[IC] The Ultimate Arrowed 60% Kit

[KHAANNN]

I've been using 60% with arrows for almost a year now, this is my latest theoretical iteration

Pros:

• Full width usage
• Symmetrical arrows (legends line up)
• 1.25 /? that should be easier to press, similar to the \|
• An 60% that has everything, optimal for those who don't heavily use the right-shift

Challenges:

• Arrows might require an alternative homing, as there is an adjacent 1.25 block to the left

Plan:

• Get this built as a DIY kit
• tmk_keyboard compatible PCB
• Many extra 1.25/1.75 keycaps for different use cases, 1.25 Shift, 1.25 Win, 1.25 Fn-like keycaps, 1.75 Caps-Lock, 1.75 Fn, 1.75 Control
• (Optional) Side prints! - If there is enough interest and if we can settle on placements

Business Plan:

• Gather enough interest
• Pitch this to a manufacturer to handle the PCB/case manufacturing + coordinate the keycap manufacturing
• Enforce quality keycaps (Hoping for GMK, will settle for quality PBT dye-subs, worst case thin ABS double-shots)
• At completion, those who are interested will buy the kit directly from the manufacturer
• My first choice will be TEX, the second one could be matias with alps switches, The third one could be KBParadise

Interested? Please fill out the form: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1wccGXqwqGiiKaCztS3x2k9dtXptV2Z1JOiXec82xL9Q/viewform?usp=send_form

-- -- --

Original Keyboard Layout Editor Sketch:

[KHAANNN]

Reserved

[Hypersphere]

Hi KHAANNN,

I've been noticing your keyboard in your other posts and admiring the intelligent layout.

Since my first try of the HHKB Pro 2, I have adopted that layout for all my keyboards (achieved via remapping software), so my layout preferences are decidedly biased toward that of the HHKB.

With this in mind, I like the layout of your 60% board, but I would have to change some things:

1. I would need to swap the Backspace and Backslash keys.

2. I use the Right Shift almost exclusively, and I have found that I need the Right Shift to be at least 1.25x. This would of course knock out the arrow keys for me, but I am fine using Fn plus the HHKB cursor diamond for the arrow keys.

For those who can use the Left Shift in preference to the Right Shift, your layout could be ideal.

Best wishes for success with your project.

[ideus]

I would be in immediately, one year ago; but now, the arrows in a sixty keyboard are not an issue any more, that was solved using the elegant concept of Space-FN; therefore, there is no need for special hardware and my boards can use authentic OG Cherry and GMK.


Good luck with your project, it may pull the interest of Leopold FC660 and TKL users, if for the last their main interest are the arrows, only.

[jdcarpe]

I wish people would stop trying to shove dedicated cursor arrows into a 60% keyboard. They don't belong there. If you need cursor arrows, try a TKL or 75%. Or do like we all do, and learn to use the arrows on a function layer.

Even if you were to get a nice keycap  set made for this project, you are limited to those stock keycaps. Want to use your Hack'd By Geeks or GMK HyperFuse set with this keyboard? Sorry.

I admire your drive to get YOUR ideal layout produced and offer it for others, but you are looking for a solution to a problem that does not exist.

[neverused]

I wish people would stop trying to shove dedicated cursor arrows into a 60% keyboard. They don't belong there. If you need cursor arrows, try a TKL or 75%. Or do like we all do, and learn to use the arrows on a function layer.

Even if you were to get a nice keycap  set made for this project, you are limited to those stock keycaps. Want to use your Hack'd By Geeks or GMK HyperFuse set with this keyboard? Sorry.

I admire your drive to get YOUR ideal layout produced and offer it for others, but you are looking for a solution to a problem that does not exist.

I built this with Hack'd by Geeks in mind.

[neverused]

• Many extra 1.25/1.75 keycaps for different use cases, 1.25 Shift, 1.25 Win, 1.25 Fn-like keycaps, 1.75 Caps-Lock, 1.75 Fn, 1.75 Control

This should be listed under cons.

[whmeltonjr]

I can see the merit behind a 68 key layout, but anything that would require keycaps like in the OP would not interest me. You would be incredibly limited in caps.

[KHAANNN]

I would be in immediately, one year ago; but now, the arrows in a sixty keyboard are not an issue any more, that was solved using the elegant concept of Space-FN; therefore, there is no need for special hardware and my boards can use authentic OG Cherry and GMK.


Good luck with your project, it may pull the interest of Leopold FC660 and TKL users, if for the last their main interest are the arrows, only.

Thanks :)

Hi KHAANNN,

I've been noticing your keyboard in your other posts and admiring the intelligent layout.

Since my first try of the HHKB Pro 2, I have adopted that layout for all my keyboards (achieved via remapping software), so my layout preferences are decidedly biased toward that of the HHKB.

With this in mind, I like the layout of your 60% board, but I would have to change some things:

1. I would need to swap the Backspace and Backslash keys.

2. I use the Right Shift almost exclusively, and I have found that I need the Right Shift to be at least 1.25x. This would of course knock out the arrow keys for me, but I am fine using Fn plus the HHKB cursor diamond for the arrow keys.

For those who can use the Left Shift in preference to the Right Shift, your layout could be ideal.

Best wishes for success with your project.

Hi Hypersphere,

Thanks a lot for your kind words, from my posts in the keyboards/keycaps sections, and from general feedback/reading, I've noticed that some people type very crudely like me, use mostly the left shift already, seek dedicated arrows, and some people type using the home-row more and with 2 hands more synchronised, this is for the first group, I would guess maybe the 15%-20% of mech users, maybe less, maybe more

That's kind of the reason why I didn't bother with adding the 1.5u Backspace to the IC, those who use the 1.5u Backspace almost always have the arrows at their FN layers, so I didn't think there would be interest

So your analysis is spot on

I wish people would stop trying to shove dedicated cursor arrows into a 60% keyboard. They don't belong there. If you need cursor arrows, try a TKL or 75%. Or do like we all do, and learn to use the arrows on a function layer.

Even if you were to get a nice keycap  set made for this project, you are limited to those stock keycaps. Want to use your Hack'd By Geeks or GMK HyperFuse set with this keyboard? Sorry.

I admire your drive to get YOUR ideal layout produced and offer it for others, but you are looking for a solution to a problem that does not exist.

jdcarpe I'm not seeking a solution to a universal problem, I know that a minority of people share the same tastes as me, this IC is for those people, to asses the numbers, it might be 5-10 and this idea might not take off, or it might be 50-60 and we might make this a reality

I'm not even sure whether this symmetrical arrows are optimal, I'm wondering what other people think, I'm using 1.75/1.25 arrows myself, it lacks legend-symmetry, yet mis-clicks doesn't occur, with uniform 1.25 arrows mis-clicks are a bit more likely, the 60% is for minimalism, TKL has the solution yet the extra width makes a mouse/controller harder to use, there is also not much need for the additional keys other than the arrow, a 65%/75% doesn't change anything, it even complicates things further, 1u arrows in a crowded layout are harder to use, and there is not much need for the extra keys, finding keycaps for them is also challenging

Like I mentioned in my OP, this kit will come with a pre-set keycap set, the best quality set possible, the reason for this IC is to make this possible, otherwise anyone can build any layout they want these days

I really find your attitude hostile in general, you are refuting ideas that doesn't align with your own tastes

As a bonus:

[KHAANNN]

• Many extra 1.25/1.75 keycaps for different use cases, 1.25 Shift, 1.25 Win, 1.25 Fn-like keycaps, 1.75 Caps-Lock, 1.75 Fn, 1.75 Control

This should be listed under cons.

The Tab/Shift/Esc/Backspace are mostly universal

Yet everyone has different preferences for the 1.25/1.75 keys, that's why I listed it under Pro's, if this kit becomes a reality, it will come with several extra/alternative 1.25 keycaps

[suicidal_orange]

I like this and would add (for those who need a right shift) that if you use EasyAVR firmware you can use a tapkey to make it so that if you tap "up" it's an up arrow, but if you hold it it's a standard shift key.  Not sure if that's available in TMK but I'm guessing not or I'm sure it would be mentioned more often in discussions like this

[KHAANNN]

I like this and would add (for those who need a right shift) that if you use EasyAVR firmware you can use a tapkey to make it so that if you tap "up" it's an up arrow, but if you hold it it's a standard shift key.  Not sure if that's available in TMK but I'm guessing not or I'm sure it would be mentioned more often in discussions like this

I know that it's very possible, it's extremely easy to make the "Up" a Shift when being held, yet the challenging part is to cancel the "Up" when the Shift is actually used, there are many entry points tho, one would need to find the entry point for all the keypresses and modify a flag there, so the "Up" isn't sent

I personally don't like the idea myself, as it changes the "Up" keycap's behaviour, you need to release it to register, if you also decide not to use it as a Shift, there is an extra "Up" there that you need to handle

+Update: Added a more neutral, appealing keycap selection to the OP

Edit: +Thanks for the support

[neverused]

Oh I like this

[ideus]

People interested in this will have a hard time to find common ground between many layouts, all of them mostly non standard. The one in the picture can make it with a more standard bottom row, though.

[harlw]

I wish people would stop trying to shove dedicated cursor arrows into a 60% keyboard. They don't belong there. If you need cursor arrows, try a TKL or 75%. Or do like we all do, and learn to use the arrows on a function layer.

Even if you were to get a nice keycap  set made for this project, you are limited to those stock keycaps. Want to use your Hack'd By Geeks or GMK HyperFuse set with this keyboard? Sorry.

I admire your drive to get YOUR ideal layout produced and offer it for others, but you are looking for a solution to a problem that does not exist.

Ugh - by your logic, nobody should ever use any alternative layouts which would discard 80% of the community. I'm on board with this idea because my specific usage reflects OP's in many aspects. I've been using a Pok3r for a couple months and there are many things i like about it. Using func+arrows works fine for programming but there are some Photoshop operations that i use daily that require I jump between 3-4 modifier keys + arrows to use function layer arrows, this really slows me down and discarding the entire bottom right side of my board in favor of arrows would be a huge improvement for me.


I like keycap sets, probably more than most, but I always favor utility over looks.

[Coreda]

I admire your drive to get YOUR ideal layout produced and offer it for others, but you are looking for a solution to a problem that does not exist.

A problem that doesn't exist? Pretty much universally 60% are criticized by users for the lack of arrow keys. It's an adapt or give up on the board situation, but not everyone is satisfied with the Function layer solution or software-based layouts.

The real drawback of this proposed layout isn't the idea but the lack of compatibility with custom keycaps.

The Leopold FC660 was designed as a kind of half-way compromise although even it has a non-standard space bar.

[KHAANNN]

Thanks for the support harlw

I admire your drive to get YOUR ideal layout produced and offer it for others, but you are looking for a solution to a problem that does not exist.

A problem that doesn't exist? Pretty much universally 60% are criticized by users for the lack of arrow keys. It's an adapt or give up on the board situation, but not everyone is satisfied with the Function layer solution or software-based layouts.

The real drawback of this proposed layout isn't the idea but the lack of compatibility with custom keycaps.

The Leopold FC660 was designed as a kind of half-way compromise although even it has a non-standard space bar.

I probably didn't emphasize this enough in my OP, however the proposed keyboard will come with a custom keycap set of it's own, one created/verified by the community, with a lot of extra keycaps that will make it usable for many edge use cases, for example some like to have their \| in the modifier color, I mostly like my Tab with alpha-coloring instead, there will be a surplus of alternative 1.25's and 1.75's, maybe even alternatively phrases keycaps like Delete/Backspace and Return/Enter

The problem with stock keyboards* is usually their lack of alternative keycaps, if FC660's included some alternative keycaps, I might not even started this quest in the first place, comparatively I enjoyed my time with a KBParadise V60, as it had alternative 1.75/1.25 keycaps

I think this is not too unrealistic, since it's a pre-set 60% it has less keys than regular keysets, even with the surplus of additional keys, the cost should be close to a regular keyset that usually includes keycaps to support multiple layouts

------

I think the main challenge is to find a 1.25 keycap type that differentiates itself from other keycaps somehow, without the usual keyboard spacing, differentiated arrows would really make this keyboard/layout more usable

[jdcarpe]

Ugh - by your logic, nobody should ever use any alternative layouts which would discard 80% of the community.

Really? 80%? I'm sure you have some research to back up your statistic, right? Last I checked, the vast majority of keyboard enthusiasts were using standard ANSI, split between full size, TKL, and 60%.

I'm on board with this idea because my specific usage reflects OP's in many aspects. I've been using a Pok3r for a couple months and there are many things i like about it. Using func+arrows works fine for programming but there are some Photoshop operations that i use daily that require I jump between 3-4 modifier keys + arrows to use function layer arrows, this really slows me down and discarding the entire bottom right side of my board in favor of arrows would be a huge improvement for me.

Sounds like you would be much better served in your case by using a TKL (80%) keyboard. I use a full size at work, because I input a lot of numbers, and having a numpad is of great benefit. But that doesn't mean that full size is my favorite form factor.

I like keycap sets, probably more than most, but I always favor utility over looks.

If you owned many more keycap sets than you own keyboards, you would probably change your mind about that.

Pretty much universally 60% are criticized by users for the lack of arrow keys. It's an adapt or give up on the board situation, but not everyone is satisfied with the Function layer solution or software-based layouts.

Tell that to the thousands of happy Poker owners. A very small number of 60% keyboard users find that they can't live without dedicated cursor arrows (or a dedicated function row, for that matter).

[ideus]

There is a pool for compact keyboard with dedicated arrows at MD now. The images shows the top options.

[neverused]

Ugh - by your logic, nobody should ever use any alternative layouts which would discard 80% of the community.

Really? 80%? I'm sure you have some research to back up your statistic, right? Last I checked, the vast majority of keyboard enthusiasts were using standard ANSI, split between full size, TKL, and 60%.

I'm on board with this idea because my specific usage reflects OP's in many aspects. I've been using a Pok3r for a couple months and there are many things i like about it. Using func+arrows works fine for programming but there are some Photoshop operations that i use daily that require I jump between 3-4 modifier keys + arrows to use function layer arrows, this really slows me down and discarding the entire bottom right side of my board in favor of arrows would be a huge improvement for me.

Sounds like you would be much better served in your case by using a TKL (80%) keyboard. I use a full size at work, because I input a lot of numbers, and having a numpad is of great benefit. But that doesn't mean that full size is my favorite form factor.

I like keycap sets, probably more than most, but I always favor utility over looks.

If you owned many more keycap sets than you own keyboards, you would probably change your mind about that.

Pretty much universally 60% are criticized by users for the lack of arrow keys. It's an adapt or give up on the board situation, but not everyone is satisfied with the Function layer solution or software-based layouts.

Tell that to the thousands of happy Poker owners. A very small number of 60% keyboard users find that they can't live without dedicated cursor arrows (or a dedicated function row, for that matter).

This is an interest check, if there isn't support it'll die out, what's the harm in that?

I personally like a 60% with dedicated arrows. I don't want to put them on another layer because I don't like that, simple as that. If I can't find keycaps to fit then they is my problem. Why discourage this at all?

Similar arguments could be made for 40% and 45% keyboards. They are certainly in a niche, but people still like them. Why design the jd40 or jd45?

[Coreda]

Tell that to the thousands of happy Poker owners. A very small number of 60% keyboard users find that they can't live without dedicated cursor arrows (or a dedicated function row, for that matter).

As a Poker owner being able to adapt to the Function based arrow key solution is not the same as being happy about the lack of dedicated arrow keys.

Any hotkey combination that requires several modifiers is a chore and is an inherit limitation of these boards but there are enough positives that most users stick with them. There are countless posts about this. Were computer interactions restricted solely to arrow keys it wouldn't be much of a problem as the Fn key combo works well enough that it becomes intuitive, but add other combinations and it frequently reminds one how much easier it is with arrow keys.

There is a pool for compact keyboard with dedicated arrows at MD now. The images shows the top options.

Cheers. Can't find it MD though, have a link?

Edit: found it via Google.

[jdcarpe]

Similar arguments could be made for 40% and 45% keyboards. They are certainly in a niche, but people still like them. Why design the jd40 or jd45?

The difference is that I'm not asking TEX or Matias to produce them for me. I am intimately aware that the 40% and similar form factor is an extremely niche product, with a very limited potential user base. So much so, in fact, that I never intended the JD40 to be a "production" keyboard. The original PCB I specified had several shortcomings, which necessitated having the PCB completely revised for what I consider the (upcoming) production version.


I guess I am biased when it comes to the 60% form factor, as I use the best layout available (HHKB) exclusively. I have no trouble at all doing everyday typing tasks when using the HHKB layout on a 60%, but using a standard ANSI layout on a 60% annoys me.

[Hypersphere]

<snip>
I guess I am biased when it comes to the 60% form factor, as I use the best layout available (HHKB) exclusively. I have no trouble at all doing everyday typing tasks when using the HHKB layout on a 60%, but using a standard ANSI layout on a 60% annoys me.

Yes! My overall all-time favorite keyboard is the HHKB Pro 2. I don't use it exclusively, however, because I like to introduce some variety from time to time with respect to switch type and form factor. Nevertheless, when using other keyboards, I use remapping software to create a layout as close as possible to that of the HHKB Pro 2.

[braidn]

I guess I am biased when it comes to the 60% form factor, as I use the best layout available (HHKB) exclusively. I have no trouble at all doing everyday typing tasks when using the HHKB layout on a 60%, but using a standard ANSI layout on a 60% annoys me.

Couldn't agree more here. I am on the fence about changing the HHKB over with JTK's sliders but so many new keyboard's go the Poker route.

[neverused]

Similar arguments could be made for 40% and 45% keyboards. They are certainly in a niche, but people still like them. Why design the jd40 or jd45?

The difference is that I'm not asking TEX or Matias to produce them for me. I am intimately aware that the 40% and similar form factor is an extremely niche product, with a very limited potential user base. So much so, in fact, that I never intended the JD40 to be a "production" keyboard. The original PCB I specified had several shortcomings, which necessitated having the PCB completely revised for what I consider the (upcoming) production version.


I guess I am biased when it comes to the 60% form factor, as I use the best layout available (HHKB) exclusively. I have no trouble at all doing everyday typing tasks when using the HHKB layout on a 60%, but using a standard ANSI layout on a 60% annoys me.

Oh I agree the hhkb is a great layout and standard ansi on a 60% is a bad idea. As far as I know, he isn't asking a manufacturer to make the layout, rather he is proposing the project as a partnership amongst different companies with a single distributor to make it easy for the end user.

Btw I really like your layouts and am still trying to get a jd45, but that buy hasn't happened yet.

[ideus]

This is very confusing, is this IC about JD40s, now?

[neverused]

This is very confusing, is this IC about JD40s, now?

If you add keys and make it look like the OP

[ideus]

This is very confusing, is this IC about JD40s, now?

If you add keys and make it look like the OP

Suddenly, the discussion turned to be on JD's and HHKB. It appears something very frequent, the OP gets derailed, mostly by people that are not interested at all in the OP's proposal.

[neverused]

This is very confusing, is this IC about JD40s, now?

If you add keys and make it look like the OP

Suddenly, the discussion turned to be on JD's and HHKB. It appears something very frequent, the OP gets derailed, mostly by people that are not interested at all in the OP's proposal.

Fair. With that said, I very much like the OP proposal, though I don't know what the 1.25u arrows would feel like.

[KHAANNN]

Fair. With that said, I very much like the OP proposal, though I don't know what the 1.25u arrows would feel like.

The regular multi-option 60% PCB's can be used with 1.25 arrows, with this proposal only the /? and the rightmost 1u becomes 1.25u, not a major change, it's also easy to manually drill existing PCB's and make the change, so I might just do that at one point as a proof of concept

Here is my experience so far with integrated arrows:
- Used the infinity keyboard with 1.75/1.25/1.25/1.25 arrows, the arrows were pretty easy to get used to
- Used the KBP V60 with 2.25/1.25/1.25/1.25 arrows, the cherry stabilised shift was less than optimal yet the arrows were easy to use and get used to
- Built the keyboards in the attachment with 1u arrows, the arrows were hard to get used to, it became obvious that larger arrows were much easier and practical to use
- Built the lower keyboard in the attachment, with 1.5/1.25/1.25/1.25 arrows, mainly because I couldn't find a cherry 1.75u blank at the time, the arrows were much more usable again

From my experience, enlarging the arrows reduces the possibility of misclicks, I found the 1u ones to be unusable, yet I enjoy using 1.25u ones, this is why I dismiss 75%'s, 65%'s personally, only the Race II layout seems usable
(Unusable because you can't use the arrows extremely fast and go back to typing, you have to slow down a bit to prevent mis-clicks, the larger 1.25u arrows allow fast arrow usage and fast typing recovery/continuation)

Arrow mis-clicks are much costlier than other mis-clicks, if you type "d" instead of "s" it's easy to correct, yet when you click 'Up' instead of "/", it maimes you

This is why I'm looking for keycaps with some kind of differentiation for the arrows, similar to homing modifications of F/J's, it would eliminate mis-clicks for good

[ideus]

What you meant is that regular 1u arrows are unusable? I am not sure to follow your reasoning and the existent TKL and full size keyboards are a testimony that 1u arrows work.

[KHAANNN]

What you meant is that regular 1u arrows are unusable? I am not sure to follow your reasoning and the existent TKL and full size keyboards are a testimony that 1u arrows work.

They are separated by empty areas

[FuriousGeorge]

I started with 60% boards with arrows. My first was a Tex Beetle and then a Minila Air. I do use the right shift and the 1u shift on those boards is still a little difficult to get used to. I liked having the arrows on the base layer, but I disliked having home/end and pgup/pgdn located in a completely different location in the function layer. I do wish the 4.5u space bar on the Beetle was more popular. It's the perfect size for me.

I've recently received a KC60 and an Infinity so I can play around with programmable boards and I think the Infinity may be my "end game" layout. I've found that when I'm typing I actually like having the arrows available on an easily accessed function layer on the home keys better than dedicated keys. When I'm primarily mousing or doing something like watching youtube videos it can be more convenient to have base layer arrows quickly accessible without needing to find the home keys. With TMK I can program spacefn and have a toggle to turn the right shift cluster into arrows only when I need it. I can appreciate wanting dedicated arrows and I really like what you've come up with here, but for me I've found I really like the flexibility of having them available on demand. Now to get used to the 1.5u backspace.

[Cindori]

OP, the KBT Pure is very close to your design.



After pressing FN-Space, the keys to the right will act as arrow keys.

It also places tilde on the right side which may be more useful than a small shift.

Also, many keycap sets come with keys to support this layout.

You should ignore the people saying arrow keys don't belong on a 60% layout. It's definitely a desired feature.

The ultimate solution is probably like Apple have done with the Macbook Pro keyboard. Someone just needs to release half-sized cherry mx switches. I remember seeing a post on reddit about some manufacturer showing off these kinds of switches on some exhibition.

[jdcarpe]

The ultimate solution is probably like Apple have done with the Macbook Pro keyboard. Someone just needs to release half-sized cherry mx switches. I remember seeing a post on reddit about some manufacturer showing off these kinds of switches on some exhibition.

[KHAANNN]

OP, the KBT Pure is very close to your design.

Show Image

After pressing FN-Space, the keys to the right will act as arrow keys.

It also places tilde on the right side which may be more useful than a small shift.

Also, many keycap sets come with keys to support this layout.

You should ignore the people saying arrow keys don't belong on a 60% layout. It's definitely a desired feature.

The ultimate solution is probably like Apple have done with the Macbook Pro keyboard. Someone just needs to release half-sized cherry mx switches. I remember seeing a post on reddit about some manufacturer showing off these kinds of switches on some exhibition.

I'm currently using this keycap-sized layout too, without the Space-FN tho, I also find the arrows very usable

The layout is also easy to replicate with almost any agile 60% PCB, so it's the easiest way to have arrows on 60%'s (might even be the best)

I think downwards creeped arrows could work well too, the width space is valuable, as there is usually a mouse or another controller nearby, yet there are no such restrictions for height (usually not) - it takes the simplicity out of the case design tho, at which point something like a TKL starts seeming much more logical (so there is 6 rows instead of 5 on the right side, with only the bottom arrows on the 6th row, the case is no longer rectangular)

Practically and personally, since I don't use the right-shift, at least not heavily, I'm pretty satisfied even with this layout, the proposed layout is just a fantasy that bumps 95% to 99%

The ultimate solution is probably like Apple have done with the Macbook Pro keyboard. Someone just needs to release half-sized cherry mx switches. I remember seeing a post on reddit about some manufacturer showing off these kinds of switches on some exhibition.

Show Image

Completely forgot about this keyboard, wish it was available now, it would be a great way to test some matias switches

[Cindori]

The ultimate solution is probably like Apple have done with the Macbook Pro keyboard. Someone just needs to release half-sized cherry mx switches. I remember seeing a post on reddit about some manufacturer showing off these kinds of switches on some exhibition.

Show Image

That's not Cherry MX, the one I saw was Cherry MX, half as big as normal switches

[jdcarpe]

The ultimate solution is probably like Apple have done with the Macbook Pro keyboard. Someone just needs to release half-sized cherry mx switches. I remember seeing a post on reddit about some manufacturer showing off these kinds of switches on some exhibition.

[snip]

That's not Cherry MX.

I'm well aware of that.   I just saw your comment about half sized switches, and it reminded me of the Matias 60%, which would be perfect for OP.