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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: Matias on Wed, 09 January 2013, 08:59:46

Title: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Wed, 09 January 2013, 08:59:46
Info and video, courtesy of Engadget...

      http://www.engadget.com/2013/01/08/matias-mini-quiet-laptop-pro (http://www.engadget.com/2013/01/08/matias-mini-quiet-laptop-pro)

These use our dampened Quiet Click switches, based on the ALPS design.  Ordering and product details can be found here...

      http://matias.ca/quietpro (http://matias.ca/quietpro)

Let me know if there are questions.

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: iri on Wed, 09 January 2013, 09:30:24
yes! yes! yesssssss!!!!111111
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: iri on Wed, 09 January 2013, 09:36:37
fukken ordered!
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: fatmav on Thu, 10 January 2013, 13:01:08
Have anyone seen the actual Force-Travel diagram of the quiet switches used in these keyboards? It's easy to find those diagrams for Cherry switches, but I have no luck for these so far.

(For example, a diagram for cherry ML can be found here: http://www.cherrycorp.com/english/switches/key/images/ml_force.gif )

Thanks!
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: daerid on Thu, 10 January 2013, 13:05:15
That guy has horrible typing technique.

PS: Will you guys ever release a PC version of the Tactile  Pro? I'd absolutely love a NON silenced version of that mini PC board.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: daerid on Thu, 10 January 2013, 15:12:54
Wouldn't it be more logistically simple to offer DIP switches on the bottom that toggle between PC/Mac modes - and include a keypuller and relevant keycaps of the other OS?

That's a brilliant idea, but unfortunately I think it would cannibalize sales.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Thu, 10 January 2013, 19:11:03
I would buy it in a second if they had clicky keys. BUT, in the video the guy clearly is typing on a mini clicky keyboard. Do you have it? I am buying it if you do. Thanks.  ;D
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Burz on Fri, 11 January 2013, 00:28:03
The DIP switch idea really makes sense for a smallish portable keyboard, since its more likely to be carried around between Macs and PCs by the same user.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: polpo on Fri, 11 January 2013, 00:31:35
I would buy it in a second if they had clicky keys. BUT, in the video the guy clearly is typing on a mini clicky keyboard. Do you have it? I am buying it if you do. Thanks.  ;D

There's the Mini Tactile Pro: http://matias.ca/minitactilepro/mac/
Mac layout only for now, it looks like.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Fri, 11 January 2013, 16:25:31
Why wouldn't they make that keyboard Bluetooth? It makes no sense. But i credit Matias for getting a jump on the competition for having a Bluetooth, USB port tenkeyless keyboard. DAS is too slow on advancing their keyboard that i wouldn't waste my time with them unless they do something soon.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: deepthawt on Sat, 26 January 2013, 10:23:53
looking at the matias mini quiet pro

[attachimg=1]

I love the layout, the choice of keys at corners where fingers can home in on.
pgup and pgdn conveniently located.
But I am puzzled, Y.O.Y are there two 2! OS keys instead of 1 OS key and 1 menu key.
That is beyond my understanding and I rarely if ever use the menu key anyway, but still...

<sarcasm>.oO(I wonder if it has two multimedia STOP buttons and no PAUSE button.)</sarcasm>

I intend to protest this absurdity and get one anyway, because it is frankly IMHO gorgeous, functional and considerate and I will learn to overlook this quirk.

matias mini quiet pro mmMMMmm

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: FoxWolf1 on Sat, 26 January 2013, 11:19:03
I rarely if ever use the menu key anyway

Reckon you may have answered your own question there...
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: BucklingSpring on Sat, 26 January 2013, 12:41:56
SwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwEeeeet!!!

And the Laptop Pro for Mac... Does it mean no wireless version for PC?
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: deepthawt on Sat, 26 January 2013, 12:51:20
Reckon you may have answered your own question there...

LOL Indeed! i did.

At work i'm using a model M 1391401, which has neither OSkey nor Menu key , and I get by with Ctrl+Esc  and Shift+F10

I have 2 keyboards on my wish list, this one and a Model M compact.
maybe i'll nickname then whisper and shout :D


edit:
ok, i couldn't stand it anymore, I went to the matias.ca site and pre-ordered one. 
it was the 'free shipping' on pre-orders that pushed me over the edge
.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: BucklingSpring on Sat, 26 January 2013, 16:53:36
Quote from Matias site http://matias.ca/miniquietpro/pc/ (http://matias.ca/miniquietpro/pc/)

"Available in Japan from Diatec (Filco)"

Kewl - That's pretty neat.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Pyrolistical on Sat, 26 January 2013, 20:04:05
When are these things shipping?  I know it said early feb but any updates?

Oddly I was already charged for it. That's not standard practise
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: fatmav on Sat, 26 January 2013, 20:13:05
I too noticed that they charged my card already. The pre-order confirmation email says mid-Feb:

Quote
Thank you for your pre-order of our new Matias keyboard.
As per the description on our order page, this keyboard is not yet in
stock and will be sent with free shipping via UPS as soon as the stock
arrives in mid February.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Sat, 26 January 2013, 21:02:39
Just in time for my birthday on the February 16. How pathetic that i have to buy my own birthday gift.  :mad:
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: iri on Sun, 27 January 2013, 09:19:25
they did charge my card too. didn't know i'd have to wait for mid february for it to be shipped.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Sun, 27 January 2013, 09:56:28
Matias has wonderful customer support. They admitted from the beginning that it wouldn't be ready until mid-Feb so i will be waiting anxiously for it. I give a lot of credit to Matias for making a compact keyboard. I wish they made the Tactile one Bluetooth or wireless but maybe some day they will.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: daerid on Sun, 27 January 2013, 15:16:38
I use the menu key all the freaking time. I wish that Windows had the ability to do device-specific remapping :-|
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Hyde on Sun, 27 January 2013, 16:44:15
Man the Mini Tactile Pro looks really good  :D
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Tue, 29 January 2013, 03:59:23
When are these things shipping?  I know it said early feb but any updates?

The February production run of the Bluetooth model is sold out, so we're now taking pre-orders for March on that one.  The Wall Street Journal reviewed it on Saturday, and the resulting sales pushed us over the edge.  :-)

The USB models are still available for February.

Quote
Oddly I was already charged for it. That's not standard practise

Sorry about that.  It's a limitation of our online store provider (Kagi).  If you'd rather have it billed when it ships, just call us and place your order over the phone -- and mention that you want it charged only when it ships.

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: gameaholic on Tue, 29 January 2013, 10:15:57
Might have to pick up my first alps board.  Anyone with experience with both switches have a preference?  I don't care that much about noise. 
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: deltr on Tue, 29 January 2013, 15:44:20
That guy has horrible typing technique.
QFT

Also, that design left it shaped like it is the top half of a laptop.. like it would connect to a macbook keyboard to create some sort of monster..

(http://i.imgur.com/33heJ7Z.png)
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: polpo on Tue, 29 January 2013, 17:04:38
Hilarious 'shop, deltr.

The design comes from Matias's original Tactile Pro keyboard, which is is a reference to Apple's original USB keyboards:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e4/Apple_USB_Keyboard_B.jpg)
Which are themselves a reference to Apple's Keyboard II:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/37/Apple_Keyboard_II.jpg)
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: deltr on Tue, 29 January 2013, 17:17:24
Hilarious 'shop, deltr.

The design comes from Matias's original Tactile Pro keyboard, which is is a reference to Apple's original USB keyboards

Haha, it all makes sense now!

(http://i.imgur.com/ni1CtcD.png)
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: BucklingSpring on Tue, 29 January 2013, 18:30:03
The USB models are still available for February.

Stock minus one... Just ordered mine.

Matias has wonderful customer support.

+1 -> I suspected a KRO problem when I got my full size Quiet Pro. It turned out to be the KVM's fault.
Meanwhile Matias provided immediate support to investigate the problem.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Dirty Bint on Tue, 29 January 2013, 18:42:43
Will the mini quiet pro be available with UK layout?
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Tue, 29 January 2013, 19:36:12
The USB models are still available for February.

Stock minus one... Just ordered mine.

Matias has wonderful customer support.

+1 -> I suspected a KRO problem when I got my full size Quiet Pro. It turned out to be the KVM's fault.
Meanwhile Matias provided immediate support to investigate the problem.

I had a problem getting the wrong keyboard from Matias and i vented my frustration on this website and the Matias moderator intervened and helped point me in the right direction for help. This site is awesome and so is Matias! That is why they are going to be getting more of my money. It's a win win.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Dirty Bint on Wed, 30 January 2013, 11:13:12
I will repeat my question:

Will the mini quiet pro be available with UK layout?
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: polpo on Wed, 30 January 2013, 17:38:14
Matias says in this post (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=39057.msg769033#msg769033) that they'll do the Laptop Pro in UK if The Keyboard Company decides to carry them. I assume the same for the Mini Quiet Pro. So asking The Keyboard Company probably will help.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Hyde on Wed, 30 January 2013, 18:22:36
Kinda a weird question but... how do you pronounce "Matias".  Is it "mah-tee-ahh-sss" or "mah-t-eye-yaa-sss"?
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Thu, 31 January 2013, 00:28:27
Matias : update on blank keycaps?

We're gearing up for the switches now.  Should be ready to ship next week.

The keycaps will have to wait until after Chinese New Year -- March.

Why wouldn't they make that keyboard Bluetooth? It makes no sense. But i credit Matias for getting a jump on the competition for having a Bluetooth, USB port tenkeyless keyboard. DAS is too slow on advancing their keyboard that i wouldn't waste my time with them unless they do something soon.

When we started working on the Mini Tactile Pro, there was a lot of debate as to whether it should be Bluetooth or USB.  It was a close call.  Ultimately, we chose to go with USB because the Tactile Pro was USB, and the Mini gave us a small and wired option for the Mac, while the Laptop Pro served as the small wireless option.

Having said all that, we are always open to feedback, so if anyone has strong feelings either way, feel free to vent them here.  :-)

looking at the matias mini quiet pro

(Attachment Link)

I love the layout, the choice of keys at corners where fingers can home in on.
pgup and pgdn conveniently located.
But I am puzzled, Y.O.Y are there two 2! OS keys instead of 1 OS key and 1 menu key.
That is beyond my understanding and I rarely if ever use the menu key anyway, but still...

This was another compromise we made.  For Mac users who want a wired or black Mini Quiet Pro, having 2 Win/OS keys makes it easy for it to serve double-duty as a Mac keyboard.

If you want that right Win/OS key to be a Menu key, it's easy enough to remap using AutoHotkey.

The other option would be to use Shift+F10 instead (as deepthawt suggested).

Will the mini quiet pro be available with UK layout?

Yes, and you can thank The Keyboard Company for that.  They placed Mini Quiet Pro orders for UK, German, and Nordic layouts.

Kinda a weird question but... how do you pronounce "Matias".  Is it "mah-tee-ahh-sss" or "mah-t-eye-yaa-sss"?

There are a few different ways you can pronounce it, but probably the easiest is "muh-tie-us".  :-)

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Thu, 31 January 2013, 00:49:26
Matias has wonderful customer support.

+1 -> I suspected a KRO problem when I got my full size Quiet Pro. It turned out to be the KVM's fault.
Meanwhile Matias provided immediate support to investigate the problem.

I had a problem getting the wrong keyboard from Matias and i vented my frustration on this website and the Matias moderator intervened and helped point me in the right direction for help. This site is awesome and so is Matias! That is why they are going to be getting more of my money. It's a win win.

Glad you both had positive experiences -- and thanks for saying so!  We try to take good care of everyone.

Regarding KVM switches, they are a bit of a headache when used with keyboards that have built-in hubs.  If anyone has had success with any particular model, please let me know, so I can pass the info along.

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Thu, 31 January 2013, 00:58:12
Hilarious 'shop, deltr.

The design comes from Matias's original Tactile Pro keyboard, which is is a reference to Apple's original USB keyboards:
Show Image
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e4/Apple_USB_Keyboard_B.jpg)

Which are themselves a reference to Apple's Keyboard II:
Show Image
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/37/Apple_Keyboard_II.jpg)


Yes, the lineage is pretty clear.  :-)

Having the top edge inset makes it easier to accommodate plugs into the hub -- you don't have to worry about them poking out the side, and interfering with your mouse.

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Hyde on Thu, 31 January 2013, 12:38:40
There are a few different ways you can pronounce it, but probably the easiest is "muh-tie-us".  :-)

Cool thanks now I'm ready for the Matias Tour  :D

PS: Will you guys ever release a PC version of the Tactile  Pro? I'd absolutely love a NON silenced version of that mini PC board.

lol I'm actually interested in a full size PC version Tactile Pro  :)
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Thu, 31 January 2013, 18:47:06
PS: Will you guys ever release a PC version of the Tactile  Pro? I'd absolutely love a NON silenced version of that mini PC board.

lol I'm actually interested in a full size PC version Tactile Pro  :)

I think you'll see one eventually.  :-)

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: deepthawt on Sat, 02 February 2013, 10:05:39
"Well," said Pooh, "what I like best -- "and then he had to stop and think. Because although Eating Honey was a very good thing to do, there was a moment just before you began to eat it which was better than when you were, but he didn't know what it was called”

I think the word is 'anticipation'

yay, February is here and that means the MMQP is soon to be on its way.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: BucklingSpring on Sat, 02 February 2013, 10:38:14
"Well," said Pooh, "what I like best -- "and then he had to stop and think. Because although Eating Honey was a very good thing to do, there was a moment just before you began to eat it which was better than when you were, but he didn't know what it was called”

I think the word is 'anticipation'

yay, February is here and that means the MMQP is soon to be on its way.

We can bet on who is going to get it first...
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: iri on Sun, 03 February 2013, 04:20:39
"Well," said Pooh, "what I like best -- "and then he had to stop and think. Because although Eating Honey was a very good thing to do, there was a moment just before you began to eat it which was better than when you were, but he didn't know what it was called”

I think the word is 'anticipation'

yay, February is here and that means the MMQP is soon to be on its way.

We can bet on who is going to get it first...
can we be on who is going to get it last? i will win
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: simingma on Thu, 07 February 2013, 20:53:44
I preordered Bluetooth and but cancelled it after receiving the tactile pro. I will definitely get one when resellers start to carry them.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: RougeR on Thu, 07 February 2013, 21:03:42
wait so your saying the bluetooth one is only available for a mac os computer....why cater to something with only a 10% market share instead of catering to all personal computers (yes macs are pcs)
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Burz on Sat, 09 February 2013, 21:47:08
Well I did it-- Went and pre-ordered a PC Mini MQP (that's a mouthful)!

I should soon be out of the keyboard ghetto. :D
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Sun, 10 February 2013, 08:55:41
Matias most likely is going to make a bluetooth PC mini tactile keyboard along with a mini tactile mac bluetooth keyboard. I don't understand why they didn't do it for the tactile models in the beginning but whatever. I bought the Matias Mini Tactile Mac keyboard and i can't wait. I have cleaned off my desk and it is ready for it's new home.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: daerid on Sun, 10 February 2013, 11:15:26
I think you'll see one eventually.  :-)

Hell yes! This makes me very excited :)


Also, I don't remember where, but Matias said that they went with the configuration (mac+bt, pc+wired) due to market research.

There's nothing stopping you from using the BT MQP on a PC, you'd just have to remap some keys. Vice-versa for the USB MQP on a Mac
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Sun, 10 February 2013, 12:01:49
Personally, i like the look of the PC mini version keyboard. However, it isn't tactile and that is what i want so i bought the white mini tactile keyboard.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Burz on Sun, 10 February 2013, 16:17:58
Personally, i like the look of the PC mini version keyboard. However, it isn't tactile and that is what i want so i bought the white mini tactile keyboard.
They are ALL tactile. I think what you mean is they aren't clicky.

I still mostly use Macs, but got the PC MQP anyway. Once you setup a program like keyremap4macbook a PC keyboard becomes no impediment whatsoever.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: deepthawt on Sun, 10 February 2013, 20:28:15
yes! yes! yesssssss!!!!111111
+1 ^-^

edit: LOL I   +1'd   an old post,  changed my forum prefs to have newest on top, and started reading oldest ..



 
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Pyrolistical on Wed, 13 February 2013, 11:06:53
Still waiting
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: aviphysics on Sat, 16 February 2013, 17:46:41
Would the laptop pro work with a PC? I am on the lookout for something like this for my home theater PC.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Sat, 16 February 2013, 18:01:27
Would the laptop pro work with a PC? I am on the lookout for something like this for my home theater PC.

Yes, as long as your home theatre PC supports Bluetooth.

The only oddity is that the Alt and Win keys are swapped, but that shouldn't be too much of an issue.

BTW, just out of curiosity, what's the minimal keyset you'd want for a home theatre PC keyboard?

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: aviphysics on Sat, 16 February 2013, 19:41:27
I currently switch back and forth between a Logitech Dinovo Mini and Lenovo N5902. Both of them have acceptable minimal keysets, though I would really like something bigger with proper keys. Both of them have sufficient key sets.

For a HTPC, my ideal media keyboard would have a 60% layout with dedicated arrow keys, sort of like this http://imgur.com/q3SfrH7. Being able to ctrl-alt-del is necessary. If you would really like, I can give you a key by key list of what I think is absolutely necessary.

Some things that would make it better compared to the aforementioned 60% layout, but aren't strictly necessary.
-Backlight that turns off when the keyboard is idle. Configurable timeout would be a very nice feature.

-Some sort of "media" toggle key that would turn the arrow keys into media up, down, left, right keys, turn some of the keys into media keys (play, pause, stop, etc), and disable back light for everything but the the media keys.

-A Thinkpad like keyboard nipple with mouse buttons below the space bar would be ideal. Alternatively, a thumb sized trackpad on the right (The thumb trackpad on the Lenovo N5902 is acceptable (http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/06/lenovo-n5902-ditches-the-fingerprint-magnet-finish-adds-backlit/) with mouse buttons on the left would work. I think good mouse control can really turn a good media keyboard into a great one.

-dedicated Pg Up and Pg Dn can be nice.

-a sleep/wake key would be nice.

-The ability to access F1-F12 through a function key is nice if you want to use the board to configure the bios. None of my current media keyboards have function keys. I plug in a full keyboard when I need to do this, which is very rare. F keys wouldn't really affect my purchasing decision. Other things are much more important to me.

-The ultimate media keyboard would also have a programmable IR blaster for controlling TV, Receiver, etc, but that seems like something of a pipe dream.

Edit:
Guru-Board seems to have the most minimal acceptable layout (still not wireless). http://www.guru-board.com/english/layout_en . This layout has all the required keys, as long as there is a way to Ctr-Alt-Del. A wireless version of this would be acceptable but I think a slightly bigger keyboard might actually be better because it will likely have to sit on your lap. If it is too small, I don't think it would sit nicely on a lap.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: aviphysics on Sun, 17 February 2013, 21:56:00

Yes, as long as your home theatre PC supports Bluetooth.

The only oddity is that the Alt and Win keys are swapped, but that shouldn't be too much of an issue.

BTW, just out of curiosity, what's the minimal keyset you'd want for a home theatre PC keyboard?

Are the alt and OS key caps interchangeable?

Also out of curiosity. Should we expect a media oriented wireless board anytime in the near future?


Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Hyde on Sun, 17 February 2013, 22:34:06
Are the alt and OS key caps interchangeable?

Also out of curiosity. Should we expect a media oriented wireless board anytime in the near future?

If you mean Alt and Win keys, then probably not because Win Key is 1x1 and Alt is 1x1.5.  If you mean from a PC board to the Mac board with the respective keys, then probably yes because they're both ALPS keycaps.

And what do you mean media oriented, because both the PC and Mac versions all have built in media keys already (volume, play/pause ... etc).
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: aviphysics on Mon, 18 February 2013, 00:54:10
Are the alt and OS key caps interchangeable?

Also out of curiosity. Should we expect a media oriented wireless board anytime in the near future?

If you mean Alt and Win keys, then probably not because Win Key is 1x1 and Alt is 1x1.5.  If you mean from a PC board to the Mac board with the respective keys, then probably yes because they're both ALPS keycaps.

And what do you mean media oriented, because both the PC and Mac versions all have built in media keys already (volume, play/pause ... etc).

I was referring to the Laptop Pro, which as far as I know is one of the few or only compact wireless mechanical keyboard and is designed for Mac. He has said it would work with windows but the "Alt" and "Win" key would be switched. To be honest, I am not entirely sure what this means because the Laptop pro only has option and command.  I am guessing he means that the command key will function as the "Win" key and the option key will function as "Alt".

I didn't think to ask if the media keys on the Laptop Pro would work in windows.

When I asked about a media oriented keyboard, I was referring the question he asked me. Some of the things I think would make a keyboard more media oriented are things I already listed in my previous reply to him. Features like some sort of mouse integration, a media lock key that locks the media keys in media mode and deactivates other keys, backlight, and small changes to ergonomics to make it more adapted to laptop use are all things that make a keyboard more convenient for HTPC use. While practically any keyboard can dish out the necessities a HTPC requires, a basic set of media keys does not make a media oriented keyboard IMO.

Edit: seems like the best alternative might be to replace the electronics in a quickfire Rapid with a wireless keyboard controller. Some pics on the net from someone who do this with a Filco and Logitech Wii keyboard. Doesn't look to hard. If one were to make a custom case, it might be possible to do something really neat with a Logitech K400 trackpad and keyboard controller combined with a QFR.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Number_25 on Mon, 18 February 2013, 01:24:17
'Quiet mechanical keyboard'.

Why?
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: vyshane on Mon, 18 February 2013, 05:03:40
'Quiet mechanical keyboard'.

Why?

Because quiet.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: vyshane on Mon, 18 February 2013, 05:10:16
wait so your saying the bluetooth one is only available for a mac os computer....why cater to something with only a 10% market share instead of catering to all personal computers (yes macs are pcs)


Macs are PCs like you said. Feel free to use the bluetooth keyboard with your PC.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Mon, 18 February 2013, 23:22:44
Thanks for taking the time to write up your wishlist for a home theatre mechanical keyboard.  It sounds very cool...

I'd love to do a product like that, but I fear that the cost of integrating a pointing device into it would probably price it out of most peoples' budgets.  Also, I'm not sure how many people out there would want something like that, given how compact and convenient the current offerings are.  That Lenovo keyboard especially looks nicely done.

Regarding the modifier keys, "Option" generates the keycode for "Alt", and "Command" generates the keycode for "Win".


I currently switch back and forth between a Logitech Dinovo Mini and Lenovo N5902. Both of them have acceptable minimal keysets, though I would really like something bigger with proper keys. Both of them have sufficient key sets.

For a HTPC, my ideal media keyboard would have a 60% layout with dedicated arrow keys, sort of like this http://imgur.com/q3SfrH7. Being able to ctrl-alt-del is necessary. If you would really like, I can give you a key by key list of what I think is absolutely necessary.

Some things that would make it better compared to the aforementioned 60% layout, but aren't strictly necessary.
-Backlight that turns off when the keyboard is idle. Configurable timeout would be a very nice feature.

-Some sort of "media" toggle key that would turn the arrow keys into media up, down, left, right keys, turn some of the keys into media keys (play, pause, stop, etc), and disable back light for everything but the the media keys.

-A Thinkpad like keyboard nipple with mouse buttons below the space bar would be ideal. Alternatively, a thumb sized trackpad on the right (The thumb trackpad on the Lenovo N5902 is acceptable (http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/06/lenovo-n5902-ditches-the-fingerprint-magnet-finish-adds-backlit/) with mouse buttons on the left would work. I think good mouse control can really turn a good media keyboard into a great one.

-dedicated Pg Up and Pg Dn can be nice.

-a sleep/wake key would be nice.

-The ability to access F1-F12 through a function key is nice if you want to use the board to configure the bios. None of my current media keyboards have function keys. I plug in a full keyboard when I need to do this, which is very rare. F keys wouldn't really affect my purchasing decision. Other things are much more important to me.

-The ultimate media keyboard would also have a programmable IR blaster for controlling TV, Receiver, etc, but that seems like something of a pipe dream.

Edit:
Guru-Board seems to have the most minimal acceptable layout (still not wireless). http://www.guru-board.com/english/layout_en . This layout has all the required keys, as long as there is a way to Ctr-Alt-Del. A wireless version of this would be acceptable but I think a slightly bigger keyboard might actually be better because it will likely have to sit on your lap. If it is too small, I don't think it would sit nicely on a lap.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Hyde on Mon, 18 February 2013, 23:56:29
Yeah basically on a PC Keyboard from left to right you get:

Ctrl  ->  Window  ->  Alt  ->  Spacebar  ->  Alt  ->  Window  ->  Ctrl

On a Mac Keyboard from left to right you get:

Ctrl  ->  Alt/Option  ->  Command  ->  Spacebar  ->  Command  ->  Alt/Option  ->  Ctrl

While Window = Command, Alt = Alt/Option.  So location wise they're swapped between PC and Mac.

So for example, if you plug a Mac keyboard into a PC computer, the window key will be next to the spacebar, instead of 2 keys away.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: aviphysics on Tue, 19 February 2013, 00:11:01
Thanks for taking the time to write up your wishlist for a home theatre mechanical keyboard.  It sounds very cool...

I'd love to do a product like that, but I fear that the cost of integrating a pointing device into it would probably price it out of most peoples' budgets.  Also, I'm not sure how many people out there would want something like that, given how compact and convenient the current offerings are.  That Lenovo keyboard especially looks nicely done.

Regarding the modifier keys, "Option" generates the keycode for "Alt", and "Command" generates the keycode for "Win".

Thankyou for answering my questions.

It is a shame integrating a pointing device would make it too expensive.

Regarding the current products, I think the only good one is probably the Logitech K400. The rest all have various problems. For example, the Dinovo Mini has some strange connectivity issues (sometimes we have to take out the battery and put it back in), several keys on the Lenovo are starting to fail (I have had it for less than a year), and we have had a few others that just had poor wireless range (unreliable connectivity at 10 ft).

If the Lenovo gets much worse, maybe I will try breaking it open and seeing if it would be useful for modding into another board.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: deepthawt on Tue, 19 February 2013, 08:27:04
'Quiet mechanical keyboard'.

Why?


BECAUSE QUIET, SOMETHING THAT IS APPRECIATED BY OTHERS.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Tue, 19 February 2013, 12:37:12
Regarding the current products, I think the only good one is probably the Logitech K400. The rest all have various problems. For example, the Dinovo Mini has some strange connectivity issues (sometimes we have to take out the battery and put it back in), several keys on the Lenovo are starting to fail (I have had it for less than a year), and we have had a few others that just had poor wireless range (unreliable connectivity at 10 ft).

That's interesting.  You don't find the Logitech K400 too big for a home theatre keyboard?

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: aviphysics on Tue, 19 February 2013, 13:08:08
I don't. Using a large TV that can be easily read from the couch, a keyboard only needs to be small enough to easily tuck out of the way and comfortably sit on a lap. Smaller ones can be nice when you are using a small TV and need to stand to get close enough to the screen, but I also haven't found a small one that is reliable and performs well. Don't take my word for it though, you can just look at the customer reviews for the ultra compact multimedia boards and see that there isn't really any single one that people are overwhelmingly happy with. I also think it is pretty telling that there is a problem when the "people who bought this also bought" listings on Amazon are full of very similar products.

Maybe I am just really demanding though. The Favi, which I have had connectivity problems with, has reasonably decent reviews on Amazon. The Dinovo Mini and Lenovo I mentioned also have reasonably good reviews. The other possibility is that quality has gotten better. I bought my Dinovo Mini back in 2009 so who really knows. The final issue is that I have children and roomates, so something the size of a remote needs to be ably to take a lot of abuse. People are less likely to toss around a larger keyboard.

Here is a picture of someone holding the K400 for size
http://i.imgur.com/c42TMuy.jpg

It really isn't very big. Looks about the size of a TKL.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Pyrolistical on Wed, 20 February 2013, 18:07:38
Mine came.

It feel like something between mx cherry blue and brown, but much quieter.

The first issue I found with it is the lower right rubber foot isn't touching the table, so the keyboard is sliding around a bit.

One nice touch was a short and long came was included.  This way if you had an iMac you can use the short one, otherwise the longer one if your mac mini is further.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Wed, 20 February 2013, 18:10:45
I am jealous. Still waiting for my keyboard to come. Which model did you get?
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: uzoc on Wed, 20 February 2013, 18:19:23
Mine came.

It feel like something between mx cherry blue and brown, but much quieter.

The first issue I found with it is the lower right rubber foot isn't touching the table, so the keyboard is sliding around a bit.

One nice touch was a short and long came was included.  This way if you had an iMac you can use the short one, otherwise the longer one if your mac mini is further.

I'm waiting for the the Mini Quiet Pro (black), to go down to $100 (probably when Amazon gets it) and then buy a white one, so I can start doing some keycaps swapping (black & white of course).
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Pyrolistical on Wed, 20 February 2013, 18:46:35
I
I am jealous. Still waiting for my keyboard to come. Which model did you get?

I got the mini tactile pro for Mac
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Wed, 20 February 2013, 18:56:50
That's the one i am waiting on. They said they would send me an email when it was being shipped and i did preorder it for the February run. I hope to get it soon. Thanks for the response.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: BucklingSpring on Wed, 20 February 2013, 20:31:38
Matias - Will you be on time for the Feb batch?

I'm really looking forward to that MINI Quiet for PC.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: iri on Wed, 27 February 2013, 08:38:31
when will these be shipped? i ordered mine on january the 9th, and paid for it, and there's still no shipment notice.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: Matias on Thu, 28 February 2013, 04:21:27
Very sorry for the delay.  We were pretty overwhelmed with the number of orders we got for them -- which is good and bad.

We're expecting to get another shipment before the end of March.  Due to the high demand, we'll be flying them in (at great expense) and will ship them out as soon as we get them.

Regarding the credit card charges, that unfortunately is a limitation of our online store provider.  They are not able to do deferred charges.  To compensate for this, we give everyone who pre-orders FREE shipping.

Again, sorry for the delay.  We're doing everything we can to get everyone their orders ASAP.

Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: ValerieV on Thu, 28 February 2013, 05:49:04
At least this is good because it is in demand so you obviously tapped into something the public wanted. I do appreciate your great customer service. Thank you for keeping us updated.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: danj on Thu, 28 February 2013, 22:46:15
The Laptop Pro looks fantastic. Haven't seen this mentioned anywhere: how does one switch between devices (iPad and MacBook, for example)?

I'm thinking of what the KBTalKing Pro apparently does: http://kbtalkingusa.com/kbtalking-pro-basic-info/

Quote
Furthermore, the patent-pending multi-pairing technology allows for instant switching between a PC/Mac (via USB) and any of the paired Bluetooth devices.

That "patent-pending" may answer my question for me. How does the Laptop Pro pair with a device, and does this have to be redone each time one connects to a different device?

In short, will switching between my Mac and iPad with this keyboard be a pain in the neck? :)
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: danj on Tue, 02 April 2013, 15:46:10
...While I apologise for apparently killing this thread with my very first post, I suppose I should answer my own question.

Granted, this is information from a competitor, but assuming this KBtalkKing post (http://kbtalkingusa.com/kbtalking-pro-vs-matias-tactile-one/) is correct (emphasis mine):

Quote
The Tactile One uses permanent USB connection to a computer, and connection to one HID supported BT device. Needs re-pairing if changing to a different BT device.

It seems likely that the Laptop Pro is similar, and would need to be re-paired when switching between devices. I'd be happy to know if this is or is not in fact the case!
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: fatmav on Tue, 02 April 2013, 16:35:54
It seems likely that the Laptop Pro is similar, and would need to be re-paired when switching between devices. I'd be happy to know if this is or is not in fact the case!

I am typing on a Laptop Pro now. My experience is indeed you need to re-associate every time when you switch devices.
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: danj on Thu, 04 April 2013, 18:27:08
Ah, thank you for the confirmation. How do you like the Laptop Pro otherwise? :)
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: fatmav on Thu, 04 April 2013, 21:02:40
Ah, thank you for the confirmation. How do you like the Laptop Pro otherwise? :)

The keyboard layout of the Laptop Pro is the primary reason why I bought it. So far it has not disappointed me in this regard. I very much appreciate the dedicated page up and page down keys. The forward delete key is also good, but I use it much less often due to far away placement.

The key switches themselves are fine. Not as crisp as I'd like them to be, but my officemate very much appreciates the dramatic reduction in noise. Previously I primarily use an mx brown, and occasionally an mx blue.

The key caps are my main worry right now. The printing on some of the modifiers (such as command) is already fading a bit after a month of usage. What good would having the symbols of the alternative keys (such as the european characters you input with Alt+key) if the symbols fade away?

The bluetooth link has been good so far.

The battery life seems excellent. I have never charged it since leaving the keyboard plugged in on the first night after arrival.

Oh, and the USB ports: they really don't seem to do anything other than charging the keyboard itself and also letting you charge other downstream device. (In theory, you can use the keyboard's battery to charge another device. But I don't know why you would want to do that.)
Title: Re: Tenkeyless ALPS models from Matias — USB for PC, Bluetooth for Mac
Post by: CiiDub on Wed, 01 May 2013, 21:31:10
Quote
The February production run of the Bluetooth model is sold out, so we're now taking pre-orders for March on that one.  The Wall Street Journal reviewed it on Saturday, & the resulting sales pushed us over the edge.

I saw that article and thought it might have something to do the keyboard being in short supply.

I ordered mine after seeing a write up on The Loop. I've been waiting a while for a compact (ten keyless) + mechanical + bluetooth keyboard. The CES announcement got me pretty excited.  So I for one, am not surprised that you discovered some pent-up demand. I was actually going to give up & buy a Filco for that ten-keyless mechanical goodness :)

I'm still waiting, still excited & a little frustrated. It's getting to be a very long wait. S**t happens & s**t get's delayed. I've had some correspondence about the delays, but I've had to initiate it. That sucks.

Still I am confidant that I'll love the keyboard. My first mechanical one since my model M via 1992.