how to bend or cut music wire?

[jonathanyu]

I got my music wire today, and I try to bend a 90 degree angle by du bro ez bender, but it broke every time just before get to 90 degree. 
so what kind of bender can I use for bending music wire? and what kind of cutter can I use to cut music wire?

[metalliqaz]

That bender is worthless for bending stabilizers.  It is meant for softer metal.
The only way that I've been able to produce working stab wires is to use a bench vise with good pliers and a hammer.

[jonathanyu]

That bender is worthless for bending stabilizers.  It is meant for softer metal.
The only way that I've been able to produce working stab wires is to use a bench vise with good pliers and a hammer.

That's what I am thinking too, maybe I should just use a hammer and vise.
By the way, instead of wire can I use for the stabilizer?

[PointyFox]

Cheap bladed wire cutters will cut it, but will get dulled fast.  They'll still cut while dulled though provided you distribute the cutting along the entire length of the blade.  Wire cutters with tungsten carbide inserts will also cut it and won't get dulled as fast, but they are much more expensive.  If you don't mind a little loss in cutting accuracy, you should get shear cutters.  They last a long time and are cheap, but it's hard to cut with high accuracy.  Shear cutters look like this:
.
They squeeze the wire between the jaws which move in opposite directions passed each other, creating shear force on the wire which breaks it.

Bladed cutters come in different grades of how flat they cut the wire:
.
This is only really a concern if you need a smoother end or if you want to reduce shock when cutting.  The most flush cut is usually called by a trademark name like in that picture.  Since you'll be cutting music wire which is much harder than normal wire, this amount of pinching will increase as the blades get dull, which makes choice of flatness irrelevant unless you pick something that won't dull fast like carbide cutters.  I still recommend shear cutters for this application however.

[jonathanyu]

Cheap bladed wire cutters will cut it, but will get dulled fast.  They'll still cut while dulled though provided you distribute the cutting along the entire length of the blade.  Wire cutters with tungsten carbide inserts will also cut it and won't get dulled as fast, but they are much more expensive.  If you don't mind a little loss in cutting accuracy, you should get shear cutters.  They last a long time and are cheap, but it's hard to cut with high accuracy.  Shear cutters look like this:

Show Image

.
They squeeze the wire between the jaws which move in opposite directions passed each other, creating shear force on the wire which breaks it.

Bladed cutters come in different grades of how flat they cut the wire:

Show Image

.
This is only really a concern if you need a smoother end or if you want to reduce shock when cutting.  The most flush cut is usually called by a trademark name like in that picture.  Since you'll be cutting music wire which is much harder than normal wire, this amount of pinching will increase as the blades get dull, which makes choice of flatness irrelevant unless you pick something that won't dull fast like carbide cutters.  I still recommend shear cutters for this application however.

so shear cutters will able to cut music wire? one more question, can I use brass rod for the stabilizer instead of music wire?

[mkawa]

get full carbide flush cutters for music wire. they should be sharp enough and not dull for quite a few cycles. and when they do dull you can hand sharpen them. you want FULL carbide though. wiha has exactly one pair of carbide flush cutters and they're unsharpenable because they're only carbide coated. i got a pair from edsyn (they have an entire line of carbide cutter made in switzerland/sweden that is full carbide with _excellent_ joints that challenge the drop forged box joints of the wiha germany stuff.

note that i may be carrying a small selection of these cutters in the future. they're head and shoulders above the wiha thailand stuff for very close prices.

[mkawa]

also keep in mind that flush cutters, even carbide ones are generally only up to 2mm wire. if you go past that, you want hammer/anvil style cutters. they aren't as accurate when trying to flush cut, but you can sand the wire down flat after you cut. i know the wiha professional pair was on sale recently and i got one for fairly cheap (and it wasn't wiha thailand, it was either wiha italy or wiha germany), and i've been pretty happy with it. it's definitely my go-to for really thick wire.

[jonathanyu]

also keep in mind that flush cutters, even carbide ones are generally only up to 2mm wire. if you go past that, you want hammer/anvil style cutters. they aren't as accurate when trying to flush cut, but you can sand the wire down flat after you cut. i know the wiha professional pair was on sale recently and i got one for fairly cheap (and it wasn't wiha thailand, it was either wiha italy or wiha germany), and i've been pretty happy with it. it's definitely my go-to for really thick wire.

Do you have a link of the full carbide flush cutters? I have checked edsyn, but I can only find carbide coated

[PointyFox]

also keep in mind that flush cutters, even carbide ones are generally only up to 2mm wire. if you go past that, you want hammer/anvil style cutters. they aren't as accurate when trying to flush cut, but you can sand the wire down flat after you cut. i know the wiha professional pair was on sale recently and i got one for fairly cheap (and it wasn't wiha thailand, it was either wiha italy or wiha germany), and i've been pretty happy with it. it's definitely my go-to for really thick wire.

I wouldn't go to 2mm with carbide cutters.  Max wire diameter for cutters also depends on the hardness of what you're cutting.  Full flush cutting reduces the max wire diameter even more since the blades will have a finer edge.  I've looked everywhere for cutters that could flush cut medical wire, and found that the max rating was 0.508mm diameter wire.  Any larger and the blades are likely to chip.

[Thimplum]

[jonathanyu]

Show Image

Actually I have thought this before. ^-^. But seems too much for a tiny wire

[Thimplum]

Show Image

Actually I have thought this before. ^-^. But seems too much for a tiny wire

If you get a small torch head, it's perfect.

[Neebio]

If you don't want to go full size propane torch, you could probably manage the same result with a butane lighter.  Lots of heat, much smaller form factor!

[Thimplum]

If you don't want to go full size propane torch, you could probably manage the same result with a butane lighter.  Lots of heat, much smaller form factor!

I suppose that's possible too.

[TheSoulhunter]

Humm, even the tungsten-carbide ones in the 100 Euro range have a rating below 2mm for piano wire...
Why not simply using an angle-grinder or Dremel with a cutting disc? Discs are cheap, replacement cutters not so much.

[PointyFox]

You don't need tungsten carbide unless you're mass-producing these things.  Just get something cheap that is rated for "piano wire".  It will get dull, but it should cut for quite a while after dulling.

[mkawa]

also keep in mind that flush cutters, even carbide ones are generally only up to 2mm wire. if you go past that, you want hammer/anvil style cutters. they aren't as accurate when trying to flush cut, but you can sand the wire down flat after you cut. i know the wiha professional pair was on sale recently and i got one for fairly cheap (and it wasn't wiha thailand, it was either wiha italy or wiha germany), and i've been pretty happy with it. it's definitely my go-to for really thick wire.

I wouldn't go to 2mm with carbide cutters.  Max wire diameter for cutters also depends on the hardness of what you're cutting.  Full flush cutting reduces the max wire diameter even more since the blades will have a finer edge.  I've looked everywhere for cutters that could flush cut medical wire, and found that the max rating was 0.508mm diameter wire.  Any larger and the blades are likely to chip.

welllll i have a semi-flush i cut 2mm COPPER wire with sometimes, but i also hand sharpen my cutters and blades, and generally i use one of the various gigantor cutters i have for anything over 14ga solid of any alloy

what is medical wire made out of?

[mkawa]

ok, so for reference it looks like music wire is high carbon steel, whereas medical wire is either stainless (sometimes braided stainless -- OUCH), or a variety of precious extremely hard alloys that mostly involve titanium. OUCH.

high carbon steel is not a huge deal, but you are only going to be cutting that with a carbide cutter and if you want it flush, you're not going to get a whole lot of cuts out of any tool before you need to sharpen it. stainless is trickier. carbide should work but again, fewer cycles before you will need to sharpen depending on the alloy. hence, you want full carbide cutters, not carbide coated (in fact most of the precious metal tools out there, nit/tin drill bits for example, are only like 9-10 microns of coating). yah.

i would say the best way to go is a big fat gigantor cutter or anything that will make the cut, then abrasives to get it flush. a non-flush but effective cutter and then working up to very high grit abrasives is going to get you an even better flush finish than anything but the sharpest highest leverage pure alumina forged from heaven flush cutter on the planet.

[jonathanyu]

also keep in mind that flush cutters, even carbide ones are generally only up to 2mm wire. if you go past that, you want hammer/anvil style cutters. they aren't as accurate when trying to flush cut, but you can sand the wire down flat after you cut. i know the wiha professional pair was on sale recently and i got one for fairly cheap (and it wasn't wiha thailand, it was either wiha italy or wiha germany), and i've been pretty happy with it. it's definitely my go-to for really thick wire.

I wouldn't go to 2mm with carbide cutters.  Max wire diameter for cutters also depends on the hardness of what you're cutting.  Full flush cutting reduces the max wire diameter even more since the blades will have a finer edge.  I've looked everywhere for cutters that could flush cut medical wire, and found that the max rating was 0.508mm diameter wire.  Any larger and the blades are likely to chip.

welllll i have a semi-flush i cut 2mm COPPER wire with sometimes, but i also hand sharpen my cutters and blades, and generally i use one of the various gigantor cutters i have for anything over 14ga solid of any alloy

what is medical wire made out of?

Copper wire or music wire harder? If they are the same size?

[Neebio]

-- snip --

Copper wire or music wire harder? If they are the same size?

Copper is much softer than steel/stainless.  That is to say, music wire will be harder than copper if they are the same size.

[jonathanyu]

-- snip --

Copper wire or music wire harder? If they are the same size?

Copper is much softer than steel/stainless.  That is to say, music wire will be harder than copper if they are the same size.

Thanks! I asked this question because I an thinking of use copper instead of music wire for the stabilizer

[Neebio]

I should clarify: copper is much softer than steel/stainless, or whatever music wire is made of.  It is probably not durable enough to stand up to being a stabilizer for very long.

[hoggy]

Which begs the question of what could we use instead of music wire?

[jonathanyu]

I should clarify: copper is much softer than steel/stainless, or whatever music wire is made of.  It is probably not durable enough to stand up to being a stabilizer for very long.

Um..maybe I will make one by copper and one by music wire, and get a compare

[wcass]

thanks for the info - i was getting into this too for IBM 122 model F stabilizer.

the spacebar for the 122 F is just like the 7x "long" spacebar for a 101 model M but the F has a much smaller diameter stabilizer and you can't get the F spacebar or stabilizer any more.

so i had this idea to use thin stainless wire and stainless micro tubing. i put the M gauge micro tubing over the F gauge wire where it fits into the M spacebar. and i cut wire and tubing using a Dremel cut wheel.


by the way, i have enough wire and tubing to do a lot more if anyone needs one.

[PointyFox]

Copper is much softer than regular stainless steel, which is softer than music wire, which is softer than some medical wires which often contain tungsten.

[mkawa]

music wire  looks like it's mostly stainless to me. it could be a marginally harder stainless alloy, (one of the exotic high 3 series), but it looks like basically stainless steel. medical wire is either stainless (no doubt an exotic grade), or it's NiT (sometimes referred to TiN), a titanium nichel chromium alloy, which is hard as crap

edit: one also needs to distinguish between rockwell hardness, which is a surface property (you only need a 10um RMS layer to pass high rockwell tests) as opposed to bulk material with very high shear strength as per ASTM. aluminum feather shafting, for example, is aluminum (low rockwell hardness and low shear strength) covered with 10um RMS or slightly more of ceramic. that ceramic often as rockwell hardness of like 70-90. ie, hard as CRAP. once you shave off the coating though, it's just aluminum, and has the usual crappy aluminum mechanical properties.