Post by: Special K on Thu, 21 January 2016, 23:16:58
Here's a couple of concept renders created by DannyHuynh:
(https://i.imgur.com/bIDbGYf.png)
(http://i.imgur.com/s2jLGKu.png)
UPDATE 03/14/21
I've noticed that there are now multiple sets that feature secondary Katakana sublegends. Example (GMK Fuji): https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=111695.new#new
That said, would anyone be interested in this set given that Katakana sublegend molds already exist? The primary critique against this set when I first proposed it was the cost of the then non-existent Katakana sublegends.
UPDATE 07/01/18
Interest in this IC has been revived based on feedback from other users and recent success of other sets that require custom molds, such as GMK Laser, GMK Burgundy, and GMK Space Cadet. I'm currently seeking out an artist to create full 3D renders.
UPDATE 11/21/16:
Hey guys,
I just wanted to give a quick update and hopefully solicit some feedback from the GH community. Over the past few weeks I've been doing some research into how to market this set better and one thing I thought would really help would be to pay for some 3D renders by some of the talented graphic designers we have here.
Just as I was about to pull the trigger, I noticed a new IC, GMK Terminal, that appears to be very similar to mine. While I think the set looks great and appears to have significantly more organization behind it (i.e. an actual company) than mine, it has left me wondering if I should continue to pursue this. I will note that the differences between mine and theirs are as follows:
1. N7 instead of AE (or maybe a custom green color? It would be whatever shade of green they use for the characters in the movie)
2. CR instead of N9
3. Different mod keys that are colored green
4. Matrix-themed novelty keys
5. Kanji characters (unlikely given the cost)
Are the differences above enough to distinguish this set from Terminal? Is there anything else I could do to stand out? I'm not trying to present this as a competition or anything, but the fact is that people's keycap budgets are limited and therefore only so many sets will reach MOQ. That said, I only see a few possibilities:
1. Drop the idea completely
2. Wait some time after Terminal drops, then try to launch it (there are always people who miss out on drops for various reasons who might be interested later)
3. Keep pushing to market this set and see if it launches whenever
Thoughts?
Post by: intelli78 on Thu, 21 January 2016, 23:29:38
Post by: Special K on Fri, 22 January 2016, 00:58:50
Sounds similar to Midnight (http://keypuller.com/midnight/)
That's definitely close to what I had in mind, although that set is a paler green than what I'm thinking of.
Also how does the quality of Signature Plastics compare to GMK? I thought GMK made the highest quality caps of anyone.
Also direct link to the set intelli78 mentioned:
http://pimpmykeyboard.com/dcs-midnight-keycap-set-price-reduced/
Post by: lashiel on Fri, 22 January 2016, 01:02:33
Sounds similar to Midnight (http://keypuller.com/midnight/)
That's definitely close to what I had in mind, although that set is a paler green than what I'm thinking of.
Also how does the quality of Signature Plastics compare to GMK? I thought GMK made the highest quality caps of anyone.
Also direct link to the set intelli78 mentioned:
http://pimpmykeyboard.com/dcs-midnight-keycap-set-price-reduced/
If you're shooting for Cherry profile, then GMK is better/best in most cases. SP has other profiles and options such as novelties and more colors. SP does offer the Cherry-like DCS profile, but they're rather thin (whether or not this is a big deal will vary from person to person, but certainly it's thinner than GMK).
Post by: Melvang on Fri, 22 January 2016, 01:44:07
Sounds similar to Midnight (http://keypuller.com/midnight/)
That's definitely close to what I had in mind, although that set is a paler green than what I'm thinking of.
Also how does the quality of Signature Plastics compare to GMK? I thought GMK made the highest quality caps of anyone.
Also direct link to the set intelli78 mentioned:
http://pimpmykeyboard.com/dcs-midnight-keycap-set-price-reduced/
Well, GMK owns Cherry's molds. Cherry sold off their key cap division years ago and GMK bought the tooling. I can't speak for the quality differences between GMK and SP, as I have never owned GMK, but SP's DCS profile is rather thin. Personally I find this doesn't dampen the bump on tactile switches as much as heavier caps, but to each their own.
Post by: darkclone24 on Fri, 22 January 2016, 05:12:04
So CR keys, but AE or N7 legends?
Post by: Brammm87 on Fri, 22 January 2016, 05:35:51
Post by: Special K on Fri, 22 January 2016, 08:26:29
Sounds similar to Midnight (http://keypuller.com/midnight/)
That's definitely close to what I had in mind, although that set is a paler green than what I'm thinking of.
Also how does the quality of Signature Plastics compare to GMK? I thought GMK made the highest quality caps of anyone.
Also direct link to the set intelli78 mentioned:
http://pimpmykeyboard.com/dcs-midnight-keycap-set-price-reduced/
If you're shooting for Cherry profile, then GMK is better/best in most cases. SP has other profiles and options such as novelties and more colors. SP does offer the Cherry-like DCS profile, but they're rather thin (whether or not this is a big deal will vary from person to person, but certainly it's thinner than GMK).
My preference is for OEM profile, but GMK doesn't offer that, correct? In that case I'd rather have thick, high quality caps over novelties and would therefore prefer GMK.
Post by: Special K on Fri, 22 January 2016, 08:28:05
Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/94CxFfr.jpg)
So CR keys, but AE or N7 legends?
Dumb question: What exactly is this picture showing? Fonts? The keycaps all look the same size and shape to me.
Post by: FLFisherman on Fri, 22 January 2016, 08:35:23
Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/94CxFfr.jpg)
So CR keys, but AE or N7 legends?
Dumb question: What exactly is this picture showing? Fonts? The keycaps all look the same size and shape to me.
It's showing the key color palette.
Post by: Special K on Fri, 22 January 2016, 08:57:12
Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/94CxFfr.jpg)
So CR keys, but AE or N7 legends?
Dumb question: What exactly is this picture showing? Fonts? The keycaps all look the same size and shape to me.
It's showing the key color palette.
Are those the only choices? AE would work for The Matrix, I was just wondering if those were all the choices GMK offered.
Post by: lashiel on Fri, 22 January 2016, 10:25:24
Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/94CxFfr.jpg)
So CR keys, but AE or N7 legends?
Dumb question: What exactly is this picture showing? Fonts? The keycaps all look the same size and shape to me.
It's showing the key color palette.
Are those the only choices? AE would work for The Matrix, I was just wondering if those were all the choices GMK offered.
Yes. Those are the only choices, unless you want to go into custom colors, which sharply increase the MOQ (something like 150 becomes 500). GMK has also had trouble with custom colors in the past.
That's one of the other advantages of Signature Plastics besides custom tooling.
(For the record I'd prefer GMK here like almost anyone else, I'm just trying to present an even picture when questions are asked, lol)
Post by: Special K on Fri, 22 January 2016, 10:53:41
Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/94CxFfr.jpg)
So CR keys, but AE or N7 legends?
Dumb question: What exactly is this picture showing? Fonts? The keycaps all look the same size and shape to me.
It's showing the key color palette.
Are those the only choices? AE would work for The Matrix, I was just wondering if those were all the choices GMK offered.
Yes. Those are the only choices, unless you want to go into custom colors, which sharply increase the MOQ (something like 150 becomes 500). GMK has also had trouble with custom colors in the past.
That's one of the other advantages of Signature Plastics besides custom tooling.
(For the record I'd prefer GMK here like almost anyone else, I'm just trying to present an even picture when questions are asked, lol)
Who makes the thickest/highest quality OEM profile caps?
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 22 January 2016, 10:55:40
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=70595.msg2000293#msg2000293
Post by: MaNiFeX on Fri, 22 January 2016, 11:24:42
I own a set of Midnight, and despite it being the colors I was looking for, I prefer hard green on black, like all my terminal windows / shells / SSH windows are at work. :thumb:
Post by: Special K on Fri, 22 January 2016, 11:30:27
Also I notice that most group buys include a number of modifier keys and add-on packs. How do those affect the final price/MOQ? Do you get a certain number of them for free?
Post by: lashiel on Fri, 22 January 2016, 11:41:16
Do I need to get 150 commitments before an [IC] can become a [GB]?
Not necessarily. It's kinda gonna be up to you to decide when you feel a set has garnered enough interest. You will want to have finalized designs and/or renders, and to really have everything nailed down. Don't rush, basically.
Also I notice that most group buys include a number of modifier keys and add-on packs. How do those affect the final price/MOQ? Do you get a certain number of them for free?
GMK buys are generally run as one large set, without separate "kits" or addons. This is something you should talk with GMK about, as well as some other people who have run GBs.
In fact, I think your next big priority should be to reach out and get some advice/guidance/assistance from community members who have done this before (I sure haven't, ha). I know intelli78 has run at least one successful GMK GB, and Karura has one in progress (that was/is a very large/ambitious one). I would honestly recommend finding a more experienced member to help you run the buy--you come off as very inexperienced, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but people will sometimes be unwilling to buy in if they're unsure about the runner.
Other community members who have been around the block are:
- livingspeedbump
- BunnyLake (though the dude is super busy right now, I always hear about how helpful he tries to be)
Definitely a bunch of others too, but those are the names that jump to mind immediately.
Hope this helps! I definitely think you should keep pursuing this.
Post by: Special K on Fri, 22 January 2016, 11:52:24
Do I need to get 150 commitments before an [IC] can become a [GB]?
Not necessarily. It's kinda gonna be up to you to decide when you feel a set has garnered enough interest. You will want to have finalized designs and/or renders, and to really have everything nailed down. Don't rush, basically.
How do I create those mock-ups/renders I see of new keycap sets?
Quote from: lashiel
Also I notice that most group buys include a number of modifier keys and add-on packs. How do those affect the final price/MOQ? Do you get a certain number of them for free?
GMK buys are generally run as one large set, without separate "kits" or addons. This is something you should talk with GMK about, as well as some other people who have run GBs.
In fact, I think your next big priority should be to reach out and get some advice/guidance/assistance from community members who have done this before (I sure haven't, ha). I know intelli78 has run at least one successful GMK GB, and Karura has one in progress (that was/is a very large/ambitious one). I would honestly recommend finding a more experienced member to help you run the buy--you come off as very inexperienced, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but people will sometimes be unwilling to buy in if they're unsure about the runner.
Other community members who have been around the block are:
- livingspeedbump
- BunnyLake (though the dude is super busy right now, I always hear about how helpful he tries to be)
Definitely a bunch of others too, but those are the names that jump to mind immediately.
Hope this helps! I definitely think you should keep pursuing this.
Yes, I fully admit I have never run a GB before and would need to enlist the help of more experienced members to make progress. I just had the idea for a set that doesn't seem to been done before (at least not exactly in the way I'm imagining it) and wanted to get the ball rolling.
Also who makes the thickest/highest quality OEM profile keycaps?
Post by: lashiel on Fri, 22 January 2016, 12:13:30
Definetely keep pursuing this--it's not even remotely my intent to discourage--I think this is a neat idea, and you already seem to be garnering some interest.
As for OEM, I'm not positive if any of the custom manufacturers do commission/custom OEM profile caps.
SP and GMK (and JTK, kinda--they're just not taking community designs yet), do Cherry profile.
SP does SA and DSA profile.
Post by: againer on Fri, 22 January 2016, 17:18:22
I would prefer build quality over novelties -> GMK
And I hope there will be an decent ISO set too.
Post by: FLFisherman on Fri, 22 January 2016, 17:20:34
Post by: DannyHuynh on Mon, 25 January 2016, 11:25:56
(http://i.imgur.com/pnf7h6O.jpg)
Post by: lishi on Mon, 25 January 2016, 11:33:19
Like this ? :(Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/pnf7h6O.jpg)
If you're gonna go this route, OP, you'll definitely want to go with signature plastics for the custom moulds
Post by: DannyHuynh on Mon, 25 January 2016, 11:35:53
If you're gonna go this route, OP, you'll definitely want to go with signature plastics for the custom moulds
I'm not OP though, just have an idea of a Matrix theme keyset also :-[
Post by: mashby on Mon, 25 January 2016, 16:00:58
Like this ? :(Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/pnf7h6O.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/zAucx3J.gif)
Post by: xondat on Mon, 25 January 2016, 16:09:42
Like this ? :(Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/pnf7h6O.jpg)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/zAucx3J.gif)
Can confirm, did sploosh
Post by: Special K on Mon, 25 January 2016, 21:52:49
Like this ? :(Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/pnf7h6O.jpg)
That's nice. Personally I would have all keys be black with green text, and then have an "add-on pack" of optional green modifier keys/blue pill/red pill/etc. Is that possible?
Post by: Special K on Mon, 25 January 2016, 21:53:35
Like this ? :(Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/pnf7h6O.jpg)
If you're gonna go this route, OP, you'll definitely want to go with signature plastics for the custom moulds
As opposed to GMK? If so, why? Can GMK not produce the keyset DannyHuynh created?
Also how did you make that?
Post by: FLFisherman on Mon, 25 January 2016, 21:53:47
Like this ? :(Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/pnf7h6O.jpg)
That's nice. Personally I would have all keys be black with green text, and then have an "add-on pack" of optional green modifier keys/blue pill/red pill/etc. Is that possible?
Anything is possible. It's your set, after all. :thumb:
Post by: livingspeedbump on Mon, 25 January 2016, 22:16:35
From the looks of it, a 75% kit would be needed ^-^
(http://static1.gamespot.com/uploads/original/120/1204282/2679919-7191113790-matri.jpg)
Post by: livingspeedbump on Mon, 25 January 2016, 22:17:51
Like this ? :(Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/pnf7h6O.jpg)
Looks pretty cool. Though I saw the novelties and the first thing i read was "There is no sperm" ? :))
Post by: cryptokey on Mon, 25 January 2016, 22:53:37
Post by: lashiel on Tue, 26 January 2016, 00:05:52
I can say this. As it stands, having custom green legends on a black cap will be quite expensive. You can't dye sub a lighter legend on a darker keycap, so the only way to do this would be to make them doubleshots, which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From the looks of it, a 75% kit would be needed ^-^Show Image(http://static1.gamespot.com/uploads/original/120/1204282/2679919-7191113790-matri.jpg)
This was my second thought :(
My first thought was that I didn't realize I needed green on black JIS keys in my life until I saw that picture.
Post by: Special K on Tue, 26 January 2016, 01:15:35
I can say this. As it stands, having custom green legends on a black cap will be quite expensive. You can't dye sub a lighter legend on a darker keycap, so the only way to do this would be to make them doubleshots, which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From the looks of it, a 75% kit would be needed ^-^Show Image(http://static1.gamespot.com/uploads/original/120/1204282/2679919-7191113790-matri.jpg)
Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
Post by: n__dles on Tue, 26 January 2016, 02:21:21
Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
.. having custom green legends on a black cap will be quite expensive. You can't dye sub a lighter legend on a darker keycap, so the only way to do this would be to make them doubleshots, which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
Just a heads up everyone. If you do want to make a group buy with doubleshot ABS and have plans for customized legends, say Chinese characters, you will need to pay for a new mold... when the Cherry Legends at SP were made, it cost $45 per keycap (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=28324.0). So just in legend changes, the buy needed an extra $45*104 = $4680.
The reason I keep asking in threads if people are going to use dye-sub or doubleshots is that dyesubbing caps does not have the same legend fee. That is due to how the processes work.
If you are new to the scene and you want to make a keycap set, please keep this in mind.
- They're talking about SP, not GMK.
- It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
Post by: DannyHuynh on Tue, 26 January 2016, 15:30:28
(http://i.imgur.com/8eKfJ8y.png)
Hope it didn't turn our weird :-\
Post by: switchnollie on Tue, 26 January 2016, 23:52:16
SP's DCS profile is rather thin.
Not sure if they make custom sets with these but SP makes a thicker version of DCS that's about as thick as GMK.
I found them in my crap bag, same sculpt as DCS when set side by side.
[attachimg=1]
Post by: cryptokey on Wed, 27 January 2016, 00:01:57
SP's DCS profile is rather thin.
Not sure if they make custom sets with these but SP makes a thicker version of DCS that's about as thick as GMK.
I found them in my crap bag, same sculpt as DCS when set side by side.
(Attachment Link)
It's worth a shot to contact SP about making a custom set in that profile. It looks quite nice actually.
Post by: Melvang on Wed, 27 January 2016, 00:03:50
Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?.. having custom green legends on a black cap will be quite expensive. You can't dye sub a lighter legend on a darker keycap, so the only way to do this would be to make them doubleshots, which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.Just a heads up everyone. If you do want to make a group buy with doubleshot ABS and have plans for customized legends, say Chinese characters, you will need to pay for a new mold... when the Cherry Legends at SP were made, it cost $45 per keycap (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=28324.0). So just in legend changes, the buy needed an extra $45*104 = $4680.
The reason I keep asking in threads if people are going to use dye-sub or doubleshots is that dyesubbing caps does not have the same legend fee. That is due to how the processes work.
If you are new to the scene and you want to make a keycap set, please keep this in mind.
- They're talking about SP, not GMK.
- It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Post by: n__dles on Wed, 27 January 2016, 03:21:12
You tell Special K,
which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From his response, it would seem that he thinks every individual physical keycap produced would cost $45, and that every person who purchased a set would pay around $4k.
Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
I tried to clarify what you said for Special K,
It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
I guess you think I meant it would be a unique fee of $45 for the entire set,
It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Since informal speech has led to these ambiguities, here's my understanding expressed in predicate logic: ∀ n ∃! f where n is a new double shot legend, and f is a $45 fee. :p
Phew! I think (hope?) everyone is on the same page, let me know if I'm wrong.
Post by: 1deeg on Wed, 27 January 2016, 07:14:59
Post by: Special K on Wed, 27 January 2016, 11:32:33
http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/
and will be using it to create some samples.
Post by: livingspeedbump on Wed, 27 January 2016, 11:52:13
Man, there's some communication break down in this thread.
You tell Special K,which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From his response, it would seem that he thinks every individual physical keycap produced would cost $45, and that every person who purchased a set would pay around $4k.Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
I tried to clarify what you said for Special K,It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
I guess you think I meant it would be a unique fee of $45 for the entire set,It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Since informal speech has led to these ambiguities, here's my understanding expressed in predicate logic: ∀ n ∃! f where n is a new double shot legend, and f is a $45 fee. :p
Phew! I think (hope?) everyone is on the same page, let me know if I'm wrong.
Yes. You are correct. That $45 fee is the price for them to make a mold, and that cost is then added into the kit of the buy and distributed out among everyone that buys it. So, a single novelty for example, wont really create a noticeable pricing rise, but having 15 will. This is an issue that plagued Modern Selectric due to having the Icon Modifiers. Most kits have 10 or less custom keys.
So lets say you want a full custom font (something that is currently being funded elsewhere in the community). If you wanted a full custom font, you'd have to pay for the 104 molds needed for the set. Lets call that cost 5k just to be easy. Now, if you were to buy only 1 set, you'd have to pay full pricing for the set, say $150, PLUS 5k. So the set is $5,150 total with one unit sold. Now, say 100 people buy the set. That price is now split between all the people, and all the sets, making the price around $200 (150 base cost+50 legend fee that is already added into the actual cost) of the set. Does this makes sense?
So you wont be paying out of pocket for the molds. You will just have to reach MOQ or those molds/subsequent kits simply wont be made. A significant number of custom keys will result in a significant price increase for everyone though, and generally I advise against this when possible. In the case of the Matrix font, I don't think it is worth it. Unlike a font with molds that can be used for other sets later, this would be a very specific niche set, and likely kill this group buy with the extreme costs.
Post by: Special K on Thu, 28 January 2016, 12:15:56
Hmm, for some reason the CR color looks like dark green. The keycaps are supposed to be black.
Another thing I noticed is the legends on some of the keys don't match what I have seen on other GMK sets. For example, "Enter" is just an arrow in every other GMK keycap set I have seen. Also there doesn't appear to be any way to make things like a stepped Caps Lock.
Post by: livingspeedbump on Thu, 28 January 2016, 13:34:00
OK, here are a couple mock-ups:
Hmm, for some reason the CR color looks like dark green. The keycaps are supposed to be black.
Another thing I noticed is the legends on some of the keys don't match what I have seen on other GMK sets. For example, "Enter" is just an arrow in every other GMK keycap set I have seen. Also there doesn't appear to be any way to make things like a stepped Caps Lock.
Under "misc" at the bottom of the page you can select "steeped" fyi ;)
Post by: DannyHuynh on Sat, 30 January 2016, 18:07:46
(http://i.imgur.com/s2jLGKu.png)
If there's no interest, I'll probably think of some other ideas for a keyset :(
Post by: xondat on Sat, 30 January 2016, 18:09:33
Here's a potato render :blank:Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/s2jLGKu.png)
If there's no interest, I'll probably think of some other ideas for a keyset :(
Looks good, seeing it like this justifies it a bit more.
Post by: Special K on Sat, 30 January 2016, 18:40:06
Here's a potato render :blank:Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/s2jLGKu.png)
If there's no interest, I'll probably think of some other ideas for a keyset :(
Nice! Although it looks like adding the Matrix characters as secondary legends would drive the cost up quite a bit.
Post by: qazeqaz on Sat, 30 January 2016, 23:55:40
Post by: DannyHuynh on Sun, 31 January 2016, 02:30:50
I think the Matrix code would be way cooler. Ditch the real text or make it small like the recent Massdrop Elven characters.
But the whole point of the matrix digital code rain is about including both of the alphanumeric letters and japanese katakana, without either, it doesn't seem really justified, for me at least. :-X
how about another potato...
...in full hd :'(
(http://i.imgur.com/bIDbGYf.png)
Post by: Special K on Sun, 31 January 2016, 17:45:23
I think the Matrix code would be way cooler. Ditch the real text or make it small like the recent Massdrop Elven characters.
But the whole point of the matrix digital code rain is about including both of the alphanumeric letters and japanese katakana, without either, it doesn't seem really justified, for me at least. :-X
how about another potato...
...in full hd :'(Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/bIDbGYf.png)
If we include the matrix code characters I think they should be secondary legends as shown in DannyHuynh's renders. They add flavor to the design but at the end of the day I would still be using the keyboard to type standard characters.
Post by: Special K on Thu, 04 February 2016, 11:44:24
Post by: mashby on Fri, 05 February 2016, 11:16:06
We have some sample ideas and renders in this thread. What is the next step?
LOL. Fundraising for all the new legends?
Post by: DannyHuynh on Fri, 05 February 2016, 19:06:35
We have some sample ideas and renders in this thread. What is the next step?
LOL. Fundraising for all the new legends?
Apparently, there is not enough fans of Keanu Reeves, so it might be hard for this to become solid, especially with all these legends :-X
Post by: Special K on Sat, 06 February 2016, 12:43:03
We have some sample ideas and renders in this thread. What is the next step?
LOL. Fundraising for all the new legends?
Apparently, there is not enough fans of Keanu Reeves, so it might be hard for this to become solid, especially with all these legends :-X
Is there no interest in getting a set made with the just the colorway and no special legends?
Post by: mastermachetier on Sun, 07 February 2016, 18:38:51
Here's a potato render :blank:Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/s2jLGKu.png)
If there's no interest, I'll probably think of some other ideas for a keyset :(
How do you create a render like that if you can lead me in the right direction.
Post by: ideus on Mon, 08 February 2016, 09:10:43
SP's DCS profile is rather thin.
Not sure if they make custom sets with these but SP makes a thicker version of DCS that's about as thick as GMK.
I found them in my crap bag, same sculpt as DCS when set side by side.
(Attachment Link)
If available, the thicker key caps would be far more expensive than the regular DCS, SP sites explained they built molds with thinner walls to reduce costs, but a set of DCS is as expensive as a GMK, even in its thinner version; thus, anything thicker will cost an arm and a leg.
Post by: Special K on Sun, 14 February 2016, 20:02:53
Man, there's some communication break down in this thread.
You tell Special K,which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From his response, it would seem that he thinks every individual physical keycap produced would cost $45, and that every person who purchased a set would pay around $4k.Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
I tried to clarify what you said for Special K,It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
I guess you think I meant it would be a unique fee of $45 for the entire set,It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Since informal speech has led to these ambiguities, here's my understanding expressed in predicate logic: ∀ n ∃! f where n is a new double shot legend, and f is a $45 fee. :p
Phew! I think (hope?) everyone is on the same page, let me know if I'm wrong.
Yes. You are correct. That $45 fee is the price for them to make a mold, and that cost is then added into the kit of the buy and distributed out among everyone that buys it. So, a single novelty for example, wont really create a noticeable pricing rise, but having 15 will. This is an issue that plagued Modern Selectric due to having the Icon Modifiers. Most kits have 10 or less custom keys.
So lets say you want a full custom font (something that is currently being funded elsewhere in the community). If you wanted a full custom font, you'd have to pay for the 104 molds needed for the set. Lets call that cost 5k just to be easy. Now, if you were to buy only 1 set, you'd have to pay full pricing for the set, say $150, PLUS 5k. So the set is $5,150 total with one unit sold. Now, say 100 people buy the set. That price is now split between all the people, and all the sets, making the price around $200 (150 base cost+50 legend fee that is already added into the actual cost) of the set. Does this makes sense?
So you wont be paying out of pocket for the molds. You will just have to reach MOQ or those molds/subsequent kits simply wont be made. A significant number of custom keys will result in a significant price increase for everyone though, and generally I advise against this when possible. In the case of the Matrix font, I don't think it is worth it. Unlike a font with molds that can be used for other sets later, this would be a very specific niche set, and likely kill this group buy with the extreme costs.
Just to clarify, is the $45 per custom legend fee the same for both GMK and SP?
Post by: Melvang on Sun, 14 February 2016, 20:03:13
No idea.Man, there's some communication break down in this thread.
You tell Special K,which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From his response, it would seem that he thinks every individual physical keycap produced would cost $45, and that every person who purchased a set would pay around $4k.Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
I tried to clarify what you said for Special K,It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
I guess you think I meant it would be a unique fee of $45 for the entire set,It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Since informal speech has led to these ambiguities, here's my understanding expressed in predicate logic: ∀ n ∃! f where n is a new double shot legend, and f is a $45 fee.
Phew! I think (hope?) everyone is on the same page, let me know if I'm wrong.
Yes. You are correct. That $45 fee is the price for them to make a mold, and that cost is then added into the kit of the buy and distributed out among everyone that buys it. So, a single novelty for example, wont really create a noticeable pricing rise, but having 15 will. This is an issue that plagued Modern Selectric due to having the Icon Modifiers. Most kits have 10 or less custom keys.
So lets say you want a full custom font (something that is currently being funded elsewhere in the community). If you wanted a full custom font, you'd have to pay for the 104 molds needed for the set. Lets call that cost 5k just to be easy. Now, if you were to buy only 1 set, you'd have to pay full pricing for the set, say $150, PLUS 5k. So the set is $5,150 total with one unit sold. Now, say 100 people buy the set. That price is now split between all the people, and all the sets, making the price around $200 (150 base cost+50 legend fee that is already added into the actual cost) of the set. Does this makes sense?
So you wont be paying out of pocket for the molds. You will just have to reach MOQ or those molds/subsequent kits simply wont be made. A significant number of custom keys will result in a significant price increase for everyone though, and generally I advise against this when possible. In the case of the Matrix font, I don't think it is worth it. Unlike a font with molds that can be used for other sets later, this would be a very specific niche set, and likely kill this group buy with the extreme costs.
Just to clarify, is the $45 per custom legend fee the same for both GMK and SP?
Post by: swimmingbird on Mon, 15 February 2016, 02:47:26
We have some sample ideas and renders in this thread. What is the next step?
LOL. Fundraising for all the new legends?
Apparently, there is not enough fans of Keanu Reeves, so it might be hard for this to become solid, especially with all these legends :-X
[attachimg=1]
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 15 February 2016, 06:20:02
That only applies to signature plastics.Man, there's some communication break down in this thread.
You tell Special K,which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From his response, it would seem that he thinks every individual physical keycap produced would cost $45, and that every person who purchased a set would pay around $4k.Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
I tried to clarify what you said for Special K,It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
I guess you think I meant it would be a unique fee of $45 for the entire set,It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Since informal speech has led to these ambiguities, here's my understanding expressed in predicate logic: ∀ n ∃! f where n is a new double shot legend, and f is a $45 fee. :p
Phew! I think (hope?) everyone is on the same page, let me know if I'm wrong.
Yes. You are correct. That $45 fee is the price for them to make a mold, and that cost is then added into the kit of the buy and distributed out among everyone that buys it. So, a single novelty for example, wont really create a noticeable pricing rise, but having 15 will. This is an issue that plagued Modern Selectric due to having the Icon Modifiers. Most kits have 10 or less custom keys.
So lets say you want a full custom font (something that is currently being funded elsewhere in the community). If you wanted a full custom font, you'd have to pay for the 104 molds needed for the set. Lets call that cost 5k just to be easy. Now, if you were to buy only 1 set, you'd have to pay full pricing for the set, say $150, PLUS 5k. So the set is $5,150 total with one unit sold. Now, say 100 people buy the set. That price is now split between all the people, and all the sets, making the price around $200 (150 base cost+50 legend fee that is already added into the actual cost) of the set. Does this makes sense?
So you wont be paying out of pocket for the molds. You will just have to reach MOQ or those molds/subsequent kits simply wont be made. A significant number of custom keys will result in a significant price increase for everyone though, and generally I advise against this when possible. In the case of the Matrix font, I don't think it is worth it. Unlike a font with molds that can be used for other sets later, this would be a very specific niche set, and likely kill this group buy with the extreme costs.
Just to clarify, is the $45 per custom legend fee the same for both GMK and SP?
Post by: Special K on Mon, 15 February 2016, 09:48:45
That only applies to signature plastics.Man, there's some communication break down in this thread.
You tell Special K,which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From his response, it would seem that he thinks every individual physical keycap produced would cost $45, and that every person who purchased a set would pay around $4k.Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
I tried to clarify what you said for Special K,It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
I guess you think I meant it would be a unique fee of $45 for the entire set,It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Since informal speech has led to these ambiguities, here's my understanding expressed in predicate logic: ∀ n ∃! f where n is a new double shot legend, and f is a $45 fee. :p
Phew! I think (hope?) everyone is on the same page, let me know if I'm wrong.
Yes. You are correct. That $45 fee is the price for them to make a mold, and that cost is then added into the kit of the buy and distributed out among everyone that buys it. So, a single novelty for example, wont really create a noticeable pricing rise, but having 15 will. This is an issue that plagued Modern Selectric due to having the Icon Modifiers. Most kits have 10 or less custom keys.
So lets say you want a full custom font (something that is currently being funded elsewhere in the community). If you wanted a full custom font, you'd have to pay for the 104 molds needed for the set. Lets call that cost 5k just to be easy. Now, if you were to buy only 1 set, you'd have to pay full pricing for the set, say $150, PLUS 5k. So the set is $5,150 total with one unit sold. Now, say 100 people buy the set. That price is now split between all the people, and all the sets, making the price around $200 (150 base cost+50 legend fee that is already added into the actual cost) of the set. Does this makes sense?
So you wont be paying out of pocket for the molds. You will just have to reach MOQ or those molds/subsequent kits simply wont be made. A significant number of custom keys will result in a significant price increase for everyone though, and generally I advise against this when possible. In the case of the Matrix font, I don't think it is worth it. Unlike a font with molds that can be used for other sets later, this would be a very specific niche set, and likely kill this group buy with the extreme costs.
Just to clarify, is the $45 per custom legend fee the same for both GMK and SP?
GMK doesn't allow custom legends in the first place?
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 15 February 2016, 10:08:32
They have only recently done any and they were for cherry china division for what seem to be very large orders. And we're for single novelty keys like an escape key.That only applies to signature plastics.Man, there's some communication break down in this thread.
You tell Special K,which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From his response, it would seem that he thinks every individual physical keycap produced would cost $45, and that every person who purchased a set would pay around $4k.Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
I tried to clarify what you said for Special K,It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
I guess you think I meant it would be a unique fee of $45 for the entire set,It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Since informal speech has led to these ambiguities, here's my understanding expressed in predicate logic: ∀ n ∃! f where n is a new double shot legend, and f is a $45 fee. :p
Phew! I think (hope?) everyone is on the same page, let me know if I'm wrong.
Yes. You are correct. That $45 fee is the price for them to make a mold, and that cost is then added into the kit of the buy and distributed out among everyone that buys it. So, a single novelty for example, wont really create a noticeable pricing rise, but having 15 will. This is an issue that plagued Modern Selectric due to having the Icon Modifiers. Most kits have 10 or less custom keys.
So lets say you want a full custom font (something that is currently being funded elsewhere in the community). If you wanted a full custom font, you'd have to pay for the 104 molds needed for the set. Lets call that cost 5k just to be easy. Now, if you were to buy only 1 set, you'd have to pay full pricing for the set, say $150, PLUS 5k. So the set is $5,150 total with one unit sold. Now, say 100 people buy the set. That price is now split between all the people, and all the sets, making the price around $200 (150 base cost+50 legend fee that is already added into the actual cost) of the set. Does this makes sense?
So you wont be paying out of pocket for the molds. You will just have to reach MOQ or those molds/subsequent kits simply wont be made. A significant number of custom keys will result in a significant price increase for everyone though, and generally I advise against this when possible. In the case of the Matrix font, I don't think it is worth it. Unlike a font with molds that can be used for other sets later, this would be a very specific niche set, and likely kill this group buy with the extreme costs.
Just to clarify, is the $45 per custom legend fee the same for both GMK and SP?
GMK doesn't allow custom legends in the first place?
You seem to want an entire set which up until now GMK has not done and has shown no interest in doing.
Post by: DannyHuynh on Mon, 15 February 2016, 10:35:04
We have some sample ideas and renders in this thread. What is the next step?
LOL. Fundraising for all the new legends?
Apparently, there is not enough fans of Keanu Reeves, so it might be hard for this to become solid, especially with all these legends :-X
(Attachment Link)
(http://uncommongeek.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/the-matrix-bullet-time-gif.gif)
I hope so. However, we might need a render specialist to make this thing looks more appealing. I really can't google "How to create good render of keyboard" you know
Post by: mashby on Mon, 15 February 2016, 12:02:52
Just a thought.
Post by: Special K on Mon, 15 February 2016, 12:24:46
They have only recently done any and they were for cherry china division for what seem to be very large orders. And we're for single novelty keys like an escape key.That only applies to signature plastics.Man, there's some communication break down in this thread.
You tell Special K,which will cost ~$45 a cap, and around $4k for a full set.
From his response, it would seem that he thinks every individual physical keycap produced would cost $45, and that every person who purchased a set would pay around $4k.Why would it cost $45/cap? Is CR text on AE caps not the same as AE text on CR caps? Don't GMK group buys sell for ~$120 or so per set?
I tried to clarify what you said for Special K,It's a one time fee of $45, not $45 for every individual cap made
I guess you think I meant it would be a unique fee of $45 for the entire set,It is in face $45 PER LEGEND.
Since informal speech has led to these ambiguities, here's my understanding expressed in predicate logic: ∀ n ∃! f where n is a new double shot legend, and f is a $45 fee. :p
Phew! I think (hope?) everyone is on the same page, let me know if I'm wrong.
Yes. You are correct. That $45 fee is the price for them to make a mold, and that cost is then added into the kit of the buy and distributed out among everyone that buys it. So, a single novelty for example, wont really create a noticeable pricing rise, but having 15 will. This is an issue that plagued Modern Selectric due to having the Icon Modifiers. Most kits have 10 or less custom keys.
So lets say you want a full custom font (something that is currently being funded elsewhere in the community). If you wanted a full custom font, you'd have to pay for the 104 molds needed for the set. Lets call that cost 5k just to be easy. Now, if you were to buy only 1 set, you'd have to pay full pricing for the set, say $150, PLUS 5k. So the set is $5,150 total with one unit sold. Now, say 100 people buy the set. That price is now split between all the people, and all the sets, making the price around $200 (150 base cost+50 legend fee that is already added into the actual cost) of the set. Does this makes sense?
So you wont be paying out of pocket for the molds. You will just have to reach MOQ or those molds/subsequent kits simply wont be made. A significant number of custom keys will result in a significant price increase for everyone though, and generally I advise against this when possible. In the case of the Matrix font, I don't think it is worth it. Unlike a font with molds that can be used for other sets later, this would be a very specific niche set, and likely kill this group buy with the extreme costs.
Just to clarify, is the $45 per custom legend fee the same for both GMK and SP?
GMK doesn't allow custom legends in the first place?
You seem to want an entire set which up until now GMK has not done and has shown no interest in doing.
Personally I'm fine with green text on black keys without any special legends. Others made the suggestion for special legends. While I think it's a nice touch, the price would kill the set.
Post by: Special K on Mon, 15 February 2016, 12:43:13
If you reversed the colors so that the alphas were green keys with black fonts, you could dye sub them and get the custom legends. That would make the modifiers black and maybe those could be doubleshot since they are mocked up as standard legends.
Just a thought.
Thanks for the suggestion. Personally if we do the group buy at all I'd want it to be green text on black keys just because that's what actually appears in the movie. If the majority really wants to have the secondary legends and is willing to invert the color scheme to get them, then maybe we could go that route.
Post by: 00zeRO on Mon, 22 February 2016, 23:46:41
Post by: lashiel on Mon, 22 February 2016, 23:57:57
I actually know very little about the process, so it may be that it's not viable at all (plus I know pad printing is somewhat frowned on, since it's much more susceptible to wear).
That said, I think that just a normal set with the suggested colors could be interesting, even without the secondary legends. I think people are just interested in the idea of the kana because it adds a cool bit of flair.
Post by: 00zeRO on Tue, 23 February 2016, 06:53:25
Thought: how viable would it be to pad print the secondary legends, similar to how some of the Cyrillic sets have been done (I think?).
I actually know very little about the process, so it may be that it's not viable at all (plus I know pad printing is somewhat frowned on, since it's much more susceptible to wear).
That said, I think that just a normal set with the suggested colors could be interesting, even without the secondary legends. I think people are just interested in the idea of the kana because it adds a cool bit of flair.
Viable but expensive. Still, cheaper than a whole bunch of new legends...
Post by: MOZ on Tue, 23 February 2016, 07:33:23
Thought: how viable would it be to pad print the secondary legends, similar to how some of the Cyrillic sets have been done (I think?).
I actually know very little about the process, so it may be that it's not viable at all (plus I know pad printing is somewhat frowned on, since it's much more susceptible to wear).
That said, I think that just a normal set with the suggested colors could be interesting, even without the secondary legends. I think people are just interested in the idea of the kana because it adds a cool bit of flair.
Viable but expensive. Still, cheaper than a whole bunch of new legends...
GMK charge a nominal fee for the pad-printing and it is about to become even more cheaper as they are working on a new pad printing method.
Post by: heedpantsnow on Tue, 23 February 2016, 08:33:38
Post by: swimmingbird on Tue, 23 February 2016, 18:37:08
Thought: how viable would it be to pad print the secondary legends, similar to how some of the Cyrillic sets have been done (I think?).
I actually know very little about the process, so it may be that it's not viable at all (plus I know pad printing is somewhat frowned on, since it's much more susceptible to wear).
That said, I think that just a normal set with the suggested colors could be interesting, even without the secondary legends. I think people are just interested in the idea of the kana because it adds a cool bit of flair.
Viable but expensive. Still, cheaper than a whole bunch of new legends...
GMK charge a nominal fee for the pad-printing and it is about to become even more cheaper as they are working on a new pad printing method.
I was literally just thinking about pad printing for this set - would be interested to see how it would add to the cost
Post by: DannyHuynh on Tue, 23 February 2016, 19:05:59
Post by: swimmingbird on Tue, 23 February 2016, 21:18:46
Will someone create a poll for GMK vs DSA, sub legend vs normal on MD ? :eek:
you don't need a poll to know that GMK ****s all over DSA
Post by: 00zeRO on Tue, 23 February 2016, 21:23:49
Will someone create a poll for GMK vs DSA, sub legend vs normal on MD ? :eek:
you don't need a poll to know that GMK ****s all over DSA
I know, right?
Post by: lashiel on Wed, 24 February 2016, 00:24:06
I was literally just thinking about pad printing for this set - would be interested to see how it would add to the cost
It may be at least worth inquiring into, along with a more normal set. Although I think we'd need to decide on which keys are included before GMK would be willing to give any real price estimate.
Also, **** DSA for this set. Cherry or bust. I think DSA is an interesting profile, but for some reason it seems harder to make a good looking set in it (imo).
Post by: DukeMugen on Wed, 24 February 2016, 01:58:38
Post by: MOZ on Wed, 24 February 2016, 02:09:47
Post by: swimmingbird on Wed, 24 February 2016, 04:00:44
I think a standard set of green on dark grey/black would work well along with pad-printed sublegends.
I'd love to see a green on black/dark grey Windows 95 logo to go with this set
Keep that 90s feel alive
Post by: DannyHuynh on Wed, 24 February 2016, 09:58:23
Post by: Special K on Wed, 24 February 2016, 12:13:31
I think a standard set of green on dark grey/black would work well along with pad-printed sublegends.
I'd love to see a green on black/dark grey Windows 95 logo to go with this set
Keep that 90s feel alive
What options does GMK offer for windows logos? A quick image search shows the most recent win8+ logo.
Post by: MOZ on Wed, 24 February 2016, 14:27:14
Post by: Special K on Wed, 24 February 2016, 21:54:22
We have some sample ideas and renders in this thread. What is the next step?
LOL. Fundraising for all the new legends?
Apparently, there is not enough fans of Keanu Reeves, so it might be hard for this to become solid, especially with all these legends :-X
(Attachment Link)Show Image(http://uncommongeek.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/the-matrix-bullet-time-gif.gif)
I hope so. However, we might need a render specialist to make this thing looks more appealing. I really can't google "How to create good render of keyboard" you know
I thought yours looked fine. How could it be improved?
Post by: FranksNewLiver on Thu, 25 February 2016, 02:07:03
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
Post by: swimmingbird on Thu, 25 February 2016, 03:52:40
Why not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
From what I've heard the production schedule for JTK is pretty full for the foreseeable future
Post by: jaffers on Thu, 25 February 2016, 04:24:40
Why not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
This is the only acceptable colour scheme. Even then its pushing it. Green is such a terrible colour :confused:
Post by: DukeMugen on Thu, 25 February 2016, 04:48:23
Why not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
this one looks nice!
Post by: Special K on Thu, 25 February 2016, 08:54:13
Why not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
I like the pic. How thick are JTK caps?
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 25 February 2016, 09:11:24
The thickness is comparable to GMKWhy not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
I like the pic. How thick are JTK caps?
Post by: Data on Wed, 02 March 2016, 14:52:32
Why not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
This, with maybe 1 novelty cap... subtle, but very clearly "The Matrix" even if it doesn't have the Japanese characters.
It's similar to Toxic. What green did you use here?
Post by: Special K on Sun, 06 March 2016, 02:08:48
Why not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
From what I've heard the production schedule for JTK is pretty full for the foreseeable future
Do you have a link that talks about this? Where can I go to get more information about JT Keycaps: color options, pricing, etc.? I did a search but it only returns links to the first JTK GB here.
Post by: SpAmRaY on Sun, 06 March 2016, 13:52:51
For the time being I believe they are only working with [ctrl]alt so you might try and contact bunnylakeWhy not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
From what I've heard the production schedule for JTK is pretty full for the foreseeable future
Do you have a link that talks about this? Where can I go to get more information about JT Keycaps: color options, pricing, etc.? I did a search but it only returns links to the first JTK GB here.
Post by: Special K on Mon, 07 March 2016, 14:47:01
For the time being I believe they are only working with [ctrl]alt so you might try and contact bunnylakeWhy not see what JTK could do. I just filled in the white with green from the WoB Debut render at https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut (https://ctrlalt.io/buys/jtk-debut)
I have a stormtrooper set and they are nice to type on and doubleshot.
From what I've heard the production schedule for JTK is pretty full for the foreseeable future
Do you have a link that talks about this? Where can I go to get more information about JT Keycaps: color options, pricing, etc.? I did a search but it only returns links to the first JTK GB here.
bunnylake just told me the legend set is not complete yet so they are not taking orders to manufacture other sets.
Post by: DukeMugen on Mon, 07 March 2016, 23:53:26
[attachimg=1]
Post by: DukeMugen on Tue, 08 March 2016, 00:01:55
Post by: ideus on Tue, 08 March 2016, 08:20:03
Post by: DukeMugen on Tue, 08 March 2016, 12:02:53
Post by: Special K on Tue, 08 March 2016, 12:04:55
Gray to be CC and black to be CR, then legends will be all in AE. Oh how i wish :)
That seems just as feasible as all CR caps with AE legends. What about an optional set of modifiers with CR text on AE caps?
Post by: DukeMugen on Tue, 08 March 2016, 12:09:08
Personally, im not a fan of bright mods on dark alphanumerics. Id rather choose all to be black with ae legends. Simple but nice. But that's just me.Gray to be CC and black to be CR, then legends will be all in AE. Oh how i wish :)
That seems just as feasible as all CR caps with AE legends. What about an optional set of modifiers with CR text on AE caps?
Post by: Mothore on Thu, 10 March 2016, 15:07:51
Post by: Special K on Thu, 10 March 2016, 23:34:34
I love this theme. We all need more Matrix in our lives.
Then everyone who is interested keep bumping this thread with ideas so more people see it!
Post by: Geekmie on Fri, 11 March 2016, 09:09:13
Post by: Special K on Tue, 07 June 2016, 10:42:41
Post by: dubious on Tue, 07 June 2016, 11:59:34
may i suggest this?
(Attachment Link)
I think we have a winner...
Just add symbol legend mods and you can have my first unborn child :))
Post by: Mr Mulch on Thu, 09 June 2016, 09:05:13
Post by: 00zeRO on Fri, 10 June 2016, 06:51:51
I love this theme. We all need more Matrix in our lives.
I think this set might have a better chance if done in DSA, but that is just me.
Post by: Data on Fri, 10 June 2016, 08:41:08
I love this theme. We all need more Matrix in our lives.
I think this set might have a better chance if done in DSA, but that is just me.
This matches the screen-used props. The guys at DT already did some detectiving -- it's an Apple Powerbook keyboard. Profile is flat.
(http://i.imgur.com/k5SZpfL.jpg)
I'm not sure if DSA is doing the set any favors from a group buy standpoint, but it's something to consider anyway.
Post by: 00zeRO on Fri, 10 June 2016, 12:26:42
I love this theme. We all need more Matrix in our lives.
I think this set might have a better chance if done in DSA, but that is just me.
This matches the screen-used props. The guys at DT already did some detectiving -- it's an Apple Powerbook keyboard. Profile is flat.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/k5SZpfL.jpg)
I'm not sure if DSA is doing the set any favors from a group buy standpoint, but it's something to consider anyway.
Wonderful. I think DSA would need a new set soon anyways since it has not been shown much DoubleShot ABS love lately. What, with all the SA hype of late...
Post by: Data on Fri, 10 June 2016, 13:25:19
I love this theme. We all need more Matrix in our lives.
I think this set might have a better chance if done in DSA, but that is just me.
This matches the screen-used props. The guys at DT already did some detectiving -- it's an Apple Powerbook keyboard. Profile is flat.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/k5SZpfL.jpg)
I'm not sure if DSA is doing the set any favors from a group buy standpoint, but it's something to consider anyway.
Wonderful. I think DSA would need a new set soon anyways since it has not been shown much DoubleShot ABS love lately. What, with all the SA hype of late...
MiTo is planning another big DSA set that's rumored to run on Massdrop either this month or next, so I think that might fill the niche for the near term. It's called Overcast and has a bunch of bold primary colors. Should be decent -- and it's not at all similar to what we're talking about in here.
Post by: sambarugh on Fri, 10 June 2016, 15:47:20
Post by: Data on Fri, 10 June 2016, 16:23:03
Yeah the design of this set is not worth the time or money. It doesn't look good at all and I would only be interested if the sub's were removed and the keys were made by GMK. Just because it references the Matrix doesn't make it good by default. Probably best to leave this one on the cutting room floor.Your (lack of) interest is noted.
Post by: chuckdee on Fri, 10 June 2016, 20:30:18
Post by: SamFlynn on Fri, 10 June 2016, 23:18:21
Yeah the design of this set is not worth the time or money. It doesn't look good at all and I would only be interested if the sub's were removed and the keys were made by GMK. Just because it references the Matrix doesn't make it good by default. Probably best to leave this one on the cutting room floor.Your (lack of) interest is noted.
Who invited this guy to drop a big fat thread-crapping turd right here?
Hey, sambarugh, just because you have an account it doesn't mean you need to post any and all opinions in interest checks. If you aren't interested, just keep lurking, dude.
Post by: Special K on Mon, 13 June 2016, 11:17:45
Yeah the design of this set is not worth the time or money. It doesn't look good at all and I would only be interested if the sub's were removed and the keys were made by GMK. Just because it references the Matrix doesn't make it good by default. Probably best to leave this one on the cutting room floor.
What do you mean "if the sub's were removed"? Also the original plan was to have this one made by GMK.
Yeah the design of this set is not worth the time or money. It doesn't look good at all and I would only be interested if the sub's were removed and the keys were made by GMK. Just because it references the Matrix doesn't make it good by default. Probably best to leave this one on the cutting room floor.
What do you mean "if the sub's were removed"? Also the original plan was to have these made by GMK.
Post by: sambarugh on Tue, 14 June 2016, 13:14:42
What do you mean "if the sub's were removed"? Also the original plan was to have these made by GMK.
The sub legends, they're ugly
Post by: Data on Tue, 14 June 2016, 14:18:21
sambarugh, you might want to familiarize yourself with the forum rules here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=36672.0) and (subsequently) here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=36773.0).
This subsection might be particularly useful to you:
More
Quote
2) Threadcrapping: If you aren't interested in joining a group buy, STAY OUT OF THE GROUP BUY THREAD. This goes doubly so if you disagree with the way the buy is being run, the product being purchased, or have any other complaint not relevant to buying into the group buy. Repeat offenders put themselves in danger of moderator action.
:thumb:
Post by: sambarugh on Wed, 15 June 2016, 09:18:11
I think he means the kanji.
sambarugh, you might want to familiarize yourself with the forum rules here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=36672.0) and (subsequently) here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=36773.0).
This subsection might be particularly useful to you:MoreQuote2) Threadcrapping: If you aren't interested in joining a group buy, STAY OUT OF THE GROUP BUY THREAD. This goes doubly so if you disagree with the way the buy is being run, the product being purchased, or have any other complaint not relevant to buying into the group buy. Repeat offenders put themselves in danger of moderator action.
:thumb:
This is an IC thread, not a GB thread. Rekt, GG, git gud.
Post by: SamFlynn on Wed, 15 June 2016, 10:48:27
I think he means the kanji.
sambarugh, you might want to familiarize yourself with the forum rules here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=36672.0) and (subsequently) here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=36773.0).
This subsection might be particularly useful to you:MoreQuote2) Threadcrapping: If you aren't interested in joining a group buy, STAY OUT OF THE GROUP BUY THREAD. This goes doubly so if you disagree with the way the buy is being run, the product being purchased, or have any other complaint not relevant to buying into the group buy. Repeat offenders put themselves in danger of moderator action.
:thumb:
This is an IC thread, not a GB thread. Rekt, GG, git gud.
Data -
Trolls don't have etiquette as part of their demeanor/behavior. If they did, they would cease to be trolls.
sambarugh -
Thanks for your participation, we just wish you had a little more tact...but you can't always get what you want. :p
Post by: Data on Wed, 15 June 2016, 11:56:02
Data -
Trolls don't have etiquette as part of their demeanor/behavior. If they did, they would cease to be trolls.
Oh, I know. ;) Everything is playing out precisely as I planned.
Post by: infiniti on Wed, 15 June 2016, 12:12:37
Post by: shower_king on Thu, 16 June 2016, 20:52:29
MOZ 's Royal Type Writer have perfect arrangement in light green and dark green and both GREENs matches ratherwell but barely get through GB. Perhaps one point is that many people would not like the feelings on touching and typing on keycaps's surface with sub.the feel typing on key with sub is more vicious or just like that and less cleanly and gentleness than normal GMK's. it is undoubtly that the double-shot keys with sub have more possibility and more beautiful . As for a set of GMK up to 100+ USdollors or even more, i think many people would prefer practicability to beauty.
AS FOR ME, i don't hate sub on key's surface ,i just prefer key without it to ones with it. i also respect minority's likes. i think minority would like type on sub, but GMK' s MOQ , decreasing from 250 to 150, is rather high in comparison with SP's.
now turn to the topic , my suggestion on this whether we could make the sub on the keycap's side surface not top surface. this could retain your good idea on arranging these different but lovely colors and don't affect the feel for using the good GMK's keys
Post by: Special K on Mon, 21 November 2016, 21:27:41
I just wanted to give a quick update and hopefully solicit some feedback from the GH community. Over the past few weeks I've been doing some research into how to market this set better and one thing I thought would really help would be to pay for some 3D renders by some of the talented graphic designers we have here.
Just as I was about to pull the trigger, I noticed a new IC, GMK Terminal, that appears to be very similar to mine. While I think the set looks great and appears to have significantly more organization behind it (i.e. an actual company) than mine, it has left me wondering if I should continue to pursue this. I will note that the differences between mine and theirs are as follows:
1. N7 instead of AE (or maybe a custom green color? It would be whatever shade of green they use for the characters in the movie)
2. CR instead of N9
3. Different mod keys that are colored green
4. Matrix-themed novelty keys
5. Kanji characters (unlikely given the cost)
Are the differences above enough to distinguish this set from Terminal? Is there anything else I could do to stand out? I'm not trying to present this as a competition or anything, but the fact is that people's keycap budgets are limited and therefore only so many sets will reach MOQ. That said, I only see a few possibilities:
1. Drop the idea completely
2. Wait some time after Terminal drops, then try to launch it (there are always people who miss out on drops for various reasons who might be interested later)
3. Keep pushing to market this set and see if it launches whenever
Thoughts?
Post by: Vigrith on Mon, 21 November 2016, 22:39:35
As someone who already owns Midnight (and will be owning Toxic shortly) I'm not particularly in need of more green/black but the Katakana legends make the set for me - if those are included I'd say it is definitely different enough from both Midnight as well as Terminal_, plus it then has a very defined theme that would make it stand out. Then again if you do go with the Katakana (I don't know whether or not you are willing to adopt the style, as I see the concept/renders were provided by another user) it may become too niche and may lack interest. I'd imagine you could theoretically still get a nice buy going regardless provided things are handled well but still, these alternate legends tend to always have a hard time compared to just straight Latin.
For what it's worth, if the set came out tomorrow with the exact look of the render you have in the OP, I would buy it - even as someone who is just a fan of the Matrix, not a fanatic.
Post by: mbljs5555 on Mon, 27 November 2017, 17:23:13
Post by: xondat on Mon, 27 November 2017, 17:38:58
Interesting how this keyset doesn't really remind me of the GMK Terminal... looks different and maybe it's because of the font but definitely evokes the Matrix feels!
Why are you bumping threads that are obviously not being worked on anymore? :rolleyes:
Post by: amnesia0287 on Mon, 27 November 2017, 17:58:01
Interesting how this keyset doesn't really remind me of the GMK Terminal... looks different and maybe it's because of the font but definitely evokes the Matrix feels!
Why are you bumping threads that are obviously not being worked on anymore? :rolleyes:
To be fair, with laser, this set is far more viable now. All the molds will exist already. You best believe people are gonna start making more Japanese sets.
Post by: Special K on Fri, 29 June 2018, 16:54:58
Post by: dimo on Fri, 29 June 2018, 17:09:37
I would still like to pursue this someday, but now that GMK Terminal is doing a round 2, I'm not sure this is different enough to capture people's attention.
It's not different enough. The red/blue pills don't match the set at all. The colors imo look worse than Terminal too-- maybe it's just the awful renders from early community days.
Terminal completely encapsulated what the theme of this set was, and it turned out great
Post by: Giorgio on Fri, 29 June 2018, 17:46:43
A black and green set, with standard colours, Japanese sublegends and some matrix styled keys can call itself GMK matrix.
Post by: dimo on Fri, 29 June 2018, 17:55:22
Post by: Giorgio on Sat, 30 June 2018, 04:04:46
Why are there even japanese sublegends?? If it's supposed to be following a theme of the "matrix"-- the creative choices seem random.
No.
"The code used in the introduction to all three movies is actually text characters scanned from Japanese cookbooks.[3] Its creator, Simon Whiteley, was never credited.[4]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain
Post by: Special K on Sat, 30 June 2018, 12:19:59
I would still like to pursue this someday, but now that GMK Terminal is doing a round 2, I'm not sure this is different enough to capture people's attention.
It's not different enough. The red/blue pills don't match the set at all. The colors imo look worse than Terminal too-- maybe it's just the awful renders from early community days.
Terminal completely encapsulated what the theme of this set was, and it turned out great
Additionally this set would use CR instead of N9 for the keycaps. I own GMK Terminal and personally think the keycaps look closer to gray than black. I realize that was done for compatibility purposes with other sets, but if I was building GMK Matrix from the ground up I would choose CR for a "true" black.
My next step is to get some higher quality renders. I realize the ones posted in the OP aren't as high quality as the ones used in other sets (no offense to the artist intended).
Post by: dimo on Sat, 30 June 2018, 12:24:53
I would still like to pursue this someday, but now that GMK Terminal is doing a round 2, I'm not sure this is different enough to capture people's attention.
It's not different enough. The red/blue pills don't match the set at all. The colors imo look worse than Terminal too-- maybe it's just the awful renders from early community days.
Terminal completely encapsulated what the theme of this set was, and it turned out great
Additionally this set would use CR instead of N9 for the keycaps. I own GMK Terminal and personally think the keycaps look closer to gray than black. I realize that was done for compatibility purposes with other sets, but if I was building GMK Matrix from the ground up I would choose CR for a "true" black.
My next step is to get some higher quality renders. I realize the ones posted in the OP aren't as high quality as the ones used in other sets.
agree with everything. This should be wiped and started from a clean slate into a fully rendered IC if interest is intended to be gathered.
Post by: chuckdee on Sat, 30 June 2018, 15:05:08
I would still like to pursue this someday, but now that GMK Terminal is doing a round 2, I'm not sure this is different enough to capture people's attention.
It's not different enough. The red/blue pills don't match the set at all. The colors imo look worse than Terminal too-- maybe it's just the awful renders from early community days.
Terminal completely encapsulated what the theme of this set was, and it turned out great
Additionally this set would use CR instead of N9 for the keycaps. I own GMK Terminal and personally think the keycaps look closer to gray than black. I realize that was done for compatibility purposes with other sets, but if I was building GMK Matrix from the ground up I would choose CR for a "true" black.
My next step is to get some higher quality renders. I realize the ones posted in the OP aren't as high quality as the ones used in other sets.
I actually like this better than terminal, and think it's different enough to succeed on its own.
Post by: pvd on Sat, 30 June 2018, 16:21:01
Why are there even japanese sublegends?? If it's supposed to be following a theme of the "matrix"-- the creative choices seem random.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain)
The "digital rain" in the matrix is mostly a mix of katakana and latin alphabet. I hope OP is still considering katakana sublegends, now that gmk sublegends are a thing. I think it would look very cool.
Post by: dimo on Sat, 30 June 2018, 16:21:50
Why are there even japanese sublegends?? If it's supposed to be following a theme of the "matrix"-- the creative choices seem random.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain)
The "digital rain" in the matrix is mostly a mix of katakana and latin alphabet. I hope OP is still considering katakana sublegends, now that gmk sublegends are a thing. I think it would look very cool.
yeah I got it. It’s been a while
Post by: Special K on Sat, 30 June 2018, 19:52:04
Why are there even japanese sublegends?? If it's supposed to be following a theme of the "matrix"-- the creative choices seem random.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain)
The "digital rain" in the matrix is mostly a mix of katakana and latin alphabet. I hope OP is still considering katakana sublegends, now that gmk sublegends are a thing. I think it would look very cool.
Now that GMK Laser exists, the molds exist and should be usable by any future sets, correct? If so, I would use them as others have suggested.
Post by: pvd on Sat, 30 June 2018, 21:24:35
Why are there even japanese sublegends?? If it's supposed to be following a theme of the "matrix"-- the creative choices seem random.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain)
The "digital rain" in the matrix is mostly a mix of katakana and latin alphabet. I hope OP is still considering katakana sublegends, now that gmk sublegends are a thing. I think it would look very cool.
Now that GMK Laser exists, the molds exist and should be usable by any future sets, correct? If so, I would use them as others have suggested.
The GMK laser molds are hiragana characters, while the characters in your render in your render are katakana. I think katakana sublegends would look much cooler on this set and would be more true to the digital rain of the matrix (though I don't know anything at all about Japanese, I'm in it strictly for the aesthetics :) ). If the sublegends are part of the default kit, it would stand a pretty good chance of making MOQ I think, which of course is always the issue.
Post by: Special K on Sat, 30 June 2018, 21:47:36
Why are there even japanese sublegends?? If it's supposed to be following a theme of the "matrix"-- the creative choices seem random.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain)
The "digital rain" in the matrix is mostly a mix of katakana and latin alphabet. I hope OP is still considering katakana sublegends, now that gmk sublegends are a thing. I think it would look very cool.
Now that GMK Laser exists, the molds exist and should be usable by any future sets, correct? If so, I would use them as others have suggested.
The GMK laser molds are hiragana characters, while the characters in your render in your render are katakana. I think katakana sublegends would look much cooler on this set and would be more true to the digital rain of the matrix (though I don't know anything at all about Japanese, I'm in it strictly for the aesthetics :) ). If the sublegends are part of the default kit, it would stand a pretty good chance of making MOQ I think, which of course is always the issue.
How do we map katakana characters as secondary legends to the alphabetical characters? Does anyone following this thread speak/read Japanese? I also need this information to give to the artist who will be creating the renders.
Finally, if the katakana character set is different from the hiragana characters used for GMK Laser, then this IC is kind of back at square one with respect to needing to factor in the cost of custom molds for most of the keys, which is what turned people off the first time (see earlier pages for the debate).
Post by: Ohjay on Sun, 01 July 2018, 03:16:44
How do we map katakana characters as secondary legends to the alphabetical characters? Does anyone following this thread speak/read Japanese? I also need this information to give to the artist who will be creating the renders.
The characters for Hiragana and Katakana represent the same set of syllables, so mapping is easy since it's just to interchange one character for the other.
See this table for a reference where the top character is Hiragana, middle is Katakana, and the third is the syllable representation in roman letters (credit to: cyborgsmurf.wordpress.com (https://cyborgsmurf.wordpress.com/teach-me-2/hiragana-katakana/))
(https://cyborgsmurf.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/kanatable1.png)
(Sidenote: I don't think keysets generally use the g*, z*, d*, b*, p* syllables so they can be disregarded. Same with everything to the right of ya, yu, yo)
And for those that do not know, but are curious as to why there are two character sets for the same syllables...
Hiragana is used for domestic words.
Katakana is used for words loaned from other languages (mainly english).
Post by: Giorgio on Sun, 01 July 2018, 04:18:23
How do we map katakana characters as secondary legends to the alphabetical characters? Does anyone following this thread speak/read Japanese? I also need this information to give to the artist who will be creating the renders.
The characters for Hiragana and Katakana represent the same set of syllables, so mapping is easy since it's just to interchange one character for the other.
See this table for a reference where the top character is Hiragana, middle is Katakana, and the third is the syllable representation in roman letters (credit to: cyborgsmurf.wordpress.com (https://cyborgsmurf.wordpress.com/teach-me-2/hiragana-katakana/))Show Image(https://cyborgsmurf.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/kanatable1.png)
(Sidenote: I don't think keysets generally use the g*, z*, d*, b*, p* syllables so they can be disregarded. Same with everything to the right of ya, yu, yo)
And for those that do not know, but are curious as to why there are two character sets for the same syllables...
Hiragana is used for domestic words.
Katakana is used for words loaned from other languages (mainly english).
That's confusing as ****. Why don't we simply replicate what other GMK sets used the most?
Post by: pvd on Sun, 01 July 2018, 08:54:11
Why are there even japanese sublegends?? If it's supposed to be following a theme of the "matrix"-- the creative choices seem random.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain)
The "digital rain" in the matrix is mostly a mix of katakana and latin alphabet. I hope OP is still considering katakana sublegends, now that gmk sublegends are a thing. I think it would look very cool.
Now that GMK Laser exists, the molds exist and should be usable by any future sets, correct? If so, I would use them as others have suggested.
The GMK laser molds are hiragana characters, while the characters in your render in your render are katakana. I think katakana sublegends would look much cooler on this set and would be more true to the digital rain of the matrix (though I don't know anything at all about Japanese, I'm in it strictly for the aesthetics :) ). If the sublegends are part of the default kit, it would stand a pretty good chance of making MOQ I think, which of course is always the issue.
How do we map katakana characters as secondary legends to the alphabetical characters? Does anyone following this thread speak/read Japanese? I also need this information to give to the artist who will be creating the renders.
Finally, if the katakana character set is different from the hiragana characters used for GMK Laser, then this IC is kind of back at square one with respect to needing to factor in the cost of custom molds for most of the keys, which is what turned people off the first time (see earlier pages for the debate).
The first few pages of this IC are from 2016, right? That was back when GMK custom legends were unthinkable. Since then we've had GMK Laser, which had two sets of completely custom molds for the hiragana sublegends and hiragana monolegends, GMK Burgundy, which has hangul sublegends, and we will soon have GMK space cadet, which has fancy math sublegends. The appetite for custom sublegends absolutely exists now.
How do we map katakana characters as secondary legends to the alphabetical characters? Does anyone following this thread speak/read Japanese? I also need this information to give to the artist who will be creating the renders.
The characters for Hiragana and Katakana represent the same set of syllables, so mapping is easy since it's just to interchange one character for the other.
See this table for a reference where the top character is Hiragana, middle is Katakana, and the third is the syllable representation in roman letters (credit to: cyborgsmurf.wordpress.com (https://cyborgsmurf.wordpress.com/teach-me-2/hiragana-katakana/))Show Image(https://cyborgsmurf.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/kanatable1.png)
(Sidenote: I don't think keysets generally use the g*, z*, d*, b*, p* syllables so they can be disregarded. Same with everything to the right of ya, yu, yo)
And for those that do not know, but are curious as to why there are two character sets for the same syllables...
Hiragana is used for domestic words.
Katakana is used for words loaned from other languages (mainly english).
That's confusing as ****. Why don't we simply replicate what other GMK sets used the most?
Just look at the front page of the thread. :p The render there is katakana sublegends. No need to think further about it.
Post by: Ohjay on Sun, 01 July 2018, 09:43:28
Just look at the front page of the thread. :p The render there is katakana sublegends. No need to think further about it.Haha, serves me right for not reading the entire thread :)
Post by: pvd on Sun, 01 July 2018, 11:32:53
Just look at the front page of the thread. :p The render there is katakana sublegends. No need to think further about it.Haha, serves me right for not reading the entire thread :)
Nothing wrong with dropping some knowledge. :))
Post by: Special K on Sun, 01 July 2018, 19:54:27
Why are there even japanese sublegends?? If it's supposed to be following a theme of the "matrix"-- the creative choices seem random.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_digital_rain)
The "digital rain" in the matrix is mostly a mix of katakana and latin alphabet. I hope OP is still considering katakana sublegends, now that gmk sublegends are a thing. I think it would look very cool.
Now that GMK Laser exists, the molds exist and should be usable by any future sets, correct? If so, I would use them as others have suggested.
The GMK laser molds are hiragana characters, while the characters in your render in your render are katakana. I think katakana sublegends would look much cooler on this set and would be more true to the digital rain of the matrix (though I don't know anything at all about Japanese, I'm in it strictly for the aesthetics :) ). If the sublegends are part of the default kit, it would stand a pretty good chance of making MOQ I think, which of course is always the issue.
How do we map katakana characters as secondary legends to the alphabetical characters? Does anyone following this thread speak/read Japanese? I also need this information to give to the artist who will be creating the renders.
Finally, if the katakana character set is different from the hiragana characters used for GMK Laser, then this IC is kind of back at square one with respect to needing to factor in the cost of custom molds for most of the keys, which is what turned people off the first time (see earlier pages for the debate).
The first few pages of this IC are from 2016, right? That was back when GMK custom legends were unthinkable. Since then we've had GMK Laser, which had two sets of completely custom molds for the hiragana sublegends and hiragana monolegends, GMK Burgundy, which has hangul sublegends, and we will soon have GMK space cadet, which has fancy math sublegends. The appetite for custom sublegends absolutely exists now.
Wow, I haven't been keeping up with recent sets. GMK Burgundy does something very similar to this set with its 2x secondary legends on some keys.
How do we map katakana characters as secondary legends to the alphabetical characters? Does anyone following this thread speak/read Japanese? I also need this information to give to the artist who will be creating the renders.
The characters for Hiragana and Katakana represent the same set of syllables, so mapping is easy since it's just to interchange one character for the other.
See this table for a reference where the top character is Hiragana, middle is Katakana, and the third is the syllable representation in roman letters (credit to: cyborgsmurf.wordpress.com (https://cyborgsmurf.wordpress.com/teach-me-2/hiragana-katakana/))Show Image(https://cyborgsmurf.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/kanatable1.png)
(Sidenote: I don't think keysets generally use the g*, z*, d*, b*, p* syllables so they can be disregarded. Same with everything to the right of ya, yu, yo)
And for those that do not know, but are curious as to why there are two character sets for the same syllables...
Hiragana is used for domestic words.
Katakana is used for words loaned from other languages (mainly english).
That's confusing as ****. Why don't we simply replicate what other GMK sets used the most?
Just look at the front page of the thread. :p The render there is katakana sublegends. No need to think further about it.
So you don't think anyone will care how the mapping is done? Do the Hangul characters in GMK Burgundy match up to the alpha characters they are paired with?
Post by: chuckdee on Sun, 01 July 2018, 20:19:27
So you don't think anyone will care how the mapping is done? Do the Hangul characters in GMK Burgundy match up to the alpha characters they are paired with?
Hangul? I thought we were talking Katakana vs Hiragana...
Post by: pvd on Sun, 01 July 2018, 21:03:18
So you don't think anyone will care how the mapping is done? Do the Hangul characters in GMK Burgundy match up to the alpha characters they are paired with?
It is entirely possible that some people will care about how the mapping is done. I don't, but I suppose if something is going to be done it should be done right. From a super cursory cross reference of the render on the front page vs the table supplied by Ohjay vs the gmk laser sublegends, the render on the front page does have correct mapping.
So you don't think anyone will care how the mapping is done? Do the Hangul characters in GMK Burgundy match up to the alpha characters they are paired with?
Hangul? I thought we were talking Katakana vs Hiragana...
Since we're talking about gmk burgundy's hangul kit... gmk matrix could be run as an alphas-only katakana sublegends AE on N9 kit. Then people could pair it with GMK terminal if they felt so inclined. That might be a bad idea though, considering how burgundy's hangul kit only made it to MOQ with vendor help.
Post by: Special K on Mon, 02 July 2018, 01:02:13
So you don't think anyone will care how the mapping is done? Do the Hangul characters in GMK Burgundy match up to the alpha characters they are paired with?
Hangul? I thought we were talking Katakana vs Hiragana...
I was just using GMK Burgundy, which uses Hangul, as an example of another set that used a different character set as secondary legends.
Post by: chuckdee on Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:16:35
So you don't think anyone will care how the mapping is done? Do the Hangul characters in GMK Burgundy match up to the alpha characters they are paired with?
Hangul? I thought we were talking Katakana vs Hiragana...
I was just using GMK Burgundy, which uses Hangul, as an example of another set that used a different character set as secondary legends.
Kobe on GMK Oasis might be a better comparison then, even though that sets are Hiragana.
Post by: Special K on Mon, 09 July 2018, 11:46:11
https://www.vecteezy.com/free-vector/katakana
Would any of these look OK, or does someone have a better recommendation? Is there a "preferred" source that other sets with secondary legends have used? I realize that not all of these are free.
Post by: Giorgio on Mon, 09 July 2018, 13:56:23
I need to supply a vector graphics file with katakana characters in order for an artist to create renders. A brief Google search reveals this page with lots of different font choices:
https://www.vecteezy.com/free-vector/katakana
Would any of these look OK, or does someone have a better recommendation? Is there a "preferred" source that other sets with secondary legends have used? I realize that not all of these are free.
It's going to be very expensive to pay for the artist and for the new gmk molds. This assuming that gmk is willing to invest in new molds, which require a serious commitment on their part, more serious than the money that we pay them.
Post by: dimo on Mon, 09 July 2018, 13:59:20
I need to supply a vector graphics file with katakana characters in order for an artist to create renders. A brief Google search reveals this page with lots of different font choices:
https://www.vecteezy.com/free-vector/katakana
Would any of these look OK, or does someone have a better recommendation? Is there a "preferred" source that other sets with secondary legends have used? I realize that not all of these are free.
This set needs to be very popular if you want to pull of new legends for all the alphas.
GMK space cadet and laser are the only ones which will and have successfully do this and those are some of the most hyped up sets in the community.
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Post by: pvd on Mon, 09 July 2018, 16:13:53
I need to supply a vector graphics file with katakana characters in order for an artist to create renders. A brief Google search reveals this page with lots of different font choices:
https://www.vecteezy.com/free-vector/katakana
Would any of these look OK, or does someone have a better recommendation? Is there a "preferred" source that other sets with secondary legends have used? I realize that not all of these are free.
This set needs to be INSANELY popular if you want to pull of new legends for all the alphas.
GMK space cadet and laser are the only ones which will and have successfully do this and those are some of the most hyped up sets in the community.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I don’t think this is true. GMK Burgundy had a MOQ of 100 for Hangul alphas (which required new molds, but didn’t include a num row).
If the katakana alphas are part of the base set (which is the obvious decision) then the set may be more expensive than normal but there’s no reason to think it will be absurdly priced or require an absurd MOQ.
Post by: Special K on Mon, 09 July 2018, 17:24:35
I need to supply a vector graphics file with katakana characters in order for an artist to create renders. A brief Google search reveals this page with lots of different font choices:
https://www.vecteezy.com/free-vector/katakana
Would any of these look OK, or does someone have a better recommendation? Is there a "preferred" source that other sets with secondary legends have used? I realize that not all of these are free.
It's going to be very expensive to pay for the artist and for the new gmk molds. This assuming that gmk is willing to invest in new molds, which require a serious commitment on their part, more serious than the money that we pay them.
The cost of the renders is not an issue provided I can supply a proper vector graphics file.
Post by: Giorgio on Mon, 09 July 2018, 17:34:55
Post by: Special K on Sun, 14 March 2021, 12:32:27
That said, would anyone be interested in this set given that Katakana sublegend molds already exist? The primary critique against this set when I first proposed it was the cost of the then non-existent Katakana sublegends.
Post by: Raptor_N60 on Sun, 14 March 2021, 15:44:19
I've noticed that there are now multiple sets that feature Katakana sublegends. Example (GMK Fuji): https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=111695.new#new
That said, would anyone be interested in this set given that Katakana sublegend molds already exist? The primary critique against this set when I first proposed it was the cost of the then non-existent Katakana sublegends.
You might need to reconsider the current taste of the market, and the level of polish ic posts are required to have.
IMO it is a good idea to overhaul the ic, make some changes, more renders, and post it again.
Post by: kapowaz on Sun, 14 March 2021, 16:17:38
Post by: Bobatype on Sun, 14 March 2021, 18:43:01
I've noticed that there are now multiple sets that feature Katakana sublegends. Example (GMK Fuji): https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=111695.new#newFirst off, wow this is an old IC from 2016. Community was sure much nicer and less stringent when it came to interest checking concepts.
That said, would anyone be interested in this set given that Katakana sublegend molds already exist? The primary critique against this set when I first proposed it was the cost of the then non-existent Katakana sublegends.
A good Matrix themed keycap set will always be appreciated, however it's going to be hard to properly evaluate this set's potential without some new renders, because your current ones do an incredible disservice to what it could look like.
Note that KAT Cyberspace was a pretty popular set that ran that had some Matrix-ish vibes. Albeit that was in KAT profile, with glow in the dark legends, and PBT Dyesub.
Given GMK's recent tightening of IP rules, you're going to have be a bit more careful too.
Note that there's always the potential of ePBT or IFK or Geekark as manufacturers when it comes to cherry profile albeit they're PBT dyesubbed legends, not ABS doubleshot.
If you really want to give this idea the best platform of revival of interest in 2021, I second the above comment that a revamped IC with new polished renders and kits is sort of expected community standard, or most people will just ignore this set. Even then with polished renders and kits, people are ruthless in when criticising a set...
Anyways, as is, I don't like the green mods, and I would like to see some novelties and better renders to tie it all together.
Best of luck if you revive this IC!