Kailh BOX Navy switches

[Zobeid Zuma]

I had these pre-ordered and waited patiently.  I was a fan of the BOX Pale Blue switches already, so I figured Navy would be like those only moreso!

Got them and built on a Phantom PCB.  This was only my second build, and working with the Phantom was quite a bit more involved than the previous.  My only serious hang up was when I realized that the Phantom would not fit into the Lambo TKL aluminum case that I wanted to use.  The Phantom is compatible with Filco cases, and the Lambo is compatible with Filco boards, but they don't fit each other!  It may be possible with enough modding, but I'll reserve that for future consideration.  For now the Phantom is residing in a standard Filco plastic case.  It's ugly but works Just Fine.  I got a set of Maxkeys Portland SA on it for that retro style.

So…  The Navy switches?  As advertised, they are stiff and clicky and loud.  They remind me of an IBM Model M.  That's not to say they're the same, or that anybody would mistake one for the other, but the heavy feeling and very tactile click is reminiscent to me of the M in much the same way that the Pale Blues reminded me of the Model F.  The Pale Blues were love at first tap, while the Navy switches took me a little bit of getting used to.  They've grown on me pretty quickly, though.  Not sure which I'll use for my clicky builds in the future.

[Kavik]

Ever since I heard about the Navy Blues, I've wanted them. I'm a big fan of heavy, clicky switches (especially the Model M). I think I'd like them because I have a keyboard with the kailh low profile blue switches, but they are just a little to light for me (and the click is good but could be better). Unfortunately, they were sold out by the time I became aware of them.

[Techno Trousers]

Thanks for the review. I like the model F feel best, and I already got a recommendation for the box heavy pale blue, so I have some on order. As much as I like the thought of the extreme tactility of the box navy, I think they'd be too heavy for me.

[rich1051414]

I may get flack for this, but I think box navy switches actually sound better than a model m. Mostly because of the consistent sound and loudness. It sounds so refined, that when you compare it afterwards to the model m, the model m sounds sloppy and inconsistent.

[Kavik]

I may get flack for this, but I think box navy switches actually sound better than a model m. Mostly because of the consistent sound and loudness. It sounds so refined, that when you compare it afterwards to the model m, the model m sounds sloppy and inconsistent.

I don't doubt that. Model Ms vary quite a bit in consistency from specimen to specimen since the feel of the switches depends on the condition of the whole keyboard (tightness of the barrels and plate). I have/have had several, and I definitely favor ones over others.

[Rychubil]

I already purchased Navys for my JD40 and Planck. 
Previous my plan was Cherry MX green but after I discovered Navy switches I change mind.

[Kavik]

I already purchased Navys for my JD40 and Planck. 
Previous my plan was Cherry MX green but after I discovered Navy switches I change mind.

Ha, I was actually planning on putting Gateron Greens in The Moon when it comes, but now I'm thinking of putting these in instead. I did order two plates and PCBs though, so I guess I could do both.

[Rychubil]

I already purchased Navys for my JD40 and Planck. 
Previous my plan was Cherry MX green but after I discovered Navy switches I change mind.

Ha, I was actually planning on putting Gateron Greens in The Moon when it comes, but now I'm thinking of putting these in instead. I did order two plates and PCBs though, so I guess I could do both.

Cool    I think we won't regret 
My Pok3r and Core are on Cherry MX clear for evening and night typing but personally for me, while the day, keyboard should be noisy 

[buckyballs]

I had these pre-ordered and waited patiently.  I was a fan of the BOX Pale Blue switches already, so I figured Navy would be like those only moreso!

Got them and built on a Phantom PCB.  This was only my second build, and working with the Phantom was quite a bit more involved than the previous.  My only serious hang up was when I realized that the Phantom would not fit into the Lambo TKL aluminum case that I wanted to use.  The Phantom is compatible with Filco cases, and the Lambo is compatible with Filco boards, but they don't fit each other!  It may be possible with enough modding, but I'll reserve that for future consideration.  For now the Phantom is residing in a standard Filco plastic case.  It's ugly but works Just Fine.  I got a set of Maxkeys Portland SA on it for that retro style.

So…  The Navy switches?  As advertised, they are stiff and clicky and loud.  They remind me of an IBM Model M.  That's not to say they're the same, or that anybody would mistake one for the other, but the heavy feeling and very tactile click is reminiscent to me of the M in much the same way that the Pale Blues reminded me of the Model F.  The Pale Blues were love at first tap, while the Navy switches took me a little bit of getting used to.  They've grown on me pretty quickly, though.  Not sure which I'll use for my clicky builds in the future.

Can I ask you, what is their weight compared to Cherry Green MX? I know their mechanism is very different from the Model M, but if you have something that is even halfway like buckling spring and doesn't feel 'wrong' like Cherry Greens and Whites, it already sounds super good.

[buckyballs]

I don't doubt that. Model Ms vary quite a bit in consistency from specimen to specimen since the feel of the switches depends on the condition of the whole keyboard (tightness of the barrels and plate). I have/have had several, and I definitely favor ones over others.

I think this is not because the springs are inconsistent fresh from the factory. but because so many Model Ms were built at different places and have experienced different usage conditions over the years. It's like some Cherry MX blues that have no click because they've been used for 30 years.

[buckyballs]

I had these pre-ordered and waited patiently.  I was a fan of the BOX Pale Blue switches already, so I figured Navy would be like those only moreso!

Got them and built on a Phantom PCB.  This was only my second build, and working with the Phantom was quite a bit more involved than the previous.  My only serious hang up was when I realized that the Phantom would not fit into the Lambo TKLuickly, though.  Not sure which I'll use for my clicky builds in the future.

Can I ask you, are they REALLY FULLY COMPATIBLE with all the Cherry MX keyboards, PCB, Keycaps we are used to? The box structure looks as though it would be incompatible with at least a few keycaps?

[Rychubil]

buckyballs - Navy's are bit heavier and much more clicky than Cherry greens, especially on backway. BOXs are fully compatible with all Cherry and Gateron keyboards, PCB plates and keycaps. One problem for a moment - no replacement springs for BOX, that reason I upgraded Cherry greens to 150g springs.
Any way BOXy are much more cool than Cherrys

[Techno Trousers]

I upgraded Cherry greens to 150g springs.

Wat.

[rich1051414]

buckyballs - Navy's are bit heavier and much more clicky than Cherry greens, especially on backway. BOXs are fully compatible with all Cherry and Gateron keyboards, PCB plates and keycaps. One problem for a moment - no replacement springs for BOX, that reason I upgraded Cherry greens to 150g springs.
Any way BOXy are much more cool than Cherrys

Yep, compared to my cherry green board, my jade keyboard seems very similar in perceived weight. I would assume that would put navy's in the 'heavier than greens' category. I have a feeling the greater tactility contributes to the 'heavier feel', even if the spring weight seems to conflict that assessment.

[buckyballs]

buckyballs - Navy's are bit heavier and much more clicky than Cherry greens, especially on backway. BOXs are fully compatible with all Cherry and Gateron keyboards, PCB plates and keycaps. One problem for a moment - no replacement springs for BOX, that reason I upgraded Cherry greens to 150g springs.
Any way BOXy are much more cool than Cherrys

But no one is worried that kailh made these? Thought kailh had a really aweful rep some time back.

[mustcode]

buckyballs - Navy's are bit heavier and much more clicky than Cherry greens, especially on backway. BOXs are fully compatible with all Cherry and Gateron keyboards, PCB plates and keycaps. One problem for a moment - no replacement springs for BOX, that reason I upgraded Cherry greens to 150g springs.
Any way BOXy are much more cool than Cherrys

But no one is worried that kailh made these? Thought kailh had a really aweful rep some time back.

That was before, now it's the other way around, Kaihua has been doing a lot of great stuff and Cherry is actually the one has been dropping the ball lately.

[Zobeid Zuma]

Can I ask you, are they REALLY FULLY COMPATIBLE with all the Cherry MX keyboards, PCB, Keycaps we are used to? The box structure looks as though it would be incompatible with at least a few keycaps?

I have never found any keycaps that they conflict with.  However…  Backlight LEDs are another matter.  Your LEDs have to go inside the switch, which means they have to be installed and soldered in place before the switches, and the typical round LEDs don't fit.  I've used 2x3x4mm LEDs with mine.  You have to be careful that the LEDs are positioned all the way down snug against the PCB, or else they can interfere with the click bar inside the switch.

[Rychubil]

buckyballs - Navy's are bit heavier and much more clicky than Cherry greens, especially on backway. BOXs are fully compatible with all Cherry and Gateron keyboards, PCB plates and keycaps. One problem for a moment - no replacement springs for BOX, that reason I upgraded Cherry greens to 150g springs.
Any way BOXy are much more cool than Cherrys

But no one is worried that kailh made these? Thought kailh had a really aweful rep some time back.

That was before, now it's the other way around, Kaihua has been doing a lot of great stuff and Cherry is actually the one has been dropping the ball lately.

Absolutely agree with above

[buckyballs]

But no one is worried that kailh made these? Thought kailh had a really aweful rep some time back.

That was before, now it's the other way around, Kaihua has been doing a lot of great stuff and Cherry is actually the one has been dropping the ball lately.
[/quote]
Absolutely agree with above
[/quote]

Cherry dropping the ball? Has their quality dropped?

[Rychubil]

But no one is worried that kailh made these? Thought kailh had a really aweful rep some time back.

That was before, now it's the other way around, Kaihua has been doing a lot of great stuff and Cherry is actually the one has been dropping the ball lately.

Absolutely agree with above
[/quote]

Cherry dropping the ball? Has their quality dropped?
[/quote]
Maybe quality of Cherry MX didn't drop but Gaterons and BOXes of Kailh now are better made.
Example? Zealio of Gateron vs Cherry MX brown:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=74836.0

[Kavik]

But no one is worried that kailh made these? Thought kailh had a really aweful rep some time back.

That was before, now it's the other way around, Kaihua has been doing a lot of great stuff and Cherry is actually the one has been dropping the ball lately.

Absolutely agree with above
[/quote]

Cherry dropping the ball? Has their quality dropped?
[/quote]

Well, they sold 98,000 MX silent blacks with red springs in them and then claimed that the springs were "within acceptable tolerances" when sent back for testing. Not sure if Cherry's reliability has dropped though.

[rich1051414]

Welp, it's official. I like my Kailh Jade keyboard more than my white alps keyboards now. Less stem wobble, no bindy feeling when pushed off axis, more consistent feel and tactility, just as satisfying(with how the bottom falls out after actuation). The second click on the upstroke also starts growing on you.

An interesting thing I have noticed is, kailh switches seem to be less loud after mounting while regular cherry switches seem to be more loud. I have a cherry green switch right next to a jade switch(I was 1 switch short on my board), and the green switch is louder, ONLY after mounting and putting on the keycap. Interesting. Now I wonder if traditional cherry switches could have their click deadened by using a rubberized keycap mount...

[p_blaze]

Welp, it's official. I like my Kailh Jade keyboard more than my white alps keyboards now. Less stem wobble, no bindy feeling when pushed off axis, more consistent feel and tactility, just as satisfying(with how the bottom falls out after actuation). The second click on the upstroke also starts growing on you.

An interesting thing I have noticed is, kailh switches seem to be less loud after mounting while regular cherry switches seem to be more loud. I have a cherry green switch right next to a jade switch(I was 1 switch short on my board), and the green switch is louder, ONLY after mounting and putting on the keycap. Interesting. Now I wonder if traditional cherry switches could have their click deadened by using a rubberized keycap mount...

have you tried retooled Matias switches? I heard they have much less stem wobble, but I don't know how it compares to actual ALPS
I want to try and ALPS build but I can't figure out whether Matias or white ALPS is better

[onslash]

I don't doubt that. Model Ms vary quite a bit in consistency from specimen to specimen since the feel of the switches depends on the condition of the whole keyboard (tightness of the barrels and plate). I have/have had several, and I definitely favor ones over others.

I think this is not because the springs are inconsistent fresh from the factory. but because so many Model Ms were built at different places and have experienced different usage conditions over the years. It's like some Cherry MX blues that have no click because they've been used for 30 years.

when i upgraded i put my razer blackwidow up for borrowing to friends, after several months the mx blues became mx browns lmao ... clickless