Vintage Rubber Dome Keyboards

[EscapeVelocity]

Hello, Im gonna discuss some of the more highly regarded (and widely available) vintage rubber dome keyboards in this thread.  I look forward to your comments, corrections, observations.




Today I received...

Brand New in Box Dell QuietKey RT7DJTW PS/2 keyboard   Made in Thailand (by NMB) late production model.

Used in Box IBM KB-8923 PS/2 keyboard. Made in Thailand 1996.

The IBM weighs a bit more than the Dell, but the Dell doesnt feel lightweight or cheap.


Dell QuietKey RT7DJTW

Firmer more tactile keypress
Darker toned gray keys (I slightly prefer this to the IBM)
Laser etched key caps are not as dark as the IBMs dye sub. (I prefer the IBMs greater contrast for easier visibility)
Keys have more pronounced pebbled finish than the IBM  (I prefer the feel of the IBM's smoother key cap tops)
Keys bottom out more harshly than the IBM perhaps due to newness and/or the lighter weighting/less tactility of the IBMs keypress itself.
Keys are all top printed legends (IBM has some side printed caps for 2nd function)
Bottom row has equally sized Control-Alt-Windows-Function keys with convex tops. (I prefer the IBM)
Caps Lock key drops off early producing a space between it and the A key which I like. (Both units have this)

IBM KB-8923

Lighter more linear feeling keypress. Feels easier on the fingertips almost pleasant. (I slightly prefer the IBM)
Lighter toned gray keys
Dye Sublimation printed keycaps which are darker and more easily read with higher contrast (helped by lighter colored darker grey keys)
Smoother key cap finish (I prefer the feel of these to the Dell)
Top row function keys are not two toned 4x4 color coded (I prefer the Dell)
Break and SysReq printed on side of key cap on the Pause and Print Screen button respectively (Nicer than the Dell)
Bottom Row has regular style concave curved key caps with larger Control key caps compared to the Windows/Alt/Function keys. (I prefer this to the Dell)
Caps Lock key drops off early producing a space between it and the A key which I like.  (Both units have this)


I like the cable management of the IBM slightly better but they are both functional and similar. The Dell has two level adjustable fold out feet, though the IBM is wider and sturdier.  The Dell has purple color coded usb plug, IBM's is grey. The Dell has bigger rubber feet on the front, and the IBM has no rubber feet on the back edge, while the Dell has small round rubber feet towards the back edge.

Dell on the top, IBM on the bottom.





Sideviews.  Dell QuietKey on the Left, IBM on the Right.



IBM Control/Alt/Windows/Function keys. Here you can see the crisp high contrast legends on the IBM key caps...as well as the larger sized Control key and the concave key tops. The Space Bar is slightly smaller than the Dell to accommodate the larger Control keys.



Dell Control/Alt/Windows/Function keys. Here you can see the lower contrast legends on the Dell key caps...as well as the convex key tops of this row of keys, and all these keys are the same size on the Dell.




Closeup of Dell LED indicators & Pause/Break and Print Screen/SysReq keys




Closeup of IBM LED indicators & Pause/Break and Print Screen/SysReq keys




Indentification

[EscapeVelocity]

Im kind of unsure as to the proper terminology rubber dome or membrane for these keyboards.

Anyways overall I like the IBM KB 8923 better.  However I wouldnt complain too much about the Dell QuietKey RT7DJTW.

PS Sorry about some of the pics, Ill have to retake some.

[chyros]

Im kind of unsure as to the proper terminology rubber dome or membrane for these keyboards.

Well it's both innit? Rubber dome over membrane, really.

[fohat.digs]

These are my 2 favorites of this type.

The IBM is also available in black, and swapping keys with cases looks good - either way.

[EscapeVelocity]

Ive got an Acer Accufeel 6311-TW coming as well as an NMB RT6856TW both New in Box coming to add to the comparison. Should be here early next week.

[EscapeVelocity]

These are my 2 favorites of this type.

The IBM is also available in black, and swapping keys with cases looks good - either way.

Im a big fan of the Two Tone layout as seen on the Dell QuietKey.  Wish the IBM had the same full two tone layout. But it's nice to know that the IBM comes in black for those who are matching their system or work environment.  I find Black keyboards more difficult to see clearly though I mostly touch type, it comes in handy when searching for lessor used keys.  I like LED backlighting on black keyboards to offset this minor issue.

[EscapeVelocity]

Fixed a couple of the photos.

[EscapeVelocity]

I wonder if the IBM are double shot key caps. I just assumed they were Dye Sublimation. I know what laser etching looks like and the Dell Quietkey almost certainly is laser etched.

[fohat.digs]

To see whether a plastic piece is a "multiple-shot" fabrication, just look at the underside and you will see evidence of the layers involved.

I have the IBM and the Dell, and both have ABS caps (acetone test). The Dells are lasered, but the IBM's legends look particularly crisp and nice, with the texture continuous across the legend and the face. If ABS can be dye-subbed, then these might well have been done that way.

[EscapeVelocity]

From wikipedia..

ABS keys is the prefered plastic to double-shot molding. That is because most other plastics shrink too much in the moulding process. Legends on ABS keys can also be pad-printed, laser-etched (burned) or laser-engraved (with or without infill). Because of the low shrinkage, some keyboards have space bars made of ABS even if other keys are made of PBT or POM.

[EscapeVelocity]

So Ive been doing some type testing on some keyboards I own.

The Dell QuietKey RT7DJTW requires more force than the IBM KB-8923 and the Dell is also definitely quieter. The feedback is excellent on the Dell.

The IBM has a closer feel to the Cherry & Kailh Blues that I have.  It's key depress force is lower than the Dells. Also the IBM KB-8923 is quieter than the Cherry & Kailh Blues.

I think over all I like the IBM KB-8923 better than the Dell Quietkey RT7DJTW. But they are both nice. Kudos to Dell for delivering on their "QuietKey" branding/advertising.

I think I like the Kailh Blues on the Thermaltake Tt Sport Poseidon ZX (Tenkeyless) slightly better than the Cherry MX Blues on the KBT Race II 75% keyboard. But they are both nice.

So I rate the keyboards I have here like this based entirely on typing feel.

Thermaltake Poseidon
KBT Race II
IBM 8923
Dell Quietkey RT7DJTW

The Saitek Eclipse I that I was using before is just sad in comparison to any of these.

[False_Dmitry_II]

I'm somewhat interested in trying one, but not enough to buy one.

Since you're comparing to other boards, you need to try some non-cherry mechanical.

[Blaise170]

I will potentially have a membrane board coming in soon, though I'm hoping for Alps since the only other board I found with the same P/N had Alps. I'll share my experience with it when it does.

[EscapeVelocity]

I'm somewhat interested in trying one, but not enough to buy one.

Since you're comparing to other boards, you need to try some non-cherry mechanical.

I have a Dell AT101W & an Apple Extended Keyboard II coming this week.  Ill probably be ordering a Unicomp Ultra Classic this week as well.

[EscapeVelocity]

Dell AT101W (Mexico 1999) Brand New in Box is here.

As well as the Fentek Large Print (Taiwan, Like New in Box)

[EscapeVelocity]

I have two Belkin F5U119-E PS/2 to USB adapters, two Ziotek PS/2 to USB adapters, and 1 Griffin 2001 I-Mate ADB to USB adapter coming.

[EscapeVelocity]

I wonder why it wasnt common to have rubber dampeners to cushion where the key caps bottom out.  That seems like a good strategy. I think the Apple Extended Keyboard II uses dampeners. Ill know soon enough.

These Alps Blacks in this new Dell AT101W 1999 (Mexico) are smooth as butter.  The keyboard is pretty big, but not huge.

What was the latest date the Dell AT101W was produced?  Latest date Ive seen is 2001 (by chance).

These Mexican produced ones are supposed to be built a bit tighter than the Malaysian made Silitek versions.

[chyros]

I wonder why it wasnt common to have rubber dampeners to cushion where the key caps bottom out.  That seems like a good strategy. I think the Apple Extended Keyboard II uses dampeners. Ill know soon enough.

The Ivory and White Alps ones, which are the most common, have rubber dampeners, yeah. Some versions came with Salmon Alps, though.

These Alps Blacks in this new Dell AT101W 1999 (Mexico) are smooth as butter.  The keyboard is pretty big, but not huge.

What was the latest date the Dell AT101W was produced?  Latest date Ive seen is 2001 (by chance).

Possibly. Mine is from 2001 too.

I can confirm that there are two different types of SKCM Blacks. The ones in my AT101W (from Malaysia) feel and sound considerably inferior to the ones in my old-logo AT101. It's possible that the Mexico-produced versions of the AT101W use the same, older SKCM Black switches.

[EscapeVelocity]

I thought the old logo AT101 had Salmon Alps?

[Blaise170]

The rubber dampeners in the Apple keyboards were there to quiet the switch, not the keycap. Keycap dampening is done by o rings.

[fohat.digs]

I have never seen an AT101 with salmon Alps (nor an AEK2 for that matter) although I have heard that they exist.

I have owned 2 old logo AT101s and both were garbage blacks with ABS key caps.

An AEK2 with pink/salmon will almost surely be the 1989 copyright, the 1990 copyright will probably be cream, and the 1995 copyright will likely be white, based on my personal observations.

[EscapeVelocity]

Oh I did not know that.

[False_Dmitry_II]

The rubber dampeners in the Apple keyboards were there to quiet the switch, not the keycap. Keycap dampening is done by o rings.

No, o-rings is what cherry users resort to because their switches are completely incapable of doing the same thing. The internal rubber dampeners dampen in both directions downstroke and upstroke.

[EscapeVelocity]

I realize the Del AT101W isnt a Vintage Rubber Dome, but Im just keeping my stuff contained as much as possible in this thread.

Anyways the Dell AT101W came with a 3 year warranty as noted in the box with my new unit. Pretty sweet!  Why didnt Dell continue to produce this model or something similar with Alps switches into USB after the turn of the century. For shame! 

[chyros]

Why didnt Dell continue to produce this model or something similar with Alps switches into USB after the turn of the century. For shame! 

They were still being made after 2000, although it would appear for not very long. As for the USB thing; PS/2 is superior to USB. Also, it probably didn't help that Alps had been phasing out their switches for a while at the time .

I thought the old logo AT101 had Salmon Alps?

The Alps-made ones did, the Silitek-made ones don't. Easily distinguishable by FCC ID (GYI v GYU).

I have never seen an AT101 with salmon Alps (nor an AEK2 for that matter) although I have heard that they exist.

I have owned 2 old logo AT101s and both were garbage blacks with ABS key caps.

They sure do, I have a rather broken one in one of my videos here:

Are your old-logo ones the more common GYUM97SK then? Because I compared mine to the new-logo one and they feel and sound very different. I made a quick typing comparison here:

[EscapeVelocity]

Im hoping to use the AEKII with Windows 7/8/10 PCs. I have a Griffin iMate coming and also and Adesso GPB to USB converter.  Any hiccups with that?

[fohat.digs]

Im hoping to use the AEKII with Windows 7/8/10 PCs. I have a Griffin iMate coming and also and Adesso GPB to USB converter.  Any hiccups with that?

The iMate worked well for me with Windows XP/7 and Ubuntu. I don't know what that other thing is.

[EscapeVelocity]

Adesso ADB to USB

LOL!

I ordered a Unicomp Ultra Classic with a 103 key layout (big spacebar). Hope I dont miss that 104th key! 

[EscapeVelocity]

Sorry, newbie locked the topic accidentally.

[False_Dmitry_II]

I have two iMates, and used to own a third which someone else has now. They all work great. In Ubuntu and Mint as well.

[EscapeVelocity]

Kool, I only anticipate using one on the AEKII so Im covered. 

Im gonna pick up an Apple 1242 Aluminum Wired chiclet too...but that is USB.


On a side note I just picked up a Chicony KB-5181 with Monterey switches, New in Box!

[False_Dmitry_II]

Where did you get that? I managed to get one of those too, and really like it.

[smeckledorfed]

I kind of feel like this is a dumb question...  But are those Dell QuietKey boards worth keeping?  I'm helping clean out an old lab at work and they have 2 or 3 of those that might be tossed...

Edit:  Maybe I'll just try them and see how I like them

[EscapeVelocity]

Where did you get that? I managed to get one of those too, and really like it.

Dude just put it up on eBay and I prompted him to remove a key cap and report the slider color. $55 shipped.   

[EscapeVelocity]

I kind of feel like this is a dumb question...  But are those Dell QuietKey boards worth keeping?  I'm helping clean out an old lab at work and they have 2 or 3 of those that might be tossed...

Edit:  Maybe I'll just try them and see how I like them

Yeah man. They start out really stiffish so lots of life in those keyboards.  They are a top rubber dome.  Save them and give them out or distribute them on eBay for a few bucks.

[Blaise170]

Yeah my iMate works fine on Win 7/8/8.1.

[False_Dmitry_II]

Where did you get that? I managed to get one of those too, and really like it.

Dude just put it up on eBay and I prompted him to remove a key cap and report the slider color. $55 shipped.   

I don't even see the completed listing. But that is a really good price for it. Since you're apparently immediately delving into vintage stuff, I'll say: be careful, because you may find yourself not using cherry anymore. I got my first cherry at the same time as my first space invader, and I never ended up using the cherry even though it was brand new and the SI was covered with a carpet of lint when I got it.


@smeckledorfed
That is generally a good idea. Even if you don't someone else might. Better than the landfill at the very least.

[Blaise170]

I will also say to be careful scooping up vintage. I've been burned on more than one occasion where I thought something was mechanical but it turned out to be even worse than rubber dome (the Keytronic Foam and Foil board I own... ick).

[EscapeVelocity]

Thanks, Im fairly adept at eBaying.

Im more about the experience, learning than the destination. I already have more than satisfactory keyboards to use. And Ill have plenty of presents to give out to lucky friends and family for birthdays & Christmas!

 )

[EscapeVelocity]

Here we go!  A new champion!

NMB RT6856TW

Pics coming soon.

Thanks! How does it compare to your NMB RT6856TW in terms of feel and sound? I imagine pretty similar since both are NMB rubber domes? Do you have a preference of the two? My only experience is the RT6656TW, so far.

Just a note. There are RT6656TW and RT6856TW models. I have the RT6856TW and it just came in today.

Judging by the weight the RT6856TW has a steel base plate which is nice. The Dell may not have one as it's noticeably lighter than the IBM 8923 and the NMB RT6856TW.

Im gonna say I like the NMB RT6856TW better than both the Dell Quietkey and the IBM 8923. This is why.

I like the smoother keycaps of the IBM & NMB. They fell better. The NMB RT6856TW being slightly more textured than the IBM 8923...and the Dell being much more textured than both of them.

The IBM KB-8923 feels a bit spongey-er than the Dell RT7D5JTW and the NMB RT6856TW when bottoming out the keys. The NMB and the Dell have very similar tactility in their key depresses. Maybe using the same or similar parts as they are both made by NMB (in Thailand).

So in my limited experience, I would say the NMB fixes what I found slightly annoying on the Dell QuietKey and also has better build quality with the metal base plate.

One more thing the NMB here has a more pronounced curve of the from bottom row to top row looking at the keyboard from the side than either the Dell Quiet Key or the IBM 8923. The Dell has a flatter case than the IBM but the keys have similar mild curvature to the IBM, maybe just a tad less.

Also of note is that the bottom row Control/Alt/Windows/Fn keys are normal concave key caps on the NMB (and IBM) while the dell has convex key caps which match the profile of the space bar. I prefer the normal concave style key caps.

The space bar on the NMB RT6856TW is a bit more squarish on the edge than the Dell...with the IBM 8923 in between. I like the more rounded space bar.

I like the NMB RT6856TW better than both the Dell QuietKey RT7D5JTW and the IBM-8923. But I could use any of them without complaint.

What I like about the NMB RT6856TW over the Dell QuietKey RT7D5JTW...

1. Less rough surface texture on the top of the keys.
2. More curved (rising from bottom row to top row) profile
3. Bottom row keycaps are standard concave instead of the Dell's convex.
4. Weighs more, indicating a metal base plate.
5. Key legends are a bit more contrasty and thus easily read (but the IBM trumps both here)

What I like about the Dell QuietKey RT7D5JTW over the NMB RT6856TW

1. Space bar is more rounded. NMB has a more squarish edge.  (with IBM in between)

What I like about both the Dell & the NMB

1. Tactility of the key depress is good (and very similar)
2. Dual colored Pearl & Pebble IBM M style key layout


Hope that helps.

PS- I wonder what the difference is between the RT6656TW and the RT6856TW, maybe the same keyboard but the 66 version ditched the metal base plate to save costs?

[EscapeVelocity]

Pics of the NMB RT6856TW...

Top





Bottom





The side mounted cable management is pretty unique. I like it.





Pic of the Bright Green Slider





Sideview showing curvature & rise of the rows. NMB RT6856TW on Left, IBM KB-8923 on Right.





Identification

[EscapeVelocity]

Here is a pic of the Dell RT7D5JTW slider





And here is the IBM KB-8923

[False_Dmitry_II]

Any pics of the metal plate?

[smeckledorfed]

Pics of the NMB RT6856TW...

Top

Show Image

Bottom

Show Image

The side mounted cable management is pretty unique. I like it.

Show Image

Pic of the Bright Green Slider

Show Image

Sideview showing curvature & rise of the rows. NMB RT6856TW on Left, IBM KB-8923 on Right.

Show Image

Identification

Show Image

Pretty slick looking board...

[EscapeVelocity]

Any pics of the metal plate?

No, Im not sure I want to open the up. 

[False_Dmitry_II]

Do you think it would be hard to get back together? I suppose there's no way of knowing without doing it for domes. I had one that I opened once before I got any mechs and the keys and stuff went everywhere. Though the fact that that one even has a slider means it is a much better design anyway than that one.

[EscapeVelocity]

So the Acer Accufeel 6311-TW semi-mechanical membrane is coming, but apparently this doesnt qualify as a rubber dome.

Also a mid 00s Dell KB 1421 USB is coming this week.

I also have a KeyTronic LifeTime Classic (Made in Mexico PS/2) coming.

Im gonna try to pick up another Made in USA Keytronic in it's traditional design. And maybe a Designer as well. 

Plus a Chicony 5923 or 6923 and that will do it for my Rubber Dome round up. 

Considering a BTC 5339 as well.

Any recommendations on a Maxi-Switch keyboard?  The Gateways are mostly Maxi keyboards.

[Blaise170]

Gateway2000 (Gateway changed their name) keyboards. The AnyKey series will mostly be Maxi.

[fohat.digs]

Gateway2000 AnyKey series

These are desirable and sought after by certain people, if they have the extra programmable keys.

As I remember, they have (edit:) Alps-compatible caps, but the entire board might fetch $25-$35 + shipping on ebay.

[Blaise170]

Gateway2000 AnyKey series

These are desirable and sought after by certain people, if they have the extra programmable keys.

As I remember, they have MX-compatible caps, but the entire board might fetch $25-$35 + shipping on ebay.

Mine does not have MX-compatible keys, it is basically just rubber dome mount. Some of the Maxi do, others do not.