them since I had just tried them and found them to be much better than many people say. they do not actually type on them. They sit and take pictures with a calipers. It does not count with POM exactly. For one thing POM id much more expensive. Please do not go say they are not made of POM. I have done my homework. They are fine key caps, even at twice their price point for shine through. If you do not need shine through perhaps you can do somewhat better. I hope that people feel I have been honest in my feelings regarding this. YMMV!

[mode]

Yeah, they're good vlaue for money, I recently replaced the stock caps on a filco with Olivetti caps before giving it to a friend and I thought they looked really good.

If only they did ISO ALPS sets, I'd probably use them for my daily drivers.

[typo]

I honestly think if you want shine through they are the best there is. That was my point. I am not good at collecting my thoughts. If you do not need shine through there is much better to be had. Of course at a much steeper price. My pick and choose KAT set was over $350. Over $400 with tax and shipping. It is not fair to compare that to $60 and mine do not shine through. However mine obviously feel much nicer in my opinion. The thing is not everyone has over $400 for key caps. I would guess most peoples budget is in fact more like $60. So to that effect the Tai Hao are very decent and offer many in stock color ways. Being POM You cannot just measure their thickness. It is 5x as strong. I see that that the "average" set is in fact is right at $60. So in that case I would certainly consider these. For the record I have absolutely nothing to do with them. I was honestly just impressed with the backlight. Which incidentally my $350+ set is lacking. I wish I got backlit key caps now. Oh too late. I more than blew my full budget on this board. I guess I can manage a Tai Hao set but then the hassle of selling the KAT at a loss. Trust me they are nicer than Vortex though. Yeah Vortex is thicker but again not fully POM. Vortex is about 5% POM. Look what old Cherry POM sets are worth. I am just trying to help people make a good decision.

[Riverman]

If any part of Tai Hao's keycaps is POM, it's the portion that makes up the legends, but definitely not the main shell of the keycap.  I've had a couple of Cherry G80-3000s with POM keycaps, and that material is very distinctive.  There are also quite a few POM parts in the switchgear in my car, and all of it has the same distinctive slickness of POM keycaps.  The main part of Tai Hao's keycaps is definitely PBT.  It's also thin enough that I've seen some of their keycaps crack, including one of my own.  I've always assumed that the plastic Tai Hao uses for the legends isn't PBT, because it's somewhat shinier.  I used to have a set of their black on dark grey keycaps (the ones that mimic black Topre keycaps), and the legends were always slightly shiny, which made them even harder to read than they should have been.

Otherwise, I agree that Tai Hao makes decent keycaps for the price.  I just ordered set of their doubleshot PBT keycaps for $40, and they're well worth that price.  Even their doubleshot ABS keycaps aren't half bad.  They're definitely a step or two above what comes on a Filco or a Das Keyboard, and some are as cheap as $19.99.

[typo]

Tai Hao Told me they are 100% POM. So if I am spreading misinformation please blame them. TBH, I do not even own any Tai Hao, I almost ordered 3 sets I liked. If this is really the case then why not get Vortex? AFAIK Vortex is 1.4-1.6MM thick. I have read Tai Hao can be under 1.00MM thick. If it is PBT, then indeed it would crack as you say. They do look very shiny to me though? Not like ABS. My car too may have POM. I think many good Auto's do. So the Tai Hao look like that to me. I don't know. I cannot say you are wrong. Especially if they cracked.  I would just Stick with Vortex if I must have DS and not ABS. Otherwise obviously GMK and KAT are way nicer keys. Actually for 20 bucks I saw a set on Amazon that claims to be DS PBT 1.95MM thick in 6 solid colors! I am not sure if that is a blatant lie. Since my KAT nearly rub as it is. I just really like Tai Hao's colorway's but I am honestly myself weary of how thin they are even if they are POM!

[typo]

I spent all night talking to my friend. We have nothing better to do. He has 4 Tai Hao sets and 3 Vortex sets plus expensive sets. We concluded there is some misinformation. Regardless of what Tai Hao is made of, we are not sure.  It is said Tai Hao are 1.0MM and Vortex are 1.4MM. Not exactly. It depends on what key you measure and where you measure it. Even then it can vary from part to part. With a high end calipers he measured Tai Hao from .836MM to 1.464MM and Vortex from ,892MM to 1.436MM. Simply picking many random keys in random positions. Those were the highest and lowest numbers he could obtain out of 200 keys of each. The real reason they are not so thick is that the backlighting would not shine through good. If you want good 1.5+MM caps you need to forgo backlighting. As have I. Backlighting is but a novelty to me anyways. Plus there is still plenty of light. The Drop GMK set is $99.00 on Amazon. Not sure how much it is on Drop. My KAT set was much more but I like it.

[Riverman]

I've noticed that different sides of the same Tai Hao keycap are noticeably different thicknesses.  I have no idea why they'd make them that way, but they do.

[typo]

See that was our misunderstanding I guess, Riverman. You can measure less than 1.00MM or nearly 1.5MM. Depending on the key and the position of measurement. It is indeed odd. I think maybe it makes for a "sum" of like 1.3MM or something. No clue. Vortex is not 1.4MM either. It is more like 1.1. The issue here is the light would not shine through a 1.5+MM cap very well. The only DS PBT caps I know of are very thin. Dyesub is a different story. Very good PBT dyesub caps. Typing on some right now. I just wanted to buy yet another set! So I just made a new post because I was not sure what I want this time. I am running out of "flavors". Actually, that is kind of sad. People like walie should actually feel sorry for me.

[typo]

My buddy just texted me. He found a Tai Hao, best side was 1.59MM! worst was 1.14MM. So it averaged 1.4MM. Not bad. It does not really matter if the strength is uniform on a part so small. Especially since the double shot and stem is in the middle stiffening it. He is finding they average about 1.3 MM to 1.35MM. Vortex is actually less. If you find these for $19.00 and want backlighting or like the colorway it is a good deal. For $60-$80 there may be better. That is what most big places sell them for.

[HungerMechanic]

It's funny, I probably could have skipped my entire keycap search odyssey if I had just bought the Tai Hao Dasher/Dancer ("Ocean Deep") keycaps for my Majestouch.

I was looking for a replacement for the stock Filco caps, which were becoming worn. I initially ordered $25 WoB Tai Hao keycaps from MK.COM. They were plain vanilla, but I was swayed by positive reviews from Majestouch users. These reviews said that the WoB was like a better version of the Filco keycaps.

Maybe they were. But I was burned because the $25 keycaps cost about $50+ CDN by the time they reached me. So I was dissuaded from ordering the "Blue / Light Blue" [Dasher/Dancer] like I wanted to. But if I had, I could have had a keyboard that looked like this back in 2018:



Now I have it on a Leopold, and it's great. Might be my favourite Tai Hao set.

[typo]

I do not get their pricing. They go from $89 to $19 for different colors? Apparently they they are not junk. Mechanicalkeyboards, KBDFAN. DROP all carry them. That is indeed very nice looking.
I could not tell if the Drop RedSuns was shine through? Those are not Tai Hao. I am not sure why I would even want them though. I really need to pick a Tai Hao set already!

[Rob27shred]

I think the mix up you are getting with POM is the fact that for the doubleshot PBT caps with shine through legends they use POM for the legends. Not sure if they use POM for the legends in the ABS doubleshot shine through caps, but I'm thinking they use clear ABS with them. Then beyond that their other sets with non shine through legends are made from either doubleshot ABS or doubleshot PBT & advertised as such from all I have seen. As far as the quality of their caps I've found it really varies from type to type. Their cheap doubleshot ABS sets are pretty low quality, thin, inconsistent wall thickness, & some legend problems. For the price though ($25 to $35 USD) it's not a bad starting point to get some color on your board. Their doubleshot PBT sets are a little better, thicker than the ABS (still a little thin for PBT), more consistent wall thickness, & less legend problems. Problem with them is they are the most expensive Tai-Hao sets ($50 for a plain 104 key set), plus they have a better type of caps that is cheaper & has better compatibility, the doubleshot ABS Cubic caps! Which I think is what's really worth buying if you're gonna go Tai-Hao, I was pretty impressed with the BoW set Novelkeys had made. Best compatibility of all Tai-Hao sets (most other Cubic sets have compatibility kits available), decently thick, good consistency on the thickness, & pretty good legends (except for the numpad) all for around $35 to $60. Not a bad deal at all to me. Anyways I do agree that all Tai-Hao caps have their place & it is definitely snobbish to **** on someone for using them.

[typo]

I thought the $69 PBT ones were the best shine through I ever saw. The problem is the thickness is all over the place. On a very solid board they feel okay. I want to order some. They are in fact probably not POM. The insert maybe is POM. The legends are very sharp. I am not really sure of a better shine through. Not Vortex. If you forgo shine through there are considerably better caps.

[typo]

They may in fact be POM. I realy do not know. this is from an old post on this site.

[typo]

I actually finally tried Tai Hao key caps. It is kind of funny I talked so much about them, never having typed on them. I had handled them of course.
I went to my friends house where he has a few sets. My feelings: They do not really have any profile that we know. They are flat faced, Grainy ad grippy. I like that about PBT. I do not care about their thickness because the light shines through like none other. The fonts are crisp and perfect. On a $29 Amazon keyboard they are horrible. Probably due to being so thin. My friend has a illuminati I1 prototype for testing. On that chunk of metal they are solid as a rock. Of course anything would be. So I felt it was not fair.

He pulled out a KBDFAN don't know which model. I think it was TKL. On that they were also just fine and I could see myself using them daily except for lack of a profile. I would probably get used to it. I figure the KBDFAN is akin to what most people would have, so it is a good measuring point. I feel on a solid board they are a god balance. Of course their big selling point is the myriad of colorways and the incredible shine through.
I would give them 8/10. Which is what most $60 sets would get. If you get a $20 set of these YMMV. Notice the known shops only sell $50-$60 sets. I feel it is a good value because I would only give SP PBT  Dyesub 7/0. Although I would give GMK ABS DS 9/10. Just to show where you where my references lie. I think they concur with most peoples.

[envyy24]

Hold on i always thought tai hao is OEM. What do you mean lack of profile? Im confused now what the hell have I been using lol

[typo]

Maybe it is OEM. I thought it was like their own profile. Almost flat.

[HungerMechanic]

Hey might mean that they lack sculpting.

There is a such thing as "Tai Hao profile," so may that is their spin on OEM.

[typo]

That is exactly what I meant. Thank you

[envyy24]

Interesting. I woud take out my tai hao and other OEm caps to compare later. Im too lazy at the moment, plus the switch comes off everytime I take caps out so I hate to do it if I dont have to #goddamnhotswapproblem

[Rob27shred]

They may in fact be POM. I realy do not know. this is from an old post on this site.

Oh OK, they're blanks. In that case it is very possible they could be POM. POM caps are pretty badass IME, I managed to grab some thick Cherry POM caps with lasered then infilled legends from a MY board on the cheap & love the way feel/sound! Although I kinda got screwed on that also since the entire bottom row has offset stems & can't be used unless you had a PCB & plate made specifically for them.

[typo]

Old cherry POM is probably my favorite. You can get a board for $10. Or if someone knows what it is worth $250+ LOL.

It is very hard to nail down an MM on Tai Hao. One part is .8MM and 1/15th" away is 1.8MM! I think I will safely call them 1.4MM but that is not really honest because that incites that it is "uniform". Not sure. No light bleed. They do feel solid on a solid board. I mostly like their colorways. no one else even close off the shelf. even group buys not even close.

I am also not sure what you would call the profile. they are a drop concave side to side but mainly flat. They are indeed like sand paper. they give the real meaning to unfinished PBT. they do not even bother to tumble them. I kind of like it real grippy though. I can just "bounce" off these. Not worried about hitting adjacent key. This, plus 65% my WPM skyrocketed. YMMV on that big time.

Anyways, As of the moment due to SP messing up their fonts lately I am picking these instead. Plus they are way less $$$. KAT was a different story. those are worth a lot of money still. They sell these at all the "serious" stores so I think that speaks for itself. although they do not sell their $20 sets, of which they only make 3 out of hundreds. so that may speak for itself as well.

[typo]

Some Tai Hao would be very good right now. Some have patented Anti-biosis coating on key caps. That prevents spread of disease such as Corona!

[Polymer]

But does it?  That's questionable..plus it makes them feel terrible...

If you're buying PBT for feel...both in the way they sound (because a lot of we "feel" is sound) and how they feel on your fingers (texture), the coating changes that...There have been a number of complaints about it....

[typo]

Yeah I know. Listings go out of their way to say no anti-biosis. Rather die right now though? I mean if it is community board in an office. If it is mine I am not getting that option of course. Agree with you. These are the epitome of PBT, Super scratchy. I do not know if that is cheap or good. A lot of people like raw materials. Like some Maui Jim you keep on your face. Finger tips no big deal then!

[typo]

Well, I have some Tai Hao right next to KAT. Tai Hao is okay but it is absolutely not KAT. I think what really kills them is the lack of sculpting and sandpaper finish.

[Polymer]

Yeah I know. Listings go out of their way to say no anti-biosis. Rather die right now though? I mean if it is community board in an office. If it is mine I am not getting that option of course. Agree with you. These are the epitome of PBT, Super scratchy. I do not know if that is cheap or good. A lot of people like raw materials. Like some Maui Jim you keep on your face. Finger tips no big deal then!

Well there is no proof the anti-biosis coating does anything....

One other thing, not only does it change the feel but one other reason someone might get PBT is they don't want shine..well a coating like this will wear down..then what are you left with?  Something that looks like wear on the keys? 

So many reasons this is a bad idea...

[typo]

Yeah, I agree. I was making a joke bro. However Corona is nothing funny. I meant the stupid coating was. It is very stupid in fact. I am not sure why they offer it. These are supposed to be "premium". Like 3M and Fellowes puts antimicrobial. Those are very low end though. Honestly so is this but they do not market it as such, They will sell you this on a $500 board! I think if they sculpted these and got rid of the "anti-skid" they could be very good. They are rather solid for some reason. They do not sound bad either.

[Riverman]

Most of Tai Hao's newer keycaps don't have the coating.  The last couple of sets I've bought didn't have it, and I believe that even Massdrop has asked them to leave it off when they do group buys.

Their profile definitely seems to be OEM.  It's more or less identical to the profile on the Filco and Das Keyboard keys I've had.  I'm typing on a Das Keyboard with Tai Hao keycaps right now, and if I look at the side, the profile definitely isn't flat.  There's a very noticeable angle to it, especially on the bottom three rows.  The top row also looks very tall compared to the Cherry profile keycaps I had on this keyboard recently.

[Polymer]

Happy to hear they removed it...