Author Topic: Headphone Thread. (Read 1314605 times)

ironman31 · « **Reply #750 on:** Wed, 14 September 2011, 16:26:27 »

Quote from: ascii;416181

Probably not. If I use my RSA Predator in amp only mode, it sounds just about identical to the Shadow amp pictured (probably uses the same nail polished TI chips). The DAC feature though... makes using headphones with a computer doable w/o noise. I doubt I'd be able to tell a difference between the Predator DAC and MOTU Traveler I've got at home

While different cables don't sound very (if any) different from each other, the feel of the cable itself can make a difference when you're using it all day every day.

Cables = personal preference. As long as they let the electrons pass freely and you like the results, they're going to work well.

DAC = the fact that it's there is the important part.

I just need to get a 1/4" to 1/8" adapter for my LCD-2's so I can go between the two. I'll have someone else switch them back and forth (or not at all) between the two, and see if I can hear a difference. If not, then I guess I spent 1500 dollars on a very nicely built box with a lot of inputs on the back, lol.

ascii · « **Reply #751 on:** Wed, 14 September 2011, 16:35:36 »

LOL, there you go. I need to get an 1/8" -> 1/4" adapter to try these with the MOTU. Lots of inputs = lots of options and not outgrowing the nicely built box as quickly.

Regarding headphones... I either have to do big over the ear (not good for portable) or custom IEM's. All universal IEM's were extremely uncomfortable to me. Didn't realize why until after sending JHA some ear impressions. Apparently my ears are built a bit weird and the canal flattens a bit in a bend. Customs are the only IEM's that I can wear for more than 5-10 minutes at a time. Worth the time and $ investment, IMHO.

ironman31 · « **Reply #752 on:** Wed, 14 September 2011, 16:43:00 »

Quote from: ascii;416192

LOL, there you go. I need to get an 1/8" -> 1/4" adapter to try these with the MOTU. Lots of inputs = lots of options and not outgrowing the nicely built box as quickly.

Regarding headphones... I either have to do big over the ear (not good for portable) or custom IEM's. All universal IEM's were extremely uncomfortable to me. Didn't realize why until after sending JHA some ear impressions. Apparently my ears are built a bit weird and the canal flattens a bit in a bend. Customs are the only IEM's that I can wear for more than 5-10 minutes at a time. Worth the time and $ investment, IMHO.

Those will be my next audio purchase. Not sure how long from now, but I would really like something I can listen to in a library and still have them sound great. My sr60's don't really fit well in that category, lol.

ascii · « **Reply #753 on:** Wed, 14 September 2011, 19:45:06 »

Quote from: ironman31;416195

Those will be my next audio purchase. Not sure how long from now, but I would really like something I can listen to in a library and still have them sound great. My sr60's don't really fit well in that category, lol.

HA, yeah, my re-cabled SR125's and first/second run AKG K701's are no good for wearing at work/in public. If you're looking for custom IEM's and are located in FL, I'd recommend a day trip to JHA to have them do the fitting and meet the people who make them. They're great people and you'll have a good conversation with them

ironman31 · « **Reply #754 on:** Wed, 14 September 2011, 19:59:19 »

Where is JHA located?

ascii · « **Reply #755 on:** Wed, 14 September 2011, 21:41:42 »

Quote from: ironman31;416269

Where is JHA located?

2517 East Semoran Blvd.
Apopka, FL 32703
866/485/9111
jhaudio.com

phillip · « **Reply #756 on:** Thu, 15 September 2011, 09:33:02 »

not headphone related, just audio related...

I decided to pull an old denon poa-2400a amp out of my closet the day before yesterday and use it for my movie/console setup. I also wanted to get the center speaker to the top shelf rather than being stuck so low in the middle. Unfortunately that means I had to put my tv on top of it. I don't really like having the tv up there, so I need to get a new stand soon that has a proper mount and room for everything else.

dorkvader · « **Reply #757 on:** Fri, 16 September 2011, 00:03:46 »

Quote from: NamelessPFG;415146

Same driver, much less cost? Now I'm really interested, and no, I'm not averse to modding. (If anything, it's said that the weakest part of the Fostex orthos is NOT the driver, but the enclosure. Now, if you've got $500 to spend, you could get some Thunderpants, which use those very same drivers from the look of it...but the enclosure is said to be that much better as far as sound quality goes. Or maybe people just like the wood look. Who knows?)

And as for the Stax SR-007/Omega 2 pads, I do remember hearing about someone sticking those on a set of SR-X/MK3s and saying the sound quality improved noticeably in addition to comfort. Too bad they're so expensive...but I suppose it's expected when it's an accessory for what is usually a $2,500 headphone.

I'd check if I were you, but I believe they are the same. Note that you'll get the "silver" painted metal parts on the other ones, though.

Also, on the thunderpants, from what I've read part of the sound comes from the wood, and more "solid" construction, but the bulk comes from the damping. Apparently playing with that will allow you to really bring out the thunder. Of course, the thunderpants are almost always closed or "really close", so that will greatly affect the sound.

Me, I'd love to turn some wood cups on a lathe and build one, but I haven't the time, money, effort, etc. at the moment.

Other pads include the sony SA5000 pads (which are like $55 each, also expensive) and pads from some Shure cans, that I do want to try.

I also plan to add a flexible leather strap under the headband to make a double headband. The adjusters stay almost all the way down always on my small head, so there's plenty of room, and I expect it to greatly increase comfort. Not that it needs it, though.

I still hate my SR225i's though. I'll probably wait until I have a good amp/DAC ready, then I might sell them.

Hitch22 · « **Reply #758 on:** Sat, 17 September 2011, 15:44:52 »

New range of Corsair gaming headphones coming soon. Link

Personally, I'm interested in the 1300 model because every set of USB headphones I've every tried has had awful sound quality.

arplod · « **Reply #759 on:** Sat, 17 September 2011, 16:18:40 »

Quote from: Hitch22;417826

New range of Corsair gaming headphones coming soon. Link

Personally, I'm interested in the 1300 model because every set of USB headphones I've every tried has had awful sound quality.

What, the HS1 & G35 too?

Hitch22 · « **Reply #760 on:** Sat, 17 September 2011, 16:29:54 »

Quote

What, the HS1 & G35 too?

I bought a set of HS1 USB for my old man and they sound pretty bad to me. Really tinny sounding. I can't speak to the G35's, never tried them.

dorkvader · « **Reply #761 on:** Tue, 20 September 2011, 19:58:37 »

I'm told Electrostats make good gaming headphones.

ironman31 · « **Reply #762 on:** Wed, 21 September 2011, 06:52:50 »

What is a good "gaming" headphone?

arplod · « **Reply #763 on:** Wed, 21 September 2011, 12:36:25 »

Quote from: ironman31;419486

What is a good "gaming" headphone?

IMO, one which does sound positioning well when working alongside Dolby Headphone or similar HRTF, and offers sufficient audio performance to allow you to make out all the game sounds as well as voices on top, alongside a tonal character that enhances immersion in gaming.

A lot of people equate a wide soundstage (i.e. a very distinct left-right separation of the stereo soundfield) with superior gaming attributes, but I disagree. In fact, the stereo, analog headphones I rate most for gaming, the closed Ultrasones equipped with S-Logic, have a distinctly compacted soundstage but with the ability to easier discern sweeping movements across the stereo and HRTF soundfield.

The Ultrasone Edition 8 is overkill (although in my possession where there is no such thing as overkill, they were my subway beaters until earlier this year) but it's the flagship example of a headphone with an oddly compacted, but somewhat more holographic representation of the stereo soundfield in stereo or when used with Dolby. Lesser closed Ultrasones will deliver much of the same gaming performance though.

Personally though, I stop at the diminishing returns level for PC gaming use and value usability just as much as sonic suitability, especially as I prefer headsets as opposed to headphones - since desk mics and clip-ons either get in the way, or are crud. Which is why you'll find me gaming on a Logitech G35.

Battou62 · « **Reply #764 on:** Thu, 22 September 2011, 10:59:42 »

I picked up a pair of Beyer DT 770 Pro's a few weeks ago off of Ebay for cheap. I have them paired up with a Audio-gd Sparrow. Its seriously overkill for gaming, but really adds to the immersion. Listening to music on the other hand is a very enjoyable experience.

hcry4 · « **Reply #765 on:** Thu, 22 September 2011, 11:23:26 »

I really like my 770s, too. A very good pair of closed headphones.

NamelessPFG · « **Reply #766 on:** Thu, 22 September 2011, 16:46:08 »

Quote from: dorkvader;419320

I'm told Electrostats make good gaming headphones.

My Stax Lambdas work excellently in games with CMSS-3D Headphone and can be worn for hours on end, but spending that kind of money on gaming-only headphones is getting into overkill territory. (Especially since vintage Lambda-series models seem to be getting more expensive over the years.) If you want something that also sounds great in music, though, why not give the electrostatic experience a shot? They may be the last headphones you ever need for home listening, and if you don't like them, they WILL sell.

Quote from: arplod;419598

Quote from: ironman31;419486
What is a good "gaming" headphone?
IMO, one which does sound positioning well when working alongside Dolby Headphone or similar HRTF, and offers sufficient audio performance to allow you to make out all the game sounds as well as voices on top, alongside a tonal character that enhances immersion in gaming.

Pretty much this. You want something that allows you to make out what a sound is and where it came from.

Can't vouch for or against Ultrasone, though; never heard a single model of theirs. (I did think about getting a Pro 900 at one point, just to know what the Ultrasone hype was all about...until I saw that Stax deal.)

suntorytime · « **Reply #767 on:** Fri, 23 September 2011, 00:56:54 »

Ultrasone seem very well geared for gaming. I have the HFI-2400 (open model), really good bass and the treble comes out in abundance. The DT770 which I also own do well too. I prefer the ultrasones as their imaging seems to be more accurate. I use either of these for gaming along with my webcam as the mic (easy to setup).

arplod · « **Reply #768 on:** Fri, 23 September 2011, 05:51:36 »

The only problem is - and this was one of the reasons I got rid of the Edition 8 as the aforementioned beaters - that I don't really find (closed, which is where they put in the most development thus far) Ultrasones all that enjoyable for music in terms of the way they sound, and also in the peculiar, aforementioned gaming-suitable way they deliver the soundstage. They're also certainly less fatiguing to listen to due to the way S-Logic works (and it does work) but I don't have a pair of headphones on my head as often as e.g. a recording engineer, so many of those features I think gets in the way of simple music listening.

The DT770 isn't a bad compromise for music + gaming (although it's not as good as a similarly priced closed Ultrasone for the latter), and we do have the MMX 300 which delivers (although less convenient than the G35 in a couple of areas and the fact that you have to pair it with a generic Dolby Headphone soundcard) headset-wise as well. Which is why I use a couple of those as well as the G35. But I still prefer to game on the G35, while I Skype on the Beyers because of the outstanding mic.

Mitchellderp · « **Reply #769 on:** Tue, 27 September 2011, 16:40:07 »

I have another audio based question - what are the best reasonably priced earphones? My Sennheiser CX500's just decided to die on me, as I expected seeing as they were about £8. Are there any budget ones that offer great performance?

arplod · « **Reply #770 on:** Tue, 27 September 2011, 17:49:21 »

Quote from: Mitchellderp;422290

I have another audio based question - what are the best reasonably priced earphones? My Sennheiser CX500's just decided to die on me, as I expected seeing as they were about £8. Are there any budget ones that offer great performance?

What do you expect if you buy fakes?

Ragnorock · « **Reply #771 on:** Tue, 27 September 2011, 19:31:43 »

Why Geekhack, how did you know about my other love?

AKG K701s fed from a Woo Audio 6 SE, with an EML 5U4G rectifier and matched Tung Sol 6SN7 GT driver tubes.

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 27446[/ATTACH]
[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 27447[/ATTACH]

I need more pictures of my headphones I realize. Here's a file photo:
[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 27448[/ATTACH]
I love them for their clarity and incredibly open soundstage. There is plenty of bass (most will say there isn't) so long as they are being driven properly by a good amp.

Am I doin it rite? Don't mind the 6Gv2, it's sitting in a box in my storage closet now.

Zamorph · « **Reply #772 on:** Tue, 27 September 2011, 20:58:14 »

Quote from: ironman31;419486

What is a good "gaming" headphone?

g35.

Mitchellderp · « **Reply #773 on:** Wed, 28 September 2011, 10:15:29 »

Quote from: arplod;422326

What do you expect if you buy fakes?

Amazon.co.uk sell fakes? Well, I'll be damned.

arplod · « **Reply #774 on:** Wed, 28 September 2011, 11:10:13 »

Quote from: Mitchellderp;422695

Amazon.co.uk sell fakes? Well, I'll be damned.

If it's too cheap to be true, it probably isn't. MSRP was £50 for it, wasn't it? I know people have been caught out by fake ATH-ES7's and CX300's. 500's, I wasn't aware of but I haven't kept touch.

Mitchellderp · « **Reply #775 on:** Wed, 28 September 2011, 13:19:55 »

Fake Filcos? Where?

hcry4 · « **Reply #776 on:** Wed, 28 September 2011, 13:30:30 »

Quote from: Mitchellderp;422815

Fake Filcos? Where?

Leopolds...? I kid. I kid.

Mitchellderp · « **Reply #777 on:** Wed, 28 September 2011, 14:26:06 »

Quote from: hcry4;422824

Leopolds...? I kid. I kid.

What you did there - I see it.

nar · « **Reply #778 on:** Wed, 28 September 2011, 15:10:24 »

Speaking of the PK3. I have the Sunrise AS-Feelings, they sound great and from what I read are comparable to the PK3s at pretty much the same price.
If you happen to live in Canada I'd recommend them over the PK3, solely because you get to pay cheap national shipping rather than international shipping and having to deal with customs.

Ekaros · « **Reply #779 on:** Thu, 29 September 2011, 04:37:27 »

I have been looking for replacement pads for my Sennheiser HD433, but they cost 12$ for two flat circular pieces of foam with hole in midlle. Too much for me. Have to wish for a new pair for christmas.

arplod · « **Reply #780 on:** Thu, 29 September 2011, 05:00:08 »

Quote from: ripster;422749

Fake Sennys? I've seen lots of Fake Filcos lately but not Sennys. They aren't that spendy.

Yeah - there was a big run on fake CX300's.

williamjoseph · « **Reply #781 on:** Sat, 01 October 2011, 00:36:13 »

Gee, if it wasnt for geekhack, i wouldnt be collecting keyboards and typewriters. Now i am starting to learn about head-fi.......

Tetsuma · « **Reply #782 on:** Sat, 01 October 2011, 01:14:04 »

Quote from: williamjoseph;424464

Gee, if it wasnt for geekhack, i wouldnt be collecting keyboards and typewriters. Now i am starting to learn about head-fi.......

Take the trite on that site with a bag of salt though. Also, never buy into cables sounding different and FoTM equipment. Some good posters there, lot of sensationalist's howling too.

Tetsuma · « **Reply #783 on:** Sat, 01 October 2011, 01:26:14 »

Quote from: Ragnorock;422370

Why Geekhack, how did you know about my other love?

AKG K701s fed from a Woo Audio 6 SE, with an EML 5U4G rectifier and matched Tung Sol 6SN7 GT driver tubes.

(Attachment Link) 27446[/ATTACH]
(Attachment Link) 27447[/ATTACH]
Show Image

I need more pictures of my headphones I realize. Here's a file photo:
(Attachment Link) 27448[/ATTACH]
I love them for their clarity and incredibly open soundstage. There is plenty of bass (most will say there isn't) so long as they are being driven properly by a good amp.

Am I doin it rite? Don't mind the 6Gv2, it's sitting in a box in my storage closet now.

Benchmark dac1, Heed Can amp, k701s here. How're you liking the woo 6? I was considering it as an upgrade to my can amp, but am tossing up just biting the bullet and getting a phonitor. Either that, or something solid state around $600.
Probably move onto LCD2 after that.

arplod · « **Reply #784 on:** Sat, 01 October 2011, 05:43:51 »

Quote from: Tetsuma;424479

Take the trite on that site with a bag of salt though. Also, never buy into cables sounding different and FoTM equipment. Some good posters there, lot of sensationalist's howling too.

Ironically for an audio site the SNR is incredibly low :whistle:

But then, after you gain some experience and don't consider the 'holy grail' purchases in that field a lot of money, most even enthusiast sites tend to be that way for me.

dorkvader · « **Reply #785 on:** Sun, 02 October 2011, 21:50:47 »

Quote from: Tetsuma;424480

Benchmark dac1, Heed Can amp, k701s here. How're you liking the woo 6? I was considering it as an upgrade to my can amp, but am tossing up just biting the bullet and getting a phonitor. Either that, or something solid state around $600.
Probably move onto LCD2 after that.

The Beta22 is supposed to be pretty good, and you can probably build one for $600. (~$110*3 + 120 (sigma22) +100 (transfromer)+ ?DIY case?) I'm more of a DIY-fan anyway. I'll probably DIY a nice keyboard sometime.

I considered getting the AKG as my first 'phone, but I started with the AD900, and really enjoy it. There may bass quantity, but the quality is there. I'm not much of a basshead anyway.

Once I get a real job, I'll probably get some nice Planar-magnetic headphones. LCD-2 is at the top of the list.

Pony · « **Reply #786 on:** Wed, 05 October 2011, 23:16:11 »

I just got a pair of ATH-AD700. Wow, wish I would have tried these years ago, woulda saved alot of money (much better than Beats by Dre Studio and Razer Barracudas I wasted money on).

LuvULongTime · « **Reply #787 on:** Tue, 25 October 2011, 19:06:07 »

For DIYers looking for closed cans the Fostex planar magnetic T50RPs are a great value. They can be easily modded to hang with the big boys. I was at a head-fi meet recently and had a chance to sample the LCD-3 and SR-009s. I walked away completely satisfied with my $75 cans.

ironman31 · « **Reply #788 on:** Tue, 25 October 2011, 19:27:29 »

Quote from: LuvULongTime;439308

For DIYers looking for closed cans the Fostex planar magnetic T50RPs are a great value. They can be easily modded to hang with the big boys. I was at a head-fi meet recently and had a chance to sample the LCD-3 and SR-009s. I walked away completely satisfied with my $75 cans.

Did you listen to Audez'e's 100k speakers?

LuvULongTime · « **Reply #789 on:** Thu, 27 October 2011, 02:12:26 »

Quote from: ironman31;439341

Did you listen to Audez'e's 100k speakers?

It was headphones only. Audeze brought their LCD-3s and a Red Wine Audio amp. 100k speakers, wow.

ironman31 · « **Reply #790 on:** Thu, 27 October 2011, 07:02:59 »

Quote from: LuvULongTime;440337

It was headphones only. Audeze brought their LCD-3s and a Red Wine Audio amp. 100k speakers, wow.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure they were showing off those, their near-field monitors, and their mic at the RMAF.

http://www.theaudiobeat.com/rmaf2011/rmaf2011_audeze.htm

RickyJ · « **Reply #791 on:** Fri, 28 October 2011, 23:15:25 »

There's some nice setups in this thread!

About a month ago I started looking into upgrading my headphones (Sennheiser HD228, ~2 years old), and foolishly bought a Corsair HS1A headset (online reviews were good...) to use while occasionally playing co-op games with friends. The Corsair headset was only $40 during an in-store sale at NCIX so I'm not overly broken up over the complete lack of bass, but it's still an unpleasant surprise. I do watch TV shows and movies on my PC right now, until I get my own place again where I can set up my plasma and Yamaha 5.1 system. So I've been primarily looking into gaming headphones/headset that will work great for TV/movies as well. Previously for co-op games I've plugged my Xbox 360 controller and headset into my PC just to use the mic, but it doesn't happen often enough for me to sacrifice sound quality for a built-in mic.

It's happened a few times now where I'll get deeper into headphone/DAC/amp research, then have to remind myself what I'm really going to be using it all for. So I think I've found a way to accommodate my wants/needs while still using modular building blocks. NCIX has the Creative X-Fi Titanium HD card with headphone amp good for 330Ω cans, for $130cdn after instant rebate. This card will do CMSS-3D virtual surround over the optical-out connection, so I can upgrade to a better DAC+amp at a later date and still get the benefits for gaming. For headphones, a local music store has Beyer Dynamic DT990Pro 250Ω for $180, sitting on the shelf. They also have the DT770Pro for the same price, but the comparisons I'm seeing for gaming puts the 990Pro in the lead.

Any feedback is definitely welcome!

TheProfosist · « **Reply #792 on:** Sat, 29 October 2011, 04:27:59 »

Right now im running Sony MDR-V6's because I got them at a low price (for the price I dont think that you can beat them) but after watching Dave Rat - The Mighty Headphone Quest I started looking at a pair of Denon AH-D2000's. I even tried them in person but until recently I couldnt find a good enough price to buy and now it looks like I missed out on the deal on buy.com.

Kick · « **Reply #793 on:** Sat, 29 October 2011, 04:35:53 »

For those wondering about headphones for gaming, you're probably better off with open backed headphones. The ad700 would be highly recommended by most/all gamers that have actually tried them. Definitely get those. Sounstage is amazing but because they're open backed, the bass is lacking. But then again, I'd like my bass to be limited if I'm gaming. How're you going to hear footsteps when an explosion occurs right next to you

For music it's pretty damn good too but again. Do not expect bass for you dubstep listeners

ironman31 · « **Reply #794 on:** Sat, 29 October 2011, 07:16:52 »

Quote from: Kick;441690

For those wondering about headphones for gaming, you're probably better off with open backed headphones. The ad700 would be highly recommended by most/all gamers that have actually tried them. Definitely get those. Sounstage is amazing but because they're open backed, the bass is lacking. But then again, I'd like my bass to be limited if I'm gaming. How're you going to hear footsteps when an explosion occurs right next to you

For music it's pretty damn good too but again. Do not expect bass for you dubstep listeners

I actually don't mind the bass in headphones such as the Grado sr60i's. Many of the dubstep recordings aren't very good anyways, so if the headphone can play that frequency, then it's good enough. I think the grado's bass is nice and tight, even if it is a little lacking. And that's coming from someone who normally listens to a pair of LCD-2's, who's bass response is ridonkulous.

laffindude · « **Reply #795 on:** Sat, 29 October 2011, 09:05:40 »

Quote from: RickyJ;441603

It's happened a few times now where I'll get deeper into headphone/DAC/amp research, then have to remind myself what I'm really going to be using it all for. So I think I've found a way to accommodate my wants/needs while still using modular building blocks. NCIX has the Creative X-Fi Titanium HD card with headphone amp good for 330Ω cans, for $130cdn after instant rebate. This card will do CMSS-3D virtual surround over the optical-out connection, so I can upgrade to a better DAC+amp at a later date and still get the benefits for gaming. For headphones, a local music store has Beyer Dynamic DT990Pro 250Ω for $180, sitting on the shelf. They also have the DT770Pro for the same price, but the comparisons I'm seeing for gaming puts the 990Pro in the lead.

Any feedback is definitely welcome!

I use my DT990pro as my movie/gaming can. I use it over my T1 and DT880/600 from the same family. The bass really add some oomph to explosions. It also has a bigger sense of space than DT880. Though, if you're sensitive to treble, you may want to felt mod it (add a 1.5mm thick felt in front of the driver like DT880). If bass is too much, add a piece of felt behind the driver at the vent. These also kick the crap out of Grados as low volume listening cans. I like these for acoustics guitars, electronica, and sometimes orchestras as it brings out the rumble of double bass. It is an irreplaceable can in my collection. DT990 Premium is tooooo close in performance to pay extra for, though you can sometimes find them for sale for not much over 200.
Don't bother with X-Fi. CMSS3D sounds like ass. I'd get a Xonar ST with low latency drivers over the creative.

Quote from: Kick;441690

The ad700 would be highly recommended by most/all gamers that have actually tried them.

I don't like them one bit. Bad bass extension and a bit one note bass, like most AT I've heard.

RickyJ · « **Reply #796 on:** Sat, 29 October 2011, 11:08:38 »

Thanks for the feedback laffindude. Good to know it's easy to tone down the one complaint I've heard of the 990Pros. I've seen another reference to CMSS-3D sounding muddy, I suppose the reviewer comparisons between CMSS-3D and DH are focused 100% on competitive gaming. I play 90% single player FPS/RPG and 10% co-op multiplayer with friends, so it would just be nice to hear where the enemies are instead of guessing, without sacrificing sound quality.

My only PCI slot right now is between my SLI'd GTX285's, which would make for a noisy environment for a sound card, no? I've got a PCI-e 4x slot on top, which I was hoping would be a better environment for the sound card. From what I've gathered, the only differences between the Asus STX and ST are: PCI vs PCI-e, ST has header for 7.1 analog breakout board, ST has better clock circuit for lower jitter. Is it worth paying the extra $20 and putting the card between two GPUs for lower jitter?

Thanks,
Rick

edit: Can the Asus cards output the virtual surround modified signal over a digital connection like the Creative one I've been looking at? That would make it easier to add a better DAC+amp later and keep the surround.

laffindude · « **Reply #797 on:** Sat, 29 October 2011, 11:52:00 »

In another life when I was a competitive gamer, I hated the extra processing done on by the sound card. None of the "virtual surround" sounds correct, and straight up stereo had the best sound positioning for me. Very subjective so take that with a pound of salt. Some people need to have the crossfeed type sound to help with positioning.
Xonar can do virtual surround if that is what you want (not sure on the digital output though). I don't know how it sounds compared to Creative solutions though. Like I said, I just use stereo (I use 2.0 monitors as well). I don't think the better clocks are reason enough to get the PCI version over the STX. Don't read too much into what headfi thinks. They all flocked to the Asus after the Creative debacle. Now they claim Asus sucks after a few years after crowning it as the best sound card. Just get something you can afford and be happy. You don't need the gimmicks for spacial positioning. The DAC in the Asus is decent, and the drives DT990 well enough. DT990 is a bit more picky about amps. They sound a bit too sharp with under powered amps, with loose uncontrolled bass.

TheProfosist · « **Reply #798 on:** Sat, 29 October 2011, 11:59:52 »

Personally for PC gaming im waiting for Creative's New DAC. For everything else I use a Edirol FA-66.

NamelessPFG · « **Reply #799 on:** Sun, 30 October 2011, 13:44:30 »

Quote from: laffindude;441748

Don't bother with X-Fi. CMSS3D sounds like ass.

I wouldn't use it for music, but for gaming, the imaging is leagues ahead of stereo for me.

Note that I still play a lot of older games that use DirectSound3D or OpenAL. In these games, CMSS-3D Headphone doesn't make the foolish step of emulating a speaker system; instead, it directly processes every virtual sound source for a more proper binaural effect. You even get height cues (which are sorely missing in newer games that use XAudio2 or FMOD because they pre-mix everything to 7.1 at most and stereo at least before it hits the sound driver)! (And on top of this, some of those games use EAX 3/4/5, so the X-Fi DSP is still needed for that.)

One major example that comes to mind is Unreal Tournament (which uses OpenAL with the help of an Old Unreal patch; UT 2004 uses OpenAL by default). In stereo, the sounds are clear, but all jammed right next to my ears. I don't have a clear image of exactly what sounds are coming from where. I keep flicking CMSS-3D Headphone on and off to compare, but I still get the same issue with plain stereo.

As you say, though, it's very subjective. At least it's optional and not forced on anyone; toggle to taste. (It doesn't help that you can't get a personalized HRTF on the more affordable binaural surround filters; for that, you'd need a $3,000+ Smyth Realiser and a chance to record a good home theater system. In the end, it's still emulated 7.1 at most, not a true 3D sound field...if only we could have it all.)

Now, I won't get into the usual CMSS-3D Headphone vs. Dolby Headphone or X-Fi (Creative, some Auzentech) vs. C-Media (Asus, HT Omega, most Auzentech) cards, only because I haven't owned a C-Media card with Dolby Headphone and don't intend to buy one any time soon. Note that I actually rather loathe Creative as a corporation, but I don't have much choice in the matter if I want my older games to sound as the developers intended (with EAX). Maybe things would be different if Aureal had survived...

Quote from: RickyJ;441796

Can the Asus cards output the virtual surround modified signal over a digital connection like the Creative one I've been looking at? That would make it easier to add a better DAC+amp later and keep the surround.

I cannot confirm this directly, but word on Head-Fi is that Xonar cards cannot output Dolby Headphone-processed two-channel over S/PDIF, while X-Fi cards can output CMSS-3D Headphone-processed audio over S/PDIF. That would be a shame if Asus really did impose such a limitation.

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Author Topic: Headphone Thread. (Read 1314605 times)