What your fav mouse?

[Elrick]

I've been reading all of your posts about a Zowie EVO so I'm going to ask for one of those for my bday! If I don't get it then I'll probably buy one!

You need to man up.  Don't depend on others to buy you 'presents' because that's a feminine character trait.  You want something, save up and buy it yourself without relying on others to get stuff for you free of charge.

Life isn't about bludging off other people, it's about making your own way in this world.

[davkol]

You need to man up. Don't depend on others (i.e. 9-year-old workers) to make consumer-grade products for you.

[dustinhxc]

I've been reading all of your posts about a Zowie EVO so I'm going to ask for one of those for my bday! If I don't get it then I'll probably buy one!

You need to man up.  Don't depend on others to buy you 'presents' because that's a feminine character trait.  You want something, save up and buy it yourself without relying on others to get stuff for you free of charge.

Life isn't about bludging off other people, it's about making your own way in this world.

I could buy that **** right now man. It's not about that. It's the fact that I need to make a list for my wife, so I decided a mouse would be a good item. 

[Elrick]

It's not about that. It's the fact that I need to make a list for my wife, so I decided a mouse would be a good item.

You should be telling your wife how much you love her and just being with her in this life together, is more than anything you can ever hope for.  Buying things to engender feelings of love and acceptance is a very hollow one and will pass quicker than water down a pipe.

Just be glad she still accepts you and wants you to touch her each and every day.  Not all women are so inclined for you to do that especially after some years pass by.

[dustinhxc]

It's not about that. It's the fact that I need to make a list for my wife, so I decided a mouse would be a good item.

You should be telling your wife how much you love her and just being with her in this life together, is more than anything you can ever hope for.  Buying things to engender feelings of love and acceptance is a very hollow one and will pass quicker than water down a pipe.

Just be glad she still accepts you and wants you to touch her each and every day.  Not all women are so inclined for you to do that especially after some years pass by.

Of course I tell her I love her and enjoy her company more than anything but we still enjoy getting eachother gifts as well. I do appreciate your compassion, we tell each other all the time that we don't need many gifts.

[CommonCurt]

I know what Dustin means.  My wife and I love each other no matter weather we get each other gifts or not.  It's just fun to do.

And if Dustin is like me then he is a hard guy to get gifts for.  My wife always asks me what I want for a gift when they are being given.

[dustinhxc]

I know what Dustin means.  My wife and I love each other no matter weather we get each other gifts or not.  It's just fun to do.

And if Dustin is like me then he is a hard guy to get gifts for.  My wife always asks me what I want for a gift when they are being given.

Exactly! I am sometimes hard to read as far as for gifts. I have a fine Mouse but it would be rad to have one of those! Maybe its time to try something besides Logitech.

[HPE1000]

I have a deathadder black edition, I like it. Although I might get a new mouse later on. I think I want a more ergonomic mouse, at least something like the microsoft mx mouse, the "high performance" mouse.

My hands are pretty large and the deathadder feels small in my hands.

Also, the "black edition" part of my DA failed just a couple months in, it started getting really rough and did some weird things so I had to take sandpaper to it and sand off all the rubber coating on it. Now it is really slippery and any sweat on my hands makes is even worse. Also, it gets dirty really fast, the super glossy finish I put on it looks really nice but picks so much dirt and grime.

No issues with reliability or performance though, I have had it for over a year without problems.

Anyone have suggestions for people with large hands?

[wetto]

I have a deathadder black edition, I like it. Although I might get a new mouse later on. I think I want a more ergonomic mouse, at least something like the microsoft mx mouse, the "high performance" mouse.

My hands are pretty large and the deathadder feels small in my hands.

Also, the "black edition" part of my DA failed just a couple months in, it started getting really rough and did some weird things so I had to take sandpaper to it and sand off all the rubber coating on it. Now it is really slippery and any sweat on my hands makes is even worse. Also, it gets dirty really fast, the super glossy finish I put on it looks really nice but picks so much dirt and grime.

No issues with reliability or performance though, I have had it for over a year without problems.

Anyone have suggestions for people with large hands?

Mionix Naos 7000? Evoluent Vertical Mouse?

[HPE1000]

I have a deathadder black edition, I like it. Although I might get a new mouse later on. I think I want a more ergonomic mouse, at least something like the microsoft mx mouse, the "high performance" mouse.

My hands are pretty large and the deathadder feels small in my hands.

Also, the "black edition" part of my DA failed just a couple months in, it started getting really rough and did some weird things so I had to take sandpaper to it and sand off all the rubber coating on it. Now it is really slippery and any sweat on my hands makes is even worse. Also, it gets dirty really fast, the super glossy finish I put on it looks really nice but picks so much dirt and grime.

No issues with reliability or performance though, I have had it for over a year without problems.

Anyone have suggestions for people with large hands?

Mionix Naos 7000? Evoluent Vertical Mouse?

The naos doesn't seem bigger, just wider, which i guess isn't a bad thing

Although there is no way I could get used to that vertical mouse, I also want a mouse I can do gaming on. Otherwise I would probably just get a trackball.

[Novus]

I have a deathadder black edition, I like it. Although I might get a new mouse later on. I think I want a more ergonomic mouse, at least something like the microsoft mx mouse, the "high performance" mouse.

My hands are pretty large and the deathadder feels small in my hands.

Also, the "black edition" part of my DA failed just a couple months in, it started getting really rough and did some weird things so I had to take sandpaper to it and sand off all the rubber coating on it. Now it is really slippery and any sweat on my hands makes is even worse. Also, it gets dirty really fast, the super glossy finish I put on it looks really nice but picks so much dirt and grime.

No issues with reliability or performance though, I have had it for over a year without problems.

Anyone have suggestions for people with large hands?

My guess is that its probably not a size issue as much as it is a contour issue. I think the DA probably isn't high enough for you so you aren't able to achieve a good palm grip.

I think you might like the Rival. I think its worth checking out the g400s just to see if it contours better.

I know the thermal take m10 mouse is huge but its not an optical mouse and  ... Well let's just say you should look at that mouse for yourself because it's kinda a wonky design meant for bimmer enthusiasts.

[admiralvorian]

I'm using a logitech g400 right now and I've got to say, this middle-of-the-road mouse has outperformed many other fancy gaming mice I've owned.

[Elrick]

I'm using a logitech g400 right now and I've got to say, this middle-of-the-road mouse has outperformed many other fancy gaming mice I've owned.

Based off the the original MX500 which I still use sometimes, the greatest EVER Logitech device created.  Have no rush to ever put into storage compared to some other junk I spent money on.

[Novus]

I'm using a logitech g400 right now and I've got to say, this middle-of-the-road mouse has outperformed many other fancy gaming mice I've owned.

I think the revised g400 and g400s is actually one of Logitech's best devices out of their current line up. Its optical and its a good decent size for most people.

That's why I don't really like the Logitech naming system.

Following most gaming companies that try to hype their products, Logitech's gaming "top line" (expensive stuff) is comprised of:
laser sensors
Wireless devices
Really tiny devices.

Of course you can make that argument that laser sensors and wireless aren't all that bad but they're not in the same league of precision as optical sensors and precision is what gaming peripherals should really be about.

I don't like that they market these "substandard" devices as gaming peripherals for gamers and even charge a premium on these "gamer" peripherals on top of that. Really terrible practices and I guess while I'm ranting I wish more reviewers actually called these companies out on these sort of marketing practices instead of providing free advertisement.

 

[oscillik]

my favourite mouse for many years was a Logitech MX1000, but the battery died on me and was not user replaceable. This was back in 2004/2005 I think.

When I built up another computer in 2009, I got a Logitech G9x and was very happy with it, the shape was great. And I put all the weights in it too.

I then upgraded to a Steelseries Sensei, and I'm still using it now. Getting rather annoyed with the mouse though, as there are some weird issues with it - it can never do a firmware update properly, always fails about 40% in and requires replugging in the USB, and sometimes the mouse just flatly refuses to work and requires to be plugged back in.

I'm anxiously waiting on a Zowie FK 2014 to arrive in a few weeks time.

[Elrick]

I think the revised g400 and g400s is actually one of Logitech's best devices out of their current line up. Its optical and its a good decent size for most people.

I've got these in succession (still have them) mx500, mx510, mx518 (versions 1600 and 1800 dpi), G400 (second version) and the G400S.  Comparing all of them to QUALITY (housing, switches, weight and graphic styles) the mx500 is still KING.  Why you might say, first off the plastic housing which came out first in these series was HIGH quality meaning it weighed in way above all successive series of so-called gaming mice released by Logitech.  Second, the switches which the mx500 used were perfect, not too sensitive nor too harsh but extremely quiet when pressed.  I suspect they used the original Japanese Omrons which were always first class quality compared to the Chinese made copies.  Third, is that the mx500 has a small metal plate affixed inside the top part of the housing when you first open it.  That helped to make the mouse a little heavier (which I always loved).

The down side of the mx500 was the weak max 800dpi setting within it's original sensor.  You can easily fix that because I swapped out the optical pcb plate from a worn out mx518 (1600dpi version) and slotted it into the mx500 model and presto, new higher frequency 1600dpi mouse.  Plus I love it's replaced onboard sensor that works perfectly at 400, 800 and 1600dpi without any problems  .

Now I have my MOST favourite of all Logitech optical mice, running with some of it's original housing and switches.  You might ask why I bothered to replace the internals of the mouse with something else, it's because I had to originally replace the outer black side, rubber casing with a newer mx518 black-coloured shell.  The original mx500 black rubber casing had dissolved into a sticky soft mess.  The rubber material they used was just that and never lasted long, because as soon as you placed your hand onto an original mx500 mouse that awful stickiness was there.  Logitech used the black coloured rubber which has already reached the end of it's usable lifespan and nothing you could do to fix that, other than to replace it, or get a newer mouse - riigghhtttt  .

So I replaced the black rubber side casing with a newer plastic version from an mx518 and it became a new mouse again.  I also kept the original underneath plate housing because I always favoured the original small 5 oval plastic feet that gave the mouse a different feeling on my mouse pads compared to the newer 3 part versions, sold on all the current G400's.

I always hated to throw away good mice due to housing failures so you can easily fix that.  I never thought Logitech could get any worse as they progress forward but as usual they never fail to highlight their accounting cheapness, in making mice with deliberate obsolescence so that we all can stoke up land fill sites over time, with their failed products  .

[wetto]

I'm one of those that seriously hope that Logitech understands the crap they're doing. The Logitech G9x for an instance is an awesome mouse that SHOULD receive a better version. And by better, I don't mean replacing the AVAGO 9500 sensor for an AVAGO 9800, that's some retarded bull**** that many companies are doing, but by doing the following:

- Replacing the entire scroll wheel system for a standard TTC or ALPS scroll encoder with no horizontal buttons.

Why? I know some people like horizontal buttons, but the biggest reason why the sensor was off-centered was actually because of the size of that scroll wheel thing. It's damn huge!
http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/8515/2u32.jpg

Also, at the same time this could make it possible to fix the problem of the middle button switch, which is an extremely low quality SMT type switch. That switch could be replaced for an TTC White or OTM Red switch. Hell, even Kailh or Zhij switches would be better than what was used before.
http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/7572/tklr.jpg

- Using standard mouse switches for the side buttons

I'm not one to complain when the DPI buttons use some low quality switches, because they're the least used switches on the mouse. But now, when the side buttons use the same switches as they do, things do get more complicated.
http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/183/iy0t.jpg

These are extremely low quality and cheap membrane switches, their feedback isn't that good and they cannot be replaced for any other switch. Plus, no one makes replacements for these, so, if your side buttons on the Logitech G9x end up failing, you're basically screwed.

- Going Optical

There are plenty of great optical sensors nowadays. The AVAGO 3090, 3095, 3310 and I know Logitech could even come up with a modified version of the 3310 if they wanted to. I could say stuff for half an hour, but I think posting this is just about enough:

[18/02/2014 15:01:37] Carter Salley: people who buy 9800 are people who have ZERO idea about internal components

[Novus]

I'm one of those that seriously hope that Logitech understands the crap they're doing. The Logitech G9x for an instance is an awesome mouse that SHOULD receive a better version. And by better, I don't mean replacing the AVAGO 9500 sensor for an AVAGO 9800, that's some retarded bull**** that many companies are doing, but by doing the following:

- Replacing the entire scroll wheel system for a standard TTC or ALPS scroll encoder with no horizontal buttons.

Why? I know some people like horizontal buttons, but the biggest reason why the sensor was off-centered was actually because of the size of that scroll wheel thing. It's damn huge!
http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/8515/2u32.jpg

Also, at the same time this could make it possible to fix the problem of the middle button switch, which is an extremely low quality SMT type switch. That switch could be replaced for an TTC White or OTM Red switch. Hell, even Kailh or Zhij switches would be better than what was used before.
http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/7572/tklr.jpg

- Using standard mouse switches for the side buttons

I'm not one to complain when the DPI buttons use some low quality switches, because they're the least used switches on the mouse. But now, when the side buttons use the same switches as they do, things do get more complicated.
http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/183/iy0t.jpg

These are extremely low quality and cheap membrane switches, their feedback isn't that good and they cannot be replaced for any other switch. Plus, no one makes replacements for these, so, if your side buttons on the Logitech G9x end up failing, you're basically screwed.

- Going Optical

There are plenty of great optical sensors nowadays. The AVAGO 3090, 3095, 3310 and I know Logitech could even come up with a modified version of the 3310 if they wanted to. I could say stuff for half an hour, but I think posting this is just about enough:

[18/02/2014 15:01:37] Carter Salley: people who buy 9800 are people who have ZERO idea about internal components

[/b]

Yea, I've always been puzzled as to why they didn't make a better refresh of the g9x.
Especially since the g9x was such a widely acclaimed mouse when it was released (despite it's numerous faults ... well then again those reviewers on popular general blogs don't really know what to look for).

Speaking of the 9800, it's a shame that CM also indulges in ... marketing hype cockery ... selling their most expensive mouses with a 9800 to give the impression that it's truly a premium product to unsuspecting people. Company bureaucracy at it's finest.

We should definitely start a mouse rant thread!

[Rena]

I haven't used many mice but the G9x is by far one of the most comfortable I've ever used. The sensor isn't really perfect at all but it's certainly nice still

[wetto]

I haven't used many mice but the G9x is by far one of the most comfortable I've ever used. The sensor isn't really perfect at all but it's certainly nice still

We're there with that comfort part bro, but there are unfortunately lots of points that could be fixed... There were plenty of people mad when I gave the Logitech G9x a 7/10 on my review of it, but I told them that if it weren't for the ergonomics, I'd give it a 5/10 or less due to the low quality internals and horrible price.

[Rena]

I haven't used many mice but the G9x is by far one of the most comfortable I've ever used. The sensor isn't really perfect at all but it's certainly nice still

We're there with that comfort part bro, but there are unfortunately lots of points that could be fixed... There were plenty of people mad when I gave the Logitech G9x a 7/10 on my review of it, but I told them that if it weren't for the ergonomics, I'd give it a 5/10 or less due to the low quality internals and horrible price.

price wasn't an issue for me since I got it for $38 but I completely agree it isn't worth $90 or whatever they're charging now. It's appearance and feel are great, and the DPI buttons on top are very helpful too, but the sensor and internals are just too inadequate to recommend at more than $40

[Novus]

Look at this.
Ugh.
How misleading.

[Rena]

12 hour battery life? Who would ever want that?

Sounds ****ing terrible. It's already bad enough they're advertising a wireless mouse as superior.

[Elrick]

(Attachment Link)
Look at this.
Ugh.
How misleading.

Yes, Logitech has gone all Razer-like with their crappy postings about their input devices.  Because there are no real reviewers out there that would take them to task for making such blatant claims about their dodgey products, it becomes the norm and noobs get lured into their marketing hype and start gaping their wallets.

I actually stopped buying their latest gear (except the G400S and G500S) yes I'm an idiot noob  .  Sheet, I don't even know why I posted this, I outted myself into still supporting these lame bastards  .

[wetto]

12 hour battery life? Who would ever want that?

Sounds ****ing terrible. It's already bad enough they're advertising a wireless mouse as superior.

Worse than that is the fact that it weights 150 grams with the battery, so, it's extremely heavy. I hated  using it since I have fingertip grip...

But anyways, it doesn't lasts more than 2-3 days playing and it uses a Sanyo Eneloop battery (which fortunately is the best rechargeable battery available, you can let it alone for 5 years and it'll still have more than half its charge left, plus it lasts more than 1500 recharges while other cheap rechargeable battery end up dying in between 200-500 recharges).

Anyways, unfortunately when you compare that 12 hours battery with other mice that competes with it (Razer Mamba, Razer Naga Epic, Steelseries Wow, Steelseries Sensei Wireless, A4Tech Bloody R7 and Cyborg R.A.T 9), all of these suffer of the same problems. None last longer than a 4-5 days of use.

The reason for this is because none of these were really planned to be wireless. Most use components that are NOT power-friendly (lol, the AVAGO 9800 sure doesn't seems to be a sensor that requires a low amount of energy nor does the PTE 2032 and 2033), plus other stuff like internal memory and a processor and the most important of all, all of these try to have this "1000 Hz laglesss" policy, which is actually the main cause for the battery to last next to nothing. The higher the refresh rate, the higher battery consume and less delay in the communication there will be. And yes, that's the reason why some of those cheap wireless mice have some delay.

The G602 thankfully had a different approach. They used an optical sensor which doesn't requires much energy, plus the tranmission method was changed and the "gaming refresh rate" has been decreased to 500 Hz, while it can use a 125 Hz refresh rate when you're not playing. Less gaming "gimmicks", but far better as a wireless mouse.

(Attachment Link)
Look at this.
Ugh.
How misleading.

Yes, Logitech has gone all Razer-like with their crappy postings about their input devices.  Because there are no real reviewers out there that would take them to task for making such blatant claims about their dodgey products, it becomes the norm and noobs get lured into their marketing hype and start gaping their wallets.

I actually stopped buying their latest gear (except the G400S and G500S) yes I'm an idiot noob  .  Sheet, I don't even know why I posted this, I outted myself into still supporting these lame bastards  .

While the Logitech G700s isn't a bad mouse, it's far inferior to the Logitech G602, but they still want to make it "look" superior due to the laser sensor, high DPI value and higher refresh rate... And jesus, the G400/G400s makes it look silly when you truly compare each other.

[Kamen Rider Blade]

12 hour battery life? Who would ever want that?

Sounds ****ing terrible. It's already bad enough they're advertising a wireless mouse as superior.

Worse than that is the fact that it weights 150 grams with the battery, so, it's extremely heavy. I hated  using it since I have fingertip grip...

But anyways, it doesn't lasts more than 2-3 days playing and it uses a Sanyo Eneloop battery (which fortunately is the best rechargeable battery available, you can let it alone for 5 years and it'll still have more than half its charge left, plus it lasts more than 1500 recharges while other cheap rechargeable battery end up dying in between 200-500 recharges).

Anyways, unfortunately when you compare that 12 hours battery with other mice that competes with it (Razer Mamba, Razer Naga Epic, Steelseries Wow, Steelseries Sensei Wireless, A4Tech Bloody R7 and Cyborg R.A.T 9), all of these suffer of the same problems. None last longer than a 4-5 days of use.

The reason for this is because none of these were really planned to be wireless. Most use components that are NOT power-friendly (lol, the AVAGO 9800 sure doesn't seems to be a sensor that requires a low amount of energy nor does the PTE 2032 and 2033), plus other stuff like internal memory and a processor and the most important of all, all of these try to have this "1000 Hz laglesss" policy, which is actually the main cause for the battery to last next to nothing. The higher the refresh rate, the higher battery consume and less delay in the communication there will be. And yes, that's the reason why some of those cheap wireless mice have some delay.

The G602 thankfully had a different approach. They used an optical sensor which doesn't requires much energy, plus the tranmission method was changed and the "gaming refresh rate" has been decreased to 500 Hz, while it can use a 125 Hz refresh rate when you're not playing. Less gaming "gimmicks", but far better as a wireless mouse.

(Attachment Link)
Look at this.
Ugh.
How misleading.

Yes, Logitech has gone all Razer-like with their crappy postings about their input devices.  Because there are no real reviewers out there that would take them to task for making such blatant claims about their dodgey products, it becomes the norm and noobs get lured into their marketing hype and start gaping their wallets.

I actually stopped buying their latest gear (except the G400S and G500S) yes I'm an idiot noob  .  Sheet, I don't even know why I posted this, I outted myself into still supporting these lame bastards  .

While the Logitech G700s isn't a bad mouse, it's far inferior to the Logitech G602, but they still want to make it "look" superior due to the laser sensor, high DPI value and higher refresh rate... And jesus, the G400/G400s makes it look silly when you truly compare each other.

As somebody who has the G602, the battery life is AWESOME.

I'm okay with the feature set.

Honestly the G700 feels like a wired mouse they slapped wireless functionality onto and called it a day.

They didn't bother designing it as a wireless mouse from the ground up from what I can tell.

Whereas the G602, they figured out what they needed to make a good wireless mouse and bam, success IMO.

One of the best mouse that I've ever used.

Honestly, when they refresh the G700s, they better turned it into a nice wired mouse.

That would make it perfect IMO.

[wetto]

As somebody who has the G602, the battery life is AWESOME.

Whereas the G602, they figured out what they needed to make a good wireless mouse and bam, success IMO.

One of the best mouse that I've ever used.

And that's exactly the reason why I ordered one. Plus, I need something good to use with my HTPC along with the Matias Secure Pro.

[Johan]

I'm surprised that they market the g100s as a great value, ranges from 54-60 in sweden. Seems like a lot for a 3 button mouse, considering I got a xornet for 20$.

[dmbr]

Why didn't they add a 1000hz option?

[wetto]

Why didn't they add a 1000hz option?

The higher the refresh rate, the higher the energy consumption. They wouldn't be able to keep that "250 hours battery" claim if people were able to set it up to 1000 Hz.

Besides, 2ms delay (500hz) isn't really that much, it's a sacrifice that's worth it since it does increases the battery life a lot and it's not even perceptible outside of tests.

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Why didn't they add a 1000hz option?

The higher the refresh rate, the higher the energy consumption. They wouldn't be able to keep that "250 hours battery" claim if people were able to set it up to 1000 Hz.

Besides, 2ms delay (500hz) isn't really that much, it's a sacrifice that's worth it since it does increases the battery life a lot and it's not even perceptible outside of tests.

1 ms delay between polling (1000 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 7 ms, 8x Power Consumption>
2 ms delay between polling ( 500 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 6 ms, 4x Power Consumption>
4 ms delay between polling ( 250 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 4 ms, 2x Power Consumption>
8 ms delay between polling ( 125 Hz) <Base Input Lag, Base Power Consumption>

You do the math, what is the best Performance gain to Power Consumption ratio IYO?
For wireless, I can never see 1,000 Hz as a good Option
500 Hz, 250 Hz, and 125 Hz are the best choices IMO.

[daerid]

I believe there's several pro gamers out there that do just fine @ 500hz

[munch]

I'm surprised that they market the g100s as a great value, ranges from 54-60 in sweden. Seems like a lot for a 3 button mouse, considering I got a xornet for 20$.

heh, I currently live in Sweden but bought a G100s for my brother while I was in Canada and got it for $38 CAD (~$34 USD)
at that price point I find it to be a really good deal. the innards are great and it does feel quite nice. he's a big fan of it, and as am I.
personally loving the G400s though. for its shape and good but not quite perfect sensor. good enough though. the 'smoothing' doesn't bother me too much.

[Elrick]

I'm surprised that they market the g100s as a great value, ranges from 54-60 in sweden. Seems like a lot for a 3 button mouse, considering I got a xornet for 20$.

heh, I currently live in Sweden but bought a G100s for my brother while I was in Canada and got it for $38 CAD (~$34 USD)
at that price point I find it to be a really good deal. the innards are great and it does feel quite nice. he's a big fan of it, and as am I.
personally loving the G400s though. for its shape and good but not quite perfect sensor. good enough though. the 'smoothing' doesn't bother me too much.

If you love the way the WMO fits in your hand then you'll orgasm over the G100S.  I'm not a fan over the wmo because it's just too damn small for my right hand but a lot of gamers swear over the wmo as the world's best mouse (don't quote me here).

The G400 shape is the only one I like but there are some other shapes out there worth noting like the current Mionix NAOS 7000 which is to die for but there is still the Zowie EC1's and Roccat Kone Pure Optical are the current BEST mice you can easily buy.  I have them all but I still go back to the NAOS 7000 for everyday use, because it's like caressing a super model, without the put downs  .

[wetto]

I'm surprised that they market the g100s as a great value, ranges from 54-60 in sweden. Seems like a lot for a 3 button mouse, considering I got a xornet for 20$.

heh, I currently live in Sweden but bought a G100s for my brother while I was in Canada and got it for $38 CAD (~$34 USD)
at that price point I find it to be a really good deal. the innards are great and it does feel quite nice. he's a big fan of it, and as am I.
personally loving the G400s though. for its shape and good but not quite perfect sensor. good enough though. the 'smoothing' doesn't bother me too much.

If you love the way the WMO fits in your hand then you'll orgasm over the G100S.  I'm not a fan over the wmo because it's just too damn small for my right hand but a lot of gamers swear over the wmo as the world's best mouse (don't quote me here).

The G400 shape is the only one I like but there are some other shapes out there worth noting like the current Mionix NAOS 7000 which is to die for but there is still the Zowie EC1's and Roccat Kone Pure Optical are the current BEST mice you can easily buy.  I have them all but I still go back to the NAOS 7000 for everyday use, because it's like caressing a super model, without the put downs  .

While I really don't find the Roccat Kone Pure's shape as being "one of the best" there is out there for Fingertip/Claw grips (it's good, but I'd rather have a Logitech G9x or Corsair M65 on the ergonomics department), one thing is true: That thing was made with some of the best materials available in the market.

An extremely comfortable rubber coating unlike many others, incredibly smooth Teflon feet (it just feels like a piece of soap on the first days, but you get used to it and end up loving it), TTC switches on the side buttons, a lovely ALPS scroll wheel which was implemented in a way so it wouldn't be extremely noisy (it's a little bit, but it's very acceptable) and a really nice software if you're into it. The only complaint I have is that they didn't used the OMRON D2FC-F-7N 10M or 20M variants, but the common 5M model, but even still, it's a mouse that's very, very impressive. And it's the only mouse that I regret selling, even though the model I had was the AVAGO 9800 one (though I did get R$ 250 [around US$ 120] for it  )

[mauri]

Why didn't they add a 1000hz option?

The higher the refresh rate, the higher the energy consumption. They wouldn't be able to keep that "250 hours battery" claim if people were able to set it up to 1000 Hz.

Besides, 2ms delay (500hz) isn't really that much, it's a sacrifice that's worth it since it does increases the battery life a lot and it's not even perceptible outside of tests.

1 ms delay between polling (1000 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 7 ms, 8x Power Consumption>
2 ms delay between polling ( 500 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 6 ms, 4x Power Consumption>
4 ms delay between polling ( 250 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 4 ms, 2x Power Consumption>
8 ms delay between polling ( 125 Hz) <Base Input Lag, Base Power Consumption>

You do the math, what is the best Performance gain to Power Consumption ratio IYO?
For wireless, I can never see 1,000 Hz as a good Option
500 Hz, 250 Hz, and 125 Hz are the best choices IMO.

The problem with 1000 hz is that the mice in the market atm can't hold a steady 1000 hz, it fluctuates way more than say, 500 hz would. I was pretty content with 125 until I tried 500, after that there was no coming back to the ****ty 125 hz.

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Why didn't they add a 1000hz option?

The higher the refresh rate, the higher the energy consumption. They wouldn't be able to keep that "250 hours battery" claim if people were able to set it up to 1000 Hz.

Besides, 2ms delay (500hz) isn't really that much, it's a sacrifice that's worth it since it does increases the battery life a lot and it's not even perceptible outside of tests.

1 ms delay between polling (1000 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 7 ms, 8x Power Consumption>
2 ms delay between polling ( 500 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 6 ms, 4x Power Consumption>
4 ms delay between polling ( 250 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 4 ms, 2x Power Consumption>
8 ms delay between polling ( 125 Hz) <Base Input Lag, Base Power Consumption>

You do the math, what is the best Performance gain to Power Consumption ratio IYO?
For wireless, I can never see 1,000 Hz as a good Option
500 Hz, 250 Hz, and 125 Hz are the best choices IMO.

The problem with 1000 hz is that the mice in the market atm can't hold a steady 1000 hz, it fluctuates way more than say, 500 hz would. I was pretty content with 125 until I tried 500, after that there was no coming back to the ****ty 125 hz.

That is sad if the mice can't deal with 1000 Hz steady. Do you have any hard evidence that mice fluctuate?

[Elrick]

The problem with 1000 hz is that the mice in the market atm can't hold a steady 1000 hz, it fluctuates way more than say, 500 hz would. I was pretty content with 125 until I tried 500, after that there was no coming back to the ****ty 125 hz.

I saw someone reviewing the First edition G400 and it showed that it was operating at the full 1000hz but showing the older version Razer DA fluctuating between 450 to 800hz when it should of been working at 1000hz.

The reason why Logitech fixed it in their G400 model was to always operate at that speed because very few other mice would work reliably at that setting, that gave them the edge.  Every other model version they had didn't work at 1000hz even their mx500, mx510 and mx518 operated at around 125hz default.

[Novus]

I'm surprised that they market the g100s as a great value, ranges from 54-60 in sweden. Seems like a lot for a 3 button mouse, considering I got a xornet for 20$.

heh, I currently live in Sweden but bought a G100s for my brother while I was in Canada and got it for $38 CAD (~$34 USD)
at that price point I find it to be a really good deal. the innards are great and it does feel quite nice. he's a big fan of it, and as am I.
personally loving the G400s though. for its shape and good but not quite perfect sensor. good enough though. the 'smoothing' doesn't bother me too much.

If you love the way the WMO fits in your hand then you'll orgasm over the G100S.  I'm not a fan over the wmo because it's just too damn small for my right hand but a lot of gamers swear over the wmo as the world's best mouse (don't quote me here).

The G400 shape is the only one I like but there are some other shapes out there worth noting like the current Mionix NAOS 7000 which is to die for but there is still the Zowie EC1's and Roccat Kone Pure Optical are the current BEST mice you can easily buy.  I have them all but I still go back to the NAOS 7000 for everyday use, because it's like caressing a super model, without the put downs  .

You should write a NAOS 7000 review!

[daerid]

with pics!

[wetto]

with pics!

Teardown too! 

[Elrick]

You should write a NAOS 7000 review!

I don't have the expertise as you guys have in presenting detailed investigation of any device, plus embarrassing myself should be kept in print only.  I also never take pics of anything, simply because I loath having any personal images uploaded onto the net (due to other circumstances).

Just better to describe via print like in the 56K days which I have grown up with.  The younger gens here on this website just don't know what it was like but I miss those days when everything loaded into your Netscape browser almost instantly despite traveling at under 56kbit/s  .

[demik]

need somebody wireless for crapple. bluetooth or with dongle, doesn't matter. any ideas?

[dmbr]

Just tried the Kone Pure Optical...perfect sensor (tape-trick required, though) and decent buttons, but sadly, the texture is slippery and the grip cramps my hand.

Not sure what other options I have since the Kana v2 and g400 don't fit my grip either :/

It's a real pity, I love everything about the Zowie evo EC2 CL, but the bit of jitter really bugs me.

[wetto]

Just tried the Kone Pure Optical...perfect sensor (tape-trick required, though) and decent buttons, but sadly, the texture is slippery and the grip cramps my hand.

Not sure what other options I have since the Kana v2 and g400 don't fit my grip either :/

It's a real pity, I love everything about the Zowie evo EC2 CL, but the bit of jitter really bugs me.

The reason why some of these AVAGO 3090 mice have 3-5 CDs LOD (and why some people end up using the tape-fix) is because the LOD is directly related to the surface tracking capabilities of the AVAGO 3090 sensor. The lower the LOD, less surfaces it can track on and it can have some problems with certain colored mousepads.



For an example, the CM Storm Recon (which isn't in the picture, sorry) does not tracks when placed over the Thermaltake's Red Dragon when the LOD is set to "1" (which is the lowest possible), but it can track perfectly when configured to "3", "4" or "5".

Now, here on the wood desk on which my computer is:



The CM Storm Recon does NOT tracks in any other LOD besides "5", and even still the tracking is not exactly "perfect", it still fails on a lot of moments.

What I'm trying to say, is that although having the lowest LOD possible increases the mouse's "accuracy", LOD adjustment settings may end up helping users on cases where the mouse's being used on a low-quality mouse-pad or surface. If someone wants to use an AVAGO 3090 mouse with the lowest LOD possible, I strongly recommend buying a good black cloth mouse-pad.

Now, let's think about what sort of mousepads Roccat offers to their clients:



Just think how ridiculous it'd be if the Roccat Kone Pure Optical were to not work properly on that mousepad... 

Anyways, yes, a high LOD is a bad thing, but being unable to track on certain colors/surfaces is just as bad too, thus companies need to find a balance between both of them.

[mauri]

Why didn't they add a 1000hz option?

The higher the refresh rate, the higher the energy consumption. They wouldn't be able to keep that "250 hours battery" claim if people were able to set it up to 1000 Hz.

Besides, 2ms delay (500hz) isn't really that much, it's a sacrifice that's worth it since it does increases the battery life a lot and it's not even perceptible outside of tests.

1 ms delay between polling (1000 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 7 ms, 8x Power Consumption>
2 ms delay between polling ( 500 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 6 ms, 4x Power Consumption>
4 ms delay between polling ( 250 Hz) <Reduce Input Lag by 4 ms, 2x Power Consumption>
8 ms delay between polling ( 125 Hz) <Base Input Lag, Base Power Consumption>

You do the math, what is the best Performance gain to Power Consumption ratio IYO?
For wireless, I can never see 1,000 Hz as a good Option
500 Hz, 250 Hz, and 125 Hz are the best choices IMO.

The problem with 1000 hz is that the mice in the market atm can't hold a steady 1000 hz, it fluctuates way more than say, 500 hz would. I was pretty content with 125 until I tried 500, after that there was no coming back to the ****ty 125 hz.

That is sad if the mice can't deal with 1000 Hz steady. Do you have any hard evidence that mice fluctuate?

Mouse rate checker.

[Novus]

You should write a NAOS 7000 review!

I don't have the expertise as you guys have in presenting detailed investigation of any device, plus embarrassing myself should be kept in print only.  I also never take pics of anything, simply because I loath having any personal images uploaded onto the net (due to other circumstances).

Just better to describe via print like in the 56K days which I have grown up with.  The younger gens here on this website just don't know what it was like but I miss those days when everything loaded into your Netscape browser almost instantly despite traveling at under 56kbit/s  .

I didn't get broadband until 2002-2003 because it wasn't available where I live :/
All my friends had DSL and Cable. I had crappy dial up.
That was not fun.


So back to the mionix.
I tried a mionix at an open display once. I think it was the Avior 8200 - I'm not sure but I remembered that I wished it was a bit taller and longer when I was trying to palm it so it's probably the avior.
I remember the external quality of the mouse was somewhat similar to a Logitech mouse but it's not easy to judge a mouse when it's outside in a retail store.
You seem to really like your mionix and it's been well received, what gives it the je ne sais quoi over everything else -is the build quality that much better?
Is it the ring and pinkie finger rest?
Does the S.Q.A.T™ – Surface Quality Analyzer Tool actually work or is it a gimmick?

[SirReallySam]

I don't know yet... XD

[Elrick]

Just disemboweled my ancient mx500 simply because I couldn't stand the rubber compound gone all sticky and oozy (disgusting).

Replaced the older black plastic rubber-compound with a newer G400 case shell.  You can find them on Ebay for around $14.00USD.  I received it today and set about taking apart the new shell and replacing it with some of the internals of my mx500.  The only things I took away from the mx500 is the tiny weight disk with screw and took the scroll wheel housing assembly with Omron Switches.  These omrons where made in Japan as the print showed and they definitely feel superb after all these years.  The funny thing is inside these older mice they used all omron switches hence these input devices were built to last compared to the ratty junk currently sold everywhere now.

I also ripped off the grey coloured fascia of the older mx500 and replaced it onto the newer G400 shell (by removing the newer fascia of course).  I basically want my new upgraded mouse to work with the older gear because it simply still works for me  .

I also replaced the older usb cable with a brand new one consisting of woven fabric.  Much more pliable and very easy to attach and thread through their idiot maze under the pcb.  I also swapped out the older mx500 PCB - LED sensor with the newer mx518 (wanted the upgrade from the max 800dpi to 1600dpi).  Currently using it now as I type, very beautiful mouse to use.  I think this one plus the NAOS 7000 are my ALL TIME FAVOURITE input devices to use.

A pure pleasure to finally use a true Frankenstein Mouse (It's alive, it's alive), a delight to use something that has been tested and confirmed as the very best Logitech has made thus far, the red coloured led is simply beautiful to behold.  Never throw away mice always keep them for future upgrades and testing  .

[POMPyro]

For me this is the best week in computer history.  Got my ps2 TrackBall mouse working on my new computer.  Tried a Naga for the macros & G5 is my backup.  Maybe my imagination or does anyone know why during fast movements the TrackBall feels more responsive that my other two laser mice.  Is it a mechanical thing?