HHKB Pro 2 is here!

[Waves77]

Finally got my hands on it... I'll wait at least a week to post a more thorough impression, but I have to say that the first impression is extremely positive.

The switches are... wow, nothing remotely like on the hhkb lite. Reminds me of cherry browns indeed, but much more "solid" - I can tell that I will really really like these

I'm still getting used to not peeking at the labels, and trying to figure out the dip switches (is there really only one Fn key?).

But yeah... this keyboard is pretty kick ass! Looks great too (the black is close to a charcoal type of color).

[vils]

Congrats! And welcome to the club, or should I say sect?

/Vils

[Waves77]

Congrats! And welcome to the club, or should I say sect?

/Vils

Thanks man!

I think it's only a cult if you buy more than one

[bigpook]

I think sw-4 will put a function key on the left hand side....

[Waves77]

I think sw-4 will put a function key on the left hand side....

Indeed, thanks for the tip. I'll need the Fn-key a lot more than the alt key I would say...

[graywolf]

I think sw-4 will put a function key on the left hand side....

Thuns the left Alt to left Fn, correct?

[graywolf]

The wait is over, now the honeymoon begins. Enjoy!

[bigpook]

Yes, graywolf, that it does. For those that are curious there are 6 switches that can be manipulated.

sw1---off, sw2---off equals HHK mode

sw1---on, sw2---off equals Lite Ext. mode

sw1---off, sw2---on equals Macintosh mode

sw1---on, sw2---on equals ----------(nothing?)

sw3---off is Delete=Delete

sw3---on is Delete=Backspace

sw4---off is left diamond key = left diamond key

sw4---on is left diamond key = function key

sw5---off is diamond key = diamond key, alt key = alt key

sw5---on is diamond key = alt key, alt key = diamond key

sw6---off is wake up disable

sw6---on is wake up enable

[iMav]

I have to say that the first impression is extremely positive.

Of course it is!!  Everybody loves the HHKB Pro!!

Glad to hear you finally got your hands on one.  I'm still considering ordering a back up "just in case".

[Waves77]

Of course it is!!  Everybody loves the HHKB Pro!!

Glad to hear you finally got your hands on one.  I'm still considering ordering a back up "just in case".

Yeah, been typing away very happily for a couple of hours now!

I don't think they'll discontinue these anytime soon, they might just up it to a Pro 3 It sucks they're so expensive, I could definitely get a second one of these as well (to plug into my secondary PC and/or take to work).

They are the ultimate keyboard to carry around though, very light, love the detachable usb and very awesome. The Filco makes me want to write prose, a Model M secure a server, but the HHKB just makes me feel like an all around Linux ninja (*dork*)

I actually have to set up a server this evening, so I'll be fun doing it on the HHKB.

[bigpook]

Yes, having the function key available on the left hand side is most useful.
It would be difficult for me if it wasn't available on the left hand side.....

On another note, do other HHKB owners bottom out often/alot?
I am trying to modulate the amount of pressure that I apply to the key, to get it to actuate before I hit bottom. Its kind of tough for me not to bottom out......

[victheslik]

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[victheslik]

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[xsphat]

Have fun with those questions

[iMav]

The Cherry browns feel similar to the HHKB Pro...however, the feel is lighter.

The brown's are non-clicky with a very subtle tactile feel.  It is a slight "catch" in the switch and I find that they are a joy to type on.  Some seem to have issues typing on them from an accuracy point of view (namely, xsphat).  I think that, depending on your background, they might take some getting used to.

These are entirely different than white Alps switches which are clicky and have a much harsher tactile feel.  No comparison really.

I am of the opinion that you can enjoy a variety of switches.  I love my Model M mini, my HHKB, and the feel of both blue and brown cherry switches.  I also find the white Alps switches enjoyable.  Throw any of these into a HHKB layout and I would happily use them long-term.

[parisnight]

Yeah waves77 you've got a lot of keyboards, I'd be interested in your opinions esp. regarding switches and layout.   I like the cherry browns so I think the HHKB switches should be good.  Of course my son and wife picked the Alps white stem clickys over the browns.  Based only on speed I could type faster and smoother on the browns.  I think ideal for me is HHKB with even weight 30g switches.

[parisnight]

The Cherry browns feel similar to the HHKB Pro...however, the feel is lighter.

So the Cherry browns are lighter?  I'm looking for light keys.  I think xsphat said one time that the HHKB switches weren't quite as smooth as the cherry, as though there was a touch of roughness.  Does anyone else care to comment on that?  BTW, I never thought I'd be dissecting  keyboard switch like this before.

[Korbin]

So the Cherry browns are lighter?  I'm looking for light keys.  I think xsphat said one time that the HHKB switches weren't quite as smooth as the cherry, as though there was a touch of roughness.  Does anyone else care to comment on that?  BTW, I never thought I'd be dissecting  keyboard switch like this before.

Cherry switches or great, but in my opinion the HHKB switches are far more smoother. The key press of the HHKB or probably the lightest you can get, although to me the browns feel lighter (cherry brown: 56grams, HHKB:45grams).

[Waves77]

The browns require a bit more force to press down (very relative mind you) and feel a bit crispier. They definitely sound "clickier" (higher pitch).

The switches in the HHKB are very easy to press down, but have a more solid feel, almost like a very smooth model M, it offers a nice resistance while at the same time being lighter. (both the M and the HHKB use springs in their switches, see http://www.pfusystems.com/hhkeyboard/leaflet/keyspec.html for the HHKB Pro).

I do find myself being more accurate on the HHKB than on the brown cherries (that's been one of my minor complaints about them, although it's a lot better than in the beginning).

Still, I would say both of these are my favorites. The Filco (w/ brown cherries) at half the price of the HHKB is an amazing keyboard. Something cool about the HHKB (especially with blank keys) is the geekyness factor. Other boards just look like a regular keyboard (or an old vintage POS) to the untrained eye. This board makes a bit more of a statement if you enjoy that kind of thing (I do).

The design of the HHKB is very tight, has a small learning curve (switches and key combinations) - which I think, like learning vi/emacs/etc makes it a bit more personal of a board. There's a personal investment and effort involved. The layout is very intelligent and elegant, I don't miss having the other keys: function keys, numpad, arrows, etc. All of these are accessible through easy key combinations.

One big advantage is that you get an extremely good quality board that's extremely portable, unlike a model M or even a regular full sized board. The HHKB will easily fit in a laptop/messenger bag, is light (but still heavy enough to be stable on the desk) and has a detachable usb cable - just unplug the board and get a second cable for at work or retractable cable to take with you.

[lowpoly]

Welcome to the HHKB owners club, Waves.

I use the function key left to space and press it with my left thumb. When I 'discovered' that (i.e. read it here), all the cursor keys suddenly made sense cause the right hand doesn't have to leave the home row anymore.

[bigpook]

Thats a great post waves77. The brown cherries require more force than the HHKB? How does that compare with the blue cherries. I have a DASIII but didn't really like it. I am wondering if the brown cherries would be something to try.

[Waves77]

Welcome to the HHKB owners club, Waves.

I use the function key left to space and press it with my left thumb. When I 'discovered' that (i.e. read it here), all the cursor keys suddenly made sense cause the right hand doesn't have to leave the home row anymore.

Thanks, yeah, that's how I have it setup (tip from bigpook). The cursors are very comfortable indeed (as are all the key combinations so far).

[Waves77]

Thats a great post waves77. The brown cherries require more force than the HHKB? How does that compare with the blue cherries. I have a DASIII but didn't really like it. I am wondering if the brown cherries would be something to try.

Yes, they (browns) do require a little bit more force (but both a lot less than a model M). My Das III is boxed now. I would say the HHKB is a lot more solid, low pitched, more of a "thoch thoch" sound that a "click click" sound as with the blues.

Check out the sound in these:
HHKB: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1XBmmsP2gI&feature=related
Das: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJitURx3ZVQ&feature=related (skip to around 0:53)

I have some soundclips of both the brown and blue cherry switches in the sound clip section. The browns are IMHO way better than the blues (I'd rather have alps or bs). Since you have the HHKB I would say think of the browns as a clickier version of the HHKB switches.

Let me know if that makes any sense, I know you are debating trying the browns.

[megarat]

Speaking of the HHKB, if you look at the Japanese PFU site, you can see all sorts of nifty accessories for sale, like the leatherette slipcase, and the stylish wood and acrylic wrist-rests.  Has anyone been able to find these accessories from another (export-friendly) vendor?

(benippon can't source them; I expect that I could get them through crescent-shop.com, but haven't asked.  geekstuff4u carries the so-called "hard case", but that's it.)

-cam

[Waves77]

iMav has a cool case for his, search the forum for it if you haven't seen it yet. I think I would just put it in my Swissgear backpack, or maybe at most buy a zeroshock sleeve for it if I moved it around a lot.

[xsphat]

He has the HHKB hard case and he got it from GeekStuff4U.

[lowpoly]

One of these wood/leather wrist rests and the acrylic dust cover are high on my Xmas wish list.

[parisnight]

Leatherette slipcase .. now that is definitely something the world can use more of.  Thanks waves for differentiating the HHKB switches and the cherry browns.  Alas, I badly just need to try out a HHKB.  I'm amused that the dreamboard Model M is membrane and HHKB is rubber cup.  I guess we need to be careful about terminology here ..

[iMav]

Leatherette slipcase .. now that is definitely something the world can use more of.  Thanks waves for differentiating the HHKB switches and the cherry browns.  Alas, I badly just need to try out a HHKB.  I'm amused that the dreamboard Model M is membrane and HHKB is rubber cup.  I guess we need to be careful about terminology here ..

With the HHKB, it's all about the conical spring and the key sliding mechanism.  The rubber cup does nothing other than contain the spring.

I have to disagree with those that believe the HHKB Pro is lighter than the Cherry browns.  My side-by-side experience is that the cherry browns are lighter and require less resistance than the HHKB.

[Waves77]

I have to disagree with those that believe the HHKB Pro is lighter than the Cherry browns.  My side-by-side experience is that the cherry browns are lighter and require less resistance than the HHKB.

It's a very slight difference, but I think it's there. The browns definitely lighter sound wise, but the resistance is not there until you press halfway down, whereas with the HHKB the resistance is there right away (which I think makes it seem heavier in comparison).

Again, it's just a very small difference (have both the Filco and the HHKB on my desk right now).

[lowpoly]

The rubber cup does nothing other than contain the spring.

I think the rubber cup provides the tactile part of the force curve. Otherwise the HHKB would be linear. It's only a little tactile and the rubber would be too weak and slow to push the keycap up again appropriately. Thus the spring.

[Bluemercury]

Just got mine, im testing it, im having some trouble with some keys, the windows keys  arent registering any idea?

edit:seems if i leave the swithes like they are, the window keys wont register, can someone give me a small round up, the manual comes in japanese of course.

[bigpook]

sw1---off, sw2---off equals HHK mode

sw1---on, sw2---off equals Lite Ext. mode

sw1---off, sw2---on equals Macintosh mode

sw1---on, sw2---on equals ----------(nothing?)

sw3---off is Delete=Delete

sw3---on is Delete=Backspace

sw4---off is left diamond key = left diamond key

sw4---on is left diamond key = function key

sw5---off is diamond key = diamond key, alt key = alt key

sw5---on is diamond key = alt key, alt key = diamond key

sw6---off is wake up disable

sw6---on is wake up enable

[Bluemercury]

ok, how can i make the fn work....i only have the switch 5 turned on.

[lowpoly]

the windows keys arent registering any idea?

I had that too, later it worked without any changes.

I had a thread about it, do a search. I think you even posted in it.

[bigpook]

sw4---on is left diamond key = function key

[Bluemercury]

its working, anyway is there a way to change so that when i press fn+backspace does the delete instead of the backspace?

[bigpook]

from what I can see sw3 determines the behaviour of backspace/delete.
I don't know if there is another combination to achieve what you ask.
Any other HHKB owners care to enlighten?

[Waves77]

Switch 3 up makes the key behave like BS and like DELETE for fn+backspace

[Bluemercury]

Switch 3 up makes the key behave like BS and like DELETE for fn+backspace

i think you're wrong, i have the switch3 on and if i press fn+the key it still behaves like backspace. Although if you press fb+"\" key it will do the delete behaviour......

[lowpoly]

With sw3 on, fn+backspace is backspace.

[bigpook]

I am using linux. It doesn't seem to matter if I am HHKB mode or HHKB lite mode, or is sw3 is up or down. The delete key will erase text, Fn-Delete does the same, Fn-Tilde does nothing for me.


Try unplugging/plugging the keyboard, maybe that will kick it.

[parisnight]

It's a very slight difference, but I think it's there. The browns definitely lighter sound wise, but the resistance is not there until you press halfway down, whereas with the HHKB the resistance is there right away (which I think makes it seem heavier in comparison).

So I bet that rubber cup that contributes the tactile bit is definitely going to feel different than the cherry browns little bump on the plastic. Probably people sense the different parts of the stroke differently.

[Waves77]

i think you're wrong, i have the switch3 on and if i press fn+the key it still behaves like backspace. Although if you press fb+"\" key it will do the delete behaviour......

You're right, switch 3 and BS is BS no matter what. It's what I have it set to, fn+` is delete.

[Bluemercury]

What are the differences in the modes, like hhk, lite and mac.......there's also some other mode which the manual its full japanese so i dont understand.
Also i can only make the switch alterations work if i unplug the keyboard and plug it again....i think.

[bigpook]

waves77 are you on a linux box?

[bigpook]

check this out

http://www.pfusystems.com/hhkeyboard/leaflet/hairetu.html

[Waves77]

waves77 are you on a linux box?

Yes, both for my desktop and my laptop.

[bigpook]

maybe its a linux thing. I like my backspace to be a delete key anyway. So it works out ok for me.

[Bluemercury]

My external hard drive isnt working with the keyboard usb ports, only directly connected in the laptop, but the mouse works, strange.

Edit: perhaps its a power related thing???
Edit2:Well tryed another external HDD and it didnt work either, with a card pen it also exceeds the power available.....strange.
Edit3: Just tried a gamepad and some seheinzer phones and both worked, seems this has to do with usb hdd´s.

[Bluemercury]

Anyone had problems like this?

[jemkeys]

My flash drive won't work through the keyboard USB ports either.  Only the ones with slower transfer speeds.

[vils]

My flash drive work's flawlessly through the keyboard...

/Vils

[Bluemercury]

My flash drive won't work through the keyboard USB ports either.  Only the ones with slower transfer speeds.

Yes i tried a sandisk card pen the fastest one, and it gives the power not enough for the device. Strangely both external HDD i tried didnt gave the message, but didnt work either.

[Bluemercury]

My flash drive work's flawlessly through the keyboard...

/Vils

Its probably a slower one......

[vils]

Its probably a slower one......

Yes it is.

/Vils

[lowpoly]

The keyboard has a passive hub. So the original usb is already running a hub and a keyboard. If a device needs full usb power it won't work.

[megarat]

If you have an HHKB-P2 (or any other keyboard that doesn't use a hardwired cable), you can buy a two-channel cable.  This is a cable that plugs into two USB ports on the computer, and provides one USB port's worth of power to the hub.

[Bluemercury]

If you have an HHKB-P2 (or any other keyboard that doesn't use a hardwired cable), you can buy a two-channel cable.  This is a cable that plugs into two USB ports on the computer, and provides one USB port's worth of power to the hub.

Well, i have a HHK professional 2, tried my external HDD with the extra usb cable that plugs in the hard drive DC-in with both usb cable parts plugged in the keyboard but that didnt work either. It worked with one plugged on the keyboard(the main one that's used to tranfers) and the power one on the laptod.......but both on the keyboard wont work. its really a matter of power....

[victheslik]

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[xsphat]

Congrats! Good time to be a keyboard junky, huh?

[victheslik]

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[Bluemercury]

Congrats! Good time to be a keyboard junky, huh?

How's that topre 86k of yours?you're enjoying it?

[xsphat]

How's that topre 86k of yours?you're enjoying it?

It's an 86U (86UK is black), and it's great. It's heavy and small, the build quality is on par with the Filco and Model M 1391401, and it does feel better than the HHKB Pro 2. So yeah, I'm pretty happy with it.

Check out my unboxing post in reviews.

[JulienC]

I did it, my HHKBP2 is in the mail ! The grey one with blank keys.

I can't wait until it arrives, because right now I'm suffering the symptoms of the Online Package Tracking Syndrome.

[kyamei]

So I just got my HHKB in and I'm trying to set the Fn key to the left side, but I must be doing something wrong.  I got the Delete --> Backspace to work fine by turning on switch 3, but when I turn on switch 4, left diamond + ;'[/ does not equal arrow keys.  Am I mistaken in that left diamond + ;'[/ with switch 4 on is supposed to be arrow keys or is this keyboard simply defective. (blank keyboard....left diamond is the key directly to the left of the spacebar right?)

[iMav]

I didn't think it was possible to make another key act as the function key.  (which is located to the right of the right shift key)

[kyamei]

Oh, I just got the idea it was possible by looking at the sticker on the back of the keyboard that said "SW4:  ON:  Left <> = Fn"  Did I just misunderstand that?

[iMav]

Oh, I just got the idea it was possible by looking at the sticker on the back of the keyboard that said "SW4:  ON:  Left <> = Fn"  Did I just misunderstand that?

What "mode" do you have it in?  Could be that it has to be in HHKB mode.

[kyamei]

I have switch 1 and 2 off, which should mean HHKB mode.

[iMav]

I have switch 1 and 2 off, which should mean HHKB mode.

I'd try the combination with every mode setting...including both 1 and 2 on.

[lowpoly]

We've seen it more than once that the dip switches didn't work immediately.

[bigpook]

IIRC, I am using linux and I had to log out and log back in for the dip switch changes to be effective.

[kyamei]

Thanks for the help, works now.  Started working after I plugged it into another computer.  Strange that it didn't work when I tried re-plugging it into this computer earlier.  

Need to get used to having the backspace key 1 row lower than normal, but I'm loving this board so far.

[xsphat]

It takes a restart for my Topre in Mac OSX.