What Linux Distro do the Linux users of GH use?

[fohat.digs]

Thank you.

I'm not sure how to interpret what I am looking at here.

[suicidal_orange]

There are three things in alsamixer - volume sliders (the long bars), multiple choice options (text) and on/off boxes (below some volume sliders and alone like "S/PDIF" in your second pic.  Pressing left and right arrows moves your focus (shown by the < LABEL >) and up and down moves the sliders and swaps between the options above the focused item.  Obviously () to toggle the on/off boxes you press M!

Sounds like you're recording from the "Input" device which is set to massively amplify the rear mic socket, which is already amplified by "Rear mic boost".  Amplifying an empty socket will definitely result in a signal that sounds like static.

So change "Input source" to front or rear line in (or similar, depending where your cable goes) and set the volume of "Capture" to the top of the green which should be loud enough to see/hear and select the top option in Audacity (the 1 device and volume would be the second option in Audacity, so if you plan on using a mic set it to that socket) and try recording again.

[fohat.digs]

OK, so I took a stab at that, but do I need to reinstate pulseaudio?

Just entering "pulseaudio" doesn't seem to be enough.

Thank you so much for all your help.

[suicidal_orange]

We're still going without pulse for the line in, once you get the soundcard setup in the background re-enabling pulse might make it just work.  Or it may still be trying to use your HDMI, if you're not able to disable it.

To re-enable pulse change "stop" to "start" in the two commands, or it will be back on if you reboot.

[appleonama]

fedora 36 

[fohat.digs]

Audacity is still borked, but I can listen to music and websites on the computer sound system.

Pavucontrol seems to show that Line-in is active but Audacity seems to refuse to find or recognize it.

[suicidal_orange]

I wonder why you have no monitor devices showing even though they were visible in Audacity earlier.

"borked" and "refuse to find or recognize" don't really describe the problem, do I assume that as you're back in pulse you got line in recording working with it disabled?  Or are you now back trying to record what's playing on the computer?

[fohat.digs]

I am sorry, I am frustrating and being flip.

To be clear: Audacity has never recorded anything properly in Mint since I switched over - but the exact same hardware setup has worked properly in Windows (with no drama) for years. But I can open, edit, and play back existing files in Audacity with no problem (using "pulse" as the playback option).

Some of the "recording" options seem to give me squiggly moving lines of some description but it is either pure static or a grossly distorted and muffled version of what is playing through the speakers.

At some point yesterday, after I had shut everything down, I could not even play back sound on my computer's speakers, but that is now back up and we are just down to Audacity not recording.

Thank you for your patience.

[suicidal_orange]

You probably couldn't play anything while pulse was disabled, nothing to worry about.

How about we swap out your config for mine and see what happens?  Lots of auto detection so it will probably be exactly the same because that's what you have installed but it's worth a try and easy enough to put it back.  Download the attached file (it's like a .zip but keeps the permissions from the Linux filesystem) then run the below to go to the config directory, move the current version in case you want to go back to it, and extract my config.

Code: [Select]

cd /etc
sudo mv pulse pulseold
sudo tar xzvf /home/harry/Downloads/pulse.tar.gz
Then reboot and see if anything changes.

[fohat.digs]

I downloaded the file to /Downloads and extracted it, but I can't copy the extracted folder to /etc

Copying the unextracted file to /etc worked, but then I was not allowed to extract it there.

Obviously I am not skilled at these basic operations.

[suicidal_orange]

I gave you the three commands you need to run, just copy and paste them in a terminal

You can't change things in /etc as your user because doing so could break everything which is why two of them use sudo.

[fohat.digs]

Thanks, I was expecting to have to extract the files and do something with them.

Doing as you said restored sound to my system in general, including being able to listen to MP3s and YouTubes, but the recording problem in Audacity remains.

Its struggles to record seem slightly different however. The "wave" (I don't know what to call the squiggly blue line wave that depicts the sound, is there a technical term for it?) is taller (ie louder I suppose) but drastically compressed and still distorted and muffled.

And it looks like I am back to the the same playback and record selections as before. Even though Pavucontrol shows Line-in up and running, Audacity can't seem to find it.

I am truly sorry to be so tedious.

[suicidal_orange]

Are you trying to record what's playing or line in?

Have you changed the device and volume in alsamixer and did it change back after you rebooted?

I'm confused why your device names in the list in Audacity aren't the same format as mine - do you still have the .asoundrc?  If the command below outputs something you do.

Code: [Select]

cat /home/harry/.asoundrc

[fohat.digs]

It does appear that the process wiped the slate clean, although .asoundrc was present.

In alsamixer I tried to add some devices to "capture" via F6, but for whatever reasons it refuses to allow me to add anything to "Input Source" or "Input Source 1" although it seemed happy enough to let me add playback sources.

After doing that, I got the picture that is all green and white. Then I opened Audacity and pressed the "Record" button for a few seconds and got garbage. When I went back to alsamixer I see that it bumped the "Capture" column all the way up to the top of the red and dropped "Line Boost" to zero.
 

[suicidal_orange]

Pressing F6 to add sources doesn't work anywhere for me - are you talking about alsamixer or pavucontrol or Audacity?  In alsamixer you can't add you can only toggle between things in the list, Line look like a good option but without the list it may not be (and no, I don't know any way to output the list)

As Audacity is (indirectly?) changing the right volume slider and you're now getting "garbage" instead of "static" I'm tempted to say we're getting somewhere though I'm not sure.  Can you upload a short sample recording?

You could try disabling pulse again then recording from all the possible looking inputs, it's just gets rid of one layer that could go wrong.

[fohat.digs]

Alsamixer specifies F6 as the way to select sound card, I don't see any other sort of "add" option.

Static is probably the better description, I don't seem to be getting that distorted version of the actual signal any more. It is almost certainly just some form of feedback.

In Windows the old list of recording inputs in Audacity had things like "Line-In" and "What U Hear" and other such options that are nowhere to be found any more. Clearly Audacity was somehow sensing the hardware that is hardwired in the computer, but can't seem to find it now.

At least that is the only way I can wrap my mind around it.

[suicidal_orange]

Ah, that F6.  Yes you can switch between "soundcards" but you only have one plus an HDMI port which if it's like mine has no inputs in alsamixer.  HDMI audio is encrypted and I can't help thinking that's what it's trying to record.  Do you ever send sound to your monitor via HDMI or can we attempt to blacklst that device?

[fohat.digs]

Ah, that F6.  Yes you can switch between "soundcards" but you only have one plus an HDMI port which if it's like mine has no inputs in alsamixer.  HDMI audio is encrypted and I can't help thinking that's what it's trying to record.  Do you ever send sound to your monitor via HDMI or can we attempt to blacklst that device?

The HDMI monitor is a Dell SE2719HR which does not even have speakers (I thought that was the major difference between monitors and TVs).

Are you implying that the card is trying to send or receive sound to or from the monitor but there is nothing to accept it?

[suicidal_orange]

There is no difference between monitors and TVs, that's why we're forced to use widescreens.  You can send sound over HDMI but if there are no speakers it's not going to get past the receiver chip.

The below stops pulse, removes the driver for HDMI audio then re-enables pulse, which will then only have one soundcard so no excuse for getting confused - if that works we can make it permanent.  If the recording sounds the same the search goes on...

Code: [Select]

systemctl --user stop pulseaudio.socket
systemctl --user stop pulseaudio.service
sudo rmmod -f snd_hda_codec_hdmi
systemctl --user start pulseaudio.service
systemctl --user start pulseaudio.socket
Please try all the options in Audacity for the input device - you don't really care what it's called as long as you know.

[fohat.digs]

code

sudo rmmod -f snd_hda_codec_hdmi

I got to this point but got a message that says "temporarily unavailable"

Does that mean "ain't gonna happen" or is there something that I need to do? Looked up "rmmod error" online and it's out of my league.

[suicidal_orange]

Tried to replicate that error - I get it when trying to remove a module that's used by another, so your HDMI audio is different to mine.  ATI card vs nvidia so I'll believe it.  Please post the output of the below, hopefully that will confirm it.

Code: [Select]

lsmod | grep hdmi

[fohat.digs]

I see "intel" in every line, but as far as I know everything in my box is AMD. Is that any problem?

[suicidal_orange]

Seeing Intel is not a problem - it's a standard for many onboard soundcards, intel used it first.  The original 64bit x86 processor architecture was called AMD64 because in that case AMD did it first.

What is a problem is the empty fourth column on the top line, which means no other module relies on the hdmi module.  If nothing else is using it why can't you unload it?  I have no idea.  Maybe user18 will know as they use Mint.

I've not found any way to prevent the module loading and you can't just unload it in a script as that doesn't work which leaves the brute force option that will break when you update your kernel - removing the module. I've done it and rebooted, somehow I still have an HDMI soundcard but it only has S/PDIF.  It may work differently for you so give it a go?

Code: [Select]

mv /lib/modules/`uname -r`/kernel/sound/pci/hda/snd-hda-codec-hdmi.ko.zst /root

[fohat.digs]

Is it me? What is it with Audacity on Mint? I have used it for 2 decades on Windows XP/7/10 with no drama at all.

My laptop is a device that I use temporarily when I need to be away from home, but I don't keep anything of value on it so at any time I could wipe it and start over.

So, given that nothing has worked in my attempts to use Audacity on my strong modern desktop since I moved to Linux Mint, and given that Mint is about to get an upgrade, I decided to try my laptop. A friend of mine has a radio program on Wednesday nights that I really enjoy and would like to record. Just that. And the station plays it online, directly.

I did a totally clean wipe and install of Mint 21 beta on my laptop, installed Audacity, with no connection to any sort of hardware (except wireless to my home wi-fi only) outside of the laptop's native components.

And guess what? Audacity is behaving exactly the same way that it did before -  using "pulse" or "default" I can record "something" of the radio program but it is deeply muffled and distorted. And there are no options for "Line-in" or "What U Hear" or other viable choices.

Now that I can see that this problem rears its ugly head in an entirely different environment, I feel that there is something else going on. Do I live in the "upside-down"?

[Leslieann]

Try something other than Mint.
Debian, LMDE, even Ubuntu... something.

Mint is often long behind on updates and you may be getting a new-ish version of Audacity and older versions of everything else. I have had lots of trouble with this problem, even something as universal as VLC has problems. Mint is like Apple, it's great if you're looking for something stable but as soon as you start trying to do anything outside the norm expect problems.

[fohat.digs]

as soon as you start trying to do anything outside the norm

Installing Audacity is outside the norm?

Current version of Audacity is too new for bleeding edge Mint?

Maybe I just never stopped to ask the question - What is the simplest and most straightforward Linux distro for a mid-level user who has been with MicroSoft for several decades?

I dabbled with Linux for over a decade, first with Ubuntu but then they changed everything and I heard that they went "corporate" so I bailed. I spent a few disastrous weeks attempting openSUSE but was driven away by the haters. Mint has generally been fine except for 2 things that really get under my skin - (1) my new-ish Brother printer/scanner seems to be banished to the Phantom Zone and (2) Audacity will not record properly. Other than that I have been pleased with it, after the heartache of getting it up and running with basic accoutrements like dual monitors keyboard shortcuts.

[Leslieann]

Installing Audacity is outside the norm?

Current version of Audacity is too new for bleeding edge Mint?

Maybe I just never stopped to ask the question - What is the simplest and most straightforward Linux distro for a mid-level user who has been with MicroSoft for several decades?

I dabbled with Linux for over a decade, first with Ubuntu but then they changed everything and I heard that they went "corporate" so I bailed. I spent a few disastrous weeks attempting openSUSE but was driven away by the haters. Mint has generally been fine except for 2 things that really get under my skin - (1) my new-ish Brother printer/scanner seems to be banished to the Phantom Zone and (2) Audacity will not record properly. Other than that I have been pleased with it, after the heartache of getting it up and running with basic accoutrements like dual monitors keyboard shortcuts.

Bleeding edge Mint is like a dull banana compared to what is actually bleeding edge in linux, I think the only think less bleeding edge is Debian stable.
It's one of the most conservative distros you can run, it's why it gets recommended, it's like training wheels for Linux and it sounds to me like it's time to take them off. I'm not trying to bash Mint, Mint is absolutely great to get people onto Linux and some people are quite happy with it long term, same with Ubuntu, they are both very capable the problem is that it takes a lot of effort to remove the training wheels and when you do things can go wonky, which is what I think you're seeing. Meanwhile something with less guiding hand would allow you a bit more freedom to correct problems.

As for Audacity,
It's what Audacity does, you're stringing together lots of different programs and systems and working at hardware level, even on Windows it goes wrong. The same happens with OBS Studio. And yes, current version Audacity, probably meant for some of the latest kernels and drivers may not work with the older stuff Mint uses.


Regarding distros
Once you understand it, all Linux is about the same, the real difference is the package manager and repos (which are curated for compatibility), both of which can be changed just like the desktop environment, it's just not always easy or advised. If you can use Mint you can use Ubuntu, Debian, Fedora, Arch, etc. with almost little difference, including stability. Raw bleeding edge Arch (for better or worse) is about as stable as Windows and it only gets better from there as you go downstream be it Arch based or anything else.

My advice, and this will sound weird, but an Arch based distro, but not raw Arch(!). The AUR, it makes the PPA system of Ubuntu look tiny and difficult to use, giving it the greatest software compatibility. It does PPAs, it does RPM, it can handle almost anything.  Yes, I know Arch users have a horrible reputation but the Arch Wiki is easily one of the best resources for Linux users on the net, I often used it when I was on Mint and if you use Manjaro, Endeavour or Arco (probably the most popular Arch based distros) they have nice support forums that are every bit as good as Ubuntu and Mint without almost any of the toxicity. Install one of them with Cinnamon desktop and you get pretty much the same experience with Mint but on newer (or older if you choose) software and easy access to so much more software without using ppas or flatpacks. You have enough knowledge you can easily make that leap now whereas had you tried any of these on day one, who knows if you would have stayed.

Endeavour is probably the most bleeding edge, it's darn near pure Arch, annoyingly so, any fresh bugs, it gets them. Manjaro is probably the least bleeding edge but it felt a bit limited to me as a result, almost like it was hand holding, less so than Mint, but still a lot of hand holding, some prefer this, you might. Arco falls in between, it's almost pure Arch but with a few tweaks to help with things.  It's just off bleeding edge enough that you miss the worst of the problems.


I use the AUR to install my Brother, works great though I've never used it to scan, just print. You will probably need brscan4 for scanning (yay -S brscan4). Some of these may also need bluetooth enabled, it's usually installed but turned off by default.
sudo systemctl enable bluetooth
reboot or then do   
sudo systemctl start bluetooth

[suicidal_orange]

If you're swapping distro don't forget that you like Thunar so you should consider choosing XFCE as your desktop environment to get it as default.  It's different but the layout is pretty much like old Windows by default.

...

I must be incredibly lucky to have updated my Arch installation (my first time using the distro) regularly for many years without hitting a single problem - more years than months any regularly used Windows install ever lasted.  While I would like to keep up to date with other options it feels rude to replace something that's so reliable!

[fohat.digs]

Manjaro is probably the least bleeding edge but it felt a bit limited to me as a result, almost like it was hand holding, less so than Mint, but still a lot of hand holding, some prefer this, you might.

I use the AUR to install my Brother, works great though I've never used it to scan, just print.

I have installed Manjaro with KDE on the laptop. It seemed to go well enough, but it seems disorienting in many ways.

Installing Audacity went smoothly (it took 18 minutes to download - that seems pretty strange), and I can record from a website, although it is about 20+db too low and still seems to have a bit of "whoosh" noise in the background, although far less than on the desktop rig.

My printer/scanner has a "Wi-fi" button that I press and it just keeps blinking as if it cannot remember how to connect and eventually times out (remember when I switched to Mint I eventually gave up and ran a USB cable around the walls, although the modem is only about 4 feet away from it?). Can a Brother DCP-L2550DW not cope with being plugged in and accessing Wi-fi at the same time?

Is there a significant difference between pacman and yay?

[Leslieann]

I have installed Manjaro with KDE on the laptop. It seemed to go well enough, but it seems disorienting in many ways.

This is a desktop environment issue, not a distro issue. You can install KDE on Mint and Cinnamon (Mint's desktop) on any other distro.

My printer/scanner has a "Wi-fi" button that I press and it just keeps blinking as if it cannot remember how to connect and eventually times out (remember when I switched to Mint I eventually gave up and ran a USB cable around the walls, although the modem is only about 4 feet away from it?). Can a Brother DCP-L2550DW not cope with being plugged in and accessing Wi-fi at the same time?

The wifi button is used in connection with the quick connect (WPS) button on your router, not the computer.

Most systems do not deal well with dual net connections without you doing some tweaking. Printers and scanners are dumb.

Is there a significant difference between pacman and yay?

YAY accesses the AUR but it's just another package manager.

Apt, Yay, Pacman, Yaourt, Trizen, are all just package managers.

[suicidal_orange]

KDE is QT based while Audacity is GTK.  If you had chosen Cinnamon, Mate, Pantheon or XFCE as your desktop you wouldn't have had to download all the graphical toolkit packages in addition to whatever extra audio stuff it needed so it would have been quicker.

Laptops often record noise picked up from mains power while plugged in which could explain the whoosh - easy to test that one.  Could also be the result of plugging a line level signal into a microphone port?
Low volume - have a look in alsamixer.  It works so you're looking for low volume sliders or a disabled/low boost slider.

Another thing you could try is plugging the laptop hard drive into the PC in place of your normal boot drive and switching it on.  90% chance it will boot to desktop, may not load proper accelerated graphics drivers in which case it will do strange things graphically (think Windows 98 resizing windows on a go slow...) but you should be able to see what sound devices show up and record something to test.

From what Leslieann said wherever you land up you will get newer versions of CUPS and kernel so the printer might work better but it definitely shouldn't be worse as it's Brother's driver, so probably best to find a distro you can record on then worry about the printer.

[fohat.digs]

Another thing you could try is plugging the laptop hard drive into the PC in place of your normal boot drive and switching it on.

you should be able to see what sound devices show up and record something to test.

When I "made the switch" to Linux I never changed anything. I have had Linux on a separate hard drive for years, and alternated between Windows and Linux by going into the boot menu in BIOS and booting from the other one. It seemed cleaner and safer than Grub with partitions and all that.

So my Windows 10 install is still active and valid, I just stopped using it. As I have said countless times, there is no hardware problem.
Everything worked perfectly in Windows from day 1, straight out of the box.
 
The problem is that in Linux, for whatever reasons, Audacity refuses to recognize what is sitting there.

[suicidal_orange]

  were all your recent questions about sound and the printer using this laptop?  That it was in a room and you could run a cable to the printer and it was connected to a monitor had me thinking you were on a desktop and saying you switch in BIOS sounds even more like a desktop.

[fohat.digs]

My questions starting yesterday concern the laptop.

When the beta release of Mint 21 came out I installed it on the laptop (since there was nothing to lose in a clean install) in hopes that the Audacity problem would have found a solution.

Leslieann suggested that Mint/Cinnamon might be problematic going forward, so I downloaded Manjaro/KDE and put that on the laptop to see how it felt, in hopes that it might be somewhere I could land and stay permanently. I am an old man and I don't want to keep hopping around with computer OS's in my life.

Beyond mundane "clerical" tasks I want to be able to do mid-level editing and manipulation of images and music. And I have a fairly large collection of "stuff" dating back to the time when my kids were born which I need to keep stored and accessible. That is pretty much all that I need to be able to do.

[Leslieann]

Leslieann suggested that Mint/Cinnamon might be problematic going forward, so I downloaded Manjaro/KDE and put that on the laptop to see how it felt, in hopes that it might be somewhere I could land and stay permanently. I am an old man and I don't want to keep hopping around with computer OS's in my life.

Manjaro has a community edition with Cinnamon but a net install of Manjaro, Arco and Endeavour will also do Cinnamon without problem.

Cinnamon is nice but it and pretty much any Gnome 3 based desktop has issues with dual screens, every now and then one will just not come on or it will flip them. There's fixes for it, I just got tired of messing with it. Anything single screen though it should be fine. Were it not for that I'd probably still be on Cinnamon.

[fohat.digs]

After I bought a 2nd monitor for $10 from my next-door neighbor's yard sale 15 years ago, I have always used 2 monitors.

After reading about the distros it seemed like there was no sure sweet spot but Manjaro/KDE looked like the best sweet-ish mix for my needs. Cinnamon was quickly usable with very little learning curve, in part because I had dabbled with Ubuntu/Gnome long enough to be moderately comfortable, but I get the feeling that KDE is going to be stronger in the long term. Just when I was freely able to type "sudo apt-get" without even blinking ....

Besides LibreOffice, the only 2 programs that I just wouldn't want to live without are GIMP and Audacity. Other various utilities and "assistance" type programs need to work for me but I am not particularly loyal to any one, although being accustomed to VLC I get frustrated when I try to stumble around in other players.

[Leslieann]

"sudo apt-get" without even blinking ....

In most instances you can skip the "-get", yay is even faster, it's a shorter command and doesn't even need sudo ("yay -S ____").
For updates pacman is also better, no need to update, then upgrade then update again then dist-upgrade, it's all handled by simply "sudo pacman -Syu". One command and it's done.

And then there's Arco... update is simple "update". No sudo, no apt, no pacman it's all just simply "update" and it does everything. This is actually just a script and could easily be done by all distros but they don't for some reason.

Speaking of updates, (I spaced on this earlier)
That was probably the biggest reason I left Mint and went Arch based. There is no version, no hassle with major updates, it just rolls along. This was a major sore spot for me with Mint and to a lesser extent Ubuntu and Debian, Mint in particular just can't get them right. I had 2 major updates in a row that just borked my system and forced a re-install and after I left I had to deal with it again on another person's system. After that I was done with it and apparently I wasn't alone, Mint has now instituted a more strict update policy because people were refusing to update. Well gee, I wonder why... I understand they want to fix the problem, but this is essentially victim blaming in my opinion and the wrong direction. Note, I don't criticize Mint out of hate but out of love. I love Mint and I want it to be better.

[suicidal_orange]

My questions starting yesterday concern the laptop.

When the beta release of Mint 21 came out I installed it on the laptop (since there was nothing to lose in a clean install) in hopes that the Audacity problem would have found a solution.

As I've said a few times in the past it seems like we're speaking different languages at times (don't worry it's my problem not yours as it happens with lots of people.  I went for Autistic spectrum assessment and that side fits, but I'm not anxious so can't possibly be that...)

I think what you want at the end of the day is your home computer recording from line in or whatever sound is playing through the speakers (or meaning choosing one not both at once) and a working printer, preferably wirelessly with a "scan" button.  Is this correct?

If so fixing the laptop beyond where it is (Audacity can record recognisable sound) isn't going to prove that your computer motherboard soundcard works in Linux so to me fixing it is a waste of time.  You could install Manjaro on the computer to test but it would be quicker to undo a couple of screws and take the drive out of the laptop and use that installation in the computer.  This also means so you can swap back without losing anything.

Gimp and Audacity are both GTK apps so running them under KDE will mean longer updates as you'll need to update both toolkits - what about KDE makes you think it's better for you?

[fohat.digs]

I think what you want at the end of the day is your home computer recording from line in or whatever sound is playing through the speakers (or meaning choosing one not both at once) and a working printer, preferably wirelessly with a "scan" button.  Is this correct?

That's right. That is exactly what I have been doing under Windows for years on this same equipment.

Gimp and Audacity are both GTK apps so running them under KDE will mean longer updates as you'll need to update both toolkits - what about KDE makes you think it's better for you?

My reading has led me to believe that KDE is a stronger and more versatile system with a cleaner future.
I don't mind a one-time learning curve if it gets me to a good place.
Also, I don't mind waiting some reasonable amount to extra time for a download if it yields a better result.

And I detest constantly having to (1) learn about the existence of, (2) find, and (3) install add-ons or extensions for every little thing that I always assumed to be fundamental and universal actions that almost any computer user would perform.
 

[suicidal_orange]

I detest constantly having to (1) learn about the existence of, (2) find, and (3) install add-ons or extensions for every little thing that I always assumed to be fundamental and universal actions that almost any computer user would perform.

Let me guess, Konqueror (the KDE file manager) handles file renaming like Windows?

I haven't used KDE in many years, I tried it a few times and it always annoyed me and with each new release the default theme looked increasingly plasticy.  Gnome 3 was also annoying so I tried Enlightenment (still fast, still beautiful - still couldn't stick with it) before settling on xfce.  Having a quick read it sounds like KDE now includes lots more programs than Gnome (42?!) so if you're looking for an all in one solution it does sound the better choice.

[fohat.digs]

handles file renaming like Windows?

Haven't gotten that far, but I thought that Dolphin was the default file manager?

[suicidal_orange]

I thought that Dolphin was the default file manager?

You're right.  Maybe Konqueror was the old file manager, maybe it was a text editor, or maybe I'm confusing it with something completely different just because it starts with a K - as I said it's been a while.  Dolphin is wrong though, everything in KDE used to start with a K.  Makes it easy to know what programs to avoid!

[suicidal_orange]

Just thought I should share that I've finally got an issue with my years-old Arch installation - they've renamed some wxgtk packages and now it can't satisfy dependencies to do an update!

[ideus]

Just thought I should share that I've finally got an issue with my years-old Arch installation - they've renamed some wxgtk packages and now it can't satisfy dependencies to do an update!

I have tried to use Linux (4 forks already) just to reach a point where it is so frustrating to do some tasks that I have skinned my boring but efficient win 10 to look a bit better, and I have quit trying to use anything else. It is incredible that some open source software—like R—are just easier to use in Windows than in Linux. Even some cloud services are just to hard to configure in Linux, while their windows counterparts run smoothly. It is a shame.

[fohat.digs]

It is a shame.

I hear you.

Leslieann put her finger directly on it, though. MicroSoft pays an army of people to ensure that "most" things "work" ?properly? just enough of the time to keep users in the corral.

If even a for-profit company like Brother can't be bothered to make my 2-year-old printer-scanner available in Linux Mint, so how can I expect developers of something like Audacity to enable it to listen to my sound card?

[Leslieann]

Just thought I should share that I've finally got an issue with my years-old Arch installation - they've renamed some wxgtk packages and now it can't satisfy dependencies to do an update!

It's already fixed.
Just updated mine and it went, just need to approve the change.

[Leslieann]

I have tried to use Linux (4 forks already) just to reach a point where it is so frustrating to do some tasks

Linux is NOT Windows, nor is it a replacement.
Stop expecting it to be.

It is a different operating system. Yes, some things are similar and they can often do the same things but they are not designed to do the same things the same way. If you stick with it long enough you will find Linux does a lot of things well that Windows is horrible at. Same for Mac, it too has strong and weak points. Distrohopping is a good way to make sure to never find those good point, you're too busy evaluating the distro. Understand you WILL have to make compromises, you may have to replace some hardware or software to get to a place that works "well enough".

What finally stopped me from distro hopping was making a list of things I HAD to have in order to switch, obviously you can ignore normal things like browsers. Then start experimenting to find which distro (or at least base I.E. Debian, Arch, Fedora) could best handle those things. In my case, at the time I needed Photoshop and one specific game. Once I got those to work in a distro I switched. The other thing I needed was a push from Microsoft, I tested Win10, I knew where things were going so it gave me a purpose.

So long as you expect Linux to absolutely replace Windows, you will never leave Windows and if it ever did become a Windows replacement there would be no reason to switch.

Even some cloud services are just to hard to configure in Linux, while their windows counterparts run smoothly. It is a shame.

Corporations love Linux but hate Linux users.

Mega drive runs fine.
Googleis all but hostile towards Linux.

[yui]

I thought that Dolphin was the default file manager?

You're right.  Maybe Konqueror was the old file manager, maybe it was a text editor, or maybe I'm confusing it with something completely different just because it starts with a K - as I said it's been a while.  Dolphin is wrong though, everything in KDE used to start with a K.  Makes it easy to know what programs to avoid!

Konqueror was the default web browser and an option for a file manager, i only ever known it as an option and not the default, but it was a far better file manager, even if a bit less elegant, only recently it lost the file manager preset allowing the file manager sidebar (like on dolphin or on windows)

Just thought I should share that I've finally got an issue with my years-old Arch installation - they've renamed some wxgtk packages and now it can't satisfy dependencies to do an update!

that is rather annoying, i have some similar problem with my hybrid 9/10 debian install, some packages searching old dependencies with = version or renamed dependencies, but then i kinda asked for it.

I have tried to use Linux (4 forks already) just to reach a point where it is so frustrating to do some tasks that I have skinned my boring but efficient win 10 to look a bit better, and I have quit trying to use anything else. It is incredible that some open source software—like R—are just easier to use in Windows than in Linux. Even some cloud services are just to hard to configure in Linux, while their windows counterparts run smoothly. It is a shame.

well it is not that incredible, a lot of open source software is made with Windows in mind, not that it has the widest user-base or anything, and that R from what i know is a annalist language, not a computer science oriented one, i'd say it make sense that they would focus on windows. even MS have opensource projects, would you expect those to be working well on Linux?
although on the opposite side, for the 1st 2 months MS teams worked much better on my Linux machine than Windows 10 and 7 machines, i do almost never use those machines because of how frustrating i find Windows bugginess and lack of customization nowadays, and because most of what i do can be done on linux often easier and faster.

Linux is NOT Windows, nor is it a replacement.

as an OS it somewhat is, though, and does a very good job at it all things considered

Google is all but hostile towards Linux.

i find that statement rather strange though, Google uses Linux as the base for their most successful product (Android), participate a lot to the security of the kernel and were part of the transition to real-time (what makes Linux sometimes pretty much the only option for time critical applications, other than a home codded OS). I do not see any of it as hostility, although they are very hostile towards Firefox yes.

[Leslieann]

Linux is NOT Windows, nor is it a replacement.

as an OS it somewhat is, though, and does a very good job at it all things considered

An OS by definition has to perform certain tasks similar to it's competition, they all have their specialties though.
A truck can carry people like a car, a car can carry cargo like a truck, they're still have different purposes.

You don't ask Mac to play games like Windows.
You don't ask Linux to battery manage like Mac.
You don't ask Windows to be a good server like Linux.

Google is all but hostile towards Linux.

i find that statement rather strange though, Google uses Linux as the base for their most successful product (Android), participate a lot to the security of the kernel and were part of the transition to real-time (what makes Linux sometimes pretty much the only option for time critical applications, other than a home codded OS). I do not see any of it as hostility, although they are very hostile towards Firefox yes.

Corporations love to use Linux, it saves them money on development.
Corporations hate Linux users because they see them as cheap (not actually true, they're just more difficult to market to as they're not as easily swayed by marketing fluff).


Google has repeatedly dangled a carrot to Linux users claiming native apps were coming then either never dropping or releasing half baked cloud based versions that only work through Chrome (and no other browsers).

[iri]

I haven't used Windows on my personal machines for 15 years, so I guess Linux is a good replacement.