Author Topic: PBT Dark second wave (production)  (Read 852156 times)

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Offline LunarisDream

  • Posts: 440
  • Location: Changchun, China
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #600 on: Sat, 23 April 2016, 07:59:43 »
Are you suggesting that I, an unemployed student, should front the money to make my custom board a reality? $350 x 25-50 is no small amount.

Are you suggesting that the community should give you $17500 to make your custom board a reality without any guarantee they'll receive it?

Sounds pretty ridiculous right?

Alright so every single groupbuy is ridiculous with that logic.

It's all trust based, and I feel like I have been around long enough and established myself as a friend to many to deserve that trust.  You may not trust that anyone will deliver, and that's up to you, but keep in mind that there have been many many more successful buys than failures.

Plus there are some locals who would quite literally beat me if I tried to scam anyone. ;)

Yep. I'm a college student and people are trusting me with fifteen grand, and I'm in China. You know how much 15 grand gets you in China? I can stop worrying about rent for the next 8 years if I took it and ran. But people are trusting me with the money, and I my parents did not raise me to betray the trust of others and steal.

Something goes wrong, I do my best to make it right. But if I was supposed to front the money for a GB, well, then that GB ain't happening. Not everyone has $15k to toss around and buy cool stuff for other people and hope to get it back later. The custom board is not just what the organizer wants, which is what Polymer seems to be implying, but what every single buyer wants. It's a dream of a small part of the community, one dream of many, and GB organizers do their best to fulfill those dreams. In the end, most people genuinely care about the community that they've invested so much in. I can't make any excuses for Ivan, nor do I intend to, but most people here are genuinely good.

tl;dr GB organizers are like fairy godmothers, except very few are evil. And fairy godmothers are generally poor.

Offline Polymer

  • Posts: 1188
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #601 on: Sun, 24 April 2016, 11:01:45 »
Are you suggesting that I, an unemployed student, should front the money to make my custom board a reality? $350 x 25-50 is no small amount.

Are you suggesting that the community should give you $17500 to make your custom board a reality without any guarantee they'll receive it?

Sounds pretty ridiculous right?

Alright so every single groupbuy is ridiculous with that logic.

It's all trust based, and I feel like I have been around long enough and established myself as a friend to many to deserve that trust.  You may not trust that anyone will deliver, and that's up to you, but keep in mind that there have been many many more successful buys than failures.

Plus there are some locals who would quite literally beat me if I tried to scam anyone. ;)

Again, what is more ridiculous?

That someone buys the goods up front and sells them at a profit...
Or you get everyone else to go in on something you really wanted but no way to guarantee they get them?

I'm not saying the idea of a GB is ridiculous..it is great for enthusiasts communities...

But THIS community in particular has had more issues than any other I've seen...far more.  And what makes it worse is a good portion of the time the people ripping the community off are long term senior members....It doesn't matter if there are more successful GBs than ones where people are getting ripped off...those should be a very rare occurrence but it isn't..there are just far too many of these...and yes that sucks because I do think most people are honest and would run an honest GB...but there are only a few people I'd buy from on here and, as much as I hate to say it, at some point one of them will probably rip the community off as well...this GB is a perfect example...

Offline Signature

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #602 on: Sun, 24 April 2016, 11:04:22 »
Are you suggesting that I, an unemployed student, should front the money to make my custom board a reality? $350 x 25-50 is no small amount.

Are you suggesting that the community should give you $17500 to make your custom board a reality without any guarantee they'll receive it?

Sounds pretty ridiculous right?

Alright so every single groupbuy is ridiculous with that logic.

It's all trust based, and I feel like I have been around long enough and established myself as a friend to many to deserve that trust.  You may not trust that anyone will deliver, and that's up to you, but keep in mind that there have been many many more successful buys than failures.

Plus there are some locals who would quite literally beat me if I tried to scam anyone. ;)
he is subscribed to the dog newsletter so I can vouch

Rest in peace Timberman

Offline metalliqaz

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #603 on: Sun, 24 April 2016, 12:03:48 »
Are you suggesting that I, an unemployed student, should front the money to make my custom board a reality? $350 x 25-50 is no small amount.

Are you suggesting that the community should give you $17500 to make your custom board a reality without any guarantee they'll receive it?

Sounds pretty ridiculous right?

Alright so every single groupbuy is ridiculous with that logic.

It's all trust based, and I feel like I have been around long enough and established myself as a friend to many to deserve that trust.  You may not trust that anyone will deliver, and that's up to you, but keep in mind that there have been many many more successful buys than failures.

Plus there are some locals who would quite literally beat me if I tried to scam anyone. ;)

If your GB is successful at $350, I'll eat my sock.  First of all, that price point is a pipe dream.  Second, the design is untested.  Third, just trying to assemble and ship the parts for 25-50 keyboards is a huge undertaking on its own, including the logistics of buying and storing all that equipment.  Finally, you've been a member since March 31, 2015.  That isn't all that long, dude.

I did a mini-GB of 7 Epsilons.  It was a huge pain in the ass and I barely pulled it off.  Good luck with yours, brah.

Offline Signature

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #604 on: Sun, 24 April 2016, 13:10:38 »
Are you suggesting that I, an unemployed student, should front the money to make my custom board a reality? $350 x 25-50 is no small amount.

Are you suggesting that the community should give you $17500 to make your custom board a reality without any guarantee they'll receive it?

Sounds pretty ridiculous right?

Alright so every single groupbuy is ridiculous with that logic.

It's all trust based, and I feel like I have been around long enough and established myself as a friend to many to deserve that trust.  You may not trust that anyone will deliver, and that's up to you, but keep in mind that there have been many many more successful buys than failures.

Plus there are some locals who would quite literally beat me if I tried to scam anyone. ;)

If your GB is successful at $350, I'll eat my sock.  First of all, that price point is a pipe dream.  Second, the design is untested.  Third, just trying to assemble and ship the parts for 25-50 keyboards is a huge undertaking on its own, including the logistics of buying and storing all that equipment.  Finally, you've been a member since March 31, 2015.  That isn't all that long, dude.

I did a mini-GB of 7 Epsilons.  It was a huge pain in the ass and I barely pulled it off.  Good luck with yours, brah.
look at my boy bill, he did an amazing job with his GB and it was lots more than 50 sets

Rest in peace Timberman

Offline ceflame

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #605 on: Sun, 24 April 2016, 17:49:56 »
Imagine if there were some type of business entity we could organize group buys through.. so buyers wouldn't have to funnel all their money into one person who may or may not deliver and/or provide periodic updates  ;) ;)

*cough* massdrop *cough*

Offline 27

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #606 on: Sun, 24 April 2016, 17:55:31 »
Imagine if there were some type of business entity we could organize group buys through.. so buyers wouldn't have to funnel all their money into one person who may or may not deliver and/or provide periodic updates  ;) ;)

*cough* massdrop *cough*

Massdrop can also raise costs and doesn't seem to be the best option for high cost, low quantity items.  Just look at the comment section of any GMK sets and you'll see what sort of crowd it attracts.  Nothing against massdrop, it just doesn't seem like the best option for a lot of the groupbuys run here.
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Offline ceflame

  • Posts: 291
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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #607 on: Sun, 24 April 2016, 18:18:37 »
Imagine if there were some type of business entity we could organize group buys through.. so buyers wouldn't have to funnel all their money into one person who may or may not deliver and/or provide periodic updates  ;) ;)

*cough* massdrop *cough*

Massdrop can also raise costs and doesn't seem to be the best option for high cost, low quantity items.  Just look at the comment section of any GMK sets and you'll see what sort of crowd it attracts.  Nothing against massdrop, it just doesn't seem like the best option for a lot of the groupbuys run here.

Posting a Massdrop link to reddit or GH will give it the regular exposure, and more from Massdrop users. Why does it matter what kind of random comments a group buy gets in this hobby anyways? The reason some GMK buys have failed is because nobody likes the sets. If you put something like GMK Hyperfuse on Massdrop, at $165/set, it'd probably still reach MOQ.

For low quantity items, I agree that using the GH format is better, but when you start taking in HUGE orders, like Ivan did, I think Massdrop has a much better infrastructure for organizing and shipping items/parts when they arrive.

I will honestly pay 10-25% more for the guarantee that product the product I paid for will be shipped, and in a timely manner. Nothing against ctrlalt, but I'm sure the last half of people waiting for Hyperfuse would readily agree to a price increase to get their caps months earlier. They work hard, but that's what happens when you have the limited organizing and shipping power of a single person.

Offline ghostjuggernaut

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #608 on: Sun, 24 April 2016, 19:37:00 »
Please take this discussion to its own thread, ideally it's IC that is ongoing.  None of this pertains to the topic at hand, and quite frankly is just clutter.
               

Offline onesassysoccermom

  • Posts: 6
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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #609 on: Tue, 26 April 2016, 14:20:16 »
Cool, looks like I've (we've) been scammed. Waited a year and change checking this thread regularly only to finally come to a conclusion which I had hoped was not the case. Principally, I'm annoyed, but I'm even more disappointed.

See you guys around.

Offline lasttycoon

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #610 on: Wed, 11 May 2016, 11:43:30 »
Should have sent a PayPal dispute while we could.
Kinesis Advantage | Ergodox EZ Browns | RK RC930 | DS 3 Blues

Offline HighNoon

  • Posts: 104
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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #611 on: Wed, 11 May 2016, 11:51:07 »
I remember hearing something about the GH mods looking into this and Ivan's other failed group buys. Anyone know what the current status of that investigation is?

Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #612 on: Wed, 11 May 2016, 12:23:57 »
I remember hearing something about the GH mods looking into this and Ivan's other failed group buys. Anyone know what the current status of that investigation is?



No order link?

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

This gb is long over man. The runner ran off with everyone's monies.

Oh crap just realised - man that sucks. Hope some resolution comes of it some day.

The moderators are trying to get it all worked out; but, what Ivan did, is just plain horrible.

For the record, the Mod team and site Admin are not working on this.  We were not involved with this in any way.  Ivan was a moderator, however he is responsible for his own actions.  Hoffmanmyster did attempt to reach out to him asking for information, but i do not believe he has heard anything back from him.  I am sure if he did, he would have posted in Ivan's threads informing everyone. 

I do hope Ivan sorts this all out though.  It may be a pipe dream at this point, but hope is about all we can have right now.

Offline grav3serker

  • Posts: 236
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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #613 on: Thu, 12 May 2016, 23:19:19 »
I emailed Ivan at the end of January to make sure that he got the change of address since I purchased the set off of another user sometime last year, and he quickly replied with "Sure, it's all fine."

I sent him another email just now to the same email address and I got a failed return from Google.

This confirms he is gone.

Next!

Offline Elrick

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #614 on: Fri, 13 May 2016, 03:12:18 »
I emailed Ivan at the end of January to make sure that he got the change of address since I purchased the set off of another user sometime last year, and he quickly replied with "Sure, it's all fine."

I sent him another email just now to the same email address and I got a failed return from Google.

This confirms he is gone.

Next!


The MODS here on Geekhack Central has already shut down Ivan's Miami Group Buy section, without notifying us poor losers who had handed over all our money to this thieving git.

Get use to losing your money as well on this Group Buy as well.

Welcome to thieving central, called Geekhack.  Hope you enjoy the results here  :p .

Offline lasttycoon

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #615 on: Wed, 18 May 2016, 11:34:34 »
Really sucks. Good lesson to learn though.
Kinesis Advantage | Ergodox EZ Browns | RK RC930 | DS 3 Blues

Offline AKmalamute

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #616 on: Wed, 18 May 2016, 13:27:50 »
Welcome to thieving central, called Geekhack.  Hope you enjoy the results here  :p .
Hey, now. As much as I regret bumping this thread, I'd like to point out that statistically, most GBs are successful, even timely by GB standards.

It's just that the failures all tend to be big, flaming zeppelins taking down everything in their path.  :'(

This is my first failure, in fact. I feel pretty okay for the sheer volume of keyboardicity surrounding me (CalmDepths set, NukaCola novelties, other things) and I guess I feel pretty okay about being sucked in by somebody with a couple years and half a dozen successes under his belt.

 Honestly I'm expecting it wasn't his first decision, either. The hospital probably came after him for sixty grand, and he decided his debt management was more important than his honor & pride. But I also doubt we'll ever hear what really happened; Ivan has clearly made the break from this community.

HHKB-lite2, Dvorak user

Offline Grrizz

  • Posts: 41
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #617 on: Fri, 20 May 2016, 02:31:52 »
Yea this was pretty disappointing, I had a reasonable stake in it but you learn from these experiences and my two take ways going forward would be;

1) Don't let your buyer protection expire.
2) with the exception of a buy that could justify more than 6 months of production and in that case confirm with the supplier directly that orders have been placed and paid for before the buyer protection expires.

Great things can come from group buys that would normally sit behind MOQ and/or price walls but you need to cover your ass when dealing with strangers (regardless of their community standing).

Offline rwarwarwa

  • Posts: 14
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #618 on: Sun, 05 June 2016, 10:55:50 »
what's the status of criminal procedure?

No one ever not going to sue him?


Offline swimmingbird

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #619 on: Mon, 06 June 2016, 01:53:39 »
what's the status of criminal procedure?

No one ever not going to sue him?

Not worth the legal fees unfortunately

Offline rwarwarwa

  • Posts: 14
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #620 on: Mon, 06 June 2016, 02:31:17 »
what's the status of criminal procedure?

No one ever not going to sue him?

Not worth the legal fees unfortunately

Good.
He is obviously happy. Without penalties with money.

Great Justice of America
« Last Edit: Mon, 06 June 2016, 02:32:55 by rwarwarwa »

Offline Baddy126

  • Posts: 108
  • Location: Toronto
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #621 on: Mon, 06 June 2016, 13:02:13 »
what's the status of criminal procedure?

No one ever not going to sue him?

Not worth the legal fees unfortunately

Good.
He is obviously happy. Without penalties with money.

Great Justice of America

No one is stopping you from suing him

Offline swimmingbird

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #622 on: Mon, 06 June 2016, 22:39:17 »
what's the status of criminal procedure?

No one ever not going to sue him?

Not worth the legal fees unfortunately

Good.
He is obviously happy. Without penalties with money.

Great Justice of America

No one is stopping you from suing him

Exactly

Stop expecting other people to do things for you

Offline rwarwarwa

  • Posts: 14
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #623 on: Tue, 07 June 2016, 06:53:03 »
In Korea, I will do.

Actually we had arrested con man.

I don't want financial compensation.

Just I think he must paid his dues.

« Last Edit: Tue, 07 June 2016, 06:57:09 by rwarwarwa »

Offline Hellcatz

  • Posts: 211
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #624 on: Tue, 14 June 2016, 22:11:18 »
It does really suck that he got away without **** happening to him but karma is going to bite him in the ass

Offline dbfj

  • Posts: 20
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #625 on: Fri, 24 June 2016, 20:16:58 »
Would the folks who claim to have met the guy confirm the name on the invoice? A yes or no would suffice.

Offline Hellcatz

  • Posts: 211
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #626 on: Fri, 24 June 2016, 21:27:51 »
May I ask why you need this information?

Offline dbfj

  • Posts: 20
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #627 on: Sat, 25 June 2016, 23:56:49 »
May I ask why you need this information?

Validation that the information is accurate. To save time and confirm jurisdiction.

Offline DanielT

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #628 on: Sun, 26 June 2016, 01:13:03 »
Would the folks who claim to have met the guy confirm the name on the invoice? A yes or no would suffice.
I've sent him stuff and that was the real name.

Offline nickheller

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #629 on: Sun, 26 June 2016, 01:24:10 »
Am sad all over again every time this thread is bumped.  :(
Gotcha. Those sacks look mouth watering.

Offline potatowire

  • Posts: 167
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #630 on: Sun, 26 June 2016, 14:45:33 »
Am sad all over again every time this thread is bumped.  :(

Me too.

Offline dbfj

  • Posts: 20
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #631 on: Mon, 27 June 2016, 14:07:51 »
Would the folks who claim to have met the guy confirm the name on the invoice? A yes or no would suffice.
I've sent him stuff and that was the real name.
Thanks.


Offline kebby

  • Posts: 92
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #632 on: Sat, 09 July 2016, 10:57:03 »
So I'm pitifully unfamiliar with the US legal system. Is there no way to file a criminal complaint or is it of no use? Can I use the Internet Cyber Crime complaint center mentioned here for filing a complaint while not a US citizen? I'd be willing to take part in another GB for a lawsuit at this point just to make this sort of thing less appealing.

I don't know why the other thread got closed but if this isn't the place to discuss this, there definitely should be one. (and this is the only remaining  everyone who has lost in this knows about for sure / could be following).

Offline keyladding

  • Posts: 71
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #633 on: Tue, 27 September 2016, 12:48:44 »
Sounds like you'd have to find him first.

Offline SuperSumo

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #634 on: Thu, 14 December 2017, 12:47:40 »
I'm still pissed about this. Screw you Ivan, wherever you are!

Offline 27

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #635 on: Thu, 14 December 2017, 12:51:02 »
Now that's a necro
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Offline ghostjuggernaut

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #636 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 07:07:09 »
Ill allow it.
               

Offline Rafa_n

  • Posts: 124
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #637 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 07:32:14 »
lmao

Offline MaNiFeX

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #638 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 11:49:17 »
What a way to bounce, though... sorta like Bilbo's 111th birthday party, but with theft.

Offline nickheller

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #639 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 11:56:46 »
Are these shipping yet?
Gotcha. Those sacks look mouth watering.

Offline Michael

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #640 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 12:10:17 »

Offline Atredl

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #641 on: Sat, 16 December 2017, 05:02:54 »
"PBT Dark second wave"

Offline pr0ximity

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #642 on: Sat, 16 December 2017, 15:25:05 »
Probably would have been tight AF just like the first wave, so really he saved everyone money in destroyed stems when you think about it

« Last Edit: Sat, 16 December 2017, 15:26:43 by pr0ximity »

Online sncbraxsc2

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #643 on: Thu, 08 March 2018, 10:01:51 »
Cream Damped Mods Sound Test

Quote
So, logically, ALL of the time between NOW and SpaceRock, is the Test..

Offline FranksNewLiver

  • Posts: 76
Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #644 on: Thu, 08 March 2018, 14:01:18 »
 :eek:
« Last Edit: Thu, 08 March 2018, 15:45:02 by FranksNewLiver »

Offline animaliaparadoxa

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #645 on: Thu, 08 March 2018, 14:14:58 »
Thanks Ivan. I'd rather know than not that this pos is creeping around. Still I'm pissed like it's the first time.


Offline HoffmanMyster

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #646 on: Thu, 08 March 2018, 14:19:33 »
Ivan HAS NOT logged into his account recently.  That was the mod team (me) logging in to see if there was anything of value to be found there, what with the recent ebay activity and happenings outside the forum. 

Offline Waateva

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Re: PBT Dark second wave (production)
« Reply #647 on: Thu, 08 March 2018, 14:49:37 »
Ivan HAS NOT logged into his account recently.  That was the mod team (me) logging in to see if there was anything of value to be found there, what with the recent ebay activity and happenings outside the forum.

Or, has Ivan hacked into Hoff's account to sent this message and throw everyone off his tracks?!

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