geekhack
geekhack Community => Ergonomics => Topic started by: adreamer on Sat, 15 September 2012, 09:35:20
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Recently bought a kinesis advantage keyboard. While installing o-ring for switches I think I broke one of the keys(Page down key).
While removing the key, entire assembly of the switch came out.
(http://[attach=1])
(Sorry for the poor picture. Have only cellphone now).
When I tried to insert it back, I think I bent some metal plate. I was not able to press down the switch at all. It got stuck in a fixed position. I tried bending the plate front/back, but unfortunately made it worse. It started sending lots of spurious signals.
As of now, I have removed the whole above portion and bent the metal plate to some angle and now I'm able to use the keyboard again.
(1) What is the correct position of the small metal plate? Should it be touching anything by default?
(2) Is there anyway I can fix this?
(3) How to insert the above portion correctly back. I saw one youtube video showing it fitting it back. It didn't work for me :(
Please let me know any other option I can use to fix this. I don't stay in US and can't send it back to repair also :(
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Look in the GH wiki....there used to be an excellent breakdown of Cherry switches...extremely informative. It was made mostly by Ripster. Look for "all about Cherry MX" in a wiki search. If you can find it, that will tell you EVERYTHING. I'm heading out the door, but will try to find it right now.
Can someone find the wiki I'm talking about?
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Look in the GH wiki....there used to be an excellent breakdown of Cherry switches...extremely informative. It was made mostly by Ripster. Look for "all about Cherry MX" in a wiki search. If you can find it, that will tell you EVERYTHING. I'm heading out the door, but will try to find it right now.
Can someone find the wiki I'm talking about?
The wiki (wiki.geekhack.org) is currently being rebuilt. There is some cherry MX information (Theory of operation mostly) in the general mechanical keyboards article [1] that I wrote. (though it needs work. I plan to put more time into this in the coming weeks. See the wiki workshop subforum for details)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?board=118.0
It sounds like you damaged one of the 'gold crosspoint contacts'. Your best bet is probably to desolder the switch and replace it completely. If you've just damaged the spring, upper housing, or stem, you can replace them with the innards of a new red switch (you can get them at WASDkeyboards or Mechanicalkeyboards. Sherryton (Keyboardstory) will probably have some in keychains, too).
[1] http://wiki.geekhack.org/index.php?title=Mechanical_Keyboards (I blame all Typographical errors on the QWERTY layout)
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Hi adreamer, welcome to GH and congratulations on your Advantage LF (seeing the red switch).
It has happened to me to have the upper switch assembly pop out, I think on my Poker. It's normally no big deal, you can usually put things back if you are careful. You could get a switch from WASDkeyboards, (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/cherry-mx-red-keyswitch-mx1a-l1nn.html) to open up and see how it's assembled and how to put it back together.
If that doesn't help, and you have some soldering experience, you can very easily swap the switch, but you need to get a red switch from Kinesis, since WASDKeyboards has a different variant (no positioning pins, no diode).
My Kinesis modification article (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=26579.0) has several internal photos that might be of help.
EDIT: This thread also has some good pictures of cherry switch components: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=34332.0
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like others said, gold cross is messed up, desolder switch and replace (buy a switch on ebay for a few bucks or buy a lot from mouser.com)
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You can also buy them from WASD keyboards.
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Adreamer:
Where are you located? There may be a GHer near you!
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Thanks for the replies. I looked more closely but looks like some parts are damaged but couldn't find out what exactly.
Like sordna said, let me try contacting kinesis/wasd for a new switch assembly. I can't do soldering, but can get local help to do that.
I'm in India btw.
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India. No prob. You provide housing and I'll come to fix keyboard. But I'll have to stay a month.
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it would be advantageous to google a few soldering for noobs video and see if you can do it, total cost minus switch (for solder iron/solder/suck out tube/bulb) should be very cheap, and if anything there should be somebody you know that bought one of those "41 tools computer kit", in it they always have a cheap soldering iron and solder.
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That's a good option, but I really like my idea much better :)
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it would be advantageous to google a few soldering for noobs video and see if you can do it, total cost minus switch (for solder iron/solder/suck out tube/bulb) should be very cheap, and if anything there should be somebody you know that bought one of those "41 tools computer kit", in it they always have a cheap soldering iron and solder.
I'm generally not good at these things. Managed to break one key just while installing o-ring. Somehow I would manage to melt one part of keyboard while soldering :)
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Again...my idea is best. Am I talking to myself over here? LOL
You may be able to change out the 'guts' .... maybe that's an option. You would need to post some close and clear pics and we can help determine that.
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Again...my idea is best. Am I talking to myself over here? LOL
You may be able to change out the 'guts' .... maybe that's an option. You would need to post some close and clear pics and we can help determine that.
I think what input nirvana is saying is he needs a place to crash for a few weeks, and India would do nicely.
Oh yeah and he'll get to that switch thing....
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ticket to india vs. soldering for noobs!
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I sent a mail to kinesis tech support, but didn't get any response. Are they slow in responding?
sordna said that switches sold by wasd can't be used for Advantage. Found one in ebay. Can this be used?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHERRY-MX-Series-Keyswitches-Red-Keyboards-Switches-ORIGINAL-/110918195733?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d33d5a15
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I sent a mail to kinesis tech support, but didn't get any response. Are they slow in responding?
sordna said that switches sold by wasd can't be used for Advantage. Found one in ebay. Can this be used?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHERRY-MX-Series-Keyswitches-Red-Keyboards-Switches-ORIGINAL-/110918195733?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d33d5a15
Does the advantage use PCB-mount switches? That would make sense. The switch in the ebay listing you linked is PCB-mount (In the second picture, you can see the two extra pins.)
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That switch will work, but it lacks a diode. You can possibly harvest the diode from your broken switch, or get a 1N4148 diode (it costs a couple of cents) which you can probably find in most local electronic parts stores.
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Sorry for another noob question :). Is this diode part of the switch itself? Do I have to modify the switch again and put in diode?
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Yes, but it's easy. :)
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You'll have to open the switch, you need a small screwdriver or something thin. I've used my fingernails in a pinch ('cause I was too lazy to go find a screwdriver)
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Again...my idea is best. Am I talking to myself over here? LOL
You may be able to change out the 'guts' .... maybe that's an option. You would need to post some close and clear pics and we can help determine that.
I think what input nirvana is saying is he needs a place to crash for a few weeks, and India would do nicely.
Oh yeah and he'll get to that switch thing....
RR: You know me so well....I could spend a lifetime there....if I had a local girlfriend....
ADREAMER: I would re-use the old diode after you desolder it. It comes right out.
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An update
Sent a mail to kinesis support and they sent two switches for free(Great customer support!).
Got help from local guy to unsolder and fix new key. However while unsoldering, I think he damaged PCB line between PgDown and space bar. So, space bar stopped working. I connected a small wire between space bar and pg down(using cell-o-tape) and it seems to be holding on for now.
Thanks everyone for the help!!
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Haha, cellotape won't hold for long, ask your friend to solder the broken PCB line, all you need to do is scratch off a bit of the insulation, and you can put some solder. I think there are also some kind of silver/conductive glues that will do the same thing without soldering.
I damaged a PCB run myself during the first part of this mod (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=26579.0) and fixed it quite easily with solder. You can see a photo of the damage in that article.