Author Topic: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?  (Read 10023 times)

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Offline Pavilions

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Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 01:52:42 »
I want to buy a new keyboard with Cherry Mx Clear Switches, but I'm confused which one should I get I like them both but what do you think anyone has tried any of them? the layout seems fine for both to me it's important to have the arrow keys and both of them has it.

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Offline Sup

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 02:40:06 »
WhiteFox if you are going to swap the keycaps out in the future since the vortex layout is non standard if not you can pick them both. They are great choices. I would go for the Whitefox
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Offline Pavilions

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 02:43:55 »
WhiteFox if you are going to swap the keycaps out in the future since the vortex layout is non standard if not you can pick them both. They are great choices. I would go for the Whitefox

Oh, Thanks for telling me. Yes in the future I'd want to customize the keycaps.

How about the switch. I do fairly amount of typing should I go with browns or clears?

Thanks

Offline Sup

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #3 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 03:38:35 »
WhiteFox if you are going to swap the keycaps out in the future since the vortex layout is non standard if not you can pick them both. They are great choices. I would go for the Whitefox

Oh, Thanks for telling me. Yes in the future I'd want to customize the keycaps.

How about the switch. I do fairly amount of typing should I go with browns or clears?

Thanks

This is kinda a hard thing to say it's mostly preference. But Clear does have more tactility then brown switches if you are into that but it's heavier. it depends do you like heavy switches or light?
current
Filco Zero -  NOS Yellow Alps | Canoe R1 Gateron Red | AEK II JP Cream dampend |Filco Majestouch 2 Tex case Gateron Yellow | HHKB Pro 1 2003 Rev AO Serial 000171 | HHKB Pro 1 2003 Rev A1s|DZ60 OG Panda's with Fei spring and stem. | Sentraq S65_Plus OG Invyr Panda's | A17 Gateron Black TX 65G 3204 | Lubrigrante Wildcard Cherry MX silent blacks 3204 58.5G Springs | Rukia Everglide Tourmaline Blue 58.5G Springs | MGA Standard Greetech brown |
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Offline HotRoderX

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #4 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 03:48:29 »
I say Vortex Race 3

Yes keycap's on the Race3 are a PITA to replace but least it has a standard layout unlike the whitefox with its funky backspace. I might also thought add in that you can get a Tada68 Kit and have KBDfan's assemble it with your choice of switches ((MX Clear)) LED's ((Optional)) for a small fee. https://kbdfans.cn/collections/diy-kit/products/tada68-keyboard-diy-kit

Offline Pavilions

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 05:06:17 »
I say Vortex Race 3

Yes keycap's on the Race3 are a PITA to replace but least it has a standard layout unlike the whitefox with its funky backspace. I might also thought add in that you can get a Tada68 Kit and have KBDfan's assemble it with your choice of switches ((MX Clear)) LED's ((Optional)) for a small fee. https://kbdfans.cn/collections/diy-kit/products/tada68-keyboard-diy-kit

The issue is that i'm not that good in assembly I think I prefer to buy it prebuilt and ready ^-^

also, does this keyboard have standard size keycaps? can I install poker II keycaps on it?
« Last Edit: Wed, 23 May 2018, 05:13:45 by Pavilions »

Offline Leslieann

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #6 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 05:19:21 »
Do not be fooled, neither are standard keycaps, the Whitefox has more standard keys, but those few oddballs are REALLY oddbals. Many sets offer extras which can fix most of the issues, but almost every set is going to have at least one or two oddballs on the Whitefox. Contrary to what you expect, the Vortex in this case is actually easier to get a full aftermarket set, even if it may cost you a bit extra.

Honestly though, after having a 60, 68 and a couple 75% boards, while caps are a concern, assuming you want to actually use this you should be paying attention to, it's the position of the FN key. One thing not shown on these pics because of the aftermarket caps on the Vortex is the FN and Backspace combo. The FN is just above the backspace, on most keyboards there is a gap between the top row and the F keys, on this, there is no gap and you might be surprised at how easy it is to hit that FN key at the same time you hit backspace, and when you do, because some keyboard designer is a total masochist, Vortex made that combo open the Calculator. So you type along, hit backspace and continue then notice you have been stuck in the calculator app for the last paragraph. I swear, if I ever meet the person who decided on that combo placement, I will forcefeed him FN keycaps until he chokes on them.  I love my Race despite it's (many 1st gen) flaws, but the only way I found I could use it was to place a short keycap on the FN key to avoid triggering it on accident.

Do you need fkeys?
Can you handle the FN placement and annoying combo?
I was in this same spot recently and ended up ordering a Chinese custom instead... Which is still in parts nearly 8 months later due to problems in shipping and manufacturing. My personal advice would be to buy something more mainstream.  :))
« Last Edit: Wed, 23 May 2018, 05:22:50 by Leslieann »
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| KBT Race S L.E.
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| GH60
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Offline Pavilions

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #7 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 05:40:37 »
Do not be fooled, neither are standard keycaps, the Whitefox has more standard keys, but those few oddballs are REALLY oddbals. Many sets offer extras which can fix most of the issues, but almost every set is going to have at least one or two oddballs on the Whitefox. Contrary to what you expect, the Vortex in this case is actually easier to get a full aftermarket set, even if it may cost you a bit extra.

Honestly though, after having a 60, 68 and a couple 75% boards, while caps are a concern, assuming you want to actually use this you should be paying attention to, it's the position of the FN key. One thing not shown on these pics because of the aftermarket caps on the Vortex is the FN and Backspace combo. The FN is just above the backspace, on most keyboards there is a gap between the top row and the F keys, on this, there is no gap and you might be surprised at how easy it is to hit that FN key at the same time you hit backspace, and when you do, because some keyboard designer is a total masochist, Vortex made that combo open the Calculator. So you type along, hit backspace and continue then notice you have been stuck in the calculator app for the last paragraph. I swear, if I ever meet the person who decided on that combo placement, I will forcefeed him FN keycaps until he chokes on them.  I love my Race despite it's (many 1st gen) flaws, but the only way I found I could use it was to place a short keycap on the FN key to avoid triggering it on accident.

Do you need fkeys?
Can you handle the FN placement and annoying combo?
I was in this same spot recently and ended up ordering a Chinese custom instead... Which is still in parts nearly 8 months later due to problems in shipping and manufacturing. My personal advice would be to buy something more mainstream.  :))

Yes, I you have a point, any pieces of advice if there are any other options to consider like the poker or the Leopold?

Thanks

Offline DALExSNAIL

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #8 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 06:42:16 »
Do not be fooled, neither are standard keycaps, the Whitefox has more standard keys, but those few oddballs are REALLY oddbals. Many sets offer extras which can fix most of the issues, but almost every set is going to have at least one or two oddballs on the Whitefox. Contrary to what you expect, the Vortex in this case is actually easier to get a full aftermarket set, even if it may cost you a bit extra.

Honestly though, after having a 60, 68 and a couple 75% boards, while caps are a concern, assuming you want to actually use this you should be paying attention to, it's the position of the FN key. One thing not shown on these pics because of the aftermarket caps on the Vortex is the FN and Backspace combo. The FN is just above the backspace, on most keyboards there is a gap between the top row and the F keys, on this, there is no gap and you might be surprised at how easy it is to hit that FN key at the same time you hit backspace, and when you do, because some keyboard designer is a total masochist, Vortex made that combo open the Calculator. So you type along, hit backspace and continue then notice you have been stuck in the calculator app for the last paragraph. I swear, if I ever meet the person who decided on that combo placement, I will forcefeed him FN keycaps until he chokes on them.  I love my Race despite it's (many 1st gen) flaws, but the only way I found I could use it was to place a short keycap on the FN key to avoid triggering it on accident.

Do you need fkeys?
Can you handle the FN placement and annoying combo?
I was in this same spot recently and ended up ordering a Chinese custom instead... Which is still in parts nearly 8 months later due to problems in shipping and manufacturing. My personal advice would be to buy something more mainstream.  :))

Yes, I you have a point, any pieces of advice if there are any other options to consider like the poker or the Leopold?

Thanks

Pok3r is a great choice imo. Was a starter for me in the higher end mech world, and loved it. A great value for what you get for sure.

Easy to find replacement caps for as the layout is pretty standard.

Anything leopold you like will be a great choice as well, very well built and great caps.

Offline Kevadu

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #9 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 10:08:49 »
Do not be fooled, neither are standard keycaps, the Whitefox has more standard keys, but those few oddballs are REALLY oddbals. Many sets offer extras which can fix most of the issues, but almost every set is going to have at least one or two oddballs on the Whitefox. Contrary to what you expect, the Vortex in this case is actually easier to get a full aftermarket set, even if it may cost you a bit extra.

You are being really misleading here.  The Whitefox is available in a few different layouts but depending on which one you get it's possible for literally the only nonstandard key to be the 1.75u right shift.  Which is definitely not that oddball at all.  A lot of 65% layouts have that and I'm seeing more and more kits these days just including it in the base set.

It's also possible to get it with a HHKB style backspace which is a bit less common but still really not that hard to accommodate.  The only other thing that could be an issue is 1u modifiers in the bottom row but those are super common.  So no, I can't agree with your assertion that it's hard to find keycaps for it.  It really isn't.

Offline killyou

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #10 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 10:51:39 »
Do yourself a favor and get Pok3r. Best price/quality ratio. It's quite common so you can easily score good deals even on ebay. I just bought another one with MX Blues new for 80$ (shipping to Europe and taxes ruins the price but still good in european terms).

Offline MC Qwerty

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #11 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 10:52:20 »
Personally I picked up the new White Fox,
its kited out with hako trues (95g basicly soft tactile dont regret)
I personly love it and dont regret my purchase, I think it looks astheticlly appealing
and it uses usb C so yeah I would recomend it no regrets buying.

MC Qwerty

Offline Kyi195

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #12 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 12:24:34 »
Just finished putting together the first run whitefox that MD did (I think the back says v1.1?) and it's a pretty solid board.  Got the DSA Quartz kit from SP and I think I only needed one extra kit for a few keys but other than that it was fine (running the split backspace too).  But yea, finding keys isn't that bad and since I don't use the F-keys all that often (f5 to refresh pages, f4 for closing things and f2 for renaming) I didn't need dedicated keys for it.  I did set it so that my caps lock is my fn though which isn't represented by the caps.  It's just how I had my V60 set up and I LOVED having it right there at my pinky with my media buttons hidden on Z-B so I couldn't drop that setup.

Offline Sup

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #13 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 13:26:42 »
For the people recommending the Pok3r do you know how many people couldn't find a key cap for that non standard ESC key yeah...
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Offline ddot

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #14 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 14:34:00 »
Any pieces of advice if there are any other options to consider like the poker or the Leopold?

I tried a Poker II for a while.  I just couldn't get comfortable without the arrow keys.  I think it's highly dependent on what you're doing with the keyboard.  My conclusion was if you're coding or word processing or something and your fingers are always in position, then having the arrows as a function layer works great.  But if you're doing things like drafting or spreadsheet work and your hands are bouncing back and forth to the mouse or something, then I found it a lot harder to re-orientate myself just to use an arrow key.  The dedicated arrow keys were a lot easier to find and use.  No single magical right answer.  You have to figure out what works for you.

I'm now using a Whitefox with both the dedicated arrow keys and another set programmed in as a function layer.  Best of both worlds.  I'm also a big fan of the HHKB backspace now that I've tried it.  It would be really hard for me to go back.

Offline jcoffin1981

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #15 on: Wed, 23 May 2018, 18:11:11 »
You may plan on getting aftermarket keycaps in the future, but for the moment you get what you get.  The race comes with a different style cap- I  think it's called spherical. This may feel slightly different to type on and you may or may not like it.  I have not tried it. 

Browns or Clears- as said this is all user preference.  However, you can adapt to a key that is a little light for you.  You can't however adapt to key that is too heavy. If your fingers fatigue they fatigue.  Therefore I would start with Browns.

Poker or Leopold as other options?  I have both and I love them.  Build quality is probably similar in all of them. Generally Leopold owners rant and rave about the quality of the keycaps and the dampening of the keystrokes.  It gives the board a nice feel, and it is probably the cheapest of all of them.  You have mentioned the necessity of the dedicated arrow keys, which Poker does not. However once I have gotten used to the arrows on the home row under the Fn layer I much prefer it.

The Race does give  you programbility. IDK how important this is for you, but it is nice to move keys around if you want to.
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #16 on: Thu, 24 May 2018, 06:03:16 »
Yes, I you have a point, any pieces of advice if there are any other options to consider like the poker or the Leopold?

Thanks
Almost anything 60%, 68%, TKL or full size will be easy to get caps for, almost anything else (65%, 75%, etc)  will be a hassle for caps because of companies insisting all keys fit into a nice rectangle without a gap anywhere and since there are no standards, they just stick things wherever they feel like it.



You are being really misleading here.  The Whitefox is available in a few different layouts but depending on which one you get it's possible for literally the only nonstandard key to be the 1.75u right shift.  Which is definitely not that oddball at all.  A lot of 65% layouts have that and I'm seeing more and more kits these days just including it in the base set.
The shift key was not my concern.
On the WF stock layouts the PgUp and PgDn keys are almost always a problem, and while you can remap them (on both), it's not as easy as other keyboads (at least on the WF) and flashing always carries some element of risk. Meanwhile there are several quality sets pre-made to fit the Vortex for 1/3rd the cost. They may not be as cool looking (though they feel/sound better) but whatever you can do to the WF you can pretty much do to the Vortex as well. Regardless, you WILL have fewer choices on caps no matter which way you go, and when the option is there or is included, it will cost you more than a set without those keys.

I'm not advocating one way or the other, I advocated against both.
I've been doing the 75% thing for a while, those side keycaps are always a concern. If caps are a major factor in your decision, and it seems like it was for the OP, then getting a more standard form factor is probably a good idea.
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62g Zilents/lubed/Novelkeys 39g springs, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, pic
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More
Vortex case squared up/blasted finish removed/custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, foam sound dampened, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs, 40g actuation
| GMMK TKL
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w/ Kailh Purple Pros/lubed/Novelkeys 39g springs, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, Netdot Gen10 Magnetic cable
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Box Jades, Interchangeable trim, mini lcd, QMK, underglow, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, O-rings, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, in progress link
| Magicforce 68
More
MF68 pcb, Outemu Blues, in progress
| YMDK75 Jail Housed Gateron Blues
More
J-spacers, YMDK Thick PBT, O-rings, SIP sockets
| KBT Race S L.E.
More
Ergo Clears, custom WASD caps
| Das Pro
More
Costar model with browns
| GH60
More
Cherry Blacks, custom 3d printed case
| Logitech Illumininated | IBM Model M (x2)
Definitive Omron Guide. | 3d printed Keyboard FAQ/Discussion

Offline HotRoderX

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #17 on: Thu, 24 May 2018, 11:55:31 »
Do not be fooled, neither are standard keycaps, the Whitefox has more standard keys, but those few oddballs are REALLY oddbals. Many sets offer extras which can fix most of the issues, but almost every set is going to have at least one or two oddballs on the Whitefox. Contrary to what you expect, the Vortex in this case is actually easier to get a full aftermarket set, even if it may cost you a bit extra.

You are being really misleading here.  The Whitefox is available in a few different layouts but depending on which one you get it's possible for literally the only nonstandard key to be the 1.75u right shift.  Which is definitely not that oddball at all.  A lot of 65% layouts have that and I'm seeing more and more kits these days just including it in the base set.

It's also possible to get it with a HHKB style backspace which is a bit less common but still really not that hard to accommodate.  The only other thing that could be an issue is 1u modifiers in the bottom row but those are super common.  So no, I can't agree with your assertion that it's hard to find keycaps for it.  It really isn't.

Thats misleading in its self! It was offered in a few different layouts. When it was produced thought Massdrop it was being offered in several. Today its only being offered in 1 or 2 layout's. Those layouts do require non standard key's. Thus making them harder to fit unless you go with a GMK set or a SA set from like Maxkey's.

Offline Max_P0

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #18 on: Thu, 24 May 2018, 20:55:47 »
Vortex Race 3 ... you get a full Func Row.
I have mapped a lot of commands to F row and also note, there is nothing wrong with having 1u ESC and DEL key.

I put GMK Sets on mine without trouble.

Offline Pavilions

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Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #19 on: Wed, 30 May 2018, 23:28:43 »
Do not be fooled, neither are standard keycaps, the Whitefox has more standard keys, but those few oddballs are REALLY oddbals. Many sets offer extras which can fix most of the issues, but almost every set is going to have at least one or two oddballs on the Whitefox. Contrary to what you expect, the Vortex in this case is actually easier to get a full aftermarket set, even if it may cost you a bit extra.

You are being really misleading here.  The Whitefox is available in a few different layouts but depending on which one you get it's possible for literally the only nonstandard key to be the 1.75u right shift.  Which is definitely not that oddball at all.  A lot of 65% layouts have that and I'm seeing more and more kits these days just including it in the base set.

It's also possible to get it with a HHKB style backspace which is a bit less common but still really not that hard to accommodate.  The only other thing that could be an issue is 1u modifiers in the bottom row but those are super common.  So no, I can't agree with your assertion that it's hard to find keycaps for it.  It really isn't.

Thats misleading in its self! It was offered in a few different layouts. When it was produced thought Massdrop it was being offered in several. Today its only being offered in 1 or 2 layout's. Those layouts do require non standard key's. Thus making them harder to fit unless you go with a GMK set or a SA set from like Maxkey's.

If I find the old layout that was sold by Massdrop should I buy it?

Thanks

Offline Deephouse_jedi

  • Posts: 21
Re: Vortex Race 3 or Whitefox?
« Reply #20 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 14:47:33 »
white fox for sure. I think vortex really messed up with that escape key