Any chance we can get some real color samples for the cases (especially for the blue)?
I AM SUPER INTERESTED IN THIS. However, my main concern is the programmable option.
What firmware will the PCB support? Can we please have more details?
Will it work with rechargeable batteries? I don't remember if it was confirmed in the interest check but I believe it was asked.
I AM SUPER INTERESTED IN THIS. However, my main concern is the programmable option.
What firmware will the PCB support? Can we please have more details?
I think this was on the reddit post. But it will be programmable through a web app.
I AM SUPER INTERESTED IN THIS. However, my main concern is the programmable option.
What firmware will the PCB support? Can we please have more details?
I think this was on the reddit post. But it will be programmable through a web app.
Many requested QMK, we will have QMK in our discussion with Elemento
A few questions... How much will the board weigh with the stock aluminum options? How long will the battery last for bluetooth mode? How long will it take to charge the battery to full?
Joined in! Tactical blue + half plate
Joined in! Tactical blue + half plate
What made you choose half plate? I never tried it out and I'm still not sure which to choose
I'm considering joining this group buy but have a lot of unanswered questions in my head that I couldn't find answers to in any topics (IC, GB, Reddit, zfrontier). The questions are the following:
* Does the PCB allow split backspace and/or split right shift or just the traditional TKL layout?
* Do I necessarily need to add weight to the keyboard or there's an alternative method to cover the battery compartment?
* What's the lightest possible weight of the keyboard and what parts do I need to purchase if that's my goal?
* How does the battery life look like if I don't use the keyboard as a Christmas decoration (eg: no backlight or fancy led strips)?
I'm wondering if there's any forum where these are all discussed that I obviously missed? The GB already went live but I don't feel confident purchasing quite an expensive keyboard without knowing anything about the technical parameters.
Just curious, if I want to change/add something to my GB order, how can I go about that?
* split right shift is available
* yes
* the lightest combination will be: an aluminum half plate + American black walnut weight
* Elemento will have it tested and we will update the numbers once available (hopefully before the GB ends)
I want this to be my first custom build. Is this a good idea?
Well put - if this is your board, then go for it! (Funny, you posted this right as I was replying to them, too, lol)I want this to be my first custom build. Is this a good idea?
You have to start somewhere. Probably the best place to start is a board you want.
I want this to be my first custom build. Is this a good idea?
Thanks, will do!Just curious, if I want to change/add something to my GB order, how can I go about that?
just send us your changes to your order along with your order no. to support@zFrontier.com :)
Am I going to want an extra pcb in case if soldering errors? Was thinking of getting both plates, should I get at least 1 pcb per?
Am I going to want an extra pcb in case if soldering errors? Was thinking of getting both plates, should I get at least 1 pcb per?
Am I going to want an extra pcb in case if soldering errors? Was thinking of getting both plates, should I get at least 1 pcb per?
I was considering doing this --- for the simple fact that you could have TWO sets of switches & programmed PCB's. For me, I'd probably have a lubed tactile switch and then a lubed linear ;P.
This being my first build, what will I need other than switches and stabilizers?
This being my first build, what will I need other than switches and stabilizers?
USB cable and keycaps, maybe batteries for the bluetooth
This being my first build, what will I need other than switches and stabilizers?
USB cable and keycaps, maybe batteries for the bluetooth
This being my first build, what will I need other than switches and stabilizers?
USB cable and keycaps, maybe batteries for the bluetooth
Don't forget some decent lube!
This being my first build, what will I need other than switches and stabilizers?
USB cable and keycaps, maybe batteries for the bluetoothThis being my first build, what will I need other than switches and stabilizers?
USB cable and keycaps, maybe batteries for the bluetooth
Don't forget some decent lube!
Thank you gentlemen. I wont need to solder in the usb thing, or buy a micro controller? No idea what im doing.
Because I have to ask: Costar stab support?
Quote
* split right shift is available
* yes
* the lightest combination will be: an aluminum half plate + American black walnut weight
* Elemento will have it tested and we will update the numbers once available (hopefully before the GB ends)
Cheers. Few more questions:
* Does the PCB allow split backspace as well?
* Yes to what? :) The question was: "Do I necessarily need to add weight to the keyboard or there's an alternative method to cover the battery compartment?"
* Do you know the weight of any of the light weighted combinations? I mean the weight in grams or in kilograms? Is it closer to 3 kg or to 1 kg?
* If Elemento doesn't manage to give tech details about the keyboard before the GB finishes, will the GB be extended?
I really would like to know more details about this keyboard but seemingly most of the certain parameters known so far are related to look and feel. What I see is amazing and all my appreciation goes to the designer. I'm desperately hunting for a Bluetooth mechanical keyboard since a long while though and to me, weight and battery life is as important as programmability (which I also don't know much about) and layout. I feel a bit silly asking these questions though. Looks like the answers are either obvious to everyone else or simply most people don't care about these details. :rolleyes: Anyhow, I'll keep an eye on the GB to see if you guys manage to find out what exactly is for sale here other than an amazing looking and finely crafted piece of aluminum with some additional weight.
Because I have to ask: Costar stab support?
Because I have to ask: Costar stab support?
can tell from the shape of the cutout: no
Thank you for showing much love to this project :) and sorry for missing some points on the previous answer :(
No, it will not support split backspace
You can only cover up the battery compartment with a weight
Elemento dont currently have every component, but the early structural prototype was around 1.5kg. We dont have the exact numbers but with the lightest combination you should be looking at something between 1.5-2 kg
Yes, we will definitely extend the GB if necessary
Since I've never built one before, what makes them different? I adore the costars on my WASD, and was looking forward to putting some on this... Is there really no way to make it work?
Do I use plate mounted stabs for this?
Regular or screw in?Do I use plate mounted stabs for this?
no, PCB mount
Regular or screw in?Do I use plate mounted stabs for this?
no, PCB mount
Since I've never built one before, what makes them different? I adore the costars on my WASD, and was looking forward to putting some on this... Is there really no way to make it work?
Costar mounts are a slightly different shape than plate-mounted Cherry stabilizers for...no real reason, actually. Slightly narrower and longer. It is possible for a plate to support both by essentially having extra small notches in the stabilizer mounting holes.
The differences are entirely historic. There is absolutely no technical reason why somebody couldn't make a mount for costars with the same dimensions as plate-mounted Cherry stabs. But nobody does. I guess it's just too niche? I've seriously thought about 3D printing my own or something.
Any chance assembly would be offered?
Could reimburse/get em shipped to them.Any chance assembly would be offered?
I second this; but I don't think they're offering switches so not sure how that'll work
It's getting pretty close to the end of the GB - still no word on the color samples, Bluetooth data, power consumption, open-source programming, etc. I love how this board looks, but I don't think I can justify going in unless we get some more information in the next few days.Didnt they already confirm QMK? Is battery life really a deal breaker? Gosh this will be my first build and idgaf about battery life lol.
I AM SUPER INTERESTED IN THIS. However, my main concern is the programmable option.
What firmware will the PCB support? Can we please have more details?
I think this was on the reddit post. But it will be programmable through a web app.
Many requested QMK, we will have QMK in our discussion with Elemento
It's getting pretty close to the end of the GB - still no word on the color samples, Bluetooth data, power consumption, open-source programming, etc. I love how this board looks, but I don't think I can justify going in unless we get some more information in the next few days.Didnt they already confirm QMK? Is battery life really a deal breaker? Gosh this will be my first build and idgaf about battery life lol.
Side note, I can't find the info anywhere but was anything mentioned regarding the switch orientation (i.e. south facing, etc)?
It's getting pretty close to the end of the GB - still no word on the color samples, Bluetooth data, power consumption, open-source programming, etc. I love how this board looks, but I don't think I can justify going in unless we get some more information in the next few days.
Side note, I can't find the info anywhere but was anything mentioned regarding the switch orientation (i.e. south facing, etc)?
LEDs are south facing according to the IC thread.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=93672.msg2551856#msg2551856 (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=93672.msg2551856#msg2551856)
It's getting pretty close to the end of the GB - still no word on the color samples, Bluetooth data, power consumption, open-source programming, etc. I love how this board looks, but I don't think I can justify going in unless we get some more information in the next few days.
Yeah, same exact reason why I haven't joined this GB either.
As a person who got in on the first few days i'm concerned to see the lack of communication from OP.
Aside from the questions posed here, there were also (important to me) questions on reddit he wanted to "come back at" which he never did. It was about if we will have the possibility to buy the case or at least the upper part of it as extras... wanted to put my money in there too, extra pcb and plate, but without seeing him caring i probably will not put more money into this :(
Meh, we all knew color samples dont come till after the order is placed. OP is probably sitting in his room testing the prototype for us.
Lets say OP was abducted and no longer on this world... Would I still get my blue elemento Fr87?Meh, we all knew color samples dont come till after the order is placed. OP is probably sitting in his room testing the prototype for us.
Wish OP was testing it by typing a reply here
Z Frontier is supposed to be a pretty legit vendor, right? I made sure to look around and read up on them prior to this buy starting. Maybe I'm just worried cause I had an indiegogo project go south on me recently, but I'm feeling uneasy here, too.
Z Frontier is supposed to be a pretty legit vendor, right? I made sure to look around and read up on them prior to this buy starting. Maybe I'm just worried cause I had an indiegogo project go south on me recently, but I'm feeling uneasy here, too.
Yes, they are. However the lack of updates has been a concern. They have been active everyday I have checked their profile...
perhaps I will have a chat with Paypal and get them to extend my buyer protection period. The groupbuy is just longer than the 3 months.
EDIT: Just come off the phone with Paypal. On all the transactions, as long as you paid for it with buyer protection, you have got 6 months (180 days) of protection. You can start a case up until the last day of that buyer protection if nothing has been delivered or if insufficient updates have been given. The guy was also very suprised how much a keyboard could cost! :P
Z Frontier is supposed to be a pretty legit vendor, right? I made sure to look around and read up on them prior to this buy starting. Maybe I'm just worried cause I had an indiegogo project go south on me recently, but I'm feeling uneasy here, too.
EDIT: Just come off the phone with Paypal. On all the transactions, as long as you paid for it with buyer protection, you have got 6 months (180 days) of protection. You can start a case up until the last day of that buyer protection if nothing has been delivered or if insufficient updates have been given. The guy was also very suprised how much a keyboard could cost! :P
Do I want that buyer protection thing? Whats the risk without it?
EDIT: Just come off the phone with Paypal. On all the transactions, as long as you paid for it with buyer protection, you have got 6 months (180 days) of protection. You can start a case up until the last day of that buyer protection if nothing has been delivered or if insufficient updates have been given. The guy was also very suprised how much a keyboard could cost! :P
Do I want that buyer protection thing? Whats the risk without it?
Just curious, what are people worried about exactly? Battery life and QMK?
Just curious, what are people worried about exactly? Battery life and QMK?
Updates on reply 1#.
I sincerely apologize for not posting an update earlier. Rest assure that Elemento and we will make this board great.
Updates on reply 1#.
I sincerely apologize for not posting an update earlier. Rest assure that Elemento and we will make this board great.
(insert updates now the GB has already closed and still not addressing questions about bluetooth and firmware)
Updates on reply 1#.
I sincerely apologize for not posting an update earlier. Rest assure that Elemento and we will make this board great.
gb concluded without us ever seeing color samples or bt working :(
But the board will be "great" ... Don't worry.
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
gb concluded without us ever seeing color samples or bt working :(But the board will be "great" ... Don't worry.
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
I'd have jumped ship already if it weren't ZFrontier. Though I'm still very close to doing so. My first GB/custom board isn't going so well. Caveat Emptor for sure :l
gb concluded without us ever seeing color samples or bt working :(But the board will be "great" ... Don't worry.
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
I'd have jumped ship already if it weren't ZFrontier. Though I'm still very close to doing so. My first GB/custom board isn't going so well. Caveat Emptor for sure :l
i wouldn't jump to conclusions yet! I mean honestly this isn't that bad at all! Things happen and the design is radical. I have my own misgivings about this group buy for other reasons. Mainly the lack of details. Which if that was a issue people should have simply not bought in. Yea some delay's and things are to be expected. I mean its completely justifiable. Your a Manufacture what are you going to tool up for a order of 200-300 keyboard's... that are going to be 150 dollars profit each to manufacture.. are do you tool up for the keyboard order thats like 5000-6000 at 100 bucks a pop. I mean since you can only manufacture one at a time. Obviously the bigger order gets priority. Special when it would come to making a 1 off custom unit as a prototype.
gb concluded without us ever seeing color samples or bt working :(But the board will be "great" ... Don't worry.
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
I'd have jumped ship already if it weren't ZFrontier. Though I'm still very close to doing so. My first GB/custom board isn't going so well. Caveat Emptor for sure :l
i wouldn't jump to conclusions yet! I mean honestly this isn't that bad at all! Things happen and the design is radical. I have my own misgivings about this group buy for other reasons. Mainly the lack of details. Which if that was a issue people should have simply not bought in. Yea some delay's and things are to be expected. I mean its completely justifiable. Your a Manufacture what are you going to tool up for a order of 200-300 keyboard's... that are going to be 150 dollars profit each to manufacture.. are do you tool up for the keyboard order thats like 5000-6000 at 100 bucks a pop. I mean since you can only manufacture one at a time. Obviously the bigger order gets priority. Special when it would come to making a 1 off custom unit as a prototype.
My issue I'm having is communication. Even if it's little updates, or just really... any kind of interacting, honestly. But maybe that's just not how things are done in group buys - I'm new to this. So, I'll just keep my fingers crossed since this board is, theoretically, the perfect board for me.
I think on average people end up waiting longer for a group buy to finish. Its uncommon for a group buy to be on time. I hope this helps cause they can be confusing group buys in general. Special if your new to the keyboard scene.Yeah, pretty much this.
I think on average people end up waiting longer for a group buy to finish. Its uncommon for a group buy to be on time. I hope this helps cause they can be confusing group buys in general. Special if your new to the keyboard scene.Yeah, pretty much this.
For the first one, two or even three groupbuys one will be kinda disappointed with having to wait that long for the stuff to arrive... but with experience one will learn that estimated shipping dates aren't something trustworthy. Some might ship in time, but most will be late.
gb concluded without us ever seeing color samples or bt working :(But the board will be "great" ... Don't worry.
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
I'd have jumped ship already if it weren't ZFrontier. Though I'm still very close to doing so. My first GB/custom board isn't going so well. Caveat Emptor for sure :l
i wouldn't jump to conclusions yet! I mean honestly this isn't that bad at all! Things happen and the design is radical. I have my own misgivings about this group buy for other reasons. Mainly the lack of details. Which if that was a issue people should have simply not bought in. Yea some delay's and things are to be expected. I mean its completely justifiable. Your a Manufacture what are you going to tool up for a order of 200-300 keyboard's... that are going to be 150 dollars profit each to manufacture.. are do you tool up for the keyboard order thats like 5000-6000 at 100 bucks a pop. I mean since you can only manufacture one at a time. Obviously the bigger order gets priority. Special when it would come to making a 1 off custom unit as a prototype.
My issue I'm having is communication. Even if it's little updates, or just really... any kind of interacting, honestly. But maybe that's just not how things are done in group buys - I'm new to this. So, I'll just keep my fingers crossed since this board is, theoretically, the perfect board for me.
Truthfully it really really depends.. majority of group buys I have seen.. there not a terrible lot of updates. Thats not to say that some don't take it to the extreme with tons of updates, Majority don't. Two of the ones I am in right now.. The updates where at the very start "Paying Vendor and manufacturing has started... the other was Order Placed with Vendor." On both of those the next step I would expect to hear something back would be that its about to ship out. I mean some leaders will tell ya there going to be packaging are that manufacturing is 50% done but most don't. It can take a while for things to ship out. I think on average people end up waiting longer for a group buy to finish. Its uncommon for a group buy to be on time. I hope this helps cause they can be confusing group buys in general. Special if your new to the keyboard scene.
A word from zFrontier would be great, it's been six weeks since the last update.
A word from zFrontier would be great, it's been six weeks since the last update.
I talked to Alex (ZFrontier) earlier, there an update coming. I will let him explain the situation, however I am expecting a delay...
Hi guys, Alex here
In short, I sincerely apologize for lack of updates, some issues occurred, but things are back on track and should proceed fast in the following weeks.
Really sorry for the lack of news here, but Elemento and us did encounter some issues:
To be frank, the factory Elemento first contacted was not able to meet the requirements after the intricate structural upgrade that includes many parts in different materials, so we help Elemento out and moved on to a new source.
And that take quite some time as communication back and forth wasnt smooth
But Elemento and we have things sorted out and things are back on track, I will be responsible for this thread and have updates from time to time, solid or not, to keep you guys in the loop.
Again, sorry for the miscommunication.
Thank you for your support!
I didnt know that there was an MOQ as the GB has ended and a manufacturer has been found...
Hi guys, Alex here
In short, I sincerely apologize for lack of updates, some issues occurred, but things are back on track and should proceed fast in the following weeks.
Really sorry for the lack of news here, but Elemento and us did encounter some issues:
To be frank, the factory Elemento first contacted was not able to meet the requirements after the intricate structural upgrade that includes many parts in different materials, so we help Elemento out and moved on to a new source.
And that take quite some time as communication back and forth wasnt smooth
But Elemento and we have things sorted out and things are back on track, I will be responsible for this thread and have updates from time to time, solid or not, to keep you guys in the loop.
Again, sorry for the miscommunication.
Thank you for your support!
Hey Alex, thanks for the update! Have a few questions on this:
Will Elemento have a presence here, on the forums?
What structural changes were made that caused an issue at the factory?
Is there any kind of MOQ, and if so, what percentage are we at towards meeting it?
Hi guys, Alex here
In short, I sincerely apologize for lack of updates, some issues occurred, but things are back on track and should proceed fast in the following weeks.
Really sorry for the lack of news here, but Elemento and us did encounter some issues:
To be frank, the factory Elemento first contacted was not able to meet the requirements after the intricate structural upgrade that includes many parts in different materials, so we help Elemento out and moved on to a new source.
And that take quite some time as communication back and forth wasnt smooth
But Elemento and we have things sorted out and things are back on track, I will be responsible for this thread and have updates from time to time, solid or not, to keep you guys in the loop.
Again, sorry for the miscommunication.
Thank you for your support!
Hey Alex, thanks for the update! Have a few questions on this:
Will Elemento have a presence here, on the forums?
What structural changes were made that caused an issue at the factory?
Is there any kind of MOQ, and if so, what percentage are we at towards meeting it?
Hi Raven,
Yes, I will ask him to have an account here.
The major problem is the battery housing, possible interference with the PCB if not milled perfectly. also, as elemento move on to a rechargeable design, safety becomes a more important thing. NiMH becomes the idea choice for battery, but then worries like people using non-rechargeable batteries occurs. First off, Elemento tried to redesign the contact springs since some rechargeable batteries have their negative exposed to the side and thus some structural changed. And then that was reversed since that really limits the choice of battery and some places might not be able to find those exact batteries. These back and forth costs a lot of time.
And yes, Elemento will be heading to China, again, to check on the manufacturing process.
Snip
I'm also still curious about QMK. It was mentioned a few times in this forum, but I never saw a confirmation that the board will support it.
Thanks for the updates!
Snip
I agree with Raven Panther, a standard AA size battery would work perfectly!
As far as timescales, do know how much of a delay are we looking at?
Snip
Hi guys, I have just emailed this to Zfrontier asking for an update but also asking for some much needed answers to some of your questions.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/07Iy3Ak.png)
Hi guys, I have just emailed this to Zfrontier asking for an update but also asking for some much needed answers to some of your questions.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/07Iy3Ak.png)
to play devil's advocate perhaps there trying to get answers from Elemento and getting the run around. Are being told they will get answers soon™. I could see that being why Zfrontier is dragging there feet with answers. Cause from what seen Zfrontier is always pretty upfront. Honestly when the group buy was running Elemento set off so many redflag's for me as being sorta shady. This is just my humbled opinion. Given some answers would be better then the radio silence people are getting about the entire thing.
Thanks for supporting us. Apologies for lack of updates. Here they are:
We received some parts and PCB last week, and this is what you are looking at:
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
This unit is Cool Gray.
Unfortunately, our board is likely not QMK compatible mostly due to the light effects we want to achive. However, we will have our own Windows-based software for macro and light effects editing. Our PCB do have an onboard flash for memorizing all your settings.
The battery life depends significantly on LEDs. With all lights off, 4 AAA should last 1.5 weeks based on medium usage (like 4 hours per day). The Bluetooth module is a 3.0 version, instead of a BLE one, for better compatibility with older devices.
For Bluetooth signal, we have no problem with normal typing scenarios. But signal shielding on the bottom is expected since the bottom case is fully enclosed.
For the timescales, sadly, we will need an extra month or two.
Thanks!
Thanks for supporting us. Apologies for lack of updates. Here they are:
We received some parts and PCB last week, and this is what you are looking at:
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
This unit is Cool Gray.
Unfortunately, our board is likely not QMK compatible mostly due to the light effects we want to achive. However, we will have our own Windows-based software for macro and light effects editing. Our PCB do have an onboard flash for memorizing all your settings.
The battery life depends significantly on LEDs. With all lights off, 4 AAA should last 1.5 weeks based on medium usage (like 4 hours per day). The Bluetooth module is a 3.0 version, instead of a BLE one, for better compatibility with older devices.
For Bluetooth signal, we have no problem with normal typing scenarios. But signal shielding on the bottom is expected since the bottom case is fully enclosed.
For the timescales, sadly, we will need an extra month or two.
Thanks!
Snip
Thanks for supporting us. Apologies for lack of updates. Here they are:...
Thanks for supporting us. Apologies for lack of updates. Here they are:
We received some parts and PCB last week, and this is what you are looking at:
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
This unit is Cool Gray.
Unfortunately, our board is likely not QMK compatible mostly due to the light effects we want to achive. However, we will have our own Windows-based software for macro and light effects editing. Our PCB do have an onboard flash for memorizing all your settings.
The battery life depends significantly on LEDs. With all lights off, 4 AAA should last 1.5 weeks based on medium usage (like 4 hours per day). The Bluetooth module is a 3.0 version, instead of a BLE one, for better compatibility with older devices.
For Bluetooth signal, we have no problem with normal typing scenarios. But signal shielding on the bottom is expected since the bottom case is fully enclosed.
For the timescales, sadly, we will need an extra month or two.
Thanks!
No qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
No qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
You can VM windows.
No qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
You can VM windows.
I will be fair, using a Windows VM to code a keyboard on a Mac or Linux isn't ideal.
No qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
No qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
You can VM windows.
I will be fair, using a Windows VM to code a keyboard on a Mac or Linux isn't ideal.
Oh, I won't argue that. But he's acting like he can't do it and won't ever be able to do it.
No qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
You can VM windows.
I will be fair, using a Windows VM to code a keyboard on a Mac or Linux isn't ideal.
Oh, I won't argue that. But he's acting like he can't do it and won't ever be able to do it.
Updating the firmware in a VM isn't ideal. I had some troubles with the pok3r. Go figure what will happen with a keyboard made in 100 pieces, with a custom firmware, that will not be sold or updated anymore after this GB.
mac whoNo qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
You can VM windows.
I will be fair, using a Windows VM to code a keyboard on a Mac or Linux isn't ideal.
Oh, I won't argue that. But he's acting like he can't do it and won't ever be able to do it.
Updating the firmware in a VM isn't ideal. I had some troubles with the pok3r. Go figure what will happen with a keyboard made in 100 pieces, with a custom firmware, that will not be sold or updated anymore after this GB.
can I just ask why you bought into the keyboard if you knew going in there was a chance that it might not be Mac friendly? I am just kinda curious cause I always go into things thinking what I see is what I get. Given if there is some kinda nifty addon/upgrade after the fact then great. Otherwise I just assume things are the way they are.
mac whoNo qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
You can VM windows.
I will be fair, using a Windows VM to code a keyboard on a Mac or Linux isn't ideal.
Oh, I won't argue that. But he's acting like he can't do it and won't ever be able to do it.
Updating the firmware in a VM isn't ideal. I had some troubles with the pok3r. Go figure what will happen with a keyboard made in 100 pieces, with a custom firmware, that will not be sold or updated anymore after this GB.
can I just ask why you bought into the keyboard if you knew going in there was a chance that it might not be Mac friendly? I am just kinda curious cause I always go into things thinking what I see is what I get. Given if there is some kinda nifty addon/upgrade after the fact then great. Otherwise I just assume things are the way they are.
mac whoNo qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
You can VM windows.
I will be fair, using a Windows VM to code a keyboard on a Mac or Linux isn't ideal.
Oh, I won't argue that. But he's acting like he can't do it and won't ever be able to do it.
Updating the firmware in a VM isn't ideal. I had some troubles with the pok3r. Go figure what will happen with a keyboard made in 100 pieces, with a custom firmware, that will not be sold or updated anymore after this GB.
can I just ask why you bought into the keyboard if you knew going in there was a chance that it might not be Mac friendly? I am just kinda curious cause I always go into things thinking what I see is what I get. Given if there is some kinda nifty addon/upgrade after the fact then great. Otherwise I just assume things are the way they are.
dunno... sounds like nonsense ;)
but you could give it a spin with Wine (https://www.winehq.org), maybe that'll work... (or something like it)
Im not clued up on Mac stuff but to me it just sounds like you have a drinking problem... :pdunno...sounds like nonsense ;)mac whocan I just ask why you bought into the keyboard if you knew going in there was a chance that it might not be Mac friendly? I am just kinda curious cause I always go into things thinking what I see is what I get. Given if there is some kinda nifty addon/upgrade after the fact then great. Otherwise I just assume things are the way they are.Updating the firmware in a VM isn't ideal. I had some troubles with the pok3r. Go figure what will happen with a keyboard made in 100 pieces, with a custom firmware, that will not be sold or updated anymore after this GB.Oh, I won't argue that. But he's acting like he can't do it and won't ever be able to do it.I will be fair, using a Windows VM to code a keyboard on a Mac or Linux isn't ideal.No qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?You can VM windows.
I don't have windows.
but you could give it a spin with Wine (https://www.winehq.org), maybe that'll work... (or something like it)
No qmk tmk compatibility isn't good. Why can't you improve the existing software, or pay the developer?
I don't have windows.
You can VM windows.
I will be fair, using a Windows VM to code a keyboard on a Mac or Linux isn't ideal.
Oh, I won't argue that. But he's acting like he can't do it and won't ever be able to do it.
Updating the firmware in a VM isn't ideal. I had some troubles with the pok3r. Go figure what will happen with a keyboard made in 100 pieces, with a custom firmware, that will not be sold or updated anymore after this GB.
can I just ask why you bought into the keyboard if you knew going in there was a chance that it might not be Mac friendly? I am just kinda curious cause I always go into things thinking what I see is what I get. Given if there is some kinda nifty addon/upgrade after the fact then great. Otherwise I just assume things are the way they are.
can I just ask why you bought into the keyboard if you knew going in there was a chance that it might not be Mac friendly? I am just kinda curious cause I always go into things thinking what I see is what I get. Given if there is some kinda nifty addon/upgrade after the fact then great. Otherwise I just assume things are the way they are.I need to adopt this mindset, this is a beautiful way to live life. Anything that's extra is always a pleasant surprise! :]
can I just ask why you bought into the keyboard if you knew going in there was a chance that it might not be Mac friendly? I am just kinda curious cause I always go into things thinking what I see is what I get. Given if there is some kinda nifty addon/upgrade after the fact then great. Otherwise I just assume things are the way they are.I need to adopt this mindset, this is a beautiful way to live life. Anything that's extra is always a pleasant surprise! :]
don't we all first need to get a life? :p
can I just ask why you bought into the keyboard if you knew going in there was a chance that it might not be Mac friendly? I am just kinda curious cause I always go into things thinking what I see is what I get. Given if there is some kinda nifty addon/upgrade after the fact then great. Otherwise I just assume things are the way they are.I need to adopt this mindset, this is a beautiful way to live life. Anything that's extra is always a pleasant surprise! :]
don't we all first need to get a life? :p
Hi ELEMENTO, how are things doing? Any updates?
Just so everyone knows. We are at 110 days since they took payment via Paypal. We have another 70 days of buyer protection. Make sure you contact Paypal to cancel and restart the payment before the 180 days ends. This gives you another 180 days of buyer protection!
Just so everyone knows. We are at 110 days since they took payment via Paypal. We have another 70 days of buyer protection. Make sure you contact Paypal to cancel and restart the payment before the 180 days ends. This gives you another 180 days of buyer protection!
what? that's an option?
TILJust so everyone knows. We are at 110 days since they took payment via Paypal. We have another 70 days of buyer protection. Make sure you contact Paypal to cancel and restart the payment before the 180 days ends. This gives you another 180 days of buyer protection!
what? that's an option?
Yeh, of course. Just phone Paypal and they will do it for you...
Just so everyone knows. We are at 110 days since they took payment via Paypal. We have another 70 days of buyer protection. Make sure you contact Paypal to cancel and restart the payment before the 180 days ends. This gives you another 180 days of buyer protection!
Just so everyone knows. We are at 110 days since they took payment via Paypal. We have another 70 days of buyer protection. Make sure you contact Paypal to cancel and restart the payment before the 180 days ends. This gives you another 180 days of buyer protection!
Awesome! Thanks
TILJust so everyone knows. We are at 110 days since they took payment via Paypal. We have another 70 days of buyer protection. Make sure you contact Paypal to cancel and restart the payment before the 180 days ends. This gives you another 180 days of buyer protection!
what? that's an option?
Yeh, of course. Just phone Paypal and they will do it for you...
Just so everyone knows. We are at 110 days since they took payment via Paypal. We have another 70 days of buyer protection. Make sure you contact Paypal to cancel and restart the payment before the 180 days ends. This gives you another 180 days of buyer protection!
Just so everyone knows. We are at 110 days since they took payment via Paypal. We have another 70 days of buyer protection. Make sure you contact Paypal to cancel and restart the payment before the 180 days ends. This gives you another 180 days of buyer protection!
Honestly, given how ****ty Elemento (and to some extent zF) has been about giving updates, I'm strongly considering doing it. Kinda steamed too since I cancelled my KBD 8X GB slot (which was running at the time and looks beautiful from all the posts here and on reddit) to get in on this.
Edit to add: I don't think it's too much to ask them to update on a weekly or biweekly basis, given how few updates/contacts all the GB participants have received so far.
Check your emails I guess. I received an email from zF about this groupbuy yesterday. Claiming an ETA of September.
yep, really happy I went with blue. Will match nicely with Sol DarkCheck your emails I guess. I received an email from zF about this groupbuy yesterday. Claiming an ETA of September.
Yep, saw it, at least we have something. The blue they showed look great by the way.
Why are they not pushing this update to the place where the originally announced it? Perhaps to try and quell the public conversations about this GB?
I for one am really dissapointed that it has taken another month to get this update.
1. You have confirmed that the ETA is now September... Lets see how long that will last. We are now at the point of shipping and we have pictures of 2/4 colours and no proper pictures of the PCB or the parts for the bluetooth/ battery compartment.
2. You have confirmed the colour of the tactical blue... Something that should of been done in the prototyping phase or at the beginning of the GB. NOT mid groupbuy!
3. Why at no stage in your pre GB posts did you say what the colour codes you were using were? Or is this just the closest Pantone to the anodized finish? Can we perhaps know what the other pantone colours are then to get a proper idea of what to expect?
4. You have said repeatedly that you are going to give us more updates. However that has fallen short of the mark multiple times. Elemento has made one post and then none of the questions directed to them have been answered. How do we know that these aren't false promises like before?
5. A PCB update in 1-2 weeks... Why has there been no movement on this before now? Surely that can be created seperately from the case? or were the PCB and case not finished designs which we were sold?
Throughout this whole groupbuy, I felt like I have been fobbed off. We get enough information to keep us happy for another month and then radio silence once again.
I strongly suggest to everyone who is within this GB to call Paypal and to make sure that they can extend their buyer protection. At this rate we will be well past the 180 days of Buyer protection before we see something nearly complete.
Snip
SnipI am guessing you are in the US, so I would contact your credit card provider and see what they are able to do!
Has anybody seen Input Club RE:Type? I'm tempted to jump ship for that. IC seems more reliable than ZF at this point... I really wish zFrontier would take charge with this buy. I see them being revered for other GB projects, which is why I went in on this buy with such little info on the board. I figured that even if ELEMENTO wasn't on the up-and-up, that they'd own up to the issues and be open with what's going on.meh, retype is nothing for me... I don't like being locked down to a single layout... also no half plate, doesn't look good, it's just bland
Has anybody seen Input Club RE:Type? I'm tempted to jump ship for that. IC seems more reliable than ZF at this point... I really wish zFrontier would take charge with this buy. I see them being revered for other GB projects, which is why I went in on this buy with such little info on the board. I figured that even if ELEMENTO wasn't on the up-and-up, that they'd own up to the issues and be open with what's going on.
Has anybody seen Input Club RE:Type? I'm tempted to jump ship for that. IC seems more reliable than ZF at this point... I really wish zFrontier would take charge with this buy. I see them being revered for other GB projects, which is why I went in on this buy with such little info on the board. I figured that even if ELEMENTO wasn't on the up-and-up, that they'd own up to the issues and be open with what's going on.meh, retype is nothing for me... I don't like being locked down to a single layout... also no half plate, doesn't look good, it's just bland
Has anybody seen Input Club RE:Type? I'm tempted to jump ship for that. IC seems more reliable than ZF at this point... I really wish zFrontier would take charge with this buy. I see them being revered for other GB projects, which is why I went in on this buy with such little info on the board. I figured that even if ELEMENTO wasn't on the up-and-up, that they'd own up to the issues and be open with what's going on.
I don't know I hadn't heard a lot of good about input club. They seem almost shady at times. They tend to hold back info until brought public. Like guy asked a simple question if I order XYZ how will it ship. They refused to tell him saying they couldn't. Then he gets on reddit and suddenly they admit they don't know they ship thought a 3rd party that just ships things.
Then there is the K-Type they abandoned that project December was the last update. Glad they got into a pissing match with massdrop but as a customer. I could honestly careless I would have liked to have had my product supported.
Then they blamed Massdrop for the inferior stabilizers that rattle. They supposedly tried to get Massdrop to go with better. There Whitefox they released not the ones from massdrop suffered the same issue from reports. They also suffered the same static issues with the PCB from what read that the first two generations had from Massdrop.
Then the switches they produced remember first few batches were lubed in such a way they basically become liner's from the factory. I think they got that worked out finally. I just wouldn't trust Massdrop. Sure Z-Frontier hasn't been the best people to deal with on this drop but. this was a single drop and it could be Elemento that is the problem.
Bumping this in hopes it gets ZF attention.
We are now on two months of no communication from either Elemento or ZF - save for a single email from ZF which is unacceptable in my eyes as the buy is being run in here, not through my email. I see other buys by ZF that are getting frequent attention, while this gets buried.
Just your friendly reminder to contact Paypal to extend your buyer protection!
We have just 29 days of buyer protection left and if you don't extend then there is nothing that PayPal will be able to do, if the product the never sent out or has even more major delays.
It has taken 151 days so far to get the pictures of two out of the four colours. We also have no proper updates on the PCB!
How does extending buy protection work?
Check your email guys, new update there...nice, but image links are broken
Check your email guys, new update there...nice, but image links are broken
I think everybody got the second mail with the picsCheck your email guys, new update there...nice, but image links are broken
I asked Alex about that and he sent me the pics. Don’t know if I should be the one posting them.
I think everybody got the second mail with the picsCheck your email guys, new update there...nice, but image links are broken
I asked Alex about that and he sent me the pics. Don’t know if I should be the one posting them.
Check your email guys, new update there...
Check your email guys, new update there...
What the absolute ****?! I haven't gotten anything in my emails as far as I can tell!
ZFrontier, why are updates to the group buy not being posted in the group buy thread?
Third thing why don't you just ask someone who got the email to post a update. People are being so cagey with this stuff its kinda insane. I mean since ZFrontier isn't updating and neither is Elemento. Then go ahead post the email's. They don't like it tough they should have followed geekhack guide lines and posted updates to the thread.
Hi all,
First of all, I would like to apologize that I could not keep up the update due to being to occupied coordinating many other GBs and shipping.
Now we are at a stage where we have all the housing, metal parts done and sorting should begin early Sept once packages and other assembly parts are ready. Packaging should be ready soon as well. The annoying part is that the PCB manufacturer is now fixing some issues we discovered during inspection.
Anodizing, done. Laser etching, done. Requesting photos from the manufacturer.
PVD, done. Took the manufacturer 3 trials and attempts to perfect them.
Custom rubber feet, done.
Package, ongoing.
Assembly parts, ongoing.
PCB, ongoing. RGB refresh rate was not desired, staring long time into the backlight is not comfortable. Manufacturer currently working on fixing this issue.
If you need help extending paypal protection, feel free to let me know. I will help you with this. And zFrontier as a company and a business will be responsible for your purchase.
Best,
Alex
Check your email guys, new update there...
What the absolute ****?! I haven't gotten anything in my emails as far as I can tell!
ZFrontier, why are updates to the group buy not being posted in the group buy thread?
Did you check your spam folder? That would be my first guess as to what happened to your email's.
Second guess is depending on who you use for a Email provider ((I know most use Gmail)) They might have email's from Zfrontiers home region blocked. I am guessing its china.
Third thing why don't you just ask someone who got the email to post a update. People are being so cagey with this stuff its kinda insane. I mean since ZFrontier isn't updating and neither is Elemento. Then go ahead post the email's. They don't like it tough they should have followed geekhack guide lines and posted updates to the thread.
Also if its this upsetting to you Raven why not go ahead and do a buyer protection claim with paypal.
Snip
Got my refund through from ZFroniter and paid the new invoice to renew my 180 days of Paypal Protection! Feel a little more secure about this now!
Is that why the GB isn't shown as Sold Out on Zfrontier?
Now it shows as sold out for me too. Pretty sure that when I wrote that comment I could place an order lol.Is that why the GB isn't shown as Sold Out on Zfrontier?
It is for me? Also, I just want to point out that I emailed zFrontier about a week ago regarding my order and haven't heard anything back. The Pokémon Kid, how long did they take to respond to your email?
Is that why the GB isn't shown as Sold Out on Zfrontier?
It is for me? Also, I just want to point out that I emailed zFrontier about a week ago regarding my order and haven't heard anything back. The Pokémon Kid, how long did they take to respond to your email?
Now it shows as sold out for me too. Pretty sure that when I wrote that comment I could place an order lol.Is that why the GB isn't shown as Sold Out on Zfrontier?
It is for me? Also, I just want to point out that I emailed zFrontier about a week ago regarding my order and haven't heard anything back. The Pokémon Kid, how long did they take to respond to your email?
Is that why the GB isn't shown as Sold Out on Zfrontier?
It is for me? Also, I just want to point out that I emailed zFrontier about a week ago regarding my order and haven't heard anything back. The Pokémon Kid, how long did they take to respond to your email?
They took a day to respond. I would contact Paypal about getting a refund. That will get you on Zfrontiers radar pretty quick. I think paypal can send a message to them on your behalf...
That 2 week PCB update is now 6 weeks late...no, no update yet... I'm still trusting on zFrontier to get a grip on this though, they have been pretty correct so far, it's just that the delays are annoying for sure
Has anyone recieved any updates on this GB since 15th of August? We are now in the time when the delayed board was ment to being shipped.
That 2 week PCB update is now 6 weeks late...
Has anyone recieved any updates on this GB since 15th of August? We are now in the time when the delayed board was ment to being shipped.
That 2 week PCB update is now 6 weeks late...no, no update yet... I'm still trusting on zFrontier to get a grip on this though, they have been pretty correct so far, it's just that the delays are annoying for sure
Has anyone recieved any updates on this GB since 15th of August? We are now in the time when the delayed board was ment to being shipped.
That 2 week PCB update is now 6 weeks late...
Has anyone recieved any updates on this GB since 15th of August? We are now in the time when the delayed board was ment to being shipped.
I've emailed them 3 times now regarding getting my payment re-done, and haven't heard anything back. Three weeks, one email a week, no response :lThat 2 week PCB update is now 6 weeks late...no, no update yet... I'm still trusting on zFrontier to get a grip on this though, they have been pretty correct so far, it's just that the delays are annoying for sure
Has anyone recieved any updates on this GB since 15th of August? We are now in the time when the delayed board was ment to being shipped.
Please help me keep my faith in them too, it's wavering hard. Not a lot of people seem to be jumping ship (or at least being vocal about it) so I'm curious what positive experiences they've had with ZF as this one is my first and it's certainly not positive.
Please help me keep my faith in them too, it's wavering hard. Not a lot of people seem to be jumping ship (or at least being vocal about it) so I'm curious what positive experiences they've had with ZF as this one is my first and it's certainly not positive.
Well, since it's someone else behind the production they can't influence that too much, however if things go wrong I'm sure they'd either look for other means to get it done or refund the money. (I don't mistrust them in that regard)
As for the lack of updates and not replying to mails, that's a no no. I know they've been extremely busy lately, but that's not an excuse.
Imho the ZFrontier brand is as good as it was before this gb, after all this is still a GB. Let me cite from "What is a group buy? Should I join one? Group Buy FAQ / Buying Guidelines" (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=77272.0): "And it takes months, sometimes a year+ for group buys to complete. Be prepared to wait."
Well, since it's someone else behind the production they can't influence that too much, however if things go wrong I'm sure they'd either look for other means to get it done or refund the money. (I don't mistrust them in that regard)
As for the lack of updates and not replying to mails, that's a no no. I know they've been extremely busy lately, but that's not an excuse.
Well actually ZFrontier should be able to have an influence on this. They should be the ones steering the ship and making regular checks on Elemento and not just allowing to do their own thing. Especially when they find a manufacturer and then it becomes evident that the manufacturer can't do the work. At this point if I were ZFrontier I would be managing Elemento on a weekly basis, if not more frequent as they are dragging the ZFrontier brand through the mud.
Imho the ZFrontier brand is as good as it was before this gb, after all this is still a GB. Let me cite from "What is a group buy? Should I join one? Group Buy FAQ / Buying Guidelines" (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=77272.0): "And it takes months, sometimes a year+ for group buys to complete. Be prepared to wait."
Well, since it's someone else behind the production they can't influence that too much, however if things go wrong I'm sure they'd either look for other means to get it done or refund the money. (I don't mistrust them in that regard)
As for the lack of updates and not replying to mails, that's a no no. I know they've been extremely busy lately, but that's not an excuse.
Well actually ZFrontier should be able to have an influence on this. They should be the ones steering the ship and making regular checks on Elemento and not just allowing to do their own thing. Especially when they find a manufacturer and then it becomes evident that the manufacturer can't do the work. At this point if I were ZFrontier I would be managing Elemento on a weekly basis, if not more frequent as they are dragging the ZFrontier brand through the mud.
This is a more or less complex product unlike some keycaps from GMK i.e., where you gather money, give it to them and the rest will be fine. Here you have to work with not one but several manufacturers to get a complete product and if one thing fails the whole product is on hold. I for one account for problems to occur in such a gb, in the end there are lots of humans involved and everyone can make mistakes.
For the communication part i totally agree that this could be better, emails only come after many complaints here which is on the outlines of OK^^... but everytime they fail an expected date they should notify us before we start to "cry". Whom to fault there? Idk, ZFrontier seems like the party who handle the money part to let us feel more secure (assumtions!!! but imagine we wouldn't have ZF and would have given the money directly to Elemento, that would have worried me) and about Elemento i don't know nothing... maybe they have lots of work with other gbs, maybe it's just one human doing this as a hobby besides a 10 hour day job and caring about two kids.
TLDR: keep calm and clack on and to elemeto/zfrontier: more updates please <3
Imho the ZFrontier brand is as good as it was before this gb, after all this is still a GB. Let me cite from "What is a group buy? Should I join one? Group Buy FAQ / Buying Guidelines" (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=77272.0): "And it takes months, sometimes a year+ for group buys to complete. Be prepared to wait."
Well, since it's someone else behind the production they can't influence that too much, however if things go wrong I'm sure they'd either look for other means to get it done or refund the money. (I don't mistrust them in that regard)
As for the lack of updates and not replying to mails, that's a no no. I know they've been extremely busy lately, but that's not an excuse.
Well actually ZFrontier should be able to have an influence on this. They should be the ones steering the ship and making regular checks on Elemento and not just allowing to do their own thing. Especially when they find a manufacturer and then it becomes evident that the manufacturer can't do the work. At this point if I were ZFrontier I would be managing Elemento on a weekly basis, if not more frequent as they are dragging the ZFrontier brand through the mud.
This is a more or less complex product unlike some keycaps from GMK i.e., where you gather money, give it to them and the rest will be fine. Here you have to work with not one but several manufacturers to get a complete product and if one thing fails the whole product is on hold. I for one account for problems to occur in such a gb, in the end there are lots of humans involved and everyone can make mistakes.
For the communication part i totally agree that this could be better, emails only come after many complaints here which is on the outlines of OK^^... but everytime they fail an expected date they should notify us before we start to "cry". Whom to fault there? Idk, ZFrontier seems like the party who handle the money part to let us feel more secure (assumtions!!! but imagine we wouldn't have ZF and would have given the money directly to Elemento, that would have worried me) and about Elemento i don't know nothing... maybe they have lots of work with other gbs, maybe it's just one human doing this as a hobby besides a 10 hour day job and caring about two kids.
TLDR: keep calm and clack on and to elemeto/zfrontier: more updates please <3
I understand that I am joining a groupbuy and there can be long wait times, however I have bought a product which was sold by a reputable source and had feasible timescales. The board should of originally been here in July; with everything going smoothly. This has then been pushed back because of issues to September so that they can get work done. I have had to accept this if I want the product, however for those who don't have buyer protection, they are now in for the full ride. I also feel that 3 months is a long enough period of time for them to get things back under control and a new solution to be sorted. However the updates (Or lack there of) have made me question if that 3 month period has been long enough for them to complete this task. It has also made me question on how much ZFrontier are managing Elemento.
I can understand if they have got long work hours, a family, other commitments, however an update takes 30 minutes to write. It puts us all at ease and allows us to understand where we are at in the process. However we are being blindly lead right now which I am not okay with. I will follow your sentiment of: More updates please <3
Honestly you shouldn't enter group buy's make this one your last. Look at ESPECTRO look at the up's down and everything with it. Most of us no longer have buyer protection either. Its a risk you take when you go into a group buy. There was a possibility it be done in 40 day's that was back in like February/March. The group buy runner even forgot about geekhack and for the longest time was only posting updates to discord. He has done everything he can reasonably be expected to do to get the boards produced thought. I am excited to get mine, I am also nervous but mostly excited.
Then to top it off keep in mind this isn't the only group buy Z-Frontier is running while you think its the most important cause your a part of it. They have most likely dozen others there managing that are the most important group buy to the people in them also. I am sure its a balancing act of trying to get information get out updates. Keep people focused etc etc.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/9iq1q6/stay_away_from_zfrontier_terrible_communication/
https://web.archive.org/web/20180925074145/https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/9iq1q6/stay_away_from_zfrontier_terrible_communication/
BIG UPDATE POST:
https://en.zfrontier.com/blogs/project-updates/project-updates-sept-25-2018
(most infos are at the bottom of the post)
BIG UPDATE POST:
https://en.zfrontier.com/blogs/project-updates/project-updates-sept-25-2018
(most infos are at the bottom of the post)
Every time I send an email there is an update the next day... (I sent an email last night to Alex).
New update guys: https://en.zfrontier.com/blogs/project-updates/project-updates-oct-9-2018
Starting to feel as if I should be taking a cut of the profits on this GB, because of how update to date I have kept this thread!rly? we can all read updates too ;)
Starting to feel as if I should be taking a cut of the profits on this GB, because of how update to date I have kept this thread!rly? we can all read updates too ;)
Is it shipping yet?
Given that it's been another couple weeks since I've seen an update, has anyone heard anything? It sounds like everything is coming together, but it has sounded like that for most updates we've gotten :/
Our latest update form Elemento says that the PCB will wrap up in 2 weeks and we should be able to ship them out by the end of this month.
We apologize for the constant delay on this project and we are pushing the manufacturer and the designing team as hard as we could :(
Emailed zFrontier and got response.
Hey all, I have just pinged an email to Alex at ZFrontier
Hey all, I have just pinged an email to Alex at ZFrontier as its been nearly two month since our last proper update.
In under one month the second lot of buyer protection will run out, so those who still have buyer protection will need to lodge a dispute with Paypal before their 180 days are up.
Emailed zFrontier and got response.Hey all, I have just pinged an email to Alex at ZFrontier
Can I ask what email address you guys have been using? I've sent, I think, eight emails now, over the course of ~11 months, and none of them have gotten a response.
Emailed zFrontier and got response.Hey all, I have just pinged an email to Alex at ZFrontier
Can I ask what email address you guys have been using? I've sent, I think, eight emails now, over the course of ~11 months, and none of them have gotten a response.
There is two emails addresses which I usually send to. Their support one and then Alexs one. I wont give out his information however I am still waiting on a reply. Chinese new year is incoming and very little will be done over that time im sure.
When is Chinese New Year? I didn't think that was until next month.. I been trying to ping Zfrontier for the past 2weeks with nothing. Perhaps its just the new year causing the issue. I know it last like what month month and a half
Oh man, that pcb...And apparently only one pcb manufacturer in whole Asia...
Oh man, that pcb...And apparently only one pcb manufacturer in whole Asia...
I just got my google calendar notification to say that there is 15 days left of my second lot of buyer protection.
This is to update people who managed to get their buyer protection renewed to renew it once again... We are nearly at 360 days since I bought it!
I started the hobby in January, and I just gotta say this was the first GB I joined and the last to deliver.Similar situation here.
Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk
Finally got a reply from ZFrontier and this was their response:I really wish they would communicate things like this more. This would be a far less frustrating group buy if they kept us in the loop, even if there's little we can do about the problems.
"Elemento and us are, super frustrated with the PCB supplier. But we are being pushed back again and again. We are told today that factory is now back from the Chinese New Year holidays and are working on them.
We have been in contact with them every business day ever since last year. They gave us some alleged deadlines and we provided them in the updates but obviously that did not work out. Again, we are sad how this turned out and it's been a physically and mentally draining journey. However, we will carry on. "
However as of yet, they have not replied to my outstanding Paypal dispute which will automatically be awarded to me in 5 days time if they don't respond. I just want to be reissued my order so I can continue having buyer protection!
Still waiting for the PCB to arrive. PCB manufacturer told us they will deliver in March.
For those curious, there is an update on their website: https://en.zfrontier.com/blogs/project-updates/project-updates-mar-2-2019 (https://en.zfrontier.com/blogs/project-updates/project-updates-mar-2-2019)
TL;DR below:QuoteStill waiting for the PCB to arrive. PCB manufacturer told us they will deliver in March.
QuoteStill waiting for the PCB to arrive. PCB manufacturer told us they will deliver in March.
Still waiting for the PCB to arrive. PCB production was heavily delayed by the factory due to low quantity to make way for larger orders.
Sorting shall begin next week, PCB should arrive late Oct. For detailed updates, check the last project update post.
MoreKeyboard housing and accessories:
Metal parts: All milled and finished anodizing in late Aug to early Sept. After inspecting, Some gray parts were around 1-2 pantone code darker, got them back for re-anodizing to match the original gray advertised.
Plastic parts: All milled and done in late Aug, early Sept. Battery chamber, done, CNCed ABS, sprayed black, perfectly textured. Plastic Washer, done, sits between the on/off metal switch and the battery chamber. However, after pre-assembling we discovered that the tolerance was a bit off, rendering the switch wobble more than we could accept. Hence, these two are now being machined again..
Wood Piece: Done.
Package: Done this week.
PCB:
PCB is the most frustrating part. It has not been a pleasant journey working with the current PCB vendor. They promised to deliver in late June and early July. But there are always some minor issues from the post production units that didn't meet our standard.
Revision 1 was the one in the early prototype: in-switch RGB, RGB Strip, USB Type-C, BT, fixed layout. R2 changed the PCB to mother and daughter board to incorporate better with the internal design, changed the side RGB strip configuration, and added multiple layout support. R3 added charging circuit and DIP. Revision 4 fixed some issues detected when testing and has recently been approved. Phase 1 to Phase 2 was a drastic change: tray mount to top mount, 1 PCB to 1 mother and 3 daughter boards (2 high-density SMD LED strip, 1 Type-C port), fixed layout to flexible layout while incorporating in switch SMD. Slowly adding more features to the PCB thus generated many unwanted issue.
BT 3.0 + BLE connection, 4-5m connection (full metal housing, full plate). Delay, not an issue (surely there will be delay, but not noticeable when work and casual gaming) (noticeable delay might occur when you pair many BT devices to a single machine). Could easily switch between (Windows, MAC, iOS) machines via Fn + function short cuts.
That being said, we bear full responsibility for the lack of communication and overall unsatisfactory group buy experience:
Problems we had during this group buy with the designer and factories:
- Miscommunication. Three parties are involved: Elemento, PCB vendor, and zFrontier. Communication were often times unilateral. Demands and feedback weren't clearly delivered.
- Lack of supervision over the production process. Happens when working with larger factories: smaller projects were postponed and bigger projects were prioritized when project managers were not in the place of constantly overseeing the production phase.
- Not taking immediate action when the factory failed to deliver. We put our trust into the said PCB vendor, but they were not able to deliver on time and created more issues. They are competent, in fact. But their attitude towards the project wasn't quite in the right place. We didn't take immediate action to push them or switch vendor, believing they could still make it right. Fact is, yes, they did, but too much time were wasted.
We sincerely apologize for our poor service for this project.
Elemento and zFrontier are pushing the factories to deliver every single day. We do not want to deliver a product that is sub-par to our standard. And thus many parts where rejected and ordered for a re-make.
Again, I am sincerely sorry and feel immense regret for the lack of communication.
What to expect:
•Fr87 by Elemento
Shipping ETA: October
•Regular update on every project
Best Regards,
Alex
- Not taking immediate action when the factory failed to deliver. We put our trust into the said PCB vendor, but they were not able to deliver on time and created more issues. They are competent, in fact. But their attitude towards the project wasn't quite in the right place. We didn't take immediate action to push them or switch vendor, believing they could still make it right. Fact is, yes, they did, but too much time were wasted.
QuoteStill waiting for the PCB to arrive. PCB manufacturer told us they will deliver in March.
And from back in January, it was:QuoteStill waiting for the PCB to arrive. PCB production was heavily delayed by the factory due to low quantity to make way for larger orders.
And early October, it was:QuoteSorting shall begin next week, PCB should arrive late Oct. For detailed updates, check the last project update post.
The September project update before that:QuoteMoreKeyboard housing and accessories:
Metal parts: All milled and finished anodizing in late Aug to early Sept. After inspecting, Some gray parts were around 1-2 pantone code darker, got them back for re-anodizing to match the original gray advertised.
Plastic parts: All milled and done in late Aug, early Sept. Battery chamber, done, CNCed ABS, sprayed black, perfectly textured. Plastic Washer, done, sits between the on/off metal switch and the battery chamber. However, after pre-assembling we discovered that the tolerance was a bit off, rendering the switch wobble more than we could accept. Hence, these two are now being machined again..
Wood Piece: Done.
Package: Done this week.
PCB:
PCB is the most frustrating part. It has not been a pleasant journey working with the current PCB vendor. They promised to deliver in late June and early July. But there are always some minor issues from the post production units that didn't meet our standard.
Revision 1 was the one in the early prototype: in-switch RGB, RGB Strip, USB Type-C, BT, fixed layout. R2 changed the PCB to mother and daughter board to incorporate better with the internal design, changed the side RGB strip configuration, and added multiple layout support. R3 added charging circuit and DIP. Revision 4 fixed some issues detected when testing and has recently been approved. Phase 1 to Phase 2 was a drastic change: tray mount to top mount, 1 PCB to 1 mother and 3 daughter boards (2 high-density SMD LED strip, 1 Type-C port), fixed layout to flexible layout while incorporating in switch SMD. Slowly adding more features to the PCB thus generated many unwanted issue.
BT 3.0 + BLE connection, 4-5m connection (full metal housing, full plate). Delay, not an issue (surely there will be delay, but not noticeable when work and casual gaming) (noticeable delay might occur when you pair many BT devices to a single machine). Could easily switch between (Windows, MAC, iOS) machines via Fn + function short cuts.
That being said, we bear full responsibility for the lack of communication and overall unsatisfactory group buy experience:
Problems we had during this group buy with the designer and factories:
- Miscommunication. Three parties are involved: Elemento, PCB vendor, and zFrontier. Communication were often times unilateral. Demands and feedback weren't clearly delivered.
- Lack of supervision over the production process. Happens when working with larger factories: smaller projects were postponed and bigger projects were prioritized when project managers were not in the place of constantly overseeing the production phase.
- Not taking immediate action when the factory failed to deliver. We put our trust into the said PCB vendor, but they were not able to deliver on time and created more issues. They are competent, in fact. But their attitude towards the project wasn't quite in the right place. We didn't take immediate action to push them or switch vendor, believing they could still make it right. Fact is, yes, they did, but too much time were wasted.
We sincerely apologize for our poor service for this project.
Elemento and zFrontier are pushing the factories to deliver every single day. We do not want to deliver a product that is sub-par to our standard. And thus many parts where rejected and ordered for a re-make.
Again, I am sincerely sorry and feel immense regret for the lack of communication.
What to expect:
•Fr87 by Elemento
Shipping ETA: October
•Regular update on every project
Best Regards,
Alex
What I'd like to know is where the accountability is. Specifically with this:Quote- Not taking immediate action when the factory failed to deliver. We put our trust into the said PCB vendor, but they were not able to deliver on time and created more issues. They are competent, in fact. But their attitude towards the project wasn't quite in the right place. We didn't take immediate action to push them or switch vendor, believing they could still make it right. Fact is, yes, they did, but too much time were wasted.
If this happened back in September, why is it 5-6 months later now and we're still having issues with the project not being given the priority it needs? Are there ever going to be any repercussions for this, as far as the PCB manufacturer is concerned? And where has Elemento been this whole time - like we noticed long ago, aside from the one pop-in they had here, they've been a silent partner, despite apparently designing the whole board?
I'd like to see ZF come to this thread and interact again - even if they don't have any news, seeing them interacting would be helpful. But what I'd really like to see, is all the cards laid on the table. If the PCB people are to blame, throw them under the bus. Don't take the hit for them. Let everyone see some transparency here, cause a lot of resentment seems to be building up.
I love the case and how it's flat! Finally! Only thing is i don't have a paypal account and the group buy is going to expire tomorrow :(
I love the case and how it's flat! Finally! Only thing is i don't have a paypal account and the group buy is going to expire tomorrow :(
Tomorrow of last year...
I love the case and how it's flat! Finally! Only thing is i don't have a paypal account and the group buy is going to expire tomorrow :(
Tomorrow of last year...
I love the case and how it's flat! Finally! Only thing is i don't have a paypal account and the group buy is going to expire tomorrow :(
Tomorrow of last year...
... butat the rate things are going you might be lucky enough to receive it yesterday next year.
The cases are all made, it's not like they are just going to disappear.. you guys had PayPal protection, an invincible suit of armor. You can be mad, I'm mad, but you can only wait patiently or get fed up and refund. Easy options
Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk
The cases are all made, it's not like they are just going to disappear.. you guys had PayPal protection, an invincible suit of armor. You can be mad, I'm mad, but you can only wait patiently or get fed up and refund. Easy options
Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk
Just a warning paypal protection is there as a marketing gimmick. The fine print basically says they can deny for any reason. That its not something they have to pay out on if it hurts them as a company. Also it only last 6 months. Does anyone even have proof the cases are complete? I mean Elemento sounded shady to start with. Thats why passed on the group buy. I am glad I did, but yea relying on paypal is just a let down. I have had to use them twice once they were super helpful got my refund. The other time I was SOL and denied.
The pokemon kid kept in fairly good contact with them, but it sounds like he lost his patience and invoked his buyer protection (which I don't blame him for)
I reached out to the support team and they said that the manufacturer still hasn't made the PCB
The pokemon kid kept in fairly good contact with them, but it sounds like he lost his patience and invoked his buyer protection (which I don't blame him for)I reached out to the support team and they said that the manufacturer still hasn't made the PCB
I would be happy to take the torch on getting updates from them. But I can't get them to respond to me. How are you getting in contact with them?
I sent an email to support@zfrontier.com and got a response in less than 24 hours. It sounds like other people are not having the same luck though, so YMMV
The cases are all made, it's not like they are just going to disappear.. you guys had PayPal protection, an invincible suit of armor. You can be mad, I'm mad, but you can only wait patiently or get fed up and refund. Easy options
Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk
I sent an email to support@zfrontier.com and got a response in less than 24 hours. It sounds like other people are not having the same luck though, so YMMV
Gotcha, thanks! Yeah, I've emailed them a couple times at that address.
I reached out to the support team and they said that the manufacturer still hasn't made the PCB
This is getting a little silly now. They have been working on those PCB's since the middle of last year. Something fishy is going on... I suspect that that the design on the PCB's isn't working and they haven't got it fixed yet.
I have been emailing Alex each time. He sent out an update on that email a while ago.
However I do email both at the same time.
I am going to be brutally honest. I feel super scammed. I feel lied to. I will never buy from this vendor again.
Entire projects much more complex than this have finished in a fraction of the time. If they can’t get this PCB manufacturer working, they need to drop the manufacturer, eat the loss, and apologize for the delay. It is not this hard to create and design a PCB and all we have been getting for the past year+ have been trite excuse after excuse with no accountability or transparency.
The communication and handling of this GB has been atrocious. I don’t care how many projects ZFrontier has taken on, or how it’s difficult for them to handle so much on their plate. That’s a problem of their own creation. Is it really so hard to provide even a basic (read: existent) level of accountability, responsibility, and communication?
It has been months since I have received any email or update about this project. The website is updated once every few months with a random PCB-related excuse. Come on, guys. Get it together.
It’s not the first time the community has pointed this out to them. It’s not the first time they’ve apologized. Apologies are completely and utterly meaningless if you don’t actually do anything about them.
Entire projects much more complex than this have finished in a fraction of the time. If they can’t get this PCB manufacturer working, they need to drop the manufacturer, eat the loss, and apologize for the delay. It is not this hard to create and design a PCB and all we have been getting for the past year+ have been trite excuse after excuse with no accountability or transparency.
The communication and handling of this GB has been atrocious. I don’t care how many projects ZFrontier has taken on, or how it’s difficult for them to handle so much on their plate. That’s a problem of their own creation. Is it really so hard to provide even a basic (read: existent) level of accountability, responsibility, and communication?
It has been months since I have received any email or update about this project. The website is updated once every few months with a random PCB-related excuse. Come on, guys. Get it together.
It’s not the first time the community has pointed this out to them. It’s not the first time they’ve apologized. Apologies are completely and utterly meaningless if you don’t actually do anything about them.
At this point ask for a refund from zfrontier for this board is probably the best advice.
At this point ask for a refund from zfrontier for this board is probably the best advice.
Unfortunately I have asked them before with no response. My emails have gone entirely ignored.
At this point ask for a refund from zfrontier for this board is probably the best advice.Unfortunately I have asked them before with no response. My emails have gone entirely ignored.
In my case, I haven't even wanted to take that step yet. I've simply asked for them to extend my buyer protection... With no response. You'd think they'd at least want to 'hang on' to a customer that way, seeing as it's someone still displaying some faith in them.
I think Zfrontier is legit (just a bit disorganized in their international department), so they will refund you at least. Have you reached out to Alex (check spam email box too)?
Guys!! Check your emails! Pcb’s are in!!
Guys!! Check your emails! Pcb’s are in!!Excite! Glad they included the pictures too, the PCBs look fantastic!
If this actually ships I might be interested in taking someone’s spot. Preferably silver.Buy the board, not the spot homie. This is literally the worst GB you could possibly buy a spot in heh.
Yeah whoops that’s what I meant.If this actually ships I might be interested in taking someone’s spot. Preferably silver.Buy the board, not the spot homie. This is literally the worst GB you could possibly buy a spot in heh.
According to their most recent project updates page, this should be shipping internationally within two weeks. It looks like we may get these after all!
Fr87 by Elemento
Chinese orders fulfilled. International order shipping will begin within 2 weeks.
Saw some shipped ones in China Groups!
According to their most recent project updates page, this should be shipping internationally within two weeks. It looks like we may get these after all!
I'd really like to see pictures if anyone has received them (so that I can feel more relaxed about the lack of shipping notice for myself). I don't even care if they are fully built, just seeing the case would be enough
Of course they remembered the Walnut weight I added, but forgot the Brass Weight on my original order. Contacted them just now. Will let you guys know in a year or so when I hear back.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/LoV9lEq.jpg)
Of course they remembered the Walnut weight I added, but forgot the Brass Weight on my original order. Contacted them just now. Will let you guys know in a year or so when I hear back.Thank you for posting it! It does look nice, and I'm hoping the quality holds up tooShow Image(https://i.imgur.com/LoV9lEq.jpg)
Finally... :'(Looks like they never got around to putting the LEDs on the south side like they said they would.
Finally... :'(Looks like they never got around to putting the LEDs on the south side like they said they would.
Anyone built it with 84 or 86 layout?I'd like to know the answer to this as well. Does the board come with instructions on how to get the app to remap keys and change the LED's?
I was building and just stopped before soldering cuz I want to use 86 layout and don’t know how to remap the keys. As zFrontier mentioned, no qmk but a window-based app for mapping and led setting. Can’t find it anywhere.. If someone knows, plz help me.
Emailed Alex and he already read but no response yet.
Anyone built it with 84 or 86 layout?I'd like to know the answer to this as well. Does the board come with instructions on how to get the app to remap keys and change the LED's?
I was building and just stopped before soldering cuz I want to use 86 layout and don’t know how to remap the keys. As zFrontier mentioned, no qmk but a window-based app for mapping and led setting. Can’t find it anywhere.. If someone knows, plz help me.
Emailed Alex and he already read but no response yet.
Finally... :'(Looks like they never got around to putting the LEDs on the south side like they said they would.
They look south to me. If not you can Pick up some of the washers from novelkeys. Perfect solution if you need to use cherry profile caps on upside down switches.
The LEDs are south-facing.
I gave up to build it with 86-key layout.. Alex, zFron support, Elemento all ignored my emails.
Assuming there is no app for mapping, I made it 87 keys.. ;(
I found that I can’t turn on the LEDs on bluetooth mode not like zfrontier said.
The design of this board is pretty much satisfying but except that, very disappointing in many aspects.
Finally... :'(Looks like they never got around to putting the LEDs on the south side like they said they would.
They look south to me. If not you can Pick up some of the washers from novelkeys. Perfect solution if you need to use cherry profile caps on upside down switches.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/t14arlB.jpg)Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/tR1IT3G.jpg)
The LEDs are south-facing.
I gave up to build it with 86-key layout.. Alex, zFron support, Elemento all ignored my emails.
Assuming there is no app for mapping, I made it 87 keys.. ;(
I found that I can’t turn on the LEDs on bluetooth mode not like zfrontier said.
The design of this board is pretty much satisfying but except that, very disappointing in many aspects.
I was rushing. I just noticed that I sent it to the same named wrong company. My bad. Anyway, I don’t know why zFrontier keeps ignoring us. It’s frustrating. I confirmed that he read my email on that day, but no response yet.The LEDs are south-facing.
I gave up to build it with 86-key layout.. Alex, zFron support, Elemento all ignored my emails.
Assuming there is no app for mapping, I made it 87 keys.. ;(
I found that I can’t turn on the LEDs on bluetooth mode not like zfrontier said.
The design of this board is pretty much satisfying but except that, very disappointing in many aspects.
Disappointed to hear this :( Would you mind sharing what contact info you have on Elemento? I've been unable to track anything down, though I haven't looked since early on in the buy.
I was rushing. I just noticed that I sent it to the same named wrong company. My bad. Anyway, I don’t know why zFrontier keeps ignoring us. It’s frustrating. I confirmed that he read my email on that day, but no response yet.
I was rushing. I just noticed that I sent it to the same named wrong company. My bad. Anyway, I don’t know why zFrontier keeps ignoring us. It’s frustrating. I confirmed that he read my email on that day, but no response yet.
Darn. How do you know it was read? That's honestly even more upsetting to me. It's not that they don't have time to read emails, it's that they're purposefully choosing not to acknowledge them.
I was rushing. I just noticed that I sent it to the same named wrong company. My bad. Anyway, I don’t know why zFrontier keeps ignoring us. It’s frustrating. I confirmed that he read my email on that day, but no response yet.
Darn. How do you know it was read? That's honestly even more upsetting to me. It's not that they don't have time to read emails, it's that they're purposefully choosing not to acknowledge them.
Honestly, with non-Asian orders, zFrontier probably has the worst correspondence of any vendor I've ever dealt with. It's pretty much enough to make me never purchase anything from them ever again. I've heard only good things for people in Asia though so I guess we know where their priorities lie.
Honestly, with non-Asian orders, zFrontier probably has the worst correspondence of any vendor I've ever dealt with. It's pretty much enough to make me never purchase anything from them ever again. I've heard only good things for people in Asia though so I guess we know where their priorities lie.
My email account has that function. See the attachment below :(
I dont want to purchase anymore either even I live in Korea next to China. People in my community also blame them.
Nice video! Does that last lighting mode show different lighting under keys that change functionality when the menu/layer key is pressed? That's really cool (and would be even cooler if the layer keys were programmable)
uploaded a fr87 build video.
still no answers from zfron. :(
Beautiful board, but the fact that I cannot remap the switches makes this a $400 paperweight.
When we originally bought the board, if I understand correctly, the intention was that even though the board may not use QMK, we'd be able to remap stuff.
Still no response about my missing brass weight. Anyone had luck contacting zfrontier?
Got a response last night thankfully. I'd been using contact@zfrontier with their website support button. Thanks for the info on the other email.Still no response about my missing brass weight. Anyone had luck contacting zfrontier?
I hear back when I reach out using the support@zfrontier.com email within 1-2 days, but that's only been for status updates on the GB as a whole.
Here is my FR87 Built up! Glad that it is finally built! The board feels way better once built!That's a great looking build! PLEASE let us know if you hear anything about software. If this board was programmable I'd almost forgive the delays... almost...Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/EkOHtFp.jpg)
Much like WildCat, I have had the same PCB issue where the number 8 switch grounds on the case. A bit of tape over the switch pins sorted this right out however this is a rather large oversight from ZFrontier/ Elemento, but hey what else was to be expected?
I have also dinged Alex to see if there is any software for the board incoming, however nothing back yet. I would quite like to use the lock switches I bought, but also I would like a GUI button on the right side of the bottom row...
Have these shipped to US customers yet? I haven't gotten a shipping invoice yet and need to know if I need to start reaching out to ZF about my order.
This should work with the fr87, right guys?
https://mkultra.click/collections/tkl/products/a87-plate-foam
My only assumption is the left shift which is slightly off alignment...
Has anyone used this board over Bluetooth?
My only assumption is the left shift which is slightly off alignment...
Has anyone used this board over Bluetooth?
I've honestly been hesitant to build it, given that they are working on a replacement. I haven't tested the PCB yet, but I could try pulling it out and testing it without soldering switches onto it