[IC] "Troubled Minds" - a Joker/Eva01 inspired set - Up on Massdrop!

[romevi]

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

How the ass do you get these renders?!

[CPTBadAss]

Stoked for this GB. Finally gonna pickup a set of SA. Great renders really help too

[thesiscamper]

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

Looks awesome! But this might be the closest we'll ever get to a real SA Row 4 shift.

Well, we could 3D print our own :)

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

How the ass do you get these renders?!

It is my line of work, and those are just drafts, you can clearly see the noise. Cleaning it up will take a lot longer

Stoked for this GB. Finally gonna pickup a set of SA. Great renders really help too

I'm glad you guys like it, hopefully this becomes a reality.

Here's a render for the Eva kit:

[njbair]

Stoked for this GB. Finally gonna pickup a set of SA. Great renders really help too

You can see more of his work in the Alpine Winter OP. Good stuff!

[swimmingbird]

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

Looks awesome! But this might be the closest we'll ever get to a real SA Row 4 shift.

Well, we could 3D print our own :)

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

How the ass do you get these renders?!

It is my line of work, and those are just drafts, you can clearly see the noise. Cleaning it up will take a lot longer

Stoked for this GB. Finally gonna pickup a set of SA. Great renders really help too

I'm glad you guys like it, hopefully this becomes a reality.

Here's a render for the Eva kit:

Show Image

Holy crap these renders have become amazing in the last month or so

[njbair]

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

Looks awesome! But this might be the closest we'll ever get to a real SA Row 4 shift.

Well, we could 3D print our own :)

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

How the ass do you get these renders?!

It is my line of work, and those are just drafts, you can clearly see the noise. Cleaning it up will take a lot longer

Stoked for this GB. Finally gonna pickup a set of SA. Great renders really help too

I'm glad you guys like it, hopefully this becomes a reality.

Here's a render for the Eva kit:

Show Image

Holy crap these renders have become amazing in the last month or so

Soon it will become expected that all group buys include lifelike renders.

[swimmingbird]

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

Looks awesome! But this might be the closest we'll ever get to a real SA Row 4 shift.

Well, we could 3D print our own :)

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

How the ass do you get these renders?!

It is my line of work, and those are just drafts, you can clearly see the noise. Cleaning it up will take a lot longer

Stoked for this GB. Finally gonna pickup a set of SA. Great renders really help too

I'm glad you guys like it, hopefully this becomes a reality.

Here's a render for the Eva kit:

Show Image

Holy crap these renders have become amazing in the last month or so

Soon it will become expected that all group buys include lifelike renders.

So far I've only seen the renders for SA profile sets - they don't exist in Cherry profile yet do they?

edit: spelling

[njbair]

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

Looks awesome! But this might be the closest we'll ever get to a real SA Row 4 shift.

Well, we could 3D print our own :)

Still clarifying stuff with Melissa at SP, while I'm waiting for more conrcrete info I've rendered some new angles and here's one of them:

Show Image

How the ass do you get these renders?!

It is my line of work, and those are just drafts, you can clearly see the noise. Cleaning it up will take a lot longer

Stoked for this GB. Finally gonna pickup a set of SA. Great renders really help too

I'm glad you guys like it, hopefully this becomes a reality.

Here's a render for the Eva kit:

Show Image

Holy crap these renders have become amazing in the last month or so

Soon it will become expected that all group buys include lifelike renders.

So far I've only seen the renders for SA profile sets - they doesn't exist in Cherry profile yet do they?

Check out Alpine Winter in my sig. I've got some DCS renders that thesiscamper made for me.

BTW I think Danger Zone is actually a Photoshop composite, not a true 3D render.

[thesiscamper]

So far I've only seen the renders for SA profile sets - they doesn't exist in Cherry profile yet do they?

I have models for DSA, SA, OEM and just recently I made DCS for njbair. I believe Cherry is very close to the last two I mentioned, I've been rendering SA almost exclusively because that's the profile for this set. At the moment sphericals fascinate me because I haven't seen one in person, I've only ever seen cylindrical keys all my life.

[njbair]

So far I've only seen the renders for SA profile sets - they doesn't exist in Cherry profile yet do they?

I have models for DSA, SA, OEM and just recently I made DCS for njbair. I believe Cherry is very close to the last two I mentioned, I've been rendering SA almost exclusively because that's the profile for this set. At the moment sphericals fascinate me because I haven't seen one in person, I've only ever seen cylindrical keys all my life.

I feel like if someone's seen your renders, they've seen spherical caps.

[thesiscamper]

So far I've only seen the renders for SA profile sets - they doesn't exist in Cherry profile yet do they?

I have models for DSA, SA, OEM and just recently I made DCS for njbair. I believe Cherry is very close to the last two I mentioned, I've been rendering SA almost exclusively because that's the profile for this set. At the moment sphericals fascinate me because I haven't seen one in person, I've only ever seen cylindrical keys all my life.

I feel like if someone's seen your renders, they've seen spherical caps.

Thanks for the compliment! By the way I'm intrigued by the Alps/Matias switches, maybe we can design another set for Alps one of these days

[njbair]

So far I've only seen the renders for SA profile sets - they doesn't exist in Cherry profile yet do they?

I have models for DSA, SA, OEM and just recently I made DCS for njbair. I believe Cherry is very close to the last two I mentioned, I've been rendering SA almost exclusively because that's the profile for this set. At the moment sphericals fascinate me because I haven't seen one in person, I've only ever seen cylindrical keys all my life.

I feel like if someone's seen your renders, they've seen spherical caps.

Thanks for the compliment! By the way I'm intrigued by the Alps/Matias switches, maybe we can design another set for Alps one of these days

Sounds like fun, but I think it will be a while before I'm ready to lead another GB.

Just curious, do your 3D models actually have switches and stems?

[thesiscamper]

So far I've only seen the renders for SA profile sets - they doesn't exist in Cherry profile yet do they?

I have models for DSA, SA, OEM and just recently I made DCS for njbair. I believe Cherry is very close to the last two I mentioned, I've been rendering SA almost exclusively because that's the profile for this set. At the moment sphericals fascinate me because I haven't seen one in person, I've only ever seen cylindrical keys all my life.

I feel like if someone's seen your renders, they've seen spherical caps.

Thanks for the compliment! By the way I'm intrigued by the Alps/Matias switches, maybe we can design another set for Alps one of these days

Sounds like fun, but I think it will be a while before I'm ready to lead another GB.

Just curious, do your 3D models actually have switches and stems?

Not these ones, but the ones I did for Alpine Winter have switches and stabilizers, no stems though.

[Hexterdude]

Do you plan on releasing two sets of keycaps (1 Eva and 1 Joker) or do you plan on 1 big set?

[thesiscamper]

Do you plan on releasing two sets of keycaps (1 Eva and 1 Joker) or do you plan on 1 big set?

Basekit with the basic colorway, and separate child deals for Joker and Eva so you can get both of them or only one of them. That's the current plan anyway.

[Hexterdude]

Do you plan on releasing two sets of keycaps (1 Eva and 1 Joker) or do you plan on 1 big set?

Basekit with the basic colorway, and separate child deals for Joker and Eva so you can get both of them or only one of them. That's the current plan anyway.

Do you plan on making the keys have the same back-lit effect as the EVA Noctilucous PBT 104-Keyset?

[thesiscamper]

Do you plan on releasing two sets of keycaps (1 Eva and 1 Joker) or do you plan on 1 big set?

Basekit with the basic colorway, and separate child deals for Joker and Eva so you can get both of them or only one of them. That's the current plan anyway.

Do you plan on making the keys have the same back-lit effect as the EVA Noctilucous PBT 104-Keyset?

Nope it's doubleshot so no backlit legends.

[Elrick]

Do you plan on releasing two sets of keycaps (1 Eva and 1 Joker) or do you plan on 1 big set?

Basekit with the basic colorway, and separate child deals for Joker and Eva so you can get both of them or only one of them. That's the current plan anyway.

Wallet is now waiting for this, so don't tease her for too long before she loses interest and chases another key-set elsewhere  .

[thesiscamper]

Do you plan on releasing two sets of keycaps (1 Eva and 1 Joker) or do you plan on 1 big set?

Basekit with the basic colorway, and separate child deals for Joker and Eva so you can get both of them or only one of them. That's the current plan anyway.

Wallet is now waiting for this, so don't tease her for too long before she loses interest and chases another key-set elsewhere  .

I'm just waiting for Melissa's confirmation that the HaHa key is possible, that's the only thing holding this back right now

[just66in]

Yeah, really hope that the Haha key is possible. Keeping for gers crossed! Btw, your renders are truly "next levelled".

[tofgerl]

So this is 1-1-2-3-3-4? Or are the renders wrong...?

[thesiscamper]

So this is 1-1-2-3-3-4? Or are the renders wrong...?

1-1-2-3-4-4, I just based the models on Googled images and accuracy was not high on the list when I first did it. I'm constantly improving the model so if you have suggestions to make them better that would be great

[njbair]

So this is 1-1-2-3-3-4? Or are the renders wrong...?

1-1-2-3-4-4, I just based the models on Googled images and accuracy was not high on the list when I first did it. I'm constantly improving the model so if you have suggestions to make them better that would be great

Take a look at Hack'd by Geeks, which used a full-contour profile: 3-1-2-3-4-3.

[tofgerl]

Gorgeous set:

[nosage]

I would also prefer 3-1-2-3-4-3, but will be picking up this set regardless!

[njbair]

Gorgeous set:

Show Image

Can confirm. Am a geek.

[thesiscamper]

So this is 1-1-2-3-3-4? Or are the renders wrong...?

1-1-2-3-4-4, I just based the models on Googled images and accuracy was not high on the list when I first did it. I'm constantly improving the model so if you have suggestions to make them better that would be great

Take a look at Hack'd by Geeks, which used a full-contour profile: 3-1-2-3-4-3.

I honestly have no idea how one would be better than the other and "used" 1-1-2-3-4-4 for this set because it made the most sense for a beginner like me, as in "this is how this profile was intended to be used".

I'd like to know the pros and cons of either layout.

[tofgerl]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

[thesiscamper]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

That is a very compelling argument

[tofgerl]

Yes it is ☺

[njbair]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

Pretty much. SA is a very steep profile. I don't know how it was designed to be used, but having flat keys on the bottom row instead of pointy ones is definitely more finger-friendly.

Row 3 on the function row is nice because you get more novelties in row 3, and that's usually the row where keyboard bling goes.

[thesiscamper]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

Pretty much. SA is a very steep profile. I don't know how it was designed to be used, but having flat keys on the bottom row instead of pointy ones is definitely more finger-friendly.

Row 3 on the function row is nice because you get more novelties in row 3, and that's usually the row where keyboard bling goes.

Unless someone else presents a convincing argument for other layout/s I guess it will be 3-1-2-3-4-3, thanks a lot!

[Oobly]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

As a Penumbra set user (1-2-3-3-3-4) who keeps their board very flat I can say that: No, it won't. The spacebar is Row 3 no matter what you choose for the other bottom row caps and symmetrical and is a lot nicer to use than DCS profile or even Cherry profile. In fact since I use my pinkies for Ctrl and Fn, I find I prefer Row 4 mods on the bottom row. However, I don't use Alt much, but I still find the angle of Row 4 subtle enough so my thumbs don't hit the edge.

jdcarpe, the designer of the Hack'd by Geeks set said that if he knew at the time that SP could do Row 4 bottom row mods, Hack'd would have had them.

Having the Fn row and number row with the same profile allows you to use the Esc on the number row for 60% boards, but it's just one extra cap if you choose to have them different. I don't really like how R3 Fn row looks if you have R1 number row, so I prefer to have them both R1 personally.

1-1-2-3-4-4 is a standard across all "normal" sculpted profiles (OEM, Cherry, DCS, etc), so I don't see why it shouldn't also be used for SA. IMHO, the only reason to use R3 on the top row is for novelties...

It's mostly personal preference, really. I think most would be happy with either 3-1-2-3-4-3 OR 1-1-2-3-4-4 OR 3-1-2-3-4-4... As long as the centre part is 1-2-3-4.

[njbair]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

As a Penumbra set user (1-2-3-3-3-4) who keeps their board very flat I can say that: No, it won't. The spacebar is Row 3 no matter what you choose for the other bottom row caps and symmetrical and is a lot nicer to use than DCS profile or even Cherry profile. In fact since I use my pinkies for Ctrl and Fn, I find I prefer Row 4 mods on the bottom row. However, I don't use Alt much, but I still find the angle of Row 4 subtle enough so my thumbs don't hit the edge.

jdcarpe, the designer of the Hack'd by Geeks set said that if he knew at the time that SP could do Row 4 bottom row mods, Hack'd would have had them.

Having the Fn row and number row with the same profile allows you to use the Esc on the number row for 60% boards, but it's just one extra cap if you choose to have them different. I don't really like how R3 Fn row looks if you have R1 number row, so I prefer to have them both R1 personally.

1-1-2-3-4-4 is a standard across all "normal" sculpted profiles (OEM, Cherry, DCS, etc), so I don't see why it shouldn't also be used for SA. IMHO, the only reason to use R3 on the top row is for novelties...

It's mostly personal preference, really. I think most would be happy with either 3-1-2-3-4-3 OR 1-1-2-3-4-4 OR 3-1-2-3-4-4... As long as the centre part is 1-2-3-4.

These are good points, too.

[tofgerl]

I've never understood why different row profiles couldn't be child deals. Perhaps because not enough people cares, so they wouldn't hit MOQ. Anyway, having a 1-1-2-3-4-3 standard kit and a R3 function row and a 7-key R4 mod-kit shouldn't be too hard?

[Oobly]

For reference:

All Row 3: Nuclear Data, 1976, Symbiosis, Danger Zone
1-2-3-3-3-4: Commando, Penumbra
1-1-2-3-4-3: Round 5 Sphericals (7bit's massive GB)
3-1-2-3-4-3: Round 4 Sphericals, PuLSE SA, Hack'd by Geeks, Modern Selectric
1-1-2-3-4-4: Jukebox, Retro SA, Carbon

I use Penumbra and Hack'd by Geeks on my "daily driver" boards.

As an example to compare to the image above of Hack'd, here's one of Retro so you can see how the R1 F keys look:

[romevi]

For reference:

All Row 3: Nuclear Data, 1976, Symbiosis, Danger Zone
1-2-3-3-3-4: Commando, Penumbra
1-1-2-3-4-3: Round 5 Sphericals (7bit's massive GB)
3-1-2-3-4-3: Round 4 Sphericals, PuLSE SA, Hack'd by Geeks, Modern Selectric
1-1-2-3-4-4: Jukebox, Retro SA, Carbon

I use Penumbra and Hack'd by Geeks on my "daily driver" boards.

As an example to compare to the image above of Hack'd, here's one of Retro so you can see how the R1 F keys look:

Show Image

I love my Retro SA set, but yeah, I can't stand those huge 1 Esc/Fn row caps. They look really weird and awkward.

[Niomosy]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

As a Penumbra set user (1-2-3-3-3-4) who keeps their board very flat I can say that: No, it won't. The spacebar is Row 3 no matter what you choose for the other bottom row caps and symmetrical and is a lot nicer to use than DCS profile or even Cherry profile. In fact since I use my pinkies for Ctrl and Fn, I find I prefer Row 4 mods on the bottom row. However, I don't use Alt much, but I still find the angle of Row 4 subtle enough so my thumbs don't hit the edge.

Out of curiosity, how would a row 4 space bar work out for those like me that have a negative tilt on their keyboards?  I put a wrist wrest under the front of mine so it's raised in the front.  Row 4 space bars would seem to have a greater likelihood of problems there.

[Oobly]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

As a Penumbra set user (1-2-3-3-3-4) who keeps their board very flat I can say that: No, it won't. The spacebar is Row 3 no matter what you choose for the other bottom row caps and symmetrical and is a lot nicer to use than DCS profile or even Cherry profile. In fact since I use my pinkies for Ctrl and Fn, I find I prefer Row 4 mods on the bottom row. However, I don't use Alt much, but I still find the angle of Row 4 subtle enough so my thumbs don't hit the edge.

Out of curiosity, how would a row 4 space bar work out for those like me that have a negative tilt on their keyboards?  I put a wrist wrest under the front of mine so it's raised in the front.  Row 4 space bars would seem to have a greater likelihood of problems there.

SP doesn't make Row 4 spacebars for SA profile. I have a problem even with slight positive tilt and DCS Row 4 spacebars (I think these are the ones that led to the spaceflipping - flipping the spacebar upside down- phenomenon?), but Cherry profile is a bit shallower angle, similar to SA Row 4 and that's acceptable to me up to completely flat. I think you'll be fine with the standard Row 3 SA spacebar and negative tilt, although you may prefer Row 3 mods to Row 4.

Here's a better picture to see the profile angles:

[Niomosy]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

As a Penumbra set user (1-2-3-3-3-4) who keeps their board very flat I can say that: No, it won't. The spacebar is Row 3 no matter what you choose for the other bottom row caps and symmetrical and is a lot nicer to use than DCS profile or even Cherry profile. In fact since I use my pinkies for Ctrl and Fn, I find I prefer Row 4 mods on the bottom row. However, I don't use Alt much, but I still find the angle of Row 4 subtle enough so my thumbs don't hit the edge.

Out of curiosity, how would a row 4 space bar work out for those like me that have a negative tilt on their keyboards?  I put a wrist wrest under the front of mine so it's raised in the front.  Row 4 space bars would seem to have a greater likelihood of problems there.

SP doesn't make Row 4 spacebars for SA profile. I have a problem even with slight positive tilt and DCS Row 4 spacebars, but Cherry profile is a bit shallower angle, similar to SA Row 4 and that's acceptable to me up to completely flat. I think you'll be fine with the standard Row 3 SA spacebar and negative tilt, although you may prefer Row 3 mods to Row 4.

Here's a better picture to see the profile angles:

Show Image

Great info and the picture does help.  I wasn't sure on how SP handled the spacebars so I figured I'd ask the generic question.  Good to know that it's row 3.  I was also suspecting that row 3 would be easier on a negative tilt keyboard than row 4 but thought I'd ask.

[Data]

For reference:

All Row 3: Nuclear Data, 1976, Symbiosis, Danger Zone
1-2-3-3-3-4: Commando, Penumbra
1-1-2-3-4-3: Round 5 Sphericals (7bit's massive GB)
3-1-2-3-4-3: Round 4 Sphericals, PuLSE SA, Hack'd by Geeks, Modern Selectric
1-1-2-3-4-4: Jukebox, Retro SA, Carbon

I use Penumbra and Hack'd by Geeks on my "daily driver" boards.

As an example to compare to the image above of Hack'd, here's one of Retro so you can see how the R1 F keys look:

Show Image

Nice.

I wonder how 1-2-2-3-3-4 would look/feel.

[thesiscamper]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

As a Penumbra set user (1-2-3-3-3-4) who keeps their board very flat I can say that: No, it won't. The spacebar is Row 3 no matter what you choose for the other bottom row caps and symmetrical and is a lot nicer to use than DCS profile or even Cherry profile. In fact since I use my pinkies for Ctrl and Fn, I find I prefer Row 4 mods on the bottom row. However, I don't use Alt much, but I still find the angle of Row 4 subtle enough so my thumbs don't hit the edge.

jdcarpe, the designer of the Hack'd by Geeks set said that if he knew at the time that SP could do Row 4 bottom row mods, Hack'd would have had them.

Having the Fn row and number row with the same profile allows you to use the Esc on the number row for 60% boards, but it's just one extra cap if you choose to have them different. I don't really like how R3 Fn row looks if you have R1 number row, so I prefer to have them both R1 personally.

1-1-2-3-4-4 is a standard across all "normal" sculpted profiles (OEM, Cherry, DCS, etc), so I don't see why it shouldn't also be used for SA. IMHO, the only reason to use R3 on the top row is for novelties...

It's mostly personal preference, really. I think most would be happy with either 3-1-2-3-4-3 OR 1-1-2-3-4-4 OR 3-1-2-3-4-4... As long as the centre part is 1-2-3-4.

Thank you for the very informative reply! Unfortunately I'm more confused which one to use now, I've been leaning towards 1-1-2-3-4-4 from the beginning until a few hours ago, then 3-1-2-3-4-3, but now I'm not sure again. It's a very subjective topic that I can't relate to because I have no experience with it.

[romevi]

Having 4 at the bottom will hurt your thumbs.

As a Penumbra set user (1-2-3-3-3-4) who keeps their board very flat I can say that: No, it won't. The spacebar is Row 3 no matter what you choose for the other bottom row caps and symmetrical and is a lot nicer to use than DCS profile or even Cherry profile. In fact since I use my pinkies for Ctrl and Fn, I find I prefer Row 4 mods on the bottom row. However, I don't use Alt much, but I still find the angle of Row 4 subtle enough so my thumbs don't hit the edge.

jdcarpe, the designer of the Hack'd by Geeks set said that if he knew at the time that SP could do Row 4 bottom row mods, Hack'd would have had them.

Having the Fn row and number row with the same profile allows you to use the Esc on the number row for 60% boards, but it's just one extra cap if you choose to have them different. I don't really like how R3 Fn row looks if you have R1 number row, so I prefer to have them both R1 personally.

1-1-2-3-4-4 is a standard across all "normal" sculpted profiles (OEM, Cherry, DCS, etc), so I don't see why it shouldn't also be used for SA. IMHO, the only reason to use R3 on the top row is for novelties...

It's mostly personal preference, really. I think most would be happy with either 3-1-2-3-4-3 OR 1-1-2-3-4-4 OR 3-1-2-3-4-4... As long as the centre part is 1-2-3-4.

Thank you for the very informative reply! Unfortunately I'm more confused which one to use now, I've been leaning towards 1-1-2-3-4-4 from the beginning until a few hours ago, then 3-1-2-3-4-3, but now I'm not sure again. It's a very subjective topic that I can't relate to because I have no experience with it.

3-1-2-3-4-3 Seems like the "best" option, but all I have in SA profile is Retro SA.
Maybe do a poll?


Update:
Anyone have a HiPro? Their row layout seems similar to the above.

[thesiscamper]

FYI, Melissa is not at work, she said the answer to my query won't come until Monday.

[just66in]

FYI, Melissa is not at work, she said the answer to my query won't come until Monday.

Thanks for the update. I can't share any opinion on other SA height profiles as similarly to you, have know tried 112344 and I can see how the spacebar row being height 3 wld actually avoid the cornered contoured height 4.

[thesiscamper]

FYI, Melissa is not at work, she said the answer to my query won't come until Monday.

Thanks for the update. I can't share any opinion on other SA height profiles as similarly to you, have know tried 112344 and I can see how the spacebar row being height 3 wld actually avoid the cornered contoured height 4.

After Oobly chimed in I believe no thumbs would be hurt by R4 bottom rows, especially if you raise the rear feet or use a palm rest.  Most people would only ever use the thumb on the spacebar (R3 either way) and Alt keys. I haven't decided yet, but leaning toward the more traditional 1-1-2-3-4-4 again.

[Elrick]

Gorgeous set:

Show Image

On a plain Filco it makes it look really unique and every stranger will stop to look at your NEW keyboard.

The essence of Geekhack, transforming everyone's keyboard into a Utopian Dream  ;) .

[thesiscamper]

Poll is up for row numbering, login required 

http://goo.gl/forms/IP9ZGg9BkV

[Oobly]

Another option (although it could be controversial) is to use Row 3 Alt keys and Row 4 for the other bottom row mods, but that limits the 1.25x novelty cap usage a bit.

I think the poll is a good idea.

[just66in]

Poll is up for row numbering, login required 

http://goo.gl/forms/IP9ZGg9BkV

Thanks for another poll. I'm definitely leaning to 112344 as I don't face any existing issue with my SA in that height. On the other hand, I've never owned a 312343 haha. The theme basically, gosh, its too "sick" to miss. I'll have them in ANY profile order under the SA family