[IC] GMK Taegeukgi | GROUPBUY IS LIVE

[SMOKEY]

Rice Novelty has been changed.
젓가락 gone.
숟가락 instead.

[CherryB]

This sets look really clean. I'm interested.

[SMOKEY]

Hello everyone,

finally I am able to share this with you.

The Collaboration with Artkey Universe was just announced by them and here are the Stars: Sirius, Bull and Devourer!

Artkey Universe

Raffle times:

Hanguk Sirius - Live at 9:00 AM ICT / 7th October / for 30 minutes

Hanguk Bull V2 and Hanguk Devourer - Live at 9:00 AM ICT, 10th October / for 12 hours

May the luck be with you!

[SojuSempai]

Can't wait to see more from this set! Definitely interested in picking it up!

[SMOKEY]

RAFFLE TIME!

Sirius x GMK Hanguk will go live in 19 hours for 30 minutes only!

October 7th, 9AM ICT / 4AM CEST / 7PM PDT / 10PM EDT

https://artkeyuniverse.com/shop/detail/hanguk

Artkey Universe

[LightningXI]

The ArtKey collab is so sick. No luck for me on the Sirius.

I like the small change to the spoon.

[SMOKEY]

Hi everybody,

guess what? It's update time again.

Luxe Cables finished the proto of his cable and it turned out awesome! What did you expect?

Here it is:

Cable Specs:

- 7-8 inch coil (depending on orientation)
- GX16 Connector, painted red and blue, with white threads
- Black heatshrink
- White TechFlex
- White paracord
- 4, 5, or 6 feet of total cable length available
- USB-C, Mini-USB, Micro-USB available for device connections
- Engraving of TAEGEUK optional


Tech Specs:

- Cable is USB Rev 2.0 Compliant 28 / 28AWG
- Cable/Coil Diameter 1 inch
- Coil Inner Diameter 1/2 inch
- TechFlex PET Sleeving
- 5-pin GX16 connectors.

I hope you enjoy!

[SMOKEY]

RAFFLE TIME!

Bull v2 & Devourer x GMK Hanguk will go live in 6 hours for 12 hours!

October 7th, 9AM ICT / 4AM CEST / 7PM PDT / 10PM EDT

https://artkeyuniverse.com/shop/detail/hanguk-bd

Artkey Universe

[Philbeey]

RAFFLE TIME!

Bull v2 & Devourer x GMK Hanguk will go live in 6 hours for 12 hours!

October 7th, 9AM ICT / 4AM CEST / 7PM PDT / 10PM EDT

https://artkeyuniverse.com/shop/detail/hanguk-bd

Artkey Universe

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New to these artisans but I'd there a reason that these are limited raffles and not available for purchase after?

Appreciate the info

Sent from my SM-N986W using Tapatalk

[Cubic // esc lab]

EDIT: I apologize for the frustrated tone I had in this initial comment. I let my emotions get to me in terms of the observations of my upbringing. For the sake of transparency, I am keeping this comment up and unedited.

_____

Found this set through the video pasted below.

As an Asian person, seeing sets like this is disappointing. They seem lazy, and doesn't come from a place of genuine interest or respect for the culture they are trying to portray. GMK Hanguk isn't the first or last to do this, so it's not on you in particular, but it's a trend I'm seeing.

Will this be successful? Probably. Will it sell a lot? Yeah. But I think that's sort of the point.

How can a designer do better when it comes to creating sets that address cultural themes?

1. Do your research. Seriously. At the bare basics, talk to people. Watch videos online. Understand why certain cultural elements are the way they are. Look at deeper values and meaning. Go beyond the surface. Maybe even visit the country or immerse yourself into the culture.
2. Introspect into the motivation you have with creating a set. Is it the money? Is it the color scheme? Is it paying respect to the cultural themes? Is it because of a trend? Is it popular culture? etc etc. I think you may have been motivated to create the set because the Korean flag has an interesting color scheme. That's fine. But why not name the layouts based on the elements in the flag, instead of Bibimbap.. Kimchi (really?).. etc
3. Get the opinion of people in that culture. This part isn't 100% necessary, because this is borderline gatekeeping. I DO think we should embrace people with new perspectives and ideas. But at the bare basics it avoids mistakes like tattooing "buttcrack" in Chinese on your arm because you thought it was supposed to mean "Power".

Please don't misunderstand my post in thinking that non-Asians shouldn't design Asian sets. I am actually asking the complete opposite, we *should* encourage new ideas and concepts to a culture. That's how some of the best cuisine in the world today is made, because of fusion and new perspective. But *please* do so respectfully and show some sort of level of research. Like JYMV says, you calling your set Hanguk sets a really really high bar, to represent Korea and its culture. It better be spot on and perfect and represent Korea correctly.

[Philbeey]

Just out of curiousity since you managed to type up a storm perhaps you'd like to add a bit more and like many of the others here.

Provide suggestions?

The creator has been nothing but respectful through and through so essentially you're entire blurb boils down to thematic choices.

And as someone who is Asian himself. I'm curious it is what it is you find wrong albeit you danced around it by pretty much using no succinct words.

You mention food items and all sorts of other things but very loosely so are these requirements? I assume not.
And if so what exactly makes these topics better than others?

I'm sincerely curious as to what you find so obscenely wrong with this set and others like it because, well you managed to speak upon everything except the actual point.

And as a point of focus you stated you're Asian, cool. But the tone especially near the end leaves without a doubt that you seem to be speaking to the needs, preferences of all Asian people in general.
Let alone one who grew up in Korea.

Sent from my SM-N986W using Tapatalk

[SMOKEY]

I have A LOT to say about all this.
But since I have 2 little kids and it is weekend it will take me to Monday until I reply to this
So many things were stated completely wrong.

[Philbeey]

I have A LOT to say about all this.
But since I have 2 little kids and it is weekend it will take me to Monday until I reply to this
So many things were stated completely wrong.

Honestly go spend time with your loved ones. Effort enough has been seen by everyone in the discord and here as testament to your efforts.

No more need be spent over the weekend over Esckeys hypocritical post

Sent from my SM-N986W using Tapatalk

[Cubic // esc lab]

I apologize if my tone and original comment was unproductive. I let my frustration get to me. I didn't mean to wish any bad feelings on anyone. I will be more aware moving forward.

I think the topic of culture is different and nuanced for everyone. I grew up like many Asian Americans/Canadians straddling between two cultures. My family is very traditional, so we follow the customs fairly closely despite living in the West, so I grew up very proud of my heritage. But growing up in the west, it can be rare to see an accurate portrayal of our culture -- whether it's the customs, the tradition, the food, the entertainment, etc. So whenever I see our culture displayed, they are often portrayed in a way that's based on what people THINK our background is. Oh Chinese food? Panda Express. Oh Korean food? Kimchi. Japanese food? Sushi. Japanese culture? Anime. Chinese culture? Dragons and red colors.

The reason this set "triggered" me was because I saw it as again a manifestation of my observations. Is it accurate? Probably not. I'm sure Smokey had no ill intentions making it. I'm sorry Smokey if my original comment came off very strong. I'm leaving it up for transparency reasons.

In terms of improvements, here are my suggestions. Not that they matter all that much.

1. Calling the set GMK Korea is a heavy responsibility. It should get Korea right, and I think there are other avenues that could showcase that other than Kimchi, Bibimbap, etc. Another suggestion is just rename the set to GMK Korean Food. The most initial vibe I got from this set was the layout names are food, but the set name is Hanguk. Where are the other Korean elements that are not just food?

2. Tightening the scope of your set to being related to food could unleash even greater flexibility and creativity, as you can showcase even more diverse food items of Korea in various regions, and not just what people generally know about. Maybe you can talk about Korea's prized cow, the Hanwoo. Or the drinking culture (and the foods you eat + games you play) surrounding soju. But JTK Soju already has done this so maybe not. I'm personally not Korean so I won't even begin to say I know the things that Koreans take proudly.

3. Further tightening the scope of this set means also greater creativity and tighter theme with your novelties. It's tough to cover every Korean theme when you only have so many keys to work with.

4. Take the scallions and chopsticks and sesame oil out of the cable photos. The cables are nice enough by themselves without adding those.. slightly stereotypical elements.

That's all I can think of for now.

Again, apologies for the tone. The more I look at this set, the more it seems to me the theme is on what Korean culture means to you. I think the intent is good, but execution can use some tweaking for this to become a great set.

[prizeS]

I apologize if my tone and original comment was unproductive. I let my frustration get to me. I didn't mean to wish any bad feelings on anyone. I will be more aware moving forward.

I think the topic of culture is different and nuanced for everyone. I grew up like many Asian Americans/Canadians straddling between two cultures. My family is very traditional, so we follow the customs fairly closely despite living in the West, so I grew up very proud of my heritage. But growing up in the west, it can be rare to see an accurate portrayal of our culture -- whether it's the customs, the tradition, the food, the entertainment, etc. So whenever I see our culture displayed, they are often portrayed in a way that's based on what people THINK our background is. Oh Chinese food? Panda Express. Oh Korean food? Kimchi. Japanese food? Sushi. Japanese culture? Anime. Chinese culture? Dragons and red colors.

The reason this set "triggered" me was because I saw it as again a manifestation of my observations. Is it accurate? Probably not. I'm sure Smokey had no ill intentions making it. I'm sorry Smokey if my original comment came off very strong.

In terms of improvements, here are my suggestions. Not that they matter all that much.

1. Calling the set GMK Korea is a heavy responsibility. It should get Korea right, and I think there are other avenues that could showcase that other than Kimchi, Bibimbap, etc. Another suggestion is just rename the set to GMK Korean Food. The most initial vibe I got from this set was the layout names are food, but the set name is Hanguk. Where are the other Korean elements that are not just food?

2. Tightening the scope of your set to being related to food could unleash even greater flexibility and creativity, as you can showcase even more diverse food items of Korea in various regions, and not just what people generally know about. Maybe you can talk about Korea's prized cow, the Hanwoo. Or the drinking culture (and the foods you eat + games you play) surrounding soju. But JTK Soju already has done this so maybe not. I'm personally not Korean so I won't even begin to say I know the things that Koreans take proudly.

3. Further tightening the scope of this set means also greater creativity and tighter theme with your novelties. It's tough to cover every Korean theme when you only have so many keys to work with.

4. Take the scallions and chopsticks and sesame oil out of the cable photos. The cables are nice enough by themselves without adding those.. slightly stereotypical elements.

That's all I can think of for now.

Again, apologies for the tone. The more I look at this set, the more it seems to me the theme is on what Korean culture means to you. I think the intent is good, but execution can use some tweaking for this to become a great set.

dude you're definitely reading way too much into it. it's not that difficult. he enjoys Korean culture, and this set is inspired by his take on it.

you don't need to read into everyone's inspiration for a set.

[Philbeey]

I apologize if my tone and original comment was unproductive. I let my frustration get to me. I didn't mean to wish any bad feelings on anyone. I will be more aware moving forward.

I think the topic of culture is different and nuanced for everyone. I grew up like many Asian Americans/Canadians straddling between two cultures. My family is very traditional, so we follow the customs fairly closely despite living in the West, so I grew up very proud of my heritage. But growing up in the west, it can be rare to see an accurate portrayal of our culture -- whether it's the customs, the tradition, the food, the entertainment, etc. So whenever I see our culture displayed, they are often portrayed in a way that's based on what people THINK our background is. Oh Chinese food? Panda Express. Oh Korean food? Kimchi. Japanese food? Sushi. Japanese culture? Anime. Chinese culture? Dragons and red colors.

The reason this set "triggered" me was because I saw it as again a manifestation of my observations. Is it accurate? Probably not. I'm sure Smokey had no ill intentions making it. I'm sorry Smokey if my original comment came off very strong.

In terms of improvements, here are my suggestions. Not that they matter all that much.

1. Calling the set GMK Korea is a heavy responsibility. It should get Korea right, and I think there are other avenues that could showcase that other than Kimchi, Bibimbap, etc. Another suggestion is just rename the set to GMK Korean Food. The most initial vibe I got from this set was the layout names are food, but the set name is Hanguk. Where are the other Korean elements that are not just food?

2. Tightening the scope of your set to being related to food could unleash even greater flexibility and creativity, as you can showcase even more diverse food items of Korea in various regions, and not just what people generally know about. Maybe you can talk about Korea's prized cow, the Hanwoo. Or the drinking culture (and the foods you eat + games you play) surrounding soju. But JTK Soju already has done this so maybe not. I'm personally not Korean so I won't even begin to say I know the things that Koreans take proudly.

3. Further tightening the scope of this set means also greater creativity and tighter theme with your novelties. It's tough to cover every Korean theme when you only have so many keys to work with.

4. Take the scallions and chopsticks and sesame oil out of the cable photos. The cables are nice enough by themselves without adding those.. slightly stereotypical elements.

That's all I can think of for now.

Again, apologies for the tone. The more I look at this set, the more it seems to me the theme is on what Korean culture means to you. I think the intent is good, but execution can use some tweaking for this to become a great set.

You've oddly decided what to create a bias over so I'm confused.
What exactly did that set embody over this one?
They're both lovely sets so I'm curious as to why?

You're apologising for your tone but you're being passive aggressive again.

To tell you something of my observations as a Korean who was born in Korea, grew up in Australia then went back for military service.

No one cares.

You've put Korean culture on this god tier pedestal but if someone made GMK Aussie or a GMK Canuck it wouldn't be any different.

We like seeing our culture being pervasive it's not about purity or traditionalism it's about thoughtful and respectful spread of it.
And no that doesn't mean they want everyone in Hanboks and suddenly making kimchi or being Samsung fanatics.
Sometimes it really is just okay to do a fun homage.

Lastly, if you don't like the set you don't like the set. Stop trying to weave a whole story about its poor execution, it's terrible backstory, it's tooic matter and it's lack of respect.

You yourself are continuing to be entitled disrespectful and absolutely dismissive of everyone else's tastes especially the many many other Koreans everywhere who absolutely love this set.

Step off the high horse and don't start the next response if it's just going to be a disingenuous response.

Sent from my SM-N986W using Tapatalk

[DukeEsquire]

I think there are certainly flaws with the set--no set is perfect--but the guy doesn't need to perfectly represent all of Korean culture to have a set that respects the core theme.

My only problem is that, if you take out the Korean sub-legends, I would have thought the base kit was a USA themed set. Reminds me of SA Rocket.

[Findecanor]

TL;DR: There shouldn't be any space separating the coloured fields of the taegeuk.

[NixieTea]

I'm not gonna say any of my judgements on this set itself, but I seriously think people who aren't Korean and defending the set don't really have any place to speak. Sure, some Koreans probably are fine with the set, but that's basically the "I can't be racist because I have a black friend" argument. There are legitimate Korean people who take offense to this set, and those here who are just brushing it off are in the wrong. Also, this is just fetishization. Just because the fetish turns out to be positive in the case of South Korean culture, doesn't make it a good thing to do. It's like saying all Asians are smart. It might make us look good, but it's still terrible to stereotype us. You can see the same thing happening to a lot of Japanese keycap sets. For example, if someone created a set for my culture and country in a similar fashion, the fetishization would be much less kind due to most people seeing my country as overtly terrorist or violent.

What I'm saying here is that just brushing people off because you don't think this set is an issue is wrong. I'd like to point out that my comment isn't specifically directed at Smokey because he's been respectful thus far, even if I take issue with his designs. In terms of constructive criticism, from what I've heard, Sumi and Bento are done well because they don't generalize all of Japanese culture and focus on specific aspects. Now, take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt, but I think the set would be better if it was actually based on KBBQ instead of Korea as a whole. I think you could get a lot more people on board and it wouldn't be offensive (assuming research was done of course).

Also, Philbeey, I think you are being too aggressive and need to cool it. You may like the set, but people can have criticism.

[Fredington]

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(Attachment Link)

Thank you for bringing this to our attention. You are definitely the first person to ever notice this. I guess Korea should just rename itself to Pepsi now. Would make it easier for everyone.

[reminbee]

I think it takes a lot of guts to bring up a criticism like this within a somewhat old fashioned community like the mk community, so I just wanted to say thanks! The fetishization and overuse of "east Asian" aesthetics is really not something that is talked about beyond "lol another weeb set?"

When it comes to using iconography associated with certain cultures, you often get the response "it's not a big deal" or "why do you care so much?" Personally, growing up I had a lot of negative experiences related to being Chinese American - bullying because of my name, people telling me my food smells like garbage, etc. So when the same people turn around ten years later and suddenly decide certain aspects of my culture are "cool" or "marketable," it makes you feel really mad. The same society that made you feel subhuman because of your background now wants to profit off of it. Not to mention, only the parts that are deemed "cool" enough get highlighted, further reducing actual cultures to tropes.

I'm not Korean and am not here to pass judgement on this set. Just offering a POV that may help illuminate why a lot of Asian Americans, at least the ones in my circles, have a strong reaction in these situations.

[mrboxturtle]

What I'm seeing people have an issue with is that the set set out to encompass South Korea in a keycap set. On one hand it is impossible to capture a country in a keycap set, on the other hand, Smokey tried to take on this seemingly impossible challenge by designing his set around this theme, much to the dismay of some people, clearly. I really do think people wouldn't have raised any fuss if it were more focused on kbbq or something. You'd lose the themeing around the flag of course, but that's not what I want to discuss here.

I believe the root of this issue is this: in trying to take a country and fit it onto a very small canvas of a handful of keys and color combinations, it's impossible to not dilute the entire country to the elements which stand out in pop culture. This is how the rest of the world sees a country, which is why certain individuals look at the set and say a korean would not have made this (and to be clear I'm not saying this or this set is right or wrong, just providing perspective). Of course the nuances of a country will be lost when the country is filtered down to a handful of things which stand out to a designer. Whether this is falls on the side of celebratory or on the side of offensive/fetishization depends on the person, and I think it is at least important to hear out those with dissenting opinions, because it may regard something important to them, such as their culture or country of origin. Everyone has different values.

[qluboards]

I apologize if my tone and original comment was unproductive. I let my frustration get to me. I didn't mean to wish any bad feelings on anyone. I will be more aware moving forward.

I think the topic of culture is different and nuanced for everyone. I grew up like many Asian Americans/Canadians straddling between two cultures. My family is very traditional, so we follow the customs fairly closely despite living in the West, so I grew up very proud of my heritage. But growing up in the west, it can be rare to see an accurate portrayal of our culture -- whether it's the customs, the tradition, the food, the entertainment, etc. So whenever I see our culture displayed, they are often portrayed in a way that's based on what people THINK our background is. Oh Chinese food? Panda Express. Oh Korean food? Kimchi. Japanese food? Sushi. Japanese culture? Anime. Chinese culture? Dragons and red colors.

The reason this set "triggered" me was because I saw it as again a manifestation of my observations. Is it accurate? Probably not. I'm sure Smokey had no ill intentions making it. I'm sorry Smokey if my original comment came off very strong. I'm leaving it up for transparency reasons.

In terms of improvements, here are my suggestions. Not that they matter all that much.

1. Calling the set GMK Korea is a heavy responsibility. It should get Korea right, and I think there are other avenues that could showcase that other than Kimchi, Bibimbap, etc. Another suggestion is just rename the set to GMK Korean Food. The most initial vibe I got from this set was the layout names are food, but the set name is Hanguk. Where are the other Korean elements that are not just food?

2. Tightening the scope of your set to being related to food could unleash even greater flexibility and creativity, as you can showcase even more diverse food items of Korea in various regions, and not just what people generally know about. Maybe you can talk about Korea's prized cow, the Hanwoo. Or the drinking culture (and the foods you eat + games you play) surrounding soju. But JTK Soju already has done this so maybe not. I'm personally not Korean so I won't even begin to say I know the things that Koreans take proudly.

3. Further tightening the scope of this set means also greater creativity and tighter theme with your novelties. It's tough to cover every Korean theme when you only have so many keys to work with.

4. Take the scallions and chopsticks and sesame oil out of the cable photos. The cables are nice enough by themselves without adding those.. slightly stereotypical elements.

That's all I can think of for now.

Again, apologies for the tone. The more I look at this set, the more it seems to me the theme is on what Korean culture means to you. I think the intent is good, but execution can use some tweaking for this to become a great set.

I can understand the idea that culture is nuanced and it is most definitely difficult to encapsulate an entire culture within a keycap set. That being said, just as everyone's view of culture is nuanced in their own way, what is so wrong with an individual bringing their own vision of korean culture to life? I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with this. You are always free to disagree, but this set does not stop you from creating your own GMK Mingug or GMK seoul as a counterbalance for your own perspective on Korean culture.

[huey]

I apologize if my tone and original comment was unproductive. I let my frustration get to me. I didn't mean to wish any bad feelings on anyone. I will be more aware moving forward.

I think the topic of culture is different and nuanced for everyone. I grew up like many Asian Americans/Canadians straddling between two cultures. My family is very traditional, so we follow the customs fairly closely despite living in the West, so I grew up very proud of my heritage. But growing up in the west, it can be rare to see an accurate portrayal of our culture -- whether it's the customs, the tradition, the food, the entertainment, etc. So whenever I see our culture displayed, they are often portrayed in a way that's based on what people THINK our background is. Oh Chinese food? Panda Express. Oh Korean food? Kimchi. Japanese food? Sushi. Japanese culture? Anime. Chinese culture? Dragons and red colors.

The reason this set "triggered" me was because I saw it as again a manifestation of my observations. Is it accurate? Probably not. I'm sure Smokey had no ill intentions making it. I'm sorry Smokey if my original comment came off very strong. I'm leaving it up for transparency reasons.

In terms of improvements, here are my suggestions. Not that they matter all that much.

1. Calling the set GMK Korea is a heavy responsibility. It should get Korea right, and I think there are other avenues that could showcase that other than Kimchi, Bibimbap, etc. Another suggestion is just rename the set to GMK Korean Food. The most initial vibe I got from this set was the layout names are food, but the set name is Hanguk. Where are the other Korean elements that are not just food?

2. Tightening the scope of your set to being related to food could unleash even greater flexibility and creativity, as you can showcase even more diverse food items of Korea in various regions, and not just what people generally know about. Maybe you can talk about Korea's prized cow, the Hanwoo. Or the drinking culture (and the foods you eat + games you play) surrounding soju. But JTK Soju already has done this so maybe not. I'm personally not Korean so I won't even begin to say I know the things that Koreans take proudly.

3. Further tightening the scope of this set means also greater creativity and tighter theme with your novelties. It's tough to cover every Korean theme when you only have so many keys to work with.

4. Take the scallions and chopsticks and sesame oil out of the cable photos. The cables are nice enough by themselves without adding those.. slightly stereotypical elements.

That's all I can think of for now.

Again, apologies for the tone. The more I look at this set, the more it seems to me the theme is on what Korean culture means to you. I think the intent is good, but execution can use some tweaking for this to become a great set.

I can understand the idea that culture is nuanced and it is most definitely difficult to encapsulate an entire culture within a keycap set. That being said, just as everyone's view of culture is nuanced in their own way, what is so wrong with an individual bringing their own vision of korean culture to life? I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with this. You are always free to disagree, but this set does not stop you from creating your own GMK Mingug or GMK seoul as a counterbalance for your own perspective on Korean culture.

I get that there is iherently nothing wrong with "bring their own vision of Korean culture to life", but this set has clearly shown a lack of understand of the culture past a surface layer. On top of that, the designer seems to heavily bind food with culture (which, granted, is normally a corner stone of introducing culture) and it displays a lack of understanding past that.

I've never understood the western fetishization of eastern countries, particually in this hobby. I think discourse like this needs to happen.

[Philbeey]

What suggested that the keyset was trying to encapsulate something deep and profound?

The keyset is a representation of a small sliver of Korean culture. It's not here to represent the dresses, the palaces, the silicon tech industry, the car industry and the food industry all while appeasing the literally baseless complaints about it not being the keycap equivalent of Albert Camus' "The Outsider" in philosophical essays.

By all means you and every other soldier ant wants to speak of discourse but again my response to you is like others.
What makes you think; that what you think; is the intended goal.
What do you have to offer as meaningful contribution to cultural markers aside from Twitterific outrage.
What makes you think those contributions are even what this ketcap set is going for.
What theme would you make around a Hangul alpha set.

I can go on and on but you like each and every person comes by with the exact same set of apparent outrage, which is baseless and literally personal preference tied up in a bow of "approximate appropriation outrage".
Vomits their 2 cents and then leaves because at the end of it all its not your cup of tea and you can't speak on behalf of native and disporia Koreans or SEAs of which I am both.

This is an open letter as to everyone planning on jumping in the train and those who have posted and not responded. To go ahead and prove me wrong with the objective enlightenment you all seem to share but are beyond sharing.

How would you do a flag theme.
How would you name it.
How would you colour it.
How would you tool it.
How would incorporate alphas.
How would you change, improve of modify the set.
How would you remove the "fetishism".
How do you represent all Koreans.
How do you represent all American/Oz/Can Koreans.
How would you decide to incorporate "Korea"
How would you cover the grand scheme of ALL Korean culture.
How would you snapshot it if not all.

The discourse is here and happening, and you're all already here. So discuss instead of saying it needs to happen.
Discuss it away. I believe I've laid out enough groundwork that those who only respond in rebuttals alone can have enough to work off.

Sent from my SM-N986W using Tapatalk

[dandruff]

The keyset is a representation of a small sliver of Korean culture.

I'm not here to pick a side, but their point is that the set is literally called GMK South Korea. With a name like that, it does seem to want to represent South Korea as a whole, not just a small sliver of Korean culture.

[Philbeey]

It could also suggest that it may want to cover aspects from it as a whole. Not to encapsulate it.
Not focusing you by the way just taking an opportunity to expand on your point.

Much like you'd not find anything representing a whole culture  you could potentially bring back in 50kg weight limit suitcase.

You'd be hard pressed to do so on a keycap set.

There is no fitting an entire culture in a keycap set so making assumptions that fit a bias aside.
These people, as you put it, are literally setting themselves up for outrage.

And putting that aside as a disingenuous request. You either go remarkably vague or go with themes that will be decreed as "fetishism".

Thematic choices must be made and it takes discretion and discerning decisions to weigh what goes in and what stays out.

I'm curious as to what becomes acceptable then?
Many say it's surface deep but these are exports and are exactly that PROUD exports and markers.

GMK Mexico with Tacos and guac and sombreros and their tricolour sounds awfully off kilter doesn't it but it's entirely because there's a contextual cultural landscape to work with. And throwing broad strokes is a very easy way for people to paint things in extremes on a topic that requires far more nuance in straddling the line of what is homage and appreciation and what unwelcome cliches

Many people including many Koreans from around the globe provided input into this in it's early stages and still do so I employee everyone reading this to read my last comment and well and truly respond to it if you have legitimate fleshed out concerns.

And I'll put it here simply now. If my previous post has no relevance to your disagreements or you cannot respond frankly and with substance. You can roll your eyes all you very well please and tell yourself the disagreement you have is one of a moral high ground.
But if you cannot flesh it out just know, it's okay for different people and different Koreans of all places and kinds to have different tastes to you.
And there's no need to rant as I am, only with the guise of your distaste or disinterest being one under the cover of your moral "woke" high horse.


Sent from my SM-N986W using Tapatalk

[qluboards]

this thread lowkey turning out spicy and fun lol

[Findecanor]

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Thank you for bringing this to our attention. You are definitely the first person to ever notice this. I guess Korea should just rename itself to Pepsi now. Would make it easier for everyone.

No. What I meant is that there isn't any space between the coloured fields in the taegeuk symbol.
If you add the space, it becomes something else.

But that's the least of this set's problems.

[Philbeey]

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Thank you for bringing this to our attention. You are definitely the first person to ever notice this. I guess Korea should just rename itself to Pepsi now. Would make it easier for everyone.

No. What I meant is that there isn't any space between the coloured fields in the taegeuk symbol.
If you add the space, it becomes something else.

But that's the least of this set's problems.

Oh look another hit and run comment with nothing of value to add other than the video which is based entirely on opinion pandered as fact.

What a surprise handful of underdog bandwagon riding people never flesh out their discussion despite, "discourse is required".

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[moonux]

I deeply appreciate the effort in this community to pay homage to Korean culture in a fun way. And I love the recent increase in Korean-themed keycaps. I thought Bingsu was a great example of this kind of thing. As a Korean American, I am not offended here, if it matters. But, I will say that when I saw the set was basically representing Korea as a mashup of the S. Korean flag and Korean food, I was a bit disappointed. Just as if I saw a red, white and blue set as GMK USA with novelties that had hot dogs, hamburgers, stars, and a bald eagle, and kits like "Meatloaf", "Mac and Cheese" or whatever. I think Americans see this all the time when traveling abroad; it's an immediate recognition of, oh yeah, this is how foreigners see America. A bit stereotypical, and I wouldn't buy it, but I wouldn't see any disrespect.

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[NixieTea]

Philbeey, why are you so aggressive? You’re insulting people here for giving their opinions. It seems that YOU are the one offended by the criticism. YOU are acting like an authority on culture while you call out others for exactly that. For the lack of a better comparison, you seem like one of those boomers who complains about any social progress and yells “those damn SJWs”.


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[Philbeey]

If you reference all the posts here they are not presented as opinions and doing hit and run criticisms are the opposite of productive.

So pardon my aggression if I'm not exactly soft spoken to people who are here for honest discussion.

You'll also notice none of the points I've raised have ever been answered.

I'm not an authority on my culture I'm simply providing a look and I'm not claiming I'm the only right view. Only that those who have alternate views should perhaps state them and explain them instead of making sweeping judgements.

Call me a boomer if you like but that much like the rest of your confirmation bias riddled response is based on your own deliberate  misinterpretation of my responses.

Don't make opinionated comments and call them facts. Don't make generalisations then cry aggression when you're avoidant of answering points then claiming that somehow I claimed to be the grand purveyor of all Korean knowledge and my word is final.

I'm not shutting anyone's opinion I'm questioning the misdirection of outrage opinion as fact.
I'm asking for more detail which as I stated no one has answered.
Critique in itself is not free of critique.

The irony is in your hypocrisy though at least it can be said you came back to at least attempt to respond if only to round it out with "hurR boomer SJW hate" to a 24 year old who isn't riding the bandwagon.

All my many many points and requests stand in my previous comments if you do wish to provide myself, anyone else and especially SMOKEY some actual productive criticism though.

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[myseriousdark14]

I think it’s good to have these discussions with the hope of getting better sets in the future, but like someone else said, this ain't it fam.

After watching that video, I couldn’t help but make an account to post my thoughts as a Korean American. Apologies for any formatting errors.

Before getting into what I feel is wrong with the set (many of which are laid out in the video), I’d like make a couple of points:

1.   Intent =/= Impact. As the well-known proverb goes, “The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.” Good intentions are not a strong defense against criticism. Period. It's amazing how many people do not understand this. I was at the park several weeks ago with my toddler son, who was being pushed around by another dad’s kid. “Oh, he means well,” said the dad, all the while making no attempt to stop his son from pushing mine. Should I just take that because your son supposedly has “good intentions”?

2.   You cannot equate a native Korean’s opinions with a Korean American’s or other immigrant Korean, as their experiences are often times significantly different and tinged with racist experiences in their adopted country. Just because Quad-H says the set is good to go, means nothing. I’ve often had the experience of a well-meaning White person telling me how they had such a great time visiting the country of my ethnicity, how they appreciate the culture so much, and how the country is doing so well for themselves. That’s great man, but it really doesn’t have anything to do with me, other than the fact that my ancestors originated there.

3.   The designer of this set does NOT have to be Korean, but if you’re attempting to represent an entire country or culture (especially if you’re standing to profit off of a culture that is not your own), you better get it RIGHT. I understand that to a foreigner the line between appreciation and exotification can be hard to discern, but again, if you stand to profit off of our culture, that's kind of the price of admission to get it right.

OK, with that out of the way, below are my problems with the set (again, many of these points are laid out in the previously mentioned video):

1.   The first image consists of Korean food presented on Japanese lacquerware(!). If not downright offensive, it’s pretty insensitive at the very least and shows a lack of understanding of the cultural and historical nuances at play between the two nations. If you Google a Korean table setting, you’ll notice that the banchan bowls are round, not rectangular. And Korean chopsticks are flat and metal, not square and wood. The KBBQ deskmat has a similar issue, with Japanese-style chopsticks and chopstick rests, which you would not find at an authentic Korean restaurant.

2.   Other than the sublegends, the Base kit does not convey Korea as a country or a culture. The design is tacky, uninspired, and too nail-on-the-head. Flag design =/= the sum of a country and culture. I think deep down, the designer knows this and has tried to compensate with a plethora of collaborations and an aggressive hype campaign.

3.   The hype campaign and artisan collaboration images are SUPER tacky.

4.   A Korean designer would never use Korean numbers as sublegends. It’s like writing “ONE” as a sublegend on the “1” key. Does that look cool in anyway? No.

5.   Koreans eat rice with spoons, not chopsticks. To the designer’s credit, this has been changed but can still be interpreted as chopsticks in the rice. Besides, Koreans don't leave the spoon in the rice anyway.

6.   I absolutely agree with the maker of the video that Korea deserves better than this low-quality representation and that this is simply a blatant cash-grab. I say scrap the set, but maybe proceed with some of the artisan collaborations, so as not to have wasted their time.

Also, Philbeey, stop gaslighting.

[Fredington]

EDIT: Kokaloo (below) you're right. I have nothing constructive to add right now so I will delete this monstrous quote lol.

[Kokaloo]

The real issue is the lack of forum etiquette here with ya'll quoting these extremely long posts.

[Philbeey]

Also, Philbeey, stop gaslighting.

Ah yes evidently what I'm doing and not striving for someone like yourself to actually elaborate.

Though I'm glad you attempted to use Google as a reference to make a singular titular point. Also the chopsticks are dependant on setting and food as well as meal and lacquer wear does exist in traditional Korean homes.
Japan-Korean conflation does exist but like you said this ain't it fam.

Also as per it's own definition of gaslighting if someone's sanity is in question because I have asked them to provide factual explanation to their outrage which is opinion maraudered as fact then my own sanity must be in question.

If people are enough upset that someone isn't fawning over bandwagoned responses and outrage.
To the point over a handful of the same posts many from fresh accounts exist before a singular comment with a singular actual point made existed.

Then so be it. I'm not here to be friendly with those without reciprocation.

Make your points if they're there to be made.
Otherwise skip the fluff about not being interested and of your taste. The IC form already existed for those uninterested to move on.

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[myseriousdark14]

Also, Philbeey, stop gaslighting.

Ah yes evidently what I'm doing and not striving for someone like yourself to actually elaborate.

Though I'm glad you attempted to use Google as a reference to make a singular titular point. Also the chopsticks are dependant on setting and food as well as meal and lacquer wear does exist in traditional Korean homes.
Japan-Korean conflation does exist but like you said this ain't it fam.

Also as per it's own definition of gaslighting if someone's sanity is in question because I have asked them to provide factual explanation to their outrage which is opinion maraudered as fact then my own sanity must be in question.

If people are enough upset that someone isn't fawning over bandwagoned responses and outrage.
To the point over a handful of the same posts many from fresh accounts exist before a singular comment with a singular actual point made existed.

Then so be it. I'm not here to be friendly with those without reciprocation.

Make your points if they're there to be made.
Otherwise skip the fluff about not being interested and of your taste. The IC form already existed for those uninterested to move on.

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Korean lacquerware uses extensive mother-of-pearl and abalone inlays and is ornamental, used to store things like jewelry and not used for food.

Lots of words in your post but no substance.

[tngpq]

Also, Philbeey, stop gaslighting.

Ah yes evidently what I'm doing and not striving for someone like yourself to actually elaborate.

Though I'm glad you attempted to use Google as a reference to make a singular titular point. Also the chopsticks are dependant on setting and food as well as meal and lacquer wear does exist in traditional Korean homes.
Japan-Korean conflation does exist but like you said this ain't it fam.

Also as per it's own definition of gaslighting if someone's sanity is in question because I have asked them to provide factual explanation to their outrage which is opinion maraudered as fact then my own sanity must be in question.

If people are enough upset that someone isn't fawning over bandwagoned responses and outrage.
To the point over a handful of the same posts many from fresh accounts exist before a singular comment with a singular actual point made existed.

Then so be it. I'm not here to be friendly with those without reciprocation.

Make your points if they're there to be made.
Otherwise skip the fluff about not being interested and of your taste. The IC form already existed for those uninterested to move on.

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Korean lacquerware uses extensive mother-of-pearl and abalone inlays and is ornamental, used to store things like jewelry and not used for food.

Lots of words in your post but no substance.

I can confirm this. We don't use lacquerware for food in Korea. Not in any form did our ancestors use dishes like that. Chopsticks were predominantly metal. Since the traditional food display these days are based on the privileged 양반 class table, we never display wood chopsticks. Those became popular in modern era when delivery food became common, mostly originated from Korean Chinese food I would say. That display in the very first picture is a very modernized depiction of Korean food. No Korean will think it's representing our culture in a traditional way. If you don't know **** about Korean culture, stay out of this.

[Philbeey]

Oh damn. Better tell my two sets of grandparents to pack up their lacquer wear. They've been using jewellery storage for food. I'll admit it's not standard within any home but it's far from uncommon.

Also yes the predominant use of chopsticks is one of metal primarily to emulate the  Baejke period where silver chopsticks showed up and were used because they were pure and apparently detect poisons. How I'm not quite sure but nevertheless.

They're a pain to work with but in modern times is only further concreted at least in general public use for the reasons that "disposable" cutlery is regulated in numbers by the government. Though hardly a concern for the pass through numbers of most restaurants.

Primarily aristocracy started the silver trend and commoners would use wooden tools. Silver became stainless steel and convenience and hygiene as well as ease of use became the trend. Wood became much more niche.

So  maybe, much in the very vein of my many words as it was put the purpose of discussion may have been to discover that not experiences are the same and what line is drawn from modern to ancient and what is concerned right.

A discussion between contributes and buyers as to what is considered completely left field, what works and what is generally wrong through and through.

But alas those weren't everyone's desired intentions were they.

[cecioclock]

I apologize if my tone and original comment was unproductive. I let my frustration get to me. I didn't mean to wish any bad feelings on anyone. I will be more aware moving forward.

I think the topic of culture is different and nuanced for everyone. I grew up like many Asian Americans/Canadians straddling between two cultures. My family is very traditional, so we follow the customs fairly closely despite living in the West, so I grew up very proud of my heritage. But growing up in the west, it can be rare to see an accurate portrayal of our culture -- whether it's the customs, the tradition, the food, the entertainment, etc. So whenever I see our culture displayed, they are often portrayed in a way that's based on what people THINK our background is. Oh Chinese food? Panda Express. Oh Korean food? Kimchi. Japanese food? Sushi. Japanese culture? Anime. Chinese culture? Dragons and red colors.

The reason this set "triggered" me was because I saw it as again a manifestation of my observations. Is it accurate? Probably not. I'm sure Smokey had no ill intentions making it. I'm sorry Smokey if my original comment came off very strong. I'm leaving it up for transparency reasons.

In terms of improvements, here are my suggestions. Not that they matter all that much.

1. Calling the set GMK Korea is a heavy responsibility. It should get Korea right, and I think there are other avenues that could showcase that other than Kimchi, Bibimbap, etc. Another suggestion is just rename the set to GMK Korean Food. The most initial vibe I got from this set was the layout names are food, but the set name is Hanguk. Where are the other Korean elements that are not just food?

2. Tightening the scope of your set to being related to food could unleash even greater flexibility and creativity, as you can showcase even more diverse food items of Korea in various regions, and not just what people generally know about. Maybe you can talk about Korea's prized cow, the Hanwoo. Or the drinking culture (and the foods you eat + games you play) surrounding soju. But JTK Soju already has done this so maybe not. I'm personally not Korean so I won't even begin to say I know the things that Koreans take proudly.

3. Further tightening the scope of this set means also greater creativity and tighter theme with your novelties. It's tough to cover every Korean theme when you only have so many keys to work with.

4. Take the scallions and chopsticks and sesame oil out of the cable photos. The cables are nice enough by themselves without adding those.. slightly stereotypical elements.

That's all I can think of for now.

Again, apologies for the tone. The more I look at this set, the more it seems to me the theme is on what Korean culture means to you. I think the intent is good, but execution can use some tweaking for this to become a great set.

I can understand the idea that culture is nuanced and it is most definitely difficult to encapsulate an entire culture within a keycap set. That being said, just as everyone's view of culture is nuanced in their own way, what is so wrong with an individual bringing their own vision of korean culture to life? I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with this. You are always free to disagree, but this set does not stop you from creating your own GMK Mingug or GMK seoul as a counterbalance for your own perspective on Korean culture.

I get that there is iherently nothing wrong with "bring their own vision of Korean culture to life", but this set has clearly shown a lack of understand of the culture past a surface layer. On top of that, the designer seems to heavily bind food with culture (which, granted, is normally a corner stone of introducing culture) and it displays a lack of understanding past that.

I've never understood the western fetishization of eastern countries, particually in this hobby. I think discourse like this needs to happen.

I really agree. Especially as someone who is enthusiastic about reclaiming Korean culture in a wholistic manner/from a family with a lot of history, this set seems like an early 2000’s South Korea’s trying to appeal to western foreigners, inspired from the things Westerners were historically more intrigued about. Lately S Korean culture promotion organizations have been putting in efforts to provide a more local and genuine understanding of our culture, too. The set does seem to set the effort back a few steps, especially since the MK community has a lot of influence on popularizing aesthetics.

(Ft. The font of 대한민국 looks like the standard North Korean print and looks unnatural with the S Korean brighter flag colors in my opinion; first font in the image of representative N Korean fonts attached)

I’ve really been debating on this set, since I want to support Korean sets a lot but this set is feeding into the stereotypically narrow perspectives of S Korean culture.
But despite that, I know the organizer out a lot of effort, and really set an example of being a community-friendly and diligent organizer.
And I thank you for choosing to make a Korean set come true to life!

[Philbeey]

I think the biggest appeal to this set seems primarily to be non-Koreans, disporia Koreans or beyond second generation Koreans.

While thematically it maybe odd for let's say a Korean living in Korea. Much like an Australian likely wouldn't have an overtly Aussie themed set it might be a different matter if they're overseas.

Or in all exceptions sometimes an overtly in your face theme is exactly what some people like myself are looking for.

Different strokes for different folks.

I'm with you Ceic and my primary support definitely comes from the fact that he been respectful and diligent in his work and even if the theme of not everyone's taste it is also many other's. And I hope it spurs a greater desire for these kinds of sets with these efforts allowing for more specific sets with nuances in different places to appear.

As we've seen from Hallyu and hopefully more sets to come.
Maybe a GMK Hanbok or a GMK Gyeongbokgung

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[SMOKEY]

Hello everyone,

so...I have been thinking a lot over the past weekend.

To start off I want to say, that I do not want to go into a discussion with a person, or a group of people, who think that it is a good idea watching a keycap set sit in an almost 4 months long IC phase, with an IC form from day 1 I want to add, without ever voicing their opinion on an implementation of a korean theme  / their culture on a keycap set, feeling disrespected or anything like that. Someone decided now, 2 weeks prior to GB phase, would be a good idea to start with that.

Nonetheless everybody is entitled to their own opinion, and I fully respect that.

There were allegations pulled out of thin air I decided not to go through bit by bit.
I think everyone who voiced objective criticism or constructive feedback on my set, kitting-wise and way beyond that, was heard and I was very open to ASAP change things if someone saw their foot stepped on, like the chopstick in the bowl of rice for example.

Speaking about that. That novelty was trouble from the beginning of this IC, to be quite honest with you. Originally I had something different planned for that "spot" which did not work out as I wanted it to turn out (More on that later). Very early on there were some feedbacks saying that this Novelty was "too generic asian-y", and I felt the same way at first. I decided then to add a specific question regarding that in the IC form. I gave two options:

1. Get rid of it, it's too generic
2. I need my rice, bro.

But the result of this question has shown, while almost 300 people who filled out the form during that period, that 78% voted for second. So I decided to leave it where it is.

All this aside, I do, under no circumstances, want to be known as a designer  / creator / human being that disrespects a whole country and its culture.
I am not a person like that, but I understand some people feel that way. For that, I want to deeply apologize. This was not my intent.

I also understand, that there are quite a lot of Koreans, living in Korea and all over the world, messaging me over the weekend, affirming me that they love the set and that there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. I really appreciate all of you. Thank you so much!

So, long story short, here is what is going to happen:

A. The name of this Set will be changed from "GMK Hanguk" to "GMK Taegeukgi".
I deeply regret that some people felt their culture disrespected. By this change, I want to take the focus off of the "culture". And I think it makes sense, since the complete set has the original, specified colors of the Korean Flag anyways, as well as I have all of this in my novelties, too (Taegeuk, Trigrams i.e.).



B. The kits will be renamed to what they actually are without metaphoric Food-related names. Matching to the new name, the kits names will be named after the 4 trigrams of the flag: geon, ri, gam and gon.

C. The generic rice novelty will be changed to a novelty of a Hahoetal Mask. I had this planned from the beginning and was never satisfied. I want to make sure that I am satisfied now before changing it.


(work in progress)

I just hope by this changes, I am able to make it up to some of you.

Kind Regards,
SMOKEY aka. Chris

[dandruff]

Although I avoided picking a side in all of this and am not one of the ones that dreaded the set, I think the way that you responded is amazing. Obviously it would mean a lot more from someone who had complaints, but regardless, I want to put in my two cents. It is definitely unfortunate that all of this came towards the end of your IC and almost into your GB. You took the community's complaint and quickly acted on it. Regardless if the changes were enough to satisfy everyone, I can definitely commend and applaud you for implementing these changes. Good luck with the set, and I hope it goes well 

Edit: For the record, I don't think the enter novelty was something that people discussed about (unless the change was to match the set's new name more)

[SMOKEY]

Edit: For the record, I don't think the enter novelty was something that people discussed about (unless the change was to match the set's new name more)

I thought it made sense, since I do not want to step on someones foot again. Not sure about that change though.
**edit**
will not be changed.

[myseriousdark14]

What does it matter that someone decided to make that video 2 weeks before the GB? Some people won't see this set until the last day of the GB. Are you going to turn them away if they want to buy it? The timing is out of your hands, as well as theirs for that matter, regardless of how long the IC has been up.

Also, stop hiding behind your intentions. Impact matters (especially in a communal society like Korea) and the fact is you made a cringey AF set that is a poor representative of the subject matter (Japanese tableware, scallions sprinkled over cables--WTF).

You dismiss criticism you don't like as "subjective" and refer to them as "allegations" while avoiding addressing them (sounds like a certain orange-toned world leader we all know). Sorry, but there is no conspiracy against you. You made a bad set and people are calling you for it. No one is making "allegations," just simply voicing their opinions which you claim to respect. Well, respect them by listening--actually listening--and not writing them off as being non-objective.

You also continue to emphasize that many native Koreans have continued to voice their support for the set. That's great, but it doesn't negate the criticism from other parts of the Korean diaspora, none of which you have responded to in any meaningful manner. I hope you can understand that.

Good luck with the GB.

[Emir]

I didn't watch the video but I heard there was drama. Who gives a **** what the inspiration or back story to a set is. If it's good looking and appeals to you then consider buying it. If not, just look at a different set. I can't imagine people unironically being offended.

This is exactly why I just scroll past any 1500 word essays about how their grandmas refrigerator door had a loose rusted hinge which forced them to go to a store to look for a replacement where they happened to stumble across a highschool knitting club knitting an arabian carpet with a pattern that ended up inspiring them to grab a bite to eat and they happened to have kimchi at the asian restaurant they went to there so the set is now based on apricots. come on people, what the ****


edit; we have bigger problems in the world to make 40 min videos about, like what modifier legends people are using. wake up

[Philbeey]

I thought it made sense, since I do not want to step on someones foot again. Not sure about that change though.

My two cents have been throw in already but I'm with Emir generally on this one.

As MySeriousDark has shown it's simply a matter of subject matter and taste rather than one of genuine offence.
Allegations and lack of address being the main points despite the ironic lack of anything being fleshed out beyond "it's cringy"

Some people are looking for a fight and a set that pleases everyone. That's simply not happening.

If you do wish to change names and modifiers by all means.

However the enter key isn't something that was really discussed. Honestly the only thing that was truly discussed is lacquer wear and chopsticks and people who aren't getting the set saying "they've never been a fan of it".

People have legitimate concerns and opportunities a plenty and have been given weeks and months in advance to act.
Things haven't just happened by SMOKEYs hand alone without them here and other feedback did happen.

There are places to request deep cut insights into a culture.
I've still to hear absolutely anyone state how that could be on a keycap set.
Without simply diluting the markers of the set in an all or nothing fashion.

Early examples of productive feedback are a plenty early in so it's definitely not a case of impossibility.






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[harlekein]

GMK Pepsi. Can't unsee it.

[Kokaloo]

I didn't watch the video but I heard there was drama. Who gives a **** what the inspiration or back story to a set is. If it's good looking and appeals to you then consider buying it. If not, just look at a different set. I can't imagine people unironically being offended.

This is exactly why I just scroll past any 1500 word essays about how their grandmas refrigerator door had a loose rusted hinge which forced them to go to a store to look for a replacement where they happened to stumble across a highschool knitting club knitting an arabian carpet with a pattern that ended up inspiring them to grab a bite to eat and they happened to have kimchi at the asian restaurant they went to there so the set is now based on apricots. come on people, what the ****


edit; we have bigger problems in the world to make 40 min videos about, like what modifier legends people are using. wake up

I would implore someone like who you has had many successful group buys (6 right?) to watch the video because it brings up points of consumerist choice. People should be spending more time thinking how they should be spending their money and what the set represents. "ooooooo kbbq!!!!" is what a lot of people got from glancing at this set but internally there was a lot more going on. This thread and other discussions about the set have made me realize how very unempathetic some keyset designers can be, and it's extremely disheartening. If you can't spend an hour watching a critique video and reading how people are affected by it, should you really be in charge of what people are able to buy, especially if it's made to represent a certain group of them?