Skool shootn'

[tp4tissue]

Dang,  it's only December.

/Oxford highschool, Michigan,   3 kill, 8 injure

3 injured in critical

Shooter: age 15 sophomore detained @ juvenile facility,

[chyros]

Eh, don't want to appear insensitive, but these happen pretty much every week in the US, don't they? Oo What's "only December" about this exactly? I don't get it.

[fohat.digs]

Virtually everyone in the US realizes that there are colossal "cultural" problems that are tearing our country apart.

Unfortunately, very few people understand the history of "how" and "why" we lost our way.

This is mostly because over the past 40 years there have been concerted and coordinated efforts to mislead and miseducate the unsuspecting public into imagining that "The Right" is somehow working to improve the process of: " .... in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare ....  " and that "The Left" is somehow working against it.

This process was well-entrenched by the late-1980s through the efforts of Fox TV and AM talk radio, and then exploded exponentially when the interwebs came into common use.

I put considerable effort into raising my children to ensure that they could understand "the Big Picture" but most members of Generation X and beyond are hopelessly angry, lost, and confused as to how we got where we are today. Having never experienced America when it was "great" they have no idea what it would look like if it could become "great again" ....

[fohat.digs]

Let's have a family values Christmas this year!

[noisyturtle]

Super trashy parents if you read up on them. This was very easily avoidable if they put in any effort towards being a mother and father.
Their first reaction to their son shooting up a school was to go on the run. What the ****?

[Leslieann]

most members of Generation X

Gen X started the fight but lacked the numbers and power to make any meaningful change.

They should be renamed the forgotten generation, so forgotten they never even bothered naming them.

[noisyturtle]

most members of Generation X

Gen X started the fight but lacked the numbers and power to make any meaningful change.

They should be renamed the forgotten generation, so forgotten they never even bothered naming them.

Almost everyone around my age looks back at the '90s as the optimal American experience, and I am inclined to agree. I feel so sad for anyone who cannot remember a pre 9/11 World, because it was a better and more innocent time. People were genuinely happier. All the people who were born after 2001 grew up in an angry country, and what a shocker, are still very much angry when they reach adulthood. This is normal to them. Being disenfranchised and mad at the world is all these 20 somethings know, because that's how the world was when they were growing up.

[tp4tissue]

Super trashy parents if you read up on them. This was very easily avoidable if they put in any effort towards being a mother and father.
Their first reaction to their son shooting up a school was to go on the run. What the ?

they look like they probably homebrew meth.   but not to pay for cancer.. the bad kind of breaking bad.

[treeleaf64]

most members of Generation X

Gen X started the fight but lacked the numbers and power to make any meaningful change.

They should be renamed the forgotten generation, so forgotten they never even bothered naming them.

Almost everyone around my age looks back at the '90s as the optimal American experience, and I am inclined to agree. I feel so sad for anyone who cannot remember a pre 9/11 World, because it was a better and more innocent time. People were genuinely happier. All the people who were born after 2001 grew up in an angry country, and what a shocker, are still very much angry when they reach adulthood. This is normal to them. Being disenfranchised and mad at the world is all these 20 somethings know, because that's how the world was when they were growing up.

Why Mr Noisy turtle? Was the average person more friendly? Did you see more work satisfaction? What kind of American culture was there in the 90s to make it a better place?

[fohat.digs]

the optimal American experience

I feel so sad for anyone who cannot remember

because it was a better and more innocent time. People were genuinely happier.

All the people who were born after - grew up in an angry country

In my opinion the hope and prestige of our country peaked when Neil Armstrong stepped onto the Moon at the end of the 1960s.

What you describe is what I would say happened at the end of the 1970s, and then after 2001 it was just ratcheting up the ugly to a new level.

[Leslieann]

Why Mr Noisy turtle? Was the average person more friendly? Did you see more work satisfaction? What kind of American culture was there in the 90s to make it a better place?

I blame crowd sourcing, social media and the ability for anyone to become a "media" outlet. And of course greedy corporate CEOs and media consolidation.
The internet, specifically social media allowed anyone to say anything and spread anything without repercussions and without anyone even fact checking, memes became reality/fact.

Many media outlets, with CNN being one of the first, FIRED their entire editorial staff and switched to crowd sourced information. The first real test of this was during the Boston Marathon Bombing coverage, CNN had TONS of "reporters" on scene each who they gave low end cameras and vying for their shot on tv, you could see them behind the reporting team in the studio waving their arms trying to get their attention "Ooh!, Ooh! Cut to me, I heard something!" they'd cut to that person "so what did you hear {reporters name}?" 
And I kid you not...
"I don't know, but I heard a really loud noise!"
Studio - "what kind of noise, where did it come from and can you get any closer?"
"I don't know and I can't really get any closer but it was LOUD!"
Amazing reporting and it never really got any better.

Sadly they were only the first to do this.
When it was one station or a few stations owned by one company you could combat it, but today only a few companies/people control our news media and they only care about money and the rest is crowd sourced and that's being manipulated.


Politics should be boring, when it's not, something is wrong.
It doesn't belong on a 24 hour news cycle. Debating the merits of a new park in your town and how to pay for it should not come off as a WWE wrestling match with Joe Rogan calling commentary and then both sides returning to the locker room to give interviews and line up a rematch.

[tp4tissue]

switched to crowd sourced information.

Despite having to deal with inaccuracies, it is still possible that within this system, the truth floats to the top.

Whereas in nations without journalistic freedoms, then the human system just gets continuously corrupt with absolutely NO sorting.

Letting information Compete is really the only essential part, and that requires very broad freedom.

The bleeding is the price we pay.

AI should be able to settle this though, so Tp4 is optimistic.

[fohat.digs]

the truth floats to the top.

Do you have legitimate evidence of this?

[noisyturtle]

most members of Generation X

Gen X started the fight but lacked the numbers and power to make any meaningful change.

They should be renamed the forgotten generation, so forgotten they never even bothered naming them.

Almost everyone around my age looks back at the '90s as the optimal American experience, and I am inclined to agree. I feel so sad for anyone who cannot remember a pre 9/11 World, because it was a better and more innocent time. People were genuinely happier. All the people who were born after 2001 grew up in an angry country, and what a shocker, are still very much angry when they reach adulthood. This is normal to them. Being disenfranchised and mad at the world is all these 20 somethings know, because that's how the world was when they were growing up.

Was the average person more friendly?

100% yes people were so friendly back then.
This video always reminds me perfectly of the early 90s vibe, how open and friendly people were. I know it's technically '87, but this is how I remember it.

Everyone was so much more open, and accepting of differences. No shaming, yelling, or confronting. No need to be scared someone might pull a gun on you. The cops actually helped people, sometimes they'd walk around a neighborhood helping people with their house chores.
I believe work satisfaction was higher back then partially because there wasn't teenagers on social media shoving their easy yolo wealth in the faces of people who work hard. Or people dropping 8 figures on things like NFTs just to flex how much money they have to waste. People were just generally more open, and it felt like things could only keep getting better. That the sky was the limit.
Now everyone is so angry, sad, and disenfranchised. And with good reason, because all the evils have not only been allowed to exist, but have been rewarded and continue to thrive. People willingly segregating to support their group-think, as if anyone with a differing opinion doesn't have any right to exist. Corruption being allowed to exist in the open, selfishness and evil being rewarded, stupidity being praised. The World is burning at an exponential rate. The past 10 years, and especially the last 6-7, have been hands down the worst I have ever lived through. Not just on a personal level, but from a Global perspective. I don't think people want good will to triumph any longer. Kindness and acceptance may as well be Santa Claus in 2021.

[fohat.digs]

the last 6-7, have been hands down the worst I have ever lived through.

This is true, and I ascribe it to Trump becoming a hero and role model for all the other haters and losers and failures in the world, because everybody knows that that is what he is, regardless of the absurd facades presented to the contrary. He brought them out from under their rocks and holes and they love him for it.

Honorable people must reject these attitudes and behaviors, absolutely and unequivocally. The human race thrives on hope and withers in fear.

[tp4tissue]

the truth floats to the top.

Do you have legitimate evidence of this?

More people are vaxxed than unvaxxed.

Epstein got in trouble (eventually).

Trump is, NO LONGER, the president.

[noisyturtle]

the last 6-7, have been hands down the worst I have ever lived through.

This is true, and I ascribe it to Trump becoming a hero and role model for all the other haters and losers and failures in the world. He brought them out from under their rocks and holes.

Honorable people must reject these attitudes and behaviors, absolutely and unequivocally. The human races thrives on hope and withers on fear.

You've been through a lot more than most of us on GH as well. Whenever I ask an older person if they think current times are actually worse, or it's just perspective, every single one with zero hesitation say yes, this is the worst of society they have ever witnessed. I am inclined to believe it at this point, and again, feel so genuinely sad for those growing up in this and having it be the only way of life they know. It is painful and heart wrenching, knowing how much better things could seem (seem, or actually be?,) and that people growing up now don't even know how it's possible. Entering adulthood in such state, of COURSE everyone is selfish, disenfranchised, and depressed. And for that to be all you know...

[Faceman76]

We went from someone with diarrhea of the mouth to one who doesn't even know what he's saying at times.  Where have all the good presidential candidates gone?

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[fohat.digs]

this is the worst of society they have ever witnessed

"they have ever witnessed" being the operative concept.

For all the idyllic scenes we imagine in the pre-Industrial ages, life was really really hard for just about every human being (with the possible exception of the very wealthy - surprise!) until the 20th century. The Industrial Revolution, including the harnessing of electricity and advancement of medicine, brought us out of the Dark Ages. Finally, for the first time ever, this started to make life more easily bearable in the developed world. And a key component of that was that income was becoming less unequal.

The 2 World Wars were almost necessary to the closing of the "old ways" of human interaction, and the post-WW2 reconstruction saw a new age emerge for humankind. The US was spared the destruction and thus had a tremendous advantage for a few short decades and enjoyed an amazing age of peace and prosperity that the rest of the developed world was just catching up to. Even racial inequalities were eroding with Brown vs Board of Education and the Civil Rights Act and the War on Poverty. Not that there weren't stains on our society - Vietnam being the worst but not the only one.

But then the plutocrats initiated their campaign to roll back those advances, and when they successfully enshrined Reagan in the presidency they were back on the path to control.

[noisyturtle]

If I understand you're saying; Don't fear, we are only experiencing some temporary growing pains.

True or not, that does make me feel a little better.

[fohat.digs]

I was actually saying that there was a brief window of about 2-3 decades when "we the people" were coming together - as a country - and feeling hopeful for a more equitable and progressive society, which the plutocrats could not tolerate, and so they redoubled their efforts to roll back the tide of progress and re-establish their stranglehold on our society.

How did they do it?
By spreading fear and misinformation. And with the advent of the interwebs the loonies and Russians and bozos were able to join the party pile on.

Lucky for me, I was able to experience the optimistic time.
Unlucky for me, I have watched it unraveling.

[Leslieann]

the truth floats to the top.

Do you have legitimate evidence of this?

More people are vaxxed than unvaxxed.

Epstein got in trouble (eventually).

Trump is, NO LONGER, the president.

Yes, but it took far too long.

[fohat.digs]

Where have all the good presidential candidates gone?

They are around. Obama was a truly excellent president whose main failure was being "too nice" and not pushing hard enough for what he knew to be right.

Biden has the potential to be equally important and possibly transformative, if less personally charismatic. But both men were and are opposed by the full force of the "old" power structure at every turn. For every progressive success they achieved there were multiple others which were completely or partially thwarted by anti-progressive misinformation campaigns.

I don't really get what  "one who doesn't even know what he's saying at times"  is supposed to mean, but maybe you are parroting what the angry right is saying in an attempt to derail Biden's initiatives. If you have doubts about Biden, read some of his speeches (the inauguration was especially good). They are powerful and inspiring.

[tp4tissue]

Bernie would've been a quantum leap...  but shhhhiieee...  you guys let the billionaires win..

[fohat.digs]

Bernie would've been a quantum leap

And Elizabeth would have been even better, because she is smarter and more well-educated.

[fohat.digs]

let the billionaires win

Even a right-wing rag like NewsMax no longer tries to camouflage it.

https://www.newsmax.com/finance/streettalk/covid-pandemic-household-wealth/2021/12/07/id/1047640/?ns_mail_uid=753fe9a6-cfaf-41bb-bc96-51d0d2ab29ae&ns_mail_job=DM280687_12072021&s=acs&dkt_nbr=010102zi5m6j

https://graphics.reuters.com/GLOBAL-ECONOMY/BILLIONAIRES/klvykndqgvg/wealth-inequalty_wealth.jpg

[chyros]

What kind of American culture was there in the 90s to make it a better place?[/size][/color]

Well I can't speak for Noisy but I'd say the 90s definitely had the best music .

[fohat.digs]

Most people probably think that the best music came out when they were 15-25 years old ....

edit - maybe I should have said about 12-22

[tp4tissue]

Most people probably think that the best music came out when they were 15-25 years old ....

No ? Bach began and ended music.

[chyros]

Most people probably think that the best music came out when they were 15-25 years old ....

edit - maybe I should have said about 12-22

I was 3 when the 90s hit .

[phinix]

What kind of American culture was there in the 90s to make it a better place?[/size][/color]

Well I can't speak for Noisy but I'd say the 90s definitely had the best music .

...and movies

[noisyturtle]

Most people probably think that the best music came out when they were 15-25 years old ....

No ? Bach began and ended music.

lol that reminds me of a line in Empire Records

[Leslieann]

Most people probably think that the best music came out when they were 15-25 years old ....

No ? Bach began and ended music.

lol that reminds me of a line in Empire Records

"The fat man walks alone."