I think the key distribution is a bit weird
the keys in red should be in kit2, I think.
(Attachment Link)
extra left Shift is 2u, right?
with other keys in kit2, they're for Filco Minila, I presume.
I don't think I have any problem with [1.75u Shift + 1u Fn] in kit1, right now I'm using a board with split right Shift (1.75+1) and normal Backspace (2u)
but 2u Shift and other 1u keys there is weird...
Also on "zfrontier" site its said that RainDrop is designed by "Toxic" (who ever he is) and that RainDrop is zfrontier exclusive. How comes?
>literally use the exact same set someone else designed
>pretend you designed it
>call it exclusive
>sell it for like 200 bucks
>lol
Boycot is real ^-^
I know SP has waffled on whether to re-run colorways without consulting the original designer, but I thought they were pretty steadfast about not reusing novelties someone had designed?
I know SP has waffled on whether to re-run colorways without consulting the original designer, but I thought they were pretty steadfast about not reusing novelties someone had designed?
....and this is literally the last time I will every pay attention to any zFrontier buy. :thumb: :rolleyes:
Like aggiejy said, its one thing to make a "heavily inspired by" set and a completely different thing to make claims that you have permission/designed it/have exclusive rights to it/etc.
Yes, I came up with Raindrop (http://aggiejy.com/raindrop/ (http://aggiejy.com/raindrop/)), so it's not right to call it your exclusive or original. Also the icons you use are ones I designed and paid for moulds... I will be very disappointed if SP offers them to you without asking me.There is another JT Raindrop group buy by OCO, they do have Novelty Keys but have not shown at their renders. I presume Sherry have got your endorsement if your design are being used.
I have not problems with people doing similar sets, but don't understand why you have to call them the same thing, and use the same designs. Do something more original!
xoxoxo
Yes, I came up with Raindrop (http://aggiejy.com/raindrop/ (http://aggiejy.com/raindrop/)), so it's not right to call it your exclusive or original. Also the icons you use are ones I designed and paid for moulds... I will be very disappointed if SP offers them to you without asking me.There is another JT Raindrop group buy by OCO, they do have Novelty Keys but have not shown at their renders. I presume Sherry have got your endorsement if your design are being used.
I have not problems with people doing similar sets, but don't understand why you have to call them the same thing, and use the same designs. Do something more original!
xoxoxo
I am just curious if you guys have the permission to run RainDrop from original Designer "aggiejy"?
Here is the link to previous "original" GB: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40520.0 (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40520.0)
Also on "zfrontier" site its said that RainDrop is designed by "Toxic" (who ever he is) and that RainDrop is zfrontier exclusive. How comes?
remember a few months ago on reddit where we crucified the person for copying the raindrop colorway exactly, but made their own novelties?
906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
Oh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
Oh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
Oh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
Pretty sure Nike would come after you if you added a shine line to their icon and then used it commercially ;)
Anyhow, nounproject licenses are very much affordable, just 2 bucks to distribute 100 copies. I think licensing would be appropriate here.
Licensing is a possibility but why license if you can just have someone do it themselves with the appropriate software? Then you skip copying altogether.
Oh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
This is not the first time you try to defend copy cats. Who are you? And why are you playing devils advocate? I found always your expressions very shady.
This particular group buy will not happen, because of 1:1 copy (colorway, novelties and name). SP is not going to produce this. These guys got just pricing tiers and are doing a groupbuy without resolving any copyright issues. And yes RainDrop was and is under copyright protection. Thats why SP is not going to manufacture it. This here is dead GB.
Roll the credits!
Oh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
This is not the first time you try to defend copy cats. Who are you? And why are you playing devils advocate? I found always your expressions very shady.
This particular group buy will not happen, because of 1:1 copy (colorway, novelties and name). SP is not going to produce this. These guys got just pricing tiers and are doing a groupbuy without resolving any copyright issues. And yes RainDrop was and is under copyright protection. Thats why SP is not going to manufacture it. This here is dead GB.
Roll the credits!
Novelty copying (icons, basically) is legal
Novelty copying (icons, basically) is legal
Did you mean to say "creating icons inspired by existing ones" or actually mean straight copying?
An keyset is on itself not a usefull article because its a part of a keyboard, which you can also remove. As such RainDrop is a rain themed set and it has its artificial expressions (which are done flawlesly by it Autor), despite the limitations given by form, material, function etc. We are talking here about Art . Giving that this is not just 0815 keysets, its a custom keyset with artificial properties. Because its Art the Autor gets the Copyright protection by creating it automaticaly. Its the same as with writing a song or book, drawing a picture, sculpting, making a photo and every other artificial expression given. And again we are speaking here not about just the colorway but about that RainDrop and its autor is "aggiejy" and he can claim the right for itOh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
This is not the first time you try to defend copy cats. Who are you? And why are you playing devils advocate? I found always your expressions very shady.
This particular group buy will not happen, because of 1:1 copy (colorway, novelties and name). SP is not going to produce this. These guys got just pricing tiers and are doing a groupbuy without resolving any copyright issues. And yes RainDrop was and is under copyright protection. Thats why SP is not going to manufacture it. This here is dead GB.
Roll the credits!
Let me state first, my pitchfork is out for this set but not because it's a copy. That said, let's jump into your comments and talk about my thoughts on copying then we'll get back to my particular pitchfork.
Colorway copying is legal. Novelty copying (icons, basically) is legal - hence all the icon options you have out there. Beyond that, keyboards are similarly not covered by nature of being a useful article. Under the useful article clause, the useful article isn't protected, only those artistic elements that can be removed from the useful article itself may be protected. Even then, the useful article remains unprotected. Hence why we've had similar colorway after colorway outside the enthusiast community without issue; companies knew the legalities and simply go about their business. The thing I find baffling within the community is that copying seems perfectly fine under certain circumstances. Copy a classic colorway? Great. Custom colors to match the original? Even better. Copy all the various specialized caps the original set had ? Fantastic. Don't have access or permission to the old molds? No worries, get new ones made! Now try that same thing with a modern set and people suddenly get upset.
As for my pitchfork, it's out not because it's a copy but because of the claims of originality. It's clearly not the case.
Oh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
This is not the first time you try to defend copy cats. Who are you? And why are you playing devils advocate? I found always your expressions very shady.
This particular group buy will not happen, because of 1:1 copy (colorway, novelties and name). SP is not going to produce this. These guys got just pricing tiers and are doing a groupbuy without resolving any copyright issues. And yes RainDrop was and is under copyright protection. Thats why SP is not going to manufacture it. This here is dead GB.
Roll the credits!
Not doubting the veracity of this claim. But as a curious observer and possible point of reference for GB leads/makers, can you link or point to where one would find this specific information? This really need to hashed out and pinned somewhere because I do believe many people don't understand this.
An keyset is on itself not a usefull article because its a part of a keyboard, which you can also remove. As such RainDrop is a rain themed set and it has its artificial expressions (which are done flawlesly by it Autor), despite the limitations given by form, material, function etc. We are talking here about Art . Giving that this is not just 0815 keysets, its a custom keyset with artificial properties. Because its Art the Autor gets the Copyright protection by creating it automaticaly. Its the same as with writing a song or book, drawing a picture, sculpting, making a photo and every other artificial expression given. And again we are speaking here not about just the colorway but about that RainDrop and its autor is "aggiejy" and he can claim the right for itOh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
This is not the first time you try to defend copy cats. Who are you? And why are you playing devils advocate? I found always your expressions very shady.
This particular group buy will not happen, because of 1:1 copy (colorway, novelties and name). SP is not going to produce this. These guys got just pricing tiers and are doing a groupbuy without resolving any copyright issues. And yes RainDrop was and is under copyright protection. Thats why SP is not going to manufacture it. This here is dead GB.
Roll the credits!
Let me state first, my pitchfork is out for this set but not because it's a copy. That said, let's jump into your comments and talk about my thoughts on copying then we'll get back to my particular pitchfork.
Colorway copying is legal. Novelty copying (icons, basically) is legal - hence all the icon options you have out there. Beyond that, keyboards are similarly not covered by nature of being a useful article. Under the useful article clause, the useful article isn't protected, only those artistic elements that can be removed from the useful article itself may be protected. Even then, the useful article remains unprotected. Hence why we've had similar colorway after colorway outside the enthusiast community without issue; companies knew the legalities and simply go about their business. The thing I find baffling within the community is that copying seems perfectly fine under certain circumstances. Copy a classic colorway? Great. Custom colors to match the original? Even better. Copy all the various specialized caps the original set had ? Fantastic. Don't have access or permission to the old molds? No worries, get new ones made! Now try that same thing with a modern set and people suddenly get upset.
As for my pitchfork, it's out not because it's a copy but because of the claims of originality. It's clearly not the case.
In that case you can bring as many law articles as possible which suits your issues you have with this community but they dont fit this particular case because this here is art. RainDrop is art and nobody can run it just like that without permission of its Autor.
Its just keycaps for you. But for me and many other community members this is art which also makes this hobby so great and explains why you, me and others are here.Oh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
This is not the first time you try to defend copy cats. Who are you? And why are you playing devils advocate? I found always your expressions very shady.
This particular group buy will not happen, because of 1:1 copy (colorway, novelties and name). SP is not going to produce this. These guys got just pricing tiers and are doing a groupbuy without resolving any copyright issues. And yes RainDrop was and is under copyright protection. Thats why SP is not going to manufacture it. This here is dead GB.
Roll the credits!
Not doubting the veracity of this claim. But as a curious observer and possible point of reference for GB leads/makers, can you link or point to where one would find this specific information? This really need to hashed out and pinned somewhere because I do believe many people don't understand this.
I've described it above. Given the RainDrop keyset is Art the rights for it are granted automaticaly to its Autor.
An keyset is on itself not a usefull article because its a part of a keyboard, which you can also remove. As such RainDrop is a rain themed set and it has its artificial expressions (which are done flawlesly by it Autor), despite the limitations given by form, material, function etc. We are talking here about Art . Giving that this is not just 0815 keysets, its a custom keyset with artificial properties. Because its Art the Autor gets the Copyright protection by creating it automaticaly. Its the same as with writing a song or book, drawing a picture, sculpting, making a photo and every other artificial expression given. And again we are speaking here not about just the colorway but about that RainDrop and its autor is "aggiejy" and he can claim the right for itOh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
This is not the first time you try to defend copy cats. Who are you? And why are you playing devils advocate? I found always your expressions very shady.
This particular group buy will not happen, because of 1:1 copy (colorway, novelties and name). SP is not going to produce this. These guys got just pricing tiers and are doing a groupbuy without resolving any copyright issues. And yes RainDrop was and is under copyright protection. Thats why SP is not going to manufacture it. This here is dead GB.
Roll the credits!
Let me state first, my pitchfork is out for this set but not because it's a copy. That said, let's jump into your comments and talk about my thoughts on copying then we'll get back to my particular pitchfork.
Colorway copying is legal. Novelty copying (icons, basically) is legal - hence all the icon options you have out there. Beyond that, keyboards are similarly not covered by nature of being a useful article. Under the useful article clause, the useful article isn't protected, only those artistic elements that can be removed from the useful article itself may be protected. Even then, the useful article remains unprotected. Hence why we've had similar colorway after colorway outside the enthusiast community without issue; companies knew the legalities and simply go about their business. The thing I find baffling within the community is that copying seems perfectly fine under certain circumstances. Copy a classic colorway? Great. Custom colors to match the original? Even better. Copy all the various specialized caps the original set had ? Fantastic. Don't have access or permission to the old molds? No worries, get new ones made! Now try that same thing with a modern set and people suddenly get upset.
As for my pitchfork, it's out not because it's a copy but because of the claims of originality. It's clearly not the case.
In that case you can bring as many law articles as possible which suits your issues you have with this community but they dont fit this particular case because this here is art. RainDrop is art and nobody can run it just like that without permission of its Autor.
Its just keycaps for you. But for me and many other community members this is art which also makes this hobby so great and explains why you, me and others are here.Oh linking! Let's have fun.
From the US Copyright Office: http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf (http://copyright.gov/comp3/chap900/ch900-visual-art.pdf)Quote906.2 Familiar Symbols and Designs
Familiar symbols and designs are not protected by the Copyright Act. 37 C.F.R. §
202.1(a). Likewise, the copyright law does not protect mere variations on a familiar
symbol or design, either in two or three-dimensional form. For representative examples
of symbols or designs that cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office,
see Chapter 300, Section 313.4(J).
A work that includes familiar symbols or designs may be registered if the registration
specialist determines that the author used these elements in a creative manner and that
the work as a whole is eligible for copyright protection.
Examples:
Francis Ford created a sketch of the standard fleur de lys design used by the French monarchy. The registration specialist may refuse to register this claim if the work merely depicts a common fleur de lys.
Samantha Stone drew an original silhouette of Marie Antoinette with a backdrop featuring multiple fleur de lys designs. The registration specialist may register this work because it incorporates an original, artistic drawing in addition to the standard fleur de lys designs
And section 313.4.Quote313.4(J) Familiar Symbols and Designs Familiar symbols and designs are not copyrightable and cannot be registered with the U.S. Copyright Office, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. 37 C.F.R. § 202.1(a). Likewise, the Office cannot register a work consisting of a simple combination of a few familiar symbols or designs with minor linear or spatial variations, either in two-dimensional or three-dimensional form. Examples of familiar symbols and designs include, without limitation:
Letters.
Punctuation.
Symbols typically found on a keyboard, such as asterisks, ampersands, and the like.
Abbreviations. Musical notes and symbols.
Numbers.
Mathematical symbols.
Currency symbols.
Arrows and other directional or navigational symbols.
Common representational symbols, such as a spade, club, heart, diamond, star, yin yang, fleur de lys, or the like.
Common patterns, such as standard chevron, polka dot, checkerboard, or houndstooth designs.
Well-known and commonly used symbols that contain a de minimis amount of expression or that are in the public domain, such as the peace symbol, gender symbols (♀ ♂), the symbols for play, pause, stop, forward, back, simple emoticons such as the typical smiley face (☺), or the like.
Standard industry designs, such as the caduceus, the barber pole, food labeling symbols, hazard warning symbols, or the like.
Familiar religious symbols such as crosses, stars, crescents, and the like.
Common architecture moldings, such as the volute used to decorate Ionic and Corinthian columns.
While familiar symbols and designs cannot be registered by themselves, a work of authorship that incorporates one or more of these elements into a larger design may be registered if the work as a whole contains a sufficient amount of creative expression.
For additional information concerning familiar symbols and designs, see Chapter 900, Section 906.2.
This is not the first time you try to defend copy cats. Who are you? And why are you playing devils advocate? I found always your expressions very shady.
This particular group buy will not happen, because of 1:1 copy (colorway, novelties and name). SP is not going to produce this. These guys got just pricing tiers and are doing a groupbuy without resolving any copyright issues. And yes RainDrop was and is under copyright protection. Thats why SP is not going to manufacture it. This here is dead GB.
Roll the credits!
Not doubting the veracity of this claim. But as a curious observer and possible point of reference for GB leads/makers, can you link or point to where one would find this specific information? This really need to hashed out and pinned somewhere because I do believe many people don't understand this.
I've described it above. Given the RainDrop keyset is Art the rights for it are granted automaticaly to its Autor.
I'll let Melissa handle this one.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=78797.msg2015702#msg2015702
I would dare argue that a keyset is merely a part of the useful article; the keyboard itself. Without the caps, the keyboard is a much less functional item similar to a lamp lacking a switch or bulb. The legends are also useful so you know what you're typing.
As to the law articles. That's an incorrect term. That information I liked is straight from the US Copyright Office. That is official legal copyright information from the US government, not an article.
That said, where is the line drawn on what is claimed as art? If what you're saying is true, T0mb3ry, would not other sets that have already been copied fall under copyright? If not, I'm wondering why not.
And, yes, they're just keycaps to me and art to you. The problem is, you have not defined how they do not meet the uncopyrightable material sufficiently. That it's a custom keyset is insufficient if it does not meet the minimum requirements to be considered copyrightable. The images may have more capability of copyright than the actual keysets themselves. Even then, nothing is stopping a run of the colorway separate from the novelties. In which case, it's still not an exact copy.
First, let me say thank you for engaging me in this discussion, T0mb3ry. I find the topic fascinating and the discussion we're having engaging as it's great to read other thoughts on this topic.
Let me see if I understand this from your side. Please correct me if I'm not understanding something correctly. It seems that you are saying that the completed set which includes the colorway, novelties, and general theme is the art work? Do I have that right? If so, it also seems as if the individual pieces might not receive protection while the completed set does? At least it seemed as if you were alluding to such and if not, I apologize.
I will first say that I don't disagree with you on the potential for this. My concern is that it has yet to be confirmed. We've all simply assumed copyright without ever testing it by submitting a set for copyright. I find this disconcerting in a way similar to a pre-mature victory celebration.
That said, the colorway itself isn't protected as we've seen many a colorway reproduced with and without any approval from the original designer. Many of the novelties would also fall into this - else I would expect Harmony Gold to be not very pleased with Skull Squadron and the use of various Robotech icons. I would argue that some might fall under protection. I would also argue most artisans meet protection requirements.
However, it seems to me that a colorway of a set could be rerun. In the case of a set without novelties, it might be able to fully run as-is. The caveat would likely be a name change to avoid trademark problems. In addition, it seems that many sets could see novelties run separate from the main set should they not fall under separate protection.
In the end, the problem of protecting a set seems to be the set itself as multiple individual items that can be bought separately whereas a painting or sculpture is a single item. I can, essentially, recreate an existing art piece through painting by numbers due to the simple nature of keyboards and their keycaps. In the end, you might technically be right that the set can't run as-is but it still might not matter if the elements can be purchased separately and assembled by anyone into either an identical set or close enough set.
Would copyright even apply here? Wouldn't this be new molds either way given the change to SA? They don't look the same to me (the umbrella for example), but more importantly even if they were the same molds somehow, would this this not be considered derivative work? The legends are different. The profile is different. There are new novelties. The modifiers are different. The arrows are different. It's totally the same concept, but it's a fundamentally unique interpretation of it. The only actual similarities are the colors and rain theme.
To be clear, I absolutely agree it was ****ty to not ask and it's morally wrong. But legally? No case.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
First, let me say thank you for engaging me in this discussion, T0mb3ry. I find the topic fascinating and the discussion we're having engaging as it's great to read other thoughts on this topic.
Let me see if I understand this from your side. Please correct me if I'm not understanding something correctly. It seems that you are saying that the completed set which includes the colorway, novelties, and general theme is the art work? Do I have that right? If so, it also seems as if the individual pieces might not receive protection while the completed set does? At least it seemed as if you were alluding to such and if not, I apologize.
I will first say that I don't disagree with you on the potential for this. My concern is that it has yet to be confirmed. We've all simply assumed copyright without ever testing it by submitting a set for copyright. I find this disconcerting in a way similar to a pre-mature victory celebration.
That said, the colorway itself isn't protected as we've seen many a colorway reproduced with and without any approval from the original designer. Many of the novelties would also fall into this - else I would expect Harmony Gold to be not very pleased with Skull Squadron and the use of various Robotech icons. I would argue that some might fall under protection. I would also argue most artisans meet protection requirements.
However, it seems to me that a colorway of a set could be rerun. In the case of a set without novelties, it might be able to fully run as-is. The caveat would likely be a name change to avoid trademark problems. In addition, it seems that many sets could see novelties run separate from the main set should they not fall under separate protection.
In the end, the problem of protecting a set seems to be the set itself as multiple individual items that can be bought separately whereas a painting or sculpture is a single item. I can, essentially, recreate an existing art piece through painting by numbers due to the simple nature of keyboards and their keycaps. In the end, you might technically be right that the set can't run as-is but it still might not matter if the elements can be purchased separately and assembled by anyone into either an identical set or close enough set.
Again i am talking about RainDrop keyset. Not the colorway. So yes the combination of colorway, novelties and theme define RainDrop keyset. I think i am pretty much clear here.
Zslane described pretty well, that its not as easy to make things clear. Each country has its own laws. And if you want to make things clear then you have need enough money to pay a Lawyer which can explain you the situation. Laws are very complex. They do have many and probably more specific cases which might and might not apply in a particular case. Because the laws are complex, people study laws. But in gererall amost every western country has laws which protects autor rights. RainDrop is here the clear case.Would copyright even apply here? Wouldn't this be new molds either way given the change to SA? They don't look the same to me (the umbrella for example), but more importantly even if they were the same molds somehow, would this this not be considered derivative work? The legends are different. The profile is different. There are new novelties. The modifiers are different. The arrows are different. It's totally the same concept, but it's a fundamentally unique interpretation of it. The only actual similarities are the colors and rain theme.
To be clear, I absolutely agree it was ****ty to not ask and it's morally wrong. But legally? No case.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sure. Despite its different profile, it does not change the fact its a RainDrop keyset.
A derivative work is a work based upon one or more preexisting works, such as a translation, musical arrangement, dramatization, fictionalization, motion picture version, sound recording, art reproduction, abridgment, condensation, or any other form in which a work may be recast, transformed, or adapted. A work consisting of editorial revisions, annotations, elaborations, or other modifications which, as a whole, represent an original work of authorship, is a derivative work.
I am not lawyer who is specialized on US laws to confirm this...First, let me say thank you for engaging me in this discussion, T0mb3ry. I find the topic fascinating and the discussion we're having engaging as it's great to read other thoughts on this topic.
Let me see if I understand this from your side. Please correct me if I'm not understanding something correctly. It seems that you are saying that the completed set which includes the colorway, novelties, and general theme is the art work? Do I have that right? If so, it also seems as if the individual pieces might not receive protection while the completed set does? At least it seemed as if you were alluding to such and if not, I apologize.
I will first say that I don't disagree with you on the potential for this. My concern is that it has yet to be confirmed. We've all simply assumed copyright without ever testing it by submitting a set for copyright. I find this disconcerting in a way similar to a pre-mature victory celebration.
That said, the colorway itself isn't protected as we've seen many a colorway reproduced with and without any approval from the original designer. Many of the novelties would also fall into this - else I would expect Harmony Gold to be not very pleased with Skull Squadron and the use of various Robotech icons. I would argue that some might fall under protection. I would also argue most artisans meet protection requirements.
However, it seems to me that a colorway of a set could be rerun. In the case of a set without novelties, it might be able to fully run as-is. The caveat would likely be a name change to avoid trademark problems. In addition, it seems that many sets could see novelties run separate from the main set should they not fall under separate protection.
In the end, the problem of protecting a set seems to be the set itself as multiple individual items that can be bought separately whereas a painting or sculpture is a single item. I can, essentially, recreate an existing art piece through painting by numbers due to the simple nature of keyboards and their keycaps. In the end, you might technically be right that the set can't run as-is but it still might not matter if the elements can be purchased separately and assembled by anyone into either an identical set or close enough set.
Again i am talking about RainDrop keyset. Not the colorway. So yes the combination of colorway, novelties and theme define RainDrop keyset. I think i am pretty much clear here.
Zslane described pretty well, that its not as easy to make things clear. Each country has its own laws. And if you want to make things clear then you have need enough money to pay a Lawyer which can explain you the situation. Laws are very complex. They do have many and probably more specific cases which might and might not apply in a particular case. Because the laws are complex, people study laws. But in gererall amost every western country has laws which protects autor rights. RainDrop is here the clear case.Would copyright even apply here? Wouldn't this be new molds either way given the change to SA? They don't look the same to me (the umbrella for example), but more importantly even if they were the same molds somehow, would this this not be considered derivative work? The legends are different. The profile is different. There are new novelties. The modifiers are different. The arrows are different. It's totally the same concept, but it's a fundamentally unique interpretation of it. The only actual similarities are the colors and rain theme.
To be clear, I absolutely agree it was ****ty to not ask and it's morally wrong. But legally? No case.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sure. Despite its different profile, it does not change the fact its a RainDrop keyset.
That would be important if this were a Trademark and the style was considered trade dress. You cannot label the original a work of art and then ignore the differences. That is not how copyrights work.
This is the literal definition of derivative work. It would be thrown out of court immediately.QuoteA derivative work is a work based upon one or more preexisting works, such as a translation, musical arrangement, dramatization, fictionalization, motion picture version, sound recording, art reproduction, abridgment, condensation, or any other form in which a work may be recast, transformed, or adapted. A work consisting of editorial revisions, annotations, elaborations, or other modifications which, as a whole, represent an original work of authorship, is a derivative work.
Note: Art REPRODUCTION
To be honest, keycaps don't really fit the bill for copyright to begin with. Trademark however could be argued. For example were Honeywell still making keyboards, I imagine they could exert a trademark claim to the colorway itself. Because they could claim it was part of their brand identity.
By your logic there is only 1 person allowed to paint pictures of dogs playing cards.
I totally think it's bull****. I won't buy one. I'm glad zfrontier pulled it. But there is no way anyone could win a legal claim here. None.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sincere apologies for the misunderstanding. I was not aware of any IP issue during the IC process, and an official price quotation from SP was provided. So I presumptuously assumed that the authorization of the design was provided, and moved directly onto the group buy.
I was therefore shocked to see the recent discussion. If I had known about this, I would not have started the GB. I have notified zFrontier regarding the issue immediately, and saw that the GB has been taken off.
Also, I noticed that there was a previous GB of Raindrop in DSA Profile in 2015, which was fulfilled by SP. (http://www.waishechina.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=895&extra=page%3D1)Show Image(https://ooo.0o0.ooo/2017/06/23/594ce91b0ec40.jpg)Show Image(https://ooo.0o0.ooo/2017/06/23/594ce92c54771.jpg)
This fulfilled GB partly misled me into thinking that there would be no problem with the authorization of this design. Again, apologies for the misunderstanding.
... if you pay for your own molds and just copy the design with some similar artwork... that's just poor taste. Be original. Call it Bluebird and make a bird nest, bird, birdhouse, egg, etc.
The things that seem wrong to me are using the name "Rain Drop" without permission, and using the molds for my legends. (I paid to have them made.)
To be clear, I could care less if someone copies the colorway. (Though, if I had to do it over, I'd have selected a more vibrant blue.)
The things that seem wrong to me are using the name "Rain Drop" without permission, and using the molds for my legends. (I paid to have them made.)
Now that said, if you pay for your own molds and just copy the design with some similar artwork... that's just poor taste. Be original. Call it Bluebird and make a bird nest, bird, birdhouse, egg, etc.
And if you do make your own molds, make sure the artwork is licensed for reproduction. I paid for my artwork, so if you copy it you're not just in violation of my copyright.
Either way, it's just keycaps. Running the buy was fun. It took a lot of time, a ton of effort, and I lost money. So it's just kind of sad to see it copied exactly. xoxoxo
PS: The firsttwothree posts of the buy are good historical reading material. https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40520.0 It was long ago, but I'm still happy with how it went and the (relatively) fast pace. Good old fashioned community-led buys are good for the community. (Nothing wrong with responsible venders either though.) For those who were on Geekhack in 2011/2012 should remember - it was difficult to get custom keys at all. Now we're in the golden years. :)
The things that seem wrong to me are using the name "Rain Drop" without permission, and using the molds for my legends. (I paid to have them made.)
I think they are using new molds because of the new profile. Still kinda lame to do a rip of an old set and claim ownership. They should at least buy the icons same as you did.
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The things that seem wrong to me are using the name "Rain Drop" without permission, and using the molds for my legends. (I paid to have them made.)
I think they are using new molds because of the new profile. Still kinda lame to do a rip of an old set and claim ownership. They should at least buy the icons same as you did.
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I believe Melissa at SP has stated previously that mold usage requires permission from the mold owners.
I believe Melissa at SP has stated previously that mold usage requires permission from the mold owners.