Author Topic: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling  (Read 70685 times)

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Offline SMKNGNZ

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Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« on: Wed, 17 January 2018, 17:55:46 »
During the Seattle Mechanical Keyboard Meetup on January 13th, Melissa was able to share samples of our long retired DSS keycap family with several of you. Since there appeared to be interest in producing this family again, we have decided to go ahead and tool up several shapes that are missing from today's keyboard configurations. We hope to have this tooling completed over the next few months.
The DSS family is a medium height key with a spherical matte finish touch surface (similar to DSA) and a sculptured profile. We will add a data sheet of the DSS profile to the KeyShop Resources page shortly.

Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 17 January 2018, 18:51:15 »
Will the DSS family support both double-shot and dye-sub legends?

Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 17 January 2018, 20:30:12 »
No it won't. Only double-shot. We went down that road with the double-shot (ABS) SA tooling and were very unhappy with the results, especially with the darker PBT colors. Because of the large void left to fill without a first shot insert to balance the wall thickness, the parts were subject to sink, warping, flow lines, you name it. We see the same results, to a lesser degree, with the DSA tooling which was also designed for double-shot ABS molding. New DSA PBT molds are in the schedule with a late '18 early '19 completion.

Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #3 on: Thu, 18 January 2018, 12:06:50 »
Okay, so initially DSS will be double-shot ABS only? That's still pretty awesome. I look forward to this!

Offline dr_derivative

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #4 on: Thu, 18 January 2018, 12:11:31 »
Do you have any pictures of the samples? There has been a lot of talk about samples but nobody seems to have taken any pictures of them at the meetup.
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Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #5 on: Thu, 18 January 2018, 13:41:07 »
Always interested in new profiles.  I've never seen DSS but I see their profile discussed in several forums.  Do they have angled stems? The profile looks bizarre to me on a flat plate.

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 18 January 2018, 17:05:27 »
I would like to know:
* Will there be support for ISO Enter?
* Is the surface slick (like SA) or textured (like DCS or DSA) ?

I've never seen DSS but I see their profile discussed in several forums.  Do they have angled stems? The profile looks bizarre to me on a flat plate.
In Signature Plastics' info on DSS, it looks to me like it is closer to "OEM profile" in heights but closer to DCS in which angles the top surfaces have. I think I would personally prefer that over SA.

Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 18 January 2018, 18:46:53 »
In the very first post, Bob said:

Quote
The DSS family is a medium height key with a spherical matte finish touch surface (similar to DSA) and a sculptured profile.

Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 18 January 2018, 19:44:52 »
I will post some pics of the 60% board we put together next week. The DSS top surface is a matte finish like the DSA. We need to build a number of shapes before we have it production ready: R3 2.25; R4 2.75; R1 2sp; R3 stepped 1.75; R3/4 vertical 2 space (NP); ISO key; and a 6.25 R3 space bar. A R3 6u SB is already tooled. The board Melissa had at the Seattle meetup had a DCS R4 bar that matched the R4 DSS profile but was nasty to type on.

Offline a_ak57

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #9 on: Sun, 21 January 2018, 10:43:49 »
I will post some pics of the 60% board we put together next week. The DSS top surface is a matte finish like the DSA. We need to build a number of shapes before we have it production ready: R3 2.25; R4 2.75; R1 2sp; R3 stepped 1.75; R3/4 vertical 2 space (NP); ISO key; and a 6.25 R3 space bar. A R3 6u SB is already tooled. The board Melissa had at the Seattle meetup had a DCS R4 bar that matched the R4 DSS profile but was nasty to type on.

Are the 6u space bar's stems going to be in the same position as the 6u DSA bars, i.e. centered middle stem with outer stems that are considerably closer in than a 6u GMK bar's?

Offline blighty

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #10 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 10:20:31 »
I will post some pics of the 60% board we put together next week. The DSS top surface is a matte finish like the DSA. We need to build a number of shapes before we have it production ready: R3 2.25; R4 2.75; R1 2sp; R3 stepped 1.75; R3/4 vertical 2 space (NP); ISO key; and a 6.25 R3 space bar. A R3 6u SB is already tooled. The board Melissa had at the Seattle meetup had a DCS R4 bar that matched the R4 DSS profile but was nasty to type on.

Is there already a R3 7u space bar?
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Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #11 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 12:12:23 »
Pics of DSS family

Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #12 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 12:23:38 »
I will post some pics of the 60% board we put together next week. The DSS top surface is a matte finish like the DSA. We need to build a number of shapes before we have it production ready: R3 2.25; R4 2.75; R1 2sp; R3 stepped 1.75; R3/4 vertical 2 space (NP); ISO key; and a 6.25 R3 space bar. A R3 6u SB is already tooled. The board Melissa had at the Seattle meetup had a DCS R4 bar that matched the R4 DSS profile but was nasty to type on.

Are the 6u space bar's stems going to be in the same position as the 6u DSA bars, i.e. centered middle stem with outer stems that are considerably closer in than a 6u GMK bar's?
We currently mold the DSA 6u space bar with a center mount and outboard mounts 1.520" from center. The DSS 6u R3 space bar has a center mount and fixed outboard mounts at 1.880" from center. We have little info on where users would like the outboard mounts located.

Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #13 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 12:24:35 »
I will post some pics of the 60% board we put together next week. The DSS top surface is a matte finish like the DSA. We need to build a number of shapes before we have it production ready: R3 2.25; R4 2.75; R1 2sp; R3 stepped 1.75; R3/4 vertical 2 space (NP); ISO key; and a 6.25 R3 space bar. A R3 6u SB is already tooled. The board Melissa had at the Seattle meetup had a DCS R4 bar that matched the R4 DSS profile but was nasty to type on.

Is there already a R3 7u space bar?

No. That will need to be tooled also.

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #14 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 14:00:45 »
Sorry if i missed and probably this has been answered already but still. How thick are the cap wals of DSS Porfile? Is it as thick as DSA or thicker?

Probably it would be nice to add some short FAQ on the front page.

Thanks.

Offline Unforgivable

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #15 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 14:37:30 »
Someone provide PMK with the GMK 6u Spacebar mounts please. :(

Also, this new profile looks awesome. Can’t wait! I’m hoping there will be 7u spacebars and etc., though!

Dolch love!

Offline spacewolf

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #16 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 14:51:00 »
Thanks for bringing this back! I've been waiting for it for a while! Hopefully I can afford it when it comes out. I know it's going to be popular though.

One thing I ask, is there any way to keep 5x15 Ortholinear owners in mind. Some serious mod kit on the side would be great.

Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #17 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 14:55:48 »
Sorry if i missed and probably this has been answered already but still. How thick are the cap wals of DSS Porfile? Is it as thick as DSA or thicker?

Probably it would be nice to add some short FAQ on the front page.

Thanks.

DSS has the same wall thickness as DSA (.040").

Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #18 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 14:57:14 »
Thanks for bringing this back! I've been waiting for it for a while! Hopefully I can afford it when it comes out. I know it's going to be popular though.

One thing I ask, is there any way to keep 5x15 Ortholinear owners in mind. Some serious mod kit on the side would be great.

Not a problem. Send us a layout of the 'serious mod kit' you would like.

Offline ramnes

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #19 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 15:35:18 »
Very interesting indeed. This profile comeback will be a real game changer.

Can you share more pictures?
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Offline menuhin

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #20 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 15:40:57 »
Very interesting.

This completes the picture - DSA and DSS!
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Offline UsualSuspectXXX

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #21 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 17:29:48 »
Definitely intrigued. The sculpting looks a bit strange coming from SA, but looks like something that would be a nice alternative with a cherry-like profile.

Wish these would be a bit thicker than the DSA, but I'm definitely going to try to pick up a set.

Offline jnthnrvs

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #22 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 17:44:11 »
One thing I ask, is there any way to keep 5x15 Ortholinear owners in mind. Some serious mod kit on the side would be great.

Good man. Thanks for looking out for the orphans that no one wants (like me).

Offline schoolbus

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #23 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 17:55:48 »
Definitely intrigued by this- as long as you can support a 75% layout I will definitely keep my eyes peeled.
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Offline neralo

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #24 on: Mon, 22 January 2018, 19:55:57 »
A spherical cherry-ish profile with sculpt? And in Dolch? Ye god say no more. Sign me right up.
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Offline .

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #25 on: Tue, 23 January 2018, 03:01:58 »
This is pretty cool, I like it!

Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #26 on: Tue, 23 January 2018, 11:56:50 »
At the end of the day, the DSS family will only be as good as the keycap set designs that use it...

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #27 on: Tue, 23 January 2018, 14:29:27 »
We currently mold the DSA 6u space bar with a center mount and outboard mounts 1.520" from center. The DSS 6u R3 space bar has a center mount and fixed outboard mounts at 1.880" from center. We have little info on where users would like the outboard mounts located.
It seems as if the 6u space bar is the least standardised.

The 1.880" from centre would seem to be the most reasonable as the stems would then be the same distance from the ends as on 6.25u and 7u space bars, but apparently  1.520" and 1.929" from centre also exist.
I measured a space bar I have from a Razer BlackWidow to 1.929" but the Razer BlackWidow listed on that Wiki page has close to 1.520".

I measured a PBT 6u space bar from a Cherry's G80-1800 or G80-11900 with off-centre switch to having the outer mounts 2×1.869" apart, and a ABS 6u DCS space bar fits on that board with a little persuasion...

A space bar with 1.880" spacing might work on a keyboard with 1.929" spacing if the keyboard has Costar-style stabilisers. (wire above the plate)

Offline BigTinz

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #28 on: Fri, 26 January 2018, 21:21:33 »
I'm definitely in for a 104 of DSS Dolch. Please include a red ESC and Return!

Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #29 on: Sat, 27 January 2018, 11:05:20 »
I'm definitely in for a 104 of DSS Dolch. Please include a red ESC and Return!

I second this suggestion! I think Dolch should be the first set out of the gate for this profile. With the full RED kit that is planned for DSA Dolch, of course!

Offline spacewolf

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #30 on: Mon, 29 January 2018, 12:11:39 »
Thanks for bringing this back! I've been waiting for it for a while! Hopefully I can afford it when it comes out. I know it's going to be popular though.

One thing I ask, is there any way to keep 5x15 Ortholinear owners in mind. Some serious mod kit on the side would be great.

Not a problem. Send us a layout of the 'serious mod kit' you would like.

For sure. I've been meaning to plan it but I have to find a job first. Once that's taken care of I will get right to working on the layout I have in mind (unless of course you're hiring web product developers)

Offline blighty

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #31 on: Wed, 31 January 2018, 15:44:26 »
I wonder if this profile will get stuck in the same production queue as SA?
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Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #32 on: Wed, 31 January 2018, 18:39:00 »
Well, the good news is that DSS won't use the same second shot molds as SA. It will be more like double-shot DSA which, for reasons I don't entirely understand, has a very different (much shorter) waiting period than SA.


Offline consolation

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #34 on: Mon, 05 February 2018, 16:14:16 »
Pics of DSS family

Is there any chance of a plan view? Or, even a front elevation?

Offline Harms

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #35 on: Thu, 08 February 2018, 01:56:13 »
So will people be able to use this profile to create custom sets like how they do it with SA and DSA sets?

Would love to see this in more colorways in the future. :)

Offline UsualSuspectXXX

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #36 on: Sat, 10 February 2018, 19:36:56 »
So will people be able to use this profile to create custom sets like how they do it with SA and DSA sets?

Would love to see this in more colorways in the future. :)

So long as people like it, I'm sure we'll see custom sets in the future.

Only problem is that new legend molds will need to be made for any of the legends that the community has had made in the past.

Offline BigTinz

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #37 on: Mon, 12 February 2018, 13:10:25 »
Any update from SP on this?

Offline Rob27shred

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #38 on: Sun, 11 March 2018, 13:14:06 »
Any update from SP on this?

I second this, never heard about them potentially bringing this profile back until today. Very interested from what I've read here. The only thing I can say I honestly don't like is the thickness of the walls being the same as DSA. Don't get me wrong it's not nearly as bad as how thin DCS caps are, but depending on the colors I can see these caps having a ton of light bleed like lighter colored DSA caps with in switch LEDs.
« Last Edit: Sun, 11 March 2018, 13:15:45 by Rob27shred »

Offline BigTinz

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #39 on: Mon, 11 June 2018, 15:44:34 »
My body and money are ready...

Any update on this?

Offline Jacob4341

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #40 on: Mon, 11 June 2018, 16:13:24 »
I would love to get in on a dss set the profile looks so cool to type on.

Offline spacewolf

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #41 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 10:44:51 »
What ever happened to this?

Offline Gati

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #42 on: Mon, 10 September 2018, 10:37:44 »
Is this still going to be a thing?

Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #43 on: Mon, 10 September 2018, 21:14:31 »
Yes it is. We postponed tooling up the missing DSS shapes while working on the SA-P tooling. We're still a month or two away with completion of both programs. Sorry for the delay and thanks for your patience.

Offline Myoth

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #44 on: Sat, 27 October 2018, 09:40:42 »
I forgot about this profile, and I'm definitely happy to remember about it. Looking forward to this  :thumb:

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #45 on: Tue, 30 October 2018, 15:34:57 »
Oh man, they just updated their website saying the new PBT and the DSS caps won't be moving forward until summer of 2019.  Boo

Offline dr_derivative

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #46 on: Tue, 30 October 2018, 16:01:20 »
Oh man, they just updated their website saying the new PBT and the DSS caps won't be moving forward until summer of 2019.  Boo

The way I read it it sounds like the new G20 tooling will be ready for summer 2019, and they're quoting the time it is taking for DSS and SA-P as the reason for that estimate. I hope we won't have to wait that long for DSS :'(

Also, for the lazy:

Quote from: SP
Many of you are wondering what happened to the G20 keysets for Semiotic and Stealth. G20 was an experiment. We wanted to test market acceptance of a fairly unique shape and profile using some prototype tooling. The results were very positive and we are now in the process of designing and building new G20 production tooling. We will continue to run G20 blanks on the prototype tooling but, due to the cosmetic challenges during printing, we will not be sublimating keysets from this prototype tooling. I'm hesitant to say when the new tooling will be production ready. Our track record for release of new tooling (SA-P, DSS) has been less than stellar, but we are hoping to have pre-production sets available by the summer of 2019.
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Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #47 on: Tue, 30 October 2018, 16:09:46 »
Quote
Many of you are wondering what happened to the G20 keysets for Semiotic and Stealth. G20 was an experiment. We wanted to test market acceptance of a fairly unique shape and profile using some prototype tooling. The results were very positive and we are now in the process of designing and building new G20 production tooling. We will continue to run G20 blanks on the prototype tooling but, due to the cosmetic challenges during printing, we will not be sublimating keysets from this prototype tooling. I'm hesitant to say when the new tooling will be production ready. Our track record for release of new tooling (SA-P, DSS) has been less than stellar, but we are hoping to have pre-production sets available by the summer of 2019.

Okay, I think you're right.  Looking forward to some nice new caps from SP :)

Offline grizzly_teddy

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #48 on: Fri, 15 February 2019, 17:09:27 »
Any news about DSS?
> The way GH looks now, to a regular person, it screams, "Oh dang, this is one of **those** sites for really devoted and weird people".

Offline dr_derivative

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #49 on: Sun, 17 March 2019, 11:45:31 »
There was a new update about DSS on PMK's What's New page for anyone who hasn't seen it:

Quote
Production will begin shortly on a new DSS Dolch Keyset. This is the first keyset produced since the early 80's on the once retired DSS tooling. The DSS family has a medium height, sculptured profile that is slightly shorter than SA. The spherical touch surface has a matte finish like the DSA family. We hope to have DSS Dolch Keysets available in the KeyShop by the middle of April.
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Offline elfick

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #50 on: Fri, 17 May 2019, 15:00:45 »
from https://pimpmykeyboard.com/whats-new/

"We hope to have DSS Dolch ready to release by the middle of June."

Offline grizzly_teddy

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #51 on: Sun, 19 May 2019, 01:22:37 »
Came here to say that I just got some DSS caps in a grab bag! Not all 5 rows. Looks like 3 of them. Texture feels just like DSA. But honestly I'm confused because R3 seems to be tallest.
> The way GH looks now, to a regular person, it screams, "Oh dang, this is one of **those** sites for really devoted and weird people".

Offline cola375

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #52 on: Fri, 24 May 2019, 08:43:38 »
I saw the updated product page.
I was excited about the variety of child kits.
But the split space bar set is missing.
Do you have any plans for blank keys?


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Offline dr_derivative

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #54 on: Fri, 24 May 2019, 17:23:52 »
Looks very nice :o

My only complaint is that there is no stepped caps lock key, just a regular 1.75u with an off-centre stem (at least that's how it seems from the pictures). I hope they plan to add a proper stepped caps in future.
« Last Edit: Fri, 24 May 2019, 17:44:51 by dr_derivative »
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Offline Findecanor

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #55 on: Fri, 24 May 2019, 18:11:08 »
My only complaint is that there is no stepped caps lock key, just a regular 1.75u with an off-centre stem (at least that's how it seems from the pictures).
Yikes. Pressing that off-centre would be like using a ANSI Enter key without stabilisers
Hmm. I would also question the choice of having function keys in the base set.

Nice to see a "NORDE" set ("International Kit"). Too bad that there's not yet any ISO Enter key. I have not identified which layout the Ñ key is for.
« Last Edit: Fri, 24 May 2019, 18:16:08 by Findecanor »

Offline euphxenos

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #56 on: Fri, 24 May 2019, 18:13:17 »
Looking at the kits, I wonder if they've heard of 65% keyboards.  They're not really giving us any options for the right hand column above the right arrow.  I realize the ~` / Delete / PgUp / PgDn I prefer isn't as common as Home/PgUp/PgDn/End, but it doesn't look like those kits allow for either one.  If the navigation keys in the modifiers kit have their rows labelled correctly, then the keys that should be R2 (Del, End, Page Down) are R1, which seems weird.  Hopefully that's just a bad picture.

Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #57 on: Sun, 26 May 2019, 10:27:12 »
I don’t understand the row profiles. I guess that DSS R1 is the same as DSA R3, and all the other rows angle “towards the top” like SA R4? That’s a really odd profile family, if you ask me.

DSA never had an ISO Enter key; DSS will be shipping with the same DCS ISO Enter key that DSA sets always have.

BTW, did DSS Dolch sell out already, or is it simply not out yet?

Offline euphxenos

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #58 on: Sun, 26 May 2019, 15:15:43 »
They haven't started selling DSS Dolch yet.  From the product description on this page:

https://pimpmykeyboard.com/new-dss-dolch-keyset/

"We will be launching DSS Dolch on Wednesday, May 29th, at 11:00am PT."

It's also mentioned in their keycap status here:

https://pimpmykeyboard.com/whats-new/

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #59 on: Sun, 26 May 2019, 15:56:45 »
I don’t understand the row profiles. I guess that DSS R1 is the same as DSA R3, and all the other rows angle “towards the top” like SA R4? That’s a really odd profile family, if you ask me.
The angles are standard, comparable to most vintage keyboards and keyboards with cylindrical keycaps such as DCS.
It is SA that the odd one out: SA had been designed back in the day to be mounted on angled stems -- and it would get similar angles to DSS when mounted on such a keyboard. It just hasn't been used that way as much in recent times, so that we modern users of SA are not used to them.

Offline dr_derivative

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #60 on: Sun, 26 May 2019, 16:52:06 »
I don’t understand the row profiles. I guess that DSS R1 is the same as DSA R3, and all the other rows angle “towards the top” like SA R4? That’s a really odd profile family, if you ask me.

DSA never had an ISO Enter key; DSS will be shipping with the same DCS ISO Enter key that DSA sets always have.

BTW, did DSS Dolch sell out already, or is it simply not out yet?



It's very similar to DCS if you look at the picture above. SA has a kind of weird curved sculpt with no step between rows. Most 'normal' sculpted profiles like DCS or Cherry have a step down from each row to the one below it, as does DSS.

Also, where did you get that info about the ISO enter? Earlier in this thread they said they'd be making a DSS ISO key.
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Offline dvorcol

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #61 on: Sun, 26 May 2019, 17:07:32 »
I don’t understand the row profiles. I guess that DSS R1 is the same as DSA R3, and all the other rows angle “towards the top” like SA R4? That’s a really odd profile family, if you ask me.

DSA never had an ISO Enter key; DSS will be shipping with the same DCS ISO Enter key that DSA sets always have.

BTW, did DSS Dolch sell out already, or is it simply not out yet?

(Attachment Link)

It's very similar to DCS if you look at the picture above. SA has a kind of weird curved sculpt with no step between rows. Most 'normal' sculpted profiles like DCS or Cherry have a step down from each row to the one below it, as does DSS.

Also, where did you get that info about the ISO enter? Earlier in this thread they said they'd be making a DSS ISO key.

DSS and GMK (Cherry) are also quite similar.  Biggest difference is the dish: DSS is spherical, GMK is cylindrical.





I set the bottom of the GMK keycaps below the top of the case to get a similar gap between keycaps.  This GMK case appears to protrude further above the PCB than this DSS case does.

Assuming both cases protrude the same amount above the PCB:

« Last Edit: Mon, 27 May 2019, 11:15:18 by dvorcol »

Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #62 on: Mon, 27 May 2019, 11:09:42 »
Ah, okay, it all makes sense now. DSS is sorta like a spherical Cherry profile. I will definitely give it a try, but I confess I was hoping it would like a lower profile version of SA (kinda how DSA is a lower profile version of SA row3). SA is my favorite keycap family, so...

Offline garbo

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #63 on: Mon, 27 May 2019, 12:12:37 »
Ah, okay, it all makes sense now. DSS is sorta like a spherical Cherry profile. I will definitely give it a try, but I confess I was hoping it would like a lower profile version of SA (kinda how DSA is a lower profile version of SA row3). SA is my favorite keycap family, so...

Sounds like JTK should have you covered on that front with their "half height SA"-like profile. Not to distract from the topic at hand.

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #64 on: Tue, 28 May 2019, 19:35:56 »
It looks like a mix of DSA and SA. High profile flat goodness.

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #65 on: Tue, 28 May 2019, 19:39:24 »
Ah, okay, it all makes sense now. DSS is sorta like a spherical Cherry profile. I will definitely give it a try, but I confess I was hoping it would like a lower profile version of SA (kinda how DSA is a lower profile version of SA row3). SA is my favorite keycap family, so...

Sounds like JTK should have you covered on that front with their "half height SA"-like profile. Not to distract from the topic at hand.

Isn't JTK pretty much an exact replica of cherry profile?? Or do they have more than one profile they use??

On topic I want to try DSS profile.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Offline Sintpinty

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #66 on: Tue, 28 May 2019, 19:41:12 »
Ah, okay, it all makes sense now. DSS is sorta like a spherical Cherry profile. I will definitely give it a try, but I confess I was hoping it would like a lower profile version of SA (kinda how DSA is a lower profile version of SA row3). SA is my favorite keycap family, so...

Sounds like JTK should have you covered on that front with their "half height SA"-like profile. Not to distract from the topic at hand.

Isn't JTK pretty much an exact replica of cherry profile?? Or do they have more than one profile they use??

On topic I want to try DSS profile.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

What is JTK ?  :-X

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #67 on: Tue, 28 May 2019, 20:25:23 »
Ah, okay, it all makes sense now. DSS is sorta like a spherical Cherry profile. I will definitely give it a try, but I confess I was hoping it would like a lower profile version of SA (kinda how DSA is a lower profile version of SA row3). SA is my favorite keycap family, so...

Sounds like JTK should have you covered on that front with their "half height SA"-like profile. Not to distract from the topic at hand.

Isn't JTK pretty much an exact replica of cherry profile?? Or do they have more than one profile they use??

On topic I want to try DSS profile.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Yes, JTK is a cherry profile clone. I’ve never heard of JTK making an SA profile. That’s news to me

Offline garbo

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #68 on: Tue, 28 May 2019, 20:37:14 »

Isn't JTK pretty much an exact replica of cherry profile?? Or do they have more than one profile they use??

On topic I want to try DSS profile.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Yeah, they do the cherry caps, but are also developing the new lower SA profile. Pictures have been posted in the chinese community: https://www.zfrontier.com/post/detail/14066 and https://www.zfrontier.com/post/detail/14017

Also on topic... I've never really liked Dolch's brownish grey, but I'm psyched for DSS so will probably pick up this first set anyway.

Offline euphxenos

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #69 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 01:08:46 »
I was looking at the DSS Dolch kits again, and I realized I don't see a 1.75U shift in there anywhere.  The Extreme Modifier Kit includes a 2.25U, 2U, and 1U shift, but there doesn't appear to be a 1.75U in any of the kits.

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #70 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 03:49:07 »
I was looking at the DSS Dolch kits again, and I realized I don't see a 1.75U shift in there anywhere.
It's at the bottom of the image of the Pro Modifier set.

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #71 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 05:43:55 »
Ah, okay, it all makes sense now. DSS is sorta like a spherical Cherry profile. I will definitely give it a try, but I confess I was hoping it would like a lower profile version of SA (kinda how DSA is a lower profile version of SA row3). SA is my favorite keycap family, so...

Sounds like JTK should have you covered on that front with their "half height SA"-like profile. Not to distract from the topic at hand.

Isn't JTK pretty much an exact replica of cherry profile?? Or do they have more than one profile they use??

On topic I want to try DSS profile.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Yes, JTK is a cherry profile clone. I’ve never heard of JTK making an SA profile. That’s news to me

Ok thanks  :thumb:

Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #72 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 08:24:59 »
That top surface texture... why??

You guys could/should have done a community poll on this. I would be surprised if "textured like DSA" won out over "smooth like SA".
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Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #73 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 14:21:43 »
This was existing tooling (except for a few shapes), not something new we built.

Offline macclack

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #74 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 15:21:59 »
That top surface texture... why??

You guys could/should have done a community poll on this. I would be surprised if "textured like DSA" won out over "smooth like SA".

Yes the surface texture isn't ideal for me. Maybe some people prefer it though.

Offline japanitrat

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #75 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 16:43:09 »

Isn't JTK pretty much an exact replica of cherry profile?? Or do they have more than one profile they use??

On topic I want to try DSS profile.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Yeah, they do the cherry caps, but are also developing the new lower SA profile. Pictures have been posted in the chinese community: https://www.zfrontier.com/post/detail/14066 and https://www.zfrontier.com/post/detail/14017

Also on topic... I've never really liked Dolch's brownish grey, but I'm psyched for DSS so will probably pick up this first set anyway.

Huh, that new JTK stuff looks quite good!
So glossy, too. Would love to get such a set (well, different coloway, though ;)

Offline euphxenos

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #76 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 17:23:49 »
This was existing tooling (except for a few shapes), not something new we built.

Would it be possible to add an R3 Page Up and R4 Page Down to one of the modifier kits?  Or is there some other way I could get those two keys?  I'd like to try this profile on a 65% (Tada68).

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #77 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 17:48:19 »
I keep wanting to checkout but I'd be spending ~$200 to get the kits I want/need to fit my board(s), just don't think I can do it.

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Offline Aerizu

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #78 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 20:00:41 »
That top surface texture... why??

You guys could/should have done a community poll on this. I would be surprised if "textured like DSA" won out over "smooth like SA".

Yes the surface texture isn't ideal for me. Maybe some people prefer it though.

I prefer textured :)

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #79 on: Wed, 29 May 2019, 22:20:07 »
That top surface texture... why??

You guys could/should have done a community poll on this. I would be surprised if "textured like DSA" won out over "smooth like SA".

Yes the surface texture isn't ideal for me. Maybe some people prefer it though.

I prefer textured :)

I also prefer a bit of texture.  When the caps are smooth like on SPs SA finish, I find my fingers stick to the keycaps slightly as I move across the keys.

Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #80 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 03:01:21 »
This was existing tooling (except for a few shapes), not something new we built.

Good to know! That's pretty cool actually.. how long were these molds sitting unused before you decided to start this project?
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Offline Aerizu

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #81 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 06:33:32 »
So DSS Hana when?  :p

Offline zslane

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #82 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 10:37:59 »
I would have loved to see a 1.75u R3 “Fn” keycap. It is not uncommon for 60% users to configure the Caps Lock key to be a left-side Fn key.

It would also be good to have a source for extra spacebars given that these are ABS.

But other than that, the set looks great! Already ordered mine.

Offline Prelim

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #83 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 12:00:13 »
what case is this?



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Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #84 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 12:54:49 »
what case is this?

Show Image


pretty sure that is the revised poker 2 with USB C

Offline Prelim

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #85 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 12:57:04 »
thanks!  :thumb:
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Offline blighty

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #86 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 15:17:39 »
I would have loved to see a 1.75u R3 “Fn” keycap. It is not uncommon for 60% users to configure the Caps Lock key to be a left-side Fn key.

It would also be good to have a source for extra spacebars given that these are ABS.

But other than that, the set looks great! Already ordered mine.

You could order an extra space bar as an "individual key" for $10?  I did that for a 2.75u shift key.
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Offline elfick

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #87 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 16:27:29 »
This was existing tooling (except for a few shapes), not something new we built.
@SMKNGNZ Any idea when the ortho kit will be available?

Offline SMKNGNZ

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #88 on: Thu, 30 May 2019, 16:47:36 »
We're hoping within two to three weeks.

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #89 on: Mon, 03 June 2019, 11:31:11 »
Got my set today but haven't put it on anything yet.  Everything looks nice from what I see.  Some sprue markings on the edges are a bit rougher than other sets I've received from SP, but they mostly won't be visible when mounted.

I did test a shift and enter cap on my novatouch and confirmed that it contacts the stabilizer housings, similar to cherry profile caps.  So.  I'll likely keep my MT3 caps on the novatouch.

Offline blighty

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #90 on: Mon, 03 June 2019, 18:38:04 »
They didn't have me at hello like the MDA profile, but they are nice to type on.  The dolch coloured caps block light nicely, while the white on red, not so much.

220405-0

I do like how the 7u space doesn't cut into one's thumbs.  I was afraid it was going to be like DCS all over again.  LOL

220407-1
« Last Edit: Mon, 03 June 2019, 18:52:37 by blighty »
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Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #91 on: Mon, 03 June 2019, 21:18:52 »
They didn't have me at hello like the MDA profile, but they are nice to type on.  The dolch coloured caps block light nicely, while the white on red, not so much.

(Attachment Link)

I do like how the 7u space doesn't cut into one's thumbs.  I was afraid it was going to be like DCS all over again.  LOL

(Attachment Link)

Yes, the space bar might be my favorite thing about the profile

Offline cola375

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #92 on: Sun, 16 June 2019, 22:56:09 »
The Pro mod set included "R1" 1.5 BS. At first I thought it was a photo error, but it wasn't. HHK Layout cannot be set up correctly: ( 
Will it be fixed in the future?
Also, I would like you to support the right end column of 65%.
« Last Edit: Mon, 17 June 2019, 07:47:10 by cola375 »

Offline Krelbit

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #93 on: Sun, 16 June 2019, 23:12:48 »
Still not a fan of this annoying kit system.

Offline japanitrat

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #94 on: Mon, 17 June 2019, 02:58:02 »
The Pro mod set included "R1" 1.5 BS. At first I thought it was a photo error, but it wasn't. HHK Layout cannot be set up correctly: ( 
Will it be fixed in the future?
Also, I would like you to support the right column of 65%.

This. R1 1.5U Backspace is such a fail. There are like three different modifier kits but none support HHKB.

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #95 on: Mon, 17 June 2019, 09:31:50 »
I’m hoping they plan to add some keys in the future.   Norbauer asked them about missing keys in this profile and they said it was an oversight on their part.  I know they plan to make the keys for his set, but I’m not sure they’ll go back and fix these kits. 

Offline RominRonin

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #96 on: Mon, 17 June 2019, 18:42:46 »
No it won't. Only double-shot. We went down that road with the double-shot (ABS) SA tooling and were very unhappy with the results, especially with the darker PBT colors. Because of the large void left to fill without a first shot insert to balance the wall thickness, the parts were subject to sink, warping, flow lines, you name it. We see the same results, to a lesser degree, with the DSA tooling which was also designed for double-shot ABS molding. New DSA PBT molds are in the schedule with a late '18 early '19 completion.
What about blanks? I noticed a 1.25u row 3 cap with a legend, can it be ordered without?

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Offline cola375

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #97 on: Tue, 18 June 2019, 10:58:45 »
R1 1.5 BACKSPACE replacement support announced.
Check product page.Thank you, SP.

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #98 on: Tue, 18 June 2019, 11:47:16 »
R1 1.5 BACKSPACE replacement support announced.
Check product page.Thank you, SP.

Thanks for letting us know.  I sent a request for one :)

EDIT---
Aaaand, it's on the way
« Last Edit: Tue, 18 June 2019, 12:31:16 by pixelpusher »

Offline melgeek

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #99 on: Sun, 04 August 2019, 22:19:58 »
They didn't have me at hello like the MDA profile, but they are nice to type on.  The dolch coloured caps block light nicely, while the white on red, not so much.

(Attachment Link)

I do like how the 7u space doesn't cut into one's thumbs.  I was afraid it was going to be like DCS all over again.  LOL

(Attachment Link)

MDA BID BONE PROFILE
MelGeek- aim to bring the joy of using a mechanical keyboard to everyone.

Offline jacobolus

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #100 on: Tue, 20 August 2019, 02:30:07 »
Oh wow, someone finally answered my question from 2014!

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=62417

Offline jacobolus

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #101 on: Tue, 20 August 2019, 03:52:53 »
Folks in this thread might want to look at
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=63052.0



DSS used on Cherry MX switches should be substantially similar to the keycap profile used on old IBM Beam Spring and Honeywell Hall Effect keyboards from the 1970s.

Offline RominRonin

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #102 on: Sat, 24 August 2019, 14:06:16 »
Folks in this thread might want to look at
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=63052.0

Show Image


DSS used on Cherry MX switches should be substantially similar to the keycap profile used on old IBM Beam Spring and Honeywell Hall Effect keyboards from the 1970s.
For the record, @jacobolus, you're my keyboards hero.

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Offline melgeek

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Re: Signature Plastics' DSS tooling
« Reply #103 on: Tue, 27 August 2019, 00:53:50 »
 :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
MelGeek- aim to bring the joy of using a mechanical keyboard to everyone.