Kishsaver Club

[Parak]

I gave up on the spacers.  The case is still tight without them and I have not noticed any problems.  I think they mainly serve to line up the keyboard assembly with the case when you screw them together, but it seems the keyboard will be fine without them.  The assembled keyboard is still tight and sturdy during use without the spacers.

The spacers are actually there to make sure that there isn't too much pressure on the top plate. If you notice, the curve of the case actually presses into the top plate as it's screwed in, so there's a risk of damage to barrels or pcb if it's screwed down too much.

[vivalarevolución]

I gave up on the spacers.  The case is still tight without them and I have not noticed any problems.  I think they mainly serve to line up the keyboard assembly with the case when you screw them together, but it seems the keyboard will be fine without them.  The assembled keyboard is still tight and sturdy during use without the spacers.

The spacers are actually there to make sure that there isn't too much pressure on the top plate. If you notice, the curve of the case actually presses into the top plate as it's screwed in, so there's a risk of damage to barrels or pcb if it's screwed down too much.

Interesting.  I may fashion some sort of temporary replacement with some firm foam in the meantime just as a precautionary measure.

[riotonthebay]

Okay, now I need to convert this to HHKB layout. Things that need to change:

split left shift => full size
full size right shift => short right shfit + fn
split enter => full size
backspace => split

I believe all this is possible but I don't know how to get started. Can someone point me towards a good resource?

[jwaz]

So I got around to stripping the paint off my Kishsaver, sanding it down, and spraying on a clearcoat.  I probably will keep this bare metal look, even with some of deep scratches from the paint chipper and wire brush that I did not bother to remove.  It will match all my kitchen appliances:

(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link)

Looking good, I'm doing the same thing. But I'm going to try to sand it in one direction to get that brushed metal look.

ermahgerd you guys quit copying my idea.

If only I wasn't so lazy. 

[CPTBadAss]

I believe all this is possible but I don't know how to get started. Can someone point me towards a good resource?

Step 1) Unscrew the screws to separate the the case halves.
Step 2) Remove the back and unscrew the 4 screws holding the plate/hammers/caps to the top of the case
Step 3) Remove the screw holding on the PCBs at the top
Step 4) Carefully bend the tab near the screw that holds in the PCB
Step 5) Remove the plate/hammers/caps assembly

From here it's a bit tricky. I couldn't remove the plate from the assembly without a hammer so I couldn't do what phosphorglow shows in his video. He removes the plate then tapes the hammers on a piece of tape, one per row, so the hammers don't all fall out. I did it the hard way. Put the assembly on the side, got the plate off, then all the hammers fell out and it was a PITA to reseat them all. You can try putting the assembly face down, removing the plate, and then taping the hammers them pulling them out. Watch his video if you're not sure what I'm talking about.

Once the plate is removed, you can move the hammers around to accomidate the layout you would like. When you're done, do everything in reverse. It's not too hard. If you don't drop all the hammers out, it's a fairly quick mod.

If you have more questions, I can take pictures.

[Puddsy]

seriously, don't let the hammers drop

[riotonthebay]

I believe all this is possible but I don't know how to get started. Can someone point me towards a good resource?

Step 1) Unscrew the screws to separate the the case halves.
Step 2) Remove the back and unscrew the 4 screws holding the plate/hammers/caps to the top of the case
Step 3) Remove the screw holding on the PCBs at the top
Step 4) Carefully bend the tab near the screw that holds in the PCB
Step 5) Remove the plate/hammers/caps assembly

From here it's a bit tricky. I couldn't remove the plate from the assembly without a hammer so I couldn't do what phosphorglow shows in his video. He removes the plate then tapes the hammers on a piece of tape, one per row, so the hammers don't all fall out. I did it the hard way. Put the assembly on the side, got the plate off, then all the hammers fell out and it was a PITA to reseat them all. You can try putting the assembly face down, removing the plate, and then taping the hammers them pulling them out. Watch his video if you're not sure what I'm talking about.

Once the plate is removed, you can move the hammers around to accomidate the layout you would like. When you're done, do everything in reverse. It's not too hard. If you don't drop all the hammers out, it's a fairly quick mod.

If you have more questions, I can take pictures.

So, to summarize: Don't drop the hammers. Move some of the around.

Got it

[CPTBadAss]

I spent....three nights(?) trying to reseat those ****ing hammers 'cause i'm a klutz . IT'S VERY IMPORTANT, NO DROPPING HAMMERS. I recommending trying to do it phosphorglow style to save yourself the frustration.

So, to summarize: Don't drop the hammers. Move some of the around.

Got it

Yup, you got it.

[hwood34]

This is a club I need to be a part of

[MTManiac]

I believe all this is possible but I don't know how to get started. Can someone point me towards a good resource?

Step 1) Unscrew the screws to separate the the case halves.
Step 2) Remove the back and unscrew the 4 screws holding the plate/hammers/caps to the top of the case
Step 3) Remove the screw holding on the PCBs at the top
Step 4) Carefully bend the tab near the screw that holds in the PCB
Step 5) Remove the plate/hammers/caps assembly

From here it's a bit tricky. I couldn't remove the plate from the assembly without a hammer so I couldn't do what phosphorglow shows in his video. He removes the plate then tapes the hammers on a piece of tape, one per row, so the hammers don't all fall out. I did it the hard way. Put the assembly on the side, got the plate off, then all the hammers fell out and it was a PITA to reseat them all. You can try putting the assembly face down, removing the plate, and then taping the hammers them pulling them out. Watch his video if you're not sure what I'm talking about.

Once the plate is removed, you can move the hammers around to accomidate the layout you would like. When you're done, do everything in reverse. It's not too hard. If you don't drop all the hammers out, it's a fairly quick mod.

If you have more questions, I can take pictures.

I don't want to let the hammer drop let alone multiple hammers?!? where do I find this video?

[sleepy916]

So I got around to stripping the paint off my Kishsaver, sanding it down, and spraying on a clearcoat.  I probably will keep this bare metal look, even with some of deep scratches from the paint chipper and wire brush that I did not bother to remove.  It will match all my kitchen appliances:

(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link)

Looking good, I'm doing the same thing. But I'm going to try to sand it in one direction to get that brushed metal look.

ermahgerd you guys quit copying my idea.

If only I wasn't so lazy. 

That is why you bought me a drink! to steal my kish ideas..  )

[HoffmanMyster]

I believe all this is possible but I don't know how to get started. Can someone point me towards a good resource?

Step 1) Unscrew the screws to separate the the case halves.
Step 2) Remove the back and unscrew the 4 screws holding the plate/hammers/caps to the top of the case
Step 3) Remove the screw holding on the PCBs at the top
Step 4) Carefully bend the tab near the screw that holds in the PCB
Step 5) Remove the plate/hammers/caps assembly

From here it's a bit tricky. I couldn't remove the plate from the assembly without a hammer so I couldn't do what phosphorglow shows in his video. He removes the plate then tapes the hammers on a piece of tape, one per row, so the hammers don't all fall out. I did it the hard way. Put the assembly on the side, got the plate off, then all the hammers fell out and it was a PITA to reseat them all. You can try putting the assembly face down, removing the plate, and then taping the hammers them pulling them out. Watch his video if you're not sure what I'm talking about.

Once the plate is removed, you can move the hammers around to accomidate the layout you would like. When you're done, do everything in reverse. It's not too hard. If you don't drop all the hammers out, it's a fairly quick mod.

If you have more questions, I can take pictures.

So, to summarize: Don't drop the hammers. Move some of the around.

Got it

TBH, I modified my layout (removed a few hammers and did something similar to what you're doing - turned it into a more standard layout), and it was actually quite simple.  If you just remember to always keep it upside down so you don't lose hammers you should be good. 

Actually, I'll be taking mine apart soon to clean glass shards out of it, so if you think you would benefit from a video I'd be happy to put something together.

[riotonthebay]

I believe all this is possible but I don't know how to get started. Can someone point me towards a good resource?

Step 1) Unscrew the screws to separate the the case halves.
Step 2) Remove the back and unscrew the 4 screws holding the plate/hammers/caps to the top of the case
Step 3) Remove the screw holding on the PCBs at the top
Step 4) Carefully bend the tab near the screw that holds in the PCB
Step 5) Remove the plate/hammers/caps assembly

From here it's a bit tricky. I couldn't remove the plate from the assembly without a hammer so I couldn't do what phosphorglow shows in his video. He removes the plate then tapes the hammers on a piece of tape, one per row, so the hammers don't all fall out. I did it the hard way. Put the assembly on the side, got the plate off, then all the hammers fell out and it was a PITA to reseat them all. You can try putting the assembly face down, removing the plate, and then taping the hammers them pulling them out. Watch his video if you're not sure what I'm talking about.

Once the plate is removed, you can move the hammers around to accomidate the layout you would like. When you're done, do everything in reverse. It's not too hard. If you don't drop all the hammers out, it's a fairly quick mod.

If you have more questions, I can take pictures.

So, to summarize: Don't drop the hammers. Move some of the around.

Got it

TBH, I modified my layout (removed a few hammers and did something similar to what you're doing - turned it into a more standard layout), and it was actually quite simple.  If you just remember to always keep it upside down so you don't lose hammers you should be good. 

Actually, I'll be taking mine apart soon to clean glass shards out of it, so if you think you would benefit from a video I'd be happy to put something together.

I actually did it earlier today and it wasn't so bad . I just gave everything a thorough cleaning. Some of the hammers aren't seated quite right and don't click correctly though, but I'll fix that when I take it apart again to install my controller when it arrives.

[HoffmanMyster]

I believe all this is possible but I don't know how to get started. Can someone point me towards a good resource?

Step 1) Unscrew the screws to separate the the case halves.
Step 2) Remove the back and unscrew the 4 screws holding the plate/hammers/caps to the top of the case
Step 3) Remove the screw holding on the PCBs at the top
Step 4) Carefully bend the tab near the screw that holds in the PCB
Step 5) Remove the plate/hammers/caps assembly

From here it's a bit tricky. I couldn't remove the plate from the assembly without a hammer so I couldn't do what phosphorglow shows in his video. He removes the plate then tapes the hammers on a piece of tape, one per row, so the hammers don't all fall out. I did it the hard way. Put the assembly on the side, got the plate off, then all the hammers fell out and it was a PITA to reseat them all. You can try putting the assembly face down, removing the plate, and then taping the hammers them pulling them out. Watch his video if you're not sure what I'm talking about.

Once the plate is removed, you can move the hammers around to accomidate the layout you would like. When you're done, do everything in reverse. It's not too hard. If you don't drop all the hammers out, it's a fairly quick mod.

If you have more questions, I can take pictures.

So, to summarize: Don't drop the hammers. Move some of the around.

Got it

TBH, I modified my layout (removed a few hammers and did something similar to what you're doing - turned it into a more standard layout), and it was actually quite simple.  If you just remember to always keep it upside down so you don't lose hammers you should be good. 

Actually, I'll be taking mine apart soon to clean glass shards out of it, so if you think you would benefit from a video I'd be happy to put something together.

I actually did it earlier today and it wasn't so bad . I just gave everything a thorough cleaning. Some of the hammers aren't seated quite right and don't click correctly though, but I'll fix that when I take it apart again to install my controller when it arrives.

Oh, nice.    Also, you probably already realized this, but just in case not: I had a bunch of trouble getting the caps to seat on the springs properly.  I basically had to have the board propped up at a 90 degree angle, on its back, to get the springs to "relax" so as to allow me to put the caps on the right way.  Without doing that, they wouldn't click, or really work at all.  Maybe that's causing it?  If not, then yeah you'll have to re-seat them. 

[riotonthebay]

More

I believe all this is possible but I don't know how to get started. Can someone point me towards a good resource?

Step 1) Unscrew the screws to separate the the case halves.
Step 2) Remove the back and unscrew the 4 screws holding the plate/hammers/caps to the top of the case
Step 3) Remove the screw holding on the PCBs at the top
Step 4) Carefully bend the tab near the screw that holds in the PCB
Step 5) Remove the plate/hammers/caps assembly

From here it's a bit tricky. I couldn't remove the plate from the assembly without a hammer so I couldn't do what phosphorglow shows in his video. He removes the plate then tapes the hammers on a piece of tape, one per row, so the hammers don't all fall out. I did it the hard way. Put the assembly on the side, got the plate off, then all the hammers fell out and it was a PITA to reseat them all. You can try putting the assembly face down, removing the plate, and then taping the hammers them pulling them out. Watch his video if you're not sure what I'm talking about.

Once the plate is removed, you can move the hammers around to accomidate the layout you would like. When you're done, do everything in reverse. It's not too hard. If you don't drop all the hammers out, it's a fairly quick mod.

If you have more questions, I can take pictures.

So, to summarize: Don't drop the hammers. Move some of the around.

Got it

TBH, I modified my layout (removed a few hammers and did something similar to what you're doing - turned it into a more standard layout), and it was actually quite simple.  If you just remember to always keep it upside down so you don't lose hammers you should be good. 

Actually, I'll be taking mine apart soon to clean glass shards out of it, so if you think you would benefit from a video I'd be happy to put something together.

I actually did it earlier today and it wasn't so bad . I just gave everything a thorough cleaning. Some of the hammers aren't seated quite right and don't click correctly though, but I'll fix that when I take it apart again to install my controller when it arrives.

Oh, nice.    Also, you probably already realized this, but just in case not: I had a bunch of trouble getting the caps to seat on the springs properly.  I basically had to have the board propped up at a 90 degree angle, on its back, to get the springs to "relax" so as to allow me to put the caps on the right way.  Without doing that, they wouldn't click, or really work at all.  Maybe that's causing it?  If not, then yeah you'll have to re-seat them. 

I appreciate the tips . I happened to know that one already and I think that the hammers aren't seated quite right, but I'll make sure first.

[hwood34]

So much did you guys have to shell out for yours?

[HoffmanMyster]

So much did you guys have to shell out for yours?

I think it was on the order of $130 to get the board sent to CPTBadAss, and then another $17 or so from him to me.  But the first number (the important one, I know    ) is a guess as I can't find the paypal transaction to confirm it.   

[hwood34]

So much did you guys have to shell out for yours?

I think it was on the order of $130 to get the board sent to CPTBadAss, and then another $17 or so from him to me.  But the first number (the important one, I know    ) is a guess as I can't find the paypal transaction to confirm it.   

Wow that's not even that bad 

[HPE1000]

So much did you guys have to shell out for yours?

I think it was on the order of $130 to get the board sent to CPTBadAss, and then another $17 or so from him to me.  But the first number (the important one, I know    ) is a guess as I can't find the paypal transaction to confirm it.   

Wow that's not even that bad 

It's a bit painful after you figure in powder coating, new keycaps, and a controller for it. 
 
Although I doubt everyone is going to powder coat theirs as well as replace the keycaps.

[hwood34]

So much did you guys have to shell out for yours?

I think it was on the order of $130 to get the board sent to CPTBadAss, and then another $17 or so from him to me.  But the first number (the important one, I know    ) is a guess as I can't find the paypal transaction to confirm it.   

Wow that's not even that bad 

It's a bit painful after you figure in powder coating, new keycaps, and a controller for it. 
 
Although I doubt everyone is going to powder coat theirs as well as replace the keycaps.

Yeah, a Kishsaver would definitely be an "all in" project.

[CPTBadAss]

So much did you guys have to shell out for yours?

I think it was on the order of $130 to get the board sent to CPTBadAss, and then another $17 or so from him to me.  But the first number (the important one, I know    ) is a guess as I can't find the paypal transaction to confirm it.   

It was $84 for the board and $36.50 for shipping from HK. Then $17.30 for shipping within CONUS from me to the buyer.


This is the phosphorglow video I was referring to.

[hwood34]

So much did you guys have to shell out for yours?

I think it was on the order of $130 to get the board sent to CPTBadAss, and then another $17 or so from him to me.  But the first number (the important one, I know    ) is a guess as I can't find the paypal transaction to confirm it.   

It was $84 for the board and $36.50 for shipping from HK. Then $17.30 for shipping within CONUS from me to the buyer.

Even better

[Techno Trousers]

I think the important thing about the price is that these are a precious resource with a miniscule supply. I had to spend over $200 for mine a couple of months ago, but I still feel lucky to have gotten one since I missed out on the original GB. It's not like there will ever be more of these made.

Personally, I value mine much more than I would any Korean custom.

[newchemicals]

So I got around to stripping the paint off my Kishsaver, sanding it down, and spraying on a clearcoat.  I probably will keep this bare metal look, even with some of deep scratches from the paint chipper and wire brush that I did not bother to remove.  It will match all my kitchen appliances:

(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link)

Now that is how I would like my keyboard to look like. Very sweet looking prdlm. 

[phosphorglow]

So I got around to stripping the paint off my Kishsaver, sanding it down, and spraying on a clearcoat.  I probably will keep this bare metal look, even with some of deep scratches from the paint chipper and wire brush that I did not bother to remove.  It will match all my kitchen appliances:

(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link)

That is absolutely gorgeous!!!

[riotonthebay]

Potato, toe for scale

[mashby]

Very clean riotonthebay. Nicely done sir!

[riotonthebay]

Thanks mashby

There's a few things that need to be changed/fixed still:
- The flippers on 8* and a need to be replaced.
- The right shift is sitting funny. Not totally sure what to do to fix that.
- I'm also not entirely sure how the spacebar is supposed to be stabilized. The wire is thicker than can fit in the inserts that are already in the plate – are other people making their own inserts or doing something else entirely?
- Unicomp's dyesub QC is really bad. I ordered an APL set and one of the 1.5u Alt and 1.5u Ctrl were aligned very poorly. I asked for replacements, specifying '1.5unit "Alt" from APL set' and '1.5unit "Ctrl" from APL set' and I received the Option/Alt key pictured and a "Control" key :|. Also the alignment on the Ctrl in the caps lock position is messed up.

All that said, I'm typing on a living dinosaur

[vivalarevolución]

Thanks mashby

There's a few things that need to be changed/fixed still:
- The flippers on 8* and a need to be replaced.
- The right shift is sitting funny. Not totally sure what to do to fix that.
- I'm also not entirely sure how the spacebar is supposed to be stabilized. The wire is thicker than can fit in the inserts that are already in the plate – are other people making their own inserts or doing something else entirely?
- Unicomp's dyesub QC is really bad. I ordered an APL set and one of the 1.5u Alt and 1.5u Ctrl were aligned very poorly. I asked for replacements, specifying '1.5unit "Alt" from APL set' and '1.5unit "Ctrl" from APL set' and I received the Option/Alt key pictured and a "Control" key :|. Also the alignment on the Ctrl in the caps lock position is messed up.

All that said, I'm typing on a living dinosaur

I believe this thread has some information on how to make custom wire atabilizers for the Model F.  Wcass made a bunch for Kishsaver owners.  He com led some thin wire with metal tubing so a Model M spacebar could work with Model F inserts.

[wcass]

...
- The right shift is sitting funny. Not totally sure what to do to fix that.

If you re-used the insert that came from an ISO Enter or num pad Enter, then you are using a vertical insert (hole is off center) - you want to use a horizontal insert (hole is on center).

- I'm also not entirely sure how the spacebar is supposed to be stabilized. The wire is thicker than can fit in the inserts that are already in the plate – are other people making their own inserts or doing something else entirely?

That sounds like you got a Model M space bar; these need a stabilizer wire replacement to function properly. At least one other KS came with an M space bar, so you are not alone. I'm out of stainless steel tubing at the moment, but will get some the next time I order from McMaster. PM me your address and i will send one to you.

- Unicomp's dyesub QC is really bad. I ordered an APL set and one of the 1.5u Alt and 1.5u Ctrl were aligned very poorly. I asked for replacements, specifying '1.5unit "Alt" from APL set' and '1.5unit "Ctrl" from APL set' and I received the Option/Alt key pictured and a "Control" key :|

APL != Apple

[rowdy]

Potato, toe for scale

Show Image

Call me strange, but I prefer the full touch keys, like Alt and Ctrl.  Exception permitted for Caps Lock, except you have Ctrl on there, ;D

[vivalarevolución]

Potato, toe for scale

Show Image

Call me strange, but I prefer the full touch keys, like Alt and Ctrl.  Exception permitted for Caps Lock, except you have Ctrl on there, ;D

You're strange.

[sleepy916]

Just the top half, it still needs some work. The bottom half still has a lot of spaces I need to get to.


From this:


To this:

[HPE1000]

I just need to get some of those little white plastic stabilizer inserts so I can assemble the board first(To make it ansi). It's all apart and I don't want anything to happen to it. Then I need the converter as well ;_;

Has anyone ordered a pack of 3 PCBs from oshpark yet?

[mashby]

Just the top half, it still needs some work. The bottom half still has a lot of spaces I need to get to.


From this:

Show Image

To this:

Show Image

Looks great Sleepy! What did you use to remove the paint?

[sleepy916]

Just the top half, it still needs some work. The bottom half still has a lot of spaces I need to get to.


From this:

Show Image

To this:

Show Image

Looks great Sleepy! What did you use to remove the paint?

I used this, it has worked really well.

[vivalarevolución]

Just the top half, it still needs some work. The bottom half still has a lot of spaces I need to get to.


From this:

Show Image

To this:

Show Image

Looks great Sleepy! What did you use to remove the paint?

I used this, it has worked really well.

Show Image

Did you use any other tools to remove the paint, like a paint scraper and such? 

[sleepy916]

Just the top half, it still needs some work. The bottom half still has a lot of spaces I need to get to.


From this:

Show Image

To this:

Show Image

Looks great Sleepy! What did you use to remove the paint?

I used this, it has worked really well.

Show Image

Did you use any other tools to remove the paint, like a paint scraper and such?

After you spray the paint remover, the paint gets a bubbly and is easy to remove. But I used an old box cutter to scrape off the paint. It didn't scratch the metal too much. I used the right end piece in the picture where it is rounded. I'm sure you can use pretty much anything, the paint comes off really easy.

[mashby]

I was planning on using my Skrapr, but I think I'll try and find a metal putty knife instead. Don't know that the Skrapr would survive the chemicals.

[MTManiac]

Just the top half, it still needs some work. The bottom half still has a lot of spaces I need to get to.


From this:

Show Image

To this:

Show Image

Looks great Sleepy! What did you use to remove the paint?

I used this, it has worked really well.

Show Image

That is freaking awesome!

I knew there had to be an easier way than sanding the poor bugger!

(I'm totally adding this to my shopping list)

[snoopy]

just have to post this pic also here 

[Techno Trousers]

You got two! And going for the Darth Vader look? Do you have white on black caps to complete it?

[snoopy]

You got two! And going for the Darth Vader look? Do you have white on black caps to complete it?

one will become blank black keycaps... the other one... i don't know yet.

btw, it looks black on the pics. But it is a dark grey.

[dustinhxc]

Potato, toe for scale

Show Image

Pretty sure this is the cleanest case I've ever seen very nice bro!

[JPG]

just have to post this pic also here 

(Attachment Link)

Just WOW!

[CPTBadAss]

just have to post this pic also here 

(Attachment Link)

Sexy time. Looking forward to the final product. You've got a nice BS Clack collection too for that little extra touch on top of the case and whatever keycaps you use .

[MTManiac]

hmmm you make me want to take mine down to a local powder coating shop...
wonder if they have jdcarpurple 

[vivalarevolución]

Just the top half, it still needs some work. The bottom half still has a lot of spaces I need to get to.


From this:

Show Image

To this:

Show Image

Looks great Sleepy! What did you use to remove the paint?

I used this, it has worked really well.

Show Image

Did you use any other tools to remove the paint, like a paint scraper and such?

After you spray the paint remover, the paint gets a bubbly and is easy to remove. But I used an old box cutter to scrape off the paint. It didn't scratch the metal too much. I used the right end piece in the picture where it is rounded. I'm sure you can use pretty much anything, the paint comes off really easy.

Show Image

Awesome.  The paint remover and scraper that I used required a lot of elbow grease, and I wondered  how you were able to remove the paint so cleanly without any deep scratches.

[vivalarevolución]

just have to post this pic also here 

(Attachment Link)

Gorgeous.

[HPE1000]

Ok, I am probably going to throw in an order to unicomp in the next few days to get keycaps for this thing. I am converting it to a standard layout and I was wondering, how many little stabilizer inserts am I going to need in total?

I am ordering the following items, tell me if I am grabbing the right stuff.

101 Pearl/Pebble Set
Large Pearl Spacebar
2 Unprinted Pebble 1x Keys