feel guilty, feel very guilty.

[wellington1869]

dont know if this has been posted already, but re: corporate responsiblity and consumer morality...

Macs and PC's share a dirty secret.

hl=en_US&fs=1">

[bitflipper]

.....and exactly what do you propose we do about all this exploitation of people & environment by corporations?

This is where we are with capitalism today. Corporations have gamed the system and just about control our government with lobbyists, campaign contributions, and politicians othewise in bed with corporations through acceptance of jobs, seats on the board, pork barrel (earmarks) projects attached to legislation. They outsource skilled labor and bring in workers through the H1-B scam.

NAFTA hasn't worked. The government is destroying what's left of our economy with overspending, passing useless stimulus bills, disastrous health care bills, 2 concurrent decade long wars, allowing undocumented workers to enter the country and serve as exploited unskilled labor, (and vote), etc.

The middle class has is wealth being destroyed through the effect of the banking near collapse & high unemployment rate on home values.

I'm curious what your proposed plan of action is? Boycott Apple? Vote Republican? Attend Tea Parties? Start drinking?

[bitflipper]

JCD really likes Carly, predicts she'll be the first female POTUS. She has to unseat the entrenched Boxer, first.

[Findecanor]

Those conflict minerals are required to make the surface-mounted types of capacitors that are required to make cell phones and smaller laptops.
On the other hand, laptop tech drives power consumption down, which is better for the environment in one way, and that has to count for something, right?
I made sure that my new computer (purchased two weeks ago), including screen is one that draws less power than an old-fashioned light bulb, even during heavy use.

She has to unseat the entrenched Boxer, first.

She is a little bit like Mike Tyson in that way ...

[ricercar]

**** Carly Fiorna. She's pro-legislation that will kill my wife.

Read the label before you buy the package.

[itlnstln]

Anyway, the Congolese blame the Belgians for all their problems, not Apple.

Show Image

Wow, could they have used a more racist drawing of a black person?

[bitflipper]

JCD = Jesus Christ Dude?

John C. Dvorak, The Glenn Beck of Tech.

Wow, could they have used a more racist drawing of a black person?

Look at that white guy - fat round face, no lips, no muscle tone, stupid designer golf shirt, stupid hat hiding his combover. Truly offensive stereotyping.

[bitflipper]

He liked the way she ran HP??

I'm still waiting for my HP build to order netbook making it's way on a slow boat from Shanghai China - one of the reasons for California's high unemployment rate.

Two of my best computers are HP.

[wellington1869]

I'm curious what your proposed plan of action is? Boycott Apple? Vote Republican? Attend Tea Parties? Start drinking?

lol, i dont have a "proposed plan of action", though I do think raising awareness is a prerequisite to anything.  I also think the status quo is, quite obviously, in the long run, quite unacceptable.

And I also think human beings at their best and in the long run are capable of working together to come up with reasonable solutions for common problems. If we give up on that basic ideal, then we may as well walk outside and shoot ourselves in the head right now and get it over with. I think history shows how incapable we are, but also shows how capable we are. So I'm not about to throw my hands up in the air just because a new set of common problems have appeared in our economy and ecology.

Throwing hands up in the air seems like a favorite activity on this site when ethical/moral issues come up. I thought geeks were supposed to be rational.

[bitflipper]

lol, i dont have a "proposed plan of action", though I do think raising awareness is a prerequisite to anything.  I also think the status quo is, quite obviously, in the long run, quite unacceptable.

And I also think human beings at their best and in the long run are capable of working together to come up with reasonable solutions for common problems. If we give up on that basic ideal, then we may as well walk outside and shoot ourselves in the head right now and get it over with. I think history shows how incapable we are, but also shows how capable we are. So I'm not about to throw my hands up in the air just because a new set of common problems have appeared in our economy and ecology.

Throwing hands up in the air seems like a favorite activity on this site when ethical/moral issues come up. I thought geeks were supposed to be rational.

We geeks always have trouble communicating our solutions. The assburgers gets in the way. ;-)

On a personal level, when giving gifts, I try to give something handmade, vintage or made in the USA. In general, I try to avoid buying anything large and/or plastic. I keep fixing my iPod instead of tossing it and buying another mp3 player. I don't frequent Wal-Mart or Target or the malls. I only buy down pillows. I've driven an average of 8,200 miles per year for the last 7 years - probably half of what most people drive.

There's only so much one person can do.

[8_INCH_FLOPPY]

On the other hand, laptop tech drives power consumption down, which is better for the environment in one way, and that has to count for something, right?

Only laptops are less modular, so that, typically, when their laptop gets old/slow enough, most people simply throw the whole thing away.  With a desktop, the most you are going to replace is the Motherboard.  You can't do that with a laptop, at least not easily.  The case, Monitor, power supply, speakers, keyboard and drives can be easily separated, if you are using a desktop.
Uh-oh, monitor broke ----> Replace monitor.
Uh-oh, Floppy drive is busted ---> Replace floppy drive.
Most of this is possible with some laptops, but most people are too afraid/lazy to bother.

[ch_123]

Upgradability is not a concern for laptops. Laptops should be durable, lightweight, and low power. If you're talking about gaming, and counting pi to a gazillion decimal places, you're missing the point.

And HP stopped being cool when they stopped making PA-RISC machines... Just another generic Wintel box-churner.

Ironically, the only real principled dislike I have of anything in the software industry is the whole Richard Stallman freetard nonsense. I think they do far more to damage the cause of open source software than they do to make it palatable to the general market.

[chimera15]

This is the kind of thing that makes someone get into politics.  It's the governments job to regulate this sort of thing, not the consumer, and not the companies.  Their responsibility is to act as capitalists and get what they can for the smallest money, not care where it comes from.

The confusion is coming from the right, where if the government steps in to stop this kind of crap they're called communists.

[Input Nirvana]

Carly Fiorna=Shameless ****
Meg Whitman=Shameless ****
I am NOT anti-women politicians. I am anti anyone that is a piece of ****. Why is it everyone seems to not mind their blatant lies, ridiculous platforms and pathetic cover-ups? Why does star power run politics in California?

[bitflipper]

With a desktop, the most you are going to replace is the Motherboard.

And HP stopped being cool when they stopped making PA-RISC machines... Just another generic Wintel box-churner.

Ironically, the only real principled dislike I have of anything in the software industry is the whole Richard Stallman freetard nonsense. I think they do far more to damage the cause of open source software than they do to make it palatable to the general market.

.

[bitflipper]

This is the kind of thing that makes someone get into politics.  It's the governments job to regulate this sort of thing, not the consumer, and not the companies.  Their responsibility is to act as capitalists and get what they can for the smallest money, not care where it comes from.

The confusion is coming from the right, where if the government steps in to stop this kind of crap they're called communists.

Umm, the problem is the govt is in cahoots with big corporations. The voters/consumers have little power in this situation.

Both (R) and (D) are the problem. Both are driving the US towards being a bankrupt banana republic. It doesn't matter what names you call them.

We are a corporate oligarchy - ruled by a few elites. That cannot be changed by simply voting (R) or (D) and consuming.

[wellington1869]

This is the kind of thing that makes someone get into politics.  It's the governments job to regulate this sort of thing, not the consumer, and not the companies.  Their responsibility is to act as capitalists and get what they can for the smallest money, not care where it comes from.

i agree its govt's job to regulate. problem is govt is supposed to represent the people, so its a circular feedback loop.

in a democracy, as the saying goes, a people get the govt they deserve. if govt isnt doing the right things, we need to participate more in our democracy. we'd only have ourselves to blame.

if we all act like capitalists, we're going to get a capitalist govt. If we all act like commies we're going to get a commie govt. Govt merely does what gets it the most votes.
If we cant agree we have to fight it out between ourselves and persuade whoever can be persuaded. That takes getting off the couch and getting involved - on any side.
I hate the tea partiers as much as anyone, but I have to give them credit: they're out there every single day, while i'm on the couch. Thats why they have a shot at winning while my morals and my vision for responsible govt remains with me on my couch.

in a way, democracy = open source govt. With all the problems and challenges (and benefits) of open source software. Often we have no support line to call. Often we dont have the right drivers. Development is haphazard and goes in spurts. We depend a lot on crowd sourcing our policies.
But we also benefit, when it works -- responsiveness to the times and the needs, keeping barriers to entry low, keeping monopolies in check, letting the best solutions win by open competition and based on merit, etc.

I agree its not a level playing field (its hard to fight monied interests when you have none yourself) and its hard to organize tons of people around particular issues in a timely way. But its not impossible, and believe me, the lobbyists and the lunatics are extraordinarily hard working, whatever else they are.

[microsoft windows]

Wow, could they have used a more racist drawing of a black person?

How's that racist? He's just sitting there in a Model T.

[ch_123]

It's how the black person is drawn.

[microsoft windows]

You all get too worked up about these things. What's next? Black people eating pork's racist?

[ch_123]

I think it's more the "Oh dear, how did they get away with that?" reaction rather than moral panic.

[Mental Hobbit]

It's the governments job to regulate this sort of thing, not the consumer, and not the companies.  

Unfortunately these days the corporations regulate governments, not the other way round. I've lost all hope for a peaceful solution of this epic ****up.

[microsoft windows]

Upgradability is not a concern for laptops. Laptops should be durable, lightweight, and low power. If you're talking about gaming, and counting pi to a gazillion decimal places, you're missing the point.

And HP stopped being cool when they stopped making PA-RISC machines... Just another generic Wintel box-churner.

Ironically, the only real principled dislike I have of anything in the software industry is the whole Richard Stallman freetard nonsense. I think they do far more to damage the cause of open source software than they do to make it palatable to the general market.

I've always liked laptops since they use less power. But, the main issue with those laptops is their batteries don't last forever. But my 10-year-old laptop still gets great battery life (Much better actually--14 hrs versus 2 hrs). You all know how I do it? I just plug it into my 850W UPS. It's the best laptop  battery there is. Portability's the only problem.

[DreymaR]

Carly Fiorna=Shameless ****
Meg Whitman=Shameless ****

Calling women ****s (even the ones that actually do work in the trade) is the most efficient way I know of being ignored by people of intelligence. All it achieves is marking yourself off as not worth listening to. Fail.

[Half-Saint]

My biggest issues with computers were and still are:
1) power consumption
2) noise
3) size

I partially addressed the 1st and 3rd issue by getting my first LCD monitor in 2004. I was also very impressed with mini-ITX size motherboards due to small size and low power consumption but didn't make the switch (expensive, underpowered). In the end I kept my Athlon XP for almost 6 years. I'm now using a Core2Duo laptop as my main rig but I'm planning to build a modern mini-ITX rig for TV/gaming.

Anyway, back to the point of "saving the environment". I don't toss hardware in the garbage. If it works, I sell it or give it away. If it's broken, I salvage the usable parts and take the rest to the recycling centre. I also like to fix stuff - mostly motherboards these days.

Cheers
SainT

[Findecanor]

Nah, the main reason why I got myself a power-efficient computer was so that I could mod it into becoming totally fanless and thus very quiet. I want to replace the single small fan with a large cooling flange some day.
I figure that any expansion that I will do will be in the form of external devices connected by USB or eSata, or replacement of memory modules or internal disk drive.

My apartment block has a recycling bin for used electronics in the basement. When I got rid of my old one, I disassembled it and tossed only the components there and the plastic and metal elsewhere.

I use a laptop at work -- which is always connected to external full-size screen, mouse and keyboard. My biggest gripe with it is that the power button is not located on the outside: I have to open the lid to power it on every day.

[wellington1869]

lowering consumption (and saving a lot of money in the process by the way) is one part of the solution for sure.   What makes me more interested tho is a couple of other ideas:

1. reclamation. How to manufacture products that use materials (and processes) that can be 100% reclaimed on the other end, by the recycler.

2. building cost of reclamation/recycling/recovery into the cost of the product. This has to do with a major problem right now, that of externalized costs. This is already being done for a variety of products by the way, the 5 cents you pay on plastic bottles is one small example. Such an add-on by the way is a fraction of what reclamation would (and does) cost otherwise, and which we all pay for anyway. (Take the healthcare example. We're all already paying for those without healthcare and without preventative care. They dont fall out of the system, they still get treated, but usually too late and at far more cost than if they were simply made part of the system. This was one of the more compelling economic arguments for universal healthcare, for instance). Same thing applies to the cost of reclaiming consumer products. We're already paying that cost, in clean ups (usually after the fact and at far more expense). People who rail against such 'taxes' dont realize how the economy actually works. You're already paying that tax; such an add on at the point of sale would in fact reduce that tax on you.

(Here's a great video that explains all about externalized costs in our consumer economy):

hl=en_US&fs=1">

[Half-Saint]

George Carlin put it nicely:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvgN5gCuLac

[wellington1869]

George Carlin put it nicely:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvgN5gCuLac

lol. i think i still have my fourth grade arithmetic papers

[ricercar]

George Carlin put it nicely

****, piss, ****, ****, mother****er, cocksucker, and tits. Tits shouldn't even be on the list.

[Input Nirvana]

Quote:
Originally Posted by input nirvana  
Carly Fiorna=Shameless ****
Meg Whitman=Shameless ****
I am NOT anti-women politicians. I am anti anyone that is a piece of ****. Why is it everyone seems to not mind their blatant lies, ridiculous platforms and pathetic cover-ups? Why does star power run politics in California?

Calling women ****s (even the ones that actually do work in the trade) is the most efficient way I know of being ignored by people of intelligence. All it achieves is marking yourself off as not worth listening to. Fail.

Such delicate little ears! You missed the entire point of the post and became hung up on the sound and misunderstanding of one word.
I didn't/never call women ****s, but even if they do work in the trade, I would still be grammatically correct. I do call people ****s. Although perhaps next time I might say "Shameless hooka!" instead.
The shoe still fits. They are both absolutely venal and unscrupulous people that will hurt many in this state for their corporate greed. A very emotional topic if you live here in California. (Disclaimer: That is my opinion)

My gift to all the people of "intelligencia": Please reference Merriam-Webster definition #3 as listed below. (Sorry, there's no listing for "hooka" in the dictionary).
---Main Entry: ****  
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English hore, from Old English hōre; akin to Old Norse hōra ****, hōrr adulterer, Latin carus dear — more at charity
Date: before 12th century
1 : a woman who engages in sexual acts for money : prostitute; also : a promiscuous or immoral woman
2 : a male who engages in sexual acts for money
**3 : a venal or unscrupulous person**

And for further intelligent reading:
---http://www.britannica.com/bps/search?query=****&source=MWTEXT
---"****" and "ass" are used in the bible extensively, I figured it was open game.

I stand by my previous post even though by my very own standards I should not have posted it, it's not worth listening to, and probably should be deleted/ignored by the intelligent. I was just so overcome with emotion after seeing those two shameless hookas on tv prostituting their ugly, corrupt asses for money.

At least the post is in the correct category.

(Where in the world is webwit?)

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