geekhack

geekhack Marketplace => Interest Checks => Topic started by: Lil on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:10:52

Title: [IC] Ex Idol - Has now been open-sourced.
Post by: Lil on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:10:52
Ex: Idol [Open sourced]
(https://imgur.com/NyvIja8.png)

Stay up to date with this and my other projects - by joining my discord, linked here:  https://discord.gg/5EHyfwCchZ (https://discord.gg/5EHyfwCchZ)
Open sourced here:  LINK TO GITHUB (https://github.com/designedbydark/open-source-keyboards-designedbydark)


(https://imgur.com/iCVszYs.png)

Specifications
.F12 layout TKL, WKL + WK. Changed to F12 in the open sourced version.
.9 Degree typing angle and below 17.5mm adjusted front height [front height measured from the inside of the bezel to the bottom of the case]
.Top mount variation based on the 'ecliptica' plate. Stylised for this keyboard.
.Large through-weight
.Easy to pick up due to the side profile/bottom shape
.Original design yet reminscent of the styling of KPOP themed boards; faithful as an evolution to the spirit of the design language inherited from the Camp C225 Keyboard  (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=81377.0)

(https://imgur.com/jO0HHrk.png)
(https://imgur.com/OYWz0Y0.png)
(https://imgur.com/vUImo5l.png)
Inspiration

(https://imgur.com/TImJQtz.png)(https://imgur.com/qrZn5OS.png)(https://imgur.com/6sos2zu.png)

Typing test by Shoobs of V1 using bumpon mounting
(https://imgur.com/hVP4Yj9.png)



Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:12:02
RESERVED
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: ankit on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:15:00
I love you dark.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Gondolindrim on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:15:44
Let's goooo
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: chat and team on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:17:59
sick mounting, estimated price?
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Diggidy on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:23:32
.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: caap on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:25:23
nicely written IC, good work on the board! :thumb:

excited for the public buy!
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: 7empest on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:28:17
the plate on this board looks amazing. i love it! great stuff
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Hinkerbottom on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:29:28
Let’s goooo Dark, consider me in :)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Zeelobby on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:30:45
Awesome stuff. As always. Pushing that design limit

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: SDKCAMPING on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:32:35
i don't know how effective those leaf springs will be on the bottom two mounting points considering the point is directly mounted to the plate avoiding the spring, but cool none the less with the bumpons,

The bottom shape is not my style, feels a little weird and forced or something not sure. but really I don't think this board shares any similar design to most of the K-pop boards i know like the jinsoul or IU or RBB, those have the simple and clean design but not very original, while this one is original but it looks kind of unsure or lost in what it wants to look like if that makes sense. maybe the one trait they share is a K-pop engraving
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: fropsie on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:45:27
Dark so stinky. Good thing the work is good  :)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Puddsy on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:48:30
taking the under on this one making it past GB based on your previous projects, also taking the under on this board feeling notably different from other gasket mount leaf spring boards

but the plate looks cool, shame it goes inside the board where i will never see it
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Fri, 20 May 2022, 19:59:06
taking the under on this one making it past GB based on your previous projects, also taking the under on this board feeling notably different from other gasket mount leaf spring boards

but the plate looks cool, shame it goes inside the board where i will never see it

Your lack of reading comprehension never fails to amaze me
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Puddsy on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:06:04
taking the under on this one making it past GB based on your previous projects, also taking the under on this board feeling notably different from other gasket mount leaf spring boards

but the plate looks cool, shame it goes inside the board where i will never see it

Your lack of reading comprehension never fails to amaze me

what am i not comprehending

there's no gb date or info in post (except that it might be private gb, at which point, why make a GH post), no clear testimony about the feel, and i can't see the plate in the photos where the board is put together
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Kokaloo on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:13:28
These naming schemes are always so odd all I can think about is how the designer has most absolutely definitely whacked it to the idol these names are based off of
Bumpon mount is neat and paired with spring leaf I can see how you want something a little more stuff like a bumpon but I can't imagine it makes that drastic of a different over it being screws into a post. At least you can replace the bumpon with harder/softer materials? Still very complicated.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Puddsy on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:15:14
I can't imagine it makes that drastic of a different over it being screws into a post.

rare kokaloo puddsy agreement
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:19:55
Quote

taking the under on this one making it past GB based on your previous projects
what am i not comprehending

In the first paragraph of the post I state I have successfully run and delivered 4 GBs/projects/private buys in a row (Since mid 2021), and you are saying based on this you think it's unlikely I will be able to successfully run a public GB.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Kokaloo on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:21:48
I can't imagine it makes that drastic of a different over it being screws into a post.

rare kokaloo puddsy agreement

Christ look at all those typos how embarrassing
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Puddsy on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:22:49
Quote

taking the under on this one making it past GB based on your previous projects
what am i not comprehending

In the first paragraph of the post I state I have successfully run and delivered 4 GBs/projects/private buys in a row (Since mid 2021), and you are saying based on this you think it's unlikely I will be able to successfully run a public GB.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=110579.msg3000385#msg3000385

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=111859.msg3027892#msg3027892

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=113347.msg3058625#msg3058625

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=114305.msg3076945#msg3076945
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:27:46
Yes, my first keyboard design failed. All the rest are keysets which I shelved in order to focus on keyboards.

The past 4 keyboard GBs have all been made, and have been delivered or are currently being delivered.
There isn't any other designer in this hobby that has turned around so many self run projects in the same time frame.

If you continue to try to baselessly throw mud at me trying to make something stick, just because you dislike me, you might find yourself regretting it.

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Puddsy on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:32:17
Yes, my first keyboard design failed. All the rest are keysets which I shelved in order to focus on keyboards.

The past 4 keyboard GBs have all been made, and have been delivered or are currently being delivered.
There isn't any other designer in this hobby that has turned around so many self run projects in the same time frame.

If you continue to try to baselessly throw mud at me trying to make something stick, just because you dislike me, you might find yourself regretting it.

(https://i.imgur.com/iwXkVZp.png)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: wigol2506 on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:44:18
Tbh your contention with Puddsy's opinion that this might not make it past GB based on your past projects having not gone past the GB stage is bewildering when its your own fact that you shelved those abovementioned projects after IC.

GLWIC tho

Nice design overall but indifferent about the plate design till a review on it is made. 
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: shima on Fri, 20 May 2022, 20:58:40
ex idol so lit
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Yaezaki on Fri, 20 May 2022, 21:10:52
sick mount bro, love to see this on live gb
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: keyjemm on Fri, 20 May 2022, 21:16:23
yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes .... yes
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Shoobs on Fri, 20 May 2022, 21:19:42
I like it
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: subieboobies on Fri, 20 May 2022, 21:31:43
really liking the look of this, definitely interested if alternative engravings are available
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: tngpq on Fri, 20 May 2022, 21:50:11
It’s a leaf spring with bumpons. How innovative, lol.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Screen.jing on Fri, 20 May 2022, 21:51:10
Mr Dark i love you, i love this, good luck with this  :cool:
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: TypicalOranges on Fri, 20 May 2022, 22:20:35
Have you guys done a fatigue analysis of the leaf spring?
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: granola bar enthusiast on Fri, 20 May 2022, 22:37:09
i feel this is less of a "next-generation mounting method" and more of a mod on the existing isolated gasket mount. Regardless a nice design
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: LaserCrafter on Fri, 20 May 2022, 22:37:53
i would take this over gasket mount poron foam pe foam meme boards
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: jrfhoutx on Fri, 20 May 2022, 23:39:37
The past 4 keyboard GBs have all been made, and have been delivered or are currently being delivered.

since these 4 projects were all private buys, out of curiosity, how many units of each were produced?
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: FatefulStranger on Fri, 20 May 2022, 23:43:37
This actually goes pretty hard, I dig it. Hope to see an estimated price for this cool board.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: dérobé on Sat, 21 May 2022, 00:20:43
Very unique and cool looking board. Will be keeping up with this one.

Wish there was some more info on this IC though...
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Sicowa on Sat, 21 May 2022, 00:32:47
wickedge board dark,
glwic
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: chat and team on Sat, 21 May 2022, 03:30:44
Yes, my first keyboard design failed. All the rest are keysets which I shelved in order to focus on keyboards.

The past 4 keyboard GBs have all been made, and have been delivered or are currently being delivered.
There isn't any other designer in this hobby that has turned around so many self run projects in the same time frame.

If you continue to try to baselessly throw mud at me trying to make something stick, just because you dislike me, you might find yourself regretting it.

Show Image
(https://i.imgur.com/iwXkVZp.png)

No puddsy!!! Ics should be friends of the TC and good comments only!!!! inb4 500+ for this
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: linell on Sat, 21 May 2022, 03:41:50
bumpon mount is hawt
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: zekkin on Sat, 21 May 2022, 03:55:57
Been lurking around your socials and I'm really liking this, it's clear you put a lot of thought and work into it.

:thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: unusuaL_ on Sat, 21 May 2022, 04:56:18
Happy to see visas' mounting on a TKL. I'm also really appreciating the distinguishable looks, as with your design language in general. GLWGB
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Sat, 21 May 2022, 06:18:20
Let's goooo

the plate on this board looks amazing. i love it! great stuff

Awesome stuff. As always. Pushing that design limit


Dark so stinky. Good thing the work is good  :)

I like it

Thank you brothers for supporting me
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Sat, 21 May 2022, 06:26:46
nicely written IC, good work on the board! :thumb:

excited for the public buy!


Thank you!

I love you dark.

Thanks for your kind words ankit

I love it - great design, the mounting method is very interesting.

Is the proto that shoobs built without the front lip? I agree that it definitely improves the overall look - given that the front bezels need to be so thick to accommodate for the mounts - and is probably more comfortable to type on as well.

Thank you, yes you are correct. It was without the lip and I feel like it would look better with it. The CCRX is used as an example of how it looks in real life. Since it doesn't affect the height of the keycaps it won't affect the typing experience, but I really like how it looks.

Mr Dark i love you, i love this, good luck with this  :cool:

Thank you Yung Jing.

ex idol so lit

Fire emoji

yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes .... yes

yes

Very unique and cool looking board. Will be keeping up with this one.

Wish there was some more info on this IC though...

Ty. What information would you like to see?

Let’s goooo Dark, consider me in :)

Your interest has been noted.

wickedge board dark,
glwic

Thank you.

This actually goes pretty hard, I dig it. Hope to see an estimated price for this cool board.

Thank you. To be honest, for the first protoype, I only got a quote for one unit and not more. I am getting a quote with the changes, like changing to F13 and the lip etc for higher unit counts, I am aware that going with or without a vendor could impact the price by a large amount.

really liking the look of this, definitely interested if alternative engravings are available

Understood, it should be possible to offer an alt version without

sick mount bro, love to see this on live gb

Thank you!

bumpon mount is hawt

Pray Emoji

Happy to see visas' mounting on a TKL. I'm also really appreciating the distinguishable looks, as with your design language in general. GLWGB

Thank you sir. I liked your hali collab
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Sat, 21 May 2022, 06:33:00
Been lurking around your socials and I'm really liking this, it's clear you put a lot of thought and work into it.

:thumb:

I really appreciate you saying that! Your recognition means alot, like being complimented by a renowned sushi chef for my fish or something
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: denibhoxha on Sat, 21 May 2022, 07:41:43
Very cool seeing in detail how the bumpon mount works, really cool showcase Mr. Dark.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: CookieFlow on Sat, 21 May 2022, 08:10:18
I'm really not a big TKL fan and I never understood these boards inspired by/designed for K-Pop and idols.
I really can't grasp the connection between the two.

But the board itself looks nice and the mounting looks fun (not sure it really feels any different than a regular leaf spring, but at least it's something a bit different), will keep an eye on the project  :thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Vigrith on Sat, 21 May 2022, 08:29:36
If you continue to try to baselessly throw mud at me trying to make something stick, just because you dislike me, you might find yourself regretting it.

Is this serious or satire? It better be satire LOL

PS: the whole thread reeks of discord. Unfortunate.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Zeelobby on Sat, 21 May 2022, 08:45:12
If you continue to try to baselessly throw mud at me trying to make something stick, just because you dislike me, you might find yourself regretting it.

Is this serious or satire? It better be satire LOL

PS: the whole thread reeks of discord. Unfortunate.
If you mean supporters from Lil's private buys are here to support this one, there's nothing shocking about that. If you mean drama carried over from discords, well they're kind of central to the hobby at this point. Agree the response was misplaced but not sure why "discord" = bad.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Sat, 21 May 2022, 08:55:33

Is this serious or satire? It better be satire LOL

PS: the whole thread reeks of discord. Unfortunate.

(https://c.tenor.com/B72kPCAnzu4AAAAC/thats-bait-bait.gif.png)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: zekth on Sat, 21 May 2022, 09:27:48
Mount looks sick

Inspiration / engraving total meh

Quote
[Changing to F13 from F12 in the second rendition/prototype]

RIP...
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Laur on Sat, 21 May 2022, 10:30:41
Although looking cool, I can't see how this mounting has benefits over conventional mounting systems, maybe we should just stick to the previous generation Dark. Not a fan of the bezels and large case fillets but we all have our preferences. Also I love K-Pop women!!!!
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: prettydouchebag on Sat, 21 May 2022, 12:32:34
Fantastic, another k-pop idol board. One that isn't completely cookie-cutter though.

Mounting looks absolutely fun. Great job on previous runs and hope this one goes just as smoothly.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: LaserCrafter on Sat, 21 May 2022, 13:13:58
Yes, my first keyboard design failed. All the rest are keysets which I shelved in order to focus on keyboards.

The past 4 keyboard GBs have all been made, and have been delivered or are currently being delivered.
There isn't any other designer in this hobby that has turned around so many self run projects in the same time frame.

If you continue to try to baselessly throw mud at me trying to make something stick, just because you dislike me, you might find yourself regretting it.
Its really hard to take you seriously, drop your ego please
https://imgur.com/pzIUrbh (ignore the fat stuff that stuff totally isn't true and not nice fatphobia is seriously an issue and people should not judge based off appearances)

chat and team, I appreciate your input dude, but you're always so ****ing negative man. Honestly man, this is the one thing i ****ing hate about streaming some times, because you always have this one guy that just needs to be super ****ing negative all the time when you stream. I appreciate your input man but like my god, I never see positive stuff come from you. It's always just like bashing people, making fun of things. Even in Simon's chat one time too. It's just so ****ing tiring bro, like it honestly is dude. I understand you don't want the product and stuff like that but you don't need to be so god damn ****ing negative man. Like it really is ****ing tiring to read. ****. It's so boring to read the same **** over and over and over again from the same people. You don't like anything, cool! Find a new hobby maybe. ****.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: LaserCrafter on Sat, 21 May 2022, 13:16:37
my sh*tposting aside, this is a cool board and i'm glad that you're doing cool things in this hobby dark
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Photekq on Sat, 21 May 2022, 22:32:58
Very cool mount. It's great to see a serious implementation of snaking XY flexures. I messed around with some in CAD but never came up with something as sensible or realistic as this.

How much have you experimented with the dimensions of the flexures? Clearly, they provide a lot of flex as-is, but going by that video I think there's some room for optimizing it with respect to fatigue over time (that is, if this board will experience fatigue at all). I'd be really curious to see a video of the winkey area mounts in action too.

These are very small things, but I'd love to see a different font choice for the engravings as well as hex fasteners. I quite like the choice of font - it reminds me a lot of small brand logos from Japan/Korea in the late 90s/early 00s, but I don't think it meshes well with such a futuristic design.

taking the under on this one making it past GB based on your previous projects
He's done quite a few private buys successfully in a short span of time. I think he deserves more than zero confidence for that.

I can't imagine it makes that drastic of a different over it being screws into a post. At least you can replace the bumpon with harder/softer materials? Still very complicated.
Screwing these to posts would perform very differently for numerous reasons. But I'll give you one particularly important one: bumpons mounted in a dish allows for rotation along the Y axis, which will make a hell of a difference in the case of this specific mount. Have a look at the video in OP, you should see it clearly. I also don't think the hardness of the bumpons would have much of a difference; bumpons of that dimension could never provide as much flex as the flexures themselves.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: $W4GK!NG on Sun, 22 May 2022, 00:45:39
:gugapog: good **** mister dark

Sent from my Disco using Geekhack
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: berto on Sun, 22 May 2022, 09:37:29
mr dark, you are so lovely
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: soundstage on Sun, 22 May 2022, 11:22:50
You should edit your OP title to include the word WKL so people do not get misled.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: catamscott on Sun, 22 May 2022, 14:23:12
mounting looks very cool, always nice seeing new mounting styles being developed. curious if the bottom flex is significantly different because of the portions directly connected to the plate, but realistically who knows how noticeable the general flex/softness would be in average real world use. regardless, it's the experimentation that makes the hobby fun. very cool stuff  :thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Nonnegaard on Sun, 22 May 2022, 16:45:15
the plate is a work of art
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: spedywin on Sun, 22 May 2022, 17:41:08
interesting
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Mon, 23 May 2022, 05:28:56
Mount looks sick

Inspiration / engraving total meh

Quote
[Changing to F13 from F12 in the second rendition/prototype]

RIP...

I appreciate it, and at this point I intend to offer a version without engravings

Fantastic, another k-pop idol board. One that isn't completely cookie-cutter though.

Mounting looks absolutely fun. Great job on previous runs and hope this one goes just as smoothly.

Thank you for your kind words
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Mon, 23 May 2022, 06:54:18
Very cool mount. It's great to see a serious implementation of snaking XY flexures. I messed around with some in CAD but never came up with something as sensible or realistic as this.

How much have you experimented with the dimensions of the flexures? Clearly, they provide a lot of flex as-is, but going by that video I think there's some room for optimizing it with respect to fatigue over time (that is, if this board will experience fatigue at all). I'd be really curious to see a video of the winkey area mounts in action too.

These are very small things, but I'd love to see a different font choice for the engravings as well as hex fasteners. I quite like the choice of font - it reminds me a lot of small brand logos from Japan/Korea in the late 90s/early 00s, but I don't think it meshes well with such a futuristic design.

Thank you!
Hex fasteners are being used on the current prototype, and countersunk into the internal fastening point so there isn't any possibility of interference between the screw head and the keycaps when typing.
I personally think mechanical keyboards are pretty retro futuristic in general which is probably why I don't find a problem with it. I can probably offer an option for them to be completely blank along with the rest of the engravings if this is something people want.

I try to get things right the first time, although admittedly that's pretty difficult when trying to do something new. With this being a public GB there will probably be more opportunity to experiment and prototype things. On previous designs I have have tried much more fragile implementations of aluminium plates - they've been used consistently for coming up to a year without any fatigue that I have noticed thusfar.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: LegendsWorks on Mon, 23 May 2022, 09:10:11
Yeah, This is cool.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: zekth on Mon, 23 May 2022, 16:39:09
Mount looks sick

Inspiration / engraving total meh

Quote
[Changing to F13 from F12 in the second rendition/prototype]

RIP...

I appreciate it, and at this point I intend to offer a version without engravings


Pretty cool move. But F12 is no more you confirm?
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Tue, 24 May 2022, 11:01:31
(https://imgur.com/7bjttKs.png)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Tue, 24 May 2022, 11:08:33
:gugapog: good **** mister dark

Sent from my Disco using Geekhack


my sh*tposting aside, this is a cool board and i'm glad that you're doing cool things in this hobby dark

mr dark, you are so lovely

the plate is a work of art

interesting

Yeah, This is cool.

Thanks everyone!


Pretty cool move. But F12 is no more you confirm?

Yes F13 is confirmed. I might put a blocker at the f13 location but that would be the only other option.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: bshendy on Tue, 24 May 2022, 20:30:17
So since the 'leafs' are kinda dangling out, we're pretty much screwed if they end up getting bent or something like that during shipping, falling at the wrong angle, etc. etc. etc right?

And it seems like a material like pom for the plate would simply not work since it's too flexible?
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Tue, 24 May 2022, 21:15:25
So since the 'leafs' are kinda dangling out, we're pretty much screwed if they end up getting bent or something like that during shipping, falling at the wrong angle, etc. etc. etc right?

And it seems like a material like pom for the plate would simply not work since it's too flexible?

The chances of dropping a plate and damaging it is far lower than the risk of dropping an entire keyboard and denting it. Not sure what else needs to be said with that, maybe you think the average keyboard case design needs to be adapted so it's much more resistant to dropping? Different plate materials are probably possible, depending on the minimum thickness allowable. It might be better to create one intended experience rather than enable several sub par options though... I guess that's something to test in the next prototyping round
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: darthcapn on Wed, 25 May 2022, 02:36:29
The mounting style looks interesting! Glwic!

Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: VXQN on Wed, 25 May 2022, 03:48:34
Those bottom Winkey mounting points look like they won't flex as much as the others, due to the "support bars" either side of the leaf spring. Is that a reasonable assessment?
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Zeelobby on Wed, 25 May 2022, 07:19:46
Those bottom Winkey mounting points look like they won't flex as much as the others, due to the "support bars" either side of the leaf spring. Is that a reasonable assessment?
My guess would be that because of the xonledge on the bottom (to achieve low front lip) you don't want the bottom to be as flexible as the top, otherwise you risk bottoming out the bottom row of keys. I'm not a designer tho. Could be totally wrong.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Ghostinn on Wed, 25 May 2022, 08:20:23
I really, REALLY, enjoy the innovation here for the plate mounting method, as well as the simple but beautiful side profile. I also agree with whoever said it above, this would be very interesting to see a stress test as well as a fatigue test over time, but with the way you have your cutouts (especially under the WK), I doubt there will be droop and fatigue. The bumpon is a fantastic idea to start a new era in designing mounting methods, excited to see how this idea can be implemented further in the future. Good luck!
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Wed, 25 May 2022, 17:45:08
Mini update

Considering a version without engravings/Kpop references. It looked a little bland though so I thought about doing a blocker instead.

(https://imgur.com/IOLP1Vq.png) (https://imgur.com/fT2QG8P.png)

Gondo is working on adapting the PCB to be F13 [Only one of the JST connectors will be used on the actual PCB]:

(https://imgur.com/e63MDoB.png) (https://imgur.com/E7KuZUH.png)

If the project is run through a vendor with sufficient units, then I would like to use a CEM3 PCB for the GB. If it's on the lower end of things - say 30-50 units, it will probably be standard FR4 instead. It should be possible to try to match the PCB colour to a custom pantone, maybe something pink or lilac could be fun.

At this point I'm trying to finalise changes prior to a second and hopefully final prototype revision being ordered. I will consider prototyping different plate materials and potentially a PC version of the case if that seems feasible. Being able to see the mounting and the plate through the case is a nice idea.

Once I have the second prototype in hand, I can go about doing further testing/demonstrations of the plate mounting; along with answering more questions of that nature at that point.

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: SDKCAMPING on Thu, 26 May 2022, 16:57:14
i saw this vid the other day,

this one has much thicker spring mechanism than yours, and it has permanent warping pretty easily, so please check to see how your system handles it
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: stidal on Thu, 26 May 2022, 21:10:21
drama aside how has nobody pointed out that the bottom looks like amogus
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Zeelobby on Thu, 26 May 2022, 21:40:53
i saw this vid the other day,

this one has much thicker spring mechanism than yours, and it has permanent warping pretty easily, so please check to see how your system handles it
Def important to check. That said I'm not sure if the stems in that wildcat vid were tight or what, but she pressed down pretty hard to get those on. I imagine through normal typing you probably wouldn't have to worry. Just don't beast your caps on.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Fri, 27 May 2022, 17:12:28
i saw this vid the other day,

this one has much thicker spring mechanism than yours, and it has permanent warping pretty easily, so please check to see how your system handles it

I thought this was obvious just by looking, but you're making me feel like it's not?

(https://imgur.com/Xjgo0cW.png)

Here a thin unsupported part is holding the entire weight of the plate/pcb combination against the force of the typing, this is exacerbated by the long travel distance that the force has to travel laterally
Looking at this, it's easy to see that it's liable to bend. The whole 'flex' that this 'leafspring' generated relies on it bending or deforming. The design is banking on the mounting point being close in proximity in the up/down [edit: for clarity] north/south dimension to compensate for a lack of support provided by the mechanism.

My implementation is the complete opposite approach, where the 'leafspring coils' themselves provide support. It's obvious to me that a more tightly bound coil, as opposed to no coil at all, will provide more support. It's probably something to do with when the force travels around the corner of the bend, and would deform as in the example of the board you have provided, that deformation and tearing force is resisted by the bend in front and behind. That simultaneous transfer and resisting of force is very different from an implementation which has no support and intends to create a typing feeling through only deformation of the plate. I'm just someone who designs intuitively, so I have difficulty trying to explain what I innately understand.

(https://imgur.com/WUNrsSb.png)

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: plag on Fri, 27 May 2022, 21:14:21
interesting plate design..... stainless weight...... a great but simple looking side profile. count me in  :thumb: its obvious that this board is work of passion, however, id really love to know what colors are available as well as the price. id love nothing more than to have a red unit on my desk in the future. glwic  :p
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: vonk on Wed, 01 June 2022, 05:06:16
i saw this vid the other day,

this one has much thicker spring mechanism than yours, and it has permanent warping pretty easily, so please check to see how your system handles it

I thought this was obvious just by looking, but you're making me feel like it's not?

Show Image
(https://imgur.com/Xjgo0cW.png)


Here a thin unsupported part is holding the entire weight of the plate/pcb combination against the force of the typing, this is exacerbated by the long travel distance that the force has to travel laterally
Looking at this, it's easy to see that it's liable to bend. The whole 'flex' that this 'leafspring' generated relies on it bending or deforming. The design is banking on the mounting point being close in proximity in the up/down [edit: for clarity] north/south dimension to compensate for a lack of support provided by the mechanism.

My implementation is the complete opposite approach, where the 'leafspring coils' themselves provide support. It's obvious to me that a more tightly bound coil, as opposed to no coil at all, will provide more support. It's probably something to do with when the force travels around the corner of the bend, and would deform as in the example of the board you have provided, that deformation and tearing force is resisted by the bend in front and behind. That simultaneous transfer and resisting of force is very different from an implementation which has no support and intends to create a typing feeling through only deformation of the plate. I'm just someone who designs intuitively, so I have difficulty trying to explain what I innately understand.

Show Image
(https://imgur.com/WUNrsSb.png)


I don't think you can expect any plastic deformation from normal use, although it would be quite easy to permanently deform from improper handling, so no holding it by one mounting point and then waiving it around to see what happens.

To comment on the 40% video.  A single flat bar supported only at both ends will bend in the middle.  If the cross section stays the same, the longer the distance between the supported ends the more it will bend with the same applied force. With sufficient flex the metal will plastically deform and the bend will be permanent. To avoid this your options are: Change the shape to make it stiffer (why I beams are a thing), change the material, make the unsupported length smaller or redistribute the load. That said it looks like the observed bend is due to improper handling as in use the load should be sufficiently distributed in normal use.

Your 'coil' design has short straight lengths between the bends so it is unlikely to deform in the same way.  The force has to go into the metal somewhere, however.  In the case of your coil, I would expect the deformation to be mostly torsional at the bends.  With the first bend twisting most and the last bend twisting least.

But for people worried, just look at the video in the first post, empirical is always better than theoretical.  In the video the 'coil' handles a large displacement elastically without any problem :).  Also, since only the bottom Bumpon is supported in the demo, it shows a much larger flex than you can expect when both top and bottom Bumpon are supported.

My solid mechanics are a bit rusty these days, so don't ask me to do any calculations to show my working  ;).
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Thu, 02 June 2022, 09:52:29
If you continue to try to baselessly throw mud at me trying to make something stick, just because you dislike me, you might find yourself regretting it.

Are you threatening him? On top of being incredibly excessive (there's a report button if you feel someone is acting inappropriately), what exactly are you planning to do here?
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Thu, 02 June 2022, 12:52:03
Are you threatening him? On top of being incredibly excessive (there's a report button if you feel someone is acting inappropriately), what exactly are you planning to do here?

I don't have a problem with anyone disagreeing with me or giving criticism, but I don't think it's acceptable to baselessly engage in thread poisoning. If someone harasses you it's considered normal to give them a warning before meeting them at their level, giving them back that same energy and escalating the situation.

Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Laur on Thu, 02 June 2022, 18:12:32
If you continue to try to baselessly throw mud at me trying to make something stick, just because you dislike me, you might find yourself regretting it.

Are you threatening him? On top of being incredibly excessive (there's a report button if you feel someone is acting inappropriately), what exactly are you planning to do here?

Dark:
(https://imgur.com/eKtMJu4.gif)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: treeleaf64 on Thu, 02 June 2022, 20:07:18
Mr Dark can have a snuggle with Dogger and the Pogger to make him happier
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Thu, 02 June 2022, 20:47:03

Dark:
Show Image
(https://imgur.com/eKtMJu4.gif)


[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: The0rigina1 on Sat, 04 June 2022, 14:45:02
The new f13 blocker is just yikes
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Sun, 05 June 2022, 16:24:11
The new f13 blocker is just yikes

I appreciate the feedback, from the yikes-poster themselves no less. The design isn't finalised yet, and has gone through a few changes since I last posted on geekhack. I have some other projects that I am dealing with for the moment, so there is a delay before the design changes are confirmed in full and the second rendition is ordered for prototyping.

I don't think you can expect any plastic deformation from normal use, although it would be quite easy to permanently deform from improper handling, so no holding it by one mounting point and then waiving it around to see what happens.

To comment on the 40% video.  A single flat bar supported only at both ends will bend in the middle.  If the cross section stays the same, the longer the distance between the supported ends the more it will bend with the same applied force. With sufficient flex the metal will plastically deform and the bend will be permanent. To avoid this your options are: Change the shape to make it stiffer (why I beams are a thing), change the material, make the unsupported length smaller or redistribute the load. That said it looks like the observed bend is due to improper handling as in use the load should be sufficiently distributed in normal use.

Your 'coil' design has short straight lengths between the bends so it is unlikely to deform in the same way.  The force has to go into the metal somewhere, however.  In the case of your coil, I would expect the deformation to be mostly torsional at the bends.  With the first bend twisting most and the last bend twisting least.

But for people worried, just look at the video in the first post, empirical is always better than theoretical.  In the video the 'coil' handles a large displacement elastically without any problem :).  Also, since only the bottom Bumpon is supported in the demo, it shows a much larger flex than you can expect when both top and bottom Bumpon are supported.

My solid mechanics are a bit rusty these days, so don't ask me to do any calculations to show my working  ;).

Thanks for your comment, you've explained it alot better than I could have! I definitely think the ability to 'elastically' respond to the load applied is the key difference as you have stated. Once the second prototype has been built, I will try to provide a comprehensive demo with the fully assembled board.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: FitLabb on Wed, 10 August 2022, 01:44:00
Love this design and interesting & creative mounting method. Any update on when this might go to GB? Very interested in this board! 💪
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Fri, 12 August 2022, 14:35:32
Love this design and interesting & creative mounting method. Any update on when this might go to GB? Very interested in this board! 💪

Thanks! I'm not happy with the side profile, so i'm going to redesign/prototype that first before going forward with the project. I want every design to be unique and I'm not satisfied with that aspect right now, because it doesn't properly convey the feeling I want it to.

Due to timescales it will probably be pushed back to second priority for a little bit since I have another project which is much closer to being finalised design-wise. I have ordered a prototype for that other project, through testing it should allow me to dial in the mounting method which will feedback into informing the final design of the idol board.

I've made some progress with being able to design things a little more 3 dimensionally on the side profile too

[attachimg=1]

I will use that experience to develop this board to better, and more striking visually, with it's own flavour. I'd prefer to take time to get it right than to release something half baked.






Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Kokaloo on Fri, 12 August 2022, 15:00:05
(https://cdn.thewirecutter.com/wp-content/media/2022/04/bikehelmets-2048px-0243-1.jpg)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Gondolindrim on Fri, 12 August 2022, 18:53:22
Show Image
(https://cdn.thewirecutter.com/wp-content/media/2022/04/bikehelmets-2048px-0243-1.jpg)


You know, I really like your comments but you really deserve the nickname "kok" as you can be such a **** sometimes
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: hali on Fri, 12 August 2022, 19:06:07
it does kinda look like a bike helmet though
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: aa212121 on Fri, 12 August 2022, 19:26:21
it do
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: herbologist on Wed, 24 August 2022, 22:31:01
This you?
!designer
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220825/dada5e768f4b0862e38fe666af3df915.jpg)

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: lewisflude on Thu, 25 August 2022, 09:20:06
This you?
!designer
Show Image
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220825/dada5e768f4b0862e38fe666af3df915.jpg)


Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

I don't get it, this looks good
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: Lil on Fri, 26 August 2022, 11:35:05
This you?

If these are the images you are referring to, it appears to be me

[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
[attachimg=3][attachimg=4]

Photo credit: Kiyoboard (https://www.instagram.com/kiyoboard/)


More
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/truely (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/truely)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: kiyoboard on Sun, 28 August 2022, 14:54:10
This you?

If these are the images you are referring to, it appears to be me

(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)

Photo credit: Kiyoboard (https://www.instagram.com/kiyoboard/)


More
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/truely (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/truely)

That's me :D Though I don't get what is the problem in that zoomed in bit. I assume it is the screw not being flush with the weight? Which is fine in my opinion. The board looks really good.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: lw88 on Sun, 28 August 2022, 18:14:43
This is a very professional groupbuy and your attitude is among the best in the hobby.
I look forward to definitely giving you my money and trusting that I get a quality keyboard in return :)
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - [TKL] Next generation mounting method
Post by: treeleaf64 on Mon, 29 August 2022, 10:30:01
This is a very professional groupbuy and your attitude is among the best in the hobby.
I look forward to definitely giving you my money and trusting that I get a quality keyboard in return :)


Can you also give me your money : )  I will give you a Quality keyboard   :p

Mr dark is my idol.
Good night Mr Dark
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - Intending to publicly release files
Post by: Lil on Sun, 15 January 2023, 16:59:14
I've already moved on and don't have the energy or enough interest to circle backwards to this project, with the required changes to be implemented/prototyped if keeping the current mounting method.

In light of that, I'll spend a short amount of time over the next few weeks to try to get the design to be in a working state before I release the files publicly.



So far:

I intend to release the files for the keyboard based on a creative commons non-commercial license.

Whereby the keyboard files will be released for you to download, change and use, but the design can't be used on a commercial basis;
that non-commercial stipulation applies for any derivatives, future transformations or other continuations from these root files.

So long as it's non-profit/non commercial you could make one just for you, or do a small run with a few friends, etc.

Running for profit sale using an edited file, akin to the idea of running a sale with a design 'based on a bakaneko' is prohibited under the intended license.
Flipping a unit you get made on the aftermarket is also prohibited, as previously stated.
This applies to any singular part of the whole.


The intention is to give something to the community that they'll be able to enjoy and can order themselves direct from the manufacturer.

That means that if you really like it, you can have it in your hands much sooner; with a colour, price and quality of your choosing dependent on the manufacturer chosen.

You can even add some engravings on there and customise it as you want it.

I wanted to avoid a situation where **works/studio/lab suddenly has a new GB for you to join or mechmarket was flooded with derivative TKLs 'designed' by people who have simply added an engraving.
I will try to make a tutorial to show you how to add an engraving yourself, if you haven't used 3D CAD software before.

It will probably take at minimum a few weeks to accomplish this since I have other priorities that take precedent.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - Intending to publicly release files
Post by: mr_foggy on Sun, 15 January 2023, 17:14:36
BASED
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - Intending to publicly release files
Post by: Patty on Sun, 15 January 2023, 17:17:06
gorgeous design, very kind of you to release the files

the bump on mounting system looked really cool, excited to see if you'll use it in your future designs!
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - Intending to publicly release files
Post by: twitchytheinsideman on Thu, 02 February 2023, 11:09:05
This looks so cool.

Interesting mount.

GL  :-* :-*
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - Intending to publicly release files
Post by: Lil on Thu, 14 December 2023, 02:05:56
Here is a link to the open sourced files, where Idol has been changed to top-mount and F12.
It lacks any engravings outside of the plate, apart from 'Idol', 'designedbydark' and a placeholder in CN for the manufacturer to put their name/maker's mark on the inside facing part of the weight:

https://github.com/designedbydark/open-source-keyboards-designedbydark (https://github.com/designedbydark/open-source-keyboards-designedbydark)

Here is a link to my discord for more info on this and future projects:

https://discord.gg/R8ywkm8UrB (https://discord.gg/R8ywkm8UrB)

Sorry for not updating this thread in a timely manner, I was part-way through completing the task and got sidelined until now. But I've come back and finished it!

Have a nice day.
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - Has now been open-sourced.
Post by: Lil on Thu, 14 December 2023, 02:16:44
[attachimg=1]
[attachimg=2]
[attachimg=3]
[attachimg=4]

Oh here are some screenshots as previews of what it looks like now, cheers!
Title: Re: [IC] Ex Idol - Has now been open-sourced.
Post by: Lysol_ on Mon, 18 December 2023, 18:05:57
i appreciate your work Mr. Dark