Totally in for this. I'd prefer a more ANSI-like layout, but you can always include options. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/UoVc6Xq.png)
Totally in for this. I'd prefer a more ANSI-like layout, but you can always include options. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/UoVc6Xq.png)
Might as well have a full top 2 rows all the way across to have a full battlestation!
Totally in for this. I'd prefer a more ANSI-like layout, but you can always include options. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/UoVc6Xq.png)
Might as well have a full top 2 rows all the way across to have a full battlestation!
I'm sure you refer to this image, which I posted here quite some time ago:Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/k4NhMhc.png)
The PCB would clearly have to bend for the upper bank of 24 function keys.
why not just use 2 PCBs?
Wow! Apparently people are interested, at least as a thought experiment. So I went ahead and did a proper layout.
- ANSI
- ISO
- Full matrix for any arrow cluster desired
- Hidden switch positions in all the usual places (e.g. under Backspace, both centered and off-set Capslock, etc.)
- MX and Alps (Matias) switch support
- Teensy++ controller
- Bend and floating controller daughter-board will be supported by using optional ribbon cables, location TBD.
- Bottom row options:
1.5 - 1.0 - 1.5 - 7.0 - 1.5 - 1.0 - 1.5 (Leave the 1.0 switches out if you want.)
1.25 - 1.25 - 1.25 -6.25 - 1.25 - 1.25 - 1.25 - 1.25
I haven't done ANYTHING for LED support beyond pads and resistor locations. I haven't done the proper things to the numpad (just remembered that.) I haven't put in stabilizer mounts.
And I have not connected the sections, the controller, or even run the row/column traces TO the controller.
But the actual switch layout addresses everything suggested except for the mega-matrix top rows.
(Attachment Link)
GH-122 PCB Pre-Prototype Design by samwisekoi 2014
Keep commenting and I'll keep running traces!
- Ron | samwisekoi
p.s. Also, go buy some Nuclear Data Green keycaps to fill this mother!
Is that an LED screen in your mockup, we could just roll it that way :thumb:
Is that an LED screen in your mockup, we could just roll it that way :thumb:
That's the controller daughterboard, for the Teensy++ 2.0. :D
I don't want to derail the thread too much. But this is somewhat related to something that's been bouncing around in the back of my head for a little while.
The idea would be instead of creating one large board instead create keyboard modules(i.e. a 60% board, a keypad, a function board) than then connect to a keyboard controller board. The advantage there would be you could be very custom in how you layout the keyboard and have any size board you want. You just get a plate cut put the boards in, wire them to the controller configure which keys do what and you'd be good to go.
This is a more complicated solution than just making a fixed size pcb but I just wanted to put it out there to see if anyone else had any similar thoughts.
Wow! Apparently people are interested, at least as a thought experiment. So I went ahead and did a proper layout.
- ANSI
- ISO
- Full matrix for any arrow cluster desired
- Hidden switch positions in all the usual places (e.g. under Backspace, both centered and off-set Capslock, etc.)
- MX and Alps (Matias) switch support
- Teensy++ controller
- Bend and floating controller daughter-board will be supported by using optional ribbon cables, location TBD.
- Bottom row options:
1.5 - 1.0 - 1.5 - 7.0 - 1.5 - 1.0 - 1.5 (Leave the 1.0 switches out if you want.)
1.25 - 1.25 - 1.25 -6.25 - 1.25 - 1.25 - 1.25 - 1.25
I haven't done ANYTHING for LED support beyond pads and resistor locations. I haven't done the proper things to the numpad (just remembered that.) I haven't put in stabilizer mounts.
And I have not connected the sections, the controller, or even run the row/column traces TO the controller.
But the actual switch layout addresses everything suggested except for the mega-matrix top rows.
(Attachment Link)
GH-122 PCB Pre-Prototype Design by samwisekoi 2014
Keep commenting and I'll keep running traces!
- Ron | samwisekoi
p.s. Also, go buy some Nuclear Data Green keycaps to fill this mother!
Is that an LED screen in your mockup, we could just roll it that way :thumb:
Of course I say go all out crazy and split it out into 8 pcbs to be connected together or could at least be cut apart and used otherwise. :p
(Attachment Link)
Doesn't MOZ have a thread about that in Making Stuff Together? I'm on mobile, and can't be arsed. :p
nobody reads my posts :P
I don't want to derail the thread too much. But this is somewhat related to something that's been bouncing around in the back of my head for a little while.
The idea would be instead of creating one large board instead create keyboard modules(i.e. a 60% board, a keypad, a function board) than then connect to a keyboard controller board via a communication wire (using something like SPI or I2C). The advantage there would be you could be very custom in how you layout the keyboard and have any size board you want. You just get a plate cut put the boards in, wire them to the controller configure which keys do what and you'd be good to go.
This is a more complicated solution than just making a fixed size pcb but I just wanted to put it out there to see if anyone else had any similar thoughts.
Sorry but after going through Phantom and GH60 i really hope that this will be a small venture, no way that i'll be in another super ultra mega custom kb GB.
Sorry but after going through Phantom and GH60 i really hope that this will be a small venture, no way that i'll be in another super ultra mega custom kb GB.
It's Ron, so you know it's good. No chance of mistake with a Ron GB.
May have to buy into this one myself. Looking over at MOZ's blox project - great idea but seems a like lot more work to implement. This is just a large sized board, which is not at all like anything I have been thinking of myself...... ;)Show Image(http://s3.postimg.org/5yzxg1l5f/Opt3.png)Show Image(http://s3.postimg.org/5ijb7cms3/Opt2.png)Show Image(http://s14.postimg.org/ly2s2bb01/key1.jpg)
May have to buy into this one myself. Looking over at MOZ's blox project - great idea but seems a like lot more work to implement. This is just a large sized board, which is not at all like anything I have been thinking of myself...... ;)Show Image(http://s3.postimg.org/5yzxg1l5f/Opt3.png)Show Image(http://s3.postimg.org/5ijb7cms3/Opt2.png)Show Image(http://s14.postimg.org/ly2s2bb01/key1.jpg)
I followed the Matias blueprints, so the pads should fit. I don't know anything about Alps stabilizers, so that will be up to you. Also, I had to rotate the ISO enter switch, so I have no idea if that will work with Alps keycaps.
Regardless, this is going to be one huge board. Assuming it works and we can get cases and firmware for the Teensy++. 😉 :cool:
- Ron | samwisekoi
I don't think firmware will be a big issue. Most common firmwares can likely be modified to work, since the Teensy++ uses the same ATmega32U4 chip.
Don't forget to include the 2x keys for the number pad. You can rotate those also, if you need. :)
I would be interested in this if made the PCB to fit Cherry G80-2000 series. Would be nice replacement for those PCB to fix the numerous issues they have like bigass enter, or ISO enter, or only 2KRO... etc.
Adding support for JIS layout would also be very nice.
I would be interested in this if made the PCB to fit Cherry G80-2000 series. Would be nice replacement for those PCB to fix the numerous issues they have like bigass enter, or ISO enter, or only 2KRO... etc.
The Enabler, I still don't quite get what advantage it offers over direct wiring, assuming you don't want backlit.
I will see what I can do, but I am not terrific about measure things accurately.
There are several different models in 2000 family. Some are extremely hard to get, others not too much like 2551 and 2500 are probably most common.
This might be a stupid suggestion, but have we thought about talking to Unicomp about what their 122 key cases would cost?
We don't need barrels or whatever, but just the outer plastic. Mount it all to a steel plate (and the bend could be in the plate!) and then add pcbs.
I also don't even solder, so if this is a stupid idea, well, ignore it.
This might be a stupid suggestion, but have we thought about talking to Unicomp about what their 122 key cases would cost?
We don't need barrels or whatever, but just the outer plastic. Mount it all to a steel plate (and the bend could be in the plate!) and then add pcbs.
I also don't even solder, so if this is a stupid idea, well, ignore it.
Any case from Unicomp is $20. But using a Unicomp 122 case would (likely) require a bent PCB / plate.
I followed the Matias blueprints, so the pads should fit. I don't know anything about Alps stabilizers, so that will be up to you. Also, I had to rotate the ISO enter switch, so I have no idea if that will work with Alps keycaps.soarer's controller code will run on T++ so we can use that for sure.
Regardless, this is going to be one huge board. Assuming it works and we can get cases and firmware for the Teensy++. 😉 :cool:
- Ron | samwisekoi
wow this is moving pretty quick, what sort of case did you envision for this Samwise?
You can assign a key (or combination of keys ) to a FN layer and then define a remapblock for that function layer. Then when the FN key is pressed (or held down, depending on how you want to do it) the keys are "remapped" to the new layer. I really like it.soarer's controller code will run on T++ so we can use that for sure.
I was just looking up this fine piece of software. I see it supports multiple layers but couldn't find any examples of same. How do soarer's layers work?
Of course, with 122-ish keys, there's nearly no need for alternate layers as even mousing and media keys could be added into layer one without too much crowding.
The main PCB now has cut lines for everywhere cuts should be made.
No, only the top, left, and rightmost blocks can be cut off.
But why? Then you'd have a Phantom!
- Ron | samwisekoi
If you slice off the editing block, the controller has to go somewhere else... so we can assume those users will be on ribbon cables 100% of the time.
The issue is that the cut would have to go somewhere in the middle of the second ribbon cable connector.
Why not run a second instance of that connector, say, above ~, 1, and 2? Wire it to the same lines as the ones that would be endangered by the cut. I think really, you'd only need the first six or seven of the lines from the second ribbon cable to be actually carried over there. Everything after that is exclusively numpad and editing block territory, it looks like.
this is one insane board... and i'm interested.
one question: would the numpad section allow 2u for both plus and enter?
this is one insane board... and i'm interested.
one question: would the numpad section allow 2u for both plus and enter?
bianco raises a good point, it looks like the intermediary hole for the 2u "+" switch on the number pad is placed in the wrong spot.
Good work none the less samwise! I'm definitely interested in picking one of these up if a small buy is made available. Just for the sake of having a stupidly large custom keyboard.
this is one insane board... and i'm interested.
one question: would the numpad section allow 2u for both plus and enter?
I think when it's ready to open, it might be worth asking if there are price breaks at more than ten units, and possibly also posting something to DT and maybe some of the Korean forums. I don't think anyone's ever done a custom larger than a 101-104-108 key layout before, so there might be global demand, and the more people you can talk into it, the cheaper it's likely to be per unit.
Cherry have 1cm space between each section. I measured that from outside edge of keycap to next outside edge of keycap. I still haven't been able to get case open again. It has these really deep latches that are really stubborn. But, I am concerned about where holes would be on pcb so case can close vs all those traces you have on the top of the pcb.
In the 2x5 breakaway board on the left side, where you have stabilizers for a 2x width key on the top - you could probably just leave that as 2 single keys. Would only look like a Sun Type 6/7 board if you added a 2x width key above the 2x5 pack, in line with the bottom function row.
In the 2x5 breakaway board on the left side, where you have stabilizers for a 2x width key on the top - you could probably just leave that as 2 single keys. Would only look like a Sun Type 6/7 board if you added a 2x width key above the 2x5 pack, in line with the bottom function row.
Yes, okay. It might be interesting to have a pair or quad up there anyhow.
Meantime, this is what I think I shall do for a case. This is just the face plate. Made from 0.125" stainless and bent up just below the function keys and bent down (to vertical) above them, it will (IMHO) make a nice top plate. Matching metal bottom plate with (possibly) translucent sides for a subtle lighting effect. And a whole bunch of weight. Perhaps painted a nice industrial color, or even wrinkle-finish Engine Enamel.
Oh, and it will fit, fully assembled, into a USPS Game Box.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Totally in for this. I'd prefer a more ANSI-like layout, but you can always include options. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/UoVc6Xq.png)
NOTE: Backlighting and/or traces for backlighting are not part of the design spec of this board. However, in all the places where they wouldn't cause re-routing of keyswitch traces, you may find traces for LEDs and related resistors. Not control circuits, mind you, but 150 of the tedious lines manual backlighting would require. The other 75 or so are up to the user.
Totally in for this. I'd prefer a more ANSI-like layout, but you can always include options. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/UoVc6Xq.png)
Wait - I missed this.
Did you just whip together a plate design?
You da man!
- Ron | samwisekoi
How about something like this for a case+plate thing?
Obviously, I've used jdcarpe's design as a reference... the point is more to demonstrate the overall design concept, so no measurements are final.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/NDO5qwR.png)
LED holes obviously needed, and possibly a cutaway to access the Teensy.
The idea is just to add a tiny bit of extra material on the sides, and then bend it twice on each side. You can either then attach feet directly to the bottom ridge, or bolt a "bottom plate" to those four holes.
Potentially, cuts could be made to have the upper 24 keys at an angle.
Does SP have SA relegendables? Those would be awesome.
although i do understand that the layout was based on an existing keyboard (that i'm honestly not familiar with)...
i'm looking at soldering switches on all the available 'holes' (like in Hak Foo's plate)... is this possible?
Does SP have SA relegendables? Those would be awesome.
Depending on the cost, if you need another prototype tester, I could be in. I find this idea awesome.
although i do understand that the layout was based on an existing keyboard (that i'm honestly not familiar with)...
i'm looking at soldering switches on all the available 'holes' (like in Hak Foo's plate)... is this possible?
Yup. Totally supported. Go crazy!Does SP have SA relegendables? Those would be awesome.
Yes; see above for pricing considerations.Depending on the cost, if you need another prototype tester, I could be in. I find this idea awesome.
You are in and we are up to eight, so this is definitely a go.
Now all I am waiting for is the Unicomp 122 case to see if that is a viable option ($20 each!).
- Ron | samwisekoi
125 switches ($45 from Techkeys.us; more from Mouser).
125 switches ($45 from Techkeys.us; more from Mouser).
Or depending on preferred switch type you can buy genuine cherry switches from http://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/index.php?l=product_list&c=43 at ~$0.50 each, the biggest pack is only 110 but I bet if you ask nicely they would accomodate a few more to get 125 at the same price per switch.
Definitely answers my question, thanks! I'll have to be tentative at this point, and double check the money situation to see whether swinging this is possible.
Good source. Also, Techkeys has gen-u-ine Cherry in Black and Red.
Good source. Also, Techkeys has gen-u-ine Cherry in Black and Red.
Are those 'brand new' genuine cherry switches?? Somehow I don't believe it at $0.30 each. There were some quality issues at one time also, not sure if those were isolated incidents or not.
I'd be in for ansi/1.5 bottom row and if it could fit the 2000 series. I was going to get an ISO 2100 modded to ansi but if this was designed to fit into place in the 2100 case and was ansi it would solve a lot of problems for me :)) (ansi 2100s are a lot of fun)
I can be in if Dorkvader can assembly it for me
Quote from: jpz;357640Yeah your completely correct you should at least meet their tolerances. Why did you choose 6061 aluminum?
It's light and stiff and I want to keep the weight down for the portability.
Hmmm. Those bent-plate "cases" were originally a samwisekoi design, and I have a couple live and useable now.They were used by dox in his original DoxKB in 2011 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=19227.0). You independently invented them, but they are not your original design.
I can be in if Dorkvader can assembly it for meI will give you a discount because I really want to assemble one.
My lucky dayQuote from: jpz;357640Yeah your completely correct you should at least meet their tolerances. Why did you choose 6061 aluminum?Hmmm. Those bent-plate "cases" were originally a samwisekoi design, and I have a couple live and useable now.I can be in if Dorkvader can assembly it for meI will give you a discount because I really want to assemble one.
Count me in for one. I'd like to build one of these too. I've been looking for an F-122 on ebay but building my own is even better.
Count me in for one. I'd like to build one of these too. I've been looking for an F-122 on ebay but building my own is even better.
Keep in mind that this will use cherry (or ALPS) switches which are different than IBM ones. It'll make a great keyboard though
You may be interested in MX green, which (in my opinion) are the closest to IBM buckling spring. They are heavy and clicky. Getting some MX blue and modifying them with heavier springs is a good idea.
You may be interested in MX green, which (in my opinion) are the closest to IBM buckling spring. They are heavy and clicky. Getting some MX blue and modifying them with heavier springs is a good idea.
I'll probably be getting Greens for all of their goodness. Dorkvader, i am in MA and was wondering if you would consider assembling mine as well? I have a few smaller (and less important projects) coming soon that i'd want to learn to solder on before i undertook this project and considering this is pretty much a dream board, i def wouldnt want to bork it up! PM me if you could and we can talk a bit more about it.
I will see what I can do, but I am not terrific about measure things accurately.
There are several different models in 2000 family. Some are extremely hard to get, others not too much like 2551 and 2500 are probably most common.
This might be a stupid suggestion, but have we thought about talking to Unicomp about what their 122 key cases would cost?
We don't need barrels or whatever, but just the outer plastic. Mount it all to a steel plate (and the bend could be in the plate!) and then add pcbs.
I also don't even solder, so if this is a stupid idea, well, ignore it.
Any case from Unicomp is $20. But using a Unicomp 122 case would (likely) require a bent PCB / plate.
$6 buys a proper LED plate with no logo or modern icons.
I would very much like to see a silver and black medallion. Perhaps GH-122 over GEEK and HACK. Striped lettering would be excellent!
- Ron | samwisekoi
Nice! Can the third line be GH122 ?
For myself, I would be more than content to refurbish an IBM F122 (or even an M122, including a bolt mod). However, if I were interested in a 122 with something other than capacitive buckling spring switches, I might consider Matias tactile-clicky switches. I also wonder if CM would sell their hybrid Topres with Cherry-mx-compatible stems.
Nice! Can the third line be GH122 ?
Yeah, I can work on it, but the font as installed spaces out the numbers too much, and it didn't look right. :)
Nice! Can the third line be GH122 ?
Yeah, I can work on it, but the font as installed spaces out the numbers too much, and it didn't look right. :)
Is that "Men in Blue"?
This is City Medium, modified by hand in a manner similar to the original.
(Attachment Link)
Very Draft GH122 Logo
Have to improve the anti-aliasing and make it more blocky. And improve the kerning between 1 and 2.
Possibly also reduce the number of "stripes" to avoid copyright issues.
- Ron | samwisekoi
How about something like the back-panel badges on pre-PS/2 IBM kit... "GH" or even "Geekhack" in the big striped font, and then "GH122" in small Helvetica, or the italic serif font they used for front panel badges.
Is that an LED screen in your mockup, we could just roll it that way :thumb:
That's the controller daughterboard, for the Teensy++ 2.0. :D
:facepalm:
as a side note we really need an animated facepalm smiley...i do it alot....:D
How's this?Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/ooXQ8CU.png)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/ooXQ8CU.png)
I’m not totally satisfied, I’ll fiddle a bit more.
How's this?Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/ooXQ8CU.png)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/ooXQ8CU.png)
I’m not totally satisfied, I’ll fiddle a bit more.
I don't know if it were just me but that "H" is very easily mistaken to "K"Basically putting a whole bunch of stripes across letters makes for all kinds of confusing optical effects, and is definitely not optimized for legibility. I don’t think there’s any obvious way to avoid that without ditching the stripes idea.
Some tweaks:Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/nZur7UH.png)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/nZur7UH.png)
SVG file:
(Attachment Link)
Did I make the G too wide here?
Maybe make the serifs on the H a bit smaller?I exactly copied the serifs from the I, B, and M in the original IBM logo (all of which are the same).
maybe the serifs could be longer, I mean like those of the I from IBM logoAre you talking about my design here? Or the ones from the previous page? Mine use literally identical serifs to the original IBM logo. (On the H. The G is rather trickier to make something that still looks good with all the white stripes through it, so it differs a bit more dramatically from the source “City” typeface.)
Maybe make the serifs on the H a bit smaller?I exactly copied the serifs from the I, B, and M in the original IBM logo (all of which are the same).Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/vX2q8h4.png)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/Fyq8Cwu.png)
g space on a QWERTY keyboard, it's very easy to associate us with being the center of the keyboard world.
Consider how elegant and memorable this is
After using an IBM F-122 for a couple of years I have grown to really like the configuration, but I can't see using it for other keyboard switch types. Well, maybe blue or orange Alps ......This PCB is compatible with alps.
This PCB is compatible with alps.
I've been looking at F-122's
While I know it's sort of been a side issue on the discussion, we might want to just give the PCB design a sanity check before launch and see if it would be feasible to use Soarer's Controller firmware. http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/soarer-s-keyboard-controller-firmware-t6767.htmlIt's a good idea.
It apparently supports the Teensy++ and pretty collosal matrices (supposedly, 256 keys) and it looks like it could be simple to configure (well, as simple as a hand-written config file can be expected to be) All we'd need to be sure of is that it's wiring to appropriate pins on the Teensy++
While someone might want to write something super-custom later, especially if they want to also bolt a bunch of LEDs on, this could give us the ability to use the board within a day or two of the PCBs coming home. Such a situation could be especially valuable for testing-- even if you don't want to impose a layout, a map which just issued "Row 1, Column 1" as each key was struck would make it child's play to locate sticky or poorly soldered switches.
Cool. I was just worried that the current design might call for pins that that firmware can't reach.
While I know it's sort of been a side issue on the discussion, we might want to just give the PCB design a sanity check before launch and see if it would be feasible to use Soarer's Controller firmware. http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/soarer-s-keyboard-controller-firmware-t6767.htmlIt's a good idea.
It apparently supports the Teensy++ and pretty collosal matrices (supposedly, 256 keys) and it looks like it could be simple to configure (well, as simple as a hand-written config file can be expected to be) All we'd need to be sure of is that it's wiring to appropriate pins on the Teensy++
While someone might want to write something super-custom later, especially if they want to also bolt a bunch of LEDs on, this could give us the ability to use the board within a day or two of the PCBs coming home. Such a situation could be especially valuable for testing-- even if you don't want to impose a layout, a map which just issued "Row 1, Column 1" as each key was struck would make it child's play to locate sticky or poorly soldered switches.
I recommended (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=62003.msg1445865#msg1445865) we use soarer's firmware on a teensy++ from the beginning. Metalliqaz might import the matrix to his firmware opening up other options, but I really like how soarer's works what with the config files and not-having-to-reflash-the-chip.
Please tell me more. I was just about to use the 'inboard' pins to free up the PWM pins on the outside edges.
I believe metalliqaz' tool already supports the Teensy++, but I also want to be sure we have firmware on Day One.
DV, I'll start sending you the matrix pin-outs as they evolve. Please do let me know if any of them won't work.
Thanks!
- Ron | samwisekoi
Now, although the docs aren't specific, it looks like the compiler should be able to handle specifying the PA series pins (which are the middle ones).
From a physical perspective, this does make it a lot harder to have the Teensy socketed-- you can't just solder in a DIP socket anymore if you're accessing pins mid-PCB. Yeah, you could solder pins to the mid-PCB openings, and then make up something with SIP connectors... but is this even important? Probably not.
I do see a useful heads-up in the Controller discussion thread: pin PD6 has a LED sitting on it, which means it can't be used as a sense pin. The latest image you posted seems to avoid PD6, so that's not a big deal.
The LED is dim because it is on pin D6, which you used for Col12. The dimness is caused by the column getting energized every millisecond.
Please tell me more. I was just about to use the 'inboard' pins to free up the PWM pins on the outside edges.
I believe metalliqaz' tool already supports the Teensy++, but I also want to be sure we have firmware on Day One.
DV, I'll start sending you the matrix pin-outs as they evolve. Please do let me know if any of them won't work.
Thanks!
- Ron | samwisekoi
Ok I can come up with a flashing guide and some default layout files. I have the documentation (sadly split across two files) open in another window as well.
I've never used soarer's code on the teensy++ so I will have to do some reading on pin assignments and the like.
One downside is that soarer's code does not support backlighting very well. So unless you want to map "backlight all LEDs" to scroll-lock (or use a toggle switch: my personal favourite idea), it may be better to go with a different firmware.
At one point you (I think it was you) said you could hang a transistor off of a keyswitch and energize LEDs that way. Was that you, and is that true?That was probably me.
- Ron | samwisekoi
At one point you (I think it was you) said you could hang a transistor off of a keyswitch and energize LEDs that way. Was that you, and is that true?That was probably me.
- Ron | samwisekoi
If you look in LED backlit keyboards like the poker2, they have a few transistors. That way they can just send voltage out one pin to activate the transistor and then the transistor will switch power on for the LED matrix. I might have to get a germanium one or something with better specs if we're driving a ton of LEDs here (or get 2 in parallel) but yes I planned to use a transistor.
Actually, I planned to use a panel-mounted toggle switch to turn on the transistor to power the LEDs, but I might use a relay if I can get away with it (they use up power), 'cause toggle switches and relays are really cool, and I think fit with the theme of a big bad industrial 122-key keyboard.
I dont think the teensy has the current capacity to drive all the LEDs at once. We're talking like 200 mA LED matrix, I don't want that coming form one pin on the teensy.At one point you (I think it was you) said you could hang a transistor off of a keyswitch and energize LEDs that way. Was that you, and is that true?That was probably me.
- Ron | samwisekoi
If you look in LED backlit keyboards like the poker2, they have a few transistors. That way they can just send voltage out one pin to activate the transistor and then the transistor will switch power on for the LED matrix. I might have to get a germanium one or something with better specs if we're driving a ton of LEDs here (or get 2 in parallel) but yes I planned to use a transistor.
Actually, I planned to use a panel-mounted toggle switch to turn on the transistor to power the LEDs, but I might use a relay if I can get away with it (they use up power), 'cause toggle switches and relays are really cool, and I think fit with the theme of a big bad industrial 122-key keyboard.
Can you explain how using a transistor hooked to a raw 5V source (USB in this case, I presume) is different than using the teensy itself to switch a pin to +5V using its internal controller? In both cases you would code it to switch a pin to output a current to accomplish your task, so the coding wouldn't be significantly different, would it? Or is the difference that the teensy pins can't handle the current output we'd need?
Or am I totally misunderstanding? ^-^
I dont think the teensy has the current capacity to drive all the LEDs at once. We're talking like 200 mA LED matrix, I don't want that coming form one pin on the teensy.At one point you (I think it was you) said you could hang a transistor off of a keyswitch and energize LEDs that way. Was that you, and is that true?That was probably me.
- Ron | samwisekoi
If you look in LED backlit keyboards like the poker2, they have a few transistors. That way they can just send voltage out one pin to activate the transistor and then the transistor will switch power on for the LED matrix. I might have to get a germanium one or something with better specs if we're driving a ton of LEDs here (or get 2 in parallel) but yes I planned to use a transistor.
Actually, I planned to use a panel-mounted toggle switch to turn on the transistor to power the LEDs, but I might use a relay if I can get away with it (they use up power), 'cause toggle switches and relays are really cool, and I think fit with the theme of a big bad industrial 122-key keyboard.
Can you explain how using a transistor hooked to a raw 5V source (USB in this case, I presume) is different than using the teensy itself to switch a pin to +5V using its internal controller? In both cases you would code it to switch a pin to output a current to accomplish your task, so the coding wouldn't be significantly different, would it? Or is the difference that the teensy pins can't handle the current output we'd need?
Or am I totally misunderstanding? ^-^
And you can still use the teensy to turn the LED matrix on/off for fancy LED effects. Just have the pin on the teensy connect to the transistor gate.
I'm no EE (still not taken any classes) but I know transistors and LEDs from a nanotechnology class I had once (and from reading into DIY amplifiers for some time). I'm busy today, but I'll write up my ideas tomorrow if no-one else has discussed it
Teensy pins are rated for 50mA, but can push to 100. However, using the Teensy pin and a simple transistor means you can pump VCC through a string of LEDs. That is what I am doing on the GH36.
What I don't know is if I can use a closed keyswitch (e.g. the Fn key) to activate a transistor and from there power a string of LEDs.
Also, the transistor could be replaced - not with a relay - but with a vacuum tube! THAT would be machine-age madness!
- Ron | samwisekoi
Edit: Even if you use transistors to circumvent the limit of a teensy, you might run into issues if you want to power it through one USB port.
Edit: Even if you use transistors to circumvent the limit of a teensy, you might run into issues if you want to power it through one USB port.
Back to PS2 ports? Or have the LEDs draw power from a PS2 cord ... or yes, a 2nd USB port ... Don't the TG3 red LEDs use a 12v car adapter? ... maybe a bluetooth keyboard sucking power from a proper 1A wall-wart instead of a battery...
Just throwing ideas out there! No plans to do any of these things!
I'd step up and ask to be another prototyper but I just wrote down all the projects I want in on, and there's no fewer than 7 keyboards I want ... of course that includes the GH60 when it goes live but there's also JoseyQuinn's 42% and the GH36 and ...
So I guess I'm relegated to moral support for this one. And spouting gibberish without cue.
Just some thoughts on lighting up 122keys:
USB is 500mA at 5V
Leds are about 1.6V and 20mA each, connected serially in groups of three to reach 5V.
That results in 813mA if I am not mistaken. It is possible to PWM them to not have them all ON at the same time, or run them at lower voltages or currents, but it is still fairly close to the limit of USB 2.0 at least. Just something to keep in mind unless it has already been mentioned.
Edit: Even if you use transistors to circumvent the limit of a teensy, you might run into issues if you want to power it through one USB port.
no led's needed for me. Caps, num and scroll lock leds are nice, but i absolutely dont need any LED's.
I'm not a backlighting user at all. I want a CAPLOCK LED and that is it. Maybe more indicators on a 40% to indicate state/layer.
However, every time I design a keyboard using a Teensy controller, there are not enough pins for even a few LEDs. And for the GH122 there are nowhere near enough. So I moved up to the Teensy++ and suddenly there are PLENTY of pins. And the controller is a daughter card anyhow, so I thought what the heck, let's use those pins and make the *controller* useful for more than this one board.
So the GH122 might not have more than three LEDs, but the controller might be smart enough to control more than that.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Is the controller board layout finalized?
The most recent image in the thread looks like it has a a couple row traces crossed, and there are traces going to the PA0-7 pins; wasn't sure if that was the final plan or not.
EDIT : Also - are the Ground and VCC pins in the correct positions?
Is the controller board layout finalized?
The most recent image in the thread looks like it has a a couple row traces crossed, and there are traces going to the PA0-7 pins; wasn't sure if that was the final plan or not.
EDIT : Also - are the Ground and VCC pins in the correct positions?
Oh, heck no. You will have to be patient my friend. I am waiting for feedback on the GH36 layout and the Unicomp case.
But we SHALL have our battleship! Yes we shall.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Is the controller board layout finalized?
The most recent image in the thread looks like it has a a couple row traces crossed, and there are traces going to the PA0-7 pins; wasn't sure if that was the final plan or not.
EDIT : Also - are the Ground and VCC pins in the correct positions?
Oh, heck no. You will have to be patient my friend. I am waiting for feedback on the GH36 layout and the Unicomp case.
But we SHALL have our battleship! Yes we shall.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Is the controller board layout finalized?
The most recent image in the thread looks like it has a a couple row traces crossed, and there are traces going to the PA0-7 pins; wasn't sure if that was the final plan or not.
EDIT : Also - are the Ground and VCC pins in the correct positions?
Oh, heck no. You will have to be patient my friend. I am waiting for feedback on the GH36 layout and the Unicomp case.
But we SHALL have our battleship! Yes we shall.
- Ron | samwisekoi
More and useful keys? I like it.
Now we just need a split/ergo version, too!
/runs
Now we just need a split/ergo version, too!Go see the GH36 project in my sig.
Now we just need a split/ergo version, too!Go see the GH36 project in my sig.
Not quite enough keys -- unless you bought two pair of GH36es, then arranged them either all in a row, or maybe a quad array of 2x2 boards.
At twelve-square of keys, it would finally be a battleship keyboard! Make a litster - style case of 304 stainless, and you'd have the keyboard to fight the apocalypse with.
That might be more keyboard than I actually need.
It'd be like kbdfr's keyboard (http://deskthority.net/keyboards-f2/tipro-model-is-this-single-layer-pcb-t7981.html#p162211)Show Image(http://deskthority.net/resources/image/12416)
Forget backlighting. Use the extra capabilities of the controller to drive an LCD panel. Then it could be cool like the 9009.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/v1e3d.jpg)
I hate to be a beggar, but I might suggest we do the plate with the "hybrid" mounting like Matias is using in his 60% -- see http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=60268.msg1447591#msg1447591
SpecificallyShow Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=60268.0;attach=69978;image)
This makes it easy for both MX and ALPS fans. Costar-style plate-mount stabs work well either way-- you can use them with minor modifications to support keys with ALPS style stabilizer inserts. It also looks like it would provide that "side access to allow popping the top on MX switches" while actually being a simpler cut than the usual "four tiny notches" thing. However, whether it would work for that, I will leave to someone who actually understands the mechanics of opening MX switches on plate-mount boards.
Forget backlighting. Use the extra capabilities of the controller to drive an LCD panel. Then it could be cool like the 9009.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/v1e3d.jpg)
I guess my question is "if it would work, why is this not becoming the dominant plate design?" My guesses are either "everyone just jumped on the four notches bandwagon after the first guy did it" or possibly "it isn't quite as stable for Cherry-only usage" or "Most people didn't bother because the PCB was going to limit you to MX switches anyway".How about: it’s never actually been produced, so we still have no idea how well it works. I have a sneaking suspicion that it will be okay but not quite as nice as a dedicated MX or Alps plate. MX + Alps should definitely become the standard for PCBs though.
Forget backlighting. Use the extra capabilities of the controller to drive an LCD panel. Then it could be cool like the 9009.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/v1e3d.jpg)
Screw it, do this with an ARM based teensy, use the LCD panel and have it able to show system info such as ram;usage, clock temp, CPU;usage, temp, clock, GPU;usage, temp, clock, HDD usage, read write speeds, network status, battery status for mobile users, (that would be awesome getting an action shot of someone putting bluetooth into something like this and using it with their ipad. Sorry had a bit of a squirrel moment.
Forget backlighting. Use the extra capabilities of the controller to drive an LCD panel. Then it could be cool like the 9009.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/v1e3d.jpg)
Screw it, do this with an ARM based teensy, use the LCD panel and have it able to show system info such as ram;usage, clock temp, CPU;usage, temp, clock, GPU;usage, temp, clock, HDD usage, read write speeds, network status, battery status for mobile users, (that would be awesome getting an action shot of someone putting bluetooth into something like this and using it with their ipad. Sorry had a bit of a squirrel moment.
Dunno if the T3.1 (the ARM one) has enough pins for a screen AND a 122-key matrix. The T++2.0 probably does. Depending on your LCD screen though.
And even a normal teensy can run a LCD screen. Check it out:
http://www.pjrc.com/tech/8051/board5/lcd_128x64.html
well, soarer's code runs on the ++ some of the other ones might have a ++ version as well. I think the real hard part is integrating the display driver library with the KB code and also figuring out some client side app to export that data to your teensy.Forget backlighting. Use the extra capabilities of the controller to drive an LCD panel. Then it could be cool like the 9009.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/v1e3d.jpg)
Screw it, do this with an ARM based teensy, use the LCD panel and have it able to show system info such as ram;usage, clock temp, CPU;usage, temp, clock, GPU;usage, temp, clock, HDD usage, read write speeds, network status, battery status for mobile users, (that would be awesome getting an action shot of someone putting bluetooth into something like this and using it with their ipad. Sorry had a bit of a squirrel moment.
Dunno if the T3.1 (the ARM one) has enough pins for a screen AND a 122-key matrix. The T++2.0 probably does. Depending on your LCD screen though.
And even a normal teensy can run a LCD screen. Check it out:
http://www.pjrc.com/tech/8051/board5/lcd_128x64.html
Might need to get fancy with the traces but 121 key can be done with 22 pins. Granted you need to get fancy with traces as thats with 11x11 matrix. Though standard layout for traces would need a bit more pins. How much more difficult would it be to use a ++ version over a standard 2.0?
What kind of display? (as there are a lot of options)
Most appropriate would probably be nixie or VFD - but too expensive and power hungry.
More appropriate would be LCD or LED.
Or, we could go nuts and just do TFTs :))Show Image(http://www.nylenkonsult.se/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/c0acaf2e68.jpg)
Just mount a cheap Chinese Android tablet in every keyboard, and then you have a touchscreen.
Just mount a cheap Chinese Android tablet in every keyboard, and then you have a touchscreen.
Raspberry Pi mounted inside the case and a LCD display and you have a standalone system.
Just mount a cheap Chinese Android tablet in every keyboard, and then you have a touchscreen.
Raspberry Pi mounted inside the case and a LCD display and you have a standalone system.
Ok, now this is getting very close to a non flip screen laptop.
You could potentially design a case which let you slot in, say, a thin-ITX mainboard, a PicoPSU if necessary, and a 2.5" hard disc underneath the PCB... then just run an internal connector to a USB header on the motherboard... then you've got an all-in-one build, maybe set up a switchbox which lets you either use it as a standalone PC, or just connect the keyboard to an external PC.
Yeah, except that had all sorts of stupid compromises and a ridiculous price tag to appeal to the nostalgic "it looks like a C64" crowd. This could well be built for a specific (likely low-intensity usage) task, like being a dedicated word-processor, and it would likely be less than $150 addition to the bare keyboard project, especially if you've already got bits to reuse.I think it's best used as a thin client. get one of those small standalone boards and a small display, HDMI out (though DP is waaaay better how come nobody uses it?) etc.
What about this one?
https://www.pjrc.com/store/display_ili9341.html
- Ron | samwisekoi
:thumb: I approve on the screen. Not sure about the extra keys as I think that makes it instantly incompatible with anything that may be existing to use for case solutions.
I was actually thinking about doing something like a really basic integrated system deal with a Galileo or similar.
:thumb: I approve on the screen. Not sure about the extra keys as I think that makes it instantly incompatible with anything that may be existing to use for case solutions.
I was actually thinking about doing something like a really basic integrated system deal with a Galileo or similar.
Thanks.
I had the board space for the extra positions, but I'll include cut lines, and of course the actual switches can be left out.
Me, I am going to try to fit it into a Unicomp PC-122 case, so I will make sure it is compatible with that.
- Ron | samwisekoi
So here I am on a Wednesday night watching the Nuclear Green group buy and waiting for the prototype GH-36 matrix keypad PCBs to arrive. And what do I see on geekhack? Another Great Find post for an F-122 that I won't ever own.
(Attachment Link)
Another F-122 I won't ever own.
And there I am with my PCB design software open in a VM in front of me, and I started to wonder what it would cost to make a small quantity of MX (or Alps) 122-key keyboard PCBs. So I cobbled one together using the layout of the F-122 above, adjusted to modern keycap spacing. Here is what I got:
(Attachment Link)
GH-122 Exercise by samwisekoi 2014
The answer to what would it cost? Just $60 each for a batch of 10 PCBs.
Of course there are issues. Setting aside the case question for the moment, what controller could support a 24x7 matrix? The PCB would clearly have to bend for the upper bank of 24 function keys. Can the Easy AVR software support a controller big enough to drive this thing?
And, of course, are there any other people in this fine community crazy enough to try to build such a beast?
Anyone?
Let me know.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Also, thinking about the useful and not-so-useful expansion proposals, I have come up with some simple changes that don't impact the size of the master PCB.
I added:
- Four keys in the upper left, with an optional 2x position.
- Four keys in the Fn block, to enable expansion, movement, or re-insertion of gaps between blocks of eight.
- Six keys above the arrow cluster to enable some or all of the PRINT/PAUSE section to be added.
Let me know your thoughts!
- Ron | samwisekoi
If someone wants a stupidly large Alps keyboard, and has some money to burn, this is pretty ridiculous:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231329823834
Ortek MCK-142PRO
I’m guessing complicated white Alps, but who knows.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/16lviiL.jpg)
If someone wants a stupidly large Alps keyboard, and has some money to burn, this is pretty ridiculous:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231329823834
Ortek MCK-142PRO
I’m guessing complicated white Alps, but who knows.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/16lviiL.jpg)
If someone wants a stupidly large Alps keyboard, and has some money to burn, this is pretty ridiculous:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231329823834
Ortek MCK-142PRO
I’m guessing complicated white Alps, but who knows.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/16lviiL.jpg)
That. Is. Almost. Perfect.
Change that ISO enter to ANSI and add some 1x keys between the Alt / Ctrl.
Amazing.
If someone wants a stupidly large Alps keyboard, and has some money to burn, this is pretty ridiculous:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231329823834
Ortek MCK-142PRO
I’m guessing complicated white Alps, but who knows.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/16lviiL.jpg)
That. Is. Almost. Perfect.
Change that ISO enter to ANSI and add some 1x keys between the Alt / Ctrl.
Amazing.
More and useful keys? I like it.
Now we just need a split/ergo version, too!
/runs
Go see the GH36 project in my sig.
- Ron | samwisekoi
- Ron | samwisekoi
p.s. @SpecTP, if you'd care to donate one of those keyboards on the shelf, I would be happy to send you a pre-paid mailer. I also used to use them to write some RPG, although it was on an older S/38!
Here is the matrix I am going to use as a base.
I'll add ANSI, ISO, Winkeyless and possibly JIS and/or a split spacebar.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Here is the matrix I am going to use as a base.
I'll add ANSI, ISO, Winkeyless and possibly JIS and/or a split spacebar.
- Ron | samwisekoi
If someone wants a stupidly large Alps keyboard, and has some money to burn, this is pretty ridiculous:Looks like someone bought this monster. Was it someone here? If so, let us know what it’s like when it arrives. (Is it as ridiculous in person as it looks from the picture? :p )
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231329823834
Ortek MCK-142PRO
I’m guessing complicated white Alps, but who knows.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/16lviiL.jpg)
This layout would almost work on that PCB - except for the F row :
http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/2a48b060fef5b575e0d9d4b468fdd807
Might we be moving far away from "using the unicomp cases" plan with all these extra keys?
That new "F row" needs to be spaced differently if you're thinking about having it support a conventional 101-104-108 case and plate. The gap between Esc and F1 seems to be about 1.25x, while the ones between F4 and F5 and F8 and F9 are closer to 0.5x
On that 3rd modifier from the right (with the 1x / 1.25x / 1.5x positions all next to each other); does that one through hole where the Alps pin touches the Cherry pin present any issue?
On your caps lock layout, looks like the through hole is only partially plated on the top and bottom 'sides', so one could solder the appropriate pin to only needed 'side' of the hole? Side in this case is probably not the best word though, since one would only be soldering from the back side of the PCB.
One other thought. Maybe have a small area around the through hole that doesn't have a solder mask over the trace, so one could cut the un-needed trace with an exacto knife?
i unhid this forum just to say that i love this idea and will certainly be buying one
Finally an update here...
This is a monster PCB, so I am trying to get in 30 minutes of layout time each morning to keep progress moving and keep mistakes to a minimum. I've hit a design milestone: All switches, rows, and columns have traces run. All holes and pads are done, and I am ready to do LED and controller wiring.
FYI, there will be a total of 45 pins going to the controller!
I am planning to have individual LED control for each block, plus WASD (all PWM.) Including non-PWM indicator LED circuits, here is the planned list of LED circuits:
NUM
CAPS
FN
FN2
LED1
LED2
LED3
LED4
LED5
LED6
LED7
WASD
I have not worked out cut lines yet. I can't support TKL, and anyhow, what is the point? I will support full-size and full-width.
Does anyone anticipate building a tall TKL? That is the one that will be hardest to support.
Anyhow, here is a screen-shot of the PCB so far. I have a full-resolution version, but that is 3M compressed, so I have not posted it. Ask and ye shall receive!
Anyhow. That is the news from Lake Wobegon for today.
- Ron | samwisekoi
it looks good! so good... i might get 2 of these. not unless you're planning a v2.It's a work in progress so they won't look like that on the finished board. I would expect they show trace spacing so he can check the amount of space those 45 incoming traces will take up to ensure he has enough space in the controller area.
btw, as i'm new to pcb design my apologies in advance for asking --- what are those lines in the upper right part of the board?
It's ok. I set him straight. Welcome to GH, tacticalstache.i unhid this forum just to say that i love this idea and will certainly be buying one
Why do you hide the best subforum...? :'(
it looks good! so good... i might get 2 of these. not unless you're planning a v2.It's a work in progress so they won't look like that on the finished board. I would expect they show trace spacing so he can check the amount of space those 45 incoming traces will take up to ensure he has enough space in the controller area.
btw, as i'm new to pcb design my apologies in advance for asking --- what are those lines in the upper right part of the board?It's ok. I set him straight. Welcome to GH, tacticalstache.i unhid this forum just to say that i love this idea and will certainly be buying one
Why do you hide the best subforum...? :'(
i unhid this forum just to say that i love this idea and will certainly be buying one
Why do you hide the best subforum...? :'(
Looking good. Only see some nitpicky stuff, nothing function impacting.
it looks good! so good... i might get 2 of these. not unless you're planning a v2.It's a work in progress so they won't look like that on the finished board. I would expect they show trace spacing so he can check the amount of space those 45 incoming traces will take up to ensure he has enough space in the controller area.
btw, as i'm new to pcb design my apologies in advance for asking --- what are those lines in the upper right part of the board?
Finally an update here...
This is a monster PCB, so I am trying to get in 30 minutes of layout time each morning to keep progress moving and keep mistakes to a minimum. I've hit a design milestone: All switches, rows, and columns have traces run. All holes and pads are done, and I am ready to do LED and controller wiring.
FYI, there will be a total of 45 pins going to the controller!
I am planning to have individual LED control for each block, plus WASD (all PWM.) Including non-PWM indicator LED circuits, here is the planned list of LED circuits:
NUM
CAPS
FN
FN2
LED1
LED2
LED3
LED4
LED5
LED6
LED7
WASD
I have not worked out cut lines yet. I can't support TKL, and anyhow, what is the point? I will support full-size and full-width.
Does anyone anticipate building a tall TKL? That is the one that will be hardest to support.
Anyhow, here is a screen-shot of the PCB so far. I have a full-resolution version, but that is 3M compressed, so I have not posted it. Ask and ye shall receive!
Anyhow. That is the news from Lake Wobegon for today.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Thanks all!Looking good. Only see some nitpicky stuff, nothing function impacting.
What? The wiggly traces that avoid invisible obstacles? That was to enable standardized switch cells. Anything else? Tell me now while they are still just pixels.
(Don't count the between-block trace stubs. Those will be used or removed.)
- Ron | samwisekoi
If I got a PCB I think I would frame it or put it up on display. I would feel bad soldering on such beauty.
It might be kind of cool to make it possible to have TKL like the IBMShow Image(http://www.9999hp.net/keyboard/temp/1387033.jpg)
but anything less would just be silly as there are plenty of other choices for regular.
How will YOU use those 153 switch positions? (Yes, I finally counted.)
I can't for the life of me figure out why I might need layers, but I am sure I do. Right? And if we have layers, we should have MODES. That way you can press a single key and be in HTML coding mode, and another and be hacking limbs off of zombies, and another and be designing PCBs, etc.
For some reason gamer keyboards (IIRC) use Gn keys for that purpose. And it seems like the four keys in the upper-left corner would be good for that purpose.
http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/5e5991e096e9d247a50933cfded78416
So here is the question: Should I run indicator LEDs to those four keys?
I mean, WTF, anyhow. It isn't like this isn't already a stupidly large keyboard. What are four more traces betweenfellow freaksfriends?
Serious question: Would indicator LEDs be interesting in that corner of the board?
- Ron | samwisekoi
....and using the unicomp cases is out?
Tall TKL support would be cool and I would definitely build one but honestly if it's too much work don't worry about it.
yeah, that would be almost a perfect use of that four-key cluster.
Make sure it works still if you set it up as three keys though.
That would be cool, this keyboard NEEDS relegendables.
Using those four keys to toggle layers and having indicator LEDs would be awesome.
How will YOU use those 153 switch positions? (Yes, I finally counted.)
How will YOU use those 153 switch positions? (Yes, I finally counted.)
This (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/##@@_x:2.5&a:5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM1&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM2&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM3&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM4&_x:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM5&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM6&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM7&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM8&_x:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0APlay&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0APrev&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ANext&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AStop&_x:0.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AVOL%20UP&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AVOL%20DN&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AMUTE%3B&@_a:4&w:2%3B&=RUN%20STOP&_x:0.5&a:5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF1&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF2&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF3&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF4&_x:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF5&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF6&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF7&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF8&_x:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF9&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF10&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF11&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF12&_x:0.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0APLOT&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ASCRL&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ASTOP%3B&@_y:1%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AGEEK%20HACK&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ARAD%20S&_x:0.5%3B&=~%0A`&=!%0A1&=%2F@%0A2&=%23%0A3&=$%0A4&=%25%0A5&=%5E%0A6&=%2F&%0A7&=*%0A8&=(%0A9&=)%0A0&=%2F_%0A-&=+%0A%2F=&_w:2%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ABackspace&_x:0.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AINS&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AHOME&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0APAGE%20UP&_x:0.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ANUM%20LOCK&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A÷&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AX&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A-%3B&@=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ADEF%20CON&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0Aα&_x:0.5&w:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ATAB&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AQ&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AW&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AE&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AR&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AT&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AY&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AU&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AI&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AO&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AP&=%7B%0A%5B&=%7D%0A%5D&_w:1.5%3B&=%7C%0A%5C&_x:0.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ADEL&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AEND&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0APAGE%20DOWN&_x:0.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A7&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A8&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A9&_h:2%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A+%3B&@=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ARAD%20S&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0Aβ&_x:0.5&w:1.75&l:true%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ACAPS%20LOCK&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AA&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AS&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AD&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AF&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AG&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AH&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AJ&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AK&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AL&=%2F:%0A%2F%3B&=%22%0A'&_w:2.25%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ARETURN&_x:4%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A4&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A5&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A6%3B&@=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AFN&_a:1%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0Aγ&_x:0.5&a:5&w:2.25%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ASHIFT&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AZ&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AX&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AC&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AV&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AB&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AN&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AM&=%3C%0A,&=%3E%0A.&=%3F%0A%2F%2F&_w:2.75%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ASHIFT&_x:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A↑&_x:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A1&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A2&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A3&_h:2%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ALINE%20FEED%3B&@=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ALINE%20FEED&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0An&_x:0.5&w:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ACTRL&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AWIN&_w:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AALT&_a:4&w:7%3B&=&_a:5&w:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AALT&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0AMENU&_w:1.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0ACTRL&_x:0.5%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A←&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A↓&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A→&_x:0.5&w:2%3B&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A0&=%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A%0A.) is what I'm envisioning:
The 1.5-1-1.5 modifiers are easier to source for ALPS caps. May end up going all-1.25x if any ALPS-oriented group buys get off the ground, although I do have a nice 7x spacebar handy.
I'm probably going to source the "second function row" from a Focus FK-9000, which has a left side function cluster AND some incredibly tall function keys on top. I'm sort of contemplating a power button somewhere in the left block-- right now.
The big "Run Stop" escape in that location gives it a nice isolation, letting you pound it in frustration easily... something you lose in more conventional 122s. It may end up being a 1.25x, red-text-on-beige Esc from the FK-9000.
How will YOU use those 153 switch positions? (Yes, I finally counted.)
- Ron | samwisekoi
How will YOU use those 153 switch positions? (Yes, I finally counted.)
- Ron | samwisekoi
Also, I have started the process of a small GB for re-legendables to match Nuclear Data Green. I think 1x and 2x in green and orange.
Finally, the wedge case design I did for the GH36 is a proof of concept for a matching case for this board. Check it out in the GH36 thread or on Shapeways.
- Ron | samwisekoi
It's attached to the plunger of a syringe, so every time he strikes a key, it injects just a little heroin in.
It's attached to the plunger of a syringe, so every time he strikes a key, it injects just a little heroin in.
Ha, no.
Mount it in the case, with the plunger set to hit the side of the case with every keypress.
Seriously? Why not a tiny speaker?If you’ve never tried a keyboard with a solenoid inside, you’re really missing out. Way more fun than a speaker.
solenoid is waaaay better than speaker but there is most likely not enough power from usb to run it and the full LED backlighting as well.It's attached to the plunger of a syringe, so every time he strikes a key, it injects just a little heroin in.
Ha, no.
Mount it in the case, with the plunger set to hit the side of the case with every keypress.
Seriously? Why not a tiny speaker?
In any event, this is such an entertaining concept that if there is an unused pin I shall run it to a pad labelled "SOLENOID". Or possibly "0100010"
- Ron | samwisekoi
solenoid is waaaay better than speaker but there is most likely not enough power from usb to run it and the full LED backlighting as well.It's attached to the plunger of a syringe, so every time he strikes a key, it injects just a little heroin in.
Ha, no.
Mount it in the case, with the plunger set to hit the side of the case with every keypress.
Seriously? Why not a tiny speaker?
In any event, this is such an entertaining concept that if there is an unused pin I shall run it to a pad labelled "SOLENOID". Or possibly "0100010"
- Ron | samwisekoi
solenoid is waaaay better than speaker but there is most likely not enough power from usb to run it and the full LED backlighting as well.It's attached to the plunger of a syringe, so every time he strikes a key, it injects just a little heroin in.
Ha, no.
Mount it in the case, with the plunger set to hit the side of the case with every keypress.
Seriously? Why not a tiny speaker?
In any event, this is such an entertaining concept that if there is an unused pin I shall run it to a pad labelled "SOLENOID". Or possibly "0100010"
- Ron | samwisekoi
This is why Gods gave us external power bricks!
- Ron | samwisekoi
3mm plate as block separator?
I'm sorry, this doesn't qualify as "stupidly large".That is actually smaller than the GH-122/153.
I think this is a good baseline:Show Image(http://deskthority.net/w/images/4/45/HONEY_HYPER7.png)
I'm working on cases. This is the shape I have come up with for the GH36, JD40, and GH-122. It is a "topless wedge" with rounded edges. It is designed to accept a 3mm/.125" acrylic top panel either as a plate or as a block separator.
(Attachment Link)
Topless Wedge Case by samwisekoi 2014
It is $50 +/- for the smaller boards at Shapeways, but 3D printing is way too expensive ($300+) for an object as long as a GH-122 case.
Anyhow, this is the design path I am taking for the GH-122. It will hold all possible variations with a simple laser-cut top plate to change.
- Ron | samwisekoi
... because the top plate would be the only thing that changes between layouts, the main case can be made in bulk and individuals can have top plates laser or CNC-cut from metal, plastic, or wood as they see fit.
Does that explain the concept better?
- Ron | samwisekoi
Could a similar case be made by bending sheet metal... maybe with a plastic "plug" on the sides
And the unicomp case? ...
is it possible to add a USB hub/ports to this monster?
Hey guys
My Tipro photos are up. Please take a look to see if we can gain any lessons from these guys. Sorry that the color is black so it’s really hard to see, and that my photographic skills are non-existent.
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=63510.msg1487567#msg1487567
-=-=
is it possible to add a USB hub/ports to this monster?
Possible? Sure. On the PCB? Probably not. In fact, the keyboard might need TWO USB cables just to get enough power if all of the LEDs are populated and lit. (Apparently this is also true of the new Corsair "tramp stamp" Gaming XL RGB keyboard.)Hey guys
My Tipro photos are up. Please take a look to see if we can gain any lessons from these guys. Sorry that the color is black so it’s really hard to see, and that my photographic skills are non-existent.
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=63510.msg1487567#msg1487567
-=-=
Thanks very much. This is indeed helpful.
Question: Is the upper casing in photos #27-32 a single piece? If so, that is the problem piece for the GH-122/153.
But thanks. These photos will be helpful.
- Ron | samwisekoi
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=63510.msg1487567#msg1487567
-=-=
is it possible to add a USB hub/ports to this monster?
Couple of things...
Power
My preference is to use an external 5v power brick for the LEDs. Except for ground loop issues, this would be easy to implement; just run the external power source to the power rail of the LED transistors. This is WAY DOWN on my to-do list.
Case Design
Using the photos from berserkfan, I got the GH36 case down to $31 of laser-cut Acrylic for a PAIR of topless wedge cases. And designed properly, that top frame for the GH-122/153 can be 3D printed for $49. The rest of the case would be flat Acrylic or metal that can be easily laser-cut.
That is a HUGE win!
Thanks berserkfan!
- Ron | samwisekoi
Couple of things...I don't think ground loops will be an issue with this, but if you're worried, you just have to tie the grounds together at just one point.
Power
My preference is to use an external 5v power brick for the LEDs. Except for ground loop issues, this would be easy to implement; just run the external power source to the power rail of the LED transistors. This is WAY DOWN on my to-do list.
But regarding that top frame, would it be possible to make it from a few flat pieces of plastic that we screw together with the aid of other plastic pieces to hold the screws, instead of via 3D printing? I am pretty much for avoiding the 3D printing process altogether, mainly because there are no economies of scale and the accretive process makes for less durable casings. I remember asking and the shop said the plastic they use melts at 65 degrees C. That’s ridiculous. If I left my keyboard in a car in summer, the keyboard would get soft and floppy!
Now another thing as you can see in my photos, the Tipro bottom plate actually has holes in it for sticking their rubber pads. I am for the use of rubber or silicon if you’re going for an acrylic bottom plate, because acrylic is too easy to scratch and also we want a keyboard that doesn’t slide off an uneven surface.
It’s late now. Tomorrow I will draw (by hand) an illustration of what I mean. I’m afraid I am too technologically ancient to do this any other way.
Anyhow, this is an extensible design. Thanks, berserkfan!
- Ron | samwisekoi
Well, I hope my hand-drawn designs were useful... I feel really embarrassed to be using hand drawn designs at a time when the entire younger generation seems to be CAD experts, that's why I told you over email not to show anyone what I'd done. Hope the modular idea will work in practice so that we can attain economies of scale for most keyboard casings.
Well, I hope my hand-drawn designs were useful... I feel really embarrassed to be using hand drawn designs at a time when the entire younger generation seems to be CAD experts, that's why I told you over email not to show anyone what I'd done. Hope the modular idea will work in practice so that we can attain economies of scale for most keyboard casings.
A thought: on the full-size one, you could have several standoffs to reduce flex. Looking at the empty case from my Ducky 1008XM, it has three or so standoffs.
Looking very interesting Ron. The file "GH36x2 Laser Wedge Sides.png" represents pieces that have to be cut for a pair of cases if I'm not wrong, correct?
They were. I don't think we need quite that many parts, but an extensible design doesn't necessarily mean extensible parts. I'll draft end plates for various widths, and longer back plates are probably attainable from any plastics shop.
[UPDATE]
I drew this comparison up so people could see the various sizes of side plates next to each other. From shortest to longest they are:
- 5-row keyboard (60% through wide-and-narrow GH-122)
- 6-row keyboard (GH36)
- 8-row keyboard (Full-size GH-122/153)
Width is varied by getting longer or shorter front and back rails. And then the bottom plate is sized to fit.
- Ron | samwisekoi
[/UPDATE]
How do you intend for the pieces to combine?
Ah, I see where you're coming from. You have the concept of a basic design, except scaled to whichever size of kb that geekhackers want.
My concept is more akin to the Tipro that I am using. There is a minimum base keyboard, and if you want anything else (function row, tenkeys, numpad, etc.) these are added on. My concept has the advantage of allowing people to swap parts around (eg put numpad on the left side) but it involves having more components which might confuse people. Yours is definitely far simpler and idiot proof.
However, I would still urge doing a design where the majority of the parts are common to all keyboard layouts. That way it is easier for us to attain economies of scale in production.
Regarding your choice of standoff for the Gh36, would it be the same as standoffs used in Filco LEDs and in the G122? I'm thinking that standardization of parts would make things pretty cheap. These LED standoffs come in like, what, packs of thousands for only a few bucks?
One thought I had - spacebars that don't have a center stem. Any need to add a switch position for this?
One thought I had - spacebars that don't have a center stem. Any need to add a switch position for this?
You mean those wierd-ass Cherry spacebars with the offset switch? There should be room on the bottom row, so if someone can point me to the specs, I'll add the position.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Sig auto-typed by my GH36 LH keypad.
If I bought the Nuclear Data keycap set, how many relegendables would I potentially need to supplement it for this keyboard?
Cherry offset switch position for 6.25 is actually the same exact spot for a 7x from the left. So it already taken care of on the PCB.
Cherry offset switch position for 6.25 is actually the same exact spot for a 7x from the left. So it already taken care of on the PCB.
Good question. I've been holding off on buying boards because I expect this to lighten my wallet substantially. I already have everything I need save PCB, plate, and case.
This keyboard is going to heavily tempt me to want to get a set of Dasher terminal themed keys
What won't be fine is that every designer will have to remember that this PCB has that extra spacing, and that the 0.750" square grid is stretched vertically into an 0.750 x 0.8125" grid. This will be especially important for 2x vertical keys like ISO Enter and the pair on a numpad.
What won't be fine is that every designer will have to remember that this PCB has that extra spacing, and that the 0.750" square grid is stretched vertically into an 0.750 x 0.8125" grid. This will be especially important for 2x vertical keys like ISO Enter and the pair on a numpad.
this is my primary concern when messing with spacing. What keycaps do you plan to put on the vertical keys? They would need to have custom stem spacing, which is expensive and hard to do.
I think you should keep the 0.75" spacing and just split the difference so half the "gap" is on the bottom and the other half if at the top.
Greetings!
While the GH36 Matrix Keypad and the Nuclear Data Green keycap group buy (and recently, the JD45 PCB layout) have taken my time away from the GH-122/154, I have not forgotten! In fact, you should all take comfort that I am using those lesser boards to aid my learning curve as I work my way up to the battleship that is the one and only GH-122.
I thought of the PCB strips concept, and I think even proposed it elsewhere as "finger" PCBs. Strip-based column wiring, 2x vertical switches, and structural rigidity were issues I didn't want to address for a board this large. Maybe later...
For now I am staying with a flat, semi-modular PCB. For the Unicomp PC-122 case, I have taken further measurements and am going to have a plate and/or faux-PCB made to do some test fits. I am going to drop the non-square spacing idea, although it is gratifying to know that I reverse-engineered IBM spacing to the thousandth! :cool:
Anyhow, I am back on this project for mechanical design. On the PCB front, I need to hand off the JD45 PCB to jdcarpe, and then get the GH36 Beta traces finished.
I'll post more when I have the mock-ups under way.
Cheers!
- Ron | samwisekoi
Sig auto-typed by my GH36 LH keypad.
Ron, will you be doing another group buy for nuclear data and relegendables in the next 6 months or whenever you finish your current 122-key? I think many people will be happy to buy the keycaps once they see they have a good keyboard to put the keycaps on.
[Actually, I missed out on both group buys, they finished so fast!]
Ron, as I have said in the past, I really hope you will go for modular. Like the Tipro. The bigger a plate and casing is in one piece, the harder to make and to transport and to transform/ adjust to suit different sizes as well as the more challenge to assemble and to make every part fit precisely.
I am making a plate to fit the PC-122 case. Well, test fit, more like!
The critical dimension is the 0.350" block spacing, which I believe to be correct and final. I am using .750" between the main block and the upper rows, although I think that section should be cut and separately mounted. It probably won't need a plate except for aesthetics.
I'll post my plate design once I get the outer dimensions and mounting worked out. Mine will have:
ANSI 122-key plus:
- ISO Enter and \| keys
- Offset Capslock switch
- Winkeyless bottom row (1.5 - 1 - 1.5 - 7 - 1.5 - 1 - 1.5)
- Cross-shaped arrow cluster
- Cherry plate-mount stabsShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/yeJamej.png)
PC-122 Test Plate v141111b by samwisekoi 2014
Anyhow, once I get a quote for the plate, I'll order extras for anyone who wants one.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Sig auto-typed by my GH36 LH keypad.
I am making a plate to fit the PC-122 case. Well, test fit, more like!
The critical dimension is the 0.350" block spacing, which I believe to be correct and final. I am using .750" between the main block and the upper rows, although I think that section should be cut and separately mounted. It probably won't need a plate except for aesthetics.
I'll post my plate design once I get the outer dimensions and mounting worked out. Mine will have:
ANSI 122-key plus:
- ISO Enter and \| keys
- Offset Capslock switch
- Winkeyless bottom row (1.5 - 1 - 1.5 - 7 - 1.5 - 1 - 1.5)
- Cross-shaped arrow cluster
- Cherry plate-mount stabsShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/yeJamej.png)
PC-122 Test Plate v141111b by samwisekoi 2014
Anyhow, once I get a quote for the plate, I'll order extras for anyone who wants one.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Sig auto-typed by my GH36 LH keypad.
This is the layout that all keyboards should be.
Why can I find it nowhere?
This is the layout that all keyboards should be.
Why can I find it nowhere?
http://pckeyboard.com/page/PC122/UB40B5AShow Image(http://pckeyboard.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/BLKPC122Front.jpg)
And what makes F122s or M122s so hard to find? I have sold plenty of them, still have plenty of them!
And what makes F122s or M122s so hard to find? I have sold plenty of them, still have plenty of them!
With Cherry MX stems? Or choice of switches?
The point here is not to replace the F-122 (or even the still-available PC-122) but to create an adaptable, programmable, modern expression of the 122-key keyboard.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Sig auto-typed by my GH36 LH keypad.
The tipro idea is cool, but not very battleship-ish is it?
The tipro idea is cool, but not very battleship-ish is it?
I think the point is that it's very scalable and thus of inherent worth to this project.
Also: tipro can absolutely be a battleship. check out kbdfr's setup on DTShow Image(http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/1308/tiprokbd003.jpg)
http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/programming-a-tipro-board-on-the-fly-like-a-cherry-g80-2100-t813.html#p18835 (http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/programming-a-tipro-board-on-the-fly-like-a-cherry-g80-2100-t813.html#p18835)
If that's not a battleship, I'm not sure I know what is.
Still interested in this.
Still interested in this.
+1
Who's in charge around here, anyhow?
- Ron | samwisekoi
This keyboard is going to heavily tempt me to want to get a set of Dasher terminal themed keysShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/1fcxPWd.jpg)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/MD7M25B.jpg)
I'm sure this question has come up before, but can we have those 4 blocked off key open for us to use?
The PC-122 case won't support it, but I'm sure some people would be daring enough to wreck a case for the sake of 4 extra keys :p
I'm sure this question has come up before, but can we have those 4 blocked off key open for us to use?
The PC-122 case won't support it, but I'm sure some people would be daring enough to wreck a case for the sake of 4 extra keys :p
I'm sure this question has come up before, but can we have those 4 blocked off key open for us to use?
The PC-122 case won't support it, but I'm sure some people would be daring enough to wreck a case for the sake of 4 extra keys :p
Oh yes. There aren't 4 hidden key positions you can use. There are 30 other key positions you can use -- for a total of one-hundred and fifty-two keys!
Below and attached is a "max keys" example. The legends used are fairly arbitrary, since I couldn't actually think of any reason to use all 152 positions at the same time. But you could!
http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/a3da0ec2c105d9a93e76e42d781d2ccb
- Ron | samwisekoi
Sig auto-typed by my GH36 LH keypad.
Oh yes. There aren't 4 hidden key positions you can use. There are 30 other key positions you can use -- for a total of one-hundred and fifty-two keys!
Below and attached is a "max keys" example. The legends used are fairly arbitrary, since I couldn't actually think of any reason to use all 152 positions at the same time. But you could!
http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/a3da0ec2c105d9a93e76e42d781d2ccb
- Ron | samwisekoi
Not a carrier, a battleship! All guns blazing.
Not a carrier, a battleship! All guns blazing.
But when you factor in the air wing, a carrier has much higher offensive capabilities than a battleship.
Same here. This and the Axios thread are two I regularly check on.
Same here. This and the Axios thread are two I regularly check on.
Great thanks. I didn't know about the Axios. Just what I needed, yet another custom build to lust after and eventually throw money after.
Hi!
Hi!
Not yet.
- Ron | samwisekoi
(Typed on my newly-mapped JD45.)
ANY status at all???
Get the native PS/2 NMB Hi-Tek and forget about those wimpy switches.
I've been looking at doing a custom plate and PCB with a layout from keyboard-layout-editor.com... as a rough approximation, a similar size plate seems to run about $100 to cut. I suspect that this might be the fastest route to a 122-sized custom.I design my own PCBs on hand. I developed a technique on Eagle that makes it easy to design any keyboard you want. Of course it isn't as fast as an script, but I still prefer doing it.
The problem is PCBs... there's a tool that's supposed to generate a PCB from the layout, but it seemed to blow up when I fed it my massive layout model.
That would be awesome.I've been looking at doing a custom plate and PCB with a layout from keyboard-layout-editor.com... as a rough approximation, a similar size plate seems to run about $100 to cut. I suspect that this might be the fastest route to a 122-sized custom.I design my own PCBs on hand. I developed a technique on Eagle that makes it easy to design any keyboard you want. Of course it isn't as fast as an script, but I still prefer doing it.
The problem is PCBs... there's a tool that's supposed to generate a PCB from the layout, but it seemed to blow up when I fed it my massive layout model.
And the technique is dead simple: before anything else, create a new project and start with the board, not the schematics. Activate the grid view (I prefer dots, but you can set to lines too, your preference) and set the grid granularity to 0.1875 inches. That's 0.25u of a key. Then I start drawing guidelines with lines of 0 width of the reference or document layers. Only after drawing all guidelines I go to the schematics and start designing the board.
I should make a time lapse video showing this, I think some people would be interested.