TE Remapped and tweaked

[Gerk]

Starting to feel much better.  I have to find some time to make up the instructions for remapping in OSX, got most of what I want taken care of with the exception of the left space bar (which is still only sending 0xFF).  I don't think I'm going to go the distance on making this work (it's possible if you want to do some sleuthing and hacking on the PCKeyboardHack app source and recompile).

Here's what I've done so far for remapping:
- shifted whole number row over one position to the left
- left red blank (num row) is esc
- right red blank (num row) is backspace
- Command (ctrl) and shift swapped on left side (keycaps swapped)
- right side Command (ctrl) is enter (keycaps swapped)
- right side shift on bottom (keycaps swapped)
- bottom left blank is Control
- bottom right blank is Control
- right hand AltGr is Alt

The Geekhack keys are just for fun, no functionality changes.

Incidently these keycaps are ALL a bit whacky compared to other cherry based boards.  The two red blanks (esc row on normal board) are bigger than the normal keycaps on that row are.  So are all the GH keys (but they work ok there as they still line up with top row).  Not going to find replacement keycaps for this board for a long, long, .... ever.  The number row did all move one to the left without issue.  The way the case is moulded makes it tough to get at the keys around the edges of the board with pullers, but still doable.

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 35496[/ATTACH]

[Input Nirvana]

Q:
-movement clusters on lower left and lower right... a hit or a miss?
-key caps are smaller...what about the height? Same as the red and GH key caps?
-is this becoming your favorite? Your daily driver?
-thoughts on the center row...?

[Gerk]

Q:
-movement clusters on lower left and lower right... a hit or a miss?
-key caps are smaller...what about the height? Same as the red and GH key caps?
-is this becoming your favorite? Your daily driver?
-thoughts on the center row...?

Clusters are growing on me.  I like them, not sure that's where I would have chosen for placement if I was designing, but I think I will adapt fine.  It is very very nice having a proper 4 way arrow cluster so close to home row.

I'll do a proper analysis of the keycaps at some point soon when I have more time.  Not sure if I'm seeing things on some of them or not, will have to pull and compare some in a more direct manner.

This is becoming the current favourite yes, it's my daily driver on my main workstation currently.

I really want to like the center row, but I just can't find the love for it yet.  The only key I've used in it a lot was enter, but honestly since I remapped it to the right pinky I have barely touched it there.  The tab key I use because I have to.  Backspace I'm starting to get more comfortable with and use it about half the time.  The only reason I mapped the backspace to top right as well was for the muscle memory moments  Once/If I retrain to use the center one I'll just remap the top right to something different ... or not.  I don't think having two of them is a problem personally

Moving the number keys over was a huge improvement for me.  I realize now that I already touched type a lot of that stuff without thinking about it, but I learned it over to the left due to stagger.  It's not just the numbers ... in fact the numbers are the easier ones to break, it's also a lot of the symbols that go with them that I use all day long programming.  If this board was not on my main programming machine I probably would't have cared so much to move the number row.

I think this board is going to continue growing on me.  It feels very comfortable for me to type on and seem to feel better as I get more comfortable with it.  Aside from losing it on the odd punctuation I think my typing speed is probably 70% of the way there on it already if not better than that.  I don't think this board will be for everyone though.  I'll see if it's still on my desk next month

[Gerk]

One other general comment ... if you look at the pic in the first post, anything from the geekhack keys and up are things that I just don't use for much of anything .. I don't require or use F keys for anything that I need to do on a regular basis -- which is also one of the reasons I mapped the escape key down lower as I do use that one and wanted less travel to press it.  The only thing I really need to use up there on this board currently is to turn on caps lock, and even that's pretty rare.  You could probably lose that whole top end of the keyboard I would be happy with it still.

[boli]

Very well done summary, Gerk!

-key caps are smaller...what about the height? Same as the red and GH key caps?

The following picture from the FAQ shows it quite nicely, though I haven't actually pulled the key caps on mine to verify.

Are the Keycaps Interchangeable?

Although keycaps of the same size can be interchanged and are easily removable, it is only recommended to switch keycaps within a given row as different rows have different profile shapes. Changing keycaps between different rows is possible, but is not recommended as the keyboard could become difficult to use.

[wrtcedar]

It's a bit scary how small the TE keycaps look compared to the ones that you added. I'm not sure that my big fingers are going to like that. Do the keys feel like they're closer together as well? Does the staggering help?

[Architect]

I've gotten used to it now, last time a keyboard took this long to adjust to was the Kinesis 20 years ago. I still have some troubles though, the placement of the space and control/command key, I keep wanting them to be reversed and when I go back to a normal keyboard get mixed up again. Logically they're in the right place, my fingers just don't see it that way.

Personally I like the center row, I can git enter and return with the thumb which is awesome. Haven't really gotten used to the tab in the middle yet, and that needs the pointer finger.

[Input Nirvana]

Personally I like the center row, I can git enter and return with the thumb which is awesome. Haven't really gotten used to the tab in the middle yet, and that needs the pointer finger.

You mean the 2 bottom keys in the center row?

[Lanx]

wtf is up with the unstaggered numrow keys? the way Gerk has remapped it is imo the correct way, looks to me like TE just mapped the numrow keys out of necessity but didn't give any thought to it, anyone who has used a matrix layout will love the way regular matrix layouts are with the numrows starting at Q/1 and ending in P/0 it just makes sense.

Btw i never used the center keys on my modded V1, it was just too "far" away to use comfortably.

[Gerk]

I feel the same way about this Lanx, it doesn't seem like something done with a lot of thought, it seems like something that was done in order to keep things symmetrical and fit the required keys into the narrower layout.  Personally I think I would absolutely LOVE this board if it was that one key wider on the right and left side to keep things in a more traditional layout (but still using the matrix type layout).  By this I mean one additional set of keys to the right of the ;: key (to allow for '" and /? to be in standard placement), an when still being able to have a tab key on the left hand side instead of the /? and \|.  The only disadvantage to this would be the loss of the full symmetry ... which to me is more about the vanity of the design than it was about the usability of it.

I find the center row on the TE to be a bit of a waste, you have to lift you hands from the home row to use most of them (aside from the enter at the bottom which you can use with your thumb) ... to me that defeats the purpose of it in a lot of ways.  I'd rather use my pinky and keep my hands on the home row than to lift my whole hand from it to press a tab or backspace ...

[Lanx]

can you "thumb" the big enter key in the middle?

[Input Nirvana]

I feel the same way about this Lanx, it doesn't seem like something done with a lot of thought, it seems like something that was done in order to keep things symmetrical and fit the required keys into the narrower layout.  Personally I think I would absolutely LOVE this board if it was that one key wider on the right and left side to keep things in a more traditional layout (but still using the matrix type layout).  By this I mean one additional set of keys to the right of the ;: key (to allow for '" and /? to be in standard placement), an when still being able to have a tab key on the left hand side instead of the /? and \|.  The only disadvantage to this would be the loss of the full symmetry ... which to me is more about the vanity of the design than it was about the usability of it.

I find the center row on the TE to be a bit of a waste, you have to lift you hands from the home row to use most of them (aside from the enter at the bottom which you can use with your thumb) ... to me that defeats the purpose of it in a lot of ways.  I'd rather use my pinky and keep my hands on the home row than to lift my whole hand from it to press a tab or backspace ...

All keyboards have compromises, and you are deftly pointing out the compromises on the TE. You make some nice points about moving your entire hand off home row to use the center row on medium-use keys, which is a no-no. Low-use keys only. I've been curious about that from the beginning. The number row issue would be harder to notice unless you are more of a tech professional that has required heavy use. The vanity of the design for symmetry sake is a fail. I easily see how this has been a large selling point for the last 2 years though.

Time to see if splitting that baby in half is an improvement. Lanx, get your chainsaw!!!!

[Gerk]

can you "thumb" the big enter key in the middle?

Yes, that's not a "stretch" (pun intended).  That's the only one that is usable with your thumb though.  The backspace key I can technically reach with my thumb without too much problem, but the angle of the keycaps makes it really hard to use it like that.  If it was something angled up like the space bars it might be more usable.  Maybe if I can figure out a way to do this with some modified keycaps I'll give it a try for fun and see how it feels like that.

All keyboards have compromises, and you are deftly pointing out the compromises on the TE. You make some nice points about moving your entire hand off home row to use the center row on medium-use keys, which is a no-no. Low-use keys only. I've been curious about that from the beginning. The number row issue would be harder to notice unless you are more of a tech professional that has required heavy use. The vanity of the design for symmetry sake is a fail. I easily see how this has been a large selling point for the last 2 years though.

Time to see if splitting that baby in half is an improvement. Lanx, get your chainsaw!!!!

When I have some time I'll do some photoshopping and put together what I think would be the ultimate layout of this board for my needs.  It would not be perfectly symmetrical, but it also wouldn't be a big departure from the existing layout.

I think that over time I'll be able to adapt to a fair bit of things, but at least for coding purposes the tab key is something that's going to end up being a huge problem.  Most of the medium use keys I'm fine with having off to the far left and right.  I personally find it easier to reach out with my pinky fingers as required than it is, at least for me, to come over with my index fingers to use the center column.

The center column was also one of the big if's for me when I ordered the board.  I was hoping that I would adapt, and I still might ... but so far it still just doesn't feel good and doesn't help the ergonomics of the board.  The thumb usable enter is fine, but the rest of that middle cluster could just go away n terms of ergonomics and usability.  It certainly pales in comparison with the thumb cluster approach that the Kinesis uses.    Also if I could remap the left space bar on OSX to something else I might like things a bit more -- I could then make it a backspace or a tab or something useful.

In the key mappings I posted here I think that some of them will be temporary.  Also some of them I just honestly don't use (like the right hand side bottom modifiers -- Alt and Option in my case) but setup because they were in a familiar position.  I've always done the modifiers on the left side of the keyboard as required.  I'm probably an odd case though as I have some long standing keyboarding habits that are going to be hard to break.

[Gerk]

Very well done summary, Gerk!



The following picture from the FAQ shows it quite nicely, though I haven't actually pulled the key caps on mine to verify.

Show Image

Yes but that doesn't compare their keycap profiles to standard cherry ones.  Some are the same (or close enough), some may not be -- but hard to say without doing a direct comparison.  Some are definitely non-standard (like all the center column) -- that one is the easiest to figure out :)

EDIT: That also doesn't show the differences in all the rows.  This layout is no longer the standard 4 row kinda setup.  There are various levels going on.  

What I've noticed so far:

- esc/F key row seems to be standard cherry sizing.  
- The row under that (with the 3 keys only, Fn key, etc) seems to be the same profile as the qwerty/Delete-End-Page Down row on a standard board.  
- The row with the numbers seems to be the same profile as cherry standard.  Not sure if it's an optical illusion or not, but there does look to be some sizing difference ... if there is it might be only with the actual top of the keycap itself and not the whole skirt diameter.  Will have to investigate further for this, but no time for the next couple of days.

Not really sure about any of the other key profiles as of yet, pulled a few to look at things but haven't tried to swap anything out or compare them to standard keycaps.  The one thing I did try was to put standard cherry caps on some of the longer keys and center cluster keys ... and that didn't work out for various reasons depending on the location.

[BartVB]

@gerk; try 'xev' if you have X11 installed or ControllerMate to see if the left space bar is emitting the correct key code. It did for me on OSX. And thanks for the layout inspiration, going to test how I currently use the number row. Interesting idea and (temporarily) moving backspace back to the upper right should make the transition a bit easier. Probably going to remap backspace to the left space bar.

[xsar]

I finally got to remapping the keys in windows, using autohotkey. The umlauts key did not properly work for my US-dvorak layout. I have it remapped now to several hotkeys, in combination with vowels.
Will have to get used to the changes compared to my other keyboard; switching to and from my workplace and home keyboards may be a challenge, considering the different physical layout.

[sordna]

This board really ought to have a dip switch to swap the Shift/Control positions. To me the shift position they went with is very odd.

[BartVB]

Gerk; your arrangement with the command/option/control keys really make sense to me. Set it up in the same way but with the left command (originally labeled as Shift) as an enter key. I know, not very hard-core of me but I don't think that I use the left command a lot anyway and I need to regularly switch between my TE and a standard MBP keyboard. Doesn't sound like a great idea to get my self used to pressing return-C to copy

BTW I tried xev again and now it doesn't return anything when I press the left spacebar?