[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=108835.0] [img]https://i.imgur.com/Snl6RMK.jpg[/img][/url]
Love the set (or two sets), MacSurfy. I am however a bit weary about the quality of the dyesubbing from Keyreative after the whole KAT Milkshake debacle (misaligned icons, blurry edges, etc.). If this set would be plagued by the same imperfections it would be even more severe, due to its intricate nature. Are you in contact with Keyreative and do you know if they can guarantee that the same errors won't occur with this set?
Can I mix this with the mods from KAT Monochrome? I like their pure icon/no text mods.
Wondering how similar the white and black shades are (Refined vs Monochrome)?
Am a bit in awe of the work and attention to detail you've put into this, MacSurfy. Nothing simple about your design but it exudes simplicity. I'm in for WoB, decided on Text Mods at the finish line. Surprised myself.
never thought i'd ever join a gb that isn't gmk, but here we are :thumb:
In for WoB and BoW !
Thanks again for the French kits !
I'm so confused, why no stepped control? Massive oversight?
Can't decide between icon or text+icon mods. Help!
Can't decide between icon or text+icon mods. Help!
Let me help you: icon
Great job with this!
Everything is so polished on this GB, from all the work on legends, simple kitting for beginners as well as options for non-standard layouts, overall very excited for this!!
I'm getting BoW and WoB for myself and BoW for the missus.
You know what would be even more refined though MacSurfy? VoC.
Maybe a colab? The world deserves it!I'm getting BoW and WoB for myself and BoW for the missus.
You know what would be even more refined though MacSurfy? VoC.
Thank u! VoC? As in Violet on Cream? That's Hiney's set and it's very unlikely to happen with Refined legends :)
Are we going to get wob samples before GB is over? I'd like to see the quality of reverse dye sub before purchasing
This set hurt my AMEX LOL.
I mean... you gotta get a full set in both wob and bow right!?
:thumb:
Some samples to let us know how KAT reverse-dye-sub looks like will be very helpful.
I'm mostly into the WoB sets.
GLWGB!
Not going to share the photo I have of them since the quality was pretty bad.
Some samples to let us know how KAT reverse-dye-sub looks like will be very helpful.
Placed my order. :thumb:
How is the GB going so far? Are all the minimum's going to be met so all the kits will be made?
Show Image(https://i.postimg.cc/bqX3hbvT/KATrefined-Status201008.png)
I have a question:
Is black common black of KAT colors? I want to reduce the cost by buying both white and black but avoiding buying black spacebar kit to save some money this time and buy it later with some kind of other kits with black colors (because it has no legends it is more universal)
Why is KAT Refined Alpha BoW sold out on mykeyboard.eu? Was about to order...
KAT 176 looks to be a good compromise. Though I vote for WS1 if the choice is between KAT WS2 and WS1
To my eyes, KAT WS1 still looks best. I prefer it over KAT176. My 2 cents...I agree with this 1000% The 'thicker' tone helps the legends pop, imho
were the pictures removed?
Samples added to the first post!
Thanks for posting that collection of photos. Looking at the bottom right it's very noticeable how much darker WoB is for GMK compared to KAT. Darker would be nice but seems you're not optimistic. I can live with it but would prefer a 'pure' black. Already ordered, so c'est la vie.Samples added to the first post!
Samples added to the first post!
Damn lol the WOB is like the same ashy trashy grey that TKC got **** over for the early round of IFK Katakana.
But I guess this flies?
What doesn't fly is ppl trying to start **** for no reason.
This is a much better picture. See? Me starting **** was obviously for good reason!Damn lol the WOB is like the same ashy trashy grey that TKC got **** over for the early round of IFK Katakana.
But I guess this flies?
What doesn't fly is ppl trying to start **** for no reason.Show Image(http://img)
This is a much better picture. See? Me starting **** was obviously for good reason!Damn lol the WOB is like the same ashy trashy grey that TKC got **** over for the early round of IFK Katakana.
But I guess this flies?
What doesn't fly is ppl trying to start **** for no reason.Show Image(http://img)
The new BOW legend looks a tad thinner in comparison to WOB legend. I really like the monochrome setup in your signature (BOW alpha, WOB mod), should I be worry about the different legend thickness, or is there a reason behind this?
Oh entered for full white, amazing set, i like the non centered legends :)
I'm in. Can't wait.
Any reason for the F row to be sold out on mykeyboard.eu ?
https://mykeyboard.eu/catalogue/kat-refined-f-row-wob_2796/ (https://mykeyboard.eu/catalogue/kat-refined-f-row-wob_2796/)
Any reason for the F row to be sold out on mykeyboard.eu ?
https://mykeyboard.eu/catalogue/kat-refined-f-row-wob_2796/ (https://mykeyboard.eu/catalogue/kat-refined-f-row-wob_2796/)
Is the KAT profile similar to SA & MT3, just not as tall as either?
given that it was unavailable at mykeyboard i thought that the wob f-row was canceled but it does not look like it here... i hope i will be able to grab one when the extras come in
The site kat-refined.com (https://www.kat-refined.com/) has been down a while.
I can't obsessively drool over my choices :'(
Edit: Link formatting.
Damn... when I finally made up my mind to got for KAT profile and this KAT refined GB has ended...seems that they are making 50% extras or there about, so keep an eye out for those
If anyone else had this on the day the GB ended and you ordered anyway but without the F-Row kit, please reach out to Mykeyboard and see if they can help you out (I'm not promising anything, but worth a shot). I don't want you to be without a kit you actually wanted to order and then have to fight for extras.
If anyone else had this on the day the GB ended and you ordered anyway but without the F-Row kit, please reach out to Mykeyboard and see if they can help you out (I'm not promising anything, but worth a shot). I don't want you to be without a kit you actually wanted to order and then have to fight for extras.
Thank you for your message, was able to reach out mykb to add both F-row set to my order ! :cool: :thumb:
Damn... when I finally made up my mind to got for KAT profile and this KAT refined GB has ended...seems that they are making 50% extras or there about, so keep an eye out for those
Is there a possibility I can pick up a BoW (and/or WoB) Ortho kit? I forgot to grab one.
Is this dye-sub or doubleshot?Dyesub
Quick check-in: wondering if order has been submitted (and paid) to Keycreative yet?
Quick check-in: wondering if order has been submitted (and paid) to Keycreative yet?
Any updates? I appreciate that actual true updates will always be few and far between but I really appreciate when a GB runner keeps a thread somewhat active when the GB is over instead of months of silence.
Hey everybody!
Here's an update from me. Nothing has happened since last. Still waiting to hear back from Keyreative on dates and more samples.
I know it's much too early for this yet (or late :/), but do you have any plans for a R2? KAT sets are great for multi-language support, and I was thinking Cyrillic alphas fit just right with a grotesque font. I know I would absolutely kill for something like this:Show Image(https://i.postimg.cc/Y2Bf1t54/cyrillic.png)
I hope this one makes an R2.. or someone with nordeuk set doesnt want their bow :)I bought Nordeuk but only need the UK keys. Is this any help to you?
I hope this one makes an R2.. or someone with nordeuk set doesnt want their bow :)I bought Nordeuk but only need the UK keys. Is this any help to you?
I hope this one makes an R2.. or someone with nordeuk set doesnt want their bow :)
prayn for that R2... maybe a WoB set delicious
Still nothing to report on.. sorry
KAT explosion GB ran before refined did and is estimated for Q3 (based on CK's estimates) at the moment. I think we can expect KAT refined to arrive late Q4 or early 2022 hopefully?
Going by the KAT Arctic pics that we are starting to see, this set needs to be double shot, or cancelled.
Rev dye sub is just not there, at least for KAT.
Going by the KAT Arctic pics that we are starting to see, this set needs to be double shot, or cancelled.
Rev dye sub is just not there, at least for KAT.
Was Arctic really that bad? The only part I saw that wasn’t the greatest was the occasional misalignment. And the samples for WoB Refined looked good. I doubt they’d do doubleshot for this set anyway since it uses nonstandard legends, and the sharp edges of the font don’t really translate well either.
Hey! So, It just came to my attention that sets with normal dye subbing can have quite some problems. I don't care that much for misalignment, if it's not too bad. But my main concern is what have been happening regarding bleeding of the font after some months, I think, of use. The pic is not mine, but here is a reference:
(Attachment Link)
This is from Milkshake and I think was posted on the biip discord. A user, on the Hyperfuse discord did also confirm that the bleed happened with his KAT Alpha set. I really think that this will be the case for the BoW part of KAT Refined. I'm trying to convince myself that this is not a dealbreaker, but tbh, for me, the bleed is alot worse than yellowing or shine, from gmk, for an example. This worries me quite a bit.
Hey! So, It just came to my attention that sets with normal dye subbing can have quite some problems. I don't care that much for misalignment, if it's not too bad. But my main concern is what have been happening regarding bleeding of the font after some months, I think, of use. The pic is not mine, but here is a reference:
(Attachment Link)
This is from Milkshake and I think was posted on the biip discord. A user, on the Hyperfuse discord did also confirm that the bleed happened with his KAT Alpha set. I really think that this will be the case for the BoW part of KAT Refined. I'm trying to convince myself that this is not a dealbreaker, but tbh, for me, the bleed is alot worse than yellowing or shine, from gmk, for an example. This worries me quite a bit.
Oh, no. That is a complete dealbreaker for me. Waiting a year or more for a set that doesn’t even last that long and goes for a premium price is 100% unacceptable. I never thought I’d have to join the “doubleshot or no” group but hell, misalignment and color matching is pretty minor compared to this which actually ruins legibility.
If it’s gonna stay dyesub I really will have to cancel my order.
Thank you so much for letting us know about this! I was aware that dyesub could have bleed problems in production, but I didn’t realise these problems would appear tenfold with use. It’ll probably be worse with the WoB actually. Do you know if people have experienced this with ePBT, CRP or any of the other dyesubbers as well, or is this a KAT defect specifically?
(KAT Drifter, by the way.)
The milkshake was done using the older equipment and system.
I've been using the KAT ALPHA V1.1(which seems to use the newer system) every day for about 5 months now and I'm not experiencing any defects.
Further information about this could be found here
https://en.zfrontier.com/blogs/project-updates/202101-kat
That being said, the Arctic product sample must have been made in their newer equipment;
And them having alignment issues do concern me a lot tbh.
I've been using my KPRepublic 9009 set for a year and have absolutely no issues, they are exactly the same as when I got them.
How a product almost twice the price and backed by the biggest vendors in the hobby can be so freaking bad baffles me.
This is unacceptable tbh, between the product issues and the lack of communication from zF and Keyreative, why does the community keep running KAT and KAM sets? This is a joke, we are funding an experiment with awful results.
Only praises for MacSurfy because he has tried his best with Refined, but my experience with the other KAT set I ordered (Explosion) has been much worse, so I have no hope on Keyreative left
The milkshake was done using the older equipment and system.
I've been using the KAT ALPHA V1.1(which seems to use the newer system) every day for about 5 months now and I'm not experiencing any defects.
Further information about this could be found here
https://en.zfrontier.com/blogs/project-updates/202101-kat
That being said, the Arctic product sample must have been made in their newer equipment;
And them having alignment issues do concern me a lot tbh.
Oh this is good, hope everything goes fine then. The bleeding problems that I saw were on Milkshake and Alpha, probably V1.
IMO alignment is key to a set like Refined. It's a simple WoB color wise, the real work was done in refining the legends, and if that's not on point in production then what's the raison d'etre?
how, exactly, would you jump ship? monies already paid to vendor. gb people just wait for updates and eventual delivery. after more than a year of covid disruptions and extended supply chain issues i'm likely done with gb's for a while while production and delivery get sorted. :-[
in the future my money will go only towards projects/manufacturers that show evidence of their ability to produce a quality product in something close to the promised amount of time. :D
The design doesn't allow for doubleshots. It simply can't.
Only thing we can do is just hope that **** don't happen in production.
The Refined uses a non-round fonts with sharp edges. And doubleshots can't do that.
And the font is one of the fundamental design choices of this set.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106725.0
The Refined uses a non-round fonts with sharp edges. And doubleshots can't do that.
And the font is one of the fundamental design choices of this set.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106725.0
I do completely understand your point. But if there is any interest, on the part of the designer/runner, I think it would be interesting to actually test this out, especially since there are other sets comitting fully to doubleshot.
I have joined several KAT GBs that haven't switched to doubleshots(Space Cadet, Iron, and this),
and honestly given up hopes on those after getting the Kitty KAT (It does use the old machines, but meh).
I do love the crisp legends on doubleshot keycaps, so despite sounding like I'm against it, I do really wish for every past KAT GBs (or future GBs for that matter) to shift to using doubleshots.
It's just that I can't really see it happening.
I have joined several KAT GBs that haven't switched to doubleshots(Space Cadet, Iron, and this),
and honestly given up hopes on those after getting the Kitty KAT (It does use the old machines, but meh).
I do love the crisp legends on doubleshot keycaps, so despite sounding like I'm against it, I do really wish for every past KAT GBs (or future GBs for that matter) to shift to using doubleshots.
It's just that I can't really see it happening.
That’s my stance on it also. What problems did you find with Kitty KAT? From what I’ve heard of Arctic I’m not sure it’s just old machines at fault.
I have joined several KAT GBs that haven't switched to doubleshots(Space Cadet, Iron, and this),
and honestly given up hopes on those after getting the Kitty KAT (It does use the old machines, but meh).
I do love the crisp legends on doubleshot keycaps, so despite sounding like I'm against it, I do really wish for every past KAT GBs (or future GBs for that matter) to shift to using doubleshots.
It's just that I can't really see it happening.
That’s my stance on it also. What problems did you find with Kitty KAT? From what I’ve heard of Arctic I’m not sure it’s just old machines at fault.
Unevenness in color and matt-ness, scratch marks on keytops, shiny edges, misaligned legends, and minor shrinkage of some keys.
Yeah, the shrunken keys from the Arctic I've seen were unacceptable IMHO.
I love the typing experience itself and the sound the KAT profile makes.
It's such a shame that the manufacture is incapable.
I have joined several KAT GBs that haven't switched to doubleshots(Space Cadet, Iron, and this),
and honestly given up hopes on those after getting the Kitty KAT (It does use the old machines, but meh).
I do love the crisp legends on doubleshot keycaps, so despite sounding like I'm against it, I do really wish for every past KAT GBs (or future GBs for that matter) to shift to using doubleshots.
It's just that I can't really see it happening.
Shrinkage is definitely one the worst of the problems on my list, really hope that doesn't happen. Even if it is uniform throughout the whole set, the extra space among the keycaps on any board would definitely annoy me. As it already did on some topre sets that I used to have. Shrinkage and bleeding, hope the "To Worry" list doesn't grow, lol. The rest is bad, but passable imo. But definitely will consider that in future KAT gbs.
That’s my stance on it also. What problems did you find with Kitty KAT? From what I’ve heard of Arctic I’m not sure it’s just old machines at fault.
Unevenness in color and matt-ness, scratch marks on keytops, shiny edges, misaligned legends, and minor shrinkage of some keys.
Yeah, the shrunken keys from the Arctic I've seen were unacceptable IMHO.
I love the typing experience itself and the sound the KAT profile makes.
It's such a shame that the manufacture is incapable.
Thanks for sharing your experience. I’ve seen the shiny edges and scratches on KAM Wraith at the biip discord. The shrunken mods on Arctic were still the worst I’ve seen, though. I worry about that because I went BoW Alphas and WoB Mods, and if their current reverse dyesub of darker colors can cause that amount of shrinkage, I’m gonna have a bad time D:
The worst part is, I’m not even sure going doubleshot would solve all these issues. The color and print issues, maybe, but the shrinking and imperfections like scratches could still be there.
But by God, the profile is nice. They struck gold and lost it, so far.
I love the typing experience itself and the sound the KAT profile makes.
It's such a shame that the manufacture is incapable.
But by God, the profile is nice. They struck gold and lost it, so far.
incase if anyone was looking, ETA is apparently Dec 2021
merry christmas folks
incase if anyone was looking, ETA is apparently Dec 2021
merry christmas folks
Where did you get that info? Also, I will not believe it before I have the caps in hand. ;)
/Johannes
sad to ear, especially in the middle of so many KAT GB currently waiting
Glad you finally heard back! Any details?
I just heard from the manu out of the blue. We are apparently very close to going in to production. A lot earlier than I expected to be honest but this is good news for us all. Still have some things I need to sort out but I will keep you guys posted.
Full layout sample set is done. Will be sent to me today so will hopefully have something to show you guys next week. If everything is OK we will move in to production. Exciting!
Full layout sample set is done. Will be sent to me today so will hopefully have something to show you guys next week. If everything is OK we will move in to production. Exciting!
I have received the new samples. Unfortunately there are issues with them, so we won't be heading in to production now. I will order new samples but expect further delays. Hopefully we can still have it in our hands this year though, but we will see.
I have received the new samples. Unfortunately there are issues with them, so we won't be heading in to production now. I will order new samples but expect further delays. Hopefully we can still have it in our hands this year though, but we will see.
Thanks for your update :-)
Just out of curiosity, and maybe to benchmark the state for other GBs with Keyreative: can you share with us the issues you found?
I have received the new samples. Unfortunately there are issues with them, so we won't be heading in to production now. I will order new samples but expect further delays. Hopefully we can still have it in our hands this year though, but we will see.
I have received the new samples. Unfortunately there are issues with them, so we won't be heading in to production now. I will order new samples but expect further delays. Hopefully we can still have it in our hands this year though, but we will see.
Aw, that's a bummer. I imagine with the non-centered legends the results look a lot like KAM Wraith, which had some alignment mishaps too. Not sure how fixable it is, though. If the next samples have similar issues it probably won't be worth delaying production much longer.
No chance we could see the samples anyway? Curious to see how the BoW and WoB look together.
I haven't paid much attention or I'm mixing it up with KAT Monochrome, but is this 2-shot now?That’s Monochrome.
Here is a potato photo I took earlier to send off to Keyreative. Sorry about the poor lighting/exposure.Thank you for posting the photo! And you’re right, horizontal alignment issues on non-centered legends look conspicuously wrong. Wraith had a similar issue, with some legends well spaced and some about to fall off :/
You can clearly see a height difference, but even more so the horizontal position of the legends. 'R' vs. 'M' for instance. Big difference.
Will Mekibo offer potential refunds on this? Other vendors have started doing it for other KAT sets (or at least... one that I know of, Atlantis).
It definitely is a bummer with all the delays on KAT sets. But that's the risk we all assume when joining a group buy. If a small vendor like Mekibo can't afford to offer a refund, then I find it hard to blame them. We all knew the risk before joining.
It's over twice the wait-time and there is no clear ETA. Everything got delayed with Covid, I get that, but professionals owe ETAs to paying customers. We are not getting much here.
(yes I know it's unlikely McSurfy dictates Mekibo's cancellation policy changes. Just asking on here, just-in-case)
Will Mekibo offer potential refunds on this? Other vendors have started doing it for other KAT sets (or at least... one that I know of, Atlantis).Generally no. GB being delayed is generally not a reason for refunds. YMMV though.
It's over twice the wait-time and there is no clear ETA. Everything got delayed with Covid, I get that, but professionals owe ETAs to paying customers. We are not getting much here.
(yes I know it's unlikely McSurfy dictates Mekibo's cancellation policy changes. Just asking on here, just-in-case)
Will Mekibo offer potential refunds on this? Other vendors have started doing it for other KAT sets (or at least... one that I know of, Atlantis).
It's over twice the wait-time and there is no clear ETA. Everything got delayed with Covid, I get that, but professionals owe ETAs to paying customers. We are not getting much here.
(yes I know it's unlikely McSurfy dictates Mekibo's cancellation policy changes. Just asking on here, just-in-case)
It's over twice the wait-time and there is no clear ETA.It was supposed to be delivered may/june and was pushed to September not long after. I am struggling with how you get that to be double the time that was first communicated.
Everything got delayed with Covid, I get that, but professionals owe ETAs to paying customers. We are not getting much here.I have communicated as well as I can, but it's also pointless to give you set ETA's when they will not be met anyway. Then you would be pissed about that. It's all out of my hands. The last (I hope) samples have been ordered a while back and if they come back good I am assuming we can move in to production pretty fast. I would guess an ETA of november/december (which is still not twice the wait time :cool:)
i think the lack of professionalism was orientated toward keyreative, with their complete lack of communication on some GB, low quality samples and unmet ETA after unmet ETA, i do understand that Covid hit them too, but i feel like there would be far less frustrated peoples if communication was a bit better.
i think the lack of professionalism was orientated toward keyreative, with their complete lack of communication on some GB, low quality samples and unmet ETA after unmet ETA, i do understand that Covid hit them too, but i feel like there would be far less frustrated peoples if communication was a bit better.
From my experience (my business uses Asia for a significant amount of our supply chain) lack of communication and lack of control are the norm right now. COVID has made manufacturing and shipping so unpredictable that it's next to impossible to provide solid lead-times. My expectations are very low at the moment.
i think the lack of professionalism was orientated toward keyreative, with their complete lack of communication on some GB, low quality samples and unmet ETA after unmet ETA, i do understand that Covid hit them too, but i feel like there would be far less frustrated peoples if communication was a bit better.
From my experience (my business uses Asia for a significant amount of our supply chain) lack of communication and lack of control are the norm right now. COVID has made manufacturing and shipping so unpredictable that it's next to impossible to provide solid lead-times. My expectations are very low at the moment.
No news regarding the new samples yet, hoping to recieve them very soon though since its been a few weeks from the last batch.
I have asked for a status report on the new samples but have not heard back yet. Will let you guys know as soon as I hear something. Sorry for the bad news.
Not sure if it was asked already, is KAT Refined still dye-sub or it changed to doubleshot like some other KAT sets?
New samples came in today. I have not had the time to properly study them but from the two checks I did I can see that the improvement is big from last time. The only thing I can see right now is that BoW and WoB have slightly different padding around the legends. It is not ideal, but if this is the only issue then I would say it is passable. I am honestly not sure how close to perfection we can get them with the dye sub process. This might be it.
Oh, we are also next in line for production should the samples be approved. We're close! Thanks for hanging in there :thumb:
New samples came in today. I have not had the time to properly study them but from the two checks I did I can see that the improvement is big from last time. The only thing I can see right now is that BoW and WoB have slightly different padding around the legends. It is not ideal, but if this is the only issue then I would say it is passable. I am honestly not sure how close to perfection we can get them with the dye sub process. This might be it.
Oh, we are also next in line for production should the samples be approved. We're close! Thanks for hanging in there :thumb:
They got back to me and told me that there is only so much they can do with prototype samples since it is a different process than the actual production process. The misalignments will always be there and more pronounced in prototypes.
Hi, is it possible to see photos of the samples they sent for transparency?
Thanks
Hi, is it possible to see photos of the samples they sent for transparency?
Thanks
This tbh.
Is it possible for the vendors to offer refunds at this point? This wait has gone on too long.
Hi, is it possible to see photos of the samples they sent for transparency?
Thanks
This tbh.
Is it possible for the vendors to offer refunds at this point? This wait has gone on too long.
better to ask the vendor
Hi, is it possible to see photos of the samples they sent for transparency?
Thanks
Hi, is it possible to see photos of the samples they sent for transparency?
Thanks
Would be nice to see something, select keycaps without the alignment issues is a-ok.
like others have said, KAT typing feel is great but holy **** they cant produce a single set without issues. better off just using a sharpie and writing legends on blanks.
glad i started sitting KAT out early and only have 1 more set to deal with this non sense.
Hi, is it possible to see photos of the samples they sent for transparency?
Thanks
Would be nice to see something, select keycaps without the alignment issues is a-ok.
Photos will come a little bit later.. 8-10 days or so.
Hi, is it possible to see photos of the samples they sent for transparency?
Thanks
This tbh.
Is it possible for the vendors to offer refunds at this point? This wait has gone on too long.
Hi, is it possible to see photos of the samples they sent for transparency?
Thanks
This tbh.
Is it possible for the vendors to offer refunds at this point? This wait has gone on too long.
Some of the other vendors have already offered refunds for KAT group buys, including Cannonkeys. While, I am sure it was difficult to manage, I think offering those refunds was a very good thing... TX Keyboards, that is now Mekibo has made no such offering, or has even hinted that they would be willing to (as far as I am aware). If you look at Mekibo's "Group Buy Policy" page on their webiste, it explicitly states that there will be NO refunds outside of the group buy period. Once the group buy ends, that is the end of any refund requests. It might be worth emailing them and asking about it, because you never know; but with the website changing from TX Keyboards to Mekibo, that just makes me assume that refunds from the previous TX Keyboards US website are most likely not possible. Like I said though, it is certainly worth a shot!
Are you saying that Mekibo will be offering a refund option?
An image from the Discord server:Show Image(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/738858289915232347/916691131641778196/20211204_150214.jpg)
It is worth noting, however, that Keyreative has advised that they will continue to generate production samples as the process continues, so this batch is not a final round of samples. For this reason, choosing to cancel based on the last round of samples is, essentially, meaningless. I believe Mekibo is offering the option because some people have expressed frustration with the wait time. Since the production order has presumably already been placed with Keyreative, it's likely that canceled orders are just going to be added to the Mekibo extras pool. Which will ultimately be sold at a higher price after the GB orders are shipped. Cancelling may get you your money back now, but I imagine it will end up costing you more when you get the urge to grab extras later.
An image from the Discord server:Show Image(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/738858289915232347/916691131641778196/20211204_150214.jpg)
It is worth noting, however, that Keyreative has advised that they will continue to generate production samples as the process continues, so this batch is not a final round of samples. For this reason, choosing to cancel based on the last round of samples is, essentially, meaningless. I believe Mekibo is offering the option because some people have expressed frustration with the wait time. Since the production order has presumably already been placed with Keyreative, it's likely that canceled orders are just going to be added to the Mekibo extras pool. Which will ultimately be sold at a higher price after the GB orders are shipped. Cancelling may get you your money back now, but I imagine it will end up costing you more when you get the urge to grab extras later.
Fact. Well said. Unless they need the money back, folks are almost better off waiting and selling at extras cost themselves. Maybe that difference pays for your patience eventually.
I will post more photos for you guys tomorrow if that helps in your decision.
Is there any way to confirm whether the production caps will have the original KAT profile? Or the changed profile being shown with early recipients of KAT Cyberspace?The recent samples for Refined have reinforced stems, which is a sign that they’re using the new molds/changed profile. Black reverse dyesub really needs reinforced stems to prevent warping, so I don’t think it’s something that can be changed. If it bothers you, cancelling seems like a good idea (unfortunately :().
Is there any way to confirm whether the production caps will have the original KAT profile? Or the changed profile being shown with early recipients of KAT Cyberspace?I have spoken to zF regarding this and he explained that KAT Cyberspace is using a semi-translucent plastic with GiD agents mixed in, so not their regular PBT blend and that would show small physical characteristic difference.
I sent in my cancellation order today because I am quite concerned that the profile could be changed without any notice. That's too big of a risk IMO, but if there's a way to confirm the original profile, I may have a few days to "un-cancel" my order with Mekibo.
I have spoken to zF regarding this and he explained that KAT Cyberspace is using a semi-translucent plastic with GiD agents mixed in, so not their regular PBT blend and that would show small physical characteristic difference.
Moreover, in order for the sculpt to change dramatically, it will require Keycreative to overhaul their jigs used for dyesubbing which is not what they are doing.
We have requested to have both KAT Alphas (old molds) and KAT Refined’s next round of samples to be sent at the same time for comparison. Short answer is yes, the height profile will stay the same.
I have spoken to zF regarding this and he explained that KAT Cyberspace is using a semi-translucent plastic with GiD agents mixed in, so not their regular PBT blend and that would show small physical characteristic difference.
Moreover, in order for the sculpt to change dramatically, it will require Keycreative to overhaul their jigs used for dyesubbing which is not what they are doing.
We have requested to have both KAT Alphas (old molds) and KAT Refined’s next round of samples to be sent at the same time for comparison. Short answer is yes, the height profile will stay the same.
so if I'm understanding correctly, the upshot is that the weird shape of KAT Cyberspace is a result of the GiD plastic, not a change/update to KAT profile? and that Refined should look the way KAT usually looks?
I have spoken to zF regarding this and he explained that KAT Cyberspace is using a semi-translucent plastic with GiD agents mixed in, so not their regular PBT blend and that would show small physical characteristic difference.
Moreover, in order for the sculpt to change dramatically, it will require Keycreative to overhaul their jigs used for dyesubbing which is not what they are doing.
We have requested to have both KAT Alphas (old molds) and KAT Refined’s next round of samples to be sent at the same time for comparison. Short answer is yes, the height profile will stay the same.
so if I'm understanding correctly, the upshot is that the weird shape of KAT Cyberspace is a result of the GiD plastic, not a change/update to KAT profile? and that Refined should look the way KAT usually looks?
That is correct. Any changes in the shape isn't intentional.
I have requested both KAT Alphas and KAT Refined samples to be sent at the same time to compare.
I think it looks a bit more like a cherry profile cap. Still different of course.. but approaching cherry with spherical tops.
I guess that's a good thing.
I think it looks a bit more like a cherry profile cap. Still different of course.. but approaching cherry with spherical tops.
I guess that's a good thing.
If I wanted a Cherry-like profile I would’ve bought keycaps from any other manufacturer and avoid all of keyreative’s problems. This is my first keycap GB, and I joined because that was about the time when pictures of Eternal were getting around and showcasing the profile. It doesn’t seem right to me that keyreative can then make changes to the profile over the course of a year or two without warning. The profile was the one redeeming thing about the entire manufacturer.
Before this discussion blows up completely (like it often does in this community) I am going to post this photo I made of an old cap vs. the new.
Maybe the difference is more pronounced on other rows? I don't know. Could be, but I have nothing to compare against.
From my understanding the Cyberspace caps had different materials so it had an impact on the sculpt/shape.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/PiNZwDy.jpg)
sorry but these two caps look markedly different: the new cap is taller and narrower at the top, and the curves of the side walls have changed. imo it's one thing for Keyreative to move slowly or switch to doubleshot, but to change the physical shape of the profile itself is beyond the pale
sorry but these two caps look markedly different: the new cap is taller and narrower at the top, and the curves of the side walls have changed. imo it's one thing for Keyreative to move slowly or switch to doubleshot, but to change the physical shape of the profile itself is beyond the pale
okay, the two posts above have convinced me for the time being. with my apologies, I will look forward to seeing the set in person and hope that the differences really are negligible.
Keyreative shared their estimated KAT/KAM production schedule - https://en.zfrontier.com/blogs/project-updates/keyreative-keyset-progress-reportShow Image(https://i.postimg.cc/VYpQKr4r/220106-vis-Keyreative-Keyset-Progress-Report.png)
As someone who is in the gb for both sets Thank You! for the consistant updates, also wanted to share some photo's comparision of kat Lich on left and kat cyberspace on right.I think it looks a bit more like a cherry profile cap. Still different of course.. but approaching cherry with spherical tops.
I guess that's a good thing.
If I wanted a Cherry-like profile I would’ve bought keycaps from any other manufacturer and avoid all of keyreative’s problems. This is my first keycap GB, and I joined because that was about the time when pictures of Eternal were getting around and showcasing the profile. It doesn’t seem right to me that keyreative can then make changes to the profile over the course of a year or two without warning. The profile was the one redeeming thing about the entire manufacturer.
Before this discussion blows up completely (like it often does in this community) I am going to post this photo I made of an old cap vs. the new.
Maybe the difference is more pronounced on other rows? I don't know. Could be, but I have nothing to compare against.
From my understanding the Cyberspace caps had different materials so it had an impact on the sculpt/shape.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/PiNZwDy.jpg)
As someone who is in the gb for both sets Thank You! for the consistant updates, also wanted to share some photo's comparision of kat Lich on left and kat cyberspace on right.I think it looks a bit more like a cherry profile cap. Still different of course.. but approaching cherry with spherical tops.
I guess that's a good thing.
If I wanted a Cherry-like profile I would’ve bought keycaps from any other manufacturer and avoid all of keyreative’s problems. This is my first keycap GB, and I joined because that was about the time when pictures of Eternal were getting around and showcasing the profile. It doesn’t seem right to me that keyreative can then make changes to the profile over the course of a year or two without warning. The profile was the one redeeming thing about the entire manufacturer.
Before this discussion blows up completely (like it often does in this community) I am going to post this photo I made of an old cap vs. the new.
Maybe the difference is more pronounced on other rows? I don't know. Could be, but I have nothing to compare against.
From my understanding the Cyberspace caps had different materials so it had an impact on the sculpt/shape.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/PiNZwDy.jpg)
The typing feel is completely different there is less surface area for your fingers on new molds just not as good as older mold. Feels like keycreative attempted new mold to save on material. Really hope kat refined can use the original mold for production.
https://imgur.com/wsN8jjv[/img]
https://imgur.com/E5pFFid[/img]
https://imgur.com/WnTSiai[/img]
Hey MacSurfy, do you have an update on production?was wondering the same tho :D
I am also waiting for confirmation. Sent them two mails about this already but I have not heard anything back.
Will let you know as soon as I know more.
I am also waiting for confirmation. Sent them two mails about this already but I have not heard anything back.
Will let you know as soon as I know more.
Uhh by their schedule, shouldn't production be done now?
A little update from me: I just heard back from them today and apparently the set is in production so that's good news.
First production samples just landed.
First production samples just landed.
Looking really good! Alignment and colours look pretty neat, even on WoB. There doesn’t seem to be KAM Wraith fading around the homing bars either. Not sure how it’ll be for all sets, but thank you for pushing KR to up their game ;D
we'll be lucky to get them this year, there is like 20 different GB in queue right now
1) What is current delivery ETA?
2) For those of us who ordered Ergodox keys too, will they be included in the same shipment?
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Are these being shipped from vendors now?
the stem of stepped caps that i got broke out of the box. is there a way to get a replacement?
Seems like most (all?) vendors have received shipping notifications so all kits should be on their way. No idea how long it will take though, but hopefully you all have your stuff soon.
Here are some photos of my boards donning KAT Refined - the legend is great! KAT as a profile is awesome, I immediately swap out the MT3 ABS sets with these.If you look on the first page you can see both bow wob alpha only comes with one set of homing bar keys your set is correct.
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
Wondering if anybody has similar issues:
- the WOB set I got from GB by local vendor - the WOB alpha has both scooped and barred homing keys
- the BOW set I got 2nd hand from a guy who bought through zFrontier - the alpha kit is missing scooped homing keys, barred homing keys are still there. This must be poor QC from the factory because the kit once I got it was still 100% sealed.
Overall, happy with almost 2 years waiting!
The scooped homing keys were snuck into WoB by Keyreative because of the difficulty they have trying to dye the area around the homing bar. They really should've included them on BoW as well though to balance the sets, that's such a weird move.
Where are my keycaps!!!!!!!!!!
Do these win the world record for the longest lasting group buy? Seems like it to me. :mad:
Where are my keycaps!!!!!!!!!!
Do these win the world record for the longest lasting group buy? Seems like it to me. :mad:
Where are my keycaps!!!!!!!!!!
Do these win the world record for the longest lasting group buy? Seems like it to me. :mad:
We are trying to ship as quickly as we can
Received my sets yesterday (all BOW) and everything looks to be in order! I haven't put them on a board yet, but the quality and alignment looks pretty good out of the box and I'm happy with them. Now to see if I even like the profile :D MacSurfy, thank you for the sweet design and regular updates!
I received my WoB and BoW sets yesterday. They look good, but these new KAT sets are more KAT v2 than OG KAT. Comparing KAT Alpha side-by-side with KAT Refined and Iron, the sculpt doesn't seem to be as pronounced. Also, the texture and typing feel doesn't feel quite as solid as it was on OG KAT (although my gram scale says they weight the same, at least to the tenth of a gram). Edit: the texture and feel does still feel quite good and I'm probably splitting hairs a bit too finely here.
legends are super crisp and seem to be well centered on the sets I've opened.
Where can I get a set if I missed the GB with almost two years? (:
The listed vendors do not have any ):
Had the same experience, WoB came with scooped and BoW didn't 😂 Pretty weird.
My f-row BoW kit came with 2 Insert keys instead of a Scroll lock key, complained with zFrontier and still no answer more than a week later...
Didn't receive mine yet, it's en route to mk.eu, but I bet it the same molds as KAT Space Cadet which was already different from KAT Milkshake. I won the two (and over KAT sets) and although they are different I love them just as much.I received mine and they are definitely not the same as my previous KAT keycaps. The area of the top of the keycap you press is much smaller and the whole keycaps are differently shaped. Perhaps to save plastic? It feels more like I'm typing on cherry keycaps instead of KAT. I really appreciate the work MacSurfy put into this set though. They look amazing. It is a shame they had to change the molds without telling anyone.
Hello, I received my key caps on Tuesday (20/9) although only got round to opening them up today. They are very nice and worth the wait. But unfortunately I have a problem with my order - missing spacebars. Can anyone help me out and confirm what spacebars should have been with the alphas kits please? I thought there should have been two spacebars in the alphas kit, one being 6.25U and one 7U. Is that right or did I make an error when I ordered by not including the spacebars kit in addition to the alphas kit? Either way, sadly I am missing the spacebars which I thought should have been in the alphas kit. I see others saying that the spacebars were packaged separately loose in the box but that was not the case for me. I've opened every kit box and they are not in any of the other trays. Feeling quite sad as I was looking forward to putting this kit on my board but a missing spacebar is a fairly large omission, although so is any missing key I guess :(You should get one spacebar in the plastic holder thing and one inside the box itself beside the case in a plastic wrap similar to what computer parts come in. Hopefully your vendor has some extra.
I have reached out to my vendor, mykeyboard.eu, and I hope they can help although I see there are no extras for sale on the website at this time.
Post modified to put in the actual date I received the caps so as not to mislead anyone - I previously wrote it was last week however I got an email about the delivery last week but the actual delivery was Tuesday this week.
So, for you guys who have received your sets, how are they?
How do they feel when you're typing?
And compared to unrefined KAT?
So, for you guys who have received your sets, how are they?I like mine quite a lot design wise. They are much... sharper? than unrefined KAT sets. I prefer the feel/sound of those ones but the refinement on lettering and color on this set is absolutely unmatched so they stay on my current board and the one upcoming.
How do they feel when you're typing?
And compared to unrefined KAT?
Any idea when mekibo will run extras?
I just went to install my set today and noticed a home bar is on the H key instead of the J. This is a total dealbreaker for me, because I rely on the home keys. I also only got one space bar, but I got the one I need, so I can let this go. I sent the vendor a message, but I'm quite bummed right now. I took it for granted that the kit would be correct...
I just went to install my set today and noticed a home bar is on the H key instead of the J. This is a total dealbreaker for me, because I rely on the home keys. I also only got one space bar, but I got the one I need, so I can let this go. I sent the vendor a message, but I'm quite bummed right now. I took it for granted that the kit would be correct...
Are you sure you only got one spacebar? Many ppl have missed that the extra spacebar comes separate outside of the box. Hope you didn't throw away your package yet :)