I like it. Not a fan of icon only mods though. Would it be possible to do icon+text mods, or are you set on icon only mods.
I like it -- and personally prefer the icon mods for this one but maybe having it as an add-on kit would work too. Maybe an add-on alpha kit with Hyrulian sublegends might be neat.
We definitely need more green-alpha sets out there!
You'll want to get some better renders, keycaprenders.com struggles with those kinds of "mid brightness" colors. At least double-check your work with https://kle-render.com since the colors could be wildly different.
I'm REALLY not sure I'm sold on the colours but it would be impossible for me to not support a Zelda inspired set; I have no concrete suggestions to make but maybe play around with potentially making the green (and maybe the mods' grey too) a little lighter and see how that looks, right now the colours look a little too sombre for it to really scream LOZ but maybe that's just me.
Also obviously you may run into some issues with those novelties but I do love the way they look. Good luck!
PS: If this is very well received and MOQs are looking likely, maybe look into doing a Hylian sublegend/mono kit to go with the base; this is something I've always wanted and something I've talked with designers on and off about trying to get done for years now and have always come short on because we've never been able to really get a colourway we thought was up to Zelda standards, maybe you can pull it off here!
I'm REALLY not sure I'm sold on the colours but it would be impossible for me to not support a Zelda inspired set; I have no concrete suggestions to make but maybe play around with potentially making the green (and maybe the mods' grey too) a little lighter and see how that looks, right now the colours look a little too sombre for it to really scream LOZ but maybe that's just me.
Also obviously you may run into some issues with those novelties but I do love the way they look. Good luck!
PS: If this is very well received and MOQs are looking likely, maybe look into doing a Hylian sublegend/mono kit to go with the base; this is something I've always wanted and something I've talked with designers on and off about trying to get done for years now and have always come short on because we've never been able to really get a colourway we thought was up to Zelda standards, maybe you can pull it off here!
Rama colab with gold triforce might be nice. Not sure about the copyright implications tho
Actually, it seems that while Nintendo can (and have) copyrighted the term "Triforce", they can't copyright/trademark the symbol itself because it's just simple geometry.Rama colab with gold triforce might be nice. Not sure about the copyright implications tho
Yeaaah... that's gonna be a huge no as Nintendo tends to be v v C&D happy.
I'm REALLY not sure I'm sold on the colours but it would be impossible for me to not support a Zelda inspired set; I have no concrete suggestions to make but maybe play around with potentially making the green (and maybe the mods' grey too) a little lighter and see how that looks, right now the colours look a little too sombre for it to really scream LOZ but maybe that's just me.
Also obviously you may run into some issues with those novelties but I do love the way they look. Good luck!
PS: If this is very well received and MOQs are looking likely, maybe look into doing a Hylian sublegend/mono kit to go with the base; this is something I've always wanted and something I've talked with designers on and off about trying to get done for years now and have always come short on because we've never been able to really get a colourway we thought was up to Zelda standards, maybe you can pull it off here!
I'm a huge Zelda fan, so of course I love this set!
I'm curious: is the Hylian crest/wings imagery trademarked? If not, it would be amazing to see a Hylian shield novelty (red & blue?) or an enter key with the wing crest, or something similar.
EDIT: Since you want this set specifically based on Ocarina of Time, another novelty idea could be to have the three Spiritual Stones represented, and/or the six Sage Medallions. It could quickly get out of hand with that many different emblems, but it's worth considering.
I'm a huge Zelda fan, so of course I love this set!
I'm curious: is the Hylian crest/wings imagery trademarked? If not, it would be amazing to see a Hylian shield novelty (red & blue?) or an enter key with the wing crest, or something similar.
EDIT: Since you want this set specifically based on Ocarina of Time, another novelty idea could be to have the three Spiritual Stones represented, and/or the six Sage Medallions. It could quickly get out of hand with that many different emblems, but it's worth considering.
Yeah, unfortunately, those are protected. The stones could be worked around to some extent, but with so many, the cost would be too much I think. Wish I could have it all!
I love this set, I've been waiting for somebody to do this for a long time. Though, while it's definitely giving me a Zelda vibe, it's not giving me an OoT-specific vibe. In particular, the N9 color doesn't seem very OoT.
There's this dark purple-blue color that appears in the logo and on a lot of different important items that definitely gives me an OoT vibe. I wonder how that would look in place of the N9?Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/6CspynH.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/k5iz8UY.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/z2cQfBx.png)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/MDU9tn6.png)
Feedback on novelties:
- I'd love to see the Navi novelty of just Navi, without the bottle
- "Listen! Listen!" should be "Hey! Listen!", and I wouldn't mind them stylized kind of like this (https://i.imgur.com/taipIov.png?1) (without the Navi)
- It'd be cool if the holes on the Ocarina lined up with how they actually are in the game (see above). I understand you're going for more minimalist, but to me the Ocarina stands out as a bit over-minimalist compared to the rest of the novelties.
- A Skulltula novelty would be very OoT
- Master Sword enter novelty
- Hylian emblem (same as your profile pic) on 1.25u / 1.5u keys
- I'd rather see the bottle novelty as a clean empty bottle, or possibly with the Lon Lon label on it for extra OoT points:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/KWX45E2.jpg)
Awesome set, looking forward to seeing this develop!
Some of these things just can't be done in terms of the novelties. The exact duplication of some of these items would make the set violate TMs and it would never get made. Most of the items and logos and languages (Hylian) are property of Nintendo, so I just can't use them, as much as I'd like to. The enter key will not say "Listen! Listen!", it was just a way of showing two different options for the font (standard vs italicized). I can play around with blue a bit to see if I can find some way to incorporate it, but so far in trying various colorways, this N9 has just produced the best look for the set. I've tried browns and reds and blues with it already, but it took something away from the kit. That being said, I'm working with some other people who may have some better ideas, so I will continue to try things and gauge feedback! Thanks for the input :thumb:
Some of these things just can't be done in terms of the novelties. The exact duplication of some of these items would make the set violate TMs and it would never get made. Most of the items and logos and languages (Hylian) are property of Nintendo, so I just can't use them, as much as I'd like to. The enter key will not say "Listen! Listen!", it was just a way of showing two different options for the font (standard vs italicized). I can play around with blue a bit to see if I can find some way to incorporate it, but so far in trying various colorways, this N9 has just produced the best look for the set. I've tried browns and reds and blues with it already, but it took something away from the kit. That being said, I'm working with some other people who may have some better ideas, so I will continue to try things and gauge feedback! Thanks for the input :thumb:
Risk for getting a Cease and Desist should be determined by what others have been able to sell / get away with. When a company doesn't protect a copyright, it undermines their ability to protect it in the future. A quick visit to eBay shows are multiple whole businesses around selling LoZ merch. Here are some examples:
Playable Ocarina replicas (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Legend-of-Zelda-12Hole-Ocarina-of-Time-Ceramic-Alto-C-Flute-Good-Instrument-Gift/113692545415?hash=item1a789a9187:g:30EAAOSwfa9ZsKJY)
Master Sword replicas (https://www.ebay.com/itm/42-Legend-of-Zelda-Twilight-Princess-Replica-Master-Sword-Ocarina-of-Time-Link/302404408774?hash=item4668b515c6:g:g3gAAOSw3h1ZUzVS)
Lon Lon Milk (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Legend-Of-Zelda-Lon-Lon-Milk-Keychain-D/181933237894?hash=item2a5c10e686:g:BTUAAOxyUylTVz~8)
Thousands of unlicensed t-shirts (https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313.TR6.TRC1.A0.H0.Xzelda+t+shirt.TRS0&_nkw=zelda+t+shirt&_sacat=0)
On the topic of languages, I don't believe Matteo got permission from J.R.R. Tolkien for making elvish keycaps (https://drop.com/buy/matt3o-nerd-dsa-keycap-set-massdrop-exclusive).
The sale format of a group buy also makes it unlikely to run into any trouble, as this is a one-and-done deal.
Some kit suggestions I can make:
- add an extra 2.25u Shift key for Clueboard/660M users, split spacebar users who prefer regular R4, etc.
- Add 1u 00 key for splitting the 0 key in the numpad.
- Alternate homing keys: F, J, and 5 barred.
"Crazier"/likely-to-be-less-popular suggestions.
- Swap R4 bottom row for R5 bottom row (molds are now available for all keys)
- Go for a uniform F-row color -- in this case, N9 with the custom RAL legends (examples of this: see GMK Space Cadet, GMK Taro, GMK Hydro)
Some kit suggestions I can make:
- add an extra 2.25u Shift key for Clueboard/660M users, split spacebar users who prefer regular R4, etc.
- Add 1u 00 key for splitting the 0 key in the numpad.
- Alternate homing keys: F, J, and 5 barred.
"Crazier"/likely-to-be-less-popular suggestions.
- Swap R4 bottom row for R5 bottom row (molds are now available for all keys)
- Go for a uniform F-row color -- in this case, N9 with the custom RAL legends (examples of this: see GMK Space Cadet, GMK Taro, GMK Hydro)
I'm into some of these ideas for sure. I'm curious why you favor an R5 bottom row over R4. I definitely like the idea of uniform F-Row as well.
Some kit suggestions I can make:
- add an extra 2.25u Shift key for Clueboard/660M users, split spacebar users who prefer regular R4, etc.
- Add 1u 00 key for splitting the 0 key in the numpad.
- Alternate homing keys: F, J, and 5 barred.
"Crazier"/likely-to-be-less-popular suggestions.
- Swap R4 bottom row for R5 bottom row (molds are now available for all keys)
- Go for a uniform F-row color -- in this case, N9 with the custom RAL legends (examples of this: see GMK Space Cadet, GMK Taro, GMK Hydro)
I'm into some of these ideas for sure. I'm curious why you favor an R5 bottom row over R4. I definitely like the idea of uniform F-Row as well.
also a fan of uniform. for me, r5 gives it a dope look. haven't had a chance to use, however.
Call me crazy but I think this would look good in SA.Agree for some reason that green screens SA to me
Rama colab with gold triforce might be nice. Not sure about the copyright implications thoI think the 3 stacked triangles is totally fine, yeah it's iconic but I don't think the symbol itself is Nintendo's, just the name.
Rama colab with gold triforce might be nice. Not sure about the copyright implications thoI think the 3 stacked triangles is totally fine, yeah it's iconic but I don't think the symbol itself is Nintendo's, just the name.
I would be unable to not buy this set if color chips look good and a golden rama cap gets made.
Renders Updated!
Looks much better with the uniform F-row. Neat. I would agree that maybe the green base alphas might not look as good in person, but who knows?
Now imagine R5 bottom-row ;)
Looks much better with the uniform F-row. Neat. I would agree that maybe the green base alphas might not look as good in person, but who knows?
Now imagine R5 bottom-row ;)
Currently, they are N7. If you have a GMK Color ring, you can see for yourself ;D This COULD still change (i'm waiting on mine to arrive this week before making the final decision).
Looks much better with the uniform F-row. Neat. I would agree that maybe the green base alphas might not look as good in person, but who knows?
Now imagine R5 bottom-row ;)
Currently, they are N7. If you have a GMK Color ring, you can see for yourself ;D This COULD still change (i'm waiting on mine to arrive this week before making the final decision).
I do have a color ring, so I'll take a look. For what I know N7 is a solid, grass green.
I think the contrast may be OK with the gold-ish yellow. However, I would hope that the green being so spread throughout the set won't feel too overwhelming.
Looks much better with the uniform F-row. Neat. I would agree that maybe the green base alphas might not look as good in person, but who knows?
Now imagine R5 bottom-row ;)
Currently, they are N7. If you have a GMK Color ring, you can see for yourself ;D This COULD still change (i'm waiting on mine to arrive this week before making the final decision).
I do have a color ring, so I'll take a look. For what I know N7 is a solid, grass green.
I think the contrast may be OK with the gold-ish yellow. However, I would hope that the green being so spread throughout the set won't feel too overwhelming.
Based on the form so far, you'll get your wish with the R5 ;D
Would be nice if this set had Hylian sublegends to give it that extra umpth for fans similar to how we've seen fictional alphabets on kits like Drifter and Galactic Empire or Elvish kits.
Twilight Princess: https://www.omniglot.com/conscripts/hylian3.htm
Skyward Sword: https://www.deviantart.com/sarinilli/art/Skyward-Sword-Alphabet-Chart-Updated-2-Jan-2012-273105465
Breath of the Wild: http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/media/44405/2.jpg
That would probably cost a lot
The new renders look great, both the alphas and the mods are much more in line with what I had in mind when I wrote my first bit of feedback the day you first posted this - if you can get all of this to be accurate (I'm thinking the gold might give you some trouble) I think you have a very good thing going. I really do like it.
Mats are great, especially the black one. If you can get all of this to come together I'll be super happy.
PS: I still dream of Hylian (adaptation if needed) alphas. One day.
The new renders look great, both the alphas and the mods are much more in line with what I had in mind when I wrote my first bit of feedback the day you first posted this - if you can get all of this to be accurate (I'm thinking the gold might give you some trouble) I think you have a very good thing going. I really do like it.
Mats are great, especially the black one. If you can get all of this to come together I'll be super happy.
PS: I still dream of Hylian (adaptation if needed) alphas. One day.
if the gold can get close to the color used in red samurai, i don't think it'll be an issue.
Drifter was pretty cheap from what I remember w/ lookingWould be nice if this set had Hylian sublegends to give it that extra umpth for fans similar to how we've seen fictional alphabets on kits like Drifter and Galactic Empire or Elvish kits.
Twilight Princess: https://www.omniglot.com/conscripts/hylian3.htm
Skyward Sword: https://www.deviantart.com/sarinilli/art/Skyward-Sword-Alphabet-Chart-Updated-2-Jan-2012-273105465
Breath of the Wild: http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/media/44405/2.jpg
That would probably cost a lot
Drifter was PBT dye-sub, this is ABS doubleshot - any new legends would require new moulds, which drives up the cost.Drifter was pretty cheap from what I remember w/ lookingWould be nice if this set had Hylian sublegends to give it that extra umpth for fans similar to how we've seen fictional alphabets on kits like Drifter and Galactic Empire or Elvish kits.
Twilight Princess: https://www.omniglot.com/conscripts/hylian3.htm
Skyward Sword: https://www.deviantart.com/sarinilli/art/Skyward-Sword-Alphabet-Chart-Updated-2-Jan-2012-273105465
Breath of the Wild: http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/media/44405/2.jpg
That would probably cost a lot
Ah doh, thanks for the explanation. A fan can hope I guess. :XDrifter was PBT dye-sub, this is ABS doubleshot - any new legends would require new moulds, which drives up the cost.Drifter was pretty cheap from what I remember w/ lookingWould be nice if this set had Hylian sublegends to give it that extra umpth for fans similar to how we've seen fictional alphabets on kits like Drifter and Galactic Empire or Elvish kits.
Twilight Princess: https://www.omniglot.com/conscripts/hylian3.htm
Skyward Sword: https://www.deviantart.com/sarinilli/art/Skyward-Sword-Alphabet-Chart-Updated-2-Jan-2012-273105465
Breath of the Wild: http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/media/44405/2.jpg
That would probably cost a lot
Drifter was PBT dye-sub, this is ABS doubleshot - any new legends would require new moulds, which drives up the cost.Drifter was pretty cheap from what I remember w/ lookingWould be nice if this set had Hylian sublegends to give it that extra umpth for fans similar to how we've seen fictional alphabets on kits like Drifter and Galactic Empire or Elvish kits.
Twilight Princess: https://www.omniglot.com/conscripts/hylian3.htm
Skyward Sword: https://www.deviantart.com/sarinilli/art/Skyward-Sword-Alphabet-Chart-Updated-2-Jan-2012-273105465
Breath of the Wild: http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/media/44405/2.jpg
That would probably cost a lot
Call me crazy but I think this would look good in SA.SA sounds good!
Call me crazy but I think this would look good in SA.
Not sure if this is helpful or not, but here's a pic of an N7 spacebar with an N9 spacebar with the gold Enter from Red Samurai:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/gHRyh79.jpg)
Planning on building a board, how well will the 1up brass plate match the gold in this keyset? https://www.1upkeyboards.com/shop/parts-and-tools/parts/diy-60-ansi-plate-kit/ (https://www.1upkeyboards.com/shop/parts-and-tools/parts/diy-60-ansi-plate-kit/)
Am I the only one that's not feeling the "Listen" novelty? I just feel like it's a little limited to some of the later games. May I suggest something that is a common denominator to all the Zelda games like "TRIFORCE"?The term Triforce is copyrighted, which is why this set has shied away from things like that.
Hmmm... maybe the enter key is a sword?Am I the only one that's not feeling the "Listen" novelty? I just feel like it's a little limited to some of the later games. May I suggest something that is a common denominator to all the Zelda games like "TRIFORCE"?The term Triforce is copyrighted, which is why this set has shied away from things like that.
Hmmm... maybe the enter key is a sword?
Am I the only one that's not feeling the "Listen" novelty? I just feel like it's a little limited to some of the later games. May I suggest something that is a common denominator to all the Zelda games like "TRIFORCE"?
Am I the only one that's not feeling the "Listen" novelty? I just feel like it's a little limited to some of the later games. May I suggest something that is a common denominator to all the Zelda games like "TRIFORCE"?
It has been difficult to pick and choose novelties that represent what I was going for in this set. That being said, it was based off a specific title and not an entire series. What is and is not okay for us to use has been discussed with many people at this point :D. We have been in contact with Nintendo over the last few days and are still in the process of determining what can and can't be used, though nothing has been shot down thus far, which is a good thing. I hope to have more information soon and will post an update as soon as I receive more info.
Planning on building a board, how well will the 1up brass plate match the gold in this keyset? https://www.1upkeyboards.com/shop/parts-and-tools/parts/diy-60-ansi-plate-kit/ (https://www.1upkeyboards.com/shop/parts-and-tools/parts/diy-60-ansi-plate-kit/)
I've not used that plate personally. If you want to be 100% certain you'd need to find a gold cap from red samurai to compare. Hope that helps!
If there was a game made by geekhack, i'd call it...Am I the only one that's not feeling the "Listen" novelty? I just feel like it's a little limited to some of the later games. May I suggest something that is a common denominator to all the Zelda games like "TRIFORCE"?The term Triforce is copyrighted, which is why this set has shied away from things like that.
I'm not sure if you have chosen a shade of green yet but I would suggest going for something darker than in those images, maybe something like the green in your triforce profile picture.
any updates? :-X
this set would benefit greatly from having beige alphas with green legendI personally disagree, I really like the darker mods with beige legends. I get Dark Link vibes (perhaps a keycap in the novelty set would make this even more apparent?). But to each their own! :thumb:
i love zelda but can't see myself buying it in its current state
this set would benefit greatly from having beige alphas with green legendI personally disagree, I really like the darker mods with beige legends. I get Dark Link vibes (perhaps a keycap in the novelty set would make this even more apparent?). But to each their own! :thumb:
i love zelda but can't see myself buying it in its current state
this set would benefit greatly from having beige alphas with green legend
i love zelda but can't see myself buying it in its current state
the more i think about it the less I like these green alphas
Maybe you should invert the colors? I don't know. I feel that kokiri colors are not the way to go for a keyboard, maybe hylian would be better, i.e blue or silver/grey alphas and red/gold accents
Last Active: Sun, 16 June 2019, 14:42:50 :(Nintendo sent their hit squad.
09.21.19 - Big update; new novelties, renders, new alpha color!
The novelties are so nice and full of memory.Is there a Zelda item called "memory"?
I can't wait.
It's sad to hear about the novelties (and I'm assuming the RAMA cap is out as well), but I'm still interested in this set
It's sad to hear about the novelties (and I'm assuming the RAMA cap is out as well), but I'm still interested in this set
It's sad to hear what about the novelties? Where did you hear it if not in this thread???
The RAMA cap is me purely speculating that Nintendo would also not reach an agreement that would allow the artisan to be produced, and isn't backed up by any information in this thread or elsewhere.I'm not sure Nintendo could actually stop the usage of the triforce symbol (sierpinski triangle) since they don't appear to have a trademark on it. At least not in America.
12.11.19 - Group buy date announced, vendors, updated kits!
I'm confused as to what the alpha change was and if its represented in any of these renders, pictures. I'd love more renders and color samples but in al honesty I'm in no matter what just based on the theme... might even buy a 2nd base set to give to a friend.
I'm confused as to what the alpha change was and if its represented in any of these renders, pictures. I'd love more renders and color samples but in al honesty I'm in no matter what just based on the theme... might even buy a 2nd base set to give to a friend.
Here's a render prior to the colour changeShow Image(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/568154190061240340/615658583127752743/Y5HnJ0g.png)
and afterShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/NSqbbcM.jpg)
What color is the yellow for the keys and legends? It looks like a more faded yellow- I'm just trying to imagine if it would clash with yolk. Trying to decide between yolk, clear, or black for the board itself. Thanks!
What color is the yellow for the keys and legends? It looks like a more faded yellow- I'm just trying to imagine if it would clash with yolk. Trying to decide between yolk, clear, or black for the board itself. Thanks!
I don't know if we ever got a specific day, just "January", hopefully soon though.Up until yesterday the main post said January 1st, I guess there's just been some kind of delay.
I don't know if we ever got a specific day, just "January", hopefully soon though.Up until yesterday the main post said January 1st, I guess there's just been some kind of delay.
I don't know if we ever got a specific day, just "January", hopefully soon though.Up until yesterday the main post said January 1st, I guess there's just been some kind of delay.
I was beginning to doubt my memory when the main post was changed instead of a reply being posted to my question.
Is this set getting delayed again?
Love the set, but the optics are never good when moving the group buy date last minute, now for the second time.
forgive my ignorance - but what does walker have to do with this set?Is this set getting delayed again?
Love the set, but the optics are never good when moving the group buy date last minute, now for the second time.
Delayed again it seems. Don't know the full details, but Walker just announced in another discord that the set has been delayed again.
Isn't he the one that took over the GB cause the original runner didn't have time to do it?forgive my ignorance - but what does walker have to do with this set?Is this set getting delayed again?
Love the set, but the optics are never good when moving the group buy date last minute, now for the second time.
Delayed again it seems. Don't know the full details, but Walker just announced in another discord that the set has been delayed again.
Oof, another delay. Not sure how I should feel about this.You shouldn't feel anything. This is a bunch of wanna be colorful plastic. Not worthy of positive nor negative feelings. It just is
Oof, another delay. Not sure how I should feel about this.You shouldn't feel anything. This is a bunch of wanna be colorful plastic. Not worthy of positive nor negative feelings. It just is
Yeah, don't listen to me. It's a bad idea.Oof, another delay. Not sure how I should feel about this.You shouldn't feel anything. This is a bunch of wanna be colorful plastic. Not worthy of positive nor negative feelings. It just is
Don't listen to him. It's a hobby you're interested in. You shouldn't feel shame for showing emotion, positive or negative. :thumb:
Sigh. Only on a GH IC can philosophical discussion pertaining to emotional response (a subjective matter) be a thing. Clearly we're all allowed to feel different about different things. I don't really care about, nor am emotionally attached, to most of your mothers. Doesn't mean you don't care or that you can't be upset about her not making you breakfast. And I, or anyone else, shouldn't be the one informing you how to feel about anything.
It's that simple.
Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
;DSigh. Only on a GH IC can philosophical discussion pertaining to emotional response (a subjective matter) be a thing. Clearly we're all allowed to feel different about different things. I don't really care about, nor am emotionally attached, to most of your mothers. Doesn't mean you don't care or that you can't be upset about her not making you breakfast. And I, or anyone else, shouldn't be the one informing you how to feel about anything.
It's that simple.
Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
What a great time and place to be at
SO interestingly enough, no sooner do I check here and I get an email from Kono saying the GB is live. :)
EDIT: I don't actually see a link to buy it yet. Still shows the Interest Check button
Ouch on pricing :(
Ouch on pricing :(
Ouch on pricing :(
Honestly this pricing is hilarious. Base kit for 140 bucks and novelties for 70 more? No thanks lol.
Yes, there are so many things that could have been done better going into this buy. But I want this set made!
Skip the novelties if you can't afford them.
Base Kit ($140) + Spacebars ($25) = $165 Total Cost
The set is likely priced at 250 MOQ rather than 500, which most sets use nowadays. It's also an "all in one" style base kit, whereas many designers have moved towards splitting things off.+1
Not wanting to join at these prices is entirely valid, but I think they have a (mostly) reasonable explanation.