[GB] Granite Set ~ Sublimated Full PBT (spacebar included)

[swill]

I know it sucks, but with the scale and automation with which SP is conduction these group buys they have become a commercial product. It's no longer just a few geek hackers getting together to have a few laps made. They are processing hundreds of orders. I can't expect SP to fudge with their forms and basically lie about their product for the sake of international shipping. I too will import this set to the EU and i feel your pain, but other than having a proxy i am not sure what SP can do for you.

Yes, getting a proxy is the best option now that these GBs are being shipped by SP.  Paying for shipping to a proxy and then again to me will be cheaper than paying the import and brokerage fees.  It has happened many times now where I end up paying double the value of the goods because I end up having to pay $50-100 in brokerage fees and import charges.  I think I am just annoying because I have been bit by it one too many times...

It depends on how the packages are shipped as well.  If it is shipped with USPS, then I will just have to pay the duty (about 20% of the value).  If it is shipped via UPS, then I have to pay brokerage fees as well as the import fees, so it is more like $30 + 20% of the value of the goods.

It gets real expensive sometimes...

[Pieminister]

Wow that sucks! I didn't know about brokerage fees etc! This whe tax thing is madness

[mougrim]

Wow that sucks! I didn't know about brokerage fees etc! This whe tax thing is madness

Well, theoretically you can act as a broker yourself, but it involves a trip to the customs, so... no. Just... no.

[vierax]

In these massive GBs, 7bit always have to pay German import duties. You don't see it but it's included in what you pay. Here we all have to pay this after the order, it's psychologically different but in the end it's almost the same.

I mailed Melissa weeks ago about how they ship and it's USPS if you don't ask for another shipping method (and pay the extra amount for express delivery) I believe it's the same method even if the package doesn't have to cross oceans.

[gainz8]

How much longer until I should expect to have them arrive at my house?

No rush at all. Just curious how many more days to wait. I am just excited.

[tbc]

expect 4-6 weeks.

i'd be surprised if they're done making the keys themselves yet since I didn't notice any 'dyesub testing is done' notice.

[CommonCurt]

How much longer until I should expect to have them arrive at my house?

No rush at all. Just curious how many more days to wait. I am just excited.

Not sure about this set,  but the macross set was done in a little over a months time.

[rowdy]

How much longer until I should expect to have them arrive at my house?

No rush at all. Just curious how many more days to wait. I am just excited.

Not sure about this set,  but the macross set was done in a little over a months time.

Did that have as many orders as Granite?

[CommonCurt]

How much longer until I should expect to have them arrive at my house?

No rush at all. Just curious how many more days to wait. I am just excited.

Not sure about this set,  but the macross set was done in a little over a months time.

Did that have as many orders as Granite?

No,  Granite had more then 3 times as many orders.

[rowdy]

How much longer until I should expect to have them arrive at my house?

No rush at all. Just curious how many more days to wait. I am just excited.

Not sure about this set,  but the macross set was done in a little over a months time.

Did that have as many orders as Granite?

No,  Granite had more then 3 times as many orders.

Granite is likely to take somewhat longer than Macross then

[Matt3o]

I'm pretty sure the sublimating process takes longer than double-shot

[ideus]

I'm pretty sure the sublimating process takes longer than double-shot

This may be a newbie question, but how is the sublimating process implemented at high volume production?

[Matt3o]

I'm pretty sure the sublimating process takes longer than double-shot

This may be a newbie question, but how is the sublimating process implemented at high volume production?

with a lot of human work I believe I hope they have A LOT of sublimation machines.

[gainz8]

so what are the differences between dye sublimation and double shot?

also pros and cons of each?

[swill]

so what are the differences between dye sublimation and double shot?

also pros and cons of each?

dye sub - the lettering is dyed into the plastic.  much more durable than pad printed.  basically no one does double shot (DS) PBT caps because of the properties of PBT, so this is basically the best option for PBT caps.

doubleshot (DS) - are actually two different color plastics that are injected at different times.  So a first mold is shot for part of the cap and a second shot will fill in the voids left by the first shot.  this means that the lettering is completely through the cap, so it can never wear out.  these are most common with ABS caps.

that good enough of a description?

[SpAmRaY]

so what are the differences between dye sublimation and double shot?

also pros and cons of each?

dye sub - the lettering is dyed into the plastic.  much more durable than pad printed.  basically no one does double shot (DS) PBT caps because of the properties of PBT, so this is basically the best option for PBT caps.

doubleshot (DS) - are actually two different color plastics that are injected at different times.  So a first mold is shot for part of the cap and a second shot will fill in the voids left by the first shot.  this means that the lettering is completely through the cap, so it can never wear out.  these are most common with ABS caps.

that good enough of a description?

Vortex has double shot PBT.

[Elrick]

basically no one does double shot (DS) PBT caps because of the properties of PBT, so this is basically the best option for PBT caps.

They do, SP have done double-shot PBT keycaps in the past, I've bought them.  Please ask Melissa about them.

[00zeRO]

basically no one does double shot (DS) PBT caps because of the properties of PBT, so this is basically the best option for PBT caps.

They do, SP have done double-shot PBT keycaps in the past, I've bought them.  Please ask Melissa about them.

Wha-!?

 

[gainz8]

which one lasts longer

[ideus]

Vortex manufactures DS PBT caps, as it was pointed already. Also SP had produced some, what I do know for sure is a modifiers set, I have it under my fingers right now.

[00zeRO]

Vortex manufactures DS PBT caps, as it was pointed already. Also SP had produced some, what I do know for sure is a modifiers set, I have it under my fingers right now.

I know Vortex does them, see the sig...but I didn't know that SP did...hmmmm...

[ideus]

Vortex manufactures DS PBT caps, as it was pointed already. Also SP had produced some, what I do know for sure is a modifiers set, I have it under my fingers right now.

I know Vortex does them, see the sig...but I didn't know that SP did...hmmmm...

Haven't read your signature before, sorry. As I said, I do not know if the manufacturing capacity at SP includes full DS sets made of PBT, but I got a modifiers DS set in WoB made of PBT. You may contact them to ask. Just a few months ago a polymers manufacturer announced a combined ABS+PBT mix that I think is what Vortex uses for its set. The manufacturer is a Chinese company. I should get the specs sheet somewhere. It specifically addresses the point that the mix may be injected as easy as ABS, but has the hardness and resistance of PBT.

[Elrick]

which one lasts longer

The PBT set of course  .  Anything made from that material lasts longer than a basic ABS model.  PBT is extremely brittle so you need to handle it carefully when installing and taking them out of a keyboard.

SP will make some keys extremely tight when placing them upon MX switches, hence that is where the damage might occur unless you use some KY  .

[tbc]

one thing that people didn't mention is choice of color combinations.

dyesub legends must be darker than the cap itself.  so theres no such thing as white dyesub legends on black pbt cap.

there's no 'rule' like this for doubleshot.

[CommonCurt]

basically no one does double shot (DS) PBT caps because of the properties of PBT, so this is basically the best option for PBT caps.

They do, SP have done double-shot PBT keycaps in the past, I've bought them.  Please ask Melissa about them.

Did you have any problems with the double shot PBT that you bought from them?   

If this is a option it sounds like something people should be considering.

[tbc]

kinda on the thin side for the mods.  looks nothing like an imsto cap

[Matt3o]

AFAIK SP can't doubleshot a full set in PBT.

PBT is very durable and way better than ABS, especially for the spacebar.

Not only that but PBT doesn't yellow over time (or yellowing is very low compare to ABS). I have lego sets (in ABS) that are already yellowing after 1 year.

Dye sublimation is also very durable (look at Model M keyboards) and you can design the legends exactly the way you want them. With double-shot you are confined to the available molds.

[isaske]

Really sorry for being so late to the party, but i have some questions.
1) Does this group buy appeal to TKL keyboards as well?
2) If yes, are there any leftovers left?

[Matt3o]

Really sorry for being so late to the party, but i have some questions.
1) Does this group buy appeal to TKL keyboards as well?
2) If yes, are there any leftovers left?

1) this GB supports a large variety of keyboards (TKL included).
2) no leftovers sorry

[isaske]

Ahhhh, what a shame
Well my fault anyway. Grats for running it though, seems like a great GB!

[ideus]

Granite set has characteristics that make it a very special set: It has a special combination of icon modifiers, that is something no other set has, AFAIK, and that cannot be reproduced with the DS molding process unless you pay for the hefty price to get the legends molds build. The profile of the caps is DSA, with spherical top, unified shape, and low height, that allows a variety of layouts to be implemented. The PBT with sublimated legends make it a long, long, long lasting set of keycaps. In my humble opinion Granite cannot be compared with any other set currently available. I challenge you to find something that matches it.

[gainz8]

Granite set has characteristics that make it a very special set: It has a special combination of icon modifiers, that is something no other set has, AFAIK, and that cannot be reproduced with the DS molding process unless you pay for the hefty price to get the legends molds build. The profile of the caps is DSA, with spherical top, unified shape, and low height, that allows a variety of layouts to be implemented. The PBT with sublimated legends make it a long, long, long lasting set of keycaps. In my humble opinion Granite cannot be compared with any other set currently available. I challenge you to find something that matches it.

You are making me more excited to receive it

[Glod]

AFAIK SP can't doubleshot a full set in PBT.

PBT is very durable and way better than ABS, especially for the spacebar.

Not only that but PBT doesn't yellow over time (or yellowing is very low compare to ABS). I have lego sets (in ABS) that are already yellowing after 1 year.

Dye sublimation is also very durable (look at Model M keyboards) and you can design the legends exactly the way you want them. With double-shot you are confined to the available molds.

Granite set has characteristics that make it a very special set: It has a special combination of icon modifiers, that is something no other set has, AFAIK, and that cannot be reproduced with the DS molding process unless you pay for the hefty price to get the legends molds build. The profile of the caps is DSA, with spherical top, unified shape, and low height, that allows a variety of layouts to be implemented. The PBT with sublimated legends make it a long, long, long lasting set of keycaps. In my humble opinion Granite cannot be compared with any other set currently available. I challenge you to find something that matches it.

basically what you guys are saying is

PBT Dysub Granite DSA is for ALL DAY, EVERY DAY

this is essentially the "end game" set for many. especially ErgoDox Users I am really looking forward to it and hope that if it works out more SP dyesub DSA is coming

my poor hyperfuse dsa set, i used it so much that half of the keys is really shiny and slippery (same thing happened to one of my retro dsa set as well) really hoping this set doesn't shine easy. My HHKB, also PBT except the space bar, lacks any shine and i used that hardcore for 6 months.

[taylordcraig]

AFAIK SP can't doubleshot a full set in PBT.

PBT is very durable and way better than ABS, especially for the spacebar.

Not only that but PBT doesn't yellow over time (or yellowing is very low compare to ABS). I have lego sets (in ABS) that are already yellowing after 1 year.

Dye sublimation is also very durable (look at Model M keyboards) and you can design the legends exactly the way you want them. With double-shot you are confined to the available molds.

Granite set has characteristics that make it a very special set: It has a special combination of icon modifiers, that is something no other set has, AFAIK, and that cannot be reproduced with the DS molding process unless you pay for the hefty price to get the legends molds build. The profile of the caps is DSA, with spherical top, unified shape, and low height, that allows a variety of layouts to be implemented. The PBT with sublimated legends make it a long, long, long lasting set of keycaps. In my humble opinion Granite cannot be compared with any other set currently available. I challenge you to find something that matches it.

basically what you guys are saying is

PBT Dysub Granite DSA is for ALL DAY, EVERY DAY

this is essentially the "end game" set for many. especially ErgoDox Users I am really looking forward to it and hope that if it works out more SP dyesub DSA is coming

my poor hyperfuse dsa set, i used it so much that half of the keys is really shiny and slippery (same thing happened to one of my retro dsa set as well) really hoping this set doesn't shine easy. My HHKB, also PBT except the space bar, lacks any shine and i used that hardcore for 6 months.

currently using my hyper dsa and really excited for granite. 

[ideus]

AFAIK SP can't doubleshot a full set in PBT.

PBT is very durable and way better than ABS, especially for the spacebar.

Not only that but PBT doesn't yellow over time (or yellowing is very low compare to ABS). I have lego sets (in ABS) that are already yellowing after 1 year.

Dye sublimation is also very durable (look at Model M keyboards) and you can design the legends exactly the way you want them. With double-shot you are confined to the available molds.

Granite set has characteristics that make it a very special set: It has a special combination of icon modifiers, that is something no other set has, AFAIK, and that cannot be reproduced with the DS molding process unless you pay for the hefty price to get the legends molds build. The profile of the caps is DSA, with spherical top, unified shape, and low height, that allows a variety of layouts to be implemented. The PBT with sublimated legends make it a long, long, long lasting set of keycaps. In my humble opinion Granite cannot be compared with any other set currently available. I challenge you to find something that matches it.

basically what you guys are saying is

PBT Dysub Granite DSA is for ALL DAY, EVERY DAY

this is essentially the "end game" set for many. especially ErgoDox Users I am really looking forward to it and hope that if it works out more SP dyesub DSA is coming

my poor hyperfuse dsa set, i used it so much that half of the keys is really shiny and slippery (same thing happened to one of my retro dsa set as well) really hoping this set doesn't shine easy. My HHKB, also PBT except the space bar, lacks any shine and i used that hardcore for 6 months.

currently using my hyper dsa and really excited for granite. 

Shiny PBT?, well maybe if you apply them a polishing process. BTW, SP molds have a very nice texture, even deeper than other manufacturers, thus it may last even longer.

[Glod]

no i was saying my pbt sets, like on my HHKB, is NOT shiny, my poor abs doubleshot hyper fuse dsa half the keys are super shiny, doubt i would want to sell it anyway because i love hyperfuse but it sure does lower the resale value.

[Rodgaroon]

Sad I missed this....now I want....=(

[ideus]

Sad I missed this....now I want....=(

You may try to get one in the classifieds some months later. Of course, I am not sure if someone may want to re-sale this nice set.

[SpAmRaY]

Sad I missed this....now I want....=(

You may try to get one in the classifieds some months later. Of course, I am not sure if someone may want to re-sale this nice set.

There's always a few people who sell.

[ideus]

Sad I missed this....now I want....=(

You may try to get one in the classifieds some months later. Of course, I am not sure if someone may want to re-sale this nice set.

There's always a few people who sell.

I do not see any reason for that but some cash back and staying away from KB mania  . If there is one set I may not consider to sell it would be this Granite. I may sell my already semi shiny original Cherries instead. LOL.

[rowdy]

Sad I missed this....now I want....=(

You may try to get one in the classifieds some months later. Of course, I am not sure if someone may want to re-sale this nice set.

There's always a few people who sell.

I do not see any reason for that but some cash back and staying away from KB mania  . If there is one set I may not consider to sell it would be this Granite. I may sell my already semi shiny original Cherries instead. LOL.

Some people (like me) might be trying DSA for the first time - and might not like it.  Others might have made an impulse buy and suddenly need the money.  Others might decide it is nice, but sell it to replace it with a new set.  There are many reasons why people would sell, and with the huge number of sets being made it is almost inevitable that some will appear in Classifieds.

[taylordcraig]

I want to buy an alpha set. Will buy a tkl set if need be.

[Matt3o]

Quick update.

Production is ongoing but I won't be receiving the print proof before late next week. My unproven impression is that PBT/sublimated are a little bit longer to manufacture.

[StylinGreymon]

Quick update.

Production is ongoing but I won't be receiving the print proof before late next week. My unproven impression is that PBT/sublimated are a little bit longer to manufacture.

Thanks for the update, Matt3o 

[CommonCurt]

Quick update.

Production is ongoing but I won't be receiving the print proof before late next week. My unproven impression is that PBT/sublimated are a little bit longer to manufacture.

Thanks for the update Matt 

[rowdy]

Quick update.

Production is ongoing but I won't be receiving the print proof before late next week. My unproven impression is that PBT/sublimated are a little bit longer to manufacture.

Thanks for that!

SP have their work cut out for them!!

[ApocalypseMaow]

Quick update.

Production is ongoing but I won't be receiving the print proof before late next week. My unproven impression is that PBT/sublimated are a little bit longer to manufacture.

Can't wait and thanks for being on top of everything.

[Zeal]

Quick update.

Production is ongoing but I won't be receiving the print proof before late next week. My unproven impression is that PBT/sublimated are a little bit longer to manufacture.

Can't wait and thanks for being on top of everything.

Agreed! Eagerly waiting. 

[gainz8]

what is print proof?

[Matt3o]

they will make a test run before going full production. I need to see it and confirm that everything's fine.