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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: lknockoutl on Tue, 05 December 2017, 06:30:18
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Hi everyone. I'm really curious about topre switches so I would like to own a keyboard featuring those.
I think I'd prefer uniform switches, be it 45g or 55g.
I'd love to have dedicated arrow keys because I use them a lot for programming.
I came up with two possibilities, which are: realforce 87U and leopold fc660c
Now for the questions.
I'd like to have it silenced, unluckily the only silenced version of the realforce 87U has variable weight, doesn't it?
Should I be lubing and silencing a standard 45/55g realforce? If so which lube would you advise me? I have found too many discordant opinions regarding this topic.
By browsing around this forum I've found https://techkeys.us/products/krytox-switch-lurbricant (https://techkeys.us/products/krytox-switch-lurbricant)
and https://kbdfans.myshopify.com/products/topre-keyboard-silence-x-120pcs (https://kbdfans.myshopify.com/products/topre-keyboard-silence-x-120pcs)
People have been saying lubing is bad and silencing is bad.
I'd go for a realforce 87U silent with uniform weight if there was one.
I'd also go for a leopold fc660c is there was a silent version.
I'm so confused. Can anybody help me out to make the perfect purchase?
Thank you very much!
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lubing and silencing topre boards is definitely not bad. techkeys thin lube is good, and kbd silencing rings are good. buy whichever board you prefer layout wise and go for it. lube just the slider rails. Fc660c will be slightly heavier switch wise than 45g 87u, and slightly lighter than 55g 87u.
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I'm by no means a Topre expert, but I did get a 55g 87U recently. I can confidently say that it is the quietest keyboard I own. Quieter than any Cherry switch board I've tried (though I haven't tried linear, since I need tactility). So I honestly don't understand why anyone would feel the need to add silencing on top of it.
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I'm by no means a Topre expert, but I did get a 55g 87U recently. I can confidently say that it is the quietest keyboard I own. Quieter than any Cherry switch board I've tried (though I haven't tried linear, since I need tactility). So I honestly don't understand why anyone would feel the need to add silencing on top of it.
Un silenced topre is still very loud for me with the upstroke. The 2 cherry boards I have now are much quieter (one with blacks, the other v browns).
Silencing for me does more than reduce noise, it eliminates the sharpness of the upstroke making it more "thocky"
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lubing and silencing topre boards is definitely not bad. techkeys thin lube is good, and kbd silencing rings are good. buy whichever board you prefer layout wise and go for it. lube just the slider rails. Fc660c will be slightly heavier switch wise than 45g 87u, and slightly lighter than 55g 87u.
Thank you very much. What's the difference between applying thin lube or thick lube?
I'm by no means a Topre expert, but I did get a 55g 87U recently. I can confidently say that it is the quietest keyboard I own. Quieter than any Cherry switch board I've tried (though I haven't tried linear, since I need tactility). So I honestly don't understand why anyone would feel the need to add silencing on top of it.
Un silenced topre is still very loud for me with the upstroke. The 2 cherry boards I have now are much quieter (one with blacks, the other v browns).
Silencing for me does more than reduce noise, it eliminates the sharpness of the upstroke making it more "thocky"
Yep. Silenced realforces have a louder "thock" in my opinion, so I'm looking to silence mine eventually.
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It really depends on what you want to try. Good topre boards with dedicated arrow keys IMO are the RF87u, HHKP JP, and FC660C. As for the weight, I much prefer a 55g+ topre dome, so the 87u is by far my favorite. That being said you can grab some BKE redux domes. Do be warned though: heavy bke domes will throw a quite experience out the window.
Silencing and lubing, as previously mentioned, is easy enough to do. If you're not too afraid to take apart your board, there are plenty of cheap options to silence them.
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Silencing and lubing, as previously mentioned, is easy enough to do. If you're not too afraid to take apart your board, there are plenty of cheap options to silence them.
I'm looking forward to it by using the products mentioned in my first post.
I'm worried my "typing experience" will be messed up by applying the silence-x rings even though they're quite thin.
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Honestly silencing and lubing just aren't necessary on Topre boards. I give it 80% odds that what you want is a 55g uniform. They are nice and snappy. Keep it stock so you can sell it if you decide to in the future.
If you must have the silenced sliders, remember that the variable boards are mostly 55g anyway. Also keep in mind that the space bar is still loud.
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Honestly silencing and lubing just aren't necessary on Topre boards. I give it 80% odds that what you want is a 55g uniform. They are nice and snappy. Keep it stock so you can sell it if you decide to in the future.
If you must have the silenced sliders, remember that the variable boards are mostly 55g anyway. Also keep in mind that the space bar is still loud.
Yep, I'm going for a 55g uniform 87U.
I'll consider lubing and/or silencing if anybody else has a story to share about it.
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This is from my personal experience so your case might be different. But this is what I find through my trial and error.
- Between silence and no silence, I do like silence better because it tightens the switches and reduce the wobble. Making the keyboard feel more refined.
- Between variable, 45g and 55g, I like 45g the best (I also like MX Red and Brown). 55g start to feel a bit tiring for me.
- Opinion on Hypersphere ring and KBDFans rings. Hypersphere rings dampen REALLY well but it also reduce travel a lot which affect tactility, KBDFans rings sort of does everything "okay" it doesn't reduce travel much and doesn't dampen that much either. I would recommend buying official silent models.
- Have not try lubing so can't comment on that.
- Layout is heavily based on personal preference. I like standard layout for muscle memory also I use number pad a lot, so full size is best for me.
So based from your top 2 options, Leopold never made silent version and probably still won't. If you want silent your best bet is 87U Silent.
Realforce R2 just came out in Japan so I'd recommend wait for the tenkeyless version, which will come out some point in 2018.
https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/1081484.html
:thumb:
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Keep in mind Topre feels nearly identical to the rubber dome keyboard you've grown up with.
That is one of the reasons people like them, (familiarity).
Cannot say they're bad keyboards, but its price rides on Reputation alone, there are no technical merits to warrant its price point.
I was talked into buying an 87u very early on my keyboard journey.. It was a disappointing experience, because the Topre Crowd was very vocal at the time about how topre feels like typing on god's taint so to speak..
To me it only felt like a new outta the box Rubber dome keyboard. It'll feel superior to those library or perhaps ur at home dome board, but that's mostly due to wear difference.
Keep your expectations in line, and go in EYES OPEN.. At worse, you can pawn it off on the next keyboard initiate..
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^ yup, pretty much. The Realforce boards are definitely well, and you have the opportunity to buy aftermarket keycaps (kinda). So at least it has that going for it. :-X
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Well they do have one big advantage over cheap rubber dome keyboards in that they actuate before bottoming out. Of course any decent mechanical keyboard does that too, it's kind of a big part of the whole appeal. So it's easy to see why a Topre keyboard ought to be worth more than a rubber dome keyboard, but it's kind of hard to see why they often go for even more than a lot of mechanicals...
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I'm by no means a Topre expert, but I did get a 55g 87U recently. I can confidently say that it is the quietest keyboard I own. Quieter than any Cherry switch board I've tried (though I haven't tried linear, since I need tactility). So I honestly don't understand why anyone would feel the need to add silencing on top of it.
Un silenced topre is still very loud for me with the upstroke. The 2 cherry boards I have now are much quieter (one with blacks, the other v browns).
Silencing for me does more than reduce noise, it eliminates the sharpness of the upstroke making it more "thocky"
This is where I find people's opinions to be very odd...the upstroke is not that loud..of course if you press a key and try to make it loud by releasing it in a way that maximized the sound of course it will be different.
It could be people's typing style..or it could just be the flawed way they're testing it..but all of the testing I've seen and done myself with a meter puts MX switches as louder..even with O-Rings and especially without. Now I haven't tried these other silencers that help on the upstroke and haven't compared them to MX Silent...but objectively Topre makes less noise than a normal MX switch..
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I'm by no means a Topre expert, but I did get a 55g 87U recently. I can confidently say that it is the quietest keyboard I own. Quieter than any Cherry switch board I've tried (though I haven't tried linear, since I need tactility). So I honestly don't understand why anyone would feel the need to add silencing on top of it.
Un silenced topre is still very loud for me with the upstroke. The 2 cherry boards I have now are much quieter (one with blacks, the other v browns).
Silencing for me does more than reduce noise, it eliminates the sharpness of the upstroke making it more "thocky"
This is where I find people's opinions to be very odd...the upstroke is not that loud..of course if you press a key and try to make it loud by releasing it in a way that maximized the sound of course it will be different.
It could be people's typing style..or it could just be the flawed way they're testing it..but all of the testing I've seen and done myself with a meter puts MX switches as louder..even with O-Rings and especially without. Now I haven't tried these other silencers that help on the upstroke and haven't compared them to MX Silent...but objectively Topre makes less noise than a normal MX switch..
I've used 3 different topre boards, all unsilenced at some point before I silenced them. They have all been very loud before silencing, no testing, just typing. When MX is in a plastic case the board itself may be louder, or even the stabs, but the switch isn't very loud, especially after lubing.
After owning a few customs and using cherry outside of rickety mass produced housings, and old school cherry made housings of similar quality, it's easy to see how quiet cherry can be. If we're comparing to blues or some other clicky switch I think that's unfair, because obviously those would be louder.
As for the upstroke, I press the key then release...........you know then move to another key...........like I assume most others do. Do you hold your finger on the key until it is fully up after actuation, to dampen the upstroke?
Testing with meters is all well and good, but the switch alone isn't what determines the sound level.
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I've used 3 different topre boards, all unsilenced at some point before I silenced them. They have all been very loud before silencing, no testing, just typing. When MX is in a plastic case the board itself may be louder, or even the stabs, but the switch isn't very loud, especially after lubing.
After owning a few customs and using cherry outside of rickety mass produced housings, and old school cherry made housings of similar quality, it's easy to see how quiet cherry can be. If we're comparing to blues or some other clicky switch I think that's unfair, because obviously those would be louder.
As for the upstroke, I press the key then release...........you know then move to another key...........like I assume most others do. Do you hold your finger on the key until it is fully up after actuation, to dampen the upstroke?
Testing with meters is all well and good, but the switch alone isn't what determines the sound level.
Custom or not, MX is still really loud (I'm not talking blues). You're right though, the switch itself without anything is quite..why wouldn't it...but you add keycaps and mount it on a plate and it is noisy...
So you don't see a sound difference between normal typing and when you hold down a key and fully release it as fast as possible? Because if you fully release the upstroke isn't even slightly dampened by your typing, then you're wasting energy. I'm not saying people completely dampen until the upstroke but your typing and doing a full release is completely different...
And didn't suggest the switch alone is was determines the sound level..there are obviously ways to dampen sound...but I'm using objective measures...you're obviously not....Factually, you're incorrect...MX keyboards are louder than Topre....this isn't just based on my data but others as well..