Author Topic: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (gb coming soon, hotswap option added)  (Read 31941 times)

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Offline chouyu

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR
« Reply #50 on: Thu, 20 September 2018, 15:05:09 »
It looks retro and innovative ;D I‘am in!

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR
« Reply #51 on: Thu, 20 September 2018, 15:23:52 »
Cary is considering offering hotswap PCB for Dolch.CR with integrated thick plate. What do you guys think?

Usually only one layout is supported for hotswap PCB due to the hotswap sockets, unless many different types of PCB are provided, which will make the manufacture complex. I prefer to normal PCB which requires soldering, but with the flexibility to change the layout, e.g. split backspace or split right shift.
Based on the renders, it looks like only one layout is supported by the plate anyways.

If only one layout is supported by the plate then might as well make the pcb hotswap.

The regular PCB and plate will support a majority of layouts. It is obviously impossible for the hotswap I guess.

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR
« Reply #52 on: Thu, 20 September 2018, 15:40:15 »
Cary is considering offering hotswap PCB for Dolch.CR with integrated thick plate. What do you guys think?

Usually only one layout is supported for hotswap PCB due to the hotswap sockets, unless many different types of PCB are provided, which will make the manufacture complex. I prefer to normal PCB which requires soldering, but with the flexibility to change the layout, e.g. split backspace or split right shift.
Based on the renders, it looks like only one layout is supported by the plate anyways.

If only one layout is supported by the plate then might as well make the pcb hotswap.

The regular PCB and plate will support a majority of layouts. It is obviously impossible for the hotswap I guess.

All good.  I have plenty of hotswap boards already :)


Offline oh_chesteroni

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR
« Reply #53 on: Thu, 20 September 2018, 15:46:14 »
Would you consider having the weight just say "inspired by cherry g80-1813 dolch" and get rid of the "this design is"?

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR
« Reply #54 on: Thu, 20 September 2018, 15:48:27 »
Would you consider having the weight just say "inspired by cherry g80-1813 dolch" and get rid of the "this design is"?

Oh yes, good point. I second this notion.

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR
« Reply #55 on: Thu, 20 September 2018, 15:53:43 »

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR
« Reply #56 on: Thu, 20 September 2018, 16:26:23 »
Here is a poll for the Hotswap PCB option: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1LzmVEDkJ0j0BU0yGbochqWGEGJpH5CcjKxBSmyHgFSE/

Looks like the permissions aren’t right on the form

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR
« Reply #57 on: Fri, 21 September 2018, 16:56:57 »
Here is a poll for the Hotswap PCB option: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1LzmVEDkJ0j0BU0yGbochqWGEGJpH5CcjKxBSmyHgFSE/

Looks like the permissions aren’t right on the form

Sorry! The form has been fixed. My apologies

Offline Boy_314

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #58 on: Fri, 21 September 2018, 17:21:00 »
Following, but I wonder how hard cleaning out the dust would be

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #59 on: Fri, 21 September 2018, 17:46:11 »
Following, but I wonder how hard cleaning out the dust would be

Wouldn’t be bad.   Worst case scenario you get a brush and clean it once every other week.

Offline Cktenders

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #60 on: Fri, 21 September 2018, 17:48:30 »
Plate looks like there is no option for split backspace. Will that be changed? I love this design but would only be interested if split backspace is an option. Filled out form. Not super interested in fixed hotswap.

Offline bingo__pajama

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #61 on: Fri, 21 September 2018, 19:10:24 »
100% in if full backspace hotswap

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #62 on: Sun, 23 September 2018, 14:21:31 »
Plate looks like there is no option for split backspace. Will that be changed? I love this design but would only be interested if split backspace is an option. Filled out form. Not super interested in fixed hotswap.

I think Cary's goal is to make the plate compatible with many layouts -- its tricky because then hotswap is unlikely to work well.

Regarding hotswap, I think people's opinions are quite polarized, so I am collecting interest and feedback, to inform Cary on the final offerings. Hopefully something that works for most people.

Offline Oni74

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #63 on: Sun, 23 September 2018, 23:59:14 »
I'm a bit torn about this one. Based on initial info, my guess is that this is going to be pretty pricey, and given I'd recently joined Doro and Hi-Pro Alt GBs, I'm struggling to justify yet another board. Maybe I'll drop out of Hi-Pro Alt and get this if hot-swap makes it into the options...

So many choices lately - i'm not complaining, but i'm complaining. you know what i'm sayin? ;-)

Offline ctrl

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #64 on: Mon, 24 September 2018, 00:57:47 »
I think this looks awesome. Filled out the form and poll. :)

Would you upload a KLE layout image of all the possible layouts offered by the regular PCB and plate? I'm interested in whether it supports ISO (split LShift and ISO Enter) or not.

Regarding the poll. Hotswap is nice and all, but if you go down that lane, please consider offering the choice of both ANSI and ISO layouts. I've noticed how the frequency of hotswappable PCBs tends to end up enforcing an ANSI layout so if there's a hotswappable ISO option, that'd be something new and unique and I'd be down with that. If you have to settle for an ANSI only hotswappable PCB because of costs, then at the very least I'm hoping you'll offer ISO support with the regular PCB.

Offline breckstar

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #65 on: Mon, 24 September 2018, 21:04:54 »
Plate looks like there is no option for split backspace. Will that be changed? I love this design but would only be interested if split backspace is an option. Filled out form. Not super interested in fixed hotswap.

I think Cary's goal is to make the plate compatible with many layouts -- its tricky because then hotswap is unlikely to work well.

Regarding hotswap, I think people's opinions are quite polarized, so I am collecting interest and feedback, to inform Cary on the final offerings. Hopefully something that works for most people.
As odd as it may sound, have yall thought about a combination of hotswap + universal? Hotswap for the standard keys (ie numbers, alphas, esc, tab, arrow keys, etc) then solder the bottom row, shifts, enter/return, backspace?

It's kind of a hybrid and maybe a bit frankenstein-esque, but I think it could work. Would enable people to get the "gist" of different switches, then just having to resolder ~10 switches (bottom row, enter, etc) if they wanted to change fully.

Just a thought. Could be completely nuts and not worth.

Offline Cktenders

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #66 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 14:20:28 »
I don't know how the majority feel, but I care more about getting the exact layout I want, over the convenience (or inconvenience in this case) of having to solder a few/all keys. In other words, your solution would work for me. I like the design enough in this case to be more lenient on HOW I get to the desired layout, so long as it is an option at all. I still think split backspace is a decent group of users especially for 65% and under boards. Hopefully they can accommodate. All that said, I would still prefer to not have hotswap.

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #67 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 15:42:47 »
I don't know how the majority feel, but I care more about getting the exact layout I want, over the convenience (or inconvenience in this case) of having to solder a few/all keys. In other words, your solution would work for me. I like the design enough in this case to be more lenient on HOW I get to the desired layout, so long as it is an option at all. I still think split backspace is a decent group of users especially for 65% and under boards. Hopefully they can accommodate. All that said, I would still prefer to not have hotswap.

Yeah my feeling is that opinions on hotswap are quite polarized. I will check with Cary on if both can be provided. More work but may be worth it if there is enough interest.

Offline Oni74

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #68 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 09:38:37 »
I don't know how the majority feel, but I care more about getting the exact layout I want, over the convenience (or inconvenience in this case) of having to solder a few/all keys. In other words, your solution would work for me. I like the design enough in this case to be more lenient on HOW I get to the desired layout, so long as it is an option at all. I still think split backspace is a decent group of users especially for 65% and under boards. Hopefully they can accommodate. All that said, I would still prefer to not have hotswap.

Yeah my feeling is that opinions on hotswap are quite polarized. I will check with Cary on if both can be provided. More work but may be worth it if there is enough interest.
I am on the other side of the fence - I would like hot-swap over the layout flexibility. I just dropped out of the Hi-pro ALT GB after reading about all the QC issues with the Ctrl drop, and am willing to spend a little more for a premium keyboard with all the features including hot-swap.

I am hoping there's enough interest for both configurations to be made available.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk


Offline Oblotzky

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #69 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 09:40:16 »
Hotswap is for people that make mistakes.

Offline Oni74

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #70 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 10:09:32 »
Hotswap is for people that make mistakes.
I find your presumptuous and inflammatory comment unbecoming of a respected member of the community. Let's stay positive and keep toxicity out of this.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk


Offline Oblotzky

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #71 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 10:26:31 »
Hotswap is for people that make mistakes.
I find your presumptuous and inflammatory comment unbecoming of a respected member of the community. Let's stay positive and keep toxicity out of this.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

It was meant to be a joke/friendly banter. No toxicity intended at all.
« Last Edit: Sat, 29 September 2018, 10:30:35 by Oblotzky »

Offline Audiobs

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #72 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 12:30:19 »
Oh boy, I just joined 2x Doro67 and now this... should have read more before pulling the triggers...

On the topic of hot-swappable PCB, I don't mind either as I am handy with my soldering iron. But given a choice, I will still buy the hot-swappable, epsecially on a premium board like this. I am settled on tactile switches, but still want to try different offerings. I would rather not desolder and solder each time I want to try something. Wait, perhaps that would keep me from trying new switches...   :)
« Last Edit: Sat, 29 September 2018, 12:37:53 by Audiobs »

Offline OracleKev

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #73 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 20:57:42 »
Maybe things have changed, but hotswap sockets are known to get loose after not too many swaps.
This also depends on the quality of the sockets used, type of switches used, how switches were pulled out, etc.
Loose sockets -> PCB float? -> inconsistent feel

I rather solder than deal with unpredictable element in the long run.

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #74 on: Sun, 30 September 2018, 11:43:39 »
Prototype is done!!!

More information coming very soon!

Offline hhkbp2

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #75 on: Sun, 30 September 2018, 11:49:26 »
Maybe things have changed, but hotswap sockets are known to get loose after not too many swaps.
This also depends on the quality of the sockets used, type of switches used, how switches were pulled out, etc.
Loose sockets -> PCB float? -> inconsistent feel

I rather solder than deal with unpredictable element in the long run.

+1

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #76 on: Mon, 01 October 2018, 10:46:53 »
Maybe things have changed, but hotswap sockets are known to get loose after not too many swaps.
This also depends on the quality of the sockets used, type of switches used, how switches were pulled out, etc.
Loose sockets -> PCB float? -> inconsistent feel

I rather solder than deal with unpredictable element in the long run.

+1

I can definitely understand the sentiment against hotswap. We can confirm that non-hotswap version is 100% available

Offline stoic-lemon

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #77 on: Mon, 01 October 2018, 23:13:46 »
Interesting that for some people, hotswap is a premium feature. Never thought of it as so myself.

Offline cldskt

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #78 on: Mon, 01 October 2018, 23:54:42 »
Interesting that for some people, hotswap is a premium feature. Never thought of it as so myself.

Exactly. To me, soldering is part of the entire process to be enjoyed.
I can understand though why for those just entering to customs, hassle-free experience is preferred, hence the demand for hotswaps.


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Offline Oni74

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #79 on: Tue, 02 October 2018, 09:49:26 »
Interesting that for some people, hotswap is a premium feature. Never thought of it as so myself.

Exactly. To me, soldering is part of the entire process to be enjoyed.
I can understand though why for those just entering to customs, hassle-free experience is preferred, hence the demand for hotswaps.

I'm on this boat. I'm just starting out, and while not afraid to learn soldering and enjoy the me-time in the man-cave as I will undoubtedly do when my doro67 ships, a demanding job, family, etc. ensures that i have very little free time for me-time. For people like me, hot-swap will enable experimentation and flexibility.

I can foresee a future where both hotswap and non-hotswap boards coexist in my life. If hotswap doesn't make it into Dolch.CR, i'm sure I'll find some other board that will meet the need. I do hope that enough interest is gathered so that both configs can be supported. Who doesn't love a win-win?

Offline Unforgivable

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #80 on: Tue, 02 October 2018, 13:42:25 »
Love the look of the board, but are both the normal and hotswap PCB’s using south led Facing switch slots?

Offline hayt

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #81 on: Tue, 02 October 2018, 13:44:11 »
Looking forward to a nice photoshoot of the prototype!

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #82 on: Tue, 02 October 2018, 14:30:44 »
Love the look of the board, but are both the normal and hotswap PCB’s using south led Facing switch slots?

hope so.  I guess we'll see soon enough

Offline comdata55

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #83 on: Wed, 03 October 2018, 13:54:59 »
definitely interested in seeing the prototype on this one!

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated poll for hotswap PCB)
« Reply #84 on: Wed, 03 October 2018, 23:44:13 »
First prototype

204872-0

Offline regionfree

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #85 on: Wed, 03 October 2018, 23:48:06 »
possible to make the brass logo at the top teal/light blue as well? to be consistent with the dolch branding.

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #86 on: Wed, 03 October 2018, 23:49:58 »
possible to make the brass logo at the top teal/light blue as well? to be consistent with the dolch branding.

I believe that is customizable :) details forthcoming

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #87 on: Thu, 04 October 2018, 00:49:36 »
I’ll have to see more photos to get a better opinion.  Right now, I don’t like the way the top looks. The groves should be thinner like on thr original Dolch pac board. 

204874-0

Also, the badge feels really cramped up there.  I don’t have a solution for that.

Offline young_won

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #88 on: Thu, 04 October 2018, 00:54:30 »
i hope split space bar

Offline stoic-lemon

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #89 on: Thu, 04 October 2018, 01:18:38 »
Excellent point on the grooves. I agree, having them resemble the original would be better.

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #90 on: Sat, 06 October 2018, 22:42:39 »
First prototype (v1.0) is done! Cary is making optimizations and improvements for prototype V2.0 now!

Absolutely amazing! You can also 3D print or order PC translucent badges for light effects from LEDs  under the badge.

205011-0

Offline dimo

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #91 on: Mon, 08 October 2018, 15:40:44 »
First prototype (v1.0) is done! Cary is making optimizations and improvements for prototype V2.0 now!

Absolutely amazing! You can also 3D print or order PC translucent badges for light effects from LEDs  under the badge.

(Attachment Link)

Looks great (:

Do you know specifically the improvements that are going to be made? If it includes thinning the cuts at the top to match the original case. And if the color will stay as a straight black

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #92 on: Mon, 08 October 2018, 19:15:06 »
I would love to see a matte black option.  Maybe the new eCoat process.

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #93 on: Mon, 08 October 2018, 21:21:43 »
I would love to see a matte black option.  Maybe the new eCoat process.

The black is indeed matte I believe. the new coating is not available for black unfortunately  :(

Offline lazyfart

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #94 on: Tue, 09 October 2018, 02:11:30 »
I know this is a bit late...but any possibility of making this alps compatible?

Offline dimo

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #95 on: Tue, 09 October 2018, 17:59:49 »
I’m afraid the case will feel “plasticy”, or if the weight will make up for it for the lightness. Any word on the build quality specifically? and if prototypes will be sent to members of the community?

Offline Jkush463

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #96 on: Tue, 09 October 2018, 20:24:50 »
i was hoping the front channels would be more exaggerated but it looks pretty nice, 

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #97 on: Tue, 09 October 2018, 23:56:51 »
i was hoping the front channels would be more exaggerated but it looks pretty nice,

Will ask Cary to take some more pictures, he said the channels are a bit deeper than they appear in the pictures.

Offline oldcat

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #98 on: Wed, 10 October 2018, 00:04:01 »
First prototype (v1.0) is done! Cary is making optimizations and improvements for prototype V2.0 now!

Absolutely amazing! You can also 3D print or order PC translucent badges for light effects from LEDs  under the badge.

(Attachment Link)

Looks great (:

Do you know specifically the improvements that are going to be made? If it includes thinning the cuts at the top to match the original case. And if the color will stay as a straight black

The second prototype is pearl white color. Will find out soon about the changes!
I think if the channels are too thin, will make it hard to clean.... I will check with Cary if that will be changed.

Offline dantambok

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Re: [IC] ALF x Cary — 65% Dolch.CR (updated first prototype)
« Reply #99 on: Wed, 10 October 2018, 00:32:11 »
How much does the kit weigh?  :D
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