Alps Appreciation Thread

[Mattr567]

What about we use the amber alps for modifier and blue alps for alpha?

This is not a bad idea actually.

Haha, thanks man! I thought I saw another Hebrew set, but it ended up being this exact same board, haha.

I've seen 2 Hebrew Alps sets, one being your set, in multiple places ). I regularly search ebay with location set to Israel for 'keyboard' and מקלדת. Mechanical boards are very scarce, in a live auction I've only seen Model Ms. However, there are quite a few Quantum branded rubber domes from that time period.

I'm not sure if not many were made or if they just don't make it onto the interwebs. If anyone has anymore pics or info, please share.

Haha, I know! I am spreading the love for my FAME quite a bit, and then of course, there is the board that they came from, an APC Th-5539, which is a relative of the FAME itself. The board was ridiculously flimsy, but the caps were ace.

Hebrew does seem really hard to find OG, so that's why I'm staying off the FAME and just keeping it as a mantle piece. If I could find a way to display it, I would!

I have seen Hebrew Alps caps one other time on an F XT or F AT layout 83-84 key keyboard.

A great idea actually. SKCM Amber to me is a SKCM Blue with higher tactility. Otherwise they are just as smooooth as SKCM Blues.

Trust me, the FAME is adored  SKCM Blue with a metal backplate is a great combo imo. Still cant belive that Datatech keyboard sold for $350 although

[jacobolus]

What about we use the amber alps for modifier and blue alps for alpha?

This is not a bad idea actually.

A great idea actually.

I don’t get it. For the most part the modifier keys are pressed by weaker fingers. There’s IMO no reason to use extra stiff switches for them.

Maybe use a stiffer switch for a particularly long spacebar, or “big-ass” return key? Otherwise, putting stiff switches on shift, return, tab, etc. seems totally backwards.

[Blaise170]

I am considering contacting Tai Hao about making secondary legends on their Alps keycaps (Chinese, Cyrillic, Hebrew, etc). Is this something that people would be interested in? Tai Hao already has the molds so it would be much cheaper than going with a company like SP.

[Pdub]

I don’t think regular ABS can handle the dye-sublimation printing process, its melting temperature is too low. If you try to heat ABS to 400 °F or whatever, you’ll end up with a little plastic puddle.

Those dyesub Acer caps might not be PBT, but if not I’m not sure what plastic mix they are. Maybe something unique.

Correct! And I am not sure what plastic they are either.

[n__dles]

I am considering contacting Tai Hao about making secondary legends on their Alps keycaps (Chinese, Cyrillic, Hebrew, etc). Is this something that people would be interested in? Tai Hao already has the molds so it would be much cheaper than going with a company like SP.

Didn't Tai-Hao require that all caps be the same language to reach MOQ? I'd support this regardless, but I'd prefer another manufacturer.

Approximately how much would double shot latin legend and pad printed second legend be at SP be?

[Blaise170]

I am considering contacting Tai Hao about making secondary legends on their Alps keycaps (Chinese, Cyrillic, Hebrew, etc). Is this something that people would be interested in? Tai Hao already has the molds so it would be much cheaper than going with a company like SP.

Didn't Tai-Hao require that all caps be the same language to reach MOQ? I'd support this regardless, but I'd prefer another manufacturer.

Approximately how much would double shot latin legend and pad printed second legend be at SP be?

When badwrench got the first Alps set to SP, the full set for latin legends and blue mods was around $150, so DO would likely be even more than that for secondaries.

[bocahgundul]

I am considering contacting Tai Hao about making secondary legends on their Alps keycaps (Chinese, Cyrillic, Hebrew, etc). Is this something that people would be interested in? Tai Hao already has the molds so it would be much cheaper than going with a company like SP.

Didn't Tai-Hao require that all caps be the same language to reach MOQ? I'd support this regardless, but I'd prefer another manufacturer.

Approximately how much would double shot latin legend and pad printed second legend be at SP be?

When badwrench got the first Alps set to SP, the full set for latin legends and blue mods was around $150, so DO would likely be even more than that for secondaries.

I just wish that SP DCS caps would be thicker cause SP DCS feels like a cheap smaller profile tai hoa keycaps

[CPTBadAss]

I am considering contacting Tai Hao about making secondary legends on their Alps keycaps (Chinese, Cyrillic, Hebrew, etc). Is this something that people would be interested in? Tai Hao already has the molds so it would be much cheaper than going with a company like SP.

Very very interested in Chinese layout caps.

[bocahgundul]

I want to appreciate alps because my Orange alps just came from the mail and damn even tho it doesn't have caps or board it feels really good just like topre but the tactile is better with this
Wish I know alps before so I can join for the alps pcb GB

Still waiting for my blue alps tho 

[itzmeluigi]

I am considering contacting Tai Hao about making secondary legends on their Alps keycaps (Chinese, Cyrillic, Hebrew, etc). Is this something that people would be interested in? Tai Hao already has the molds so it would be much cheaper than going with a company like SP.

I contacted them a few weeks ago, the MOQ is 500 at $15 per set. Additional languages would each need there own MOQ.

[n__dles]

To soon after Alpine Winter to try another SP GB?

[pr0ximity]

Anyone familiar with the stabilizers on Zeniths? This board is really feeling great to type on, but the spacebar stabilizer inserts look to be made of a different material than the other stabilized keys. It has a really jarring, high-pitched, super unpleasant sound when they make contact with the plate. The other stabilized keys make a nice "thock" that sounds like all of the unstabilized keys, but the spacebar sounds like it's just plain mounted wrong or something. I think it's actually the inserts that are the problem? I've double and triple checked the way the stab and inserts sit and the key is definitely mounted and setup correctly, unless there is some fine minutiae that I'm missing with Alps stabs. When the inserts make contact with the plate it sounds like death. Here's a pic of the different materials:



The brown insert on the right is in the caps lock key, sounds excellent. The black insert on the left is the spacebar one, and is unfortunately not interchangeable because of its length. It's seriously the only thing stopping me from making this my daily work board. Send halp. 

[jacobolus]

Some alps keyboard have little felt pads under the spacebar stabilizers.

Or you could probably swap out the inserts for those from another keyboard.

The bigger problem is that those Zenith boards just have stupidly long spacebars.

[jacobolus]

Kinda dusty, and definitely not mint condition, but overall in pretty good shape. PBT in general is pretty hard wearing.

The red dye in particular is impressively crisp with very even color. The blue is slightly less even, but it’s not really too noticeable unless you put your eyeball a few inches away.

[itzmeluigi]

Those look excellent, very nice 

[nubbinator]

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Kinda dusty, and definitely not mint condition, but overall in pretty good shape. PBT in general is pretty hard wearing.

The red dye in particular is impressively crisp with very even color. The blue is slightly less even, but it’s not really too noticeable unless you put your eyeball a few inches away.

I am more than a little jealous.  Caps look like an AEK or AEKII (and the spacebar and mods look right for one of those), but I've only seen black Japanese characters on those.

[chyros]

Anyone familiar with the stabilizers on Zeniths? This board is really feeling great to type on, but the spacebar stabilizer inserts look to be made of a different material than the other stabilized keys. It has a really jarring, high-pitched, super unpleasant sound when they make contact with the plate. The other stabilized keys make a nice "thock" that sounds like all of the unstabilized keys, but the spacebar sounds like it's just plain mounted wrong or something. I think it's actually the inserts that are the problem? I've double and triple checked the way the stab and inserts sit and the key is definitely mounted and setup correctly, unless there is some fine minutiae that I'm missing with Alps stabs. When the inserts make contact with the plate it sounds like death. Here's a pic of the different materials:

Show Image

The brown insert on the right is in the caps lock key, sounds excellent. The black insert on the left is the spacebar one, and is unfortunately not interchangeable because of its length. It's seriously the only thing stopping me from making this my daily work board. Send halp.  :confused:

I've had something similar on another board. Get one of those spongy square minicloths for in your kitchen. Cut out a small square (<1 cm^2) and cut down its thickness to 1 mm or less. Stick that under the stabs with some double sided tape, should fix it.

[jacobolus]

Caps look like an AEK or AEKII (and the spacebar and mods look right for one of those), but I've only seen black Japanese characters on those.

Yes, it’s an AEK II with Taiwanese legends.

I also found a Russian one last week, which itzmeluigi bought. Here’s the pic from the ebay auction:


Hopefully he’ll take some closer pictures when he gets it.

[Den441]

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Kinda dusty, and definitely not mint condition, but overall in pretty good shape. PBT in general is pretty hard wearing.

The red dye in particular is impressively crisp with very even color. The blue is slightly less even, but it’s not really too noticeable unless you put your eyeball a few inches away.

Wow, those caps are amazing! The shade of blue is great. Do you know the model # on that board? I've only seen the ones with black legends as well.

[jacobolus]

On the back it looks like any AEK II. Made in USA, FCC ID BCGM3501, bar code *AP15401C%M0312TA*

(Usually the end bit of the bar code on these is just M3501 or M0312, without the TA. I think M0312)

Cream Alps switches, okay but not amazing condition. Some yellowing on spacebar and case. A fair bit of shine on the spacebar, and oddly quite a bit on the left command key. The rest of the keycaps are in good but not perfect condition.

[rowdy]

On the back it looks like any AEK II. Made in USA, FCC ID BCGM3501, bar code *AP15401C%M0312TA*

(Usually the end bit of the bar code on these is just M3501 or M0312, without the TA. I think M0312)

Cream Alps switches, okay but not amazing condition.

Apple hardware made in the US - rare these days!

[Den441]

On the back it looks like any AEK II. Made in USA, FCC ID BCGM3501, bar code *AP15401C%M0312TA*

(Usually the end bit of the bar code on these is just M3501 or M0312, without the TA. I think M0312)

Cream Alps switches, okay but not amazing condition. Some yellowing on spacebar and case. A fair bit of shine on the spacebar, and oddly quite a bit on the left command key. The rest of the keycaps are in good but not perfect condition.

Thanks, I love it. The japanese layout on it seems different from the AEKs I have seen with black legends. Can't find anymore info about it though.

[chyros]

On the back it looks like any AEK II. Made in USA, FCC ID BCGM3501, bar code *AP15401C%M0312TA*

(Usually the end bit of the bar code on these is just M3501 or M0312, without the TA. I think M0312)

Cream Alps switches, okay but not amazing condition.

Apple hardware made in the US - rare these days!

Still made by Asians though .

[E3E]

Anyone familiar with the stabilizers on Zeniths? This board is really feeling great to type on, but the spacebar stabilizer inserts look to be made of a different material than the other stabilized keys. It has a really jarring, high-pitched, super unpleasant sound when they make contact with the plate. The other stabilized keys make a nice "thock" that sounds like all of the unstabilized keys, but the spacebar sounds like it's just plain mounted wrong or something. I think it's actually the inserts that are the problem? I've double and triple checked the way the stab and inserts sit and the key is definitely mounted and setup correctly, unless there is some fine minutiae that I'm missing with Alps stabs. When the inserts make contact with the plate it sounds like death. Here's a pic of the different materials:

Show Image

The brown insert on the right is in the caps lock key, sounds excellent. The black insert on the left is the spacebar one, and is unfortunately not interchangeable because of its length. It's seriously the only thing stopping me from making this my daily work board. Send halp.  :confused:

I would say this is usually a case of a rickety space bar and not so much the stab inserts. In my experience, the brown and black and even translucent white ones have no differences between them, no significant differences anyway. What I would do in your situation if I were you, is lube the wire and stabs. This usually quiets up the sound very well. It was like this on my Focus FK-555. I hated the space bar sound, but after I lubed the stabs (this one had plate-mounted Cherry stabs), it sounded fine again (lubing costar and Alps-style stabs really quiets them too, so I recommend this to everyone). It is true that many with Alps stabs all around use little rubber or foam pads to combat spacebar thwack, so you could look into that too if the lube does not help.

Yeah, space bar inserts are usually different on Alps boards, and they more so have, like, closed in slots where as normal stabs are open-ended. Combined with the cylindrical peg that also helps stabilize the space bar, and it makes putting the space bar on a real PITA.

Haha. Good luck nonetheless, man!

[E3E]

So I've finally acquired one of my last dream boards, and this one really is a gem. Not only is it very seldomly seen, but I have never seen one in this mint of a condition. Not on Sandy's website, and not in the instances I've seen these on Deskthority and Geekhack (one with Mandolin, the other with Nuum, and before that, fossala). All of those except the ones on Sandy's site also had black cables and what I'd call more simplified FCC stickers and such. Also, some of those examples lacked the Caps Lock/Ctrl swapping swtch (weird quirk, I know) and rubberized flip out feet.

So this one is flawless, and the only Alps board I've gotten to date that needs no sort of restoration whatsoever. No rust, no scratches, and no yellowing and a the cable's coil are in perfect condition. Of course, now I don't want to type on it because of this. Lol. I retired my FAME because of its Hebrew caps, and now I don't want to use this because it's too clean. Sooo both of my metal backed boards are retired.







That said, I also picked up a Leading Edge DC-3014 which needed some TLC on the plastics, though its plate was fine, and I don't mind using it! So it's definitely my daily driver in the vintage world now. Blue Alps, NKRO, made in Korea, and using my Dell AT101's PBT caps. Feels nice, man.

BEFORE



AFTER



Use parts from the DC-2014 to fix things up--the cable and the logo mainly, since the logo on the DC-3014 started to fade after retrobrighting.

Yep! I hear that retrobrighting only lasts for around half a decade before the yellowing returns--I'm hoping not to see this in the boards I've restored, but it's one reason I don't mind using them either. Since the FK-555 has never been yellowed, I don't want to expose it. Plus, the case is amazingly texture. I don't want my palms rubbing up against it and shining it up.

Finally, a group shot of all my like-cased keyboards. All big-foot reminiscent. All but the AT101 have blue Alps.



Clockwise, starting from the bottom.

Alps Electric Dell AT101

Tai Hao FAME TH-5539

Focus FK-555

Monterey K101

The AT101's cable is phenomenal. Just ridiculously long, even in the coils alone.

[E3E]

Whoops!

[CPTBadAss]

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Kinda dusty, and definitely not mint condition, but overall in pretty good shape. PBT in general is pretty hard wearing.

The red dye in particular is impressively crisp with very even color. The blue is slightly less even, but it’s not really too noticeable unless you put your eyeball a few inches away.

So I've finally acquired one of my last dream boards, and this one really is a gem. Not only is it very seldomly seen, but I have never seen one in this mint of a condition. Not on Sandy's website, and not in the instances I've seen these on Deskthority and Geekhack (one with Mandolin, the other with Nuum, and before that, fossala). All of those except the ones on Sandy's site also had black cables and what I'd call more simplified FCC stickers and such. Also, some of those examples lacked the Caps Lock/Ctrl swapping swtch (weird quirk, I know) and rubberized flip out feet.

So this one is flawless, and the only Alps board I've gotten to date that needs no sort of restoration whatsoever. No rust, no scratches, and no yellowing and a the cable's coil are in perfect condition. Of course, now I don't want to type on it because of this. Lol. I retired my FAME because of its Hebrew caps, and now I don't want to use this because it's too clean. Sooo both of my metal backed boards are retired.

Show Image

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That said, I also picked up a Leading Edge DC-3014 which needed some TLC on the plastics, though its plate was fine, and I don't mind using it! So it's definitely my daily driver in the vintage world now. Blue Alps, NKRO, made in Korea, and using my Dell AT101's PBT caps. Feels nice, man.

BEFORE

Show Image

AFTER

Show Image

Use parts from the DC-2014 to fix things up--the cable and the logo mainly, since the logo on the DC-3014 started to fade after retrobrighting.

Yep! I hear that retrobrighting only lasts for around half a decade before the yellowing returns--I'm hoping not to see this in the boards I've restored, but it's one reason I don't mind using them either. Since the FK-555 has never been yellowed, I don't want to expose it. Plus, the case is amazingly texture. I don't want my palms rubbing up against it and shining it up. :P

Finally, a group shot of all my like-cased keyboards. All big-foot reminiscent. All but the AT101 have blue Alps.

Show Image

Clockwise, starting from the bottom.

Alps Electric Dell AT101

Tai Hao FAME TH-5539

Focus FK-555

Monterey K101

The AT101's cable is phenomenal. Just ridiculously long, even in the coils alone.

So much Alps porn in these two posts. Those AEK caps look so good and I can't believe you found three Blue SKCM boards so quickly E3E!

[henz]

So I've finally acquired one of my last dream boards, and this one really is a gem. Not only is it very seldomly seen, but I have never seen one in this mint of a condition. Not on Sandy's website, and not in the instances I've seen these on Deskthority and Geekhack (one with Mandolin, the other with Nuum, and before that, fossala). All of those except the ones on Sandy's site also had black cables and what I'd call more simplified FCC stickers and such. Also, some of those examples lacked the Caps Lock/Ctrl swapping swtch (weird quirk, I know) and rubberized flip out feet.

So this one is flawless, and the only Alps board I've gotten to date that needs no sort of restoration whatsoever. No rust, no scratches, and no yellowing and a the cable's coil are in perfect condition. Of course, now I don't want to type on it because of this. Lol. I retired my FAME because of its Hebrew caps, and now I don't want to use this because it's too clean. Sooo both of my metal backed boards are retired.

Show Image

Show Image

Show Image

That said, I also picked up a Leading Edge DC-3014 which needed some TLC on the plastics, though its plate was fine, and I don't mind using it! So it's definitely my daily driver in the vintage world now. Blue Alps, NKRO, made in Korea, and using my Dell AT101's PBT caps. Feels nice, man.

BEFORE

Show Image

AFTER

Show Image

Use parts from the DC-2014 to fix things up--the cable and the logo mainly, since the logo on the DC-3014 started to fade after retrobrighting.

Yep! I hear that retrobrighting only lasts for around half a decade before the yellowing returns--I'm hoping not to see this in the boards I've restored, but it's one reason I don't mind using them either. Since the FK-555 has never been yellowed, I don't want to expose it. Plus, the case is amazingly texture. I don't want my palms rubbing up against it and shining it up. :P

Finally, a group shot of all my like-cased keyboards. All big-foot reminiscent. All but the AT101 have blue Alps.

Show Image

Clockwise, starting from the bottom.

Alps Electric Dell AT101

Tai Hao FAME TH-5539

Focus FK-555

Monterey K101

The AT101's cable is phenomenal. Just ridiculously long, even in the coils alone.

Sweeet

[chyros]

Wow, someone is addicted to blue Alps . Amazing finds man, many contrafibularities!

[pr0ximity]

Anyone familiar with the stabilizers on Zeniths? This board is really feeling great to type on, but the spacebar stabilizer inserts look to be made of a different material than the other stabilized keys. It has a really jarring, high-pitched, super unpleasant sound when they make contact with the plate. The other stabilized keys make a nice "thock" that sounds like all of the unstabilized keys, but the spacebar sounds like it's just plain mounted wrong or something. I think it's actually the inserts that are the problem? I've double and triple checked the way the stab and inserts sit and the key is definitely mounted and setup correctly, unless there is some fine minutiae that I'm missing with Alps stabs. When the inserts make contact with the plate it sounds like death. Here's a pic of the different materials:

Show Image

The brown insert on the right is in the caps lock key, sounds excellent. The black insert on the left is the spacebar one, and is unfortunately not interchangeable because of its length. It's seriously the only thing stopping me from making this my daily work board. Send halp.  :confused:

I would say this is usually a case of a rickety space bar and not so much the stab inserts. In my experience, the brown and black and even translucent white ones have no differences between them, no significant differences anyway. What I would do in your situation if I were you, is lube the wire and stabs. This usually quiets up the sound very well. It was like this on my Focus FK-555. I hated the space bar sound, but after I lubed the stabs (this one had plate-mounted Cherry stabs), it sounded fine again (lubing costar and Alps-style stabs really quiets them too, so I recommend this to everyone). It is true that many with Alps stabs all around use little rubber or foam pads to combat spacebar thwack, so you could look into that too if the lube does not help.

Yeah, space bar inserts are usually different on Alps boards, and they more so have, like, closed in slots where as normal stabs are open-ended. Combined with the cylindrical peg that also helps stabilize the space bar, and it makes putting the space bar on a real PITA.

Haha. Good luck nonetheless, man!

I'm now an expert at putting on and taking off this gigantic Zenith spacebar! Right now I have some pieces of plastic cut from the backplate (there's a sheet of thick, stiff plastic between the PCB and the metal backplate) taped to the plate with painter's tape and it seems to be working pretty well. Still some tweaking to be done to get it feeling like the other keys on the board, but it's at least usable now :) I also put some of the foam I used on my Model F restoration under the spacebar where the stabilizing peg meets the cap, and where the stem meets the cap, kind of like soft, thin o-rings. I think the peg was slamming down onto the top of the plastic insert that it sits in and that was also pretty jarring.

Great board though, pretty fun to type on for sure. I think the Greens are close to my lubed Gateron Blacks in smoothness, but they're much more snappy. I think a wet lube tests to slow switches down a tad, and the Greens are nice because they feel completely unencumbered. Off-center presses definitely rub a little oddly on some keys, I attribute it to the sprue marks on the side of the stems that makes contact with the switch housing. Not very noticeable unless you're really pressing the key slowly and trying your hardest to pay attention. There's also some brief resistance when the stem meets the contact leaf as it bends out of the way which I find interesting, but that's also not noticeable during regular use.

[E3E]

There's also some brief resistance when the stem meets the contact leaf as it bends out of the way which I find interesting, but that's also not noticeable during regular use.

Glad to hear that you're really enjoying the Zenith, since I remember your initial impressions weren't the best, haha. That's kind of how I felt with my Focus FK-555, a board I have been hunting for a relatively long time, only to feel that the space bar was cheap-feeling and really icky and plasticy. I popped it off only to see plate-mounted Cherry stabs in WHITE housings of all colors. Just added some lube to the stab wire and now it's A-okay!

Also, I'm loving your ingenuity and resourcefulness with this one too, in using the foam to add dampening and bits of the plastic "shield" between the case and PCB for the space bar thwack, if I understood that correctly.

About the contact leaf remark though, I find that greens and indeed any linear Alps switch has a very minute bit of tactility you can only feel if you really look out for it or push the switch down very slowly. This is just because of how the contact leaf works, I'd say.

A good example is how, in tactile brown switches, they used a dummy plate with a spring leaf clipped onto it (much like the contact leaf) that is very similar to the contact leaf itself. It gives brown tactile switches a really odd sense of tactility. I couldn't feel much of it when I tried the individual switches, but mounted in my board, the story was far different. Very tactile! Not the biggest fan of tactile Alps though, I must admit.

[bocahgundul]

Hows brown tactile compared to orange alps?
And what is the difference between orange and salmon alps?

There is just too much type of alps!

[fohat.digs]

And what is the difference between orange and salmon alps?

In my experience, very little difference. Orange is earlier and preferable, to me.

[E3E]

Hows brown tactile compared to orange alps?
And what is the difference between orange and salmon alps?

There is just too much type of alps!

Salmon is stiffer and uses a short contact plate. Orange Alps uses a long contact plate and is quite a bit lighter. Lighter than even blue Alps, but not as light as green linear Alps.

Salmons feel a bit clunky in comparison, though they have a bit more tactility, though not as much as SKCM browns or SKCM ambers.

To me, brown tactiles are a little hard to describe. The tactility has a rounded feel and the bottom out brings it home. By itself, it's pretty tactile, but the bottom out really seems to amplify the feeling, if you ask me. The weight is around 65g I'd say. Orange is around 60g.

[chyros]

To me, brown tactiles are a little hard to describe. The tactility has a rounded feel and the bottom out brings it home.

Interesting. When you say "rounded", does it feel a little bit like SKCM neon green perhaps? Although I'd imagine with stronger tactility.

They're a very interesting switch design. Although Alps gave it up as soon as they could, Omron stuck with it. It's interesting to see how the two families diverged from a common ancestor.

I'd love to try out brown Alps someday. And amber ones. I've had so many types already, but it's like a Hydra, the more you tick off the list, the more keep popping up for you to try! xD

[bocahgundul]

Are alps really that wobbly? Doesn't have a keycaps to compare the wobbliness

[klennkellon]

Are alps really that wobbly? Doesn't have a keycaps to compare the wobbliness

Compared to my MX Reds, my complicated white alps do wobble more, but not a huge amount.

[jacobolus]

When you say "rounded", does [brown Alps] feel a little bit like SKCM neon green perhaps? Although I'd imagine with stronger tactility.

Yes, they are quite similar, but the brown ones are substantially stiffer with bigger drop in force after the tactile leaf gives way. This makes it hard to avoid bottoming out pretty hard, and I find them tiring to type on.

They're a very interesting switch design. Although Alps gave it up as soon as they could, Omron stuck with it. It's interesting to see how the two families diverged from a common ancestor.

Can you explain what you mean?

[klennkellon]

I'm quite upset I messed up my FK-2001, still works but I would rather use my completely functional Keycool with MX Reds than a messed up FK-2001. It's all my fault, live and learn I guess. At least I got to try a new switch type.

I think I'm going to try a Matias board next, either a KBParadise V80 or possibly a Matias board, from what people have told me, Matias switches feel smoother and lighter than Complicated Whites. I'm also thinking of picking up a Dell AT-101 since they are dirt cheap, but the keyboard is too damn huge!

Also thinking of picking up a SGI Graphite keyboard with dampened white alps, love the dye-sub thick PBT keycaps, but it's really yellowed and turned the case green!

[E3E]

To me, brown tactiles are a little hard to describe. The tactility has a rounded feel and the bottom out brings it home.

Interesting. When you say "rounded", does it feel a little bit like SKCM neon green perhaps? Although I'd imagine with stronger tactility.

They're a very interesting switch design. Although Alps gave it up as soon as they could, Omron stuck with it. It's interesting to see how the two families diverged from a common ancestor.

I'd love to try out brown Alps someday. And amber ones. I've had so many types already, but it's like a Hydra, the more you tick off the list, the more keep popping up for you to try! xD

Sounds like you've been been having some fun, Chyros! Do you have a Xerox you're wanting to tell us about? Yep, the brown tactiles are related to the SKCM green switches and the tactile design is very similar, though simplified in the SKCM green switch (leaf spring instead of the whole dummy plate assembly). I'd say that SKCM green is to SKCM brown, what SKCM Salmon is to SKCM orange, as they both have short contact plates.

Yes, it definitely has a more solid feel, but really, I only feel it strongly on the bottom out. Without that, the tactility is really just roundeed out and subtle. I don't know why the bottom out seems to create a greater sense of tactility on these, but I can imagine that's why they're always compared to Topre, because of that and the rounded tactility.

Are you saying that Omron used a dummy plate for tactility too? I haven't ever looked into them!

You're so right when it comes to the endless varieties of Alps to try, man. It's hard to catch 'em all! Amber Alps really remind me of how tactile brown Alps feel. It also had a click leaf that was unique from the others I've seen, but it wasn't so much in the same shape as SKCM green or brown. It didn't have a bottom lip and the two forks, if you will, were bent at a sharp right angle compared to other leaves.

It DID feel similar to the feel of switches I've played with whose tactile leaves I bent a bit too sharply, actually.

[E3E]

Are alps really that wobbly? Doesn't have a keycaps to compare the wobbliness

Linear alps switches with long contact plates like SKCL green and SKCL brown are less wobbly, I think, because of their symmetrical slider design. It's almost silly to imagine that this contributes to less wobble, but compare to non-symmetrical sliders like on blue and orange Alps, the greens and browns are very stable.

I wouldn't say that Alps are more wobbly than MX though, but my MX memory might be fuzzy.

[jacobolus]

I'm quite upset I messed up my FK-2001, still works but I would rather use my completely functional Keycool with MX Reds than a messed up FK-2001. It's all my fault, live and learn I guess. At least I got to try a new switch type.

I looked at your post history, and it seems you disassembled one of the switches, cleaned it, and put it back, and now it doesn’t click?

The way a clicky Alps switch works is that when you press down on the slider, the corner of the click leaf gets bent toward the slider, and then when the slider gets past the little legs, the click leaf snaps back against the plastic housing, causing the sound.


(This gif exaggerates the amount of twisting the slider will do, because the little groove that it usually tracks has been cut away from the near side. It also doesn’t show the switch being pressed all the way.)

If it’s not clicking, that means either the switch isn’t assembled correctly (e.g. the click leaf isn’t seated properly, the slider is flipped backwards, or similar), something else is inside the switch preventing the leaf from bending away from the wall or snapping back, or the click leaf is bent out of its correct shape.

How are you reassembling the switch? I find that the easiest way when the bottom of the switch is soldered down is to put all the loose parts (slider, click leaf, spring) into the top housing, with the slider pushed in so that the click leaf stays in snugly, flip the whole keyboard upside down, carefully get the spring aligned with the central peg, and then snap the top housing back into the bottom housing with the slider held in with my finger.

(But actually I reassemble these quite a bit faster when they’re not soldered down at all)

If the switch is assembled properly but still not clicking, that means either there’s something else inside there, or the click leaf has been bent out of shape. If you disassemble two switches you can compare their click leaves to see if there’s any obvious difference. If you’re careful you can make subtle changes to the feel of a switch by slightly bending the click leaf one way or another.

[bocahgundul]

Are alps really that wobbly? Doesn't have a keycaps to compare the wobbliness

Linear alps switches with long contact plates like SKCL green and SKCL brown are less wobbly, I think, because of their symmetrical slider design. It's almost silly to imagine that this contributes to less wobble, but compare to non-symmetrical sliders like on blue and orange Alps, the greens and browns are very stable.

I wouldn't say that Alps are more wobbly than MX though, but my MX memory might be fuzzy.

Thank you bro

[klennkellon]

I'm quite upset I messed up my FK-2001, still works but I would rather use my completely functional Keycool with MX Reds than a messed up FK-2001. It's all my fault, live and learn I guess. At least I got to try a new switch type.

I looked at your post history, and it seems you disassembled one of the switches, cleaned it, and put it back, and now it doesn’t click?

The way a clicky Alps switch works is that when you press down on the slider, the corner of the click leaf gets bent toward the slider, and then when the slider gets past the little legs, the click leaf snaps back against the plastic housing, causing the sound.

Show Image

(This gif exaggerates the amount of twisting the slider will do, because the little groove that it usually tracks has been cut away from the near side. It also doesn’t show the switch being pressed all the way.)

If it’s not clicking, that means either the switch isn’t assembled correctly (e.g. the click leaf isn’t seated properly, the slider is flipped backwards, or similar), something else is inside the switch preventing the leaf from bending away from the wall or snapping back, or the click leaf is bent out of its correct shape.

How are you reassembling the switch? I find that the easiest way when the bottom of the switch is soldered down is to put all the loose parts (slider, click leaf, spring) into the top housing, with the slider pushed in so that the click leaf stays in snugly, flip the whole keyboard upside down, carefully get the spring aligned with the central peg, and then snap the top housing back into the bottom housing with the slider held in with my finger.

(But actually I reassemble these quite a bit faster when they’re not soldered down at all)

If the switch is assembled properly but still not clicking, that means either there’s something else inside there, or the click leaf has been bent out of shape. If you disassemble two switches you can compare their click leaves to see if there’s any obvious difference. If you’re careful you can make subtle changes to the feel of a switch by slightly bending the click leaf one way or another.

Thanks, but I have tried swapping click leaves and sliders from other switches but nothing seems to help, I should also mention there is no tactility at all either, completely linear. sometimes with a very weak click, tried reversing the sliders, nothing.

I've done it to multiple switches, if it was just one I wouldn't feel so bad :L, thankfully none of the alphabetical keys.

[jacobolus]

If you’re killing the click on multiple switches, you’re probably reassembling them incorrectly.

[Mattr567]

So I've finally acquired one of my last dream boards, and this one really is a gem. Not only is it very seldomly seen, but I have never seen one in this mint of a condition. Not on Sandy's website, and not in the instances I've seen these on Deskthority and Geekhack (one with Mandolin, the other with Nuum, and before that, fossala). All of those except the ones on Sandy's site also had black cables and what I'd call more simplified FCC stickers and such. Also, some of those examples lacked the Caps Lock/Ctrl swapping swtch (weird quirk, I know) and rubberized flip out feet.

So this one is flawless, and the only Alps board I've gotten to date that needs no sort of restoration whatsoever. No rust, no scratches, and no yellowing and a the cable's coil are in perfect condition. Of course, now I don't want to type on it because of this. Lol. I retired my FAME because of its Hebrew caps, and now I don't want to use this because it's too clean. Sooo both of my metal backed boards are retired.

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That said, I also picked up a Leading Edge DC-3014 which needed some TLC on the plastics, though its plate was fine, and I don't mind using it! So it's definitely my daily driver in the vintage world now. Blue Alps, NKRO, made in Korea, and using my Dell AT101's PBT caps. Feels nice, man.

BEFORE

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AFTER

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Use parts from the DC-2014 to fix things up--the cable and the logo mainly, since the logo on the DC-3014 started to fade after retrobrighting.

Yep! I hear that retrobrighting only lasts for around half a decade before the yellowing returns--I'm hoping not to see this in the boards I've restored, but it's one reason I don't mind using them either. Since the FK-555 has never been yellowed, I don't want to expose it. Plus, the case is amazingly texture. I don't want my palms rubbing up against it and shining it up. :P

Finally, a group shot of all my like-cased keyboards. All big-foot reminiscent. All but the AT101 have blue Alps.

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Clockwise, starting from the bottom.

Alps Electric Dell AT101

Tai Hao FAME TH-5539

Focus FK-555

Monterey K101

The AT101's cable is phenomenal. Just ridiculously long, even in the coils alone.

The ultimate Alps porn lol. Nice man! Just finished my SKCM Orange SGI AT101 swap. Still needs some retrobrite.

[chyros]

To me, brown tactiles are a little hard to describe. The tactility has a rounded feel and the bottom out brings it home.

Interesting. When you say "rounded", does it feel a little bit like SKCM neon green perhaps? Although I'd imagine with stronger tactility.

They're a very interesting switch design. Although Alps gave it up as soon as they could, Omron stuck with it. It's interesting to see how the two families diverged from a common ancestor.

I'd love to try out brown Alps someday. And amber ones. I've had so many types already, but it's like a Hydra, the more you tick off the list, the more keep popping up for you to try! xD

Sounds like you've been been having some fun, Chyros! Do you have a Xerox you're wanting to tell us about? Yep, the brown tactiles are related to the SKCM green switches and the tactile design is very similar, though simplified in the SKCM green switch (leaf spring instead of the whole dummy plate assembly). I'd say that SKCM green is to SKCM brown, what SKCM Salmon is to SKCM orange, as they both have short contact plates.

Yes, it definitely has a more solid feel, but really, I only feel it strongly on the bottom out. Without that, the tactility is really just roundeed out and subtle. I don't know why the bottom out seems to create a greater sense of tactility on these, but I can imagine that's why they're always compared to Topre, because of that and the rounded tactility.

Are you saying that Omron used a dummy plate for tactility too? I haven't ever looked into them!

You're so right when it comes to the endless varieties of Alps to try, man. It's hard to catch 'em all! Amber Alps really remind me of how tactile brown Alps feel. It also had a click leaf that was unique from the others I've seen, but it wasn't so much in the same shape as SKCM green or brown. It didn't have a bottom lip and the two forks, if you will, were bent at a sharp right angle compared to other leaves.

It DID feel similar to the feel of switches I've played with whose tactile leaves I bent a bit too sharply, actually.

Haha, I wish I had a Xerox like that! No, I just have loose SKCM neon green (got a whole bunch of switches recently). No SKCM brown though xD .

Omron used a similar design with a tactile contact leaf, yes, but the dummy plate is part of the housing.

[venyv]

Will a Alps switch fit in a MX board or is that to broad of a question? Sorry for the newbie question I have never used Alps.

[Lepidus]

Will a Alps switch fit in a MX board or is that to broad of a question? Sorry for the newbie question I have never used Alps.

Plate holes and pin positions on the PCB are different.

[bocahgundul]

Yep alps will not fit in cherry board