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geekhack Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: tp4tissue on Wed, 31 May 2017, 16:37:11

Title: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Wed, 31 May 2017, 16:37:11
Recently started becoming hipster..


Everything's been alrite so far..


Notable changes..


----- Have to eat 5 times a day because most plants are not Calorically dense but take alot of Space..


As a result, Also haz to bathroom alot, up to 5 times..   

Called the doctor, he says this is good, because the more quickly things move OUT of you, the less colon cancer that waste matter is potentially contributing to..


-----  Exercise recovery improvement, almost non existent soreness post workouts..  Possibly due to improved vascular tree circulation..




Downsides.. 




sigh..................  can't save any money from eating Costco Rotisserie Chicken..   

Now Tp4 haz $0 monies.. because can't enjoy the government subsidies to the meat industry which keep meat product prices artificially low..

But it's not a huge change, as Tp4 merely went from ep1c p00r to  Destitute..   not such a large step.




Typical Meal


1/8 cup of walnuts

2x Small Red Potato (boiled)

1x Medium Sweet Potato (boiled)

--Veggie stirfry-- (Whatever's on sale)

C(7,2) of pear, banana, orange,  mango, papaya, watermelon, cantaloupe, 






Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: digi on Wed, 31 May 2017, 17:09:05
LOL, I was worried!

Glad you and your intestines are back "on track". :D

So post workout gains are usually from protein, are you saying the greens are helping you recover quickly, like from being sore?
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: OfTheWild on Wed, 31 May 2017, 17:12:36
My brother and his g/f have been doing the vegan thing for a few months. Its tough keeping your macros up so you have energy and such. Plus you definitely need to source your veggies from local organic to try and maximize nutritional value. If you ever need some motivation check out "The Omnivores Dilemma" or the follow-up research "In the Defense of Food" by Michael Pollan. Good stuff that will make you feel inspired to eat the best food you can.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: digi on Wed, 31 May 2017, 17:15:38
My brother and his g/f have been doing the vegan thing for a few months. Its tough keeping your macros up so you have energy and such. Plus you definitely need to source your veggies from local organic to try and maximize nutritional value. If you ever need some motivation check out "The Omnivores Dilemma" or the follow-up research "In the Defense of Food" by Michael Pollan. Good stuff that will make you feel inspired to eat the best food you can.

I get my macros from Popeyes Spicy Chicken Tenders..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: chyros on Wed, 31 May 2017, 17:24:26
Why am tp r become rabbit?
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 31 May 2017, 17:26:49
Bacon FTW

Oh and what I'm about to eat

(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170531/596c6769d1463473e010ca6cdd662192.jpg)
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: OfTheWild on Wed, 31 May 2017, 18:04:10
^ mmmmm makes me want some peruvian chicken
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Halverson on Wed, 31 May 2017, 19:05:44
Fgt
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Wed, 31 May 2017, 21:46:06
Why am tp r become rabbit?


Am at the age where everyone around me is catching the heart disease and cancer..

Cowardice Perhaps  ??

Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Wed, 31 May 2017, 21:51:26
My brother and his g/f have been doing the vegan thing for a few months. Its tough keeping your macros up so you have energy and such. Plus you definitely need to source your veggies from local organic to try and maximize nutritional value. If you ever need some motivation check out "The Omnivores Dilemma" or the follow-up research "In the Defense of Food" by Michael Pollan. Good stuff that will make you feel inspired to eat the best food you can.


The BEST information out there rests on correlation studies,  the actual mechanisms are too complicated for modern science to fully depict..


But the solution to near term ailments seeeeeeeeems to be a vegetable laden course.. 


As for organic,   haz walked into whole foods a few years back..  Tp4 simply can't fordz the premium label foods..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Halverson on Wed, 31 May 2017, 21:54:06
Why am tp r become rabbit?


Am at the age where everyone around me is catching the heart disease and cancer..

Cowardice Perhaps  ??


How old are you?
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Melvang on Wed, 31 May 2017, 22:00:34
My brother and his g/f have been doing the vegan thing for a few months. Its tough keeping your macros up so you have energy and such. Plus you definitely need to source your veggies from local organic to try and maximize nutritional value. If you ever need some motivation check out "The Omnivores Dilemma" or the follow-up research "In the Defense of Food" by Michael Pollan. Good stuff that will make you feel inspired to eat the best food you can.


The BEST information out there rests on correlation studies,  the actual mechanisms are too complicated for modern science to fully depict..


But the solution to near term ailments seeeeeeeeems to be a vegetable laden course.. 


As for organic,   haz walked into whole foods a few years back..  Tp4 simply can't fordz the premium label foods..

Don't worry about not being able to afford organic.  The only thing that organic means is they can only use pesticides from a specific list that are considered natural.  And remember natural does not mean better.  Also, these pesticides are not as effective, for targeted as what isn't on that list.  Organic pesticides are sprayed at up to and sometimes more than 30 pounds per acre.  Other non organic friendly pesticides are sprayed at less than 5 pounds per acre.

Also, there is zero difference in nutritional value between organic and non-organic.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: xondat on Wed, 31 May 2017, 22:03:20
Never thought I'd say this but I'm proud of you tp4, keep it up :p
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: OfTheWild on Wed, 31 May 2017, 22:22:43
My brother and his g/f have been doing the vegan thing for a few months. Its tough keeping your macros up so you have energy and such. Plus you definitely need to source your veggies from local organic to try and maximize nutritional value. If you ever need some motivation check out "The Omnivores Dilemma" or the follow-up research "In the Defense of Food" by Michael Pollan. Good stuff that will make you feel inspired to eat the best food you can.


The BEST information out there rests on correlation studies,  the actual mechanisms are too complicated for modern science to fully depict..


But the solution to near term ailments seeeeeeeeems to be a vegetable laden course.. 


As for organic,   haz walked into whole foods a few years back..  Tp4 simply can't fordz the premium label foods..

Don't worry about not being able to afford organic.  The only thing that organic means is they can only use pesticides from a specific list that are considered natural.  And remember natural does not mean better.  Also, these pesticides are not as effective, for targeted as what isn't on that list.  Organic pesticides are sprayed at up to and sometimes more than 30 pounds per acre.  Other non organic friendly pesticides are sprayed at less than 5 pounds per acre.

Also, there is zero difference in nutritional value between organic and non-organic.

There is quite a difference in product between your local small organic farm and the corporate mega farms that supply places like whole foods. I do a lot of reading on the subject of food science but i'm hardly an expert, its just a hobby of mine. I also like to 'attempt' to grow some of my own food naturally.
As for nutritional information you might enjoy this short report that sheds some light on the changes that we're seeing in modern produce from different farming tactics https://organic-center.org/reportfiles/YieldsReport.pdf
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 02:02:05

There is quite a difference in product between your local small organic farm and the corporate mega farms that supply places like whole foods. I do a lot of reading on the subject of food science but i'm hardly an expert, its just a hobby of mine. I also like to 'attempt' to grow some of my own food naturally.
As for nutritional information you might enjoy this short report that sheds some light on the changes that we're seeing in modern produce from different farming tactics https://organic-center.org/reportfiles/YieldsReport.pdf

The issue here is there's no agreed upon composition of nutrients..  it's just one word -organic-,   it only goes as far as to mean -maybe better-

So paying for premium MIGHT get you an extra few percent on compounds..  but the price increase is higher than those percentages..

Premium food may not be a prudent investment for any household below $200,000 gross..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 02:07:46
Bacon FTW

Oh and what I'm about to eat

Show Image
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170531/596c6769d1463473e010ca6cdd662192.jpg)




The majority of --Tasty-- Vegan foods are pretty loaded with oils/fats.

In that sense, this segment will contribute nearly as much to heart disease as eating meats.


But, at least with the vegan side, you still avoid the most common cancers..   breast/colon/prostate




It seems doubtful that people would go for the healthy choice though..


Oils and sugar taste great..  it's by far the cheapest --drug-- on the market..


The entire human population is addicted to it.. 




Some people might be able to get off the stuff,  but because of low cost,  and vast will-power drain of modern occupation and entertainment structure,   the majority will stay tuned for heart disease..


You can't work a boring 9 hours, then come home, and NOT eat a cupcake,  life sux, that cupcake is the only good thing in your life..

If it's a vegan cupcake though, less cancers ,  so that's a win.. !!
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: xtrafrood on Thu, 01 June 2017, 05:20:58
OLDSCHOOL vegan. Holy moly how can you manage that diet?!
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Findecanor on Thu, 01 June 2017, 08:42:30
The entire human population is addicted to it.. 
No. The entire human population is attracted to it, only a portion of them are actually addicted to it.

But, at least with the vegan side, you still avoid the most common cancers..   breast/colon/prostate
No, you don't avoid it, you only reduce the risk. But at least, the reduction is well known.
You should also avoid smoked or burned foods and avoid inhaling fumes from smoking cooking oil.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dante on Thu, 01 June 2017, 09:18:07
I've tried some forms of veganism and always failed.

Frutarian diet made me always light headed, urinate all day (they think this is a good thing but I found it quite annoying), and eventually got cavities - for the first time in my life!

Starchivore/McDougall diet always made me constipated and was bored with potatoes as quickly as I got bored with meat on a low/zero carb diet.

One thing is for certain: I am absolutely miserable on a ultra low fat diet as well as having too much sugar.  On the other hand if my carbs are too low I also get extremely depressed.

So maybe a new diet composed as a Raw Vegan Dessert diet.  Basically Puddings/Pie's/Cheesecakes all Raw Vegan and made with alternative sweeteners.

Yes tp4 is right - I am addicted to oil and sugar.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: chyros on Thu, 01 June 2017, 09:40:11
I've tried some forms of veganism and always failed.

Frutarian diet made me always light headed, urinate all day (they think this is a good thing but I found it quite annoying), and eventually got cavities - for the first time in my life!

Starchivore/McDougall diet always made me constipated and was bored with potatoes as quickly as I got bored with meat on a low/zero carb diet.

One thing is for certain: I am absolutely miserable on a ultra low fat diet as well as having too much sugar.  On the other hand if my carbs are too low I also get extremely depressed.

So maybe a new diet composed as a Raw Vegan Dessert diet.  Basically Puddings/Pie's/Cheesecakes all Raw Vegan and made with alternative sweeteners.

Yes tp4 is right - I am addicted to oil and sugar.
-milk
-beer
-meat

All you need.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: digi on Thu, 01 June 2017, 11:42:02
-milk
-beer
-meat

All you need.

Amen brother Chyros.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: nya on Thu, 01 June 2017, 11:53:57
Why am tp r become rabbit?


Am at the age where everyone around me is catching the heart disease and cancer..

Cowardice Perhaps  ??



Why be hungry for 20 years when you can eat like a king for 10?
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 11:55:20
The entire human population is addicted to it.. 
No. The entire human population is attracted to it, only a portion of them are actually addicted to it.

But, at least with the vegan side, you still avoid the most common cancers..   breast/colon/prostate
No, you don't avoid it, you only reduce the risk. But at least, the reduction is well known.
You should also avoid smoked or burned foods and avoid inhaling fumes from smoking cooking oil.


If we look at --food--, specifically unprocessed foods in the WILD.  They're nothing like what we eat and prepare for meals today.. 

Even most fruits that we eat do not exist in the wild and have thousand year histories of horticulture to make them sweeter and more fragrant.


Modern foods, both natural and processed alike are --Hyper-Palatable--..  Which induce Low-Grade-Addictions..   The effect radically alters our inclinations of not only taste but levels of desire as well..

Humans today are not only satisfied by  --A Meal--  they need a SUPER Meal, that looks good and tastes good ONTOP of mere satiation.   


This is the case primarily because our ability to make these delights came more rapidly than our physical evolution to cope..



The perception aspect is such that, Once any human is introduced to this never ending supply of _good taste_,  this becomes the new bottom line...

If it were a lower line , things would be ok,   but the brain is by design adaptive and will trim neuro-receptors upon persistent influx of the good life.. 


So, the desire upon taste has gone SO FAR,  so sweet and so greasy,  that it conflicts with our body's ability to physically process them, evidently leading to chronic Western diseases of affluence.. Heart disease/ Cancers 






As for Cancer,  Cancer is only inevitable under the assumption of a infinite lifespan..   

The Modern most common cancers are directly correlated with consumption of animal proteins, and they happen in our Western lifestyles, but NOT in other cultures which eat 0x animals...

The latest info suggest we should not be dying of the common western cancers which are today retiring americans approximately 10-20 years ahead of end of useful healthful lifespan.

Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 12:03:22
Why am tp r become rabbit?


Am at the age where everyone around me is catching the heart disease and cancer..

Cowardice Perhaps  ??



Why be hungry for 20 years when you can eat like a king for 10?


Hahaha.. ---nya ---...  I understand that sentiment well..  I was young once..   Then the cancer and heart disease started showing up in the people I knew.. You go and visit them in the hospitals...    Then the fog lifts a bit..

I got an associate who has to poo out the side of his stomach into a colostomy bag..   a few others have chest pains and they're only 40s and 50s..


It's one thing when you see these things on tv or the internet, but it's different when AFK  people closer to you and your age get them..


Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: digi on Thu, 01 June 2017, 12:26:30
Let me break this down in advanced math:

lte (lifetime enjoyment) / ym (yummy meats) * bs (barley soda) = HL (happy life) + mfov (making fun of vegans)

"hey guys look at me, I'm so healthy and miserable, I have no energy, I smell like patchouli oil and and I fart kale particles."
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 12:30:00
Let me break this down in advanced math:

lte (lifetime enjoyment) / ym (yummy meats) * bs (barley soda) = HL (happy life) + mfov (making fun of vegans)

"hey guys look at me, I'm so healthy and miserable, I have no energy, I smell like patchouli oil and and I fart kale particles."


Digi math...  Impeccable as always..




I will admit this right now to all..  Being a Health-Concious Vegan is TRAGIC compared to the Bacon life....


There's the Half measure for people who can accept at least the heart disease...   

Many vegan Meat Substitutes on the shelves are seriously delicious, as they contain just as much Oil as meats..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: digi on Thu, 01 June 2017, 12:33:50
Don't get me wrong, I touch down on tofu and like myself a salad. It's just like anything else, mix up your diet so you're not getting your proteins and complex carbs from the same sources all the time and you'll be good to go.

I don't do fast-food more than once or twice a month and I try to stay away from soda..

My problem is that I absolutely hate brown rice and I know it's way better for you than white rice...oh well.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dante on Thu, 01 June 2017, 12:39:17
The Modern most common cancers are directly correlated with consumption of animal proteins, and they happen in our Western lifestyles, but NOT in other cultures which eat 0x animals...

The latest info suggest we should not be dying of the common western cancers which are today retiring americans approximately 10-20 years ahead of end of useful healthful lifespan.

I think it's unfair to completely blame animal products.  We are not all afforded the luxury of discussing this on our asses because a good portion of our ancestors were celery munchers.

There is also another politically incorrect possibility: Perhaps not all of us are genetically set up to live to a certain statistically generated age.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 12:47:40
The Modern most common cancers are directly correlated with consumption of animal proteins, and they happen in our Western lifestyles, but NOT in other cultures which eat 0x animals...

The latest info suggest we should not be dying of the common western cancers which are today retiring americans approximately 10-20 years ahead of end of useful healthful lifespan.

I think it's unfair to completely blame animal products.  We are not all afforded the luxury of discussing this on our asses because a good portion of our ancestors were celery munchers.

There is also another politically incorrect possibility: Perhaps not all of us are genetically set up to live to a certain statistically generated age.

Well, the 7th day adventist community in california have significantly reduced rates of western cancers,  and they're genetically identical to the rest of the population.


Now, as for Living to a SPEC..   It's absolutely a choice haha..


Part of me is glad that there is a choice,     the other part of me has to eat GOD DAMN KALE as a consequence..  Jesus, Tp4 h8s kale..



As to ... Blame....   The majority of Peoples are lowly-educated, narrow, and generally stupid..    This is true of the growing vegan-populist culture as well.


It is from THIS segment that we get alot of  Omni-h8  build up..     


IMHO,  it's not about who's at fault..   or cruelty..     because heck we exploit humans in cubicles today, just as we exploit the cows in their stalls..



So,  it comes down to Where you want to go,  How you get there,  and in the case of Eating right,  HOW MUCH TIME YOU HAVE, -- To get there..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dante on Thu, 01 June 2017, 12:50:51
My problem is that I absolutely hate brown rice and I know it's way better for you than white rice...oh well.

If we are looking for real world results then white rice wins. Do you know of any large Asian populations that primarily consume brown rice?  I can't think of any.

The rice companies are probably laughing their asses off because they can push brown rice and make more profit due to less processing.

That aside there are several articles out there that not only explain how nutritionally poor rice is but how it's difficult for the body to absorb the nutrients from brown rice.

By nutrition I mean yes, rice will keep you alive but micro-nutrient wise a salad will crush it.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 12:54:24
My problem is that I absolutely hate brown rice and I know it's way better for you than white rice...oh well.

If we are looking for real world results then white rice wins. Do you know of any large Asian populations that primarily consume brown rice?  I can't think of any.

The rice companies are probably laughing their asses off because they can push brown rice and make more profit due to less processing.

That aside there are several articles out there that not only explain how nutritionally poor rice is but how it's difficult for the body to absorb the nutrients from brown rice.

By nutrition I mean yes, rice will keep you alive but micro-nutrient wise a salad will crush it.


I think potatoes are the way to go,  Yield significantly trump nearly every other crop and it has lots of nutrients.. 



But grains will remain staple, because you can store it for much longer...
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dante on Thu, 01 June 2017, 13:00:02
Well, the 7th day adventist community in california have significantly reduced rates of western cancers,  and they're genetically identical to the rest of the population.

So I took a look at their diet.  I am pretty sure if you substituted the salmon with say Chicken or Beef and made no other alterations to the diet that you would probably be ok.  It's all the other crap people throw in a diet that is the problem.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: ygor on Thu, 01 June 2017, 13:01:39
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/48/DanielDaly.jpg)
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dante on Thu, 01 June 2017, 13:06:31
I think potatoes are the way to go,  Yield significantly trump nearly every other crop and it has lots of nutrients.. 

But grains will remain staple, because you can store it for much longer...

My problem with potatoes is they are one of the crops with the most pesticides; and all the Organic Potatoes in my area are terrible!  Either the price scares people and they sit on the shelf forever or they just don't taste very good.

There's been quite a number of people who have done "Potato Fasts" or mono meals and have lost a lot of weight - and I've tried this but you've got to be dedicated.

I'm probably going to get the facts wrong so feel free to jump on me - but the way I understand it is when you eat potatoes with absolutely no fat it will cause your blood sugar to rise and with no fat present in the meal it will go to your fat stores instead to control the spike.  This can help with weight loss.

Which reminds me go search for "Rice Diet" which attempts something similar except with white rice and fruit juice.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 13:09:31
Well, the 7th day adventist community in california have significantly reduced rates of western cancers,  and they're genetically identical to the rest of the population.

So I took a look at their diet.  I am pretty sure if you substituted the salmon with say Chicken or Beef and made no other alterations to the diet that you would probably be ok.  It's all the other crap people throw in a diet that is the problem.


No one can say for sure..

But looking at multiple sources  it seems that 100% veggie is the way to go..


probably if you're 20,  you can wait it out 10 more years and see what happens,   but if you're 30+  , you might not have the time to chance it..


The risk is pretty high.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 13:17:14


My problem with potatoes is they are one of the crops with the most pesticides; and all the Organic Potatoes in my area are terrible!  Either the price scares people and they sit on the shelf forever or they just don't taste very good.

There's been quite a number of people who have done "Potato Fasts" or mono meals and have lost a lot of weight - and I've tried this but you've got to be dedicated.

I'm probably going to get the facts wrong so feel free to jump on me - but the way I understand it is when you eat potatoes with absolutely no fat it will cause your blood sugar to rise and with no fat present in the meal it will go to your fat stores instead to control the spike.  This can help with weight loss.

Which reminds me go search for "Rice Diet" which attempts something similar except with white rice and fruit juice.


It's tough to do any of the radical diet regimes.. hahahaha



As for pesticides.  yea.. they're a problem,   but with meats,  we got antibiotic and cooking resistent bacteria as the result of factory farming,   the scale is just so large it's impossible to keep clean..


And then there's the slaughter houses which also end up getting fecal particles all over meats..  looks clean in packaging but it's NOT, hahaha.. p00 everywhere...


The mechanical aspect of eating meat makes it much -dirtier-  than any vegetables..



A problem in these discussions is we try to win something or justify an incumbent lifestyle..     

It's probably more correct to affix more simply to,   How can we get less heart disease and Cancer..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 13:19:33
Show Image
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/48/DanielDaly.jpg)


I don't want to live forever..

I just don't want to live in a hospital
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dante on Thu, 01 June 2017, 13:42:28
The problem is us.  We are flawed.

Machines/AI are the future.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: chyros on Thu, 01 June 2017, 13:56:15
The problem is us.  We are flawed.
Well I don't know about you but I can eat steak every day, actually (http://i864.photobucket.com/albums/ab207/Chyrosran/8I%20smileys/I8_zpsmkdo4cj9.gif) .
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 14:17:32
The problem is us.  We are flawed.
Well I don't know about you but I can eat steak every day, actually
Show Image
(http://i864.photobucket.com/albums/ab207/Chyrosran/8I%20smileys/I8_zpsmkdo4cj9.gif)
.

Not in dispute whether anyone CAN or SHOULD.


It's only important that we do it eyes open..
Title: Vegan Trials
Post by: Doluded on Thu, 01 June 2017, 14:19:19
Tp is back baby
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: nya on Thu, 01 June 2017, 14:25:23
Considering you're SUPER healthy now it's probably ok to sneak in a lil bacon every now n then no? Or is your body already rejecting meat?
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 15:19:30
Considering you're SUPER healthy now it's probably ok to sneak in a lil bacon every now n then no? Or is your body already rejecting meat?



Not so hung up on being 100%,  for example, if there was nothing to eat at a luncheon or banquet, except cream cakes,   I'd still eat it that day..


Overall, maintenance is at the ideology level..     

Why do it.... is the primary,   how and what to do,   requires far less thought, because the solutions are pretty straight forward due to the limit of practicalities.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: mrduul on Thu, 01 June 2017, 16:01:47
I drink RAW Milk.

Very good for you if you get Organic from local farmers.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 01 June 2017, 16:08:35
I drink RAW Milk.

Very good for you if you get Organic from local farmers.


Well, mm.. this is a tough one,   milk is so powerfully ingrained into our doctrine of health,  that it's almost an affront to god to discuss the latest findings on its consumption..

hahahaha..

Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Joey Quinn on Thu, 01 June 2017, 18:27:09
I drink RAW Milk.

Very good for you if you get Organic from local farmers.

How long have you been drinking un pasteurized milk?
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: ygor on Thu, 01 June 2017, 20:04:48
Show Image
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/48/DanielDaly.jpg)


I don't want to live forever..

I just don't want to live in a hospital

(https://static01.nyt.com/images/2011/06/04/us/KEVORKIAN/KEVORKIAN-popup.jpg)
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 02 June 2017, 01:45:50
OLDSCHOOL vegan. Holy moly how can you manage that diet?!


/Conviction..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: chyros on Fri, 02 June 2017, 05:19:13
OLDSCHOOL vegan. Holy moly how can you manage that diet?!


/Conviction..
/brain damage
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: mrduul on Fri, 02 June 2017, 05:23:21
What supplements do you guys take?
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 02 June 2017, 08:52:50
What supplements do you guys take?

if you're eating meat,  you don't need any supplements

 but according to the internet,  vegans need extra b12 and some fats like in walnuts.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Sniping on Fri, 02 June 2017, 16:36:45
What supplements do you guys take?

if you're eating meat,  you don't need any supplements

 but according to the internet,  vegans need extra b12 and some fats like in walnuts.

you should take b12 supplement for sure, i used to do cyanocobalamin tablets. if you're ok with it you can give yourself shots once a month too, which is convenient but also we have some sort of almost inherent fear of stabbing ourselves with needles. make sure you mix up your main source for carbs just to get a variety of nutrients and not be bored. oatmeal for breakfast is great with brown sugar and cinnamon, or toast up a bagel and spread with peanut butter and banana slices on top. pasta, rice, and beans are also very common and so cheap. make sure you aren't getting tired of your food or else you'll go back to eating junk food within a few weeks. 
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 02 June 2017, 16:44:26
What supplements do you guys take?

if you're eating meat,  you don't need any supplements

 but according to the internet,  vegans need extra b12 and some fats like in walnuts.

you should take b12 supplement for sure, i used to do cyanocobalamin tablets. if you're ok with it you can give yourself shots once a month too, which is convenient but also we have some sort of almost inherent fear of stabbing ourselves with needles. make sure you mix up your main source for carbs just to get a variety of nutrients and not be bored. oatmeal for breakfast is great with brown sugar and cinnamon, or toast up a bagel and spread with peanut butter and banana slices on top. pasta, rice, and beans are also very common and so cheap. make sure you aren't getting tired of your food or else you'll go back to eating junk food within a few weeks. 


Tp4 considers a dull foods experience as an opportunity to hone concentration and WILL POWAH.. !!


But for the non-crazies out there,  Yes, indeed it is very important to experiment with the infinite variety of the vegan palette.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Sniping on Fri, 02 June 2017, 17:03:02
What supplements do you guys take?

if you're eating meat,  you don't need any supplements

 but according to the internet,  vegans need extra b12 and some fats like in walnuts.

you should take b12 supplement for sure, i used to do cyanocobalamin tablets. if you're ok with it you can give yourself shots once a month too, which is convenient but also we have some sort of almost inherent fear of stabbing ourselves with needles. make sure you mix up your main source for carbs just to get a variety of nutrients and not be bored. oatmeal for breakfast is great with brown sugar and cinnamon, or toast up a bagel and spread with peanut butter and banana slices on top. pasta, rice, and beans are also very common and so cheap. make sure you aren't getting tired of your food or else you'll go back to eating junk food within a few weeks. 


Tp4 considers a dull foods experience as an opportunity to hone concentration and WILL POWAH.. !!


But for the non-crazies out there,  Yes, indeed it is very important to experiment with the infinite variety of the vegan palette.

haha if you want to work on your mental toughness just do some big hills on your bicycle. you should beware of eating the same foods every day just because you probably won't be covering the complete spectrum of vitamins and minerals with only a couple of foods. just something to keep in mind i guess.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Sat, 03 June 2017, 20:54:12

haha if you want to work on your mental toughness just do some big hills on your bicycle. you should beware of eating the same foods every day just because you probably won't be covering the complete spectrum of vitamins and minerals with only a couple of foods. just something to keep in mind i guess.


Well different veggies go on sale every week, so I've got some variety by my poverty.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Sun, 04 June 2017, 15:35:56
A big boost in motivation/ Energy Level..

Getting stuff done feels lighter..  It's as if I've been wearing a laziness chain which has now been removed..

There's less mental haziness throughout my day to day.. 




Searching through ancient chinese scriptures,    80 to 150 years back (china), vegan diets are often used as treatment for sickly youths in rich families..   

There is also Dynastic family records where, a common remedy is to restrict diet on --rich-- foods such as meats/milk/eggs/refined oils..  Although they did not specify how strict the restriction was..


But this would at least indicate that there is a long heritage of improved health via removing animal products.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: E.E.L. Ambiense on Wed, 14 June 2017, 13:13:56
Congrats on the switch man!  It gets easier as you go forward too.  Plant-based for a number of years myself, and haven't had red meat in 25+ yrs.  It gets a lot easier as you go forward.  What you're describing seems to be common as I know many who have experienced similar.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: chyros on Wed, 14 June 2017, 13:30:58
Just to balance out the rabbitness here:

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/this-guy-has-eaten-nothing-but-raw-meat-for-five-years

(https://vice-images.vice.com/images/articles/meta/2013/09/31/this-guys-eaten-nothing-but-raw-meat-for-five-years-1413292898177.jpeg?crop=1xw:0.9230769230769231xh;center,center&resize=1919:*)
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dante on Thu, 15 June 2017, 09:30:46
I'm going to attempt vegan again next week, only this time I'll try to keep the carbs as low as possible.

That means no grains, no potatoes, only black soybeans/tofu for legumes, hemp hearts/pumpkin seeds/nuts/nut butters, and a lot of leafy greens/Cruciferous vegetables.

No fruit except some berries and even then only very early in the day so they can be burned off before night.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dgneo on Thu, 15 June 2017, 10:02:03
(http://i.imgur.com/wMoBy4b.png)

Found on reddit, had a raugh
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 15 June 2017, 12:09:36
I'm going to attempt vegan again next week, only this time I'll try to keep the carbs as low as possible.

That means no grains, no potatoes, only black soybeans/tofu for legumes, hemp hearts/pumpkin seeds/nuts/nut butters, and a lot of leafy greens/Cruciferous vegetables.

No fruit except some berries and even then only very early in the day so they can be burned off before night.


Dante,  the vegan run is going to be healthy,

But if you eat any more than 10% fat calories (total) per day,  you will still have to contend with Heart Disease, Dementia, and Diabetes..



This is IMHO the biggest challenge..


But yesterday I did an experiment which gave me some confidence in the 10% fats.  22 Grams per day MAXIMUM..


I made baked potatoes with small potatoes..


With only 4 grams of oil measured out on the mini scale,    I could cover the cut tops of, 6 small potatoes (581 grams), each cut into quarters,  that is approximately  72 square inches  ..   And it tasted Greasy, just like regular french fries,  only it only had 4 grams of oil..


So this is a total of 412.5 Calories from the potato, + 36 Calories from the oil.. for a total of ~450 calories..



Coating healthy whole plant food with tiny amounts of oil is going to be the key..   This is especially true for many of us who have a --food, lust-- of sorts
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 15 June 2017, 12:23:34
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/wMoBy4b.png)


Found on reddit, had a raugh


I don't think animal welfare/ rights / suffering is at all a convincing reason for people to stop eating them.


Because it is VERY easy to justify ANY form of exploitation as long as there is profit.

Are people happy being exploited at the workplace while their bosses reap the lion share of the profits.  The bosses are sure ok with it. hahahaa



So, relative to the Human / Animal relationship..  Every human is Many steps above a food-animal..   As long as Someone believe this is a Net Gain by eating them..  They will continue to do so.



The trouble is,  Our science on this has finally caught up.. Eating animals is directly causing humans,  Heart disease, Cancer, Diabetes, Dementia,   among all other leading causes of american death.


SO..... it really has to start in a self-centered desire for anyone to truly change..


Eat animals = DELICIOUS,   100% agree

Eat animals also = You Die, HORRIBLY

_______ Medical cost will be equivalent to your entire Life savings on the average salary.

_______ You have no money left to pass onto your loved ones

_______ You probably won't even have any left for your own funeral

_______ You put your family in emotional agony for the last 5 to 10 years of YOUR debilitating sickness..

_______ and Yea, that last 5 to 10 years of your life, YOU SUFFER, persist in physically and mental agony.




For some people who have no close family, a very monotonous job, and have no savings anyway..  It's probably still a logical decision to take the risk.


But asssuming this person wants to self improve,  whole plant food is still a good option, but not a necessity..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Blackehart on Thu, 15 June 2017, 12:46:40


Eat animals = DELICIOUS,   100% agree

Eat animals also = You Die, HORRIBLY

_______ Medical cost will be equivalent to your entire Life savings on the average salary.

_______ You have no money left to pass onto your loved ones

_______ You probably won't even have any left for your own funeral

_______ You put your family in emotional agony for the last 5 to 10 years of YOUR debilitating sickness..

_______ and Yea, that last 5 to 10 years of your life, YOU SUFFER, persist in physically and mental agony.




For some people who have no close family, a very monotonous job, and have no savings anyway..  It's probably still a logical decision to take the risk.


But asssuming this person wants to self improve,  whole plant food is still a good option, but not a necessity..


So vegans are somehow exempt from horrible deaths?  :p
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 15 June 2017, 13:07:41

So vegans are somehow exempt from horrible deaths?  :p


Hahahahahahha..

Vegans do die... they're not immortals,   MOST of them arn't even very good people.


If you meet a Vegan AFK,  it's probably a good idea to assume he's a stupid hipster and avoid catching the disease-stupid from them altogether.


It is true that the MAJORITY of Vegans are **** people..   Just like the Majority of Peoples..



However,  we have very good data, which tells us, Human groups that eat 90%+ PLANT calories,  live ~10-15 years LONGER, and evade almost All leading Causes of Death in (western diet) countries..

Older generation Okinawans (japan), 96%+ Veggie
Modern 7th-day adventist (california), religious nut-bags ~99%+ Veggie

-both groups have significantly reduced rates of western diseases.
- Modern Okinawans lifespan suddenly dropped off, after they opened 14 KFCs on their plot, now their kids eat KFC and drop like flies.



Don't ignore the data,  JUST because you h8 vegans..  I h8 vegans.. it's OK to h8 vegans..     But that doesn't mean you can't Copy what they do right.




Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: Bucake on Thu, 15 June 2017, 20:07:35
what is it about vegan that i'm missing, isn't it only/primarily meat that you want to avoid because there's a lot of fat in it?

i was under the impression that it's mostly the overkill of salt, sugar and fat that's attacking people their health.
seems overkill to go vegan, wouldn't just avoiding only meat be OK? besides, fish for example is pretty healthy, isn't it?

i don't think i would become any healthier if i would switch to a vegan diet.
i'm eating stuff like beef, fish, eggs, milk products.. so am i killing myself with these things? it certainly doesn't feel like it..

just curious. the internet is mostly busy trying to portray any non-vegan diet as a devil's one.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 15 June 2017, 20:30:18
what is it about vegan that i'm missing, isn't it only/primarily meat that you want to avoid because there's a lot of fat in it?

i was under the impression that it's mostly the overkill of salt, sugar and fat that's attacking people their health.
seems overkill to go vegan, wouldn't just avoiding only meat be OK? besides, fish for example is pretty healthy, isn't it?

i don't think i would become any healthier if i would switch to a vegan diet.
i'm eating stuff like beef, fish, eggs, milk products.. so am i killing myself with these things? it certainly doesn't feel like it..

just curious. the internet is mostly busy trying to portray any non-vegan diet as a devil's one.


Completely understand your confusion..


We have 4 major players in the game right now..


The Meat industry -  profit, damn the people

The Animal nuts - animals have rights !!

The Vegans - this makes me cooler than you, hurray i'm so cool

The Scientist - If you eat this this and this, you will die like this,   don't eat this, and you'll be fine,   you will still die, but much later, and most likely NOT from heart disease / cancer / or diabetes



All of these people say different things to support their interests.



Of them all, the scientists are the most impartial..  Here's the information from the research, Do with it what you will..

2 people particularly,  T. Colin Campbell   and  Caldwell Esselstyn  are the best direction to read into if you want the straight dope.

-documentary,  Fork over knives 2011
-book , the China study
-book, Prevent and reverse heart disease



Fat in excess of ~10% of total daily calories, damages the endothelial layer of your blood vessels.

If you eat animals, it will be nearly impossible to get below that threshold.

This layer is key in generating nitrous oxide,  which is the lubricant to keep your vascular system flowing smoothly..

Once this layer is damaged by excess lipids,  it will scar, further leading to buildup..   This is the root cause of coronary artery disease..


Since ONLY animal products have cholesterol, that is why it is not suitable in ANY quantity for human consumption, ASSUMING the intention is to preserve quality of life into age 70s and 80s..


While it IS a choice,  I highly suggest you visit the hospital, and meet some people with heart disease and cancer.. it's god damn awful..

Many of them are --cheerful-- about it,  but really take a step back and look at what's happening to them..

THEN, understand that 1 in 4 people get heart disease,  THEN understand that it's 100% preventable.




Fish is not healthier,  it contains significant calories in fat form, it has cholesterol, and ontop of the lipids problem, the large fish that we eat these days are highly contaminated due to how far they are up the food chain.


When the small fish becomes contaminated, the larger fish eats 1000s of small fish, Concentrating the ocean pollutants.


Humans are on the top of the food chain, so if a human then goes to eat the BIG fish,  he is receiving a Mega dose of ocean contaminants.




Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: dante on Sat, 01 July 2017, 11:22:19
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Sat, 01 July 2017, 19:10:13


Guys,


Please do not get hung up on the Socially -POPULAR-  Vegan Charicatures..


The vegan world is large these days.. in that way, like any other large -Sets- of people..

There are:


- 80% IDIOTs,

- 10% douchebags,

- 5% physically attractive idiots/douchebags, 

- 4% REAL religious (not fake, not idiots, not douchebag), 


- 1% full fledged human beings

Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: futurecrime on Mon, 03 July 2017, 05:45:07
TP4 what is your view on the environmental impact of meat and dairy industry?  I remember it was a big reason for me ditching dairy and did a bunch of research at the time but now can't remember any of it.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: xantiema on Mon, 03 July 2017, 06:48:25
The Modern most common cancers are directly correlated with consumption of animal proteins, and they happen in our Western lifestyles, but NOT in other cultures which eat 0x animals...

The latest info suggest we should not be dying of the common western cancers which are today retiring americans approximately 10-20 years ahead of end of useful healthful lifespan.

How old are you? Chances are you've already damaged your DNA significantly with years of animal protein to make a major difference now. Secondly messing with your fat intakes can seriously damage your health, just as much as having a too high saturated fat diet. I get what you are saying, but if this change is out of fear of dying early, rather than a change in point of view and thus seem half arsed attempt at increasing life span. Your points of ecological vegetables is also not entirely on point. It is true that in our parents time, they contained significantly more micronutrients up to 30-50 times as much, which has since been diminished by industrialization, however the current ones still provide a significant increase over non-ecological ones and can be rationalized buying if you can afford them.

My advice would also be to test how well your body converts plant oils to useable omega 3s etc., as most peoples bodies are at a inefficient in this conversion and would literally be starved of it, no matter the plant quantity intake. People generally eat the fish, which has already done this process en masse.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Mon, 03 July 2017, 09:48:07
The Modern most common cancers are directly correlated with consumption of animal proteins, and they happen in our Western lifestyles, but NOT in other cultures which eat 0x animals...

The latest info suggest we should not be dying of the common western cancers which are today retiring americans approximately 10-20 years ahead of end of useful healthful lifespan.

How old are you? Chances are you've already damaged your DNA significantly with years of animal protein to make a major difference now. Secondly messing with your fat intakes can seriously damage your health, just as much as having a too high saturated fat diet. I get what you are saying, but if this change is out of fear of dying early, rather than a change in point of view and thus seem half arsed attempt at increasing life span. Your points of ecological vegetables is also not entirely on point. It is true that in our parents time, they contained significantly more micronutrients up to 30-50 times as much, which has since been diminished by industrialization, however the current ones still provide a significant increase over non-ecological ones and can be rationalized buying if you can afford them.

My advice would also be to test how well your body converts plant oils to useable omega 3s etc., as most peoples bodies are at a inefficient in this conversion and would literally be starved of it, no matter the plant quantity intake. People generally eat the fish, which has already done this process en masse.



Mice experiments on casein protein  can turn on and off cancer cell promotion rates within time ranges of 2 week trials.

So the effects are quite substantial, and the alternate diet begins to work Immediately. 



Now, No one can say for sure how much DNA damage one has already received,   


Just because you've been poisoning yourself for your entire life,  has no bearing on you CONTINUING to poison yourself..


______________________________________

If you truly believe something that tastes good is reason enough to eat it,   Then why stop there,  Why not become a drug addict.. 


If you live by inconsistent logic, then again, it's a choice, i concur on that,  but you're not really a human being, if you don't exercise the cognitive potential to discern Complex harm from within your base desires.

Koalas don't know about STDs,  so entire large wild populations got chlamydia.

Being humans,  in general, we know not to engage with disease ridden prostitutes, Though of course like you said,  SOME people DO.. **


Eating animal products is the same, it's full of disease and cancer..

**(This doesn't of course make prostitutes bad people, they're mostly good people fallen on hard times)
____________________________________


What really sets humans apart from animals is this aspect of forward looking and adhesion to greater logic.


It's not wrong to call it a Choice, And perhaps the sociologists are ok with most people dying around 60 70,  because that greatly reduces resource consumption and potential for political upheaval.


________________________________________

As for testing for how well you convert Omega 3s, this is completely irrelevant. You don't need that much of it,  and the quantity is easily satisfied with walnuts which has it by the boat load..

The original fake research promoting omega 3 was mainly a product of fish oil industry funding,

it's complete bull**** and fish oil has NOT done anything positive according to years of research.

With fish, you're getting the same antibiotic resistant disease potentials, the same cholesterol, the same saturated fats,  the same cancer promoting protein profiles..


____________________________________

Again,  I do believe natural humans are omnivores and eat whatever they can , be it land animals or fish, but remember, these guys DIE at age 35- 50,  that's as far as natural evolution has designed the system.


We know NOW, that Old age is a consequence of Society and Intellect,   and it requires a trade off at the dinner table.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: xtrafrood on Mon, 03 July 2017, 10:38:17
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/wMoBy4b.png)


Found on reddit, had a raugh

lol, that's literally what would need to happen to flip the worldwide vegan switch atm
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Mon, 03 July 2017, 10:48:21
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/wMoBy4b.png)


Found on reddit, had a raugh

lol, that's literally what would need to happen to flip the worldwide vegan switch atm


I deeply fear an unstable government once enough healthy old people exist..


Healthy old people are 3 things,   

--- They're relatively wealthy
--- They're NOT STUPID/Naive like young people
--- They can't be manipulated like young people with a mortgage


You get enough of these guys,  the government can't possible contain their influence,  because their collective competence and wealth is enough to challenge their masters.


Japan seems to be dealing with the problem by creating poverty for their elderly..  cutting pensions etc, perhaps this is the route the US will take, if it can't kill off its old people at the 60 year mark through diet.


I should clarify,     OLD people are not a threat to government,  they're a threat to Government-as-it-is-now,   where the top down oligarchy rules supreme through cohesion and debt creation.

Old people living through their time past 60 won't have any debt,  Nor would they be so afraid to walk away from debt, and say fuk it..  I won't pay,  what are you going to do,  give a 60yr old guy bad credit,   He's not going to care. hahahahahaha
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: futurecrime on Fri, 07 July 2017, 10:01:45
My dad Whatsapp'd me yesterday to tell me he's vegan now. Good luck with that. He lives in a small town in the south of France. However, he's a lifetime meat and cheese fanatic, and the decision is all for his arteries, so maybe this stuff is catching on.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 07 July 2017, 10:11:42
My dad Whatsapp'd me yesterday to tell me he's vegan now. Good luck with that. He lives in a small town in the south of France. However, he's a lifetime meat and cheese fanatic, and the decision is all for his arteries, so maybe this stuff is catching on.

That's absolutely the best thing he could be doing for his heart condition..


Make sure to exchange some dialogue on Less than 10% of total calories from fat.

approximately 22g of oil per day Maximum !!!!.. 


For example, if you ate 20% calories from fat,   you're gonna clog your arteries all the same.


Most heart disease ridden americans are consuming around the 25-40% range.. something like 50 to 100 grams of fat daily.

at this rate,  it gives them a 50% odds of developing heart disease and 50% chance of developing cancer.


This is the hardest part of being not only a vegan but a HEALTHY vegan.


Southern france,  do you guys eat super greasy over there  like america ?


Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: futurecrime on Fri, 07 July 2017, 10:28:53
My dad Whatsapp'd me yesterday to tell me he's vegan now. Good luck with that. He lives in a small town in the south of France. However, he's a lifetime meat and cheese fanatic, and the decision is all for his arteries, so maybe this stuff is catching on.

That's absolutely the best thing he could be doing for his heart condition..


Make sure to exchange some dialogue on Less than 10% of total calories from fat.

approximately 22g of oil per day TOTAL.. 


For example, if you ate 20% calories from fat,   you're gonna clog your arteries all the same.


Most heart disease ridden americans are consuming around the 25-40% range.. something like 50 to 100 grams of fat daily.

at this rate,  it gives them a 50% odds of developing heart disease and 50% chance of developing cancer.


This is the hardest part of being not only a vegan but a HEALTHY vegan.


Southern france,  do you guys eat super greasy over there  like america ?

I don't live in France but I've been to where he lives and it's all meat, cheese and wine, like anywhere in France, but without the alternative options you might be able to find in big cities. Not particularly greasy I guess, but very fatty.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 07 July 2017, 10:32:54

I don't live in France but I've been to where he lives and it's all meat, cheese and wine, like anywhere in France, but without the alternative options you might be able to find in big cities. Not particularly greasy I guess, but very fatty.

Does he and your mother have a good relationship ?

She's gonna need to create entirely new menus for him..


But you know, if she h8s him, she could be slowly poisoning him with arsenic like in that french movie i saw once..  hahahahahaha



Pasta, Rice, Potato, Bright colored vegetables.

Make sure to keep it at   4 to 7 g   of cooking oil per meal Maximum..


Cheese, meats, fish, chocolate, milk, bacon, eggs,  have to be strictly removed.


IDK if it's been translated into french,  but


Prevent and Reserve Heart disease by esselstyn..


Must read for anyone on the edge..

Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: futurecrime on Fri, 07 July 2017, 11:21:53

I don't live in France but I've been to where he lives and it's all meat, cheese and wine, like anywhere in France, but without the alternative options you might be able to find in big cities. Not particularly greasy I guess, but very fatty.

Does he and your mother have a good relationship ?

She's gonna need to create entirely new menus for him..


But you know, if she h8s him, she could be slowly poisoning him with arsenic like in that french movie i saw once..  hahahahahaha



Pasta, Rice, Potato, Bright colored vegetables.

Make sure to keep it at   4 to 7 g   of cooking oil per meal Maximum..


Cheese, meats, fish, chocolate, milk, bacon, eggs,  have to be strictly removed.


IDK if it's been translated into french,  but


Prevent and Reserve Heart disease by esselstyn..


Must read for anyone on the edge..

They're divorced and he's remarried. Don't know if his partner has gone vegan but they share cooking duties pretty evenly I think. I'm just messaging with him now and it turns out it was ultimately an ethical decision, which is surprising. Although he's well aware of, and appreciates, the health benefits for his dodgy heart.

Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: xtrafrood on Fri, 07 July 2017, 11:26:30

I don't live in France but I've been to where he lives and it's all meat, cheese and wine, like anywhere in France, but without the alternative options you might be able to find in big cities. Not particularly greasy I guess, but very fatty.

Does he and your mother have a good relationship ?

She's gonna need to create entirely new menus for him..


But you know, if she h8s him, she could be slowly poisoning him with arsenic like in that french movie i saw once..  hahahahahaha



Pasta, Rice, Potato, Bright colored vegetables.

Make sure to keep it at   4 to 7 g   of cooking oil per meal Maximum..


Cheese, meats, fish, chocolate, milk, bacon, eggs,  have to be strictly removed.


IDK if it's been translated into french,  but


Prevent and Reserve Heart disease by esselstyn..


Must read for anyone on the edge..

They're divorced and he's remarried. Don't know if his partner has gone vegan but they share cooking duties pretty evenly I think. I'm just messaging with him now and it turns out it was ultimately an ethical decision, which is surprising. Although he's well aware of, and appreciates, the health benefits for his dodgy heart.

I can only imagine how difficult it must be to avoid saturated and trans fat
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 07 July 2017, 11:38:52

I can only imagine how difficult it must be to avoid saturated and trans fat



Fats are Super Delicious,   and in the quantities we eat today , they're all bad for you , saturated/ unsaturated/ poly/ mono..   ALL BAD..
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: ander on Fri, 07 July 2017, 15:01:49
They're actually putting vegans on trial now? Sheesh. The Drumpf era of steak-eating planet destroyers (https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/jun/02/un-report-meat-free-diet) must be in full effect now.

I dunno about you, but sometimes I get the creeps, realizing I'm walking among creatures who are, for the most part, carnivores. It also explains why we're so aggressive toward each other, and toward our planet: Carnivores need to be in charge, to be the bosses of everything.
Title: Re: Vegan Trials
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 07 July 2017, 15:53:19
They're actually putting vegans on trial now? Sheesh. The Drumpf era of steak-eating planet destroyers (https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/jun/02/un-report-meat-free-diet) must be in full effect now.

I dunno about you, but sometimes I get the creeps, realizing I'm walking among creatures who are, for the most part, carnivores. It also explains why we're so aggressive toward each other, and toward our planet: Carnivores need to be in charge, to be the bosses of everything.


That's not correct,  you go up to a gorilla , he'll beat the **** out of you..  gorillas only eat fruits and veggies..