geekhack

geekhack Marketplace => Interest Checks => Topic started by: paulgali on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:54:09

Title: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: paulgali on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:54:09
Introducing Ζήνων (Zeno)

Named as such after the greek philosopher. He has an interesting paradox, go check it out.
Or Baulice, since you all wont stop calling it that.


Having used ergos as my daily driver for a while, I wanted to give a go at my own implementation, with some different takes on mounting and a flatter tilt in the alphas.
The idea behind this was to get a significantly softer typing feel that I have yet to feel in ergos that are not using half plates. Maybe I have missed out on them :(
This is a concept / very early proto. Given the feedback received at the recent Dubai meetup, I thought why not share it now.

(https://imgur.com/BFxaHm1.png)

Before filling out the form, please note, the layout of the board has been altered from the above image. See below for more
IC FORM (https://forms.gle/FXLQLt4KBUPCHcE98)


Specs

- 8 degree board with 7 degree tilt on alphas
- Adjusted front height of 18.746 mm (see below, measured from the control key area, not spacebars as that would be a useless measurement)
- 7.8mm plate to top case clearance
- MX only compat for now - working on alps plates
- Alu 5052 or black Pom plates
- Brass Inside! Internal brass sheets under the alphas. I don't want this to be a heavy board
- Burger mounted with TX tape, or isolated gummy strips. Gummy mounting typically being found on boards such as the unikorn are in development on the 2nd prototype
- 1365g with current build (POM plate)


Layout
I initially made this with winkey on the left only, as this is the ideal layout for my use case.
Since then, I have changed the bottom row to mirror the left hand on the right side of the split.

(https://imgur.com/dKmsnlo.png)

A quick look at mounting. The options are either burger mounting, or HOTDOG MOUNT (using silicon orings under each of the tab areas under the plate) - akin to the F1. In this case, the plate is fully isolated.

(https://imgur.com/oUaW7jN.png)

And the internal weight structure, positioned below the alphas as much as possible.

(https://imgur.com/KrNKJ4N.png)

Adjusted front height. Add 0.75 to include bumpons.

(https://imgur.com/T55o3uL.png)

Proto v1

Let me be clear - I am not happy with the anodizing; the color shift under lighting is too much for me, and whilst this is VERY smooth (180 grit), it's too reflective.
This is just an initial prototype, and I expect a few more to come down the line.
Seams are exaggerated here because I did the force break mod with something a little too thick, all a part of testing  :D
Potato pics. I forgot how to use a camera :(

----------

Pictured with GMK Burgundy. v1 had the giant right blocker, so consider that changed by the time the new version is here.

(https://imgur.com/voZ22Bp.png)

Its a light board. I consider portability an important factor.

(https://imgur.com/nSrwdOF.png)

Side profile. Considering a few changes here, but I'm happy with how it turned out.

(https://imgur.com/TF8RRIx.png)

You know me, and discreet engravings :)

(https://imgur.com/BvkpPUO.png)

Showcasing the alternative mounting, isolating the plate with gummy strips. The silicon tape on top prevents any lateral plate movement once assembled

(https://imgur.com/Dhg6HHX.png)

Proto v2

Order placed.

Current Updates

- USB moved to alpha-central alignment (previously board central)
- Added 1u r-win key to the right side
- Increased stab clearance on the spacebars due to low front height causing conflicts
- Updated PCB files with new layout
- Moved JST to improve ease of building
- Alignment pillars updated
- Plate modifications (for alu plates only)
- X-ring testing as an alternative
- New PCB firmware push to QMK (+ via and vial)
- New anodizer testing
- New special coating being tested (an alternative finishing option I may consider for this)

Soundtests

Take soundtests with a grain of salt. Recorded with an Oktava MK0-12 + HC capsule, placed at head height.

- Gateron CJs, lubed with 3204 and using tx55m springs
- Pom Plate, in burger mount
- Sussy c3 stabs - but they work
- GMK Yuru


Another soundtest with an alu plate will come when I have rebuilt that assembly ;)

Pricing / Vendors / Unit allocation

I'm changing factories - again. I will keep working until I am satisfied with the product and so I can't give a price just yet.

Credits

Maelk and Cipulot - guiding me through pcb work. Yes, I made the pcb on twitch, and these two were a godsend!
The MENA community - you all tried this at the meetup, and I appreciate the valuable feedback. You have been heard!
Boat enjoyers (smh my head) - you know who you are, thank you for the constant encouragement <3
Alessio - for the hotdogs


Discord (https://discord.com/invite/v2sWm88)


Support this project by adding this to your signature <3
Code: [Select]
[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=117695.0][img width=210  height=120]https://imgur.com/Ikog95k.png[/img][/url]
(https://imgur.com/Ikog95k.png)

Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: paulgali on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:54:21
Reserved for hotdog mounts and memes

BOI that new anodization can't come fast enough

2022/07/09: Interested to know what you think about the sides though, i was considering "softening" the curve.
More
(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/895720731323797564/995313797692653669/unknown.png?width=797&height=289)
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: of_sam on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:55:39
I love Sandlice.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: plag on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:57:07
Cool AND good
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: elvenmonster on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:57:18
Baulice my beloved
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Bachoo on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:57:26
Soooooo ****ing lit
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Dumbass on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:58:22
Certified banger
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Hetpet on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:58:38
nice
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: whirlwind on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:58:49
Baulice my beloved
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Fe on Tue, 05 July 2022, 08:59:07
good
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Pyroo on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:01:57
YEAAAAAAAAAAAA
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: $W4GK!NG on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:04:35
Love you and your stuff man
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: rookb on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:06:04
Board looks good, not the biggest fan of the bottom row, glwic baul
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: spedywin on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:06:28
lit
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: The0rigina1 on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:15:24
Weight avail?
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: clickpig on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:16:55
blessed baulice
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: chorb on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:17:44
Board looks good, not the biggest fan of the bottom row, glwic baul
If you read the IC you'd know that it was changed roo keyboard.  :thumb:

Another good looking and sounding board from you baul, GLWIC!
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: KeyBros_ on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:46:03
Cool asf
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Detrimend on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:55:05
Very interested to see how this project progresses, i really like the practical approach you seem to have taken rather than completely sacrificing the experience for aesthetics - strikes a nice balance!
Love the understated look regardless of finish quality on the first proto, super clean :cool: also gib baul 60% now hehe

Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: unusuaL_ on Tue, 05 July 2022, 09:58:03
so naice, 180 grit must feel good to the touch, certainly looks the part.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: rookb on Tue, 05 July 2022, 10:16:20
Board looks good, not the biggest fan of the bottom row, glwic baul
If you read the IC you'd know that it was changed roo keyboard.  :thumb:

Another good looking and sounding board from you baul, GLWIC!

Yes, and I still dont like it? not a fan of the 1us.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: chorb on Tue, 05 July 2022, 10:52:34
Board looks good, not the biggest fan of the bottom row, glwic baul
If you read the IC you'd know that it was changed roo keyboard.  :thumb:

Another good looking and sounding board from you baul, GLWIC!

Yes, and I still dont like it? not a fan of the 1us.

[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: beelzking on Tue, 05 July 2022, 11:09:39
Nice Baulice, personally I'm not too fond of the extra 3 keys usually offer on regular alice, so this is a good take on alice without those extra keys IMO.

GLWIC
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: MK47 on Tue, 05 July 2022, 11:15:58
Lit. I want one
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: ankit on Tue, 05 July 2022, 11:46:24
Another banger baul board, what is there to say? Sick mounting, sick layout, and looks fantastic.
GLWIC, love ya dude.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: kyuut on Tue, 05 July 2022, 11:51:00
i love beats by baul
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: linell on Tue, 05 July 2022, 12:37:16
strange looking boat but I love it!
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: pepperfez on Tue, 05 July 2022, 12:56:20
I love the look of this board, but I'm worried it'll never actually arrive.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: niicao on Tue, 05 July 2022, 13:05:50
everytime i see paul posts an ic, i get excited cause i know theres something fcking amazing on the horizon
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: puggo69 on Tue, 05 July 2022, 14:12:02
i love you paul
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: paulgali on Tue, 05 July 2022, 14:17:33
I love the look of this board, but I'm worried it'll never actually arrive.
V2 already ordered, so I assume next month I'll receive it  :thumb: I'll be able to give clearer details when that happens
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: jendall on Tue, 05 July 2022, 16:03:25
First the Safa and now this? Hell yeah, count me in for another board by baul. Love the bottom row and the lack of the 3-key nav cluster.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: mr_foggy on Tue, 05 July 2022, 16:58:42
portability good. will keep an eye on this.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Rob27shred on Tue, 05 July 2022, 18:58:57
Very nice, fixes the couple small issues I have with my Meridian (which has been my DD for months till I got my Babylon), the 1.25u mods on the bottom row & stiffer top mount. Definitely will be keeping an eye on this, keep up the awesome work Baul!
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: treeleaf64 on Tue, 05 July 2022, 20:27:28
Not ergo enough
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Sandy on Tue, 05 July 2022, 21:14:18
Did the 60xt finish? Or were you shelving that and your other projects?
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: L0fi on Tue, 05 July 2022, 23:45:17
Really like this look. Super clean. Will be following this :)
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: paulgali on Wed, 06 July 2022, 01:54:01
Did the 60xt finish? Or were you shelving that and your other projects?

Nothing was shelved. 6xx has gone through several QC rounds and will be entering gb pretty soon (dates tbd).

This is an early design for a different project, to gather feedback, that’s all for now. IMO there is nothing wrong with overlapping ICs; especially given this isn’t a pre-sale announcement.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: paulgali on Wed, 06 July 2022, 01:56:07
Very nice, fixes the couple small issues I have with my Meridian (which has been my DD for months till I got my Babylon), the 1.25u mods on the bottom row & stiffer top mount. Definitely will be keeping an eye on this, keep up the awesome work Baul!

Are we the same person?? Hehe
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: blacksimon on Wed, 06 July 2022, 02:47:14
I like baul keyboards and baul keyboard accessories
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Zurg Eon on Wed, 06 July 2022, 05:00:50
Nice layout and design. Not as aggressive inward rotation as standard Alice layout and fixes the left spacebar placement for me. I would prefer three keys in the bottom right, like the Meridian, so you can use mod tap and have arrow keys, but that wouldn't really fit well on this board with the 1.5u mods.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Stringer Bell on Wed, 06 July 2022, 12:42:24
Looking forward to not missing this Baul's GB after the Safa accident  :-[
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: AstralYT on Wed, 06 July 2022, 12:57:46
Imo this is your best work yet baul, I daresay.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Zyrophr on Wed, 06 July 2022, 16:01:40
Interesting! That red is wonderful.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Phractals on Wed, 06 July 2022, 18:16:40
Another banger from baul! Baulice might become my first ergo board.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: base on Thu, 07 July 2022, 22:19:38
wew boy, this has got me feeling things
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: paulgali on Sat, 09 July 2022, 08:41:28
Adding traditional gummy to proto. Should be interesting to see how it works

Just want to pop in and thank each of you. Fingers crossed the new proto fixes the few issues I face with this!

Interested to know what you think about the sides though, i was considering "softening" the curve.

NEW:
(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/895720731323797564/995313797692653669/unknown.png?width=797&height=289)
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Rob27shred on Sat, 09 July 2022, 09:37:29
Adding traditional gummy to proto. Should be interesting to see how it works

Just want to pop in and thank each of you. Fingers crossed the new proto fixes the few issues I face with this!

Interested to know what you think about the sides though, i was considering "softening" the curve.

NEW:
Show Image
(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/895720731323797564/995313797692653669/unknown.png?width=797&height=289)


Nice gummy ring mount might smack on this! As for the curve, I think the newer one looks pretty damn good. Wouldn't change my interest in this project either way though. I'll be trying to get one regardless of the side profile you choose!
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: yuunoda on Mon, 11 July 2022, 04:31:52
hype hype
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: caz1e on Mon, 11 July 2022, 05:44:22
Adding traditional gummy to proto. Should be interesting to see how it works

Just want to pop in and thank each of you. Fingers crossed the new proto fixes the few issues I face with this!

Interested to know what you think about the sides though, i was considering "softening" the curve.

NEW:
Show Image
(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/895720731323797564/995313797692653669/unknown.png?width=797&height=289)

The softened curve looks really good. Definitely thinking about picking one up.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: D34ULT on Mon, 11 July 2022, 10:47:18
i really like my meridian and good to see a similar layout to it. really looking forward to this one
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: herfalerf on Mon, 11 July 2022, 18:12:25
Neat.
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: xjack312 on Mon, 11 July 2022, 22:34:37
very interested :)
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Ustinj on Mon, 11 July 2022, 23:50:58
Adding traditional gummy to proto. Should be interesting to see how it works

Just want to pop in and thank each of you. Fingers crossed the new proto fixes the few issues I face with this!

Interested to know what you think about the sides though, i was considering "softening" the curve.

NEW:
Show Image
(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/895720731323797564/995313797692653669/unknown.png?width=797&height=289)


I too prefer this new one!
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: LMarci on Tue, 12 July 2022, 15:41:47
pp out for baulice
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: pepperfez on Thu, 14 July 2022, 11:22:46
I love the look of this board, but I'm worried it'll never actually arrive.
V2 already ordered, so I assume next month I'll receive it  :thumb: I'll be able to give clearer details when that happens
Oh I'm not actually doubting, just making a Zeno joke. It does look good though!
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Zurg Eon on Sat, 29 October 2022, 06:17:02
I love the look of this board, but I'm worried it'll never actually arrive.
V2 already ordered, so I assume next month I'll receive it  :thumb: I'll be able to give clearer details when that happens
Oh I'm not actually doubting, just making a Zeno joke. It does look good though!
Xeno-Zeno, potato-potato
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: disarmyouwitha on Sun, 06 November 2022, 13:56:32
Please bring this to life! I’m so excited for an actual 60% alice with no extra buttons; brass under the alphas, handles on the case, this ticks all of my boxes =]
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Thebloodyez on Wed, 09 November 2022, 12:56:52
Another awesome keyboard by Paul. Keep the good work and looking forward to it :p
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: thocciness on Thu, 17 November 2022, 10:33:21
I love a true 60 percent ergo board. The sides look great! Keeping my eye on this one  :thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Rationalkeys on Mon, 21 November 2022, 07:49:52
glwic :thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] Zeno | 60% Ergo (early proto)
Post by: Adelscott on Sat, 08 April 2023, 13:44:54
A split left shift option would be nice