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Looks awesome! That bottom is wild, haha. I imagine that would be difficult to machine?
How do you intend to produce that bottom piece?
Looks awesome! That bottom is wild, haha. I imagine that would be difficult to machine?
Wow, very innovative from what I've seen thus far.
Is there expected flex in the plate due to it's structure?
How will it affect sound if the bottom is open and a (can I say) lattice structure?
Are there multiple rotary dial options?
I would be really worried about the plate bending just from normal use since it seems to be so thin.
Has there been any tests done with it?
This looks really interesting! Is the bottom "3D Printed AlSi10Mg" material?
This thing is nuts. Insane Hype.
I dont wanna think about how much dust will get caught on top of that space frame looking thing down below.
Regarding the knob on top of the board, are you getting the additional functionality from in-plane translation of the knob or rotation of the knob about the depth axis of the keyboard? It would be so slick if I could push it horizontally/vertically without it rotating out of plane.
This thing is nuts. Insane Hype.
I dont wanna think about how much dust will get caught on top of that space frame looking thing down below.
Regarding the knob on top of the board, are you getting the additional functionality from in-plane translation of the knob or rotation of the knob about the depth axis of the keyboard? It would be so slick if I could push it horizontally/vertically without it rotating out of plane.
Unfortunately not:
https://imgur.com/BGeH9Wu
This thing is nuts. Insane Hype.
I dont wanna think about how much dust will get caught on top of that space frame looking thing down below.
Regarding the knob on top of the board, are you getting the additional functionality from in-plane translation of the knob or rotation of the knob about the depth axis of the keyboard? It would be so slick if I could push it horizontally/vertically without it rotating out of plane.
Unfortunately not:
https://imgur.com/BGeH9Wu
Hmmmm okay.
Thanks for the animation!
This looks beautiful. I'm not a fan of the 1.5u right shift, though. Maybe you can consider shifting the bottom row to the left so you can use 2u left shift?
Just when I was looking for a board for either Camping R2 or Shoko R2, I see this, perfect.
This looks beautiful. I'm not a fan of the 1.5u right shift, though. Maybe you can consider shifting the bottom row to the left so you can use 2u left shift?
This thing is nuts. Insane Hype.
I dont wanna think about how much dust will get caught on top of that space frame looking thing down below.
Regarding the knob on top of the board, are you getting the additional functionality from in-plane translation of the knob or rotation of the knob about the depth axis of the keyboard? It would be so slick if I could push it horizontally/vertically without it rotating out of plane.
Unfortunately not:
https://imgur.com/BGeH9Wu
Hmmmm okay.
Thanks for the animation!
No problem! Sorry for the poor quality, threw it together really quickly. If I can find a rotary joystick that has lateral functionality, I will switch to it with no hesitation.
Seeing as this will seemingly be fairly expensive, I can only say that this looks incredible and I wish I could afford one. :) Good luck.Haha. Right? I'll follow along for the experience, but there's no way I'll be able to afford this.
This thing is nuts. Insane Hype.
I dont wanna think about how much dust will get caught on top of that space frame looking thing down below.
Regarding the knob on top of the board, are you getting the additional functionality from in-plane translation of the knob or rotation of the knob about the depth axis of the keyboard? It would be so slick if I could push it horizontally/vertically without it rotating out of plane.
Unfortunately not:
https://imgur.com/BGeH9Wu
Hmmmm okay.
Thanks for the animation!
No problem! Sorry for the poor quality, threw it together really quickly. If I can find a rotary joystick that has lateral functionality, I will switch to it with no hesitation.
Do you have a feel for the know diam/ height as pictured & max allowable diam/height?
giving godspeed 75 a run for it's moneyMore likely on Sat75 levels.
giving godspeed 75 a run for it's moneyMore likely on Sat75 levels.
giving godspeed 75 a run for it's money
giving godspeed 75 a run for it's money
Can't compare the two mate. Evolv is miles ahead of godspeed75.
Oh no doubt. I just meant in aftermarket popularity. Haha. I could see this being a Grail board. Great work man.giving godspeed 75 a run for it's moneyMore likely on Sat75 levels.
<3. This will definitely be more expensive than the sat75 however.
wait hold up what the F***. Never thought i'd see something like this on a keyboard :eek:Eh. Once they had 3d printed dresses it was only a matter of time til it showed up everywhere. Haha.
DM Me
This looks like it'll be way out of my price range, but I'm really interested in how you did all the computations. Did you go all the way and take into account a spring inside a plastic box with a PCB stuck to the bottom of it?
Whoa. This is an interesting concept and design. I'm definitely interested in this.
Would it be possible to see a render of this with GMK Ursa? I feel like that would look pretty great with that bottom color. Very earthy.
I know it's hard to say by now, but what is the estimated price on this one? You've said "more expensive than the Satisfaction75" but i don't even know what that retailed for, lmao.Greater than $450. I'd assume this will at least be a $700 board. If not more.
Regarding pricing, since many people are commenting about it.That was your 69th post.
I do not have an estimate as of right now for how much this board will cost. I will do my best to keep the price under $1000, but I can't promise anything do to the complexity of the 3d printed piece.
Lol. Pretty sure he meant closer to $990.Regarding pricing, since many people are commenting about it.That was your 69th post.
I do not have an estimate as of right now for how much this board will cost. I will do my best to keep the price under $1000, but I can't promise anything do to the complexity of the 3d printed piece.
$690 looks like a good best-case target to strive for.
Will this be limited? I'd hope for a non-limited GB, let the higher volume drive price down, even if only slightly.
Also: If the 3D sintered metal doesn't end up working out, maybe we could opt for something non-metallic? I'd be down with that.
That was your 69th post.
$690 looks like a good best-case target to strive for.
Will this be limited? I'd hope for a non-limited GB, let the higher volume drive price down, even if only slightly.
Also: If the 3D sintered metal doesn't end up working out, maybe we could opt for something non-metallic? I'd be down with that.
This is my first board, and while unlimited GB sounds fantastic in regards to pricing, I would rather keep the production run small that I can feasibly QC each individual board.
As an alternative to the generative baseplate, having a generative design elsewhere in the board (side profile/back accent, weight emblem, etc.) would also be cool. That said I think if you **** for the moon you'd still probably fill your slots, I'd just be jealous.
I'd be surprised if that plate doesn't snap on someone and they can't replace it because integrated.
Colors: What you see is what you get, as this is my first keyboard I'd prefer to have one option for simplicity's sake
Excited to see people buy into this and then realize none of their keysets work on it
Excited to see people buy into this and then realize none of their keysets work on it
this is all a scheme to make people buy $50 40s kits they don't need for 1 key
don't buy into the 40% propaganda
enlist in the non 40 army today
Excited to see people buy into this and then realize none of their keysets work on it
What's the name of the keycap set on this?Show Image(https://imgur.com/mdC2hQU.png)
Colors: What you see is what you get, as this is my first keyboard I'd prefer to have one option for simplicity's sake
Based on the renders, it looks like all the cases and bottom pieces are the same colors, but the rotary joysticks seem to have different color options. Will the rotary joysticks have different options for colors, and if so could we purchase multiple to have options for keysets?
Excited to see people buy into this and then realize none of their keysets work on it
this is all a scheme to make people buy $50 40s kits they don't need for 1 key
don't buy into the 40% propaganda
enlist in the non 40 army today
Certainly a new design and I like the bottom of the KB. Please consider ISO in your PCB and Plate.
The uniqueness of this is incredible.
That being said, I'm very interested in the plate strength overall.
Example #1:Show Image(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/642426539824119849/674661848091721728/image0.png)Show Image(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/642426539824119849/674661665337507840/image0.jpg)
Forgive the ignorance but I'm new to the term 'generative design'. However, in ML, we reference generative/evolutionary algorithms. Was the base designed using an algorithm? Looks wild.
Excited to see people buy into this and then realize none of their keysets work on it
I’ve looked at this board multiple times is there something I’m not seeing?? :eek:
Also, I'm not sure if many people have experience with 7075 in structural applications such as this (aka: Not just a big ol' block)
As someone who has:
The stuff is hella strong and durable compared to regular 6061, and not even really comparable to some of the softer cast alloys.
Forgive the ignorance but I'm new to the term 'generative design'. However, in ML, we reference generative/evolutionary algorithms. Was the base designed using an algorithm? Looks wild.
Yeah, you usually put in some required parameters, and then let it randomly generate the structure. In this case I'm assuming there's a specific area, specific density, maybe even material strength equation, some branching limitation, etc. Then you just let it go to town.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generative_design
This is gonna be my first group buy board purchase.Haha. It's def a way to start with a bang. I went way cheaper with mine. Lol.
Excited to see people buy into this and then realize none of their keysets work on it
I’ve looked at this board multiple times is there something I’m not seeing?? :eek:
I suggested tweaking the layout to use 2u left shift. More sets are starting to include 2u shift in base kits, like GMK Mizu, GMK Fuyu GMK Darling and GMK Future Funk to name a few. The layout will change the stagger and you may need to get used to the layout, though it may be for everyone, but at least it can help to solve the compatibility issue. It would be nice too if the pcb could accept both layouts so you can choose to go with 2u left shift or 1.5u right shift, but I imagine that would add more work to the pcb designer and complicate the plate design, increasing the overall cost.
Excited to see people buy into this and then realize none of their keysets work on it
I’ve looked at this board multiple times is there something I’m not seeing?? :eek:
The layout uses 1.5u key for shift. There are hardly any sets that have 1.5u shift key. You either have to use other 1.5u r4 keys like control, alt or manu, or 1.5u novelties. I personally am not a fan of using keys in place of spots that are not intended for them. Novelties are fine, some sets comes with 1.5u novelties in their base kit like gmk olive, and some sets don't offer novelties, not even as kits.
I suggested tweaking the layout to use 2u left shift. More sets are starting to include 2u shift in base kits, like GMK Mizu, GMK Fuyu GMK Darling and GMK Future Funk to name a few. The layout will change the stagger and you may need to get used to the layout, though it may be for everyone, but at least it can help to solve the compatibility issue. It would be nice too if the pcb could accept both layouts so you can choose to go with 2u left shift or 1.5u right shift, but I imagine that would add more work to the pcb designer and complicate the plate design, increasing the overall cost.
Yeah you're right, now that you mentioned it, the integrated plate is quite unique. I didn't notice that the plate was designed with flex cuts. It can have wider holes, but due to the design of the plate, that would compromise the rigidity of the plate. The plate actually reminded me of the carbon fiber 60% plate on kbdfans.Excited to see people buy into this and then realize none of their keysets work on it
I’ve looked at this board multiple times is there something I’m not seeing?? :eek:
The layout uses 1.5u key for shift. There are hardly any sets that have 1.5u shift key. You either have to use other 1.5u r4 keys like control, alt or manu, or 1.5u novelties. I personally am not a fan of using keys in place of spots that are not intended for them. Novelties are fine, some sets comes with 1.5u novelties in their base kit like gmk olive, and some sets don't offer novelties, not even as kits.
I suggested tweaking the layout to use 2u left shift. More sets are starting to include 2u shift in base kits, like GMK Mizu, GMK Fuyu GMK Darling and GMK Future Funk to name a few. The layout will change the stagger and you may need to get used to the layout, though it may be for everyone, but at least it can help to solve the compatibility issue. It would be nice too if the pcb could accept both layouts so you can choose to go with 2u left shift or 1.5u right shift, but I imagine that would add more work to the pcb designer and complicate the plate design, increasing the overall cost.
The issue with doing that is that the plate is integrated and layout is fixed. If he were to allow you to use a smaller left shift, all the alphas would need to stagger and I'm not sure how that work considering the design/cut of that integrated plate.
1. Can you define the order in which the plate is "solved" by the generative algorithm? For example, optimize alphanumeric to design spec then modifiers then arrow keys. Wont fix your problem but might move it to someplace no one really cares about.
2. Is the plate uniform thickness? Can the generative algorithm take your 2d planar constraint around each switch and optimize its depth to add (or remove) stiffness? If you do the metal sintering process for the plate I would imagine it would still be manufacturable.
I'll think on it a bit more but figured I'd get a conversation started earlier than later.
It's kinda funny that people are complaining about the 1.5u shift. If you have ever owned a 40% you would understand it is not a big deal. And changing the stagger is a big no-no.
Does 1.5u Shift even exist? Checked all my recent sets and found nothing.
It's kinda funny that people are complaining about the 1.5u shift. If you have ever owned a 40% you would understand it is not a big deal. And changing the stagger is a big no-no.
It's a genuine concern for many who are into 75% boards but not own 40% boards/caps, though I agree that layout changes sacrificing 'correct' alpha stagger isn't the way to go about it.
Perhaps a 1.5u Rama artisan to go along with this keyboard could make everyone happy.
How does the arrow, f-row, and nav column displacement compare with the alphas?
Have you run the process on a smaller layout to lower the load conditions to help minimize the complexity of the plate?
For the keys with displacement significantly different from the average ((Q, A, Z, }], "', ?/ )) - is the displacement much more, or much less than average? I'm assuming the former, but I've been surprised before. I wonder if allowing the generative algo to adjust the thickness of the segments of "plate" around the edge of the alpha cluster would have an impact. You could almost certainly constrain the variable to not interfere with the switch, and keep it within the clearance between plate and pcb, and any CNC that can cut the existing shape shouldn't have trouble with a thickness gradient on the "plate".
For the keys with displacement significantly different from the average ((Q, A, Z, }], "', ?/ )) - is the displacement much more, or much less than average? I'm assuming the former, but I've been surprised before. I wonder if allowing the generative algo to adjust the thickness of the segments of "plate" around the edge of the alpha cluster would have an impact. You could almost certainly constrain the variable to not interfere with the switch, and keep it within the clearance between plate and pcb, and any CNC that can cut the existing shape shouldn't have trouble with a thickness gradient on the "plate".
It's much more. I've been talking about this with a few people and I think it's a flaw in generative setup. Since the goal is weight minimization, the algorithm prefers to not bridge the gap to the mods, creating a slighly more stressed ((Q, A, Z, }], "', ?/ )). I have a few fixes in mind for this prior to messing with varying thickness.
For the keys with displacement significantly different from the average ((Q, A, Z, }], "', ?/ )) - is the displacement much more, or much less than average? I'm assuming the former, but I've been surprised before. I wonder if allowing the generative algo to adjust the thickness of the segments of "plate" around the edge of the alpha cluster would have an impact. You could almost certainly constrain the variable to not interfere with the switch, and keep it within the clearance between plate and pcb, and any CNC that can cut the existing shape shouldn't have trouble with a thickness gradient on the "plate".
It's much more. I've been talking about this with a few people and I think it's a flaw in generative setup. Since the goal is weight minimization, the algorithm prefers to not bridge the gap to the mods, creating a slighly more stressed ((Q, A, Z, }], "', ?/ )). I have a few fixes in mind for this prior to messing with varying thickness.
For the keys with displacement significantly different from the average ((Q, A, Z, }], "', ?/ )) - is the displacement much more, or much less than average? I'm assuming the former, but I've been surprised before. I wonder if allowing the generative algo to adjust the thickness of the segments of "plate" around the edge of the alpha cluster would have an impact. You could almost certainly constrain the variable to not interfere with the switch, and keep it within the clearance between plate and pcb, and any CNC that can cut the existing shape shouldn't have trouble with a thickness gradient on the "plate".
It's much more. I've been talking about this with a few people and I think it's a flaw in generative setup. Since the goal is weight minimization, the algorithm prefers to not bridge the gap to the mods, creating a slighly more stressed ((Q, A, Z, }], "', ?/ )). I have a few fixes in mind for this prior to messing with varying thickness.
I'm not familiar how this works. I thought your primary goal was uniform displacement in all 150+ load cases with weight optimization as a secondary pass to force a simple design.
It seems like you are saying weight savings are prioritized higher than uniform deflection?
Loving the Voronoi-is base on this board. Can we get some more detailed shot of that piece? Maybe like an exploded axon of the whole thing?
This is so cool. A little bummed that there’s only the one colorway, but I totally get it. Any chance of a r2 in a different color in the future? I’d kill for one of these in black
This is so cool. A little bummed that there’s only the one colorway, but I totally get it. Any chance of a r2 in a different color in the future? I’d kill for one of these in black
MetallicCharles showed me some renders of an all black Evolv earlier today. It was so amazing I'm considering adding it as a color option, would just be a shame if it never saw the light of day.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200208/d7bcdabbfe21b8717c20011f1a35ad5b.jpg) Black EvolvThis is so cool. A little bummed that there’s only the one colorway, but I totally get it. Any chance of a r2 in a different color in the future? I’d kill for one of these in black
MetallicCharles showed me some renders of an all black Evolv earlier today. It was so amazing I'm considering adding it as a color option, would just be a shame if it never saw the light of day.
This is dope. Will it be a limited gb?
Definitely following, probably not have enough cash for that. But I am on the lookout for that endgame 75%... Will it be Satisfaction75 Round 2, or will I... Evolve?
It's interesting, for sure. And I'd like to feel the typing experience with that plate. But I can't get over how bad the plate looks from above. Being able to see all the random spaces and gaps down below is enough to turn me off of the design.
It's interesting, for sure. And I'd like to feel the typing experience with that plate. But I can't get over how bad the plate looks from above. Being able to see all the random spaces and gaps down below is enough to turn me off of the design.
That just means we’re gonna need a really pretty PCB ;)
Will there be a limited amount for the keyboard? I hope not; I miss GB within minutes :(
Not sure if this has been answered before, but since the design's goal is to achieve flex uniformity, did the design process take the pcb flex in mind? I would think the pcb would flex more in the center rather on the sides, no?
An absolute beautiful looker.
I personally like Janglad's render concept the most. The white board in combination with the metallic gold bottom peace looks stunning. (I in general think that the metallic look will fit the board the most, but thats just personal preference.)
Definitely interested. Keep it up!
I agree with you, Janglad's version of the bottom piece is quite stunning. However, from speaking to manus, I don't think such a finish will be possible. MetallicCharles' version represents what the board will most likely look like during GB.
I agree with you, Janglad's version of the bottom piece is quite stunning. However, from speaking to manus, I don't think such a finish will be possible. MetallicCharles' version represents what the board will most likely look like during GB.
Ah ok, thanks for the clarification. Do you have plans on maybe doing different bottom finishes? Like copper for example (which would go really well with lighter boards i think). Or is that not a possibility for now?
Best regards
I am considering running an all-black Evolv. Beyond that, I'm not considering other materials or finishes
Join discord to look at this beauty.Show Image(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200210/2142f902b10d0cab5e46d7dc271701b7.jpg)
Join discord to look at this beauty.Show Image(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200210/2142f902b10d0cab5e46d7dc271701b7.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I have a question about simulated load (2N).
In a real situation, I think the load won't be only in the orthogonal axis.
I think there will be Shear stress.
How about shear stress?
when there is shear stress, all the flex will be uniformed?
curious about that
Join discord to look at this beauty.Show Image(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200210/2142f902b10d0cab5e46d7dc271701b7.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Woooww, that looks amazing. You would be lucky to get your hands on something that sick looking, it oozes some dark alien vibes.. If there is a black variant, I will definitely sign up for the raffle
Any ideas on the price yet?
What's your discord?
Design nerd here, I have to ask - what software did you use to design this?
Its integrated plate, one side of the switch will always be stiffer when we are talking about a switch near the edge like left control or caps. The alphas look uniform enough but why not just make a half plate with just the bottom row and top row having the integrated plate so that the pcb still has something to be mounted onto with switches. Your simulations are doing one keystroke at a time rather than multiple subsequent (sometimes concurrent) strokes within a short time period of each other. People also dont always hit the center of the keycap/switch directly at a perfect 90 degrees. Some people type heavily and others light. The simulations work only in a theoretical setting and arent really practical. A partial plate will provide as much consistency in typing feel without having to worry about whether or not those switch cutouts will break or bend.
Overall I think the plate is over engineered and you could've taken a much simpler, cost effective approach if you wanted to achieve uniformity.
- go observe your fingers resting on keycaps in typing form. It is not a perfect 90 deg. My argument is that its not a single point like your simulations use but rather an entire area that may or may not exert its force evenly. You can't assume a perfect force and say it transitions to a practical scenario.Its integrated plate, one side of the switch will always be stiffer when we are talking about a switch near the edge like left control or caps. The alphas look uniform enough but why not just make a half plate with just the bottom row and top row having the integrated plate so that the pcb still has something to be mounted onto with switches. Your simulations are doing one keystroke at a time rather than multiple subsequent (sometimes concurrent) strokes within a short time period of each other. People also dont always hit the center of the keycap/switch directly at a perfect 90 degrees. Some people type heavily and others light. The simulations work only in a theoretical setting and arent really practical. A partial plate will provide as much consistency in typing feel without having to worry about whether or not those switch cutouts will break or bend.Let's go through this bit by bit. Much like with Iron165, all engineering was done for the worst-case scenario of 2N or 200g force if you want to compare it to spring weights. From speaking with those who have typed on a 165 FE, this worst-case engineering process works for creating a more consistent typing experience, even if it doesn't represent the average user. Next, in terms of forces being not normal to the plate, I invite you to try and type off-angle right now. Likely, your finger just slipped over the key as switches are constrained to follow a normal path to the plate. If any sideways forces exist, they are due to friction between your skin and the keycap, a force so minimal it isn't worth time approximating. Finally, to address the one keycap at a time simulations: the fastest typists on here are at 200 wpm or so? With an average word length of 5 letters, that's 1000 letters a minute or 16.6 letters a second. If we generously round up, that means you depress a key every 1/20th of a second. Under a 2N load, the spring rate of aluminum is considerably faster than that.
Overall I think the plate is over engineered and you could've taken a much simpler, cost effective approach if you wanted to achieve uniformity.
- go observe your fingers resting on keycaps in typing form. It is not a perfect 90 deg. My argument is that its not a single point like your simulations use but rather an entire area that may or may not exert its force evenly. You can't assume a perfect force and say it transitions to a practical scenario.Its integrated plate, one side of the switch will always be stiffer when we are talking about a switch near the edge like left control or caps. The alphas look uniform enough but why not just make a half plate with just the bottom row and top row having the integrated plate so that the pcb still has something to be mounted onto with switches. Your simulations are doing one keystroke at a time rather than multiple subsequent (sometimes concurrent) strokes within a short time period of each other. People also dont always hit the center of the keycap/switch directly at a perfect 90 degrees. Some people type heavily and others light. The simulations work only in a theoretical setting and arent really practical. A partial plate will provide as much consistency in typing feel without having to worry about whether or not those switch cutouts will break or bend.Let's go through this bit by bit. Much like with Iron165, all engineering was done for the worst-case scenario of 2N or 200g force if you want to compare it to spring weights. From speaking with those who have typed on a 165 FE, this worst-case engineering process works for creating a more consistent typing experience, even if it doesn't represent the average user. Next, in terms of forces being not normal to the plate, I invite you to try and type off-angle right now. Likely, your finger just slipped over the key as switches are constrained to follow a normal path to the plate. If any sideways forces exist, they are due to friction between your skin and the keycap, a force so minimal it isn't worth time approximating. Finally, to address the one keycap at a time simulations: the fastest typists on here are at 200 wpm or so? With an average word length of 5 letters, that's 1000 letters a minute or 16.6 letters a second. If we generously round up, that means you depress a key every 1/20th of a second. Under a 2N load, the spring rate of aluminum is considerably faster than that.
Overall I think the plate is over engineered and you could've taken a much simpler, cost effective approach if you wanted to achieve uniformity.
- 200g is way more than what is necessary to actuate a switch. Just look at the most popular spring weights which usually fall in the lower to mid 60g weighting. Lets take the point above and assume that your 90 deg theoretical typing pressure completely applies to practical typing. You can make the plate consistent for 200g, but 200g is not anywhere close to how much force is applied per keystroke. Most people bottom out their switches whether harshly or lightly. Even with people who harshly bottom out, they might increase the spring weight to the upper 70s at most. Some outliers love weights above the 70s. Those are still obscure cases since the 70-89g range is still uncommon in most custom boards relative to 50-69g range. So you are basically adjusting the feel of the board for the .001% of people who might actually constantly type with 200g of force at a reasonable WPM. Consistency != flex. Your plate can be consistently stiff and still be consistent.
- Your simulations don't even account for a pcb. This means that even if we assume your hypothetical force simulation to be a 1-1 replica of real typing, it would still be inaccurate. You aren't accounting for the fr4 pcb that will go beneath the aluminum plate and whatever thickness that you choose for it.
Sometimes consistency shouldnt always the goal, and its seriously become a fad nowadays. Perfect consistency in keyboards is extremely hard to achieve and sometimes impossible with a given mount: Your F row, arrow cluster and nav cluster won't be consistent feel wise with your alphas or mods, its just a facet of many mounting styles and how you implement flex cuts. What matters is if the board provide a comfortable typing experience on the alphas and mods where typing is most frequent. I think you are going a bit overboard with the science and not looking into the practicality of things.
- go observe your fingers resting on keycaps in typing form. It is not a perfect 90 deg. My argument is that its not a single point like your simulations use but rather an entire area that may or may not exert its force evenly. You can't assume a perfect force and say it transitions to a practical scenario.Its integrated plate, one side of the switch will always be stiffer when we are talking about a switch near the edge like left control or caps. The alphas look uniform enough but why not just make a half plate with just the bottom row and top row having the integrated plate so that the pcb still has something to be mounted onto with switches. Your simulations are doing one keystroke at a time rather than multiple subsequent (sometimes concurrent) strokes within a short time period of each other. People also dont always hit the center of the keycap/switch directly at a perfect 90 degrees. Some people type heavily and others light. The simulations work only in a theoretical setting and arent really practical. A partial plate will provide as much consistency in typing feel without having to worry about whether or not those switch cutouts will break or bend.Let's go through this bit by bit. Much like with Iron165, all engineering was done for the worst-case scenario of 2N or 200g force if you want to compare it to spring weights. From speaking with those who have typed on a 165 FE, this worst-case engineering process works for creating a more consistent typing experience, even if it doesn't represent the average user. Next, in terms of forces being not normal to the plate, I invite you to try and type off-angle right now. Likely, your finger just slipped over the key as switches are constrained to follow a normal path to the plate. If any sideways forces exist, they are due to friction between your skin and the keycap, a force so minimal it isn't worth time approximating. Finally, to address the one keycap at a time simulations: the fastest typists on here are at 200 wpm or so? With an average word length of 5 letters, that's 1000 letters a minute or 16.6 letters a second. If we generously round up, that means you depress a key every 1/20th of a second. Under a 2N load, the spring rate of aluminum is considerably faster than that.
Overall I think the plate is over engineered and you could've taken a much simpler, cost effective approach if you wanted to achieve uniformity.
- 200g is way more than what is necessary to actuate a switch. Just look at the most popular spring weights which usually fall in the lower to mid 60g weighting. Lets take the point above and assume that your 90 deg theoretical typing pressure completely applies to practical typing. You can make the plate consistent for 200g, but 200g is not anywhere close to how much force is applied per keystroke. Most people bottom out their switches whether harshly or lightly. Even with people who harshly bottom out, they might increase the spring weight to the upper 70s at most. Some outliers love weights above the 70s. Those are still obscure cases since the 70-89g range is still uncommon in most custom boards relative to 50-69g range. So you are basically adjusting the feel of the board for the .001% of people who might actually constantly type with 200g of force at a reasonable WPM. Consistency != flex. Your plate can be consistently stiff and still be consistent.
- Your simulations don't even account for a pcb. This means that even if we assume your hypothetical force simulation to be a 1-1 replica of real typing, it would still be inaccurate. You aren't accounting for the fr4 pcb that will go beneath the aluminum plate and whatever thickness that you choose for it.
Sometimes consistency shouldnt always the goal, and its seriously become a fad nowadays. Perfect consistency in keyboards is extremely hard to achieve and sometimes impossible with a given mount: Your F row, arrow cluster and nav cluster won't be consistent feel wise with your alphas or mods, its just a facet of many mounting styles and how you implement flex cuts. What matters is if the board provide a comfortable typing experience on the alphas and mods where typing is most frequent. I think you are going a bit overboard with the science and not looking into the practicality of things.
- Your force is still off for keys like mods and some alphas that don't have mounting/connections on all sides. Take for example the popular 3-sided space bar on OTD boards and now plenty modern boards. The flex while pressing down on the spacebar is relatively even on the top, left and right side of the spacebar switch. The bottom side of the spacebar has no mounting, it flexes considerably more than the rest. if you don't press down on the bottom side of the spacebar you wont really notice it as much. Take your left control or shift for example. They are connected via the bottom side of the switch to the plate structure/left control respectively. If I disproportionately place more force on the top side of that left shift, it will bend/flex more than if I put the same amount of force on the bottom side. Keycaps help distribute force on the switch, that doesn't mean that they perfectly spread out force. Your constraint when it comes to weighting is wrong.
Okay, let's do this one more time.
- My simulations aren't a single point, they're force over area, with that area being the switch contact surface on the plate. With the way keycaps are designed and the way the switch physically works, the difference between pushing on the left side of the cap vs the right side of the cap is negligible when it comes to the force distribution over that area.
- 2N was an experimentally determined upper-boundary during the iron165 IC. The great thing about working with non-elastic materials (like metals) is that if flex is consistent at 2N, it's also consistent at all loads less than that.
- They do account for a PCB. You're just wrong there.
- I've never pretended I want the F-row, columns, and arrows to flex as much as the alphas flex. In fact, I'm doing exactly what you're suggesting: which is prioritizing the feel of the alphas and mods. That's the reason why there are no crazy cutouts in that section of the plate. I'm going overboard with the science to show that not only is this analysis possible in keyboards but that it has practical benefits to an end-user.
- Your force is still off for keys like mods and some alphas that don't have mounting/connections on all sides. Take for example the popular 3-sided space bar on OTD boards and now plenty modern boards. The flex while pressing down on the spacebar is relatively even on the top, left and right side of the spacebar switch. The bottom side of the spacebar has no mounting, it flexes considerably more than the rest. if you don't press down on the bottom side of the spacebar you wont really notice it as much. Take your left control or shift for example. They are connected via the bottom side of the switch to the plate structure/left control respectively. If I disproportionately place more force on the top side of that left shift, it will bend/flex more than if I put the same amount of force on the bottom side. Keycaps help distribute force on the switch, that doesn't mean that they perfectly spread out force. Your constraint when it comes to weighting is wrong.
Okay, let's do this one more time.
- My simulations aren't a single point, they're force over area, with that area being the switch contact surface on the plate. With the way keycaps are designed and the way the switch physically works, the difference between pushing on the left side of the cap vs the right side of the cap is negligible when it comes to the force distribution over that area.
- 2N was an experimentally determined upper-boundary during the iron165 IC. The great thing about working with non-elastic materials (like metals) is that if flex is consistent at 2N, it's also consistent at all loads less than that.
- They do account for a PCB. You're just wrong there.
- I've never pretended I want the F-row, columns, and arrows to flex as much as the alphas flex. In fact, I'm doing exactly what you're suggesting: which is prioritizing the feel of the alphas and mods. That's the reason why there are no crazy cutouts in that section of the plate. I'm going overboard with the science to show that not only is this analysis possible in keyboards but that it has practical benefits to an end-user.
- Consistency doesn't guarantee flexibility. As stated in my example above it could be guaranteed in your simulation but maybe not in a practical setting. Your QAZ column is also stiffer than the rest of the alphas because there are two connections between Q and the much stiffer numrow compared to how the rest of the switches in the qwerty row are.
- I assumed not because your simulations don't show a picture of the pcb nor do you mention that you did test with a pcb. When you say you made a visual representation of a test, then everything you tested should be present in that visualization. There is only a plate in those visualizations. You don't even make a mention of a pcb in the plate design section.
- Its great to go overboard with science when the approach is right. I disagree with your approach with this board.
Even though I questioned about the shear stress and Nathan replied, the discussion about orthogonal force simulation won't be over. This should be described in the first post.I do tech support for a company that makes instruments to measure fluid properties, mostly viscosity.
The guy wants you to present in the conference-style I think. How surprised it is. I never saw a question like that in my conference experience. Or the first post should be described in a paper-style? with a proper reference?
As a mechanical engineering graduate, as a student in a master's program, the discussion made me sad. That guy didn't even know how the stress made deformation in a specific material.
Interested in how the prototype actually comes out though.
Its a cool idea but idk why you are trying to get consistent feel when the plate displacement is less than 0.2mm. Im also worried about the left and right shifts pinging cuz its basically a cantilever, but i assume the plate material is stiff enough to prevent that :S Either way gl with your research!
With the amount of interest this board is generating, I doubt I’ll get a slot. Apart from that, discussion in discord is implying big bucks. So I have to ask: will a round 2 be considered? Thanks!
Is this board going to be run via normal GB or is it going to be a raffle? thx
Raffle.... Well there goes my chance of getting one. Really cool board though.
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I'm still considering whether or not to have a limited amount of boards reserved for a Vickery auction after the raffle spots deliver. So not all hope is gone :p
Is there a list of kits that give us a 1.5u shift?Very very few.
What’s the knob material again?
I would definitely go in on an all black.
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Any chance the knob 3D file would be available for us to play with? It could be interesting to see people customize the knob in different ways.What’s the knob material again?
I would definitely go in on an all black.
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As of right now knob is alu
Any chance the knob 3D file would be available for us to play with? It could be interesting to see people customize the knob in different ways.What’s the knob material again?
I would definitely go in on an all black.
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As of right now, the knob is alu
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Every day I pray that I get a spot in this raffle. Pleaaaaase do that all black version you teased earlier.Any chance the knob 3D file would be available for us to play with? It could be interesting to see people customize the knob in different ways.What’s the knob material again?
I would definitely go in on an all black.
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As of right now, the knob is alu
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Yes! In fact, I have some extra special plans for the spot.
I joined geekhack today because this is the first keyboard I've actually wanted badly enough to join the community.
I keep going back to this post because I find this case to be very interesting. However, I feel like there will be a lot of durability issues or even the easiness of cleaning the board.
I keep going back to this post because I find this case to be very interesting. However, I feel like there will be a lot of durability issues or even the easiness of cleaning the board.
I mean, I'm assuming it's going to be around Infinitum price for sure.Not the maker, so cant say for sure, but id expect to add at least $400 to that price point.
I mean, I'm assuming it's going to be around Infinitum price for sure.Not the maker, so cant say for sure, but id expect to add at least $400 to that price point.
I mean, I'm assuming it's going to be around Infinitum price for sure.probably not, I've heard estimates for this around the $1k range. but for what it's worth, the tech being used to manu this board actually costs that much, and that is reflected in the price for this board
Yeah. If anything it'll be well over the 1K mark when all is said and done. It's nice to dream, but manufacturing of designs like this ain't cheap.I mean, I'm assuming it's going to be around Infinitum price for sure.probably not, I've heard estimates for this around the $1k range. but for what it's worth, the tech being used to manu this board actually costs that much, and that is reflected in the price for this board
I’m new to all this so would someone explain or point me in the right direction on how this “Buy” is likely to work? What’s a vickery auction? How do these raffles work? No group buy for this? What’s the best way to stay in the loop on how to get this board? It’s the only board that’s really calling my name so I’d like to get in on this as I’ve made some real progress with work this year and I want to reward myself.
Yeah. If anything it'll be well over the 1K mark when all is said and done. It's nice to dream, but manufacturing of designs like this ain't cheap.I mean, I'm assuming it's going to be around Infinitum price for sure.probably not, I've heard estimates for this around the $1k range. but for what it's worth, the tech being used to manu this board actually costs that much, and that is reflected in the price for this board
Damn! I mean for such a long time I can decide to bring out my money. But! So sad to hear you will run the raffle, why not public GB? You can pick out some special color/change for the raffle, but I know many people want public GB...really sad
The raffle is a public GB. Anyone can join the raffle with equal chances of winning. However, since this is my first board, an unlimited GB would simply be much too insane for me to handle, hence why I'm choosing to raffle the limited amount of spots.
The raffle is a public GB. Anyone can join the raffle with equal chances of winning. However, since this is my first board, an unlimited GB would simply be much too insane for me to handle, hence why I'm choosing to raffle the limited amount of spots.
I also feel the "raffle" style GB is the best and fair solution, for both sides.
The design is insane :)
Gool luck to everyone! and big THANKS for NathanAlphaMan for bringing such cool designs! :thumb:
Very cool design. But I doubt the bottom will look like in the renderings. Laser sintered parts are very stripy. you can polish them but there is no chance to reach those inside areas.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/imaterialise/sets/72157625860613542
Very cool design. But I doubt the bottom will look like in the renderings. Laser sintered parts are very stripy. you can polish them but there is no chance to reach those inside areas.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/imaterialise/sets/72157625860613542
Quite worried about the plate. I & many hate integrated plate, the sound and typing experience is terrible.
Would love to see a Silver+Grey color combination.
Does it come with a hot-swappable option?
Hi everyone,
Small update, the prototype has just finished production and will be shipping to me from the factory soon. Once it arrives, I'll take some time to evaluate and then write an update post regarding my next steps in this project. Just want to thank everyone for the support so far, this project has been a fantastic ride so far, and I can't wait to see it to completion.
- Nathan
I was curious about the raffle because this will by my first one. I'm assuming we will be paying to enter the raffle or is that free? If so, how much is it to enter the raffle?
I was curious about the raffle because this will by my first one. I'm assuming we will be paying to enter the raffle or is that free? If so, how much is it to enter the raffle?
This is up to the runner, but raffles are usually free to enter. However, I will say that since this keyboard is likely going to be very expensive (even by custom keyboard standards), it's only fair that people enter only if they actually want one and are willing to pay for it if they get drawn.
Hi everyone,
Small update, the prototype has just finished production and will be shipping to me from the factory soon. Once it arrives, I'll take some time to evaluate and then write an update post regarding my next steps in this project. Just want to thank everyone for the support so far, this project has been a fantastic ride so far, and I can't wait to see it to completion.
- Nathan
I was curious about the raffle because this will by my first one. I'm assuming we will be paying to enter the raffle or is that free? If so, how much is it to enter the raffle?
This is up to the runner, but raffles are usually free to enter. However, I will say that since this keyboard is likely going to be very expensive (even by custom keyboard standards), it's only fair that people enter only if they actually want one and are willing to pay for it if they get drawn.
Yep, raffle will be free to enter. Constantine makes a good point as well, please only enter if you're prepared to pay for the keyboard, as failure to pay will lower your odds in future raffles.
Given the complexity and the intricacies involved in making such a beautiful piece of art I am hoping there will be a QC check to match. This might result in a few B-stock pieces to be released later for the unlucky souls who weren’t picked for the A-stock raffle.
Thank you for bringing this into my life Nathan :-*
I would also be down for a Vickrey auction for original "A-stock" kits if there are any remaining after the raffle. This is a beautiful design, and I would love to get one of these boards!
Do let me know if it is going to be a Vickrey Auction for the B-stock, and I will do the same for my left kidney two weeks beforehand :(
will the top portion be made in the same fashion as the base?
Looks stunning, hope I can get in on this.
One thing that i see as a possibility when it comes to the design of multiple plate is that you can use the same constraints and general method but play around with which parts that you don't want the software to change. The downside to this of course is that you would have to make different programs to run on the CNC machine. But i guess this price is minimized if you were to use another type of mounting than an integrated plate.
The keyboard looks absolutely amazing and i love the design and the concept behind it.
One thing that i see as a possibility when it comes to the design of multiple plate is that you can use the same constraints and general method but play around with which parts that you don't want the software to change. The downside to this of course is that you would have to make different programs to run on the CNC machine. But i guess this price is minimized if you were to use another type of mounting than an integrated plate.
The keyboard looks absolutely amazing and i love the design and the concept behind it.
Not a direct response to your comment, but with the help of a few others, I've managed to get good results on plates with multiple layout options. While it needs physical testing, the current version of the Evolv model has support for stepped caps and split backspace.
Glad to see split Backspace support on this. Keep up the good work!
I'd be very interested in 3x 1.25u keys on the bottom left instead of 1.5, 1, 1.5. A 1.25
Not going to open an official poll or anything, but what other potential layouts would people be interested in seeing?
1) I've considered split space bars as a potential layout addition, but have received mixed reviews from people I've shown it too:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/hPOJ9Ri.png)
2) ISO is unlikely to happen, I've been working on it, but the geometry of the key is pretty complicated to incorporate with the constraints I have.
3) Despite that, would there still be interest in a split right shift?
I'd be very interested in 3x 1.25u keys on the bottom left instead of 1.5, 1, 1.5. A 1.25 or 1u shift on the right would be interesting too, although I appreciate that it makes for uneven spacing between the shift and arrow block.
Stepped caps is solid gold for me. Thank you! That split space option would also be very interesting for me since it would let me run three keys on the right of the space bar.
I'd be very interested in 3x 1.25u keys on the bottom left instead of 1.5, 1, 1.5. A 1.25
Agree and i like the split space bars
Not going to open an official poll or anything, but what other potential layouts would people be interested in seeing?
1) I've considered split space bars as a potential layout addition, but have received mixed reviews from people I've shown it too:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/hPOJ9Ri.png)
2) ISO is unlikely to happen, I've been working on it, but the geometry of the key is pretty complicated to incorporate with the constraints I have.
3) Despite that, would there still be interest in a split right shift?
While I do like the layout of those spacebars, I'm a bit put off by the asymmetry between the left and right bottom mods. So it's a mixed review from me too.
As for #3, I'm assuming you mean split left shift. I like to use split LShift on ANSI boards, so it would be nice to have that as an option.
Not going to open an official poll or anything, but what other potential layouts would people be interested in seeing?
1) I've considered split space bars as a potential layout addition, but have received mixed reviews from people I've shown it too:
Not going to open an official poll or anything, but what other potential layouts would people be interested in seeing?
1) I've considered split space bars as a potential layout addition, but have received mixed reviews from people I've shown it too:
I prefer split space and this layout is fine with me - although there is an asymmetry, I use the mods around space bars a lot and the easier it is for my thumb to reach them the better. On the other hand a 1.25 mod between space bars (the way 6.25 space bar is often split) is useless to me, because it's very uncomfortable to reach it.
This is Amazing! I now can't decide if I should wait for this or get the 7V. Doing both would be awesome but a big hit on my wallet. Will definitely follow this tho. :)
This is Amazing! I now can't decide if I should wait for this or get the 7V. Doing both would be awesome but a big hit on my wallet. Will definitely follow this tho. :)
I'm also conflicted on whether to wait :( any loose estimate on when a GB will happen?
3x 1.25u keys won't happen, as there's no way to make the right side of the spacebar look good in that scenario. The asymmetry that results due to the split bars is the exact reason I've received mixed reviews from friends, so good to know that sentiment is echoed.
Two seconds after posting I’ve realised that 3x1.25u on the left is 0.25u narrower than your layout, so indeed it doesn’t work, sorry.
Two seconds after posting I’ve realised that 3x1.25u on the left is 0.25u narrower than your layout, so indeed it doesn’t work, sorry.
I feel like the layout choices you’ve made will definitely suit a set of people, while also isolating a different set. It’s a stylistic choice and I completely respect it, it just isn’t for me. Damn I hope this board goes well though! It’s so close to an ideal layout for me, and I love the trellis framing.
Thanks for your time and effort!
Two seconds after posting I’ve realised that 3x1.25u on the left is 0.25u narrower than your layout, so indeed it doesn’t work, sorry.
This. Honestly I think most people who are used to 3×1.25u won't mind 1.5u–1u–1.5u much.
Huge fan of s75 layout and this emits the same wavelength for sure. Crazy how good home pgup pgdown end look on your renders. I always wanted such layout on a custom.GMK Umbra does not have a 1.5u shift key.
Am I correct that the base kit of GMK Umbra doesn't contain the proper right shift? Would love to see a render of a black + raw with that keycap set.
Thanks, I really appreciate the comprehensive response and the consideration behind your choices.
My issues are partially with having keycaps that can be used with this layout. I don’t really have any 1.5u mods, sadly, hence why this layout doesn’t really work for me, but that’s just me.
Still think it’s a cool board, but I’ll let others pick up this beauty :D
Good Afternoon Geekhack!One step closer
I'm excited to announce the prototype has arrived!
It will take a few days to do a writeup on what I feel about it and design changes to come (if any). "Professional" photos will go up with the write-up, only have my phone right now and ain't nobody wanna see potato pics. Do note, I don't have the proper equipment to record a sound-test, so TBD on what I will do with that. I also don't have the PCBs in hand yet, so I won't be able to do a full build until I get them.
Thank you again for all the support so far,
- Nathan
The first official photo is live as a teaser!Oh lawdShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/Wtj14TD.jpg)
More will go live with the writeup, but I couldn't hold myself back from posting a teaser :p
The first official photo is live as a teaser!Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Wtj14TD.jpg)
More will go live with the writeup, but I couldn't hold myself back from posting a teaser :p
Now run it over with a truck to prove us that it can support your claims :P
Will the grainy look of the 3D printed part be improved?
I guess it is hard to archieve the cleaness of the renders but this is far from it IMO
Nice tease. When do we get to see more?
The first official photo is live as a teaser!Very reminiscent of the Adidas Ultraboost 4Ds! Love it to death <3Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Wtj14TD.jpg)
More will go live with the writeup, but I couldn't hold myself back from posting a teaser
Yeah, I actually don't mind the graininess. I was afraid it might look like plastic 3D printing, with visible layers. This actually looks better than I had expected. I'm pretty stoked.
The first official photo is live as a teaser!Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Wtj14TD.jpg)
More will go live with the writeup, but I couldn't hold myself back from posting a teaser :p
The first official photo is live as a teaser!Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Wtj14TD.jpg)
More will go live with the writeup, but I couldn't hold myself back from posting a teaser :p
Yeah, DLMS (metal printing) is a fundamentally different process to what you think of when you think of plastic printing (FDM). In DMLS, aluminum powder is cured at high resolution by a laser, instead of being deposited by a print head.Well, Today I Learned. Pretty cool stuff. So what you're saying metal 3D printing is more like Pringles are to normal chips. You create the shape out of powdered metal.
Yeah, DLMS (metal printing) is a fundamentally different process to what you think of when you think of plastic printing (FDM). In DMLS, aluminum powder is cured at high resolution by a laser, instead of being deposited by a print head.Well, Today I Learned. Pretty cool stuff. So what you're saying metal 3D printing is more like Pringles are to normal chips. You create the shape out of powdered metal.
Wow that pic is a hell of a teaser!!! Good job with everything so far. I am looking forward to your write up and of course more pictures!! Oh one question, do we know the final color choices? Edit: I see the color poll outcome was black and gold. Is this final? Black and raw was my preferred choice. Gold is cool and all but we all know everybody likes raw ;)
Black and Gold! Any ideas roughly how much this might go for?
I'm excited. I think I'm definitely in for one, maybe even two if Black + Copper with a copper rotary joystick is an added as an option. On a different note, would this build style be possible without the metal-printed angled riser underneath, with 0* angle on the keyboard. I really like the pcb/keyboard layout and would love something similar with flip out feet for travel.
Have we run this over with a truck yet?
I was tossing up with buying the 7V or not, so glad I had a quick check here to see if there was any other 75% options coming out! This looks incredible, hopefully it all works and we get the GB soon!This GB will be raffled and would cost a lot more than the 7v.
I was tossing up with buying the 7V or not, so glad I had a quick check here to see if there was any other 75% options coming out! This looks incredible, hopefully it all works and we get the GB soon!This GB will be raffled and would cost a lot more than the 7v.
Sent from my SM-J415G using Tapatalk
I was tossing up with buying the 7V or not, so glad I had a quick check here to see if there was any other 75% options coming out! This looks incredible, hopefully it all works and we get the GB soon!This GB will be raffled and would cost a lot more than the 7v.
Sent from my SM-J415G using Tapatalk
What do you mean raffled?
I will definitely watch this very closely! (hopefully it won't be a raffle. RNG gods doesn't like me that much)
I will definitely watch this very closely! (hopefully it won't be a raffle. RNG gods doesn't like me that much)
Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/kMEdZ83.jpg)
I'm ecstatic with the changes. This board instantly went from "maybe if I have the cash" status, to "I gotta get one". Additionally, now that the base will be cast, does that mean an increase of the GB limit? Or maybe even an unlimited GB? I mean you have to spread out the cost of the molds, right? Right? :D
Interesting write-up! It was a thoughtful read and it looks like these changes are all for the better.
Regarding the bottom case now being produced via casting rather than 3d printing - do you think you will also consider running a larger group buy than initially discussed as a result of this change? This certainly seems like the right direction in terms of both accessibility and quality, and will pay off especially with a larger order. I'd like to get my hands on this board and I'm hoping it's not going to be as hard to get as it initially sounded.
EDIT: Also a follow-up question - will the bottom base possibly be available in new materials besides aluminum along with this process change? I'd imagine brass will be nice if you're still sticking to the color scheme.
You say the keeping the 1.5 right shift is to keep the right mods aligned with the arrows but the column to the right of it isn't aligned to anything kinda defeating the purpose, the right arrow as well is on its own little world. Above all the support for that specific key isn't really there.
... little surprise on page 2
This Looks Awesome!! I would love to see a render of a dark purple Evolv with GMK Bingsu
or a PC Evolv with GMK Botanical on it or Oooh a white Evolv with GMK Deep Navy :eek:
You may feel that hotswap is low quality. I do not. I consider hotswap a feature, not a detriment, and the lack of it is a negative strike on any proposed board in my opinion.I mean normally hotswap is low quality because it limits the possible layouts on a pcb. Might not be the case here, but that's why. It's def not a negative strike for any board that wants to offer multiple layouts.
On a layout not, 3 1u keys right of the space (ALT, FN, CTRL) are more practical than 2 1.5u keys, as this provides an excellent spot to put FN.
You may feel that hotswap is low quality. I do not. I consider hotswap a feature, not a detriment, and the lack of it is a negative strike on any proposed board in my opinion.I mean normally hotswap is low quality because it limits the possible layouts on a pcb. Might not be the case here, but that's why. It's def not a negative strike for any board that wants to offer multiple layouts.
On a layout not, 3 1u keys right of the space (ALT, FN, CTRL) are more practical than 2 1.5u keys, as this provides an excellent spot to put FN.
Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
No hotswap please, it brings more trouble than its worth. Don't let the crying newbs force you to compromise.
sick! I look forward to it! but still glad to see you pushing on with the high concept here.Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
I have plans for exactly this, but it won't be until after the Evolv GB completes
mmmm i'm gonna put ursa on this bad boy
Since ISO is now an option, I'm very interested!
Hot damn. This board isn't particularly my cup of tea, but after reading thru how much work OP has done, its definitely peaked my interests!
Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
I have plans for exactly this, but it won't be until after the Evolv GB completes
Also chiming in to say - I think the current production model is a bit too pricey for my wallet, but a scaled back version with a simpler base is hugely appealing to me (hotswap or no). I'll be the first on the list for that :)Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
I have plans for exactly this, but it won't be until after the Evolv GB completes
I've heard all of you loud and clear! You liked the more organic bottom of the first iteration compared to the bottom of this one, so I've spent some time reworking the base to try and return to the original aesthetic. Please do let me know what you guys think!Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/IO3K8Wn.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/xf8849h.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/hG0tU1I.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/GxeWoaR.png)
I've heard all of you loud and clear! You liked the more organic bottom of the first iteration compared to the bottom of this one, so I've spent some time reworking the base to try and return to the original aesthetic. Please do let me know what you guys think!Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/IO3K8Wn.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/xf8849h.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/hG0tU1I.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/GxeWoaR.png)
To iterate the thought about making it more organic looking, I think that looks great as a base and structurally sound, but I was hoping for more randomness? Maybe it's possible to add a few random strands just for aesthetics? That's just my uneducated idea (pretty sure that would bump machining costs). Hyped for this board.
*Edit something I thought of, most of those strands are going in one directional axis, maybe some horizontal ones would help make it look more organic
I've heard all of you loud and clear! You liked the more organic bottom of the first iteration compared to the bottom of this one, so I've spent some time reworking the base to try and return to the original aesthetic. Please do let me know what you guys think!Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/IO3K8Wn.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/xf8849h.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/hG0tU1I.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/GxeWoaR.png)
To iterate the thought about making it more organic looking, I think that looks great as a base and structurally sound, but I was hoping for more randomness? Maybe it's possible to add a few random strands just for aesthetics? That's just my uneducated idea (pretty sure that would bump machining costs). Hyped for this board.
*Edit something I thought of, most of those strands are going in one directional axis, maybe some horizontal ones would help make it look more organic
I've heard all of you loud and clear! You liked the more organic bottom of the first iteration compared to the bottom of this one, so I've spent some time reworking the base to try and return to the original aesthetic. Please do let me know what you guys think!Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/IO3K8Wn.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/xf8849h.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/hG0tU1I.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/GxeWoaR.png)
To iterate the thought about making it more organic looking, I think that looks great as a base and structurally sound, but I was hoping for more randomness? Maybe it's possible to add a few random strands just for aesthetics? That's just my uneducated idea (pretty sure that would bump machining costs). Hyped for this board.
*Edit something I thought of, most of those strands are going in one directional axis, maybe some horizontal ones would help make it look more organic
So the bottom is generated algorithmically, I don't model it by hand. While I do have some control over how it looks, I do need to work within the constraints of both the algorithm and the manufacturing process.
I've heard all of you loud and clear! You liked the more organic bottom of the first iteration compared to the bottom of this one, so I've spent some time reworking the base to try and return to the original aesthetic. Please do let me know what you guys think!Dude this board is the reason I only brought one 7v and not two. Please, please let this GB start soon so you can take my money. I LOVE the design. I would even get into a FE edition if there's one.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/IO3K8Wn.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/xf8849h.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/hG0tU1I.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/GxeWoaR.png)
Would love a hot swap possibility, even if it's a premium add on or a separate purchase.
I still haven't decide on what kind of switch I like to use and sometimes I just feel like changing it up, having to desolder and resolder adds wear and tear apparently, not something I want to risk.
A good thing to remember about hotswap on the Evolv, or any board with a knob for that matter, is that you will still need to solder in the knob as there are no hotswap sockets for knobs.
Would love a hot swap possibility, even if it's a premium add on or a separate purchase.
I still haven't decide on what kind of switch I like to use and sometimes I just feel like changing it up, having to desolder and resolder adds wear and tear apparently, not something I want to risk.
Just use millmax then, will be cheaper for you and easier for the designer.
I don't know if this has been answered yet, but do you have a estimate/range for pricing after these new changes? I initial didn't really consider this board do to it's price estimate, but if the changes managed to significantly change the cost it might be accessible to me and other people who we're initial turned of by the estimated price.
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Millmax sockets cost maybe $15-30 depending on what model you get. It adds maybe 15 more min to the soldering process. I much prefer having stepped caps and all the other layout options all on 1 pcb rather than driving up the price and QC time to buy separate fixed hotswap pcbs. I understand the convenience of hotswap and it has it's benefits, but soldering is not hard guys. Get millmax sockets if you want hotswap.
Depending where your from: https://www.digikey.com/products/en?keywords=0305-2-15-80-47-80-10-0%20Millmax sockets cost maybe $15-30 depending on what model you get. It adds maybe 15 more min to the soldering process. I much prefer having stepped caps and all the other layout options all on 1 pcb rather than driving up the price and QC time to buy separate fixed hotswap pcbs. I understand the convenience of hotswap and it has it's benefits, but soldering is not hard guys. Get millmax sockets if you want hotswap.
Would you be kind enough to show me where I can buy mill max sockets for $15-30 for a tkl? I would love to have lots of layout options as well but I find myself switching switches (heh) more often than layouts.
Depending where your from: https://www.digikey.com/products/en?keywords=0305-2-15-80-47-80-10-0%20Millmax sockets cost maybe $15-30 depending on what model you get. It adds maybe 15 more min to the soldering process. I much prefer having stepped caps and all the other layout options all on 1 pcb rather than driving up the price and QC time to buy separate fixed hotswap pcbs. I understand the convenience of hotswap and it has it's benefits, but soldering is not hard guys. Get millmax sockets if you want hotswap.
Would you be kind enough to show me where I can buy mill max sockets for $15-30 for a tkl? I would love to have lots of layout options as well but I find myself switching switches (heh) more often than layouts.
If you get 2 per switch and add some extras for multiple layout compatibility, so about 200 sockets, it'll be almost $30 for a TKL.
Depending where your from: https://www.digikey.com/products/en?keywords=0305-2-15-80-47-80-10-0%20
If you get 2 per switch and add some extras for multiple layout compatibility, so about 200 sockets, it'll be almost $30 for a TKL.
The only caveat is that shipping to where I live would cost another 20$(Im form eastern Europe). Moreover Id have to buy a decent soldering station ( + solder) or pay someone to do it. With all these added costs Id rather buy another pcb. The soldering station might be a good investment in general but I dont plan on making/buying any keyboards for a long while after this one.
If you are in Europe you can order them through https://mykeyboard.eu/catalogue/mill-max-7305-hotswap-receptacles-40-pack-for-20-switches_2097/ right now so the total price should be lower if you order it there.
Any plans for artisan knobs like the Rama knob for the Satisfaction 75?Show Image(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200520/ffe0d126852e65fa2087776311c22d8a.jpg)
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I'd still like to see even more organic design. I still would like to see maybe branching that also goes laterally instead of just straight down the middle from the initial branch.
Is there an estimate for when the GB is?
interested, how much it will be? :thumb:
Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
I have plans for exactly this, but it won't be until after the Evolv GB completes
Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
I have plans for exactly this, but it won't be until after the Evolv GB completes
I was reading through the comments on this interest check and saw this. Would you be able to expand upon this idea? I really love the design but I'm not sure it will be in my budget, even with the redesign.
Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
I have plans for exactly this, but it won't be until after the Evolv GB completes
I was reading through the comments on this interest check and saw this. Would you be able to expand upon this idea? I really love the design but I'm not sure it will be in my budget, even with the redesign.
Yep! After the Evolv is complete I plan on doing a more financially accessible 65% version.
Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
I have plans for exactly this, but it won't be until after the Evolv GB completes
I was reading through the comments on this interest check and saw this. Would you be able to expand upon this idea? I really love the design but I'm not sure it will be in my budget, even with the redesign.
Yep! After the Evolv is complete I plan on doing a more financially accessible 65% version.
Cough 60%/45% cough :-X
Another thought is that this layout with the joystick encoder is exactly what I, and many others, want, if you could offer the same layout but in a less premium package (simpler machined or injection molded base) after this first one is done. Have your halo tier typing experience focused model, and a more accessible hobbyist model. Though I understand if that takes away from your whole concept here.
I have plans for exactly this, but it won't be until after the Evolv GB completes
I was reading through the comments on this interest check and saw this. Would you be able to expand upon this idea? I really love the design but I'm not sure it will be in my budget, even with the redesign.
Yep! After the Evolv is complete I plan on doing a more financially accessible 65% version.
Cough 60%/45% cough :-X
If only I liked either of those layouts lol.
Maybe one day :p
What is that keycap set in the first renders (the blue and pink/orange on the black top) it looks amazing
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What is that keycap set in the first renders (the blue and pink/orange on the black top) it looks amazing
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PBT Amalfi. It's in IC currently and also being ran by Nathan
Is there going to be a limit on this or is it open GB?
Is there going to be a limit on this or is it open GB?
With the complexity of the design, I sure hope there is a limit. QC would be a living hell otherwise.
Fingers crossedIs there going to be a limit on this or is it open GB?
With the complexity of the design, I sure hope there is a limit. QC would be a living hell otherwise.
This is correct, GB will be limited, with spots be allocated through a raffle
This looks awesome. You say v2 will (hopefully) be cheaper than v1 - I can’t find much info online about v1.For V1, the only price was that it would be under 1000 dollars
Could you let me know the price for v1, so I can tell my wallet what the upper limit (or even just ballpark figure) will be?
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And clearly it was not. HahaThis looks awesome. You say v2 will (hopefully) be cheaper than v1 - I can’t find much info online about v1.For V1, the only price was that it would be under 1000 dollars
Could you let me know the price for v1, so I can tell my wallet what the upper limit (or even just ballpark figure) will be?
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Ouch. I’ll still keep an eye on this, but I might then rather set my heart on something more conventional, like a Duck or the upcoming Rama M65-B, however long that will take.And clearly it was not. HahaThis looks awesome. You say v2 will (hopefully) be cheaper than v1 - I can’t find much info online about v1.For V1, the only price was that it would be under 1000 dollars
Could you let me know the price for v1, so I can tell my wallet what the upper limit (or even just ballpark figure) will be?
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Ouch. I’ll still keep an eye on this, but I might then rather set my heart on something more conventional, like a Duck or the upcoming Rama M65-B, however long that will take.And clearly it was not. HahaThis looks awesome. You say v2 will (hopefully) be cheaper than v1 - I can’t find much info online about v1.For V1, the only price was that it would be under 1000 dollars
Could you let me know the price for v1, so I can tell my wallet what the upper limit (or even just ballpark figure) will be?
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Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Personally, I think that the rounded corners of the top will help feel more organic and living thing. This is because creatures do not have angles.Ooo good point!
Personally, I think that the rounded corners of the top will help feel more organic and living thing. This is because creatures do not have angles.Ooo good point!
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This is a very promising keyboard indeed!
But with the effort you have put into this project, only 50 units of this keyboard would be a disappointment to many people.
Ps. the color in Mito's website is INSANE!
See a lot a people talking about the price and i was also interested to know but i think it's gonna be more than 500 right ? even more than 600 i guess.
Whatever it's gonna be to expensive for me but this is the best design keyboard i've ever seen so far. Congratulation guys.
See a lot a people talking about the price and i was also interested to know but i think it's gonna be more than 500 right ? even more than 600 i guess.
Whatever it's gonna be to expensive for me but this is the best design keyboard i've ever seen so far. Congratulation guys.
i wouldn't be surprised if this was around $1000.
the more i look at the prototypes, i feel there is a slight mismatch between the top and bottom half.
the bottom looks really organic, like the roots of a tree. but the top half looks structured and industrial.
I feel if the bottom half were to be more symmetrical and "grill" like, the entire package would be better matched. just my opinion.
Personally, I think that the rounded corners of the top will help feel more organic and living thing. This is because creatures do not have angles.Ooo good point!
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Let's not carried away with the organic motif or else we might end up with a wooden keyboard design.
The contrast between the top and bottom halves gives it a Neofuturist architectural look.
I don't want to hijack this thread, but here are two budget friendly options since it has been asked many times and people are interested in the layout.
KK75 (http://www.velocifiretech.com/product/kk75-keyboard-kit/) Groupbuy Open until End of June
KY-01 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106700.0) Interest Check Phase Prototype Ordered
KK75 (http://www.velocifiretech.com/product/kk75-keyboard-kit/) Groupbuy Open until End of JuneThese are not quite the same layout, as they don’t use the 1.5u right shift to get the perfectly aligned right column, which is IMO the main attraction of the Evolv’s layout.
KY-01 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106700.0) Interest Check Phase Prototype Ordered
Does anyone know the estimated price range? I think you should prioritize cheaper packaging to reduce the overall price.
These are not quite the same layout, as they don’t use the 1.5u right shift to get the perfectly aligned right column, which is IMO the main attraction of the Evolv’s layout.
Also, no F13.
Does anyone know the estimated price range? I think you should prioritize cheaper packaging to reduce the overall price.
It'll be cheaper than the first revision.
Under $1,000. No specific price was given.Does anyone know the estimated price range? I think you should prioritize cheaper packaging to reduce the overall price.
It'll be cheaper than the first revision.
What was the estimated price for the first revision?
Does anyone know the estimated price range? I think you should prioritize cheaper packaging to reduce the overall price.
Does anyone know the estimated price range? I think you should prioritize cheaper packaging to reduce the overall price.
Agree. Nathan will you consider sending mine (if i win) like this?
Does anyone know the estimated price range? I think you should prioritize cheaper packaging to reduce the overall price.
Agree. Nathan will you consider sending mine (if i win) like this?
Unfortunately not, just worked out a deal with the Museum of London to ship every Evolv in this:Show Image(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/f5/d8/d4f5d83a93bf992ba09e6002ef6d8f52.jpg)
Does anyone know the estimated price range? I think you should prioritize cheaper packaging to reduce the overall price.
Agree. Nathan will you consider sending mine (if i win) like this?
Unfortunately not, just worked out a deal with the Museum of London to ship every Evolv in this:Show Image(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/f5/d8/d4f5d83a93bf992ba09e6002ef6d8f52.jpg)
800 is pretty hefty, but I would need to be given the chance to pay for them. Any chance of increasing the production numbers? I don't really know how many people are out there for this, but I would assume getting in the 50 slots would be somewhat difficult (especially since I've yet to win a single raffle).
wow :eek:
wow :eek:
How's this for wow :pShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/SOX71V8.jpg)
Pic from manu, will update the OP when the board is in my hands.
Hi, will there be a metal version?
This looks so amazing! Any plans for a numpad?
Will PC also be an option along with alu? Im really liking the looks of the proto!
Will PC also be an option along with alu? Im really liking the looks of the proto!
Unlikely, PC is great for protos because printing it is cheap compared to printing Alu or investing into molds. By doing a short run of printed PC boards, I can verify everything is perfect with the design before getting the molds built.
Will PC also be an option along with alu? Im really liking the looks of the proto!
Unlikely, PC is great for protos because printing it is cheap compared to printing Alu or investing into molds. By doing a short run of printed PC boards, I can verify everything is perfect with the design before getting the molds built.
Man, that PC proto is 🔥! You should totally consider running that alongside the metal version, for real!
This keyboard made me log back in after a very, very long time. What is the best way to follow this and make sure I can enter the raffle when it finally happens?
is this going to come with a rgb pcb or just a regular pcb? also, where do you get mold for stuff like this from?
do you know how many of these are going to be made for the group buy? and on what website
also since this is a really expensive board, do you think that you would be able to include some keyboard foam
Buddy I will enthusiastically trade my first born child with no hesitation for that PC board. I don't care what I have to do, I'll do it because I need it. What are your terms?
What are the keycaps in the render in the 1st post? The matte finish makes them look similar to the GMK Modern Dolch 2
What are the keycaps in the render in the 1st post? The matte finish makes them look similar to the GMK Modern Dolch 2
I believe that's Infinikey Amalfi, by the same designer. IC thread here. (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106530.0)
Any updates on this?
Could someone be kind enough to explain to me why not run a GB instead of a raffle? Seems like demand is pretty high for this... :eek:
Has the PC proto arrived yet? I'm really excited to see what you've been working on.
Has the PC proto arrived yet? I'm really excited to see what you've been working on.
Yes, the best way to get updates is to join his Discord (Linked in the OP)
It looks stunning!
is there a new discord link? the one in the title is invalid
I really like the decisions made about the layout. I wish more keycap sets will start to include a 1.5u right shift key though in the base kit!
On that point, I was looking at your keycap set PBT Amalfi, and was wondering if 1.5u right shift key is included in the base kit too?
What's the reasoning behind using 7075 for the case? Seems a little overboard since 2024 for all intents and purposes is just as good and generally cheaper to machine. I saw that you mentioned 7075 was best for 'typing consistency and strength.' How did you test this and what traits make for good typing consistency and strength? I'm planning on designing my own board so it'd be helpful to understand the thought process.
What's the reasoning behind using 7075 for the case? Seems a little overboard since 2024 for all intents and purposes is just as good and generally cheaper to machine. I saw that you mentioned 7075 was best for 'typing consistency and strength.' How did you test this and what traits make for good typing consistency and strength? I'm planning on designing my own board so it'd be helpful to understand the thought process.
What's the reasoning behind using 7075 for the case? Seems a little overboard since 2024 for all intents and purposes is just as good and generally cheaper to machine. I saw that you mentioned 7075 was best for 'typing consistency and strength.' How did you test this and what traits make for good typing consistency and strength? I'm planning on designing my own board so it'd be helpful to understand the thought process.
I'm not sure which is more impressive... the fact that you have that specific knowledge of metallurgy or the fact that you came out of lurking just to make this your one and only post.
e: I don't think 2024 was ever even mentioned so maybe it just wasn't considered?
Hasn’t been any yet, so you didn’t miss it :)That is hella good news lol. If this stays a raffle system I hope I get a spot.
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Movement on this coming super soon with the FnF protos currently shipping!
Movement on this coming super soon with the FnF protos currently shipping!Waiting with, school girl at a Bieber concert, level of excitement.
Obligatory "Never bought a KB before, total noob" comment:
How do you buy this keyboard? Is it going on a drop website?
What kinds of timelines is common with these buys? Is it 1 year from order to arrival?
Thanks for any help!
How can I buy this keyboard?
How can I buy this keyboard?
The board is still under final developmental stages and will enter group buy. There isn't an ETA on that yet.
This thing is nuts. Insane Hype.
I dont wanna think about how much dust will get caught on top of that space frame looking thing down below.
Regarding the knob on top of the board, are you getting the additional functionality from in-plane translation of the knob or rotation of the knob about the depth axis of the keyboard? It would be so slick if I could push it horizontally/vertically without it rotating out of plane.
Unfortunately not:
https://imgur.com/BGeH9Wu
Hmmmm okay.
Thanks for the animation!
No problem! Sorry for the poor quality, threw it together really quickly. If I can find a rotary joystick that has lateral functionality, I will switch to it with no hesitation.
Is this IC dead or?
According to Nathan, the Evolv has been handed over to vendors.
If anyone has any information on where to get new updates or which vendors will be moving this project forward please leave a post. The Discord has been archived. Thanks!
According to Nathan, the Evolv has been handed over to vendors.
If anyone has any information on where to get new updates or which vendors will be moving this project forward please leave a post. The Discord has been archived. Thanks!
Yes, indeed. As far as PCB goes, it is in full active development and I fully intend to make this happen. I am still waiting for the vendors to contact me.
For the Discord members, what did Nathan mean by "The board has been handed over to vendors"?
Will they start to sell it at their own convenience or will they wait for Nathan to come back and resume the project? o.O
Hi all. We've currently got the reins for the project in Nathan's absence. We look forward to sharing more information in the future soon!
Hi all. We've currently got the reins for the project in Nathan's absence. We look forward to sharing more information in the future soon!
At the moment we are just in pre-preperation. Nathan is taking some time off and we've still got some things in discussion - Unfortunately we don't have a tentative date for the next update but rest assured we will get this moving as quickly as possible :thumb:
Lead times and part shortages (Particularly micro controllers) are causing havoc to supply chains presently, so we can afford to take some time and get it 100%.
I don't think the Discord server will work. All channels have been locked and only 3 remain. Our best option is to stay tuned to this thread, unless the guys who took over the project have another server, that would be great!At the moment we are just in pre-preperation. Nathan is taking some time off and we've still got some things in discussion - Unfortunately we don't have a tentative date for the next update but rest assured we will get this moving as quickly as possible :thumb:
Lead times and part shortages (Particularly micro controllers) are causing havoc to supply chains presently, so we can afford to take some time and get it 100%.
Will the discord still be the place to stay up to date for the board going forward or will it be this post or another discord?
Here's a link for those in need https://discord.gg/KhNs3JSagK
At the moment we are just in pre-preperation. Nathan is taking some time off and we've still got some things in discussion - Unfortunately we don't have a tentative date for the next update but rest assured we will get this moving as quickly as possible :thumb:
Lead times and part shortages (Particularly micro controllers) are causing havoc to supply chains presently, so we can afford to take some time and get it 100%.
Guys, things take time, specially with how crazy the available of raw materials and components is at the moment. Let's give the boys a chance and hope to hear more about everything soon!
Oh s*t! It's alive!Guys, things take time, specially with how crazy the available of raw materials and components is at the moment. Let's give the boys a chance and hope to hear more about everything soon!
Exactly this! Nathan has been working hard behind the scenes and there will be more news to share later on in the year, or early next. There will be an update the moment there is something newsworthy to share.
Best,
Stef
As it often happens in this hobby - ambitious projects can take too long and the hype dies off or the project is dead itself. Would be a shame for this project to go away tho, still remember the immense hype when it was first announced.
There will be an update the moment there is something newsworthy to share.
Checking in every so often even just to say "nothing new" is newsworthy. It lets people know that projects aren't abandoned and builds confidence in your commitment to communication and transparency. Going completely silent is not a professional look and erodes trust. Stopping by even just to make a simple post like this is very reassuring to the people following the project.
Checking in every so often even just to say "nothing new" is newsworthy. It lets people know that projects aren't abandoned and builds confidence in your commitment to communication and transparency. Going completely silent is not a professional look and erodes trust. Stopping by even just to make a simple post like this is very reassuring to the people following the project.
I'm not certain if they're going to continue the idea of making the Evolv (or possibly just no longer doing a raffle GB). In their discord I mentioned something along the lines of waiting for the Evolv GB raffle that was being planned and the response to it was "Evolv raffle? Chaos having effects already. We in imagination land" ("Chaos having effects" was in reference to previous discussion about GMK Chaos) so it could be the radio silence is because the board is no longer going to be made. They apparently spoke to manufacturers about numbers but that was a fair while ago and nothing in the Discord about it has been said since then, other than the nebulous imagination land thing. I hope it's not out of line to share things that were mentioned in the Discord.
I definitely agree about the complete silence on the project not being a good sign, especially if big moves relating to its production. In my opinion talking to manufacturers is definitely newsworthy enough for a quick post.
Guys I'll be streaming some firmware work for the Evolv protos today at 9PM BRT (in about 4h 30 mins).We will implement some nice little feature I call "encoder modes"!
I missed that! :eek:
Is it possible to view the stream recording?
Where can I buy those joystick encoders?
Around how expensive would the pcb be?
I wanted to design a case for a keyboard and since I wont be able to afford this case+pcb i might as-well try designing a case for this keyboard.
Thanks ;D
Evolv(https://i.imgur.com/ewQIJvH.png) (https://www.instagram.com/nathan.alpha.man/)
Designed By Alpha StudioShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/rb4YE67.png)
Welcome to the Evolv2, and evolution of a crazy idea.
Read the post below OP for information about the design philosophy behind the revision.
IC FORM: https://forms.gle/1xVWXXrjzgP9LGRDA
The ArrowsShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/AKi3os7.jpg)
Beginning with the layout, the Evolv opts for a 1.5u right shift over the 1.75u shift widespread in blocked 75 layouts.
By doing so, the arrows line up neatly with the right mods, allowing for a continuous .25u bezel.
The Rotary JoystickShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/VWo8O9R.jpg)
In the upper-right corner of the board, utility wins the battle over aesthetics.
No badges or logos; instead, the Evolv features a design evolution to the knob: the rotary joystick.
With users able to assign macros to five unique positions* and rotation, the Evolv packs functionality in a small space.
The BackShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/UXsbjx4.jpg)
A teaser to what's inside the board, the bottom piece of the keyboard is a stunning visual accent.
Created through a process known as generative design, the Evolv can support a truck without breaking, all while looking fantastic.
The Plate
Render pending, the Evolv redesign will still feature a generative plate, however, it will be available as an extra during GB
The AssemblyShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/orl7vP3.jpg)
To top off the design, the Evolv features no visible seams or screws once assembled.
The SpecsShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/Psu4nQc.jpg)
Angle: 8° (Half a degree more compared to v1)
Material: 7075 Aluminum + Cast Aluminum
Colors: TBD (Black + Raw and Black + Gold confirmed)
Plate: Full isolation mounted carbon fibre plate, considering adding more options.
PCB: Custom designed PCB: solderable, QMK, VIA, integrated USB-C port.
Weight: ~1.5Kg
Price: TBD, not as high as the first iteration of the Evolv
PCB compatibility, fixed layouts TBD:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/wO80kqN.png)
Render GalleryShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/9OMunGh.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/EFmwtPp.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Fm3OhHk.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/TvrSh3h.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/kyH5OTN.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/5VAwCnM.png)
Social
(https://i.imgur.com/1cm9kDU.png) (https://discord.gg/CDmzRRB)
Around how expensive would the pcb be?
I wanted to design a case for a keyboard and since I wont be able to afford this case+pcb i might as-well try designing a case for this keyboard.
Thanks ;D
As much as I am a huge open-source adept, I must say that I strongly suggest you talk to Nathan (the Evolv's designer) before designing a case around this PCB.
Around how expensive would the pcb be?
I wanted to design a case for a keyboard and since I wont be able to afford this case+pcb i might as-well try designing a case for this keyboard.
Thanks ;D
As much as I am a huge open-source adept, I must say that I strongly suggest you talk to Nathan (the Evolv's designer) before designing a case around this PCB.
Oh wow, thought that Nathan left the community after leaving the project in SK hands.
Guys in 45 minutes I'll open stream designing the Evolv revision Beta PCB
http://twitch.tv/gondolindrim_
Guys in 45 minutes I'll open stream designing the Evolv revision Beta PCB
http://twitch.tv/gondolindrim_
How many more revisions are there going to be before this project actually hits GB? It seems like the manufacturing of the actual case has been more of a problem to figure out than the PCB...
Any word on this? Is this project dead? Love the design and if not I can't wait to see the finale.
Any word on this? Is this project dead? Love the design and if not I can't wait to see the finale.
i haven't heard anything about this basically since gondo's stream but i'm kind of out of the loop so who knows
GB numbers are in the ****ing toilet lately so they might be holding off
but given how much of a logistical nightmare the last GB was, it may just be taking some time
Any word on this? Is this project dead? Love the design and if not I can't wait to see the finale.
i haven't heard anything about this basically since gondo's stream but i'm kind of out of the loop so who knows
GB numbers are in the ****ing toilet lately so they might be holding off
but given how much of a logistical nightmare the last GB was, it may just be taking some time
Project not dead, PCB and case updates are finished, we are waiting on protos. Should hear from us soon
Amazing! Thanks for the update!Any word on this? Is this project dead? Love the design and if not I can't wait to see the finale.
i haven't heard anything about this basically since gondo's stream but i'm kind of out of the loop so who knows
GB numbers are in the ****ing toilet lately so they might be holding off
but given how much of a logistical nightmare the last GB was, it may just be taking some time
Project not dead, PCB and case updates are finished, we are waiting on protos. Should hear from us soon
Any word on this? Is this project dead? Love the design and if not I can't wait to see the finale.
i haven't heard anything about this basically since gondo's stream but i'm kind of out of the loop so who knows
GB numbers are in the ****ing toilet lately so they might be holding off
but given how much of a logistical nightmare the last GB was, it may just be taking some time
Project not dead, PCB and case updates are finished, we are waiting on protos. Should hear from us soon
Ok guys, huge update incoming!
So we are on the final stages of designing the new version and we should have prototypes soon, but I just wasn't able to refrain myself from posting some of the awesome progress we have made so far on the PCB.
AestheticsShow Image(https://imgur.com/02XPYy2.jpg)
Following the alien-looks-theme of Evolv, we have reworked the overall aesthetics of the PCB to something out of this world. Nathan has come up with a weird indeed image replicating the cozy moonlight of an alien world.
Under the hood
The Evolv75 revision Beta PCB will use an ARM STM32F401 MCU for its availability and price (silicon shortage means nothing in alien worlds). It will support a wide variety of layouts, including ISO (yikes). PCB will feature QMK/VIA support.
The Beta PCB will use a USB daughterboard with JST connector this time around.Show Image(https://imgur.com/vMySeAg.jpg)
Functionality
The main characteristic of Evolv, at least functionality-wise, is the usage of a rotary joystick, that is, an "encoder that can also click on the four directions".
We gathered some feedback from the Evolv CE folks and on this IC page. Some people pointed out that the joystick was maybe too much for them and they wish they could just use a run-of-the-mill encoder with no directionals. Other people said that the joystick is a welcome novelty, and while I belong to this second roster, I still think people that just want a simpler thing also have a point.
So why choose?Show Image(https://imgur.com/ArQmWI7.jpg)Show Image(https://imgur.com/hxPqt6x.jpg)
The Release Beta PCB will support both encoder AND joystick, so both people are happy. Evolv will also have the "encoder modes" feature which allows for multiple functionality of the encoder with a simple holding of the encoder!
There is a downside to this, however: the joystick and the encoder do not support the same knobs, so both will need their own.
For the CE people
For the CE guys, we understand that the first support was lackluster and we are probably retrofitting the Alpha PCB with these all-new changes so our first backers are not left thinking they were simple beta-testers. Me and Nathan are working on supplying these PCBs soon.
Disclaimer
Of course guys this is just a "teaser update" and the renders here are just that, renders. There are still changes to be made, so the renders are not 100% reflective of the final product but pretty close as far as we can tell right now.
What about case protos, GB dates, pricing...?
Case prototypes will arrive soon and first testings are scheduled. For now we have no tentative GB dates or pricing, but we are steadily getting there. Hopefully we will have some more set-in-stone info soon!
Anything new about this one? Seems like a really cool concept, would hate to see so much time and innovation go down the drain!
Anything new about this one? Seems like a really cool concept, would hate to see so much time and innovation go down the drain!
New prototypes were made, keyboard will run. Not sure what model (unlimited GB, instock, whatever) but it is going to happen. We are currently making a revision of PCB, should be in final steps.
Some proto pictures:Show Image(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/650100429530857472/1124402017926922382/IMG_3204.jpg)Show Image(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1034873435416952903/1124418776214020096/IMG_3220.jpg)
Is there a one color option? Would like one of these for the office and I need basic all black.
So apparently pre-orders are live.
I received an email this morning.
https://archetypemade.com/evolv-is-here/
It feels weird that the OP has not updated this thread or created a GB thread.