67% Legal Keyboard

[Techhobbiest]

Hi,

New member here, this is my first substantive post. I have seen many very nice keyboards which you all have made and want to say kudos! I got into keyboards because I am currently in law school and working in the legal field. Generally it is typing intensive. However, my first mech keyboard I wanted something for my home office and for gaming so I got a Razer Blackwidow Ultimate; Its great . However, now I am gaming far less and working far more and a part of me dies everyday at work whilst I bond with my membrane keyboard instead of some sweet new portable 60%'er.

I have searched the market high and low within all price ranges and just cannot find the keyboard which really matches what I would like. Then I came across all of the talent here, and thought wth ill just pull the trigger on going a novel route. Leading me to thinking of a making a "legal keyboard."

The features would be:

- a silent switch for office use
- a § symbol key
- a bold key
- a underline key
- a italicize key
- a copy key
- a paste key
- a Function copy key where I could copy multiple things and assign them to a number - EX: FN + copy key + 1= that copied material assigned to #1 key. Then I could FN + pastekey + 1,2,3,4,5 etc...and it would paste whatever was assigned to that number
- clear all copies key
- arrow keys
- 60-70% form factor


What do you guys think is it possible? I want to try to make this happen!

Best,

Tech

[bcg]

Where does the copied text come from?  You'd need some sort of driver or something like that on the PC side probably... or if it is just boilerplate text you could add some flash memory to the keyboard to store the snippets I guess.  Everything else seems doable, not sure about how you would type out that squiggly symbol though, unless you defined a custom layout or hotkey on the PC

[Techhobbiest]

Look to message below -- Do not know how to delete yet. XD

[Techhobbiest]

Where does the copied text come from?  You'd need some sort of driver or something like that on the PC side probably... or if it is just boilerplate text you could add some flash memory to the keyboard to store the snippets I guess.  Everything else seems doable, not sure about how you would type out that squiggly symbol though, unless you defined a custom layout or hotkey on the PC

Copied text will normally come from; Statutes, Regulations, Online State Resources, Cases, Emails, Memo's, Motions, Pleadings, and Downloaded files. I could really see no circumstances where you would have more than 2-3 pages attached to each number key. 98% of it is just boiler plate text. The idea of having a small amount of flash memory built into the keyboard is really awesome! The method I use to access the statute/section symbol is ALT+0167 (will work in google chrome browser and word docs) which can really get tiresome and having a simple keypress would be AMAZING. As for the BLD UNDRLNE and ITLZE functions it would just be easier than using the alt+b / I / U methods.

Do you have any suggestions on how to get this off the ground? Or any suggestions on the best switch for the job (I wanted topres but access seems nonexistent)

[tbc]

can't this be done with the poker 2?  or AHK?

[whiskytango]

You can get a board that allows custom firmware and use metalliqaz's Easy AVR firmware. It will let you program macros. So you could program a macro for alt+0167, ctrl+i, etc.

As for storing the copied text to a particular key combo, I don't know, but that's a great idea. I am a practicing attorney, and those are some really good ideas there for the shortcut keys. I never thought to make macros to do those things, but I can agree that it would be helpful. I am just used to using the shortcuts as they are. I most of those shortcuts fairly often. It's not too much effort to press ctrl+i, ctrl+u, etc., and if I was going to make macros for those, I would probably put them on the fn layer which would still requires at least two keys to be pressed, but I still think it's a nifty idea.

Edit: And since I have my own office, I use clicky switches and don't care how loud it is 

2nd edit: If you get one of bpiphany's replacement controllers, you can run the Easy AVR firmware on a production kb

[Techhobbiest]

can't this be done with the poker 2?  or AHK?

If it could be I would be happy! I did not think the Poker 2 had the proper form factor for it or had the capability to maintain multiple copy/pastes - What is your personal recommendation on how to accomplish the factors for the keyboard?

Thanks!

[jacobolus]

For the multiple 'copy' functionality, you’re going to need software support.  If you want it to be cross-application compatible, then that will have to be implemented either as some kind of background application or some kind of OS-level plugin. How to best implement that depends what platform you’re on (Windows or OS X &c.), and is going to be non-trivial and require substantial help from a software developer, or a lot of work to learn on your part. But it’s certainly *possible*, so don’t despair.

If you wanted to implement that feature only within a particular application (like Microsoft Word, or a text editor, or a browser) then it could be done as an application plugin, which might in some cases be a bit easier (but is still probably non-trivial).

The rest of your desired features are pretty simple, by comparison. You should be able to get those working in any keyboard with programmable firmware. Do you plan to use an existing keyboard layout, or are you talking about making the whole keyboard from scratch? Either way, if you can I’d recommend using hasu’s tmk_keyboard firmware for it.

[Techhobbiest]

You can get a board that allows custom firmware and use metalliqaz's Easy AVR firmware. It will let you program macros. So you could program a macro for alt+0167, ctrl+i, etc.

As for storing the copied text to a particular key combo, I don't know, but that's a great idea. I am a practicing attorney, and those are some really good ideas there for the shortcut keys. I never thought to make macros to do those things, but I can agree that it would be helpful. I am just used to using the shortcuts as they are. I most of those shortcuts fairly often. It's not too much effort to press ctrl+i, ctrl+u, etc., and if I was going to make macros for those, I would probably put them on the fn layer which would still requires at least two keys to be pressed, but I still think it's a nifty idea.

Edit: And since I have my own office, I use clicky switches and don't care how loud it is 

I will check into the firmware, I am not very sophisticated yet, but I think that I know enough to know what I would generally like in a board. That is awesome that you are a practicing attorney, you can relate to exactly where this should go. Your are right the BLD UNDRLNE ITL are straight forwards enough. Reach down inside and be honest, how nice would it be to have a section key .

The copy/paste abilities really were what lead me to exploring the custom route (plus I thought it might be a good idea to get out there). I may have now corrupted your mind, and copy pasting at work tomorrow will suddenly become frustrating as you sense their might be a more efficient way. (without having to click and search through a million chrome tabs, your outlook, your word docs, and whatever other random programs you have going on).

Seriously jealous of your ability to use keys switches of your choice. All good things come in time I guess, until then I'd rather not be "that guy" LOL

[tbc]

can't this be done with the poker 2?  or AHK?

If it could be I would be happy! I did not think the Poker 2 had the proper form factor for it or had the capability to maintain multiple copy/pastes - What is your personal recommendation on how to accomplish the factors for the keyboard?

Thanks!

i'm confused...now you want actual copy/pastes?

when you said '98%', it sounds like you wanted a combination of keypresses to paste 100% of a default template.  from there, you would manually change the remaining 2%.

[Techhobbiest]

For the multiple 'copy' functionality, you’re going to need software support.  If you want it to be cross-application compatible, then that will have to be implemented either as some kind of background application or some kind of OS-level plugin. How to best implement that depends what platform you’re on (Windows or OS X &c.), and is going to be non-trivial and require substantial help from a software developer, or a lot of work to learn on your part. But it’s certainly *possible*, so don’t despair.

If you wanted to implement that feature only within a particular application (like Microsoft Word, or a text editor, or a browser) then it could be done as an application plugin, which might in some cases be a bit easier (but is still probably non-trivial).

The rest of your desired features are pretty simple, by comparison. You should be able to get those working in any keyboard with programmable firmware. Do you plan to use an existing keyboard layout, or are you talking about making the whole keyboard from scratch? Either way, if you can I’d recommend using hasu’s tmk_keyboard firmware for it.

Thanks for the reply!

Honestly because form factor is one of the huge considerations in the whole thing I would like to start from scratch. Although I am not hell-bent on re-inventing the wheel. I would like it to be somewhere between a HHKB/FC660C & a Compact TKL.

I have no knowledge of software development which definitely seems to be the weakest link in this chain so far. What did you think of the first posters idea of a built in flash memory system to the board? It would be vital that it would 100% of the time with all applications (otherwise why have it).I will look into that firmware now to start to get a feel for firmware in general.

 

[Techhobbiest]

can't this be done with the poker 2?  or AHK?

If it could be I would be happy! I did not think the Poker 2 had the proper form factor for it or had the capability to maintain multiple copy/pastes - What is your personal recommendation on how to accomplish the factors for the keyboard?

Thanks!

i'm confused...now you want actual copy/pastes?

when you said '98%', it sounds like you wanted a combination of keypresses to paste 100% of a default template.  from there, you would manually change the remaining 2%.

It is more likely that I am the one who is confused. ). What you have said just now seems to me that it was what I was attempting to communicate.
This is for me a hobby and a new one at that, so please if I confuse you or use terms incorrectly just point me in the right direction so I can learn. Thanks for helping me out!

[berserkfan]

Here's one simple solution but it takes more desktop space.

Buy a cherry g80-8200. Make sure it is USB and current (ie not the old models that only work with WinXP.)

You can have great pleasure programming many keys and making them store lots and lots of info. That way all the standard boilerplate stuff can be stored.

What do you want to specialize in, btw? What law school are you attending?

can't this be done with the poker 2?  or AHK?

If it could be I would be happy! I did not think the Poker 2 had the proper form factor for it or had the capability to maintain multiple copy/pastes - What is your personal recommendation on how to accomplish the factors for the keyboard?

Thanks!

i'm confused...now you want actual copy/pastes?

when you said '98%', it sounds like you wanted a combination of keypresses to paste 100% of a default template.  from there, you would manually change the remaining 2%.

It is more likely that I am the one who is confused. ). What you have said just now seems to me that it was what I was attempting to communicate.
This is for me a hobby and a new one at that, so please if I confuse you or use terms incorrectly just point me in the right direction so I can learn. Thanks for helping me out!

[Techhobbiest]

Here's one simple solution but it takes more desktop space.

Buy a cherry g80-8200. Make sure it is USB and current (ie not the old models that only work with WinXP.)

You can have great pleasure programming many keys and making them store lots and lots of info. That way all the standard boilerplate stuff can be stored.

What do you want to specialize in, btw? What law school are you attending?

Thanks! Even though it does not have the form factor it and its functionality is something to be considered!

I am in South Florida at Nova Shepard Broad. As far as specialization, I really love everything so it is hard to answer!

can't this be done with the poker 2?  or AHK?

If it could be I would be happy! I did not think the Poker 2 had the proper form factor for it or had the capability to maintain multiple copy/pastes - What is your personal recommendation on how to accomplish the factors for the keyboard?

Thanks!

i'm confused...now you want actual copy/pastes?

when you said '98%', it sounds like you wanted a combination of keypresses to paste 100% of a default template.  from there, you would manually change the remaining 2%.

It is more likely that I am the one who is confused. ). What you have said just now seems to me that it was what I was attempting to communicate.
This is for me a hobby and a new one at that, so please if I confuse you or use terms incorrectly just point me in the right direction so I can learn. Thanks for helping me out!

[jacobolus]

I have no knowledge of software development which definitely seems to be the weakest link in this chain so far. What did you think of the first posters idea of a built in flash memory system to the board?

The problem is that there’s no way to send the text from the computer to the keyboard, unless you have a little special-purpose software program running. [And at that point, you might as well just keep the text stored in that program, not bother sending it to the keyboard.]

[jacobolus]

My advice would be: Try to draw out what your ideal layout would be, based on your current knowledge/preferences/thoughts. One nice tool for this is http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com which you can easily save layouts with. For example, here’s one based on your description (which might not at all match your vision): http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/806c4cc4a7e48a11d424028eb043ee6e

Then folks around here might be able to offer advice about whether that’s achievable by just adapting an existing keyboard (much much easier) or whether you really want to build something custom (lots of work, but fun).

Also, you may want to learn a bit about the various ergonomic keyboards which are available. Something like the Ergodox might be better than a standard keyboard shape in the long run, if you plan to do lots of typing, since it could help save your hands from repetitive stress injuries.

[jacobolus]

By the way, one other thing you might consider: there are several little software applications which will let you assign particular keystrokes to particular actions, and some operating systems have support for modifying the keyboard layout, yourself. I’m not sure of the best tools on Windows. But you might be able to just use your existing keyboard, and assign one of the keys you don’t use much (maybe backslash or something) to be a § key.

[Eszett]

To copy&paste text snippets to and from different virtual slots is no effort to put into practice with AHK. AHK means “AutoHotkey” and is a scripting language, which basically runs in the background of Windows. You write a custom script, and then let it load automatically when Windows boots. I'm no fan of background processes, since they eat up RAM and system performance, but AHK is really lean, about 1-2 MB in size only and you can do almost everything (almost) with it.

I write an example script. Left Alt in combination with the keys “1” or “2” or “3” copies currently selected text to slot1, slot2 or slot3. Shift + Left Alt + “1” or “2” or “3” pastes snippets from slot1, slot2 or slot3. This script probably can be written much more efficiently and elegantly. However it works and serves as example.

Code: [Select]

global slot1
global slot2
global slot3

!SC002:: ; left Alt pressed together with the “1” key
bak := Clipboard ; backups current clipboard content
Clipboard := "" ; clears the clipboard
Send, ^c ; copies currently selected text to clipboard
ClipWait, 0.1 ; waits 0.1 seconds for any data to appear to the clipboard, else return an error …
slot1 := Clipboard ; copies currently selected text snippet to a variable called “slot1”
Clipboard := bak ; restores original clipboard content
Return
!SC003::
bak := Clipboard
Clipboard := ""
Send, ^c
ClipWait, 0.1
slot2 := Clipboard
Clipboard := bak
Return
!SC004::
bak := Clipboard
Clipboard := ""
Send, ^c
ClipWait, 0.1
slot3 := Clipboard
Clipboard := bak
Return

+!SC002:: Send, %slot1%
+!SC003:: Send, %slot2%
+!SC004:: Send, %slot3%

[Oobly]

You can do everything with a Poker 2.

Poker 2 can record multiple keystrokes or combinations of keystrokes and assign them to any key you like on the Pn layer. You can also switch the Fn and Pn keys so when you hit Fn-key it does whatever you programmed in.

I suspect most programs you work in use key combinations for "start bold", "end bold", etc... If they consist of more than 2 keys, you can program them as a Pn key on the Poker.

Just use the standard undo, cut, copy and paste shortcuts. Multi-page clipboard support can do your "Fn-copy" functionality and I think most programs you would use for typing large documents support this. Just check what key combinations are used and program them into the Poker 2.

Part of the problem of making a board like you describe is that most of the functionality you want is software-based, not hardware based, but if it can be done with a combination of keys, you can do it with the Poker 2.

TLDR; Buy a Poker 2.

[berserkfan]

You can do everything with a Poker 2.

Poker 2 can record multiple keystrokes or combinations of keystrokes and assign them to any key you like on the Pn layer. You can also switch the Fn and Pn keys so when you hit Fn-key it does whatever you programmed in.

I suspect most programs you work in use key combinations for "start bold", "end bold", etc... If they consist of more than 2 keys, you can program them as a Pn key on the Poker.

Just use the standard undo, cut, copy and paste shortcuts. Multi-page clipboard support can do your "Fn-copy" functionality and I think most programs you would use for typing large documents support this. Just check what key combinations are used and program them into the Poker 2.

Part of the problem of making a board like you describe is that most of the functionality you want is software-based, not hardware based, but if it can be done with a combination of keys, you can do it with the Poker 2.

TLDR; Buy a Poker 2.

Oobly, the question is whether there is enough memory. Legal boilerplate stuff can be quite long; it's not one or two lines.

[Oobly]

Y, you need to use the system's clipboard or AHK for the copy / paste stuff, no way to store that to the Poker 2 anyway. The Poker 2 does have enough memory for short "macros" for each key, accessible using the Pn layer. So you can code all the special characters and required shortcuts for various functions to the function layer of the board and access them like that.

[Techhobbiest]

My advice would be: Try to draw out what your ideal layout would be, based on your current knowledge/preferences/thoughts. One nice tool for this is http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com which you can easily save layouts with. For example, here’s one based on your description (which might not at all match your vision): http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/806c4cc4a7e48a11d424028eb043ee6e

Then folks around here might be able to offer advice about whether that’s achievable by just adapting an existing keyboard (much much easier) or whether you really want to build something custom (lots of work, but fun).

Also, you may want to learn a bit about the various ergonomic keyboards which are available. Something like the Ergodox might be better than a standard keyboard shape in the long run, if you plan to do lots of typing, since it could help save your hands from repetitive stress injuries.

That is so cool and thank you for taking the time to make out a keyboard! There are some tweaks I would make I will repost it !

[Techhobbiest]

To copy&paste text snippets to and from different virtual slots is no effort to put into practice with AHK. AHK means “AutoHotkey” and is a scripting language, which basically runs in the background of Windows. You write a custom script, and then let it load automatically when Windows boots. I'm no fan of background processes, since they eat up RAM and system performance, but AHK is really lean, about 1-2 MB in size only and you can do almost everything (almost) with it.

I write an example script. Left Alt in combination with the keys “1” or “2” or “3” copies currently selected text to slot1, slot2 or slot3. Shift + Left Alt + “1” or “2” or “3” pastes snippets from slot1, slot2 or slot3. This script probably can be written much more efficiently and elegantly. However it works and serves as example.

Code: [Select]

global slot1
global slot2
global slot3

!SC002:: ; left Alt pressed together with the “1” key
bak := Clipboard ; backups current clipboard content
Clipboard := "" ; clears the clipboard
Send, ^c ; copies currently selected text to clipboard
ClipWait, 0.1 ; waits 0.1 seconds for any data to appear to the clipboard, else return an error …
slot1 := Clipboard ; copies currently selected text snippet to a variable called “slot1”
Clipboard := bak ; restores original clipboard content
Return
!SC003::
bak := Clipboard
Clipboard := ""
Send, ^c
ClipWait, 0.1
slot2 := Clipboard
Clipboard := bak
Return
!SC004::
bak := Clipboard
Clipboard := ""
Send, ^c
ClipWait, 0.1
slot3 := Clipboard
Clipboard := bak
Return

+!SC002:: Send, %slot1%
+!SC003:: Send, %slot2%
+!SC004:: Send, %slot3%

To copy&paste text snippets to and from different virtual slots is no effort to put into practice with AHK. AHK means “AutoHotkey” and is a scripting language, which basically runs in the background of Windows. You write a custom script, and then let it load automatically when Windows boots. I'm no fan of background processes, since they eat up RAM and system performance, but AHK is really lean, about 1-2 MB in size only and you can do almost everything (almost) with it.

I write an example script. Left Alt in combination with the keys “1” or “2” or “3” copies currently selected text to slot1, slot2 or slot3. Shift + Left Alt + “1” or “2” or “3” pastes snippets from slot1, slot2 or slot3. This script probably can be written much more efficiently and elegantly. However it works and serves as example.

Code: [Select]

global slot1
global slot2
global slot3

!SC002:: ; left Alt pressed together with the “1” key
bak := Clipboard ; backups current clipboard content
Clipboard := "" ; clears the clipboard
Send, ^c ; copies currently selected text to clipboard
ClipWait, 0.1 ; waits 0.1 seconds for any data to appear to the clipboard, else return an error …
slot1 := Clipboard ; copies currently selected text snippet to a variable called “slot1”
Clipboard := bak ; restores original clipboard content
Return
!SC003::
bak := Clipboard
Clipboard := ""
Send, ^c
ClipWait, 0.1
slot2 := Clipboard
Clipboard := bak
Return
!SC004::
bak := Clipboard
Clipboard := ""
Send, ^c
ClipWait, 0.1
slot3 := Clipboard
Clipboard := bak
Return

+!SC002:: Send, %slot1%
+!SC003:: Send, %slot2%
+!SC004:: Send, %slot3%

Wow, that is far beyond my knowledge and very cool! Sorry everyone for the delay in my responses but work has been crazy. I will do some research and look into how to use this. My current computer should be able to run background processes no problem, but works...lol lets not go there!

[Techhobbiest]

My advice would be: Try to draw out what your ideal layout would be, based on your current knowledge/preferences/thoughts. One nice tool for this is http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com which you can easily save layouts with. For example, here’s one based on your description (which might not at all match your vision): http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/806c4cc4a7e48a11d424028eb043ee6e

Then folks around here might be able to offer advice about whether that’s achievable by just adapting an existing keyboard (much much easier) or whether you really want to build something custom (lots of work, but fun).

Also, you may want to learn a bit about the various ergonomic keyboards which are available. Something like the Ergodox might be better than a standard keyboard shape in the long run, if you plan to do lots of typing, since it could help save your hands from repetitive stress injuries.

Here is how I had envisioned it...

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/2cc3bd5a5d6915cc84e2e688949d34c3