Author Topic: Poker II review  (Read 85801 times)

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Offline WhiteFireDragon

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Poker II review
« on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 22:43:52 »
First, I just want to mention that this will be more geared towards the crowd that are already familiar with mechanical keyboards, or already own the original poker. There won’t be much of an intro or basic feel of the keyboard, since you can find this general info elsewhere. I’m mainly just focusing on new improvements on this Poker II. 


Basic stuff
This is a compact keyboard with cherry MX switches with only the main keys (no function row, right side keys, or numpad). Layout is English ANSI, same key sizes as the original poker. One huge improvement is that it’s programmable, so you can remap keys to any location. Meaning you can have hardware Colmak or Dvorak, or any other custom layout without depending on the OS or software to remap. It weighs 1lb 5oz, a tad heavier than the original poker because it now has a metal plate. The plate prevents any type of flexing, which was a huge complaint on the first poker. The plate also changes the bottom-out noise, making it more loud and “sharp” compared to PCB-mounted switches in the first poker.


PCB
The PCB was redone from the ground up. No parts of this resembles the original poker, except for the switch locations. Even the traces are mapped differently. The main controller is a Nuvoton rather than a Holtek found on most modern mechanical keyboards, including the original poker. The USB connector and DIP switches from the old poker were through-hole, but all components are now 100% SMD except for the optional LEDs.

What I DON’T like about this new PCB is that they use the glass type diodes, which are easier to crack than the other diodes. There is a resistor for every switch, which suggests that you can install your own LEDs. However, the LED holes are filled with solder so you need to remove the solder first. PCB says it’s RoHS, but I’m not sure how believable this is because the switch solder joints are just so dam shiny to be lead-free.


Everything included. It’s nice that a wire keycap puller was included. Most keyboards do not include this, and even if they do, it’s the el cheapo plastic clip type. Thick RGB modifiers are also included, which is a huge bonus. Although, I preferred the blue and green to be darker.



Black steel plate. I’m not sure if it’s powder-coated or just painted. No cutout design for switch removal. It still uses Cherry stabilizers, however now they’re plate-mounted instead of PCB-mounted seen in the old poker. All switches are rotated upside down, so that the LED positions can be on top for caps with see-through legends.



There are two LEDs mounted on the PCB for the spacebar, compared to just one LED on the spacebar switch from the old poker. You can also see there is a new mounting hold in the middle of the G and H key, which is not present in the old poker. The case has a standoff in this location.



The main SMD are here (there’s another small grouping of components just to the left, not shown). It uses a smaller Nuvoton controller with finer pin-pitch. USB SMD connector here.



Every switch looks like this. Very shiny solder joints. Different types of SMD diodes (redish components), with resistors just to the left. These are for the individual switch LEDs, although I don’t understand why the LED holes would be filled with solder. Slight flux marks around every switch.



The function layer is printed on the side of the caps. Programming mode is the on CTRL, and you can also see volume buttons on the N M and “<” keys, not found on the original poker



Arrow cluster has been moved to the WASD, compared to bottom right location in the old poker.



Keycaps are thick PBT, which is about as good as you can ask for. However, the legends are pad-printed instead of dyesub or double-shot, which means they can wear off faster. I’m not a fan of the font choice or centered location either. Caps are about 1.5mm thick. The caps on the right are PBT caps from a Pure (same as a poker I) for comparison, and you can see they’re a bit thinner, ever so slightly darker, and a tad more textured on the top surface.



Comparison of thickness between typical PBT caps, thick PBT from this poker, and imsto’s thick grey PBT (left to right)



One complaint about all the large keys is that I can see the stems slightly sticking out from the top surface, or very obvious outlines of them (another pic here)



New metallic label on the bottom of the case. All the words are laser-etched. There is a lame attempt for a marketing slogan in the middle



Here’s the biggest turnoff. I don’t need a keyboard to tell me what to enjoy. This doesn’t even make sense to put on a keyboard.


 
« Last Edit: Thu, 30 May 2013, 00:14:45 by WhiteFireDragon »

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:06:24 »
Maybe it just wants you to enjoy the feeling you have at the exact moment you decide to sit down at your computer. Don't take it so literally :P.

Seriously though, great review. I really liked how the review was concise and had a lot of information. Plus it will clear up a lot of questions that people will have concerning the Poker 2. Will you be posting a YouTube review as well? Or is this a transcript from a review you've already taped?

Offline mashby

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:07:18 »
You are my hero. EXCELLENT review, with precisely the information I was looking for. Thank you!

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #3 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:14:19 »
Oh and I thought this might be nice, so I hope you dont mind this post. I've linked some of the more basic info below so that this review will have all this lovely Poker 2 info in one spot. :D

Poker 2 early press release info

Some Q&A (answers from qtan) in qtan's GB IC thread

Unboxing video and qtan's GB thread with some Q&A

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #4 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:44:46 »
^ Thanks for the links. I don't mind at all, since I didn't care to post a lot of general info.


Will you be posting a YouTube review as well? Or is this a transcript from a review you've already taped?

I did record a short clip when uboxing it, but probably won't edit and upload it. Not special enough, and it's basically just a repeat of everything in here.

Offline SmallFry

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:46:26 »
Furthermore, just because CPTBadAss needs it for his Simple Answers thread, what's it weigh?

Offline Latin00032

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #6 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:47:38 »
What do you think about the pokers programming ability and how it may compare to the gh60?

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #7 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:48:24 »
Furthermore, just because CPTBadAss needs it for his Simple Answers thread, what's it weigh?

He said in the OP that it weights 1 lb, 5 oz. I already edited my post in the Questions thread to reflect that info :D

Offline okooko

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #8 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:48:45 »
Great review.

Might consider getting one now =P

I think having a replacement spacebar would solve that issue lol. Yeah I'm also not a fan of having uneccesary text on there. but they are just caps, no biggie

Offline SmallFry

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #9 on: Wed, 29 May 2013, 23:49:44 »
Furthermore, just because CPTBadAss needs it for his Simple Answers thread, what's it weigh?

He said in the OP that it weights 1 lb, 5 oz. I already edited my post in the Questions thread to reflect that info :D
Shhhhh... he didn't say that! :|

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 00:02:54 »
I think having a replacement spacebar would solve that issue lol. Yeah I'm also not a fan of having uneccesary text on there. but they are just caps, no biggie

I can actually feel the text bulging up, so I think you can just scratch it off, and if that doesn't work, just sand it.

Offline The_Beast

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 00:07:18 »
Nice review! If I didn't have a couple GH60s on the way, I'd order one.
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Offline okooko

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #12 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 00:16:02 »
Going through the review a second time, i didnt realise that the switches were mounted upside down.

They should have left the back-spec plate blank for you to engrave your own slogan lol

Offline eyesmiles

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #13 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 01:10:41 »
I love the details in your review WFD!

Offline dave23

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #14 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 02:25:38 »
Thank you for the nice review, as I was reading there was a knock on the door with a delivery for me :) Ordered mine from uk ebay last Thursday, super fast delivery as there was a bank holiday here on Monday too. Off to have a play..

Offline kaiserreich

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #15 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 03:08:41 »
Good job WFD.

Not sure about the shiny solders.
I can see the shiny solder on the empty pads for my motherboards.
There is no doubt in my mind that the motherboards are ROHS.

The LED on the CapsLock is also a feature on the Pure. Maybe Vortex just redesigned the PURE PCB?

Btw, what do you call those dimples that fills the empty spaces the PCB?
Do you know what are they for?

« Last Edit: Thu, 30 May 2013, 05:34:56 by kaiserreich »

Offline yearn4

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #16 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 03:27:28 »
well the poker x does have volume buttons too, mute on fn + v, up vol on fn + b, down vol on fn + n
i memorized the poker layout and prefer the dedicated arrow key lock that i don't believe is possible with the poker 2
other than that it's pretty good :)

Offline pichu23

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #17 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 05:13:32 »
Nice review.
Lol at the "enjoy your feeling" & "cheering up thingy" -_-
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Offline gigibecali

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #18 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 09:04:03 »
Interesting...
Nuvoton on ARM Cortex. 60MHz, 32K flash and 4K sram. Way more than respectable for a keyboard.

I wonder whether it can be reflashed somehow.
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Offline Latin00032

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #19 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 09:35:11 »
Does it look like you can easily change the stabilizers with costar stabilizers?

Plate mount or pcb mount?

Offline baller1308

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #20 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 09:49:03 »
Nice review, thanks for the pictures.  I missed out on the group buy, but I have one on the way.
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Offline kaiserreich

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #21 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 10:05:01 »
Does it look like you can easily change the stabilizers with costar stabilizers?

Plate mount or pcb mount?

Once the cherry stabilzer are clipped, they will feel infinitely better than squeaky costars

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #22 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 15:08:03 »
Going through the review a second time, i didnt realise that the switches were mounted upside down.

It was mentioned in the OP, but they're all upside down so it positions the LEDs on top, which can shine through the transparent legends. Normally legends are towards the top of the cap, not the bottom. This model doesn't have LED or caps for this, but it won't make sense to have a different PCB assembly process to accommodate to both models.

The only switch that is mounted rightside up is the spacebar, but that one already has 2 dedicated LEDs not mounted on the switch.


Not sure about the shiny solders.
I can see the shiny solder on the empty pads for my motherboards.
There is no doubt in my mind that the motherboards are ROHS.

I'll test out melting temps later today or tomorrow, and we'll see if these Chinese factories are lying or not.


The LED on the CapsLock is also a feature on the Pure. Maybe Vortex just redesigned the PURE PCB?

PURE closely resembles the old poker. They're basically just revisions of each other. The pure I have is completely different than these poker II PCBs. Same feature and location doesn't mean just modified PCBs. The poker II PCB traces are wired completely different.


Btw, what do you call those dimples that fills the empty spaces the PCB?
Do you know what are they for?

Not exactly sure what all those random dots are for. There are a ton of them too. Although, some of them act as vias and bridges one side of the PCB to the other side. These are the dots with copper dots on them. I haven't desoldered all the switches to confirm the other side, but you can kinda tell because those traces between the two dots aren't connected to anything, so it must be a bridge for the other side.
 

Offline kaiserreich

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #23 on: Thu, 30 May 2013, 19:32:23 »
Not exactly sure what all those random dots are for. There are a ton of them too. Although, some of them act as vias and bridges one side of the PCB to the other side. These are the dots with copper dots on them. I haven't desoldered all the switches to confirm the other side, but you can kinda tell because those traces between the two dots aren't connected to anything, so it must be a bridge for the other side.
 

I don't mean the random copper vias.
Those are probably for via stitching.
But I don't understand why you would need so many via stitches on a Keyboard PCB.

What I am really asking though, is the golf ball like dimples on the Black PCB surface. I have no idea what are those.


Offline laffindude

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #24 on: Fri, 31 May 2013, 02:21:13 »
Cross hatched ground plain is there to reduce EMI. Keyboards are not that sensitive to EMI though.
Legends are lasered.
Keycaps looks like the same thick OEM height PBT Ducky is using.

Edit: the filled LED holes. Probably only using 1 solder masking plate in the solder paste machine to save money from having to make a new one for non-LED version.
« Last Edit: Fri, 31 May 2013, 02:27:30 by laffindude »

Offline Lbeuol

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #25 on: Tue, 04 June 2013, 02:35:47 »
Thanks for the very detailed review, think I'll look into getting a poker soon.

Offline calavera

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #26 on: Tue, 04 June 2013, 02:43:42 »
Curious as to why they filled up the LED holes too. wtf

Offline iAmAhab

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #27 on: Tue, 04 June 2013, 16:48:42 »
Probably because this version and the backlight version is produced on the same assembly line. The solder machine does not care if there is led in place or not, it just solders away thus filling the holes.
My theory at least.

Offline elttaboi

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #28 on: Tue, 04 June 2013, 22:16:58 »
thanks for the in-depth. This might be my next keyboard since I'd like a portable.

Offline POFFINGTON

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #29 on: Wed, 05 June 2013, 00:05:21 »
Really great review! I love the Image quality on these. The compactness of this keyboard is stellar.
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Offline WhiteFireDragon

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #30 on: Wed, 05 June 2013, 00:22:15 »
The F, G, and H keys has time delay for the function layer: 15ms, 100ms, and 500ms. I noticed this, but didn't realize what it was for until looking at the manual. Anyone know why this would be a useful feature?


thanks for the in-depth. This might be my next keyboard since I'd like a portable.
Really great review! I love the Image quality on these. The compactness of this keyboard is stellar.

Thanks. And welcome to GH btw, you spent your first post in here.

Offline kenmai9

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #31 on: Thu, 06 June 2013, 12:11:23 »
Would you suggest the Poker 2 or Pure Pro? Or pure? I'm looking for a 60% board

Offline mashby

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #32 on: Thu, 06 June 2013, 14:41:49 »
Would you suggest the Poker 2 or Pure Pro? Or pure? I'm looking for a 60% board

How important are dedicated arrow keys? If you don't need them, then the Poker II is nice. If you do like dedicated arrow keys, then I'd recommend the Tex Beetle over the Pure.

Offline kenmai9

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #33 on: Thu, 06 June 2013, 14:51:59 »
Would you suggest the Poker 2 or Pure Pro? Or pure? I'm looking for a 60% board

How important are dedicated arrow keys? If you don't need them, then the Poker II is nice. If you do like dedicated arrow keys, then I'd recommend the Tex Beetle over the Pure.

I do like arrow keys, hopefully I'll get used to the fn+wasd lol. I ordered the Poker 2 because of its size, looks, plate, and keycap compatibility. I did a lot of research before buying, and I think I will be happy with it. I kind of want it as a portable work keyboard.

Thanks for the review, WFD, it was very helpful. Although I do have one question: What is the space bar mount like? Is it just standard? I couldn't find any pictures of it.


Offline cactux

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #34 on: Thu, 06 June 2013, 16:59:39 »
How do you remap the keys?
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Offline SmallFry

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #35 on: Thu, 06 June 2013, 17:14:17 »
Holy Sweet Mother of God. Cactux came out of the classifieds.
In any case, the manual is linked here.

Offline cactux

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #36 on: Thu, 06 June 2013, 17:20:55 »
I am allow to interact with the outside world once every full mon.

Thx

Holy Sweet Mother of God. Cactux came out of the classifieds.
In any case, the manual is linked here.
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Offline SmallFry

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #37 on: Thu, 06 June 2013, 19:15:09 »
I know, tis just been a while. :)

Offline POFFINGTON

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #38 on: Thu, 06 June 2013, 23:54:32 »
How programable is the PMODE? Is it mainly for the LEDs or can your reconfigure the whole function set ups?
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Offline iAmAhab

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #39 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 09:16:41 »
You can not alter the stock function layer, but you can program a second layer that is reachable via the Pn button. Read the manual for details.

Offline mashby

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #40 on: Wed, 12 June 2013, 16:52:33 »
WFD -- Sorry if I missed this earlier, but are the mount points the same as the original Pure? Or, the same as the original Poker X with the exception of the added mount point in the center of the board?

Offline TimIsABat

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #41 on: Sat, 15 June 2013, 01:40:45 »
Hmmm now I wonder if I should get this Poker II or Poker. The only difference for me at the moment is that I could only find the Poker X with reds, but I can get the Poker II with reds and brown. I guess I just gotta wait till I get my WASD sampler so I can test to see which I would probably like more. It really is just a matter of is it worth the extra money for the Poker II vs. the Poker X.
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Offline WhiteFireDragon

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #42 on: Sun, 16 June 2013, 00:47:25 »
WFD -- Sorry if I missed this earlier, but are the mount points the same as the original Pure? Or, the same as the original Poker X with the exception of the added mount point in the center of the board?

Pure and Poker have the mounting the same positions. So basically since this Poker II has the the additional standoff in the middle of the G and H keys, it's the same as the Pure mounting now.


It really is just a matter of is it worth the extra money for the Poker II vs. the Poker X.

I believe they're at the same price points. At least that's how much I paid for a new Poker I and Poker II. I'd say the improvements on these new poker are worth the small price difference.

Offline PointyFox

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #43 on: Sun, 16 June 2013, 01:09:27 »
The F, G, and H keys has time delay for the function layer: 15ms, 100ms, and 500ms. I noticed this, but didn't realize what it was for until looking at the manual. Anyone know why this would be a useful feature?


thanks for the in-depth. This might be my next keyboard since I'd like a portable.
Really great review! I love the Image quality on these. The compactness of this keyboard is stellar.

Thanks. And welcome to GH btw, you spent your first post in here.

I think those set time delays between programmed keystrokes.  You can use multiples of them to make the time longer.  It's useful for when you need a delay between actions, such as if you have to wait for something, like an internet page to load.

Offline G.C.W.

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #44 on: Sun, 16 June 2013, 05:59:57 »
Poker X also has an arrow cluster on WASD if you press down FN.

What you meant in your (quite good) review is the X's lockable arrow cluster on SHIFT,CTRL,APP,WIN.

Offline TimIsABat

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #45 on: Sun, 16 June 2013, 21:00:49 »
WFD -- Sorry if I missed this earlier, but are the mount points the same as the original Pure? Or, the same as the original Poker X with the exception of the added mount point in the center of the board?

Pure and Poker have the mounting the same positions. So basically since this Poker II has the the additional standoff in the middle of the G and H keys, it's the same as the Pure mounting now.


It really is just a matter of is it worth the extra money for the Poker II vs. the Poker X.

I believe they're at the same price points. At least that's how much I paid for a new Poker I and Poker II. I'd say the improvements on these new poker are worth the small price difference.

I ended up getting the Poker X with MX Reds (like my FC660M but whatever). Saved me about 20 bucks instead of getting a Poker II with MX Browns or Reds plus saving receiving it like a week or more later since it is coming from China. Just going to look forward to getting an aluminum case for the Poker X in the future. I will probably get MX Blues or Browns for my next keyboard with a Poker II in the future.
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Offline pichu23

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #46 on: Wed, 19 June 2013, 18:38:11 »
Cancelled my Poker 2 order.
I'm not too sure if it's worth comparing with the upcoming Ducky Shine Mini.
Comparing both, I know Poker 2 is mod-able to get the leds.
But overall, Ducky's build and all should be better than Poker 2 eh ?
Anyone can shine some light on this matter ?
Thanks
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Offline iAmAhab

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Re: Poker II review
« Reply #47 on: Thu, 20 June 2013, 12:55:44 »
Was under the impression that the duck mini is basically a rebranded poker 2 with full backlighting. So I'm guessing build quality will be identical. 

Offline CPTBadAss

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    • Tactile Zine
Re: Poker II review
« Reply #48 on: Thu, 20 June 2013, 13:02:14 »
Cancelled my Poker 2 order.
I'm not too sure if it's worth comparing with the upcoming Ducky Shine Mini.
Comparing both, I know Poker 2 is mod-able to get the leds.
But overall, Ducky's build and all should be better than Poker 2 eh ?
Anyone can shine some light on this matter ?
Thanks

According to the information posted so far, the Poker 2 will have a variant with full backlighting. So if it's programmable, has a fully backlit option, and PBT caps, I'd say the Poker 2 is the better buy.

Offline dante

  • Posts: 2553
Re: Poker II review
« Reply #49 on: Thu, 20 June 2013, 15:39:47 »
If you sell a keyboard with pad printed keys you need to be run out of business.