Should I invest in a Topre

[Laurel]

When is the Leopold fc980 available?

[xtrafrood]

When is the Leopold fc980 available?

Mechanicalkeyboards.com has an ETA of 11/10/2016 but I've noticed quite a few reviews on youtube. Maybe Leopold shipped to some mainland shops first?

[mushman]

I've tried all the Topre keyboards and concluded that I prefer Plum (clones) better.

After 30 minutes to an hour of continuous typing on Topre my hands/wrists start to feel pain.  I don't know if this is because Topre is using a thicker more rigid metal backplate but I have absolutely no troubles whatsoever on Plum boards.

In addition Plum opens up options that Topre doesn't want to explore (ie: fullsize 55g/62g, tenkeyless 35g, etc...)

Topre may in fact be "higher quality" but for typing I can't go the distance on them.

[iamtootallforthis]

I really enjoy Topre. I have a 55g Type-S HHKB. Looking forward to getting a hold of the FC980C and I also want to get a Silenced 55g UB.

[Hypersphere]

Before buying my first Topre-switch keyboard, I read countless reviews and watched a number of videos. I was intrigued by the HHKB, but initially afraid of the layout. So, at first, I went with a compromise -- the Leopold FC660C. I liked the sound and feel of the Leopold, but at the time the keycap choices for this keyboard were limited to the stock brown and gold caps, and I didn't particularly like the layout. So, I gave the Leopold away and got a RF87UB45.

I wanted to try a heavier switch, so I got an RF87UB55. Finally, after agonizing over the seemingly alien layout, I went for a HHKB Pro 2. I liked it instantly -- the 60% form factor, the design and styling, the excellent dye-sublimated PBT keycaps, and especially the layout.

Since then, my keyboard collection has grown exponentially, and I have just about every form factor, layout, and switch type imaginable. I have an active keyboard rotation that includes quite a few boards, but I always come back to my all-time favorite, the HHKB.

All my Topre-switch boards are now lubed and silenced with my own Silencing Rings, which I think makes them even better, but the stock boards are quite nice to use as well. I have modded one of my HHKB boards to 55g domes -- it is fine, but I slightly prefer the stock 45g. I also have a Novatouch, but I prefer the RF87UB45 or RF87UB55. I have never tried a Type Heaven.

The RF87 boards provide a refined typing experience, but the HHKB is more fun. The difference between the two is sort of like driving a luxury sedan vs. a sports car.

If you happen not to like your Topre board, they have excellent resale value. You could then go for other premium switches, such as IBM Model F, IBM Model M, or various flavors of Alps and Alps clones. My own current ranking is approximately as follows:

Topre 45g ~ Topre 55g ~ IBM Model F > SKCM blue Alps ~ SKCM white Alps >  IBM Model M > Matias Click > Matias Quiet> SKCM brown Alps > >> Gateron yellow >> Cherry mx red

Good luck!

[E3E]

Topre 45g ~ Topre 55g ~ IBM Model F > SKCM blue Alps ~ SKCM white Alps >  IBM Model M > Matias Click > Matias Quiet> SKCM brown Alps > >> Gateron yellow >> Cherry mx red

Good luck!

Hypersphere:

What causes Alps SKCM Brown to be placed so low on the list for you? I ask because many people consider it to be very reminiscent of Topre and enjoy it for the similarities they share. Is it simply too stiff for your liking?

It's certainly a lot louder, but I do feel they are similar. It's funny how preferences form for switch types. I much prefer Alps over Topre, though I do enjoy Topre. I think if I had found Topre first, I might've liked it more.

[y11971alex]

Hypersphere, I already have both buckling spring switches and some experience with Alps

[Hypersphere]

@E3E: I probably shouldn't attempt to rank-order my switch preferences! The difference in preference among some of them is very slight, and the order frequently changes, depending upon the phase of the moon and the relative humidity.

Sometimes I really relish typing on my brown Alps board. There's a lot to like about it, including my favorite form factor (60%) and layout (HHKB). The brown Alps switches are a lot of fun -- the tactility is amazing. However, with a small unyielding stainless steel plate, the board gets fatiguing after a while.

@y11971alex: My apologies for telling you what you already knew. I sometimes go overboard with providing a full context for my explanations. If you try Topre, let us know how you like it compared to other switches.

It is really difficult to compare switches per se. So much depends upon the particular keyboard in which they are installed and, particularly with Alps, the history of the switches including how much dirt and wear they might have accumulated. Indeed, today I have been comparing two Leading Edge DC-3014 keyboards. Both boards have SKCM blue Alps switches. The only differences are that one case has been painted and the keycaps are different, yet I find that the boards have noticeable differences in feel and sound. Doing a side by side comparison, I can choose a favorite. Yes, I like the blue Alps better than the blue Alps!

[Bucake]

i enjoy your posts hypersphere
always nicely written sentences and sound formatting, just great to read

[E3E]

@E3E: I probably shouldn't attempt to rank-order my switch preferences! The difference in preference among some of them is very slight, and the order frequently changes, depending upon the phase of the moon and the relative humidity.

Sometimes I really relish typing on my brown Alps board. There's a lot to like about it, including my favorite form factor (60%) and layout (HHKB). The brown Alps switches are a lot of fun -- the tactility is amazing. However, with a small unyielding stainless steel plate, the board gets fatiguing after a while.

@y11971alex: My apologies for telling you what you already knew. I sometimes go overboard with providing a full context for my explanations. If you try Topre, let us know how you like it compared to other switches.

It is really difficult to compare switches per se. So much depends upon the particular keyboard in which they are installed and, particularly with Alps, the history of the switches including how much dirt and wear they might have accumulated. Indeed, today I have been comparing two Leading Edge DC-3014 keyboards. Both boards have SKCM blue Alps switches. The only differences are that one case has been painted and the keycaps are different, yet I find that the boards have noticeable differences in feel and sound. Doing a side by side comparison, I can choose a favorite. Yes, I like the blue Alps better than the blue Alps!

Oh wow, do you mean your Leading Edge DC-2014 or did you actually pick up a second Leading Edge DC-3014?

Yes, I completely agree, Hypersphere, it is very difficult to compare switches outright. There are objective differences between each kind of switch which can lead to a more general preference, but keyboards are always more than just a sum of their parts. Echoing how you feel about Alps SKCM Browns in a stiff plate, I felt very much the same way with Alps SKCM Amber when I used them in a keyboard with a carbon fiber plate and just felt they were way too harsh for my fingers. 
 
Alps seem to have a more delicate relation with case and plate material other switches. I can at least say that I've never felt that Cherry MX Clears were too harsh depending on plate material. Alps, however... Yeah, very sensitive to plate material and case.

[Hypersphere]

Thanks, Bucake!

@E3E: Yes, I was very lucky in being able to find a second DC-3014 soon after the first. I will post some pics and impressions soon.

[moh18one]

Leopold FC980C all day all night ! The layout is quite impressive. Wow can't wait more to get this keyboard

[E3E]

Using my Ducky Realforce and it's always nice to type on. I see it as a board I can use to take a break from my other mechanical keyboards, kind of like a palate cleanser.

I don't like Topre more than Alps, but there is something luxurious-feeling about it. Probably influenced a bit by the price tag and the premium quality that surrounds Topre. I just think it's got a refined feel for a dome with slider board. It's a blend of interesting tech to come together into something that does have a luxurious feel.

I think Topre, for me, is a bit nostalgic but also a foil to rubber dome boards I grew up with. I love scissor switches, still, and these remind me of those, but they also make me conscious of the fact that a rubber dome can be great if designed well. Topre's design is pretty clever in how it imbues the characteristics of a traditional mechanical switch (slider, actuation that doesn't require full travel, etc) into a slider with dome design.

[y11971alex]

Elitekeyboards.com remains out of stock at February.  It looks like I'll be going for a Type Heaven

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/172486403870

[happylacquer]

Elitekeyboards.com remains out of stock at February.  It looks like I'll be going for a Type Heaven

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/172486403870

Despite what everyone says complaining about the Type Heaven, it seems perfectly fine to me. I plan to get one soon to complement my HHKB.

[zslane]

I wouldn't exactly call a Type Heaven an investment. But it is certainly a decent way to dip one's toes into the Topre waters.

[y11971alex]

I wouldn't exactly call a Type Heaven an investment. But it is certainly a decent way to dip one's toes into the Topre waters.

In case I don't like the Realforce, I can sell it for around 80% of its purchase value, right?

[1391406]

I wouldn't exactly call a Type Heaven an investment. But it is certainly a decent way to dip one's toes into the Topre waters.

In case I don't like the Realforce, I can sell it for around 80% of its purchase value, right?

You should know fairly rapidly whether you like it. If you use it for a day or two and don't like it, sell it. 75% - 80% of the original cost isn't unreasonable assuming you package it up neatly in the original box and sell it as a like new item.

[1391406]

By the way, all of the 104U's on EK are listed as in stock.

[y11971alex]

By the way, all of the 104U's on EK are listed as in stock.

But I don't want to buy the variable weight ones 

[happylacquer]

I wouldn't exactly call a Type Heaven an investment. But it is certainly a decent way to dip one's toes into the Topre waters.

 


Even for some of us keyboard fans 120 is a decent chunk of change

[y11971alex]

I wouldn't exactly call a Type Heaven an investment. But it is certainly a decent way to dip one's toes into the Topre waters.

 


Even for some of us keyboard fans 120 is a decent chunk of change

Well, the keyboard hobby for me is auto-financing.  Which means I do, as a matter of fact, by some keyboards as investments.

[happylacquer]

I wouldn't exactly call a Type Heaven an investment. But it is certainly a decent way to dip one's toes into the Topre waters.

 


Even for some of us keyboard fans 120 is a decent chunk of change

Well, the keyboard hobby for me is auto-financing.  Which means I do, as a matter of fact, by some keyboards as investments.

Nice I do that with headphones. I have been selling headphone mods for years and it has paid off nicely.

[zslane]

I wouldn't exactly call a Type Heaven an investment. But it is certainly a decent way to dip one's toes into the Topre waters.

 


Even for some of us keyboard fans 120 is a decent chunk of change

Well, the keyboard hobby for me is auto-financing.  Which means I do, as a matter of fact, by some keyboards as investments.

Sure. I just wouldn't expect a Type Heaven to qualify as one. It is unlikely to ever fetch more than you paid for it, adjusting for inflation.

[1391406]

By the way, all of the 104U's on EK are listed as in stock.

But I don't want to buy the variable weight ones 

You can always buy one from Taobao with the help of a purchasing agent such as taobaofocus.com.

[happylacquer]

By the way, all of the 104U's on EK are listed as in stock.

But I don't want to buy the variable weight ones 

You can always buy one from Taobao with the help of a purchasing agent such as taobaofocus.com.

This and whatever you do, don't use mistertao. They're a bunch of ****ers.

[y11971alex]

I am quite able to deal in Chinese, so I don't need a proxy.  In fact, I'd be happy to be a proxy for anyone here.   

[ArchDill]

By the way, all of the 104U's on EK are listed as in stock.

But I don't want to buy the variable weight ones 

You can always buy one from Taobao with the help of a purchasing agent such as taobaofocus.com.

I just looked into this... So you pay the first price and then do you pay something again when it is delivered to the Proxy?

[y11971alex]

Many of the Topre listings on Taobao are in fact proxy purchases.  So if you use a proxy on these items, they'll be imported from Japan to China and then shipped to wherever you live.  Shipping and handling will take time.

Generally speaking, I expect shipments to arrive from China in around 8 working days.

[happylacquer]

By the way, all of the 104U's on EK are listed as in stock.

But I don't want to buy the variable weight ones 

You can always buy one from Taobao with the help of a purchasing agent such as taobaofocus.com.

I just looked into this... So you pay the first price and then do you pay something again when it is delivered to the Proxy?

in my experience you pay for the items and domestic shipping, when they get everything, they figure out shipping rates to you and tell you what you owe for shipping to you.

[MperorM]

as someone who just bought a leopold fc890c from a shop in korea, I would say that you should do everything in your power to try it out first. Topre really is a unique keyboard feeling. My daily driver is a stiff alps keyboard, so usually I lean towards heavy, stiff and clicky switches that make a lot of noise when you press them. However I went into the store without any intention of buying anything and the   45 g topre switches completely won me over. They feel absolutely amazing to type on, fantastic sound, amazing feel. I would describe them like this: Imagine a rubber dome keyboard if it felt good to type on.

However I can absolutely imagine that someone might hate topres, and I think that a lot of people who buy them feel complied to love them after shelling out 200-300 dollar for them. I would never blindly buy a topre board, and I would never have bought them if I didn't have a chance to try them out first. I did not expect to like them at all, since they are pretty much the opposite of the usual switches I prefer, but I made a 180 on them.

[1391406]

I think that a lot of people who buy them feel complied to love them after shelling out 200-300 dollar for them.

I can see that being the case for something you can't recoup most of your money on, but that's not true for Topre.

[y11971alex]

I have something along the lines of a 87-key model with 55g domes incoming. 

[Hypersphere]

as someone who just bought a leopold fc890c from a shop in korea, I would say that you should do everything in your power to try it out first. Topre really is a unique keyboard feeling. My daily driver is a stiff alps keyboard, so usually I lean towards heavy, stiff and clicky switches that make a lot of noise when you press them. However I went into the store without any intention of buying anything and the   45 g topre switches completely won me over. They feel absolutely amazing to type on, fantastic sound, amazing feel. I would describe them like this: Imagine a rubber dome keyboard if it felt good to type on.

However I can absolutely imagine that someone might hate topres, and I think that a lot of people who buy them feel complied to love them after shelling out 200-300 dollar for them. I would never blindly buy a topre board, and I would never have bought them if I didn't have a chance to try them out first. I did not expect to like them at all, since they are pretty much the opposite of the usual switches I prefer, but I made a 180 on them.

This doesn't seem strange to me at all. In my own case, my favorite switches before I started using Topre on a regular basis were IBM membrane buckling spring (Model M) and IBM capacitive buckling spring (Model F). After trying Topre, I added Topre 45g and 55g to my favorites list. More recently, I have added clicky Alps (blue, white, and clicky hybrids) to the list. The common thread among these seemingly disparate switch types appears to be a similar sort of tactility.

Topre didn't cause me to abandon other tactile switches, but now I spend most of my typing time on my HHKB Pro 2. The others are in my keyboard rotation, but I always gladly return to Topre in general and the HHKB in particular.

[evilpacket]

topres are worth it.
usually considered pleasant to type on by most people, or at least before they see the pricetag...

[1391406]

You can see a small sampling of the keyboards I've tried in my signature, and of all the ones I've used I ended up settling on Topre.

[y11971alex]

[kmba]

You did it! 

Hope you're enjoying it. 

I fully disagree with the notion that people hype topre boards, or are prone to "like them" just because they shell out over $200.  My modded fc660c is my least costly board aside from the Model Ms I've owned for 30 years!!!  And yet it's my daily driver.  thock.


thock.

[yuppie]

Answer is still: yes

[1391406]

Now that you have one, what do you think?

[y11971alex]

I'll quote my post on Deskthority.

It's not the smoothest, the most tactile, or the best built keyboard, but it scores very high on all these aspects.  IMO, it combines almost all keyboard virtues in an unassuming, convenient package.  It is a very well-rounded keyboard.

I think we can all name keyboards that score higher than the Realforce in any one or more than one of these aspects, but to name one that beats the Realforce squarely on all these aspects, it would be a challenge.  In terms of switch feel, beam springs are definitely smoother, more tactile, more pleasant to type on, and (much) better build quality, but you make sacrifices on layout and ergonomics (or lack thereof) with beam springs. 

[E3E]

I've always enjoyed Realforce as a palate cleanser to my Alps collection, especially since mine is the silenced variant, so the contrast in loudness is much more noticeable. I have to say though, my NCR Alps board is very quiet for using standard (not dampened) Alps switches. It's probably as quiet as a stock Realforce. I think it's a mixture of the case and the thick ABS caps that do it. 
 
But the Realforce is nice. The mysticism built around Topre made me imagine something much greater than it really is (which is why I sold my variable Topre board almost right after receiving it), but it is a good switch. It's high quality in contrast to its contemporaries, essentially one of the few OEM keyboards that bring the build quality of premium keyboards from the '80s into the present.

Despite using rubber domes, I don't find them to be the most comfortable switch out there. I'd say Alps Plate Spring is the most comfortable switch I've ever used. I agree with Alex that the Realforce is just very well-rounded, which makes for a pleasant experience.