THINKpad or FRYpad?

[EverythingIBM]

Here's a screenshot of my thinkpad's temps:

The first one is when I did a few minor CPU things, and the second was on idle.

I knew it ran hot, but, that's pretty bad. Shame on lenovo for not making a better cooling system.
EDIT: humorously lenovo did add extra preforations under the CPU area in the T61 line.
The strange thing is, it doesn't feel that hot at all, I often have it on my lap and it's only moderately warm. Doesn't get hot to the point you can SMELL it like macbooks.

And yes, I have it sitting on an open wooden table, airflow is fine.

The bad thing is, I can't really do anything to improve the CPU temperature... unless I want the first water cooled laptop.

And I "think" my "think"pad's hard drive is getting to the point of dying. I need a thinkpad 701c

[EverythingIBM]

I actually got it down to 45C on both cores.

I simply tweaked the fan settings in power manager.

[ch_123]

EDIT: humorously lenovo did add extra preforations under the CPU area in the T61 line.

So when IBM fixes something it's good, when Lenovo fixes something it's 'humorous'?

Hmm...

[Manyak]

Which model is that?

My T401 (i7 620M) doesn't go past 65C when left at 100% load for an hour. I did open it up and replace the thermal paste with MX-2 though.

[kishy]

I don't feel so bad anymore. I don't think I've topped 65 and I've got no TIM at all, plus what I'd call a pretty loose HSF.

[elservo]

I don't feel so bad anymore. I don't think I've topped 65 and I've got no TIM at all, plus what I'd call a pretty loose HSF.

You speak in riddles just to confuse me, don't you.

[kishy]

You speak in riddles just to confuse me, don't you.

Of course.

[EverythingIBM]

Which model is that?

My T401 (i7 620M) doesn't go past 65C when left at 100% load for an hour. I did open it up and replace the thermal paste with MX-2 though.

It's a T60p.

I didn't do any thermal paste replacements; although that would be nice. I'm thinking of arctic silver:
http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/PID-MX2967%28ME%29.aspx
It would be nice if I had a crap computer to test so I could get the hang of applying thermal paste. Maybe I should bring one of those HPs home after all , or maybe a mac. YES! AND DESTROY THEM BY OVERCLOCKING AND PUSHING THEM TO THE MAX!!!

[EverythingIBM]

I don't feel so bad anymore. I don't think I've topped 65 and I've got no TIM at all, plus what I'd call a pretty loose HSF.

You think that's hot? You should see my ThinkCentre S51. It's compact alright, compact enough to go on your kitchen table and fry some eggs with IBM sauce.

[bhtooefr]

TPFanControl is better than SpeedFan, and on a T60p, it's not the CPU that gets hot, it's the GPU.

The T60p has a terrible heatsink design, though. There's stuff on thinkpads.com about modifying the heatsink to provide better cooling performance.

[Manyak]

It's a T60p.

IPS panel?

But yeah just grab some MX3, it's better than arctic silver. You'll want to clean off both the chip and the heatsink surface with alcohol, and then apply just a little bit. The whole idea of TIM is just to fill in the grooves between the two surfaces, not to form a layer between them. And since that laptop is going to be direct-die (no IHS) it'll be really, really easy.

[bhtooefr]

Be sure to do the same to at least the GPU. The northbridge... ehh, if you want to, but it won't get that hot.

[Phaedrus2129]

Bah, those temperatures aren't bad at all. Anything up to 80C in a laptop is considered "ok", and it won't fry til you're over 100C. I mean, it could be better, but I've seen far, far worse.

Also, speedfan readings are terrible.

[EverythingIBM]

TPFanControl - got that one bookmarked now.  I've used SpeedFan for years but have found it flaky sometimes.

I didn't know you had thinkpads ripster.

[bhtooefr]

The GPU in a T60p... mine hits 90 C under load. But, the shutdown point is 127 C, not 100 C, so the thermal limits are higher.

[J888www]

A coincidence, I just replaced all my desktops and Laptops with Arctic Cooling MX-3, including all graphics cards. Arctic Silver thermal paste is conductive= not good, it takes up to 200hours to cure= not good, so my preference goes with MX-3=works straight away after application and it works well.

I had a little time and after watching "How Thermal Compound Spreads" I thought that maybe I had got it all wrong 1st time (also MX-3 was not available on the market). So I replaced the thermal paste the 2nd time with MX-3 using the dot method.

If your laptop feels very hot, that's very good for the components, if you cannot feel any heat dissipating from your laptop, then it's frying inside.

Edit: Have replaced the MX-3 TIM with Shin-Etsu X23-7783D, it's second best to Indigo Extreme, but the IE is not viable for these applications at the present moment.

[bhtooefr]

Not necessarily. I'd rather feel hot air coming out of the vents and the laptop feeling cool, than warm air and the laptop feeling hot.

[EverythingIBM]

A coincidence, I just replaced all my desktops and Laptop with Arctic Cooling MX-3, including all graphics cards. Arctic Silver thermal paste is conductive= not good, it takes up to 200hours to cure= not good, so my preference goes with MX-3=works straight away after application and it works well.

I had a little time and after watching "How Thermal Compound Spreads" I thought that maybe I had got it all wrong 1st time (also MX-3 was not available on the market). So I replaced the thermal paste the 2nd time with MX-3 using the dot method.

If your laptop feels very hot, that's very good for the components, if you cannot feel any heat dissipating from your laptop, then it's frying inside.

I'm sure arctic silver has a purpose somewhere in the market.

When you're talking about the case heat, you also need to take into consideration of the heat being expelled by the fan.
Your laptop can have a cool case with lots of warm air being flowed out. When the case gets too hot, that's never a good thing, I've never heard of a thermally insulating laptop case to keep the heat inside. If the case is cool, the computer is most likely cool, if the case burns your leg, it's frying the computer alright, and your flesh.

Now obviously, my thinkpad doesn't turn the fan on when the case is cool... that's because it really is cool and doesn't need to remove any heat.

[kishy]

Well, actually, if the case is hot it means it's conducting the heat outwards and effectively functioning as a heatspreader itself.

In the optimal design, all components of the lower half of the laptop will conduct heat outwards, with the most heat-generating components placed near or in contact with an active cooler.

[ricercar]

At NVIDIA the rule of thumb was that a 10°C increase in operating temperature decreases semiconductor lifespan by 50%.

[bhtooefr]

Of course, this is NVIDIA, who designed the GeForce 8 series, which kills itself if you look at it funny.

[J888www]

Apologise for the misunderstanding, I meant feeling lots of hot air from the fan, not the actual laptop been hot. If the laptop is hot, then its also frying.

[J888www]

nVidia 8000 series had a manufacturing defect, which they eventually admitted. My DELL XPS M1330 died after 4 Months of very very light usage, then needed a motherboard replacement. Sadly DELL replaced it with another surplus mobo which have the same issue.
The main gripe with DELL is that they still pushed out all their XPS laptops knowing that there were design faults by nVidia and also a design fault with their Thermal Module.

I enquired the cost of a 2x2cm piece of thermal pad for replacement to save time and cost for them to send out a technician again, DELL wanted £68 (delivery included), the actual cost of that piece of thermal pad = £0.08p  

DELL needs to rethink their Customer Relations Policy. I for one will not be purchasing from greedy DELL for an eternity.

Oh, I was trying to say, maybe your laptop is defective, :israel:

[EverythingIBM]

nVidia 8000 series had a manufacturing defect, which they eventually admitted. My DELL XPS M1330 died after 4 Months of very very light usage, then needed a motherboard replacement. Sadly DELL replaced it with another surplus mobo which have the same issue.
The main gripe with DELL is that they still pushed out all their XPS laptops knowing that there were design faults by nVidia and also a design fault with their Thermal Module.

I enquired the cost of a 2x2cm piece of thermal pad for replacement to save time and cost for them to send out a technician again, DELL wanted £68 (delivery included), the actual cost of that piece of thermal pad = £0.08p  

DELL needs to rethink their Customer Relations Policy. I for one will not be purchasing from greedy DELL for an eternity.

Oh, I was trying to say, maybe your laptop is defective, :israel:

No it's not defective, it's always ran like that (60c is too high for my taste). I don't like high temperatures on my equipment. I doubt that thinkpad will ever break any time soon, it's made fairly decent, but I think the older thinkpads are more sturdy.

And OBVIOUSLY dell is going to give you trouble, their computers are crap. I guess personal experience is the best teacher though. I learned that the hard way when I bought a stupid HP pavilion.

[kishy]

And OBVIOUSLY dell is going to give you trouble, their computers are crap.

It's already been established that this is NOT in fact the driving hatred of Dell around here, but rather the politics of the company's founder.

Dell makes computers that, IMO, are above the average quality found market wide, if not near the top. I would venture to say that wherever Lenovo ranks, Dell is below them, but not so much so that the difference is even noticeable (unless you're one of these people who actually cares about types of LCD panel, material the lid is made of, and so forth - these are not quality concerns! these are options, categories, and can't be compared as if they are quality traits)

[ricercar]

It's already been established that this is NOT in fact the driving hatred of Dell around here, but rather the politics of the company's founder.

Ooohh! I speak for EVERYONE!

[kishy]

Ooohh! I speak for EVERYONE!

Well, in other threads, other people have stated the same things...I think.

Good enough for me.

[kishy]

A long time ago I once boycotted Coors.

In other words I only do the easy stuff.  Love dem Dell Monitors!

2007WFP...horrible, horrible things. Light leak on all 4 sides, really poor contrast. The ones I'm "evaluating" are brand new from Dell, and a good hundred of them.

[EverythingIBM]

A long time ago I once boycotted Coors.

In other words I only do the easy stuff.  Love dem Dell Monitors!

You collect IBM keyboards and use cheap dell monitors? I take it you never set eyes on a nice 19" or 20" thinkvision LCD.

[itlnstln]

I have 3 Dell monitors on my main rig and another on my laptop.  They work well enough for me.

[bhtooefr]

The thing with LCDs is, everyone uses the same panels, for the most part.

Your beloved ThinkVisions use the same panels as the Dells.

(Besides, you're not true hardcore IBM unless you're using something with an IDTech panel, which that ThinkVision most likely doesn't. I have TWO IDTech panels, one of which I use every single day on my main system, and a second that I use when I need a TON of pixels in addition to the internal panel.)

[itlnstln]

The thing with LCDs is, everyone uses the same panels, for the most part.

This.  The only difference is the implementation (backlight and case, mainly).  The same goes for TVs to a certain extent.

[bhtooefr]

Even then, the backlight is often part of the panel.

[ch_123]

Agreed. Dell monitors are great value for money. Not as good as some of the fancy NEC or whatever screens, but more than acceptable for the average human being with a non-infinite supply of cash.

[EverythingIBM]

Agreed. Dell monitors are great value for money. Not as good as some of the fancy NEC or whatever screens, but more than acceptable for the average human being with a non-infinite supply of cash.

NEC LCDs are horrible, this is the one I have (I am only holding it for a little while):
http://www.amazon.com/NEC-MultiSync-LCD1565-Portable-Monitor/dp/B0000ARC10

(hey, is that webwit's wooden floor?)

The power cord and VGA cord are all attached... normal LCD monitors, like IBM ones, have seperate cable slots. And the buttons are on the side! That's like putting power buttons at the back: buttons always go on the FRONT side! What kind of insane person decided to put buttons where they're least accessible? It's like if one day you decided to type on your keyboard upsidedown.

The thing with LCDs is, everyone uses the same panels, for the most part.

Your beloved ThinkVisions use the same panels as the Dells.

(Besides, you're not true hardcore IBM unless you're using something with an IDTech panel, which that ThinkVision most likely doesn't. I have TWO IDTech panels, one of which I use every single day on my main system, and a second that I use when I need a TON of pixels in addition to the internal panel.)

IDTech manufactured the ones that came later. They're no fun if they lack an IBM logo.
My thinkvision LCD is a lot different from a dell one. It's actually very close to a thinkpad LCD, matte and easy on the eyes, while at the same time, really good colour: probably the best colour balance I've seen in any LCD. Dell ones are all glossy and use that ugly silver plastic... like the NEC one.

[bhtooefr]

Not all Dell panels are glossy.

Buy low-end consumer crap, get low-end consumer crap.

Buy something like a U2410, get a good prosumer 1920x1200 IPS display.

Full disclosure: I now represent Dell as a field tech at a corporate site, however, my opinions have nothing to do with the name on my badge. Oh, and they gave me the choice between two 1907FPs, or a 1907FP and a P780 (that's a CRT.) I took the P780 option for more resolution, and suffer with 65 Hz on that display.

[hyperlinked]

The thing with LCDs is, everyone uses the same panels, for the most part.

How much variation is there in the supply chain for LCD screens and are they really all getting the same screens from the same vendors or are there different grades for the screens they get from the vendors? I'm just surprised that there's so little variation in the parts, but there's definitely a significant range in quality in how the final product comes across.

[EverythingIBM]

Alright, here's a picture of a ****ty compaq my step brother brought, hooked up to that horrible NEC:

[ch_123]

The existence of a crap NEC monitor does not imply that all NEC monitors are crap.

Children really should be thought predicate logic at an early age, if for no other reason to make my internet experience less painful.

[bhtooefr]

When's Dell coming out with a U3010?

30 inch prosumer for me baby!

That'd be the 3008WFP. They're using a new model numbering system, and the 30" is still from the old model line.

Or, I think the U2711 would also work, it's a 27" 2560x1440 display.