[IC] Currently unnamed split adjustable ergonomic Topre keyboard

[robotmaxtron]

Interested in assembled electronics and topre.

[hoggy]

Interested in option 3.

[noobiest]

Been lurking for a while, but definitely interested in option #1

[keyboardlover321]

I would defenitley be interested in option 3. An ergonomic topre keyboard that is like this sounds insane! You need to start selling these I think a lot of people would buy them.

[jaffers]

I just went and read your whole thread over at deskthority. All I can say is brilliant work. Plenty evidence of well thought out innovation

I really like the concept of adjustable ergonomics and think your approach to it works great and at the same time you've managed to keep it quite clean! It doesn't look like a garage job!

Fairly reasonable pricing too, I think I might just have to pick one of these up at some point,  I'll admit that I'd been a little wary about ergonomic keyboards but you've managed to intrigue me!

[Dominathan]

#3 please! This looks awesome!  Reminds me of the Dactyl

[Tafryn]

Sign me up for option #3.

[NERVOUS]

Just made an account to say I would be interested in option 3. Case and assembled electronics

[soVn]

Highly interested in #3 as well! Preferably cherry MX (:

[yorgasor]

I'm extremely interested!  How programmable is it?  Can I decide the keyboard layout (like the Infinity Ergo Dox)?  Or will it all be pre-programmed and hard coded?

[vmbray]

Very interested, made an account so I could vote. I just joined the drop for the Godspeed keyswitches and was planning on joining the ergodox drop but then saw this in the comments. I would be particularly interested in a setup with MX and pcbs, iiuc the option 1 would require stringing lots of wires between switches which would be satisfying in a max headroom way but not very attractive to actually do. But yeah either way if I can mount MX in it I would buy something, that is just too cool of a keyboard.

[cquiroz]

I'd be very interested on a fully assembled topre split keyboard, count me in

[oj3]

Yes, I would absolutely  lust over a assembled offering. 

[kentt]

I'm in. This is my dream.

[down2clown]

I just came across this project and it sounds fantastic. I'd put money down for option 3 and shipping to the US, or just an option with the included but not assembled electronics. I'm very excited to see how this project plays out.

[Bromono]

I told my self no more keyboards and to retire with the HHKB.

But I would buy this.

Edit: Option 3

[waboni]

Dear attheicearcade, what a great project idea; I'm also following you at DESKTHORITY, please count me in with option 3, this is by far the most sophisticated as well as ergonomic oriented Keyboard to date. Keep it up.

[suicidal_orange]

I'm extremely interested!  How programmable is it?  Can I decide the keyboard layout (like the Infinity Ergo Dox)?  Or will it all be pre-programmed and hard coded?

No point having a custom board that's not fully programmable - it will be

Yes, I would absolutely  lust over a assembled offering. 

I'd be very interested on a fully assembled topre split keyboard, count me in

Just checking you guys are aware that 'fully assembled' means the chips are soldered on the PCBs, but to build a working board you'll need to dismantle a Topre keyboard to get switches and wire them up?

Very interested, made an account so I could vote. I just joined the drop for the Godspeed keyswitches and was planning on joining the ergodox drop but then saw this in the comments. I would be particularly interested in a setup with MX and pcbs, iiuc the option 1 would require stringing lots of wires between switches which would be satisfying in a max headroom way but not very attractive to actually do. But yeah either way if I can mount MX in it I would buy something, that is just too cool of a keyboard.

The trouble with the idea of PCBs for the switches is that they'd need to be bent, even if someone is willing to make them the spacing between switches will be weird so would need some clever maths to work that out.  This is primarily a Topre project so they're not going to happen, the closest you can get is Enabler PCBs for individual switches but they still need wiring together...

Besides handwiring can look great if you take your time, as demonstrated by Yoe:


This was his first attempt!

[Dominathan]

#3 please! This looks awesome!  Reminds me of the Dactyl

It doesn't need switches, though.  Just the diodes and the chips

[Corusco]

I'm rolling in late on this, but I would be a definite buy for option 2.

[Shoshin]

Want to buy option 3 - Pre-built with topre.

[WNovizar]

Is option 3 includes topre switches?

[bbrotha]

Option 3 topre for me.

[suicidal_orange]

Is option 3 includes topre switches?

No.  In the words of the designer (with added bold):

Ergonomic. Topre. Fully assembled. Built within the UK. Roughly 200 quid.

Allow me to keep it short.

Yes.

By assembled I mean populated PCBs. There is still some soldering to be done after the switches are installed. I have emboldened important information in the first post (you need a donor Topre board). If I managed to get it fully assembled for £200 then that would be a true miracle given the price of Topre keyboards 

[limti]

On the MX front: what about a flex PCB for each column? A little bit like the Kinesis method, but with separate columns.

[suicidal_orange]

On the MX front: what about a flex PCB for each column? A little bit like the Kinesis method, but with separate columns.
(Attachment Link)

That would be ideal but can you find a factory willing to make a small run for a sensible price?  If you can are they tough enough to solder to, or is there another way to link them at random stagger?

Only when both are 'yes' will it be worth attempting to measure the spacing required

[limti]

... can you find a factory willing to make a small run for a sensible price?

I'll get a quote for 1k, and we'll find out.

If you can are they tough enough to solder to, or is there another way to link them at random stagger?

Soldering is the easy part. I've hand-soldered eroded traces on my wife's Kinesis. Their PCB is a good example of stiff flex which still needs strong mechanicals. See some of the images, here: https://www.google.com/search?q=kinesis+keyboard+teardown+images

Linking is the tricky part. Connectors can be cheap, but cables can be spendy - then there's the routing. Hand-soldering wires is also easy - depending on routing, again. Routing must maintain the aesthetic and allow for the mechanical adjustments.

Other items:
 - Since OP understands the problems with feature creep, any MX option must not impede the Topre effort.
 - The controller PCBs could easily be redone the same size with Ergodox components. Actually, I'll have a look at that part, as well.
 - Measurements might not even be needed. If OP exports a row as a STEP file, Altium makes it easy to define regions from any flat surface on the 3d body. Other ecad could use DXFs.

[suicidal_orange]

... can you find a factory willing to make a small run for a sensible price?

I'll get a quote for 1k, and we'll find out.

If you can are they tough enough to solder to, or is there another way to link them at random stagger?

Soldering is the easy part. I've hand-soldered eroded traces on my wife's Kinesis. Their PCB is a good example of stiff flex which still needs strong mechanicals. See some of the images, here: https://www.google.com/search?q=kinesis+keyboard+teardown+images

Linking is the tricky part. Connectors can be cheap, but cables can be spendy - then there's the routing. Hand-soldering wires is also easy - depending on routing, again. Routing must maintain the aesthetic and allow for the mechanical adjustments.

Other items:
 - Since OP understands the problems with feature creep, any MX option must not impede the Topre effort.
 - The controller PCBs could easily be redone the same size with Ergodox components. Actually, I'll have a look at that part, as well.
 - Measurements might not even be needed. If OP exports a row as a STEP file, Altium makes it easy to define regions from any flat surface on the 3d body. Other ecad could use DXFs.

Ah so it was not a casual comment, hard to tell from so few words

I guess these flexible PCBs are thicker than I was thinking, that's good.  If so the routing connections is easy enough - column down one side with a pad to go to the controller and two pads to the diode the other side of each switch for linking rows.  Then you just trim your connecting wires to fit your stagger.  Only talking of inch or two long pieces so if too long/short try again - the basis of my 'tough enough' concern (I don't think there's room for a connector between columns)

If CAD can work it out great but I'd think you'd need the measurement before getting an accurate quote?  Will probably be close enough to see if it's faesible...

I'm thinking an MX (and alps?) case run first to raise r&d money for the Topre effort would be the way to go, but if MOQ will allow two files in the same order Topre people could have a pretty case to look at while waiting for their controller.  But that would be up to the OP - I'm just a fan of the design like everyone else )

[livingspeedbump]

Id be interested in case and electronics.

[limti]

I hope I'm not needlessly cluttering the thread by talking about an MX possibility.

Exploratory quote from a US-based fab: for 1000 PCBs, each one is under US$3. If each keyboard needs ten, that's $30 per keyboard when buying enough for 100 keyboards. Maybe half that cost if done directly through a shop in Shenzhen. 0.5mm overall thickness; 1oz copper on two sides; no silk. It's stiff enough to hold switches and to hand-solder wires onto, but flexible enough to conform to mechanical features.

[gaiden]

I hope I'm not needlessly cluttering the thread by talking about an MX possibility.

Exploratory quote from a US-based fab: for 1000 PCBs, each one is under US$3. If each keyboard needs ten, that's $30 per keyboard when buying enough for 100 keyboards. Maybe half that cost if done directly through a shop in Shenzhen. 0.5mm overall thickness; 1oz copper on two sides; no silk. It's stiff enough to hold switches and to hand-solder wires onto, but flexible enough to conform to mechanical features.

I can get behind this. The price seems realistic and sounds reasonable enough. Maybe OP can look into this for a complete MX package option.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

[suicidal_orange]

I hope I'm not needlessly cluttering the thread by talking about an MX possibility.

Exploratory quote from a US-based fab: for 1000 PCBs, each one is under US$3. If each keyboard needs ten, that's $30 per keyboard when buying enough for 100 keyboards. Maybe half that cost if done directly through a shop in Shenzhen. 0.5mm overall thickness; 1oz copper on two sides; no silk. It's stiff enough to hold switches and to hand-solder wires onto, but flexible enough to conform to mechanical features.

Not bad at all!  How much for single sided? If you've got a joining wire you'd may as well solder it the other side of the trace on the same side of the board...

Or if it's not much cheaper we could put an LED circuit on the back?

[limti]

How much for single sided? If you've got a joining wire you'd may as well solder it the other side of the trace on the same side of the board...

Gut feeling: going to 1-side won't help cost, in these quantities.

Or if it's not much cheaper we could put an LED circuit on the back?

Extra pads are free, and holes are cheap. It would be left up to the user whether it's worth five more wires per column just for LEDs.

[gaiden]

How much for single sided? If you've got a joining wire you'd may as well solder it the other side of the trace on the same side of the board...

Gut feeling: going to 1-side won't help cost, in these quantities.

Or if it's not much cheaper we could put an LED circuit on the back?

Extra pads are free, and holes are cheap. It would be left up to the user whether it's worth five more wires per column just for LEDs.

I remember OP stated he doesn't care for LEDs at all but i sincerely hope this (soft PCB with LED support) would be an option for MX side.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

[clappingcactus]

Absolutely interested in both Options 2 or Option 3 for Topre.

[jal]

Nothing useful to add other than this is really, really cool.

[J-Schweezy]

I'm very much interested in this project. Count me in for option 3. I'm happy to do assembly and soldering, but PCB manufacturing is outside my skill level.

This is going to be the perfect input device, great work so far.

[FioraCorp]

I'm in.
Option 3, MX, though i'd be totally down with this being my first Topre board, too.
Heh, wouldn't that be crazy.

[attheicearcade]

I remember OP stated he doesn't care for LEDs at all but i sincerely hope this (soft PCB with LED support) would be an option for MX side.

Won't have LED support at least in the first revision  I don't have any interest personally but it might be a fun addition to the project from a design standpoint. Not yet though.

I hope I'm not needlessly cluttering the thread by talking about an MX possibility.

Exploratory quote from a US-based fab: for 1000 PCBs, each one is under US$3. If each keyboard needs ten, that's $30 per keyboard when buying enough for 100 keyboards. Maybe half that cost if done directly through a shop in Shenzhen. 0.5mm overall thickness; 1oz copper on two sides; no silk. It's stiff enough to hold switches and to hand-solder wires onto, but flexible enough to conform to mechanical features.

I haven't explored flex PCBs because I did think they'd be much more expensive. I'll have to think about the best way to do it.

I'm thinking an MX (and alps?) case run first to raise r&d money for the Topre effort would be the way to go, but if MOQ will allow two files in the same order Topre people could have a pretty case to look at while waiting for their controller.  But that would be up to the OP - I'm just a fan of the design like everyone else )

Indeed I do need to raise money for it, I want to build a full prototype before I take people's money (I don't know if the column design will actually be good!). Takes a more significant investment than I'm comfortable making given the idea might not work out. Aside from crowdfunding - which might end up in people not getting anything and losing money - I'm quietly working on a split HHKB which might be able to serve this purpose.

[clappingcactus]

Indeed I do need to raise money for it, I want to build a full prototype before I take people's money (I don't know if the column design will actually be good!). Takes a more significant investment than I'm comfortable making given the idea might not work out. Aside from crowdfunding - which might end up in people not getting anything and losing money - I'm quietly working on a split HHKB which might be able to serve this purpose.

How much money are we talking here? I'd be totally up for crowdfunding the prototype and I would expect nothing in return and would still buy the final product at full price on release/pre-order.

[Tom P.]

How much money are we talking here? I'd be totally up for crowdfunding the prototype and I would expect nothing in return and would still buy the final product at full price on release/pre-order.

So would I. The advancement of the human interface should not have to wait!

[snowkid2themax]

I haven't done extensive SMD soldering so I'd prefer Option 3, but wouldn't mind Option 2 either. Hope it's not too late for the interest check!

[fisofo]

Option 3!

[attheicearcade]

I haven't done extensive SMD soldering so I'd prefer Option 3, but wouldn't mind Option 2 either. Hope it's not too late for the interest check!

Don't worry, this isn't a fast moving project 

How much money are we talking here? I'd be totally up for crowdfunding the prototype and I would expect nothing in return and would still buy the final product at full price on release/pre-order.

I was quoted around £600 for much of the single keyboard case parts - without fasteners etc. That would be the biggest spend, but of course I don't know if it will actually work out which is why I'm not particularly happy about crowdfunding. We will see 

[v6ak]

Short: If I can get Ergodox-like key layout, I am interested in the MX version. I don't care much about the extra key in the innermost column, but two removed keys from the bottommost column does not look well for me. I remember you have mentioned that I can go this way, but I am not sure if I can go this way in this revision.

Long: I am an ErgoDox user. Maybe I am not as conservative as it might look at the first sight. I am considering using ErgoDox as a portable keyboard and your keyboard (say ErgoDox 3D) as a more comfortable but non-portable one. Ideally, I would use the same TMK firmware with the same layout. This could prevent me from need to learn two different layout and switching between them.

I believe that the MX version could be used with Teensy and the TMK firmware for Ergodox (i.e. cubuanic's fork) without much modifications (if any). I believe that the only part that requires modification is the martix (plus layout, of course).

[BetaC]

Awesome look. I'd be in for option 3.

[rtmf]

In for option 3 as well. Really concerned about how I'll source topre w/ mx sliders though...

[Tom P.]

In for option 3 as well. Really concerned about how I'll source topre w/ mx sliders though...

There are still plenty of NovaTouch TKL's out there, that's an option.
Then there are clones like the Plum84 (on Aliexpress, and Massdrop right now, has 35g Topre clone switches).
Then, you could just buy a Topre board and some separate MX sliders like these.

So don't be concerned!

And don't be worried about getting clone switches. It's not so much the domes, sliders and housings that make genuine Topre boards sound great as it is the case, and you'll be using a different (awesome) case.

[Tshort]

I'm interested in any of the options. I'm most interested in 3 then 2 then 1.

[BSmith333]

Option three with topre switches is my dream